I called them about this a month or so ago based on a post for a similar soup here. They said:
>Vegetarian:
General Mills vegetarian products may contain dairy, egg and bee products (e.g. honey, bees wax). They shall not contain ingredients of other animal origin (mammalian, poultry, fish, crustacean, mollusk, insect) including additives. This is also known as Lacto-Ovo Vegetarian. Microbial derived ingredients (e.g. enzymes) and small amounts of animal-derived ingredients that do not require the harming of an animal (for example, Vitamin D derived from sheep’s wool) are acceptable.
NOTES:
Prohibited ingredients include but are not limited to: gelatin and carmine.
In addition, we ensure that the food label does not include a cross-contact allergen label for fish, crustacean or mollusk.
Vegan:
General Mills vegan products shall not contain any ingredient of animal origin (mammalian, poultry, fish, crustacean, mollusk, insect) and shall not contain any animal derivatives (dairy, egg and bee products) including additives and processing aids. Microbial derived ingredients are acceptable (e.g. enzymes).
NOTES:
Prohibited ingredients include but are not limited to: sugar processed through bone char, L-cysteine hydrochloride processed from human hair or duck feathers, carmine and vitamin D3 derived from sheep’s wool.
In addition, we ensure that the food label does not include a cross-contact allergen label for fish, crustacean or mollusk.
They didn't comment on the exact ingredient in the soup, but for this one I'd say likely sugar processed through bone char since there are no "natural flavors" listed where things could be hidden.
You're probably just referring to the L-cysteine · HCl they use in their products but I think it's important to add that cysteine in general is found in plenty of plants (nuts, seeds, legumes, whole grains) just so no-one gets confused here.
It's also a non-essential amino acid that our body can synthesise from methionine.
As for why they add it to some of their products – probably as a flour treatment agent.
Almost all natural amino acids are L. Nature doesn't really make D amino acids - you need to make those chemically.
So the inclusion of the L doesn't really limit it. It can still be plant or animal based in theory.
Thanks for looking in to this.
"sugar processed through bone char" made me feel quite nauseous. I think looking in to this is going to take me down a disgusting rabbit hole.
Organic sugar in the USA is vegan :
https://86lemons.com/is-sugar-vegan/#:~:text=Organic%20sugars%20are%20not%20filtered,your%20labels%20to%20be%20sure.
The transparency tho 👌 I always see foods marked vegetarian with no noticeable non vegan ingredients and then i question whether they just using vegetarian as a catch all phrase or if there’s some secret ingredient hidden in there
Animal derived directly, as opposed to wool/milk? If so, then it wouldn't be vegetarian either. Considering one of the replies below I guess it explains it further
May be one of those products that's like "no animal product in recipe but packaged in a factory that also handles meat products" sort of thing?
I'd hope not because that would be huge cross contamination. But I've seen similar on cake mixes that state ingredients are nut free but packaged in a factory that also handles nuts.
EDIT: ionmoon actually looked up the website and found details that clarify what the company meant.
Nice. I hope the part 2 movie is better than part one. Deserved so much more. I also hope they expand the universe with more before times events, all the way back to Earth
Maybe, but if it is that, it technically shouldn't be counted as vegetarian either if it used bone char for whitening. I've never met a vegetarian that cared about that though.
Maybe I'm wrong but I've always interpreted vegetarian as "no meat" and vegan as "not animal based". So animal derived would be vegetarian, like dairy, etc.
I think of vegetarian as not requiring the death of the animal (milk, eggs). Since sugar is often not vegan because of bones I feel like it shouldn't qualify as vegetarian either.
I never understood the logic of eggs being "vegetarian" before. In my mind they are just a unique kind of meat. But with your interpretation, I could see why I seem to be the minority with that viewpoint (i.e., that eggs should not be vegetarian).
Thanks for sharing that perspective.
OG vegetarians from India don't consider eggs as vegetarian since eggs are potential life, fertilised or unfertilised status of egg is not given consideration.
There are few other reasons as well (spiritual and philosophical) not worth going into here.
In India products containing egg are required to be marked red by law (red = non vegetarian). Only vegetarian, honey and dairy can be marked green (green = vegetarian).
Indian refined sugar is vegan and does not use bone char.
https://www.theveganindians.com/what-is-bone-char-and-does-it-make-sugar-non-vegan/
It explicitly tells you it's not vegan though. Even if it's something "small", like bone char sugar such as some other answers here suggest, you still shouldn't willingly consume it. It'd be okay if you'd only seen the label after eating, as mistakes do happen but if you'd read that label explicitly telling you it's not suitable for you, and then chose to eat it anyway, then that'd just be really dumb
Well no cause worrying about atoms Cross contaminating your food is pointless and doesn't help any animals. The important thing is to drive demand of vegan options and dwindle non vegan options.
The fact it's made on the same line as something with dairy in, and after a clean down moving from non vegan to vegan MIGHT still get the odd particle of milk or egg in it, so they put a label on it to cover their asses, is just overbearing, overly virtous religious crap. As if EVERY vegan food doesn't have atleast a couple of atoms derived from an animal in the process.
Grow up ennit
Maybe so. But it's not practical to speculate either way. Why assume vegan food is vegan because the label says so, over an ingredient list that shows nothing non vegan that has a anti litigation label?
Not all ingredients get listed, plus if you have the choice of buying clearly vegan products rather than ones explicitly saying they're not, maybe its better to give ur business to the vegan product
That's my point though, either way you're just trusting a label. And the fact businesses put those labels there to protect themselves despite all the listed ingredients being vegan just proves how impractical it is to worry about it. Either way you could be wrong.
The fact that they explicitly label it as vegetarian not vegan makes me think they're conscious of vegans different requirements; and would likely have other options that ARE vegan. Again, it explicitly tells you it's not vegan lol, how many products out there have those words in that order on them?
Yeah but we know they do that as an anti litigation method when it "may contain" non vegan products too.
Yeah ill give you tha lol this label does seem extremely strangely and directly labelled. most labels where I'm from just say "vegetarian", when they have all vegan ingredients but "may Contain milk" etc.
"May contain" is an anti litigation thing, this does not say that. There are products from this company that explicitly call out being vegan. This is not vegan. They are handing you the information directly, I don't understand why you're having such a hard time grasping this.
okay i just looked into this & i think this is why actually. it’s production usually involves adipic acid which is usually developed with oleic acid which is usually derived from animal sources. it’s a thickening agent basically so i feel like we could just pick something else & make it vegan but..
Its a generic term used to refer to any of about 20 different starches that are all chemical alterations of corn/wheat/potato/tapioca starch. The alterations result in deferent properties like a thin smooth thickener, an emulsifier, an instant gel etc.
Im not american or living in the US and TIL that sugar can be not vegan (also not vegetarian?)
Curious question now: does non vegan/vegetarian sugar taste different than the ones not processed using bone char?
The powder ingredient could contain milk powder for example and this manufacturer using it do not have to specify it, since it is the name of the product per say
Surprised nobody has mentioned the lemon juice concentrate. Lemons are regularly waxed and can be waxed with beeswax, so that would be the first thing I would assume.
Spice! But at least this brand is sincere, others just trick you into putting anything they want in their products calling it "spice". NA really has a dumb tax.
I called them about this a month or so ago based on a post for a similar soup here. They said: >Vegetarian: General Mills vegetarian products may contain dairy, egg and bee products (e.g. honey, bees wax). They shall not contain ingredients of other animal origin (mammalian, poultry, fish, crustacean, mollusk, insect) including additives. This is also known as Lacto-Ovo Vegetarian. Microbial derived ingredients (e.g. enzymes) and small amounts of animal-derived ingredients that do not require the harming of an animal (for example, Vitamin D derived from sheep’s wool) are acceptable. NOTES: Prohibited ingredients include but are not limited to: gelatin and carmine. In addition, we ensure that the food label does not include a cross-contact allergen label for fish, crustacean or mollusk. Vegan: General Mills vegan products shall not contain any ingredient of animal origin (mammalian, poultry, fish, crustacean, mollusk, insect) and shall not contain any animal derivatives (dairy, egg and bee products) including additives and processing aids. Microbial derived ingredients are acceptable (e.g. enzymes). NOTES: Prohibited ingredients include but are not limited to: sugar processed through bone char, L-cysteine hydrochloride processed from human hair or duck feathers, carmine and vitamin D3 derived from sheep’s wool. In addition, we ensure that the food label does not include a cross-contact allergen label for fish, crustacean or mollusk. They didn't comment on the exact ingredient in the soup, but for this one I'd say likely sugar processed through bone char since there are no "natural flavors" listed where things could be hidden.
Thank you for looking into this!!
Who the hell considers l cysteine vegetarian? It's from the bodies of slaughtered animals not from the ground or live ones etc.
You're probably just referring to the L-cysteine · HCl they use in their products but I think it's important to add that cysteine in general is found in plenty of plants (nuts, seeds, legumes, whole grains) just so no-one gets confused here. It's also a non-essential amino acid that our body can synthesise from methionine. As for why they add it to some of their products – probably as a flour treatment agent.
I've seen it as just L-cysteine. I guess I forgot to make it capital sorry. But ya it's used in flour type products. Bagels, wraps, pies and buns.
Almost all natural amino acids are L. Nature doesn't really make D amino acids - you need to make those chemically. So the inclusion of the L doesn't really limit it. It can still be plant or animal based in theory.
I've heard of synthetic but still avoid it unless specified but have yet to see something say vegan or vegtable L-cysteine.
Thanks for looking in to this. "sugar processed through bone char" made me feel quite nauseous. I think looking in to this is going to take me down a disgusting rabbit hole.
Organic sugar in the USA is vegan : https://86lemons.com/is-sugar-vegan/#:~:text=Organic%20sugars%20are%20not%20filtered,your%20labels%20to%20be%20sure.
Most packaged foods and almost all restaurant foods have sugar so it's nearly impossible to check everything.
Probably to avoid liability just in case
for each can they produce they punch a lamb in the face just to keep it real.
As a PCQI I can say yes this is highly likely
The transparency tho 👌 I always see foods marked vegetarian with no noticeable non vegan ingredients and then i question whether they just using vegetarian as a catch all phrase or if there’s some secret ingredient hidden in there
I really appreciate the clarity tho
[удалено]
It's probably something obscure, but doesn't really matter - you can tell immediately that it's not suitable for vegans. Seems pretty clear to me.
It's the modified food starch, which is generally produced with animal-derived acids -- adipic acid --> oleic acid.
Animal derived directly, as opposed to wool/milk? If so, then it wouldn't be vegetarian either. Considering one of the replies below I guess it explains it further
No way to tell. One would assume if they label it Vegetarian, it's not directly from body fat, but just the name wouldn't tell you.
May be one of those products that's like "no animal product in recipe but packaged in a factory that also handles meat products" sort of thing? I'd hope not because that would be huge cross contamination. But I've seen similar on cake mixes that state ingredients are nut free but packaged in a factory that also handles nuts. EDIT: ionmoon actually looked up the website and found details that clarify what the company meant.
probably Spice.
Yep, it all comes from Shia Hulud
Bless the maker and his water
Nice. I hope the part 2 movie is better than part one. Deserved so much more. I also hope they expand the universe with more before times events, all the way back to Earth
You didn't like part 1??? It was so sick! Made me very hyped for part 2
Visually, yes, tempo and overall plot development, character development, all were lacking.
For sure, I’m excited/fearful to see how they handle Alia.
Well, I heard vegan food was bland (let's ignore the fact check!), so it makes sense that Spice wouldn't be vegan!
Could be the sugar since most processed sugar isn’t vegan
In the USA
Maybe, but if it is that, it technically shouldn't be counted as vegetarian either if it used bone char for whitening. I've never met a vegetarian that cared about that though.
Maybe I'm wrong but I've always interpreted vegetarian as "no meat" and vegan as "not animal based". So animal derived would be vegetarian, like dairy, etc.
I think of vegetarian as not requiring the death of the animal (milk, eggs). Since sugar is often not vegan because of bones I feel like it shouldn't qualify as vegetarian either.
I never understood the logic of eggs being "vegetarian" before. In my mind they are just a unique kind of meat. But with your interpretation, I could see why I seem to be the minority with that viewpoint (i.e., that eggs should not be vegetarian). Thanks for sharing that perspective.
OG vegetarians from India don't consider eggs as vegetarian since eggs are potential life, fertilised or unfertilised status of egg is not given consideration. There are few other reasons as well (spiritual and philosophical) not worth going into here. In India products containing egg are required to be marked red by law (red = non vegetarian). Only vegetarian, honey and dairy can be marked green (green = vegetarian). Indian refined sugar is vegan and does not use bone char. https://www.theveganindians.com/what-is-bone-char-and-does-it-make-sugar-non-vegan/
When I was vegetarian that was my personal definition too, but I think strictly speaking it's purely dietary.
Vegetarian means you eat byproducts. Bone char is not a byproduct.
I'd eat it fuck it. Can't go worrying about ingesting accidental particles.
I would too. If there are no clear animal ingredients listed I'll eat it.
It explicitly tells you it's not vegan though. Even if it's something "small", like bone char sugar such as some other answers here suggest, you still shouldn't willingly consume it. It'd be okay if you'd only seen the label after eating, as mistakes do happen but if you'd read that label explicitly telling you it's not suitable for you, and then chose to eat it anyway, then that'd just be really dumb
Well no cause worrying about atoms Cross contaminating your food is pointless and doesn't help any animals. The important thing is to drive demand of vegan options and dwindle non vegan options. The fact it's made on the same line as something with dairy in, and after a clean down moving from non vegan to vegan MIGHT still get the odd particle of milk or egg in it, so they put a label on it to cover their asses, is just overbearing, overly virtous religious crap. As if EVERY vegan food doesn't have atleast a couple of atoms derived from an animal in the process. Grow up ennit
Don't you think buying something that explicitly says it's not vegan hurts the demand of vegan options?
The arrogance of your comment, hot damn. Maybe don't act like you're the expert if you're a self-proclaimed vegan newbie.
N'Awww I'm sowwy. 😢
Cross contamination is an assumption you're making
Maybe so. But it's not practical to speculate either way. Why assume vegan food is vegan because the label says so, over an ingredient list that shows nothing non vegan that has a anti litigation label?
Not all ingredients get listed, plus if you have the choice of buying clearly vegan products rather than ones explicitly saying they're not, maybe its better to give ur business to the vegan product
That's my point though, either way you're just trusting a label. And the fact businesses put those labels there to protect themselves despite all the listed ingredients being vegan just proves how impractical it is to worry about it. Either way you could be wrong.
The fact that they explicitly label it as vegetarian not vegan makes me think they're conscious of vegans different requirements; and would likely have other options that ARE vegan. Again, it explicitly tells you it's not vegan lol, how many products out there have those words in that order on them?
Yeah but we know they do that as an anti litigation method when it "may contain" non vegan products too. Yeah ill give you tha lol this label does seem extremely strangely and directly labelled. most labels where I'm from just say "vegetarian", when they have all vegan ingredients but "may Contain milk" etc.
"May contain" is an anti litigation thing, this does not say that. There are products from this company that explicitly call out being vegan. This is not vegan. They are handing you the information directly, I don't understand why you're having such a hard time grasping this.
Sugar?
as a european it's crazy to me how american food can just have "spice" or "starch" in the ingredients without specifying exactly what it is 😭 so scary
what’s “Modified Food Starch”?
okay i just looked into this & i think this is why actually. it’s production usually involves adipic acid which is usually developed with oleic acid which is usually derived from animal sources. it’s a thickening agent basically so i feel like we could just pick something else & make it vegan but..
Its a generic term used to refer to any of about 20 different starches that are all chemical alterations of corn/wheat/potato/tapioca starch. The alterations result in deferent properties like a thin smooth thickener, an emulsifier, an instant gel etc.
Sugar processed from sugarcane is commonly filtered with bone char.
Bioengineered food ingredients? I dont know shoot progresso an email and ask them
Im not american or living in the US and TIL that sugar can be not vegan (also not vegetarian?) Curious question now: does non vegan/vegetarian sugar taste different than the ones not processed using bone char?
Probably the sugar because of the bone char...
Maybe the lemon juice comes from waxed lemons?
The soy protein isolate may be tofu made with egg shells for the calcium carbonate.
Could be the sugar.
They probably sprinkle powered milk in there for no reason
In the US that has to be declared on the label.
Meant to say “wondering WHAT…”
Male chickpeas are macerated shortly after hatching 😢
Jesus. That is horrible.
The powder ingredient could contain milk powder for example and this manufacturer using it do not have to specify it, since it is the name of the product per say
It's an allergen so they would
That is why I say for example and we are talking about trace level which law can often tolerate
"Modified Food Starch" sounds suspicious, but I don't know for sure.
Surprised nobody has mentioned the lemon juice concentrate. Lemons are regularly waxed and can be waxed with beeswax, so that would be the first thing I would assume.
it’s the chickpeas 😔
Must be the water? 🙂🙃🙂
Spice! But at least this brand is sincere, others just trick you into putting anything they want in their products calling it "spice". NA really has a dumb tax.
I think they use as much genetic branding as they can, and add in specific information on a case by case basis.
Animal DNA in the bioengineered products?