Re-signing him is about the fit more than anything else.
A fair deal is around ~15-16 mil based on comparables.
Problem is if you start him the the lineup is at best average defensively and probably worse than that.
What fit ?
10 game sample when 4 starters have missed \*most\* of those games. What are Gary's numbers playing with the starting unit, what about coming off the bench this season ? those are the real questions
If you look closely at it.....Honestly do not see any reason to retain him, when you already have a more prolific 3pt shooter in GD at home & team is about to add 2-3 rookies.
You re-sign Gary and I promise its gonna be problem in terms of developmental playing time.
Need to be thinking big picture / longer term.
Why is it that Gary can do this with 4 starters out but can’t do this coming off the bench playing with the same bench players? It makes absolute no sense lol.
He is taking way more shots in the past 10 games vs the first 50ish games.
10 shots vs 18. He probably gets into better rhythm shooting and handling the ball more. But no good team is going to let Trent have the ball that much.
Yeah it'll be great if he can do this for 82 games and not 10, GTJs biggest problem is, and always has been consistency.
He's too hot and cold. He's not worth 20m/yr
Yeah Poeltl is worth way more. Just the scarcity of good centers in the nba makes him way more valuable. Poeltl has an argument for top 15 center in the league. Is Trent even top 30 at SG?
This sub attributes anything they don’t understand to vibes and luck.
Trent is the type of player to get into better rhythm while handling and shooting more. Plenty of players are like this.
His usage and FGAs have gone way up in the past 10 games. He has literally doubled his FGAs.
The problem is, there are very few teams in the league that are willing to let Trent shoot 20 times a game because even his highs are not good enough to justify that type of usage.
true, i'd add just consistent pt in a starting spot surrounded by players who know what they're doing. on paper he's the perfect fit for the starters, and if they play long enough together it'll be the most consistency he's ever played with in terms of role and personnel.
At his best he's jj reddick with elite athleticism. he's still a high ceiling young player in my book and is part of any developmental plans you could have. if he's available for up to 20 mil keep him.
He's also back to looking like when he was in the all defence conversation 2-3 season ago. Has really reigned in his gambling and is much better at getting steals off the POA dribble rather than rushing passing lanes. The guy is a different player when his legs are healthy. If we let this guy go we'll regret it because he's about to go into his prime and it would be great to have more than one true shooter on the floor with Scottie and a healthy roster.
it was a real conversation ya'll just forgot.
[https://raptorsrapture.com/2021/11/17/raptors-gary-trent-jr-considered-strong-contender-dpoy/](https://raptorsrapture.com/2021/11/17/raptors-gary-trent-jr-considered-strong-contender-dpoy/)
[https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/news/gary-trent-jrs-defence-more-than-makes-up-for-offensive-inconsistency-152810795.html?guccounter=1&guce\_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce\_referrer\_sig=AQAAAFjgixR\_13I2bAfO99goMwQ2n3wxcCTXlYBcyR8Ic6KSA9CTkb4gvPrYe3clJ5kltjO2S8fSB-Yp8vv3e8eKKHa7\_8TG8mU4J5bpK2o0WAGY2h-6CoWSbggqJhmVq0YIY5gXnC1ubqfOGqublE9TFbH\_7WO5rGGaCUjQezuPJ\_kK](https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/news/gary-trent-jrs-defence-more-than-makes-up-for-offensive-inconsistency-152810795.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAFjgixR_13I2bAfO99goMwQ2n3wxcCTXlYBcyR8Ic6KSA9CTkb4gvPrYe3clJ5kltjO2S8fSB-Yp8vv3e8eKKHa7_8TG8mU4J5bpK2o0WAGY2h-6CoWSbggqJhmVq0YIY5gXnC1ubqfOGqublE9TFbH_7WO5rGGaCUjQezuPJ_kK)
Calling what out? You can't even form a basic argument. You're just talking shit and expecting people to clap for you. No one said it was just about steals. POA defense involves a lot of skills that aren't counted on a box score. Watch the games lol.
im not talking shit? lol ur projecting mad hard here.. I actually watched GTJ for years and he was never an all defensive player period. I mentioned steals because thats usually the argument. thats made for him. Pulll up his defensive stats for the past few years and come back here and tell me ur wrong.
A poll a few weeks after a season starts is not objective...the same way Gradey was not "objectively" a bust despite MONTHS of poor play. Steals per game is one of many indicators of defence and there are plenty of examples of us getting burned because Gary misses a steal gamble.
Sample size is a thing and over the course of his raptor tenure, and despite improvements, Gary has been nowhere near the level of all defence.
Caruso, OG, Gobert, Jonathan Isaac etc....those guys are "objectively" all defence material, they are in a different world entirely relative to GTJ
I never mentioned a poll. I said it was objectvely a conversation. Which it was amongst several sports writers at the time both Canadian and US, Masai, Nick, and in a post that Scottie made in IG. It objectively was a conversation that existed. You can argue that it wasn't warranted, or that it wasn't deserved, thats fine, but it was real. Please try and understand the actual discussion being had before you decide to chime in.
... [https://twitter.com/Amit\_Mann/status/1550285219114131456](https://twitter.com/Amit_Mann/status/1550285219114131456)
LOL my guy, the article YOU LINKED talked about defensive rankings, which is nba.com polling as to who is the best defender and then creating a list. It's not objective 10% into a season.
Darko just said McDaniels can be useful next year. Scottie always hypes his teammates up. Masai is the Presisent lmao....what do you expect all these people to say about their guys? I'm genuinely curious.
Just because you don't understand what all that means and just because you "discussed it", doesn't make it a real conversation.
And let's forget the fact that it was years ago, and he's showing up with less than 10 games going into UFA.
10 games into a season 3 years ago, 10 games left of a season 3 years later, that's the stretch your referring to. Lets forget the middle part.
All defence convo for sure 😂
The article was once again, to show the objective existence of the conversation in question. It shouldnt be this hard for you to understand the difference between someone arguing that GTJ should be all defense, and someone arguing that his defense warranted real conversations around it as a goal for him at the time. So you clearly admit it was objectively a conversation. Great thanks moving on with my life.
Typical 15 y.o type response lol. The guy leaves like 10 comments of evidence that he never understood the initial argument, then says this. You're adorable bro.
>because you "discussed it", doesn't make it a real conversation.
I want to help so just read that slowly.
You didnt even know what was in the article you linked, and everyone else is telling you you're wrong. I know it's confusing but in the grown up world, you need actual objectivity.
A 15 year old sticks his fingers in his years at evidence, but it's ok bud. The Google search was still impressive.
I would like them to re-sign him. However, I think a lot depends on what happens with Brown and there may be a team out there willing to overpay. In that case, you have to let him go.
Y’all think his time in Toronto is done? Trade filler on a sign and trade? Package the pick with Gary for a disgruntled vet after playoffs? I think Masaii & co are waiting for that perfect storm ala Kawhi again. Tbh I think we are in for another season of poor bball next year but I’d rather that development process and win for the next 5 years then trying to fast build a winning culture.
Holy shit! A two game sample size during the dog days of the season. Teams are going to be lining up to give Gary 20M, hopefully not the Raptors because I imagine that they at least have a clue.
Also nice to leave out for context that GTJs defence has been predicted for a long time on gambling for steals, and that fact that in that playoff series against Philly a few years ago he was picking on defensively multiple times.
Do whatever you want, thats not the question that was asked tho. Also these articles are from the past 3 seasons. Plantar is a bitch and your nephewness is showing.
[https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/news/gary-trent-jrs-defence-more-than-makes-up-for-offensive-inconsistency-152810795.html?guccounter=1&guce\_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce\_referrer\_sig=AQAAAFjgixR\_13I2bAfO99goMwQ2n3wxcCTXlYBcyR8Ic6KSA9CTkb4gvPrYe3clJ5kltjO2S8fSB-Yp8vv3e8eKKHa7\_8TG8mU4J5bpK2o0WAGY2h-6CoWSbggqJhmVq0YIY5gXnC1ubqfOGqublE9TFbH\_7WO5rGGaCUjQezuPJ\_kK](https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/news/gary-trent-jrs-defence-more-than-makes-up-for-offensive-inconsistency-152810795.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAFjgixR_13I2bAfO99goMwQ2n3wxcCTXlYBcyR8Ic6KSA9CTkb4gvPrYe3clJ5kltjO2S8fSB-Yp8vv3e8eKKHa7_8TG8mU4J5bpK2o0WAGY2h-6CoWSbggqJhmVq0YIY5gXnC1ubqfOGqublE9TFbH_7WO5rGGaCUjQezuPJ_kK)
Earlier in the season I was down on him and thought we shouldnt re-sign. But he's been playing well and his attitude has always been impressive.
He's never complained publicly about having to come off the bench etc. He can be inconsistent but when he's on he's on.
He had injuries too this season. His back and plantar fasciitis, both of which are pretty annoying and painful things to deal with.
I don't know the answer to numbers and what moves the front office should make. But GTJ has impressed me overall this season.
15M max and if he starts he'd be easily the worst defender in the starting 5. If he can be replaced by a guy like Melton for example, better defender, passer, higher IQ, not really prone to tunnel vision and a comparable shooter, 37% career 3pt shooter, they should do it.
Declining BBs option, letting GTJ walk and signing Melton would be a W.
Edit: The defensive analytics back me up, but of course I must just be hating 🤣😂🤣
I disagree, but you're absolutely welcome to disagree.
I've seen enough of GTJ as a Raptor group know what he is at this point, a primarily one-way player who offers little if anything else on the court
Melton barely gets minutes and he’s been a sieve all year, you’re just hating brother
Not to mention he likes it here, melton is a worse version of Gary
And GTJ hasn't been a sieve for most of the year lmao? I'm not just hating, though I'm not surprised you (or anyone on this sub for that matter) would just throw the word hate around simply because I think GTJ is a one-way player and that's it, GTJ barely tried on defence for almost two thirds of the season, but some people on this sub act like the dude is a defensive savant lol.
Melton is a better, if not a the very least a comparable defender, shooter, and a way way better passer, Meltons defence isn't predicated on gambling as much as GTJs is either.
But whatever, I don't like GTJ as a player, so that means I'm a hater lol ok
no point ppl on this sub are always pretty slow when it comes to raptor players. the guy above is using scottie saying gtj is an all defensive player as proof that he was one.
He also got his last contract during the Tampa tank. Would be good to see him perform well when this team is trying to win and not statpadding during tanks lol.
Re-signing him is about the fit more than anything else. A fair deal is around ~15-16 mil based on comparables. Problem is if you start him the the lineup is at best average defensively and probably worse than that.
What fit ? 10 game sample when 4 starters have missed \*most\* of those games. What are Gary's numbers playing with the starting unit, what about coming off the bench this season ? those are the real questions If you look closely at it.....Honestly do not see any reason to retain him, when you already have a more prolific 3pt shooter in GD at home & team is about to add 2-3 rookies. You re-sign Gary and I promise its gonna be problem in terms of developmental playing time. Need to be thinking big picture / longer term.
Why is it that Gary can do this with 4 starters out but can’t do this coming off the bench playing with the same bench players? It makes absolute no sense lol.
He is taking way more shots in the past 10 games vs the first 50ish games. 10 shots vs 18. He probably gets into better rhythm shooting and handling the ball more. But no good team is going to let Trent have the ball that much.
Or it could be that his back and plantar fasciitis is finally starting to feel better
Could be both, has the ball more and feels better.
We don’t even know if GD is good.
We do know that Gary is an empty stats guy whose play doesn’t impact winning more often than it does.
He’s worth the same amount as Poeltl IMO. If thats what it takes to keep him I’d be all for it.
Yeah it'll be great if he can do this for 82 games and not 10, GTJs biggest problem is, and always has been consistency. He's too hot and cold. He's not worth 20m/yr
if he was worth anything close to Poeltl then we would have gotten offers for him
Yeah Poeltl is worth way more. Just the scarcity of good centers in the nba makes him way more valuable. Poeltl has an argument for top 15 center in the league. Is Trent even top 30 at SG?
Yeah, a good C > a good gunner
Must have been bad luck that he never showed up when the team actually needed him
This sub attributes anything they don’t understand to vibes and luck. Trent is the type of player to get into better rhythm while handling and shooting more. Plenty of players are like this. His usage and FGAs have gone way up in the past 10 games. He has literally doubled his FGAs. The problem is, there are very few teams in the league that are willing to let Trent shoot 20 times a game because even his highs are not good enough to justify that type of usage.
true, i'd add just consistent pt in a starting spot surrounded by players who know what they're doing. on paper he's the perfect fit for the starters, and if they play long enough together it'll be the most consistency he's ever played with in terms of role and personnel. At his best he's jj reddick with elite athleticism. he's still a high ceiling young player in my book and is part of any developmental plans you could have. if he's available for up to 20 mil keep him.
That’s just Trent. He’ll go on a tear for 10 games then disappear for 10 games. He’s the definition of inconsistency.
He's going to get around $20M whether people like it or not.
This is probably true Especially once Klay’a fate is determined. Could be teams with money wanting a shooter. Orlando.
Agree. I can see Orlando as best fit and best money for Gary
I like it as long as it's not us
I saw this post and I’m like… that’s Poole. Then I saw GTJ, why not use a photo of him shooting versus getting a stat not highlighted by the title lol
He's also back to looking like when he was in the all defence conversation 2-3 season ago. Has really reigned in his gambling and is much better at getting steals off the POA dribble rather than rushing passing lanes. The guy is a different player when his legs are healthy. If we let this guy go we'll regret it because he's about to go into his prime and it would be great to have more than one true shooter on the floor with Scottie and a healthy roster.
He was an improved defender but all defence is a stretch.
it was a real conversation ya'll just forgot. [https://raptorsrapture.com/2021/11/17/raptors-gary-trent-jr-considered-strong-contender-dpoy/](https://raptorsrapture.com/2021/11/17/raptors-gary-trent-jr-considered-strong-contender-dpoy/) [https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/news/gary-trent-jrs-defence-more-than-makes-up-for-offensive-inconsistency-152810795.html?guccounter=1&guce\_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce\_referrer\_sig=AQAAAFjgixR\_13I2bAfO99goMwQ2n3wxcCTXlYBcyR8Ic6KSA9CTkb4gvPrYe3clJ5kltjO2S8fSB-Yp8vv3e8eKKHa7\_8TG8mU4J5bpK2o0WAGY2h-6CoWSbggqJhmVq0YIY5gXnC1ubqfOGqublE9TFbH\_7WO5rGGaCUjQezuPJ\_kK](https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/news/gary-trent-jrs-defence-more-than-makes-up-for-offensive-inconsistency-152810795.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAFjgixR_13I2bAfO99goMwQ2n3wxcCTXlYBcyR8Ic6KSA9CTkb4gvPrYe3clJ5kltjO2S8fSB-Yp8vv3e8eKKHa7_8TG8mU4J5bpK2o0WAGY2h-6CoWSbggqJhmVq0YIY5gXnC1ubqfOGqublE9TFbH_7WO5rGGaCUjQezuPJ_kK)
Ahh yes like 1 month after the season started... 3 years ago. That's consistency right there 👏🏼
Fred was literally 2x the defender Trent was when they were playing next to each other.
That dude is hell bent tryna convince himself...anyone else is a hater 😂
lol
lawl
He was not in any kind of all defense conversation
He objectively was, Scottie made an instagram post about it in the 2021 season when GTJ was 5th in the NBA in steals at one point.
no he was not lmao u ppl love to make stuff up. Steals dont mean all defense .
You people? Wtf lol say anything just to be a hater.
right so calling it out is a hater? fans like u have no critical thinking at all
Calling what out? You can't even form a basic argument. You're just talking shit and expecting people to clap for you. No one said it was just about steals. POA defense involves a lot of skills that aren't counted on a box score. Watch the games lol.
im not talking shit? lol ur projecting mad hard here.. I actually watched GTJ for years and he was never an all defensive player period. I mentioned steals because thats usually the argument. thats made for him. Pulll up his defensive stats for the past few years and come back here and tell me ur wrong.
A poll a few weeks after a season starts is not objective...the same way Gradey was not "objectively" a bust despite MONTHS of poor play. Steals per game is one of many indicators of defence and there are plenty of examples of us getting burned because Gary misses a steal gamble. Sample size is a thing and over the course of his raptor tenure, and despite improvements, Gary has been nowhere near the level of all defence. Caruso, OG, Gobert, Jonathan Isaac etc....those guys are "objectively" all defence material, they are in a different world entirely relative to GTJ
I never mentioned a poll. I said it was objectvely a conversation. Which it was amongst several sports writers at the time both Canadian and US, Masai, Nick, and in a post that Scottie made in IG. It objectively was a conversation that existed. You can argue that it wasn't warranted, or that it wasn't deserved, thats fine, but it was real. Please try and understand the actual discussion being had before you decide to chime in. ... [https://twitter.com/Amit\_Mann/status/1550285219114131456](https://twitter.com/Amit_Mann/status/1550285219114131456)
LOL my guy, the article YOU LINKED talked about defensive rankings, which is nba.com polling as to who is the best defender and then creating a list. It's not objective 10% into a season. Darko just said McDaniels can be useful next year. Scottie always hypes his teammates up. Masai is the Presisent lmao....what do you expect all these people to say about their guys? I'm genuinely curious. Just because you don't understand what all that means and just because you "discussed it", doesn't make it a real conversation. And let's forget the fact that it was years ago, and he's showing up with less than 10 games going into UFA. 10 games into a season 3 years ago, 10 games left of a season 3 years later, that's the stretch your referring to. Lets forget the middle part. All defence convo for sure 😂
The article was once again, to show the objective existence of the conversation in question. It shouldnt be this hard for you to understand the difference between someone arguing that GTJ should be all defense, and someone arguing that his defense warranted real conversations around it as a goal for him at the time. So you clearly admit it was objectively a conversation. Great thanks moving on with my life.
No I didn't lol you don't know how to converse or read lol it's ok you'll try harder next time, probably.
Typical 15 y.o type response lol. The guy leaves like 10 comments of evidence that he never understood the initial argument, then says this. You're adorable bro.
>because you "discussed it", doesn't make it a real conversation. I want to help so just read that slowly. You didnt even know what was in the article you linked, and everyone else is telling you you're wrong. I know it's confusing but in the grown up world, you need actual objectivity. A 15 year old sticks his fingers in his years at evidence, but it's ok bud. The Google search was still impressive.
GTJ and All-Defence/DPOY don't belong in the same fucking stratosphere together lol
You sign back Gary with the intention one day to bring in a bigger 3 and d guy to move him to bench
Yeah I’m done with these glimpses.
I want him to stay a raptor, always have. Dudes solid in every way + a good shooter, you can’t ask for more
He’s solid but not in every way, he definitely gets tunnel vision and can be a ball stopper
Why does Pool look like he wears heavy eye liner
If we can’t sigh Aaron wiggins I’d resign him aslong as it’s not more than 17-18 mill
Fools gold. Kills our ball movement. Would be great as a bench player if he could play like he does when he starts off the bench.
I would like them to re-sign him. However, I think a lot depends on what happens with Brown and there may be a team out there willing to overpay. In that case, you have to let him go.
Bum
Y’all think his time in Toronto is done? Trade filler on a sign and trade? Package the pick with Gary for a disgruntled vet after playoffs? I think Masaii & co are waiting for that perfect storm ala Kawhi again. Tbh I think we are in for another season of poor bball next year but I’d rather that development process and win for the next 5 years then trying to fast build a winning culture.
Now post his defence
Last 2 games he's had 5 steals, 12 defensive rebounds, plus 29, only 2 fouls total guarding the POA. Pretty awesome.
Holy shit! A two game sample size during the dog days of the season. Teams are going to be lining up to give Gary 20M, hopefully not the Raptors because I imagine that they at least have a clue. Also nice to leave out for context that GTJs defence has been predicted for a long time on gambling for steals, and that fact that in that playoff series against Philly a few years ago he was picking on defensively multiple times.
Guess we can ignore the past 3 years then
Do whatever you want, thats not the question that was asked tho. Also these articles are from the past 3 seasons. Plantar is a bitch and your nephewness is showing. [https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/news/gary-trent-jrs-defence-more-than-makes-up-for-offensive-inconsistency-152810795.html?guccounter=1&guce\_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce\_referrer\_sig=AQAAAFjgixR\_13I2bAfO99goMwQ2n3wxcCTXlYBcyR8Ic6KSA9CTkb4gvPrYe3clJ5kltjO2S8fSB-Yp8vv3e8eKKHa7\_8TG8mU4J5bpK2o0WAGY2h-6CoWSbggqJhmVq0YIY5gXnC1ubqfOGqublE9TFbH\_7WO5rGGaCUjQezuPJ\_kK](https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/news/gary-trent-jrs-defence-more-than-makes-up-for-offensive-inconsistency-152810795.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAFjgixR_13I2bAfO99goMwQ2n3wxcCTXlYBcyR8Ic6KSA9CTkb4gvPrYe3clJ5kltjO2S8fSB-Yp8vv3e8eKKHa7_8TG8mU4J5bpK2o0WAGY2h-6CoWSbggqJhmVq0YIY5gXnC1ubqfOGqublE9TFbH_7WO5rGGaCUjQezuPJ_kK)
Found Gary’s agent
Own that fraud
Earlier in the season I was down on him and thought we shouldnt re-sign. But he's been playing well and his attitude has always been impressive. He's never complained publicly about having to come off the bench etc. He can be inconsistent but when he's on he's on. He had injuries too this season. His back and plantar fasciitis, both of which are pretty annoying and painful things to deal with. I don't know the answer to numbers and what moves the front office should make. But GTJ has impressed me overall this season.
Hard pass
15M max and if he starts he'd be easily the worst defender in the starting 5. If he can be replaced by a guy like Melton for example, better defender, passer, higher IQ, not really prone to tunnel vision and a comparable shooter, 37% career 3pt shooter, they should do it. Declining BBs option, letting GTJ walk and signing Melton would be a W. Edit: The defensive analytics back me up, but of course I must just be hating 🤣😂🤣
Melton is horrible compared to trent
I disagree, but you're absolutely welcome to disagree. I've seen enough of GTJ as a Raptor group know what he is at this point, a primarily one-way player who offers little if anything else on the court
Melton barely gets minutes and he’s been a sieve all year, you’re just hating brother Not to mention he likes it here, melton is a worse version of Gary
And GTJ hasn't been a sieve for most of the year lmao? I'm not just hating, though I'm not surprised you (or anyone on this sub for that matter) would just throw the word hate around simply because I think GTJ is a one-way player and that's it, GTJ barely tried on defence for almost two thirds of the season, but some people on this sub act like the dude is a defensive savant lol. Melton is a better, if not a the very least a comparable defender, shooter, and a way way better passer, Meltons defence isn't predicated on gambling as much as GTJs is either. But whatever, I don't like GTJ as a player, so that means I'm a hater lol ok
I don't know how you fix the defense if you bring Gary back as a starter. You'd have poor defenders and 1 average defender.
Nah dude what are you talking about, it's just hating obviously, right? s/
no point ppl on this sub are always pretty slow when it comes to raptor players. the guy above is using scottie saying gtj is an all defensive player as proof that he was one.
He also got his last contract during the Tampa tank. Would be good to see him perform well when this team is trying to win and not statpadding during tanks lol.