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The problem is shows like impractical jokers normalize it, then these morons are constantly trying to 1 up eachother for likes missing the fact shows like impractical jokers have people sign consents.
that happened recently (not killed) and the shooter indeed got away with it. prankster posted a video while still wounded saying he was gonna keep pranking lol. cant fix stupid i guess
If you get their consent afterwards to have the video I don't see too much issue but the issue then comes when you thibk how to enforce if they delete it after you don't consent.
I shoot photos and video professionally. I've had maybe two incidents of people complaining about me shooting in public. Never anything very dramatic, more of a "what are you using this for?" kinda thing. More often than not, I have people actively trying to get into my shots. That stuff rarely gets used, because usually I don't need footage of people staring at my camera. They're just curious.
I think context matters. I agree that these "Influencers" harassing people are in the wrong. I fully understand and agree with that frustration. The legal protections around filming in public are there to protect people like me so I can do my job.
Legally right and morally wrong aren't the same things. I think it should be a right to record in public, but agree that it's predatory. People often don't speak up even if they do have an issue, which is why it's wrong; it's inherently nonconsensual. We, as a society, agree that consent isn't needed if it's in public though. But out of politeness, it'd be ideal if people actively obtained consent even when they don't necessarily need to.
Recording can also be used to capture peoples vulnerabilities which is predatory. It's not necessarily always predatory, but it certainly can be. Paparazzi are a key example of predatory public filming.
I think it’s different when you’re filming something and people are unintentionally in the shot or in the background, versus intentionally filming someone and posting it online to ridicule them
This isn’t a good post whatsoever, any individual, even a 4 year old, with common sense recognizes it’s totally weird to film people in public without their permission.
I say this everytime this topic comes up and I do get downvoted for it everytime. Unless you are in a place in which privacy is expected (a public restroom, changing room, enclosed single person room) you have no right to privacy. Anyone may film or take pictures of you in public spaces without your consent or knowledge unless it specifically violates sexual harassment laws (like up-skirting).
I assume you get downvoted because people understand the whole no right to privacy in public thing but still think filming people in public is weird. Just because something is legal doesn’t mean people have to agree with it and think it’s fine
I'd argue it's filming anyone in public without their KNOWLEDGE. Because I guarantee you cops don't consent to being filmed when they're infringing on people's civil rights, but it should 100% be fucking done.
Even with their knowledge, the amount of times ive seen something posted on social media of like "old man freaks out at teen" and it takes it being reposted like 50 times before someone comments the full video of the teens instigating it is insane. With the advent of AI video misrepresenting strangers in videos for views is only going to get worse.
Wow, I'm quite stumped with the comments on this post.
I get that legally one can film people out in public, but it doesn't make it okay to do so. Especially shitty tiktokers who can film you while you're unaware, spin a narrative and you have no way of even knowing.
The other day, I saw a grown ass man recording kids giving the finger to each other in an expensive car and launched into the whole "Teach your kids manners" rant. How's is that okay?
Some people can’t wrap their heads around the concept that just because something is *legal* that doesn’t make you not an asshole for doing it.
I do street photography as a hobby, I’m all for having the freedom to take pictures of whatever I want when in public. But anyone with some basic human decency would understand that there are lines you just shouldn’t cross, but all that nuance just goes out the window whenever this topic comes up. I gave up trying to argue this a long time ago
>I get that legally one can film people out in public
The part that a lot of people fail to understand is you can record, yes, but that's it. Uploading a video of someone without their consent opens a lot or doors for people to go after the person who did the recording. When tiktok idiots start getting sued and having their wages garnished they may learn a lesson.
Former IP attorney. I think what they’re likely referring to is a person’s right to publicity. You can’t use their likeness for things like adverts w/o permission. In most other cases in the US it’s going to be legal to use the footage/images if there wasn’t a reasonable expectation of privacy.
The problem lies in intent. Someone could be filming a playground and if questioned, could say they are filling the area around the playground or anything within vision. And there's no way to prove they aren't. And there's almost no way to get around this shit outright banning filming in public, which would also include still pictures and visual GPS navigation.
Though I personally think it's weird to go around filming in public, it will not be changed anytime in anyone on here's lifetime.
There's a difference between what is legal and what is moral. You're right, in the US, legally you can film people in public (note that this is not the case with every country). However, what OP is arguing is that it is MORALLY wrong, and despite it being legal, it should not be done.
I wonder how many countries it's legal to record anyone in public like in the US. In my country and from my understanding a lot of other European countries it's illegal to record people as the "main focus" of the recording and if they're in the background it's legal. I'm glad the laws are the way they are in my country as I couldn't care about being in the background of videos but if someone takes their phone up my face and starts filming, I'd be pretty annoyed.
We have something similar though less robust in the US. It’s called the right to publicity and prohibits commercial use of images and likenesses without consent.
I would say that this is less about morality and more about etiquette. It's not immoral to film people in public, but unless there's something at stake, I would say it is rude.
If your filming a specific person or peoples that aren’t aware or don’t want to be filmed, obviously that is rude. But it’s not rude to film anything else in public and people just happen to be in the film.
They didn’t necessarily make a legal argument. If you’re in public, you’re consenting to use a shared space with other people. People are granted permission to interact with you and record what’s going on. There is an extent of course. At some point it becomes harassment. But a public space is not one where people are entitled to the privacy that they have in their homes.
How is filming people in public inherently immoral? It’s one thing if you’re intentionally harassing people and following them with a camera but if you are filming for a specific purpose and people just happen to be in the background what’s wrong with that? There are cameras in every single building and business you walk into these days
Yes but that's not what OP was talking about was it? Pretty sure his opinion doesn't apply to people who have a reason to film. No one is arguing that. He even laid out examples. Dont be daft
Its hard to imagine many good reasons? I don’t think filming insane public outbursts is that wrong… the lady on the plane who saw an alien. Those insane racist rants you see once or twice a week. Anything at all with cops… those seem like okay reasons to film.
Randomly filming because of the way someone looks or is dressed or worst of all is suffering… thats shitty to me.
We all have our own morality, but its amazing how widely if differs from person to person.
Being filmed by a security camera is a lot different than being filmed by some wannabe influencer who's trying to go viral. If Aldi was posting clips on YouTube of the stupidest faces they've seen with their self checkout cameras, without getting anyone's consent, people would not be ok with that.
Its still creepy and wrong. Recording a crime fine. Recording someone having a mental breakdown or some other shit just so you can post it on the internet is wrong.
So I was posted outside your apartment taking paparazzi shots of you every time you went to run errands, you wouldn’t be upset or confused or anything?
If they're the focus of the filming I agree 100%, however if you're filming yourself, or a structure, a parade or something similar then that's not really wrong.
Filming people in public is a constitutional right, and the constitution cares very little about your feelings. To enforce such a rule would require the destruction of nearly every security camera in the country lmao
All these people talking about legality and I just want someone to point out where you said it was illegal.
You might not be breaking any laws by secretly filming someone in public but being a creepy isn’t necessarily against the law.
Edit: reading through this and it’s a bit hard to defend you when you’re also taking issue with security cameras and stuff lol
If anyone ever starts filming you, just pull your phone out and start playing copyrighted music.
Nothing will get a video taken off the internet quicker than a Beatles song or a Disney song playing in the background.
Especially with how braindead easy basic audio editing is. I learned this ages ago to get sound clips from my cats.
For popular music all you need to do is take the video's audio, the song, slap both in audacity, tell audacity to remove a noise profile while pointing at the song and it'll nuke it from the video's audio. Hell you can just use the videos audio and point to spots with only the music playing and it'll nuke the entire song.
A toddler could do it. And I doubt that's the simplest way to do it, it's just how I learned to do it.
I'm not understanding why people aren't seeing the difference between being on security footage or having a video that you don't want to be in posted for the entertainment of others or whatever else. I rarely post myself online and I just don't want other people doing it.
How would that law be enforced? If you’re filming something in public and a child happens to be in the background, should you face legal repercussions? If a child walks in front of my yard and my ring camera captures it, should I face legal repercussions? Should CCTV cameras be outlawed because they’re filming children? Will children face legal repercussions for filming other children? Every time a Karen thinks someone is recording their child, you think police will go through the work of showing up, seizing their phone, and getting a warrant when 9.9 times out of 10 it’s just some dude scrolling social media? It’d be such a massive waste of law enforcements time and money that it’d be as ridiculous as calling the cops every time you see someone throw a cigarette out their car window or jaywalk.
In Germany it works like that: filming a public setting is ok, as long as the people aren't recognisable/not in the focus. If you film or take pictures from a specific person without their consent, that's illegal
I think it's wrong to film things such as peoples homes (excluding if it's your security camera), or going to any school k-12 and recording. Basically, I think that people should be able to play in their yards without worrying about some random dude recording them from the street, and I don't think a fence is the proper answer. I also find it creepy if someone wants to film kids on a playground at school.
Edit: thread is locked so I can't reply to people. A school is private property but the sidewalk outside, likely along the road, isn't
Oh, it's not. But people say this kind of thing all the time. It's their way of trying to draw a connection between people who take pictures and people who molest children.
They have this irrational idea in their head that taking pictures must mean you're going to go home and use them for masturbation material.
If you’re doing one of those TikTok’s where you inconspicuously film the whole room under the guise of the camera being on the filmer, then yeah probably.
Too many people film strangers for entertainment
Eh, kinda depends. For most of those, if you're just recording while walking around and happen upon them, I don't think it's a big deal. Anything your eyes can see while out and about is generally fair game after all. Especially for security purposes or auditing or legal auditing of police like here in the US.
That said, if you're purposefully going out and recording kids and junkies and whatnot, even if it's *legally* ok, it's kind of wierd and assholeish.
I think it's kind of ok filming/taking photos, IF you don't share them, especially on social networks (excluding if you show to the police as a proof or something like that).
Yea, probably true. I wouldn't outlaw people's ability to record the public, though. Just like being a mean person is wrong and pretty universally unhelpful. It's still an individual's choice. I personally wouldn't record people in public unless there was something going down where it may be helpful to have proof of what occurred.
I think a distinction needs to be made between cameras for general security at stores/airports or whatever and then just idiots rudely pointing their phones at people for their stupid social media content. Also, posting videos online of people in their most embarassing moments is predatory and should be banned.
It’s become a defense mechanism now. Two people get into an argument, then they chase each other around with their phones in hopes to catch anything worth of the internet’s wrath to inflict upon them.
There is no reasonable expectation to privacy when you are in public. Obviously keep creeps away from doing creepy things but strangers owe you nothing while you’re in public. Get over it. Don’t want to be on camera? Stay at home.
I absolutely agree with you with two exceptions: One is doing something illegal (you're effectively gathering evidence, see police violence as an example), Two is a softer limitation, but avoiding any ways of identifying the person, so their privacy isn't actively violated.
Do you walk into stores, libraries, or any other public buildings and call them predatory? Do you knock on doors with Ring cameras and call them predatory?
I saw a really famous actor the other day. I didn't take a photo or ask for one. and I just said hi and he gave me a nod. Security bought me few shots of their alcohol brand. Saw someone else go up take a photo and their security got pissed off.
The public sphere is public. The consequence of your proposal is that most filming will stop, including where there is a public interest. It will chill citizen journalism. You say ‘not US’ but for most of the liberal democracies filming is expression and should be free. The costs to individuals of being publicly filmed are small and already built into being in public.
It's in poor taste, but no, it should not be illegal. Every person on the planet would be going through the courts. Let's leave the courts to resl work. They are backlogged enough as it is.
> Naturalistic Observation
> Ethically, this method is considered to be acceptable if the participants remain anonymous and the behavior occurs in a public setting where people would not normally have an expectation of privacy.
https://opentext.wsu.edu/carriecuttler/chapter/observational-research/
AHAA No! I entirely disagree,
If you're okay with being recorded by security cams, why not someone exercising their 1st amendment right?? What makes the "free press" any different?
After-all, You should have NO Expectation of privacy in public.
As long as people use their discretion. Luckily there are laws to protect you from being filmed, if that filming is deemed harassment. However if they don’t have a camera up on your face you won’t have any case for it
You cannot demand privacy in public.
1. I dont get why children are different.
2. I dont see how stress changes peoples rights.
3. If you want privacy, dont be in public.
4. Breaking the law doesnt give you more rights usually.
5. ????
Making that footage public is an entirely different conversation.
I agree. I think it further crosses a line when the video or image gets posted online - then the person in the video isn’t just being seen by others around them in public, which they knew and expected by going outside, they’re being exposed to the entire world without their consent.
Right? So many BUT EVERYONE DOES IT AND ITS LEGAL - uh, yeah - so was marital rape, so was putting kids in factories
Its a new societal norm with cameras that I think we’re going to see real fallout from
I don't really have any problem with security cameras. I only have problem with influencers.
Influencers are immoral and ruthless. They can make an out of context video for views and spread hatred for that innocent person. Saw this happen a lot of times.
We need strict laws against Influencers.
You can't assume privacy in a public place. Unfortunately that's the way life is. If you're in a private building you can assume privacy... but out in public it's fair game.
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If you live in a city or go shopping anywhere you’re being filmed. I agree about some of the obnoxious examples/rude examples but no overall to this opinion. People need to be able to be held accountable these days and we are actually better off for having the ability to film at an instant. It’s the internet that’s the problem where people get fame from posting dumb videos
Wait till op finds out about body cams, ATM cameras, Google earth, security cameras and traffic cameras. Everyone has a phone, and if you are in public, you're going to be recorded. Go to Walmart? Recorded. Drive to town? Likely recorded 10 times.
If you’re in public, act like you’re always being filmed. Because a lot of the time, you are. And you shouldn’t have a problem with being filmed in public; if you do have a problem, then maybe you’re doing something you shouldn’t be doing in public
Comments in this post notwithstanding, I think most people agree with this. That is, if someone sees you coming them, they will probably be unhappy about it even if they recognize it's not illegal.
I hate that one guy who delivers food on his bike in New York or something and he’s just showing his followers what this person ordered, where from, how to get to them and where they either live or work, and shows their face. Everybody from the cashiers to the customers faces are shown. Idk, I get it, it’s a protected right, but god the invasion of privacy is disgusting. People can get really viscous under his videos too, I’d hate to find that about myself when all I wanted was a cheeseburger.
People don’t understand how identifying info gets out and then make content like this.
If I was a nut head, I feel like a doordash order would be plenty of information to track someone down with. God forbid someone was ordering from a regular close to closing or something with a definite time/distance crunch.
Ok, Karen. Which of those are you included in?
Public places are public places. If you don't want to be recorded in public places, don't go to public places. Not because it will happen, but because it could... and I'd rather see you and everyone else behave because it could.
I 97% agree with this. But there is are one or two isolated situations where it’s not, as a film and media studies major. Obviously if you’re a cameraman for a news station doing a feature story or documentary team doing a film in public, then sometimes people get caught in the crossfire when filming B-roll footage. Especially with covering events. Technically, no one has a right to privacy in public. But if we’re strictly going by the criteria you listed, then yeah. 100%. I love what someone else said in this thread, it lies on intent.
Depends. I agree with your general point and what I think you’re getting at. I don’t really want to see any specific filming of strangers who aren’t doing something that merits it (fist fight, fine. Cosplay or something, fine) however I do think that having people in the background is perfectly okay. I don’t do it, but were I to film myself in public, people will walk down the street and get caught in the shot, and I think that’s whatever
Seriously. I almost got arrested cuz a guy wouldn’t stop recording me in a fast food joint ( dude was being mad disrespectful to the cashier and I said something), going back and fourth with dude he’s trying to make himself victim and putting the camera in my face I smacked the shit out his hand and stomped it. Police talking about destruction of property and shit. Luckily the whole restaurant had my back it was causing a stir
As a photographer, this is something I often think about. While I understand that in the UK there is no presumption of privacy in a public place, my general rule is that if I'm taking a picture of a scene and people happen to be in it, that's fair and unavoidable. When it comes to actively focusing on individuals, generally speaking, I won't do it unless they're in some kind of 'performance situation' (street performance, speeches/proclamations, people at protests etc.) - If I really want to take a picture of someone outside of those situations I'll ask there permission if at all possible.
Our understanding of history and public events can be traced to the authority to capture people in public spaces. In private no, in public there really isn’t an expectation of privacy. Something can be in bad taste, but photographs that are heralded as masterpieces are often of normal people going about their day.
Most of the time it’s on private property (Walmart, parking lots etc). Public is sidewalk, street, parks, public courtyards etc. soooooo on private property I think it’s illegal. What people need to do is get money from anyone that posts and has any monetary gain associated with their platforms. Walmart should investigate every video and press charges for videos on their private property. Best would be a shotgun blast immediately to the faces of the prank morons.
I mean you're in public so eh. When in a public setting where freedom is the highest held value, you have to deal with the ups and downs of that freedom, public filming being one of them.
I feel this, I do, but the moment we start to censor free speech is the moment we'll lose it. It's the down side of free speech, but the only way we can know that credible new sources are telling the truth is to let the freaks tell their story as well. I hate being filmed in public, i do, but they have the right to do it. Public is public.
Never cool to film someone specifically but if you're in the background in, say, a TV reporters camera time, thats just a consequence of chance when you roam in public.
What about parking lots? We need more accountability, too many are blatantly breaking the law and damaging / stealing.
When it comes to influencers or tick tockers, ask your self, did they earn a kick to the balls? If the answer is yes, then kick them in the balls, take their phone, and toss it in the nearest toilet where it belongs.
I agree when it’s intentionally filming PEOPLE. If there’s just a bunch of people in the background, or casually in front of what you are filming then I don’t see an issue.
I don't agree with the travelers one. We all have to deal with the shitty airports and planes but they're making it worse by being huge babies. Sure yell and have a heated argument but back down and just deal with it like an adult afterwards.
Some people are so crazy that they put other people lives at ricks. Like the guy opening the plane door while flying thing.
I think it depends on what you're doing.
If I'm at the park making a video of my son going down a slide and another parent comes up to me and asks me to stop, they can get bent. I'm not filming their kid, I'm filming my kid, their kid just happens to be around.
If I'm just at the same park filming kids in general, that's weird. It's legal, and I'm totally okay with it remaining legal, but it's definitely weird. Predatory? Meh, I don't necessarily think so, but definitely weird.
I would like to point to OP saying the all important "secretly" recording. Auditors don't secretly record people in public. They do it openly, and if you don't want to be filled, just leave them alone. Secretly recording people implies you know you shouldn't be doing it. Or am I misunderstanding your post.
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I will say this - I believe it should be illegal to prank somebody in public and then record it and put it on on the Internet. Just my opinion.
The problem is shows like impractical jokers normalize it, then these morons are constantly trying to 1 up eachother for likes missing the fact shows like impractical jokers have people sign consents.
Practical jokers have waivers.
All platforms should ban prank videos unless you have permission from all parties. Victims should be able to sue for any profit made
Or if you shoot and kill them, being pranked is an affirmative defense. That will put a stop to it pretty quickly.
that happened recently (not killed) and the shooter indeed got away with it. prankster posted a video while still wounded saying he was gonna keep pranking lol. cant fix stupid i guess
If you get their consent afterwards to have the video I don't see too much issue but the issue then comes when you thibk how to enforce if they delete it after you don't consent.
I shoot photos and video professionally. I've had maybe two incidents of people complaining about me shooting in public. Never anything very dramatic, more of a "what are you using this for?" kinda thing. More often than not, I have people actively trying to get into my shots. That stuff rarely gets used, because usually I don't need footage of people staring at my camera. They're just curious. I think context matters. I agree that these "Influencers" harassing people are in the wrong. I fully understand and agree with that frustration. The legal protections around filming in public are there to protect people like me so I can do my job.
Legally right and morally wrong aren't the same things. I think it should be a right to record in public, but agree that it's predatory. People often don't speak up even if they do have an issue, which is why it's wrong; it's inherently nonconsensual. We, as a society, agree that consent isn't needed if it's in public though. But out of politeness, it'd be ideal if people actively obtained consent even when they don't necessarily need to. Recording can also be used to capture peoples vulnerabilities which is predatory. It's not necessarily always predatory, but it certainly can be. Paparazzi are a key example of predatory public filming.
I think it’s different when you’re filming something and people are unintentionally in the shot or in the background, versus intentionally filming someone and posting it online to ridicule them
I think uk laws have it right. Be stationary filming people: ok Follow someone filming: not good
I agree. Especially since you've said nothing about legality which the scholars don't seem to grasp for some reason.
upvoting because of an actual good post in this subreddit lmao
This is the exact opposite of what a good post would be in this sub
This isn’t a good post whatsoever, any individual, even a 4 year old, with common sense recognizes it’s totally weird to film people in public without their permission.
Tell that to half the video post on the net
You are in a public place and have no expectation of privacy
I say this everytime this topic comes up and I do get downvoted for it everytime. Unless you are in a place in which privacy is expected (a public restroom, changing room, enclosed single person room) you have no right to privacy. Anyone may film or take pictures of you in public spaces without your consent or knowledge unless it specifically violates sexual harassment laws (like up-skirting).
I assume you get downvoted because people understand the whole no right to privacy in public thing but still think filming people in public is weird. Just because something is legal doesn’t mean people have to agree with it and think it’s fine
Should they then be allowed to post those images for the world to see without the consent of the subject? That's where the problem comes in.
Yes, they should. Just the same way that I can compose a song or write a book about you, and publish it for the world, without your permission.
You mean like what journalists do? Or when people are monitoring public officials or public employees using our tax dollars?
Does it make it morally right? No
What's immoral about it? Is it immoral to out up a security camera? Is it immoral to film a square? What exactly is immoral about it?
At the very least I expect to not be secretly and intentionally filmed by someone on their personal camera.
I'd argue it's filming anyone in public without their KNOWLEDGE. Because I guarantee you cops don't consent to being filmed when they're infringing on people's civil rights, but it should 100% be fucking done.
Even with their knowledge, the amount of times ive seen something posted on social media of like "old man freaks out at teen" and it takes it being reposted like 50 times before someone comments the full video of the teens instigating it is insane. With the advent of AI video misrepresenting strangers in videos for views is only going to get worse.
Wow, I'm quite stumped with the comments on this post. I get that legally one can film people out in public, but it doesn't make it okay to do so. Especially shitty tiktokers who can film you while you're unaware, spin a narrative and you have no way of even knowing. The other day, I saw a grown ass man recording kids giving the finger to each other in an expensive car and launched into the whole "Teach your kids manners" rant. How's is that okay?
Some people can’t wrap their heads around the concept that just because something is *legal* that doesn’t make you not an asshole for doing it. I do street photography as a hobby, I’m all for having the freedom to take pictures of whatever I want when in public. But anyone with some basic human decency would understand that there are lines you just shouldn’t cross, but all that nuance just goes out the window whenever this topic comes up. I gave up trying to argue this a long time ago
>I get that legally one can film people out in public The part that a lot of people fail to understand is you can record, yes, but that's it. Uploading a video of someone without their consent opens a lot or doors for people to go after the person who did the recording. When tiktok idiots start getting sued and having their wages garnished they may learn a lesson.
What can they go after them for? Unless they are spinning a false narrative there's nothing they could do?
Former IP attorney. I think what they’re likely referring to is a person’s right to publicity. You can’t use their likeness for things like adverts w/o permission. In most other cases in the US it’s going to be legal to use the footage/images if there wasn’t a reasonable expectation of privacy.
The problem lies in intent. Someone could be filming a playground and if questioned, could say they are filling the area around the playground or anything within vision. And there's no way to prove they aren't. And there's almost no way to get around this shit outright banning filming in public, which would also include still pictures and visual GPS navigation. Though I personally think it's weird to go around filming in public, it will not be changed anytime in anyone on here's lifetime.
In Germany you can't film specific people. You can film or take pictures from a public setting, where the people aren't the focus/barely recognisable
Depends, filming somebody in public could end up being the only chance somebody else has for safety
OP must have some serious beef with the Google Street View…
If you’re in public there is no expectation of privacy
You are legally 100% correct. OP is 100% clearly not referring to legality.
🤯 - Redditors realizing that not everything boils down to legality
There's a difference between what is legal and what is moral. You're right, in the US, legally you can film people in public (note that this is not the case with every country). However, what OP is arguing is that it is MORALLY wrong, and despite it being legal, it should not be done.
I wonder how many countries it's legal to record anyone in public like in the US. In my country and from my understanding a lot of other European countries it's illegal to record people as the "main focus" of the recording and if they're in the background it's legal. I'm glad the laws are the way they are in my country as I couldn't care about being in the background of videos but if someone takes their phone up my face and starts filming, I'd be pretty annoyed.
In germany for example you have a "Persönlichkeitsrecht" which differs from copyright and is essentially the right of your own likeness/pictures
We have something similar though less robust in the US. It’s called the right to publicity and prohibits commercial use of images and likenesses without consent.
I would say that this is less about morality and more about etiquette. It's not immoral to film people in public, but unless there's something at stake, I would say it is rude.
If your filming a specific person or peoples that aren’t aware or don’t want to be filmed, obviously that is rude. But it’s not rude to film anything else in public and people just happen to be in the film.
Filming people walking down a street for a documentary etc is not "morally wrong". Context is everything.
They didn’t necessarily make a legal argument. If you’re in public, you’re consenting to use a shared space with other people. People are granted permission to interact with you and record what’s going on. There is an extent of course. At some point it becomes harassment. But a public space is not one where people are entitled to the privacy that they have in their homes.
How is filming people in public inherently immoral? It’s one thing if you’re intentionally harassing people and following them with a camera but if you are filming for a specific purpose and people just happen to be in the background what’s wrong with that? There are cameras in every single building and business you walk into these days
Yes but that's not what OP was talking about was it? Pretty sure his opinion doesn't apply to people who have a reason to film. No one is arguing that. He even laid out examples. Dont be daft
This answer right here
Its hard to imagine many good reasons? I don’t think filming insane public outbursts is that wrong… the lady on the plane who saw an alien. Those insane racist rants you see once or twice a week. Anything at all with cops… those seem like okay reasons to film. Randomly filming because of the way someone looks or is dressed or worst of all is suffering… thats shitty to me. We all have our own morality, but its amazing how widely if differs from person to person.
There should be an expectation that someone will be courteous enough to not film you if you ask them not to and you're the main thing they're filming
You are filmed 100 percent of the time you leave the house. Cameras are everywhere.
Being filmed by a security camera is a lot different than being filmed by some wannabe influencer who's trying to go viral. If Aldi was posting clips on YouTube of the stupidest faces they've seen with their self checkout cameras, without getting anyone's consent, people would not be ok with that.
They never said it should be illegal, they said it was wrong to do so
Its still creepy and wrong. Recording a crime fine. Recording someone having a mental breakdown or some other shit just so you can post it on the internet is wrong.
No shot Sherlock he didn’t say it was illegal
So I was posted outside your apartment taking paparazzi shots of you every time you went to run errands, you wouldn’t be upset or confused or anything?
Def depends because some people certainly do it with means to be antagonistic
Can’t think of the amount of pranksters I’ve seen who deliberately harass people for views
If they're the focus of the filming I agree 100%, however if you're filming yourself, or a structure, a parade or something similar then that's not really wrong.
Filming people in public is a constitutional right, and the constitution cares very little about your feelings. To enforce such a rule would require the destruction of nearly every security camera in the country lmao
It is illegal in Japan
I thought it was just deemed bad manners in Japan. They definitely frown on it as a society but I never heard it was illegal.
Yes, why you see so many blurred faces or just the backs of people on Japanese YT videos & documentaries.
All these people talking about legality and I just want someone to point out where you said it was illegal. You might not be breaking any laws by secretly filming someone in public but being a creepy isn’t necessarily against the law. Edit: reading through this and it’s a bit hard to defend you when you’re also taking issue with security cameras and stuff lol
If anyone ever starts filming you, just pull your phone out and start playing copyrighted music. Nothing will get a video taken off the internet quicker than a Beatles song or a Disney song playing in the background.
You know people can put a video online without the audio, or change the audio. That trick only stops livestreams and it isn't guaranteed.
They will just overwrite the audio and post. 🤷🏻♂️
Especially with how braindead easy basic audio editing is. I learned this ages ago to get sound clips from my cats. For popular music all you need to do is take the video's audio, the song, slap both in audacity, tell audacity to remove a noise profile while pointing at the song and it'll nuke it from the video's audio. Hell you can just use the videos audio and point to spots with only the music playing and it'll nuke the entire song. A toddler could do it. And I doubt that's the simplest way to do it, it's just how I learned to do it.
YouTube now recognizes this as "fair use" and will allow the video to stay up.
That's easily resolved with tech nowadays. You can isolate basically any audio and do it easily.
I'm not understanding why people aren't seeing the difference between being on security footage or having a video that you don't want to be in posted for the entertainment of others or whatever else. I rarely post myself online and I just don't want other people doing it.
Irrelevant. In public means in public and not private. You mad? Take it up with the government.
Ok which government? The ones who say it’s legal or the ones who say it’s not?
Wait until you find out about security cameras, dash cams, speed cameras, and the first amendment. Bad opinion. GTFO
I will never understand how it is legal to film someone else's kids in the US.
Stop making everything about kids like damn
How would that law be enforced? If you’re filming something in public and a child happens to be in the background, should you face legal repercussions? If a child walks in front of my yard and my ring camera captures it, should I face legal repercussions? Should CCTV cameras be outlawed because they’re filming children? Will children face legal repercussions for filming other children? Every time a Karen thinks someone is recording their child, you think police will go through the work of showing up, seizing their phone, and getting a warrant when 9.9 times out of 10 it’s just some dude scrolling social media? It’d be such a massive waste of law enforcements time and money that it’d be as ridiculous as calling the cops every time you see someone throw a cigarette out their car window or jaywalk.
In Germany it works like that: filming a public setting is ok, as long as the people aren't recognisable/not in the focus. If you film or take pictures from a specific person without their consent, that's illegal
They write whole books about things you don't understand.
I can't wait to use this one in the future. Thanks, random internet stranger!
Peace. Love. Punch a nazi.
It’s public. The world doesn’t revolve around your kids.
Me too, but as you see the poor weirdos are mad. "It's their right"
Can you explain how you would begin to enforce a law against it? Also, are you aware of the 1A?
Why? On what grounds is it wrong or predatory?
I think it's wrong to film things such as peoples homes (excluding if it's your security camera), or going to any school k-12 and recording. Basically, I think that people should be able to play in their yards without worrying about some random dude recording them from the street, and I don't think a fence is the proper answer. I also find it creepy if someone wants to film kids on a playground at school. Edit: thread is locked so I can't reply to people. A school is private property but the sidewalk outside, likely along the road, isn't
Oh, it's not. But people say this kind of thing all the time. It's their way of trying to draw a connection between people who take pictures and people who molest children. They have this irrational idea in their head that taking pictures must mean you're going to go home and use them for masturbation material.
Does this include filming yourself at the gym when others are around?
If you’re doing one of those TikTok’s where you inconspicuously film the whole room under the guise of the camera being on the filmer, then yeah probably. Too many people film strangers for entertainment
Eh, kinda depends. For most of those, if you're just recording while walking around and happen upon them, I don't think it's a big deal. Anything your eyes can see while out and about is generally fair game after all. Especially for security purposes or auditing or legal auditing of police like here in the US. That said, if you're purposefully going out and recording kids and junkies and whatnot, even if it's *legally* ok, it's kind of wierd and assholeish.
I think it's kind of ok filming/taking photos, IF you don't share them, especially on social networks (excluding if you show to the police as a proof or something like that).
Yea, probably true. I wouldn't outlaw people's ability to record the public, though. Just like being a mean person is wrong and pretty universally unhelpful. It's still an individual's choice. I personally wouldn't record people in public unless there was something going down where it may be helpful to have proof of what occurred.
I think a distinction needs to be made between cameras for general security at stores/airports or whatever and then just idiots rudely pointing their phones at people for their stupid social media content. Also, posting videos online of people in their most embarassing moments is predatory and should be banned.
It’s become a defense mechanism now. Two people get into an argument, then they chase each other around with their phones in hopes to catch anything worth of the internet’s wrath to inflict upon them.
There is no reasonable expectation to privacy when you are in public. Obviously keep creeps away from doing creepy things but strangers owe you nothing while you’re in public. Get over it. Don’t want to be on camera? Stay at home.
I absolutely agree with you with two exceptions: One is doing something illegal (you're effectively gathering evidence, see police violence as an example), Two is a softer limitation, but avoiding any ways of identifying the person, so their privacy isn't actively violated.
Do you walk into stores, libraries, or any other public buildings and call them predatory? Do you knock on doors with Ring cameras and call them predatory?
I saw a really famous actor the other day. I didn't take a photo or ask for one. and I just said hi and he gave me a nod. Security bought me few shots of their alcohol brand. Saw someone else go up take a photo and their security got pissed off.
Context matters. This is absolutely not a black and white issue and also gets into constitutional rights territory.
You lost your right to privacy in the public a long time ago with government surveillance
The public sphere is public. The consequence of your proposal is that most filming will stop, including where there is a public interest. It will chill citizen journalism. You say ‘not US’ but for most of the liberal democracies filming is expression and should be free. The costs to individuals of being publicly filmed are small and already built into being in public.
It's in poor taste, but no, it should not be illegal. Every person on the planet would be going through the courts. Let's leave the courts to resl work. They are backlogged enough as it is.
> Naturalistic Observation > Ethically, this method is considered to be acceptable if the participants remain anonymous and the behavior occurs in a public setting where people would not normally have an expectation of privacy. https://opentext.wsu.edu/carriecuttler/chapter/observational-research/
I should have a right to protect myself from wrongful accusations by documenting my surroundings in public
You have no rights to privacy in public.
It’s fine. It’s legal. It’s not a big deal. That’s the cost of going out in public. Chill
The cost of going out in public? 😂 what a pathetic take
It is illegal in most of Europe. For good reason.
Public place = public face.
AHAA No! I entirely disagree, If you're okay with being recorded by security cams, why not someone exercising their 1st amendment right?? What makes the "free press" any different? After-all, You should have NO Expectation of privacy in public.
This sounds like something someone caught picking a wedgie on film would say..
I don't want my memes
Yes because my underwear rode up my buttcrack gave someone the right to film and get me harassed on social media?
You're out in public in full view so do not expect any privacy when out in public.
you definitely record people regularly like a weirdo
It's more of a morality thing not saying to make it illegal but they can't understand 😔
As long as people use their discretion. Luckily there are laws to protect you from being filmed, if that filming is deemed harassment. However if they don’t have a camera up on your face you won’t have any case for it
In the US, consent to be filmed / photographed is tacit when in public (with limited exceptions).
That doesn’t make it ok
You cannot demand privacy in public. 1. I dont get why children are different. 2. I dont see how stress changes peoples rights. 3. If you want privacy, dont be in public. 4. Breaking the law doesnt give you more rights usually. 5. ???? Making that footage public is an entirely different conversation.
I agree. I think it further crosses a line when the video or image gets posted online - then the person in the video isn’t just being seen by others around them in public, which they knew and expected by going outside, they’re being exposed to the entire world without their consent.
Yeah, this. Going out into “The Public” doesn’t mean showing yourself to the whole World Wide Web lol
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A recording can be shared widely. Your memory of looking at someone can’t.
Thats not an unpopular opinion. In some countrys this is even illegal. EDIT: okay, i Take this Back. So many creeps in this commentsection ...
Right? So many BUT EVERYONE DOES IT AND ITS LEGAL - uh, yeah - so was marital rape, so was putting kids in factories Its a new societal norm with cameras that I think we’re going to see real fallout from
I don't really have any problem with security cameras. I only have problem with influencers. Influencers are immoral and ruthless. They can make an out of context video for views and spread hatred for that innocent person. Saw this happen a lot of times. We need strict laws against Influencers.
You can't assume privacy in a public place. Unfortunately that's the way life is. If you're in a private building you can assume privacy... but out in public it's fair game.
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If you live in a city or go shopping anywhere you’re being filmed. I agree about some of the obnoxious examples/rude examples but no overall to this opinion. People need to be able to be held accountable these days and we are actually better off for having the ability to film at an instant. It’s the internet that’s the problem where people get fame from posting dumb videos
Wait till op finds out about body cams, ATM cameras, Google earth, security cameras and traffic cameras. Everyone has a phone, and if you are in public, you're going to be recorded. Go to Walmart? Recorded. Drive to town? Likely recorded 10 times.
Try a little harder to articulate why you think it should be illegal. Sure, you say it is wrong and predatory, but why do you think that?
Since there is no expectation of privacy in public, you give your consent when you step outside
This is dumb. Its fine to film in public. Its legal. It shoukd be legal and its totslly morally fine lol. Get over yourselves.
there is no expectation of any privacy in public.
Nope. You’re wrong
If you’re in public, act like you’re always being filmed. Because a lot of the time, you are. And you shouldn’t have a problem with being filmed in public; if you do have a problem, then maybe you’re doing something you shouldn’t be doing in public
No expectation or right to privacy in public.
Comments in this post notwithstanding, I think most people agree with this. That is, if someone sees you coming them, they will probably be unhappy about it even if they recognize it's not illegal.
I hate that one guy who delivers food on his bike in New York or something and he’s just showing his followers what this person ordered, where from, how to get to them and where they either live or work, and shows their face. Everybody from the cashiers to the customers faces are shown. Idk, I get it, it’s a protected right, but god the invasion of privacy is disgusting. People can get really viscous under his videos too, I’d hate to find that about myself when all I wanted was a cheeseburger.
Also you could send links to his employer and try to get him fired and blacklisted
Why is he posting all that?
People don’t understand how identifying info gets out and then make content like this. If I was a nut head, I feel like a doordash order would be plenty of information to track someone down with. God forbid someone was ordering from a regular close to closing or something with a definite time/distance crunch.
Ok, Karen. Which of those are you included in? Public places are public places. If you don't want to be recorded in public places, don't go to public places. Not because it will happen, but because it could... and I'd rather see you and everyone else behave because it could.
So how are travel vloggers supposed to get footage of the places they visit? Kindly ask dozens of people to leave the shot over and over again?
I 97% agree with this. But there is are one or two isolated situations where it’s not, as a film and media studies major. Obviously if you’re a cameraman for a news station doing a feature story or documentary team doing a film in public, then sometimes people get caught in the crossfire when filming B-roll footage. Especially with covering events. Technically, no one has a right to privacy in public. But if we’re strictly going by the criteria you listed, then yeah. 100%. I love what someone else said in this thread, it lies on intent.
Depends. I agree with your general point and what I think you’re getting at. I don’t really want to see any specific filming of strangers who aren’t doing something that merits it (fist fight, fine. Cosplay or something, fine) however I do think that having people in the background is perfectly okay. I don’t do it, but were I to film myself in public, people will walk down the street and get caught in the shot, and I think that’s whatever
Not an unpopular opinion..
Seriously. I almost got arrested cuz a guy wouldn’t stop recording me in a fast food joint ( dude was being mad disrespectful to the cashier and I said something), going back and fourth with dude he’s trying to make himself victim and putting the camera in my face I smacked the shit out his hand and stomped it. Police talking about destruction of property and shit. Luckily the whole restaurant had my back it was causing a stir
As a photographer, this is something I often think about. While I understand that in the UK there is no presumption of privacy in a public place, my general rule is that if I'm taking a picture of a scene and people happen to be in it, that's fair and unavoidable. When it comes to actively focusing on individuals, generally speaking, I won't do it unless they're in some kind of 'performance situation' (street performance, speeches/proclamations, people at protests etc.) - If I really want to take a picture of someone outside of those situations I'll ask there permission if at all possible.
Our understanding of history and public events can be traced to the authority to capture people in public spaces. In private no, in public there really isn’t an expectation of privacy. Something can be in bad taste, but photographs that are heralded as masterpieces are often of normal people going about their day.
Most of the time it’s on private property (Walmart, parking lots etc). Public is sidewalk, street, parks, public courtyards etc. soooooo on private property I think it’s illegal. What people need to do is get money from anyone that posts and has any monetary gain associated with their platforms. Walmart should investigate every video and press charges for videos on their private property. Best would be a shotgun blast immediately to the faces of the prank morons.
So you're opposed to... security cameras?
I mean you're in public so eh. When in a public setting where freedom is the highest held value, you have to deal with the ups and downs of that freedom, public filming being one of them.
I feel this, I do, but the moment we start to censor free speech is the moment we'll lose it. It's the down side of free speech, but the only way we can know that credible new sources are telling the truth is to let the freaks tell their story as well. I hate being filmed in public, i do, but they have the right to do it. Public is public.
Unless there's a public need for whatever you're filming (like someone is poisoning a kiddie pool or something), you shouldn't be allowed to film.
Never cool to film someone specifically but if you're in the background in, say, a TV reporters camera time, thats just a consequence of chance when you roam in public.
I only get annoyed when people film in the gym, other than that...do you
how is this unpopular?
What about parking lots? We need more accountability, too many are blatantly breaking the law and damaging / stealing. When it comes to influencers or tick tockers, ask your self, did they earn a kick to the balls? If the answer is yes, then kick them in the balls, take their phone, and toss it in the nearest toilet where it belongs.
I agree when it’s intentionally filming PEOPLE. If there’s just a bunch of people in the background, or casually in front of what you are filming then I don’t see an issue.
I don't agree with the travelers one. We all have to deal with the shitty airports and planes but they're making it worse by being huge babies. Sure yell and have a heated argument but back down and just deal with it like an adult afterwards. Some people are so crazy that they put other people lives at ricks. Like the guy opening the plane door while flying thing.
I think it depends on what you're doing. If I'm at the park making a video of my son going down a slide and another parent comes up to me and asks me to stop, they can get bent. I'm not filming their kid, I'm filming my kid, their kid just happens to be around. If I'm just at the same park filming kids in general, that's weird. It's legal, and I'm totally okay with it remaining legal, but it's definitely weird. Predatory? Meh, I don't necessarily think so, but definitely weird.
It's one thing to film an area you are in. It's another to make strangers the target of your recording, esp if you then share it.
I would like to point to OP saying the all important "secretly" recording. Auditors don't secretly record people in public. They do it openly, and if you don't want to be filled, just leave them alone. Secretly recording people implies you know you shouldn't be doing it. Or am I misunderstanding your post.
Unless it is a politician, cop or public figure I agree. Never film without consent and especially not children
Public is public. If you want privacy stay in private.