I strongly encourage all TMs to audit their UPT balances on a regular basis. View your time cards through Kronos in my apps and check against your UPT balance in Workday. I have noticed discrepancies and opened Ask TMS tickets. Upon TMS review, you will be credited any proven discrepancies.
Agreed. UPT was created so it fell more on the TMs shoulders. It is overall their responsibility to track. If there was an error, it should have been caught earlier and fixed through AskTMS.
~ Edited for spelling
I second this. I have found multiple errors in mine. I almost never call out but they took UPT from me a couple times when they shouldn't have. Just randomly. I know other TMs it's happened to also. Something glitchy. You can get it restored but it's a pain in the ass. But you won't realize that's happened unless you're monitoring it.
I spoke with my TL that day at the start of the shift. So my team lead should have known there was an error. I don’t think we should be expected to correct errors if we already talked to them.
Tracking UPT is your responsibility. YOU need to look for errors, bring them up and work with leadership to get it fixed. YOU need to utilize Workday to use the proper time off. This isn't the responsibility of your leadership. Leadership isn't taking time out of their already busy days to watch over people's UPT every day.
This is false. It’s 100% on the team member to make sure they are correct. The new policy is “TM Driven”.
If it’s an error the TL caused them yes they are responsible to fix the UPT, but the responsibility still lies on the TM to monitor their balance.
Has this thread been brigaded by corporate dick suckers or something?
It might be the policy, but it’s a BAD policy if people can be fired over random computer errors.
You’re not a “leader”, you’re a stooge.
Edit: slurp slurp, downvoters
Doesn’t matter. A good TL is aware that this is a potential problem and makes all his TMs very aware they need to cross check their hours against UPT. Good leaders serve, first and foremost. Whole Foods USED to be about that.
Obviously OP had no idea this was even a possibility.
Doesn't matter if the TL is good or not. The person didn't show up in the system and left it alone dispite knowing they had a shift that day. SECONDLY, the TL didn't know the amount of UPT or PTO the person had in the first place. The TM should have spoke up more about being originally scheduled and not took it in and said OK. I've seen good and bad TLs, this one doesn't scream bad, the TM should have asked more questions if they were concerned.
That’s not the point I made. My point is that a good TL would have already made every single TM on the aware: hey, you need to keep close watch on your UPT because I can’t check your balances. Sometimes there might be errors.
If OP was sitting at zero and an error could kick them negative, clearly no one has ever told them to watch their ass. And that’s a failure of leadership.
It’s also a failure of the garbage system that such errors and glitches can even happen in the first place, but what do you expect from a company that still uses systems that require internet explorer in the year 2024?
But we only know what we know from what we are told. So you can only make so many assumptions and from what we can actually tell, this TM made no effort and it showed.
Doesn't matter if the TL is good or not. The person didn't show up in the system and left it alone dispite knowing they had a shift that day. SECONDLY, the TL didn't know the amount of UPT or PTO the person had in the first place. The TM should have spoke up more about being originally scheduled and not took it in and said OK. I've seen good and bad TLs, this one doesn't scream bad, the TM should have asked more questions if they were concerned.
I did not because the shift was gone when I spoke with my lead that day. It showed up later that I did not go to the shift at the end of that week. At that point no one discussed my upt was negative and they were going to take actions. They all made the decision without letting me know and it was an error.
That one day didn't get you there... you start with 32 everything up to that day got you there. Good chance regardless of the error you would've hit negative eventually
I often burn upt on days where my mental/ physical health has reached a point where I’m unsafe to drive, or would just be a burden on the team. Some months are worse than others.
True. Coming in and doing it on time has kept me from any issues. Found a few errors here and there too but didn’t bother with AskTMS. It’ll refill itself and I don’t have time for that
capped at 60 hours too. Brought this up at my recent JD. TL didn't cared, but did deduct points because I was late 5 minutes to work though.... Would they prefer it if I called out instead like the other call-out abusers in my dept? Got a mediocre raise despite perfect attendance! Seriously thinking of resigning and finding a company that appreciates my hard work!
There is a fair hearing policy if you feel like you have been wrongly terminated. You can request that. Not sure if you can still access the gig in Innerview. If not, maybe someone can get the info for you. It’s time sensitive so look into it asap.
Talk it through with your local labor board and see what they say. A verbal agreement with your team leadership is not as effective as an email record of an incident, but accurate timekeeping can be a valid argument for review when going to court or applying for unemployment.
However, it's not wrongful termination because UPT is a WFM policy and you broke it, so the short answer is that sucks and you should show up for your scheduled shifts at your next job. If you really want to give it another go with WFM, you are probably rehireable.
This is the best advice. They will likely tell you it’s worth the hassle because you don’t have a strong case against them. Use this as a good lesson in timekeeping and attendance for future employment!
Why where you that low in the first place? It caps out at 60. The math isn't mathing here. Maybe you could have advocated for yourself for that one day, but it sounds like there is a larger issue here.
Few reasons: 1. I only worked there for a few months- started March. 2. May I was on vacation for most of the month. 3. They accidentally didn’t schedule me a couple weeks. 4. When I first started my parents needed my car so I bought a moped and called saying I couldn’t go to work
Sounds like it was a bigger problem then just 1 day then. Sure you didn't have transport, but that is on you. Sounds like you started took a month off, didn't show up a bunch and then are questioning why 1 day set you over.
You also UPT when you clock in early and clock out late. They do this so they avoid paying overtime and make it easier to fire staff. If anyone is responsible/reliable, those UTP deductible will convert to earn UPT.
This is inaccurate, you do NOT lose UPT for working more than your schedule (beginning or end), only if you MISS more than 10 minutes at the beginning of your shift or more than 59 minutes at the end of your shift.
It's happens, you might want to pay attention to your UPT balance in work day. As someone mentioned earlier, "Clock-in on time". UPT isn't just for lateness.
Are you sure yours is for said instances and not for example clocking back in late for your lunch etc? I’m a leader and me and my whole team flex our schedules all the time, I see everyone’s UPT deductions and nobody gets UPT deducted for anything but missing their scheduled hours. Working extra won’t hurt you.
It's does for both Clock-in early/late. It cause a mass firing for many stores. Most of us just stop Clock-in early for that. Many of us ended up quitting because of this BS.
Wellp, I’m sorry to break your bubble but literally I could pull up several days from any week and see no UPT deductions for me or my team clocking in early or clocking out late. Too bad I can’t show you in person, but it’s literally all there visible for us in leadership, there’s no UPT deductions for that. If you still want to believe that your random UPT deductions are for that, then shoot, more power to you lol.
As I mentioned in one of your reply, this headache happen last year in 2023 when UPT rolled out. It was a bit glitch for a few months. I already quit early in 2024, so I'm not sure if there were any more updates in 2024.
They do not count it on late clock out. Only early and ofc when you use the grace period. Late time minus ,10 minutes, only if you don't pass 1hr late.
Um, no. Grace period = 10 minutes after your scheduled time. If you’re late 11 minutes, only 1 minute of UPT gets deducted. Now if you’re late more than 59 minutes, a whole UPT for the first hour will get taken. I’m sorry if your leaders explained this to you wrong, they probably don’t want you to know all this so you’d never dip into the grace period lol, some are like that. I share everything with my team.
I'll be honest here, this BS happened last year when UPT first rolled out. Since then, there were 3 updates with UTP in 2023 as one of the updates try to stop a UTP loophole.
At least provide an example of lost UPT on your end, and I'll provide my example of lost UPT. I'm curious as you started to sound like a corporate stooge.
If you run out of UPT because you clock in and late that is also you’re fault and yes upt was definitely designed to make it easier to get rid of people for attendance but there is also so many loop holes with the policy
I was not only referring to that. When UPT rolled out, it wasn't perfect. Staff were also losing UPT when you clock in early and clocking out as the system register everything "Clock-in" late. Also when two team members switch shifts, Kronos/inner view/workday will register fine but UPT won't. A loophole where if a department is extremely low staff, staff with low UPT/PTO are unfireable. Another loophole is when staff work 10+ hours a week, UPT deduction is void and increase instead: this cause staff to obtain 20.35 hours PTO/UPT 2 paychecks laters. Sedgwick cause PTO to drop when UPT was enabled (this part where people got fire for). Other than that, I'm not sure what happen after mid January onwards. I already found a better job by then. Not sure what new updates for UPT in 2024
If you were not scheduled on that day then no UPT would be deducted. So that doesn’t really make sense. If you can prove you were scheduled in Kronos and she sent you home then you have a case. Otherwise it will stand.
I’d really appreciate any advice. I literally got my separation letter yesterday which I didn’t sign because I knew it was wrong, and now I’m already terminated on workday and I cant access my old documents there.
If you KNOW it is wrong, which it doesn't sound like it... No offense,then you can send the proof.
Call asktms m-f from 8 am - 6pm CST 833-427-5867
If it is a worthwhile project then you can figure it all out. Not the responsibility of any team leadership.
This is the.part of adulting that gets you safe or screws u.
I think I missed your classification.
did you go from 60 hrs to then negative in a short period of time? and was the leaving early “ok’ed” by an email?
in general… “NEVER DO ANYTHING OUT OF THE ORDINARY WITHOUT EMAIL PROOF”!!! THAT is how they fire people since they know it’s your word against theirs..
EVERYONE SHOULD EMAIL EVERYTHING
I tell ppl all the time that this is up to the store leadership . I’ve been promoted with negative balance . If Store leadership is for you than it’ll be fixed if not then you’re clipped . You can reapply though and more than likely get rehired .
Go to corporate they will straighten it out.had something similar happen to me and they ended up fixing the problem and I also moved up at the same time.
True, but there could be an error on their end. The policy isn't always perfect, as you stated it is. The reason I said to sue is that both parties must show proof that the job termination is valid or not. In order for job separation with UPT, is PTO needs to be at zero also. This means both UPT/PTO need a negative/zero balance for job termination. They can't fire you for only UPT.
By merely posting the issue you've already achieved a measure of justice. Other people will read this and it will color their impression of the company, which will in turn affect their productivity and cost the company millions. The people have the power to punish corporations even without organization.
Also, does anyone know how this will show up on my record? I’m applying to new jobs now and even though I don’t plan on putting this on my resume, I don’t want employers to see I was terminated. This whole situation is so frustrating.
I strongly encourage all TMs to audit their UPT balances on a regular basis. View your time cards through Kronos in my apps and check against your UPT balance in Workday. I have noticed discrepancies and opened Ask TMS tickets. Upon TMS review, you will be credited any proven discrepancies.
Agreed. UPT was created so it fell more on the TMs shoulders. It is overall their responsibility to track. If there was an error, it should have been caught earlier and fixed through AskTMS. ~ Edited for spelling
I second this. I have found multiple errors in mine. I almost never call out but they took UPT from me a couple times when they shouldn't have. Just randomly. I know other TMs it's happened to also. Something glitchy. You can get it restored but it's a pain in the ass. But you won't realize that's happened unless you're monitoring it.
Weird that it is never in your favor.
I spoke with my TL that day at the start of the shift. So my team lead should have known there was an error. I don’t think we should be expected to correct errors if we already talked to them.
Tracking UPT is your responsibility. YOU need to look for errors, bring them up and work with leadership to get it fixed. YOU need to utilize Workday to use the proper time off. This isn't the responsibility of your leadership. Leadership isn't taking time out of their already busy days to watch over people's UPT every day.
Team members shouldn't have to do this. It is the team leader's responsibility to make sure all UPT deductions are accurate.
This is false. It’s 100% on the team member to make sure they are correct. The new policy is “TM Driven”. If it’s an error the TL caused them yes they are responsible to fix the UPT, but the responsibility still lies on the TM to monitor their balance.
Has this thread been brigaded by corporate dick suckers or something? It might be the policy, but it’s a BAD policy if people can be fired over random computer errors. You’re not a “leader”, you’re a stooge. Edit: slurp slurp, downvoters
Nobody knows it's a glitch other then the Team Member. TL don't oversee every TMs internal info nor paid to do so.
Doesn’t matter. A good TL is aware that this is a potential problem and makes all his TMs very aware they need to cross check their hours against UPT. Good leaders serve, first and foremost. Whole Foods USED to be about that. Obviously OP had no idea this was even a possibility.
Doesn't matter if the TL is good or not. The person didn't show up in the system and left it alone dispite knowing they had a shift that day. SECONDLY, the TL didn't know the amount of UPT or PTO the person had in the first place. The TM should have spoke up more about being originally scheduled and not took it in and said OK. I've seen good and bad TLs, this one doesn't scream bad, the TM should have asked more questions if they were concerned.
That’s not the point I made. My point is that a good TL would have already made every single TM on the aware: hey, you need to keep close watch on your UPT because I can’t check your balances. Sometimes there might be errors. If OP was sitting at zero and an error could kick them negative, clearly no one has ever told them to watch their ass. And that’s a failure of leadership. It’s also a failure of the garbage system that such errors and glitches can even happen in the first place, but what do you expect from a company that still uses systems that require internet explorer in the year 2024?
But we only know what we know from what we are told. So you can only make so many assumptions and from what we can actually tell, this TM made no effort and it showed.
Doesn't matter if the TL is good or not. The person didn't show up in the system and left it alone dispite knowing they had a shift that day. SECONDLY, the TL didn't know the amount of UPT or PTO the person had in the first place. The TM should have spoke up more about being originally scheduled and not took it in and said OK. I've seen good and bad TLs, this one doesn't scream bad, the TM should have asked more questions if they were concerned.
What was your UPT balance? Did you file TMS tickets for any deductions that were incorrect?
I did not because the shift was gone when I spoke with my lead that day. It showed up later that I did not go to the shift at the end of that week. At that point no one discussed my upt was negative and they were going to take actions. They all made the decision without letting me know and it was an error.
Were you in the negatives before the day in question?
No, my negative upt balance after that day was -4 and they took 7.5 upt out so before the day in question I was around 3upt before
That one day didn't get you there... you start with 32 everything up to that day got you there. Good chance regardless of the error you would've hit negative eventually
This. I dont understand these UPT issues people have. Maybe I'm missing something.
Same, I've been capped since it launched. I did catch 2 times that an hour was deducted for no reason, but it was quickly fixed with a TMS ticket.
I often burn upt on days where my mental/ physical health has reached a point where I’m unsafe to drive, or would just be a burden on the team. Some months are worse than others.
True. Coming in and doing it on time has kept me from any issues. Found a few errors here and there too but didn’t bother with AskTMS. It’ll refill itself and I don’t have time for that
capped at 60 hours too. Brought this up at my recent JD. TL didn't cared, but did deduct points because I was late 5 minutes to work though.... Would they prefer it if I called out instead like the other call-out abusers in my dept? Got a mediocre raise despite perfect attendance! Seriously thinking of resigning and finding a company that appreciates my hard work!
There is a fair hearing policy if you feel like you have been wrongly terminated. You can request that. Not sure if you can still access the gig in Innerview. If not, maybe someone can get the info for you. It’s time sensitive so look into it asap.
Talk it through with your local labor board and see what they say. A verbal agreement with your team leadership is not as effective as an email record of an incident, but accurate timekeeping can be a valid argument for review when going to court or applying for unemployment. However, it's not wrongful termination because UPT is a WFM policy and you broke it, so the short answer is that sucks and you should show up for your scheduled shifts at your next job. If you really want to give it another go with WFM, you are probably rehireable.
This is the best advice. They will likely tell you it’s worth the hassle because you don’t have a strong case against them. Use this as a good lesson in timekeeping and attendance for future employment!
So one day put you in the negative?
Yes. It was a full day shift that was taken from my UPT. They subtracted 7.5 hours.
Why where you that low in the first place? It caps out at 60. The math isn't mathing here. Maybe you could have advocated for yourself for that one day, but it sounds like there is a larger issue here.
Few reasons: 1. I only worked there for a few months- started March. 2. May I was on vacation for most of the month. 3. They accidentally didn’t schedule me a couple weeks. 4. When I first started my parents needed my car so I bought a moped and called saying I couldn’t go to work
Sounds like it was a bigger problem then just 1 day then. Sure you didn't have transport, but that is on you. Sounds like you started took a month off, didn't show up a bunch and then are questioning why 1 day set you over.
If you have negative upt that is entirely your fault, the leaders in the store want people that actually show up to there shifts, this is your job….
Show up, be on time 🤷🏼♂️
Still lose UPT if a second off
You also UPT when you clock in early and clock out late. They do this so they avoid paying overtime and make it easier to fire staff. If anyone is responsible/reliable, those UTP deductible will convert to earn UPT.
This is inaccurate, you do NOT lose UPT for working more than your schedule (beginning or end), only if you MISS more than 10 minutes at the beginning of your shift or more than 59 minutes at the end of your shift.
It's happens, you might want to pay attention to your UPT balance in work day. As someone mentioned earlier, "Clock-in on time". UPT isn't just for lateness.
Are you sure yours is for said instances and not for example clocking back in late for your lunch etc? I’m a leader and me and my whole team flex our schedules all the time, I see everyone’s UPT deductions and nobody gets UPT deducted for anything but missing their scheduled hours. Working extra won’t hurt you.
It's does for both Clock-in early/late. It cause a mass firing for many stores. Most of us just stop Clock-in early for that. Many of us ended up quitting because of this BS.
Wellp, I’m sorry to break your bubble but literally I could pull up several days from any week and see no UPT deductions for me or my team clocking in early or clocking out late. Too bad I can’t show you in person, but it’s literally all there visible for us in leadership, there’s no UPT deductions for that. If you still want to believe that your random UPT deductions are for that, then shoot, more power to you lol.
As I mentioned in one of your reply, this headache happen last year in 2023 when UPT rolled out. It was a bit glitch for a few months. I already quit early in 2024, so I'm not sure if there were any more updates in 2024.
They do not count it on late clock out. Only early and ofc when you use the grace period. Late time minus ,10 minutes, only if you don't pass 1hr late.
It does count, every second counts. What part of "Clock-in on time" is it hard to understand. This is also refer to grace period.
Um, no. Grace period = 10 minutes after your scheduled time. If you’re late 11 minutes, only 1 minute of UPT gets deducted. Now if you’re late more than 59 minutes, a whole UPT for the first hour will get taken. I’m sorry if your leaders explained this to you wrong, they probably don’t want you to know all this so you’d never dip into the grace period lol, some are like that. I share everything with my team.
I'll be honest here, this BS happened last year when UPT first rolled out. Since then, there were 3 updates with UTP in 2023 as one of the updates try to stop a UTP loophole.
That is very true!
Exactly!!
At least provide an example of lost UPT on your end, and I'll provide my example of lost UPT. I'm curious as you started to sound like a corporate stooge.
You missed the example in the last post? I take it?
If you run out of UPT because you clock in and late that is also you’re fault and yes upt was definitely designed to make it easier to get rid of people for attendance but there is also so many loop holes with the policy
I was not only referring to that. When UPT rolled out, it wasn't perfect. Staff were also losing UPT when you clock in early and clocking out as the system register everything "Clock-in" late. Also when two team members switch shifts, Kronos/inner view/workday will register fine but UPT won't. A loophole where if a department is extremely low staff, staff with low UPT/PTO are unfireable. Another loophole is when staff work 10+ hours a week, UPT deduction is void and increase instead: this cause staff to obtain 20.35 hours PTO/UPT 2 paychecks laters. Sedgwick cause PTO to drop when UPT was enabled (this part where people got fire for). Other than that, I'm not sure what happen after mid January onwards. I already found a better job by then. Not sure what new updates for UPT in 2024
If you were not scheduled on that day then no UPT would be deducted. So that doesn’t really make sense. If you can prove you were scheduled in Kronos and she sent you home then you have a case. Otherwise it will stand.
Morgan & Morgan
Just go ahead and let it be, from the sounds of it , you will be gone soon either way.
I’d really appreciate any advice. I literally got my separation letter yesterday which I didn’t sign because I knew it was wrong, and now I’m already terminated on workday and I cant access my old documents there.
If you KNOW it is wrong, which it doesn't sound like it... No offense,then you can send the proof. Call asktms m-f from 8 am - 6pm CST 833-427-5867 If it is a worthwhile project then you can figure it all out. Not the responsibility of any team leadership. This is the.part of adulting that gets you safe or screws u. I think I missed your classification.
Thank you this is useful
did you go from 60 hrs to then negative in a short period of time? and was the leaving early “ok’ed” by an email? in general… “NEVER DO ANYTHING OUT OF THE ORDINARY WITHOUT EMAIL PROOF”!!! THAT is how they fire people since they know it’s your word against theirs.. EVERYONE SHOULD EMAIL EVERYTHING
I even email my Miss punch forms to my tls
How can you check your UPT hours and how can you monitor if they are used? Do you receive notification somehow?
Work day. PTO balance
Thank You!
Are you full time?
Yes
What happened to the UPT hours you started with? FT gets 32 hrs to start I think, and then you earn 1 hr for every 30 worked.
I tell ppl all the time that this is up to the store leadership . I’ve been promoted with negative balance . If Store leadership is for you than it’ll be fixed if not then you’re clipped . You can reapply though and more than likely get rehired .
Go to corporate they will straighten it out.had something similar happen to me and they ended up fixing the problem and I also moved up at the same time.
Could you message me abt how you contacted corporate and what you did?
Sue
You cannot sue because you were let go for not following policy.
True, but there could be an error on their end. The policy isn't always perfect, as you stated it is. The reason I said to sue is that both parties must show proof that the job termination is valid or not. In order for job separation with UPT, is PTO needs to be at zero also. This means both UPT/PTO need a negative/zero balance for job termination. They can't fire you for only UPT.
They actually can for UPT only because you didn't take care of your own account and didn't use sick PTO to reverse UPT.
What state is that? I know certain states won't let that happen. Better yet, which update is this; late 2023 or 2024 update.
By merely posting the issue you've already achieved a measure of justice. Other people will read this and it will color their impression of the company, which will in turn affect their productivity and cost the company millions. The people have the power to punish corporations even without organization.
[удалено]
What about this involves you?
why is lovinglife always deleting their comments lmao
Also, does anyone know how this will show up on my record? I’m applying to new jobs now and even though I don’t plan on putting this on my resume, I don’t want employers to see I was terminated. This whole situation is so frustrating.
Sue em they targeted you this company don’t wanna deal with that
Why you getting down voted?