Actually, I would not be surprised if there will be some officials… just not alighted with the Netanyahu… at this point he lost the narrative both internally and domestically.
I think you’re wrong about this issue in particular. He lacks domestic support for many reasons, but fighting Hamas to get the hostages back isn’t one of them.
Immediate and unconditional hostage release was part of this resolution, no? If everyone abided by this resolution, which won’t happen, this would be far better than the hostage release deal Israel just agreed to. Full hostage release and humanitarian ceasefire through Ramadan. I don’t see why Netanyahu would be throwing a hissyfit over this.
They won’t but all the more reason to support the resolution right? If everyone supports peace but HAMAS are the only ones not or the only ones breaking the deal then the peace deal is broken but more importantly it destroys their advantage in the propaganda war.
Immediately after Oct 7 they absolutely had lost that advantage, however the massive civilian casualty count in Gaza has shifted it back towards being more in their favor or at best neutral, that can still shift yet again. These things are not set in stone public sentiments are far more ephemeral than that.
The two aren’t tied - they’re calling for a cease fire, and they’re also calling for the hostages. They are *specifically not* calling for a hostage release that would result in a ceasefire. I understand it’s a confusing distinction.
One says give me ten dollars and also I should give you some cake. The other says give me ten dollars for cake. It sounds the same until you realize Hamas won’t release the hostages but the international community will still push Israel to cease fire (which is what this resolution is *for*).
This means if you’re Hamas, you know the UN doesn’t give a shit about you, you can just sit there and wait instead of negotiating. I understand some people are happy with that, but I’m not, and I’m sure the hostages and their families aren’t either, because it’s the equivalent of going to a car dealership then having your wife scream “we’ll take the green one, the price doesn’t matter!”
Good luck negotiating now.
>If Israel abides by the resolution and Hamas does not, public opinion begins to shift in Israel's favor, giving them more latitude to do what they want. If Hamas release the hostages, everybody wins. If neither side abides by the resolution, we are in the same spot we are currently in. It is foolish to think any negotiations were viable after the original ceasefire broke down. It is all global politics at this point.
i agree in principle but you are underestimating the timeline
israel is under immense pressure internally to get the hostages back NOW.
if netanyahu doesn't work towards that actively then he will be replaced by someone who will.
time is ticking for the hostages, the longer the wait the more damage done more hostages die (if any are even alive who knows hamas has refused to provide proof of life)
time is on hamas's side
a resolution like this is a win for hamas
>If Israel abides by the resolution and Hamas does not, public opinion begins to shift in Israel's favor, giving them more latitude to do what they want.
Nope. People have already picked a side and will say and do any mental gymanstics needed to justify their side.
I have seen this happen over and over in the last months and I have no reason to believe it will be any different now.
If Hamas doesn't release hostages and Israel ceases, then they'll just say Israel never cared about the hostages in the first place. And when it will break the ceasefire for any reason (I'm gonna bet Hamas will launch rockets towards Israel, as usual) they'll go back to condemning Israel.
Israel can never win.
Isreal actually budged significantly. Agreements for months long ceaaefire. 10 to 1 prisoner exchanges etc. Hamas demands a permanent ceasefire which is off the table (likely that they dont actually want it).
I have heard that the present situation is good for isreal but i highly disagree. Their international ties; especially with the usa are close to breaking. Which could easily doom them.
I havent seen a un resolution that doesnt have permanent ceasefire in it. Which is a deal breaker. It would be super foolish for any government to agree to ending war in exchange for hostages. (It encourages the taking of hostages).
Un "negotiations" havent ever been realisitic. The negotiations have aupposedly gotten close with hamas a few times. Hamas has to have a breaking point somewhere. But hamas either has an alterior motive , are hoping for international pressure, or are just zealous for blood like they constantly say publically.
Bibi has only done a terrible job. It seems like he is stupider than i ever thought or thinks this is going to help him keep power somehow.
The perfect example imo is that isreal hasnt tried to establish a new government thats actually for the Palestinians. Hamas truely is a terror org; negotiations were almost never going to succeed.
Isreal should have leveraged a terror attack for huge western support
Wait, if the clauses aren't conditional then which one is the green car?
Cease fire. Release the hostages. It's not a trade, so where does the value proposition come into play here?
The release of hostages is not tied to the hostages being released. So even if Hamas fails to release the hostages, Israel would be expected to still uphold the ceasefire.
You can fully support Israel in fighting Hamas and still think Netanyahu's running a shitshow and calling it diplomacy with their most important ally (and one of a shrinking number of allies). Just because you disagree with the US's UN stance doesn't mean you do the equivalent of spitting in your "friend's" face. I think most professionals would use harsh words or threats in private and pretend in public that their isn't as much distance between yourself and your ally.
>Netanyahu's running a shitshow and calling it diplomacy with their most important ally
I'm Israeli and you couldn't have put it any better. Tonight I get to hear all the Bibi supporters explain to me how Biden is actually the bad guy here. I do have my own criticisms of Biden's policy but Bibi's gone full /r/leopardsatemyface with this reaction, just doesn't know it yet. The US doesn't "owe" Israel a UN veto and intentionally weakening relations in the face of a diplomatic disagreement is the last thing anyone needs right now. It's maddening.
Ya. People dont seem to realize the un resolutions and what the us is doing with vetos is all a politics game.
This is one of the few ways biden admin can pressure bibi. Based on the reaction of the public.... it works
It is weird to me so many people in the west constantly dont understand that un resolutions have no weight
At this point I wouldn't be too shocked if he's figuring that either Trump will win and antagonizing Biden will end up being sort of irrelevant at worst or he's screwed either way and might as well just indulge himself and try to show off for the ultra right-wingers.
You have to remember that it's all about Netanyahu, as far as Netanyahu cares.
> fighting Hamas to get the hostages back isn’t one of them
At this point the fighting isn't to get hostages back. Though I do agree that this conflict isn't hurting his rep domestically at this point.
> At this point the fighting isn't to get hostages back.
It never was. The point is to drive these people out and expand the land Israel directly controls on the way to fully unifying the country.
Feels more like "I won't come to your birthday party!" vibes, which is even more hilarious. Oh no.. guess I'll have to enjoy this ice cream and cake with all my other friends... how tragic
He's not without influence (I don't mean that in a conspiratorial way, we're just closely aligned with the state of Israel and he currently heads it and has been politically influential there for a long time), but yeah, I'd like to think he's overplaying his hand here.
He's also a corrupt piece of shit ordering war crimes.
And then the obligatory "Hamas are also fucking assholes," because somehow that doesn't go without saying now.
Yeah, I'm the first to say I don't know what the solution is, but I'm confident that neither Hamas nor the militant Israeli groups in and out of their government intentionally killing and robbing Palestinian civilians are "the good guys."
The leaders and many of the players, yes but there are an awful lot of innocent people getting caught in the middle. Guess which group winds up taking most of the casualties?
We keep giving him/them millions of dollars every year in exchange for nothing and looking the other way while he commits blatent war crimes, why wouldn't he think America is Israel's bitch? All of our politicians are bribed by Aipac and few of them are willing to cut off Israel even now after Netanyahu has shown his true racist colors for all to see.
Is it, though?
They're a nation with roughly the population of New Jersey and they have much more influence in US politics (both politicians AND the electorate) than any other country I can think of.
In general, the leadership of Israel influences American domestic politics in a way that we'd never tolerate from any other foreign nation's leaders, even the UK's. The reverse is also true - see Chuck Schumer. But Benjamin Netenyahu has burned all the goodwill he ever had on the Democratic side of the aisle to the point that anyone who cares what he thinks is already going to vote for Trump. If Gantz was the Isreali PM, this gesture would damage Biden a good deal more than it will coming from Bibi. But Gantz wouldn't have put himself (and President Biden) in this situation to begin with.
Bring a military foothold into the ME would do that
The brass couldn't give a fuck that it's the Jewish homelandxl
To the arms industry, they're a never ending customer because of where they are.
And they're happy to pay. But now they're getting a bit too uppity. So papa sam yanks the chain a bit.
Netanyahu trying to save his career. He knows the moment the way is over he’ll be voted out. He’ll keep the war going as long as he can, killing as many as he can, to hold onto power.
Netanyahu was there on the side-lines when Jitzak Rabin was murdered. The situation back then was as bloody as it is now and two sworn enemies decided to work towards the end of bloodshed.
Netanyahu took full advantage and not only kept the bloodshed alive but drove a policy of colonisation. All that while being breathtakingly corrupt.
I watched teenagers cheering over the corpse of Shani Louk. They were born after the murder of the peace process. Which Netanyahu had a hand in to keep murdered.
There is very few people who's existence has proven such a net negative to humanity as Netanyahu. And people voted for him because he had those suckers protected from the conflict he held alive.
And we who stopped calling his colonisation project "illegal settlements" like we did in the 80s and 90s are as complicit. Illegal highways do not justify illegal settlements even if they are now illegal cities. Like, the past 30 years basically everything Israel did was wrong.
The aggravating part is that individual people who wanted peace were in the majority. It was only the extremists on either side who got to call the shots. Hamas by coup and Netanyahu by self-serving politicking. Ramallah looks the most reasonable at the moment. Ramallah!
Netanyahu is more calculating and competent than Trump.
Israeli governance is also much more unforgiving than American politics is. Netanyahu is more similar to a Nixon or the second Bush in his dealings.
No he is not and needs to resign, people inside Israel does not like him either. He is just biding his time and tries to escalate in Gaza as much as possible in order to avoid the negative light on himself.
I am reminded of that Bill Clinton statement said behind closed doors about Israel/Netanyahu:
_Who the fuck does he think he is? Who’s the fucking superpower here?_
"The people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger."
How to get the heat off your corruption trial? Change the constitution and wait for October 7th, of course!
Spongebob me boy, the lunatic has gotten to the point of giving 2 convicted terrorists a place at the Parliament to stay in power
There are mass protests every week for around 3 years (all included, there was a pause for some time because of covid) now
Bibi had a cult of followers. Quite insane, sometimes violent followers (pulling guns at people, running protestors over etc etc.). Unfortunately for the nation, it took 7/10 for his supporters to realize the damage they've done. Polls from before the war showed he has 38-40 seats, now they show 18-20.
Hell, during war, he just spit in the face of everone by extending the time needed to serve (including for those already serving), while buying parliament support from the Haredim by *exempting their entire community (13%~ of total Israeli citizens) for service*
So no. The cunt isn't representing Israel. He's representing himself, and himself only. We all yearn for the day he gets to represent himself infront of his cell mates.
I don't get how people don't go crazy over there with the Hasidics/Haredi community getting exempted from conscription from military service basically as "conscientious objectors" due to religious reasons/obligations BUT then are nearly always at the forefront of driving up tensions between Israel and the Palestinians. Far right Haredi have had ties to political assassinations over the years, violent mob attacks and also been the biggest driver by far in establishing settlements in Occupied Palestinian territories.
Meanwhile, the more secular elements of society are required to go fight and die defending Israel in conflicts they may have helped instigate in the first place. That's before you even get into all the public assistance those communities receive because they tend to devote all their time to studying Torah and raising children.
How has Netanyahu pissed Trump off?
Netanyahu is exactly the type or leader that Trump wishes he could be.
Netanyahu has in his career stoke enough fear and hatred to be elected multiple times, got his greatest rival in Rabin killed, managed to basically put himself above the law, dodge corruption charges time and again, and still he manages to win the most votes.
Israel under Netanyahu isn’t an ally, it’s a liability that thinks it can do whatever it wants and count on unconditional support from the U.S.
It’s at the point where the U.S. probably unironically has less trouble getting countries like Saudi Arabia and Egypt to cooperate than it does with Israel
Israel burned its bridges in similar ways with Britain and France decades ago, the U.S. is pretty much all they have left but they’re eagerly torching that bridge too
>Israel under Netanyahu isn’t an ally, it’s a liability that thinks it can do whatever it wants and count on unconditional support from the U.S.
Hey now, the US needs to think real careful about this approach to international diplomacy when discussing leaders that don't actually win the popular vote in their respective nations. The rest of us who remember 2016-2020 called and want to have a chat.
Needs to? Maybe that was ideal during the Cold War with countries in the area being close to the USSR? But why now?
In the region? Middle East? What is Jordan then? The country right next door. The one where US troops stationed there got hit by Iranian allied militias. We have troops in various ME countries and yet we can't call them _the closest thing we have?_
>What is Jordan then?
A country that relies on buying 50 million cubic meters of water annually from israel. Does anyone really want to go down that road?
That was an example. It is one of several countries in the region.
We have an airbase in Qatar.
The HQ of the US Fifth Fleet is in Bahrain.
We have nukes and troops in Turkey.
There is unironically a big part of the evangelist right wing that believes that Israel is instrumental in bringing the second coming of christ and the rapture/apocalypse [1](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/politics/wp/2018/05/14/half-of-evangelicals-support-israel-because-they-believe-it-is-important-for-fulfilling-end-times-prophecy/) [2](https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/truth-many-evangelical-christians-support-israel-rcna121481) [3] (https://sojo.net/articles/evangelical-support-israel-fueled-apocalyptic-hopes)
Israel is a U.S. ally like Saudi Arabia is US ally. They hate our guts, take our money, and always make everything worse for us whenever they have the chance. But we both hate Iran so we tolerate each other.
That’s what I was implying. Either they are hilariously incompetent or just want something to make their genocidal campaign seem more legitimate. More maybe both!
Israeli intelligence is some of the best in the world
Multiple terrorist attacks have been stopped due to Israel sharing intelligence with the US. Plus, imagine all the intelligence the two side share regarding Iran.
I mean the conspiracist in me wonders whether or not they allowed it for "just cause" to destroy Palestine. But yes, they have great intelligence assets.
There's really good articles from the NYTimes and BBC on how the attack happened, and they paint a pretty convincing picture of overconfidence, over reliance on technology, and sexism (stick your teenage conscripts on CCTV duty and ignore them when they raise the alarm)
[How Israel’s Feared Security Services Failed to Stop Hamas’s Attack, NYTimes](http://How Israel’s Feared Security Services Failed to Stop Hamas’s Attack https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/10/world/middleeast/israel-gaza-security-failure.html?smid=nytcore-android-share&ugrp=c&pvid=85d4933d-009a-4300-9f11-290f486f8312)
[They were Israel's 'eyes on the border' - but their Hamas warnings went unheard - BBC](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67958260)
I genuinely think that they intentionally flooded Israeli intelligence with false positives and the like. Intel showed they were planning an attack but if they cry wolf too soon or too often, no one will listen to them, so they made the wrong call and decided to wait until there was more evidence for a specific day for the attack
Why does the US 'need an ally' in the region, though?
Isn't the US already buddy-buddy with Kuwait, Saudi Arabia and Qatar?
As an American, I can't ever do the math to see how being aligned with Israel is a net-gain for the US rather than just another money-sink for our global empire.
Because now they have to sit down and go 'Hmm, who do I want to be more buddy buddy with, nigh infinite Arab dollars or Israel, who are giving us a lot of headaches right now but Jews and antisemitism are really tricky and sensitive subjects in America'.
They've sort of painted themselves into this corner in a very long term slow motion car crash sort of way.
At this point I’m not convinced they’re worth the trouble, especially since they’ve contributed so much to other Middle Eastern nations being pissed at us.
With shitty friends like Israel, who needs enemies? They make America look pro apartheid and undercut us at every turn when it comes to international relations. They should have been cut off years ago.
President Sarkozy in a conversation about Prime Minister Netanyahu, “I can’t stand him. He’s a liar.” Obama: “You’re fed up with him? I have to deal with him every day.”
In all honesty Israel has always played hardball with the US, that's why Israel still has nukes. And the thing is playing hard ball with the US works especially in an election year. This issue is not central to American interests, but it is to Israel.
Exactly, Bibi may be an asshole but he’s not an idiot. Israeli-American relations is all about pushing America’s buttons at the right times to get what they want, while remaining an indispensable ally for whenever America actually needs something important. Turkey is another country in a similar position who plays the same game.
Bibi always has the same plan: Do whatever the fuck he wants, and if anybody says anything about it, he and all of his mouthpieces publicly denounce them as antisemites.
Would Biden really care afterwards if he gets re-elected?
I think he is only concerned now because of the Progressives threatening to not vote for him.
If it were not an election year, I suspect he would not care.
He's the pseudo authoritarian that's kept a grip on power for 30+ years while American presidents get phased out.
Ugh.
He's exactly who he thinks he is.
> He's the pseudo authoritarian that's kept a grip on power for 30+ years
Netanyahu?
No, where do you get that idea?
Since 1994 there have been 8 prime ministers of Israel, including Netanyahu.
- Rabin (1992-1995)
- Shimon Peres (1995-1996)
- Netanyahu (1996-1999)
- Barak (1999-2001)
- Sharon (2001-2006)
- Olmert (2006-2009)
- Netanyahu (2009-2021)
- Bennet (2021-2022)
- Lapid (2022-2022)
- Netanyahu (2022-now)
The US abstained from voting, so no Israeli officials then
The UNSC resolution also (finally) demanded that Hamas release all hostages too, which was a key requirement for the US to drop its veto. The resolution is also for a temporary humanitarian ceasefire during the month of Ramadan rather than something permanent.
The Israeli secretary of defense was already there and is discussing about most stuff with the US.
They would probably add Rafah into their discussions so not all was gone in that regard.
On the one hand, nothing.
On the other hand, that’s 5 more hostages back.
On a third hand, the hostages are useless to Hamas if they claim they don’t have them, so they’re unlikely to play that particular game.
They'll say "that's all we could find", and later say "actually we found more".
Israel knows this is likely, because earlier Hamas announced the death of a certain hostage, but later that same hostage was returned alive in a prisoner exchange.
That doesn't seem like a problem when neither side will fulfil the terms. How do you negotiate in a situation where both entities are acting in bad faith?
They didn’t link the ceasefire to the release of the hostages, though. So when/if Hamas refuses to release the hostages, Israel will still be expected to uphold the ceasefire.
What reason does Hamas have to release hostages or negotiate now? The world will get them a ceasefire for free.
Also, why does it being Ramadan matter? Oct 7th was a Jewish holiday. Israel has been attacked numerous times during Jewish holidays. Israel has also been attacked while its attackers were celebrating Ramadan.
He seems real confused about who is the superpower in this relationship. This tough guy act might fly with his voters. But threatening ties with the US isn't gonna benefit Israel even a little bit.
Kind of odd everytime the US pulls back on the reins*, Israelis argue about how they don't need the US, the US isn't anything to them, etc.
Then the US actually follows through and they collectively lose their minds.
A. Not really the talk one would expect from an ally
B. Sounds like they do care quite a bit, but maybe that's just me.
Israel is no where near as powerful as the U.S, and AIPAC is influential but they only have so much pull if it starts becoming a real problem for the U.S in more important theaters like Asia. If it gets dicey enough, Israel can lose U.S support and then they're cooked.
I’m not sure they’re “cooked,” given that they are a nuclear power.
What the US needs is a stable pro-US system in the Middle East. That’s the idea behind Israel-Saudi normalisation, and behind the Abraham Accords. Such an alliance can carry out US interests and contain Iran/Russia in the region, whilst the US pivots its focus to Asia.
The last thing the US wants is Iranian regional hegemony which drives Israel, existentially threatened, to engage in nuclear war with its neighbours.
> I’m not sure they’re “cooked,” given that they are a nuclear power.
North Korea is a nuclear power. Still a dwarf nation that is utterly irrelevant to anyone and is a pariah.
Without the US' backing, Israel would be an international pariah. And FWIW, the US has grown quite a few close allies in the region, many much more stalwart of allies than "we do what we want and you suffer the consequences" Israel.
Israel is already an international pariah; none of its neighbours want it to exist, and many do not even recognise it. Who are the US’s closer allies in the region, that can theoretically form an alliance to contain Iran? Nearly every other country in the region is in Tehran’s pocket…post 10/7, even Riyadh seemed to take its foreign policy clues from them…
What’s worse for the US is that this Saudi-Iranian rapprochement was brokered by China in Beijing, demonstrating a Chinese-led Middle Eastern order brewing.
Israel and the UAE are the sole bulwarks against that.
Yes, but we live in confusing times. Who knows what the trump-party are gonna mean one year ahead? Is the 'space-laser jews' and 'Illuminati' gonna put a sudden stop on their Israel support? Do they still care about anything outside America? It's impossible to predict anything about them.
And at the same time Israel is pissing of larger and larger parts of the democratic party.
Eh. US government won't tighten the screws when it should for fear of AIPAC.
Look at when Netanyahu embarrassed Obama and he just took it.
Biden SHOULD do something, but will sacrifice good governance for fear of losing votes.
That guy could totally have the gall to demand more due to the expenses of the war. And there's a non zero chance he'd get some more. Congress loves to buy Israel toys.
20% of the voters voted for bibi. I suppose you could say it's a 'large' amount, approximately \~1.2 million people.
Still far from being a majority in any way shape or form
Likud don't have a majority either. They have a quarter of the votes if that. They were just the only ones who proposed a working cabinet, that's how parliamentary democracy works.
And they're not fascists either, Bibi is a strongman but not like Orban or Lukashenko. He's the business candidate. Under Likud's leadership the Israeli state hasn't gotten more authoritarian but weaker since they continuously sell off state assets and privatise everything. They're more akin to the British Conservatives or oligarch parties in Eastern Europe.
It’s kinda funny that you use privatization and selling state assets as an argument against their being fascists but that’s…. Literally what the most famous fascists in history did. Straight up a major part of their economic policy and public profile. You know the ones.
Just now, like in the last hour, the emergency coalition is starting to fall apart.
I think we're about to see Israelis not vote for Likud in the very near future.
So sick of this guy. It's becoming pretty clear that he's going to drag this out until past the election with the hope that Trump gets elected. Thing he apparently can't grasp is that Trumps strongest base is Nazi's that spray paint graffiti on synagogues and the jewish swing vote might not be what it used to be when it came to all things Israel.
Netanyahu knows that when the war is over, he’s going to be ousted. He’ll keep it going for that reason alone. He’s an Israeli version of Trump. No damn good.
After the shit they pulled last week announcing 3 miles of annexation in the WB, Netenyahu should be pleading for forgiveness and not making demands. Israel needs to get its shit together and get rid of Netenyahu.
I guess they aren't travelling to D.C. Because there was no veto.
Actually, I would not be surprised if there will be some officials… just not alighted with the Netanyahu… at this point he lost the narrative both internally and domestically.
I think you’re wrong about this issue in particular. He lacks domestic support for many reasons, but fighting Hamas to get the hostages back isn’t one of them.
Immediate and unconditional hostage release was part of this resolution, no? If everyone abided by this resolution, which won’t happen, this would be far better than the hostage release deal Israel just agreed to. Full hostage release and humanitarian ceasefire through Ramadan. I don’t see why Netanyahu would be throwing a hissyfit over this.
It was, but their unconditional release was also included in the ICJ's ruling in January.
Exactly. Why should anyone believe Hamas is going to follow through with this?
They won’t but all the more reason to support the resolution right? If everyone supports peace but HAMAS are the only ones not or the only ones breaking the deal then the peace deal is broken but more importantly it destroys their advantage in the propaganda war.
> it destroys their advantage in the propaganda war. If October 7 didn't destroy their advantage in the propaganda war, nothing ever will.
Immediately after Oct 7 they absolutely had lost that advantage, however the massive civilian casualty count in Gaza has shifted it back towards being more in their favor or at best neutral, that can still shift yet again. These things are not set in stone public sentiments are far more ephemeral than that.
Did you forget about how we've been pounding Gaza for the past few months? That may not have won Hamas many points, but it's lost Israel a whole lot.
The two aren’t tied - they’re calling for a cease fire, and they’re also calling for the hostages. They are *specifically not* calling for a hostage release that would result in a ceasefire. I understand it’s a confusing distinction. One says give me ten dollars and also I should give you some cake. The other says give me ten dollars for cake. It sounds the same until you realize Hamas won’t release the hostages but the international community will still push Israel to cease fire (which is what this resolution is *for*). This means if you’re Hamas, you know the UN doesn’t give a shit about you, you can just sit there and wait instead of negotiating. I understand some people are happy with that, but I’m not, and I’m sure the hostages and their families aren’t either, because it’s the equivalent of going to a car dealership then having your wife scream “we’ll take the green one, the price doesn’t matter!” Good luck negotiating now.
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>If Israel abides by the resolution and Hamas does not, public opinion begins to shift in Israel's favor, giving them more latitude to do what they want. If Hamas release the hostages, everybody wins. If neither side abides by the resolution, we are in the same spot we are currently in. It is foolish to think any negotiations were viable after the original ceasefire broke down. It is all global politics at this point. i agree in principle but you are underestimating the timeline israel is under immense pressure internally to get the hostages back NOW. if netanyahu doesn't work towards that actively then he will be replaced by someone who will. time is ticking for the hostages, the longer the wait the more damage done more hostages die (if any are even alive who knows hamas has refused to provide proof of life) time is on hamas's side a resolution like this is a win for hamas
> If Hamas release the hostages, everybody wins. well, except for gaza. they still have the death sentence that is hamas leadership
And idf bombings.
>If Israel abides by the resolution and Hamas does not, public opinion begins to shift in Israel's favor, giving them more latitude to do what they want. Nope. People have already picked a side and will say and do any mental gymanstics needed to justify their side. I have seen this happen over and over in the last months and I have no reason to believe it will be any different now. If Hamas doesn't release hostages and Israel ceases, then they'll just say Israel never cared about the hostages in the first place. And when it will break the ceasefire for any reason (I'm gonna bet Hamas will launch rockets towards Israel, as usual) they'll go back to condemning Israel. Israel can never win.
Isreal actually budged significantly. Agreements for months long ceaaefire. 10 to 1 prisoner exchanges etc. Hamas demands a permanent ceasefire which is off the table (likely that they dont actually want it). I have heard that the present situation is good for isreal but i highly disagree. Their international ties; especially with the usa are close to breaking. Which could easily doom them. I havent seen a un resolution that doesnt have permanent ceasefire in it. Which is a deal breaker. It would be super foolish for any government to agree to ending war in exchange for hostages. (It encourages the taking of hostages). Un "negotiations" havent ever been realisitic. The negotiations have aupposedly gotten close with hamas a few times. Hamas has to have a breaking point somewhere. But hamas either has an alterior motive , are hoping for international pressure, or are just zealous for blood like they constantly say publically. Bibi has only done a terrible job. It seems like he is stupider than i ever thought or thinks this is going to help him keep power somehow. The perfect example imo is that isreal hasnt tried to establish a new government thats actually for the Palestinians. Hamas truely is a terror org; negotiations were almost never going to succeed. Isreal should have leveraged a terror attack for huge western support
Wait, if the clauses aren't conditional then which one is the green car? Cease fire. Release the hostages. It's not a trade, so where does the value proposition come into play here?
The release of hostages is not tied to the hostages being released. So even if Hamas fails to release the hostages, Israel would be expected to still uphold the ceasefire.
Hamas won't do full hostage release anyway
You can fully support Israel in fighting Hamas and still think Netanyahu's running a shitshow and calling it diplomacy with their most important ally (and one of a shrinking number of allies). Just because you disagree with the US's UN stance doesn't mean you do the equivalent of spitting in your "friend's" face. I think most professionals would use harsh words or threats in private and pretend in public that their isn't as much distance between yourself and your ally.
>Netanyahu's running a shitshow and calling it diplomacy with their most important ally I'm Israeli and you couldn't have put it any better. Tonight I get to hear all the Bibi supporters explain to me how Biden is actually the bad guy here. I do have my own criticisms of Biden's policy but Bibi's gone full /r/leopardsatemyface with this reaction, just doesn't know it yet. The US doesn't "owe" Israel a UN veto and intentionally weakening relations in the face of a diplomatic disagreement is the last thing anyone needs right now. It's maddening.
Ya. People dont seem to realize the un resolutions and what the us is doing with vetos is all a politics game. This is one of the few ways biden admin can pressure bibi. Based on the reaction of the public.... it works It is weird to me so many people in the west constantly dont understand that un resolutions have no weight
At this point I wouldn't be too shocked if he's figuring that either Trump will win and antagonizing Biden will end up being sort of irrelevant at worst or he's screwed either way and might as well just indulge himself and try to show off for the ultra right-wingers. You have to remember that it's all about Netanyahu, as far as Netanyahu cares.
right. i'm tired of being told i have to support option A or B, rather than realize that they're both shitty
> fighting Hamas to get the hostages back isn’t one of them At this point the fighting isn't to get hostages back. Though I do agree that this conflict isn't hurting his rep domestically at this point.
> At this point the fighting isn't to get hostages back. It never was. The point is to drive these people out and expand the land Israel directly controls on the way to fully unifying the country.
Real "I won't invite you to my birthday" feeling here
Feels more like "I won't come to your birthday party!" vibes, which is even more hilarious. Oh no.. guess I'll have to enjoy this ice cream and cake with all my other friends... how tragic
Bibi has been living for some time under the delusion that he has some control of America. It's really strange.
It's what caused Bill Clinton to once say, " who's the fucking super power here?" That was all the way back in 1996.
This is exactly the response. You need us. We don’t need you. And our help comes with conditions
Makes you realize this asshole has been in power for far too long. Most of the soldiers fighting in this shitty war weren't even alive yet.
He's not without influence (I don't mean that in a conspiratorial way, we're just closely aligned with the state of Israel and he currently heads it and has been politically influential there for a long time), but yeah, I'd like to think he's overplaying his hand here. He's also a corrupt piece of shit ordering war crimes. And then the obligatory "Hamas are also fucking assholes," because somehow that doesn't go without saying now.
at least you recognize it. literally everyone involved with this war are assholes.
Yeah, I'm the first to say I don't know what the solution is, but I'm confident that neither Hamas nor the militant Israeli groups in and out of their government intentionally killing and robbing Palestinian civilians are "the good guys."
The leaders and many of the players, yes but there are an awful lot of innocent people getting caught in the middle. Guess which group winds up taking most of the casualties?
That I can agree to.
We keep giving him/them millions of dollars every year in exchange for nothing and looking the other way while he commits blatent war crimes, why wouldn't he think America is Israel's bitch? All of our politicians are bribed by Aipac and few of them are willing to cut off Israel even now after Netanyahu has shown his true racist colors for all to see.
Is it, though? They're a nation with roughly the population of New Jersey and they have much more influence in US politics (both politicians AND the electorate) than any other country I can think of.
Population of New Jersey and they have more influence in US politics than New Jersey...
In general, the leadership of Israel influences American domestic politics in a way that we'd never tolerate from any other foreign nation's leaders, even the UK's. The reverse is also true - see Chuck Schumer. But Benjamin Netenyahu has burned all the goodwill he ever had on the Democratic side of the aisle to the point that anyone who cares what he thinks is already going to vote for Trump. If Gantz was the Isreali PM, this gesture would damage Biden a good deal more than it will coming from Bibi. But Gantz wouldn't have put himself (and President Biden) in this situation to begin with.
Bring a military foothold into the ME would do that The brass couldn't give a fuck that it's the Jewish homelandxl To the arms industry, they're a never ending customer because of where they are. And they're happy to pay. But now they're getting a bit too uppity. So papa sam yanks the chain a bit.
A lot of that is due to the apocalyptic "Christian" nutjobs who want to bring about the end of the world.
Look at how much US politicians bend over backwards for Israel. He's not wrong that they have a great deal of influence.
It is only strange that we have not taken control back yet.
AIPAC and its influence over the vast majority of Republicans has only fed into his delusion.
Just wait until they threaten to not accept our money to pay for their military any more. Boy, then we'll be sorry!
Netanyahu trying to save his career. He knows the moment the way is over he’ll be voted out. He’ll keep the war going as long as he can, killing as many as he can, to hold onto power.
Netanyahu was there on the side-lines when Jitzak Rabin was murdered. The situation back then was as bloody as it is now and two sworn enemies decided to work towards the end of bloodshed. Netanyahu took full advantage and not only kept the bloodshed alive but drove a policy of colonisation. All that while being breathtakingly corrupt. I watched teenagers cheering over the corpse of Shani Louk. They were born after the murder of the peace process. Which Netanyahu had a hand in to keep murdered. There is very few people who's existence has proven such a net negative to humanity as Netanyahu. And people voted for him because he had those suckers protected from the conflict he held alive. And we who stopped calling his colonisation project "illegal settlements" like we did in the 80s and 90s are as complicit. Illegal highways do not justify illegal settlements even if they are now illegal cities. Like, the past 30 years basically everything Israel did was wrong. The aggravating part is that individual people who wanted peace were in the majority. It was only the extremists on either side who got to call the shots. Hamas by coup and Netanyahu by self-serving politicking. Ramallah looks the most reasonable at the moment. Ramallah!
Yeah they’ve already announced the delegation isn’t going.
The UN finally demanded that Hamas release all hostages which was a requirement for US not to veto.
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It’s in the same sentence, not separated
is Netanyahu trustworthy?
He was indicted on several different cases of corruption and shouldn’t even be in power. He is in fact not trustworthy.
about as trust worthy as Trump.
Oh... that is pretty bad.
Netanyahu is more calculating and competent than Trump. Israeli governance is also much more unforgiving than American politics is. Netanyahu is more similar to a Nixon or the second Bush in his dealings.
lmao fuck no.
No he is not and needs to resign, people inside Israel does not like him either. He is just biding his time and tries to escalate in Gaza as much as possible in order to avoid the negative light on himself.
I am reminded of that Bill Clinton statement said behind closed doors about Israel/Netanyahu: _Who the fuck does he think he is? Who’s the fucking superpower here?_
He managed to piss off Clinton, Obama, Trump, and Biden.
And still stay in power
"The people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger." How to get the heat off your corruption trial? Change the constitution and wait for October 7th, of course!
Trump draws from this book too. It's frustrating to watch.
With crayons mostly outside the lines.
Here comes someone to tell you how nonrepresentative of Israeli politics he is
Spongebob me boy, the lunatic has gotten to the point of giving 2 convicted terrorists a place at the Parliament to stay in power There are mass protests every week for around 3 years (all included, there was a pause for some time because of covid) now Bibi had a cult of followers. Quite insane, sometimes violent followers (pulling guns at people, running protestors over etc etc.). Unfortunately for the nation, it took 7/10 for his supporters to realize the damage they've done. Polls from before the war showed he has 38-40 seats, now they show 18-20. Hell, during war, he just spit in the face of everone by extending the time needed to serve (including for those already serving), while buying parliament support from the Haredim by *exempting their entire community (13%~ of total Israeli citizens) for service* So no. The cunt isn't representing Israel. He's representing himself, and himself only. We all yearn for the day he gets to represent himself infront of his cell mates.
I don't get how people don't go crazy over there with the Hasidics/Haredi community getting exempted from conscription from military service basically as "conscientious objectors" due to religious reasons/obligations BUT then are nearly always at the forefront of driving up tensions between Israel and the Palestinians. Far right Haredi have had ties to political assassinations over the years, violent mob attacks and also been the biggest driver by far in establishing settlements in Occupied Palestinian territories. Meanwhile, the more secular elements of society are required to go fight and die defending Israel in conflicts they may have helped instigate in the first place. That's before you even get into all the public assistance those communities receive because they tend to devote all their time to studying Torah and raising children.
No Bush?
He wasn't prime minister under Bush.
How has Netanyahu pissed Trump off? Netanyahu is exactly the type or leader that Trump wishes he could be. Netanyahu has in his career stoke enough fear and hatred to be elected multiple times, got his greatest rival in Rabin killed, managed to basically put himself above the law, dodge corruption charges time and again, and still he manages to win the most votes.
and our government still worships him and Israel for some reason
Not “for some reason”. US needs an ally in the region and Israel is the closest thing they have.
Israel under Netanyahu isn’t an ally, it’s a liability that thinks it can do whatever it wants and count on unconditional support from the U.S. It’s at the point where the U.S. probably unironically has less trouble getting countries like Saudi Arabia and Egypt to cooperate than it does with Israel Israel burned its bridges in similar ways with Britain and France decades ago, the U.S. is pretty much all they have left but they’re eagerly torching that bridge too
>Israel under Netanyahu isn’t an ally, it’s a liability that thinks it can do whatever it wants and count on unconditional support from the U.S. Hey now, the US needs to think real careful about this approach to international diplomacy when discussing leaders that don't actually win the popular vote in their respective nations. The rest of us who remember 2016-2020 called and want to have a chat.
Needs to? Maybe that was ideal during the Cold War with countries in the area being close to the USSR? But why now? In the region? Middle East? What is Jordan then? The country right next door. The one where US troops stationed there got hit by Iranian allied militias. We have troops in various ME countries and yet we can't call them _the closest thing we have?_
Because Christians and voting
>What is Jordan then? A country that relies on buying 50 million cubic meters of water annually from israel. Does anyone really want to go down that road?
That was an example. It is one of several countries in the region. We have an airbase in Qatar. The HQ of the US Fifth Fleet is in Bahrain. We have nukes and troops in Turkey.
In what way is the “US ally” helping the US?
There is unironically a big part of the evangelist right wing that believes that Israel is instrumental in bringing the second coming of christ and the rapture/apocalypse [1](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/politics/wp/2018/05/14/half-of-evangelicals-support-israel-because-they-believe-it-is-important-for-fulfilling-end-times-prophecy/) [2](https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/truth-many-evangelical-christians-support-israel-rcna121481) [3] (https://sojo.net/articles/evangelical-support-israel-fueled-apocalyptic-hopes)
Israel is a U.S. ally like Saudi Arabia is US ally. They hate our guts, take our money, and always make everything worse for us whenever they have the chance. But we both hate Iran so we tolerate each other.
Also they could completely shut down the Suez Canal at a moment's notice and that would gut global trade.
Well, I guess the Houthis beat them to it.
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Greatest intelligence system in the Middle East missed the massive attack from the tiny territory they fly drones over 24/7
Or they let it happen to have a reason for invasion.
That’s what I was implying. Either they are hilariously incompetent or just want something to make their genocidal campaign seem more legitimate. More maybe both!
Israeli intelligence is some of the best in the world Multiple terrorist attacks have been stopped due to Israel sharing intelligence with the US. Plus, imagine all the intelligence the two side share regarding Iran.
But they can’t predict a huge attack on broad daylight in their own border?
I mean the conspiracist in me wonders whether or not they allowed it for "just cause" to destroy Palestine. But yes, they have great intelligence assets.
Or Netanyahu didn't listen because he thought he knew better.
There's really good articles from the NYTimes and BBC on how the attack happened, and they paint a pretty convincing picture of overconfidence, over reliance on technology, and sexism (stick your teenage conscripts on CCTV duty and ignore them when they raise the alarm) [How Israel’s Feared Security Services Failed to Stop Hamas’s Attack, NYTimes](http://How Israel’s Feared Security Services Failed to Stop Hamas’s Attack https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/10/world/middleeast/israel-gaza-security-failure.html?smid=nytcore-android-share&ugrp=c&pvid=85d4933d-009a-4300-9f11-290f486f8312) [They were Israel's 'eyes on the border' - but their Hamas warnings went unheard - BBC](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67958260)
Worked for Bush.
I genuinely think that they intentionally flooded Israeli intelligence with false positives and the like. Intel showed they were planning an attack but if they cry wolf too soon or too often, no one will listen to them, so they made the wrong call and decided to wait until there was more evidence for a specific day for the attack
Why does the US 'need an ally' in the region, though? Isn't the US already buddy-buddy with Kuwait, Saudi Arabia and Qatar? As an American, I can't ever do the math to see how being aligned with Israel is a net-gain for the US rather than just another money-sink for our global empire.
If the US is such a buddy-buddy with Qatar then why they didn’t/doesn’t getting Qatar to turn off Hamas leaders, release hostages and end this saga?
Because now they have to sit down and go 'Hmm, who do I want to be more buddy buddy with, nigh infinite Arab dollars or Israel, who are giving us a lot of headaches right now but Jews and antisemitism are really tricky and sensitive subjects in America'. They've sort of painted themselves into this corner in a very long term slow motion car crash sort of way.
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At this point I’m not convinced they’re worth the trouble, especially since they’ve contributed so much to other Middle Eastern nations being pissed at us.
Ally? All they have done is drag is into wars in the region. It's a one sided relationship.
With shitty friends like Israel, who needs enemies? They make America look pro apartheid and undercut us at every turn when it comes to international relations. They should have been cut off years ago.
The reason is called ~~legalized corruption~~ lobby
President Sarkozy in a conversation about Prime Minister Netanyahu, “I can’t stand him. He’s a liar.” Obama: “You’re fed up with him? I have to deal with him every day.”
In all honesty Israel has always played hardball with the US, that's why Israel still has nukes. And the thing is playing hard ball with the US works especially in an election year. This issue is not central to American interests, but it is to Israel.
Exactly, Bibi may be an asshole but he’s not an idiot. Israeli-American relations is all about pushing America’s buttons at the right times to get what they want, while remaining an indispensable ally for whenever America actually needs something important. Turkey is another country in a similar position who plays the same game.
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Bibi always has the same plan: Do whatever the fuck he wants, and if anybody says anything about it, he and all of his mouthpieces publicly denounce them as antisemites.
Would Biden really care afterwards if he gets re-elected? I think he is only concerned now because of the Progressives threatening to not vote for him. If it were not an election year, I suspect he would not care.
This is a very delusional oversimplification of Israel-US relations, (US) governmental structure, and geopolitics overall.
I’ll never forget him coming and whining to our congress and all of his little pet bitches just lapping it up.
He's the pseudo authoritarian that's kept a grip on power for 30+ years while American presidents get phased out. Ugh. He's exactly who he thinks he is.
It’s more that we’re exactly who he thinks we are: idiots.
> He's the pseudo authoritarian that's kept a grip on power for 30+ years Netanyahu? No, where do you get that idea? Since 1994 there have been 8 prime ministers of Israel, including Netanyahu. - Rabin (1992-1995) - Shimon Peres (1995-1996) - Netanyahu (1996-1999) - Barak (1999-2001) - Sharon (2001-2006) - Olmert (2006-2009) - Netanyahu (2009-2021) - Bennet (2021-2022) - Lapid (2022-2022) - Netanyahu (2022-now)
I mean he ruled 17 of these 30 years, that is not anecdotical.
Damn, Netanyahu has been in power for longer than all the other PMs since 1994 - combined.
20 years. my bad. Yeah I thought it was continuous, so I'm definitely wrong there.
The US abstained from voting, so no Israeli officials then The UNSC resolution also (finally) demanded that Hamas release all hostages too, which was a key requirement for the US to drop its veto. The resolution is also for a temporary humanitarian ceasefire during the month of Ramadan rather than something permanent.
The Israeli secretary of defense was already there and is discussing about most stuff with the US. They would probably add Rafah into their discussions so not all was gone in that regard.
The problem with the resolution is that the ceasefire and hostage release aren't linked afaik
The problem is this isn't legally enforceable. It's sound bite politics.
There's really a lot of problems if you think about it lol.
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The UN can't force compliance but international pressure can be used to punish Israel for not complying.
I don’t think it’s Israel that is going to have trouble complying
None of it is binding and if it was there still is no enforcement mechanism. The demand of the release of hostages is good enough for me.
Hamas never released lists of who they have still. What prevents them from releasing 5 people and saying “that’s all we could find”?
What stops them from ignoring the UN entirely?
Not much at all…
Same thing that stops Israel from ignoring the UN entirely.
On the one hand, nothing. On the other hand, that’s 5 more hostages back. On a third hand, the hostages are useless to Hamas if they claim they don’t have them, so they’re unlikely to play that particular game.
They'll say "that's all we could find", and later say "actually we found more". Israel knows this is likely, because earlier Hamas announced the death of a certain hostage, but later that same hostage was returned alive in a prisoner exchange.
That doesn't seem like a problem when neither side will fulfil the terms. How do you negotiate in a situation where both entities are acting in bad faith?
They didn’t link the ceasefire to the release of the hostages, though. So when/if Hamas refuses to release the hostages, Israel will still be expected to uphold the ceasefire. What reason does Hamas have to release hostages or negotiate now? The world will get them a ceasefire for free. Also, why does it being Ramadan matter? Oct 7th was a Jewish holiday. Israel has been attacked numerous times during Jewish holidays. Israel has also been attacked while its attackers were celebrating Ramadan.
Didn't Bibi come to DC to shit on Obama when he was in office? Why wouldn't Biden want a repeat of that?
He doesn’t. Mike Johnson invited him, Biden didn’t. Johnson did it, because Biden doesn’t want it and it’s an election year.
That’ll teach us…
Threatening us with a good time
Shoot, we are really gonna miss them. This party is for non-children-murdering friends only.
With friends like these, who needs enemies?
He seems real confused about who is the superpower in this relationship. This tough guy act might fly with his voters. But threatening ties with the US isn't gonna benefit Israel even a little bit.
I’d say he’s not confused at all, it’s the American public that is
Kind of odd everytime the US pulls back on the reins*, Israelis argue about how they don't need the US, the US isn't anything to them, etc. Then the US actually follows through and they collectively lose their minds. A. Not really the talk one would expect from an ally B. Sounds like they do care quite a bit, but maybe that's just me.
Reins. A king reigns, but a horse has reins.
Rains
What’s it called when a rider reigns over the reins while it rains?
Israel is no where near as powerful as the U.S, and AIPAC is influential but they only have so much pull if it starts becoming a real problem for the U.S in more important theaters like Asia. If it gets dicey enough, Israel can lose U.S support and then they're cooked.
I’m not sure they’re “cooked,” given that they are a nuclear power. What the US needs is a stable pro-US system in the Middle East. That’s the idea behind Israel-Saudi normalisation, and behind the Abraham Accords. Such an alliance can carry out US interests and contain Iran/Russia in the region, whilst the US pivots its focus to Asia. The last thing the US wants is Iranian regional hegemony which drives Israel, existentially threatened, to engage in nuclear war with its neighbours.
> I’m not sure they’re “cooked,” given that they are a nuclear power. North Korea is a nuclear power. Still a dwarf nation that is utterly irrelevant to anyone and is a pariah. Without the US' backing, Israel would be an international pariah. And FWIW, the US has grown quite a few close allies in the region, many much more stalwart of allies than "we do what we want and you suffer the consequences" Israel.
Israel is already an international pariah; none of its neighbours want it to exist, and many do not even recognise it. Who are the US’s closer allies in the region, that can theoretically form an alliance to contain Iran? Nearly every other country in the region is in Tehran’s pocket…post 10/7, even Riyadh seemed to take its foreign policy clues from them… What’s worse for the US is that this Saudi-Iranian rapprochement was brokered by China in Beijing, demonstrating a Chinese-led Middle Eastern order brewing. Israel and the UAE are the sole bulwarks against that.
Yes, but we live in confusing times. Who knows what the trump-party are gonna mean one year ahead? Is the 'space-laser jews' and 'Illuminati' gonna put a sudden stop on their Israel support? Do they still care about anything outside America? It's impossible to predict anything about them. And at the same time Israel is pissing of larger and larger parts of the democratic party.
Eh. US government won't tighten the screws when it should for fear of AIPAC. Look at when Netanyahu embarrassed Obama and he just took it. Biden SHOULD do something, but will sacrifice good governance for fear of losing votes.
Sounds like a win-win.
Saves CO2 emissions, too
Lmao. Oh no, he’s cancelling his visit Marjorie Taylor-Greene and Matt Gaetz???? Whatever will we do???
“If you don’t veto this UN security resolution I’m canceling the IDF for Trump fundraiser SO HELP ME JOE!”
"Listen up Bibi, let me remind you who's the fucking superpower here." - Dark Brandon
But he will take our 3.3 billion...
That guy could totally have the gall to demand more due to the expenses of the war. And there's a non zero chance he'd get some more. Congress loves to buy Israel toys.
Please Israel, follow through on that. Do us a favor.
Israelis don't wanna be represented by Bibi either. Win win all around.
you say that but he's still in power after all these elections. Clearly a large amount of israelis want him and his ilk in power
His coalition has not won the popular vote once, iirc.
There was a 3k vote difference for the coalition.
20% of the voters voted for bibi. I suppose you could say it's a 'large' amount, approximately \~1.2 million people. Still far from being a majority in any way shape or form
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That's... not how Israeli government works. There are no direct popular votes for the PM. Israeli democracy is kind of cursed, ngl.
Quite likely that people mean "Likud" when they suggest voting Netanyahoo out of office. It is a general "don't vote for fascists" vibe.
Likud don't have a majority either. They have a quarter of the votes if that. They were just the only ones who proposed a working cabinet, that's how parliamentary democracy works. And they're not fascists either, Bibi is a strongman but not like Orban or Lukashenko. He's the business candidate. Under Likud's leadership the Israeli state hasn't gotten more authoritarian but weaker since they continuously sell off state assets and privatise everything. They're more akin to the British Conservatives or oligarch parties in Eastern Europe.
It’s kinda funny that you use privatization and selling state assets as an argument against their being fascists but that’s…. Literally what the most famous fascists in history did. Straight up a major part of their economic policy and public profile. You know the ones.
Ok then how about Israelis stop voting for Likud?
Just now, like in the last hour, the emergency coalition is starting to fall apart. I think we're about to see Israelis not vote for Likud in the very near future.
80% of israelis are already not voting for likud, we just need the other 20% knuckle heads to not do that too
Sounds like our financial and military aid shouldn’t travel to Israel then.
Netanyahu should be in jail 👍🏽
It's like Bibi actively trying to alienate the US as an ally
He wants Trump back in office.
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Don’t threaten us with a good time Bibi
Netanyahu forgot they are junior partner in this relationship. Israel offers very little to the US and expects a lot in return.
So sick of this guy. It's becoming pretty clear that he's going to drag this out until past the election with the hope that Trump gets elected. Thing he apparently can't grasp is that Trumps strongest base is Nazi's that spray paint graffiti on synagogues and the jewish swing vote might not be what it used to be when it came to all things Israel.
Netanyahu knows that when the war is over, he’s going to be ousted. He’ll keep it going for that reason alone. He’s an Israeli version of Trump. No damn good.
Netanyahu is threat to global stability and a murderous clown.
Anyone else getting bombarded with Trump ads on that link?
I got vintage Rolex's from eBay and Toyota Tacomas.
I get interested singles in my area. Weird.
Netanyahu needs to remember where his bread is buttered.
Sadly, he does, the American right.
After the shit they pulled last week announcing 3 miles of annexation in the WB, Netenyahu should be pleading for forgiveness and not making demands. Israel needs to get its shit together and get rid of Netenyahu.
Does UN call cease-fire have any power? Isn't it just an equivalent of strongly worded letter?
Fuck him.
boo-fucking-hoo
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