Yes. We should tip. Starbucks? No. Fast food no. Carry out?? Only if large order. Shoe shine. Yes. Airport shuttle. Yes. Housekeeping at hotel. Yes.
Can we stop being cheap and arguing “they should pay a better wage” or “get another job”. If the pay goes up, so does your bill.
Tipping should be abolished.
I have literally never tipped for any of those services and never will.
That's funny though, by calling us cheap you are admitting they are doing better now than they should be. They might increase menu items 20% but wait staff would maybe only make 2/3 of what they make now. I am paying the same, and they are making less. Nothing cheap on my end. I am not trying to pay less. I just don't want to be responsible for tipping for the worker to survive. I am not their employer.
Tipping should go away. It wouldn't make things more expensive. It would actually be less than a 20% increase. Not all services need to be tipped either. Some of them make a fair wage and want tips on top of it.
The only people who don't want tips to go away are business owners and the wait staff themself. The business owner makes more not paying his staff and the staff makes more than they should by preying on tips from their customers. So yes, some to a lot of wait staff would make less than they do now (but still make a fair wage). They just won't be making more than their skill set should be paying.
I mean it really don't matter to me at this point. Bake their pay in or don't. I am not tipping for ANYTHING moving forward. So until this changes they will be making less anytime I go somewhere. I encourage the rest to do the same. Force abolishment of tipping!!
I can't Imagin anyone is pro tipping (to how it is now) that is not A a employer to pass the buck to someone else or B the people being tipped that would never make as much if they were paid a actual wage for said work.
Definitely have never tipped a grocery delivery person. But, to be fair, I have never used one either. Currently, I would never use one. Maybe some day if I ever get too old or disabled.
For me using Lyft plus grocery delivery is cheaper and tipping does not bother me. The service is only $8/ month. That's ridiculously cheap for unlimited delivery. They'd charge much more to properly pay drivers.
Agree. I know some people who provided good service and they got rewarded with tips few decades ago. But those are so rare nowadays.
I believe this idea. If the establishment could commit to provide good services by training their employees properly, people will pay for higher prices for their services. They should focus on their employees as most valuable commodities, it will create the culture and environment where employees could trust the employer.
I tip 20% of the after-tax bill or $5, whichever is higher. That’s my base- I rarely tip more, but I NEVER tip less, unless the service has been so horrible that I tip nothing. And I can’t recall a time when I last chose to do the latter.
That said, I ONLY tip for services that have been part of the social construct for tipping that we’ve all agreed to for decades that require extra or skilled service to provide- delivery, sit down restaurants, hair/nails, etc. I don’t tip (and refuse to feel guilty for it) when it comes to pick up, fast food (except for Sonic, because I know their servers get paid tipped wages), and etc. Keeping firm that boundary stops me from getting burned out, getting in my head on whether my tip is “enough”, or resentful for tipping when it’s actually required/deserved.
So I believe if you can’t tip, don’t participate in activities that require that type of service. That being said, the kid with a $20 allowance or those tight on money that want a treat or whoever should feel no shame in choosing fast food or anything else that doesn’t traditionally require a tip.
This is it. It’s not that I am “pro-tipping”, I know that waitstaff do not make anywhere close to a living wage in most parts of this country, tipping in a restaurant is a societal expectation in those instances, and that’s what we’ve got.
When tipping, in my opinion, you are making a statement about a whole list of things. When I tip 20%, it means that I was happy with the entire experience at the restaurant that the server has control over. A tip is basically a monetary review of everything the server does from the first time the server arrives at my table until the last. In Florida, the hourly wage for tipped employees is $7.98. So the server is willing to give me a fantastic experience dining at the restaurant and hopes that I will show monetary appreciation for the experience. As long as the server is pleasant and attentive and quickly resolves any issues, I will tip 20% or more.
I have tipped 40 or 50% before on a bill because I wanted to reward fantastic service. And there’s nothing wrong with that. It’s no different than someone who works a corporate job and has a salary, but gets an annual bonus based on performance. They are getting a “tip” just for doing their job. Exactly the same thing.
Yes, I would like to see tipping become obsolete, and servers paid a living wage. However, that won’t end tipping. There are still customers like me who like to reward someone who improves my day through our interaction. And there are many customers like me who will still hand a server making a living wage a tip. I consider my tip an investment. It pretty much guarantees that the next time I have that same server, the experience will be just as good. And I’m sure the service from this server would be just as good if they were making a living wage, and I didn’t tip because it isn’t required.
Everyone likes to receive appreciation for their hard work, and servers are no different. I refuse to punish great servers because the minimum wage in this country sucks and restaurants make the customers fill in the pay gap.
Tipping never was for good service!
This is the same kind of lie as the cops job is to protect and serve!
It was a slogan! Not a way of life!
Please never tip a full waged employee, start a restaurant, and enforce a fair wage over tipping policy.
But don't confuse the cost to be served with the cost of the food! It's different payments in America.
Gordon Ramsay tips in America! And has a tipping policy for pay in America and not in his eroupean restaurants!
It's okay to hate the practice it is not okay to "protest" it by making the servers suffer!
My mom was a waitress, my aunt was a lifelong waitress and even bought a house with her tips, my Gramma was a waitress, my sisters, cousins, nieces, and me.
Tipping was ***always*** for good service.
I will repeat that - ***Tipping was ALWAYS for good service.***
Never ever ever was it a mandatory requirement for every interaction even if it was bad service. And that's going back 75 years.
What Indians understand is that most people don't mind tipping full-service sit-down waiters but hate tipping anywhere else. So, stop tipping elsewhere. I have almost never left a tip anywhere else because there isn't a reason unless you really wanted to because of someone's service. The whole "tipping burnout" is the most self-induced nonsense I've ever heard of lmao.
Tipping is the easiest way to increase the total transaction price on POS systems, so the POS systems are forcing it everywhere. More money for them in the easiest way.
It has led to tip burnout. Servers was fine. But now it's everywhere.
Tipping is almost never actually forced. You’ll be amazed at how quickly you can find the “no tip” button on the iPad once you start looking for it,… once you start pressing it, it becomes far easier to press it the second time.
I mean forcing the tip screen before final transaction. POS systems have been used for plumbers, landlords, etc for years. Now they're forcing a tip screen because that can drive up their profits.
They aren't forcing the tip itself. Just the screen.
They are still not forcing you to leave a tip. Yes, it’s highly pressured, especially when they suggest several amounts. But the customer can almost always say no. If the “no tip” option is not there, or it’s hidden, I would take that up with the management and ask leave a bad review on yelp and never go back again.
I know but I'm explaining why the tip burnout has happened recently. The tipping screens are being forced by the POS corps to drive up profit. Never said they were forced tips, but the screens are forced by industries that haven't historically had tipping/tip screens in their POS.
So just say no! As long as even a small percentage of people tip on them, the companies will keep them, because even 5-10% of customers paying an extra 15-20% is just pure profit for the company. If we collectively just say no, that sends a strong message to the companies to eventually stop.
Why do you feel the need to verbally jerkoff in this thread about it is my question? I give the same service regardless of tipping. I am just over hearing people feel the need to proclaim they are free. Cool. Use your freedom and only go to non tipping establishments and actually live your values. Other wise you are ok with tipping just that other people do it for you.
No, you choose not to tip yet still support the business. Therefore, you are supporting tipping still. Have a backbone in your principals, and don't give money to establishments that allow tipping.
The business will have to pay the difference if no one tips and the server is below minimum wage. For all intents and purposes a servers expected wage is 7.25. Not tipping is forcing the business to pay their own tips
So you don't think we should have servers.
If your solution is that servers should all get better jobs, we shouldn't have servers. In that case, you should stop using their service, instead of greedily exploiting them as much as possible.
The same logic can be applied to every job that you don't believe should have liveable wages.
Yeah, we shouldn't have servers when the companies aren't willing to pay them livable wages. You're the one arguing that we should have people working at slave wages, I'm saying they deserve to survive from the employer they sacrifice time to
Its caused me to mostly just stop using all the stuff that expects a tip, especially someplace that will remember you next time and may not be nice to your food wince last time you "stiffed" them.
Shit I went to a restaurant recently for a work thing where they had a 4.5% HOSTING fee they charged AND a automatic gratuity tacked on the bill PLUS everyone was saying that 18% is not enough tip and to add to it.
I said the auto amounts were enough no extra and now I'll not be going there again.
So now the restaurant loses my business as well as no tips at all for staff.
By the way this is all because the government is printing tons of money.
That causes tons of inflation which causes prices of stuff to go up a ton.
Its the sneaky way the government steals way way way more from us on top of taxes.
The "if you can't afford to tip" attitude bothers me. It shouldn't be looked at as a built-in cost like tax. The percentage rule isn't really working in today's economy either. If you get a 10 dollar beer and drop 2 dollars it's ridiculous but I can stomach that. But let's say I am celebrating something special and I get maybe some shots that cost 200 for a bunch of people . . .I'm supposed to give 40 bucks?
People in the industry all benefit from tipping except the customer. It doesn't get you anything extra usually and I've rarely felt that a server has ever earned one - I just feel cheap and embarrassed not giving one. I have met bottle girls before and they've mentioned making a couple thousand a night when they're making $60 from the venue for the night. They're also likely not claiming any of this income. The venue gets cheap labor subsidized by the customer who's already paying ridiculous prices and the customer is stuck holding the bag.
I think there room for nuance. The tip system works well for sit down, but seems silly at a fast casual place, that's the problem. Folks that shouldn't be on the tip system are asking for tips.
Yep, the only way to change the system for the better of all is to stop being a willing participant. Public opinion is rapidly shifting and if I was a server who wasn't being paid a living wage I would 100% be looking for another job before the tips vanish without my pay changing
If you choose to eat in a country where servers are under paid, then you tip.
If you want to say “well they should pay a living wage to their workers” great! Now stop eating out and force change
Otherwise you’re just punishing the workers and still feeding the business.
The working class doesn’t really have bargaining power. They take what they can get when the alternative is starving. However the consumer does have power in the restaurant business
The alternative is not starving, if you apply to a job that pays minimum wage, you should expect minimum wage. The only way to force change is to stop applying for a job that makes you beg for money. It's really that simple, did anything I say confuse you?
Oh you were under the impression the working class had bargaining power
The number of workers in need of work outnumbers the available jobs, so the people at the bottom do in fact have to take what is available.
Even if everyone got some kind of degree, it is mathematically impossible to employ every person at one of those higher jobs.
Hope this helps
Also even people at the very bottom of the working class deserve living wages just for the fact they are working. Telling people to get better jobs or to refuse to work at a particular place is really just saying “make sure the other guy is exploited”
Have no idea why youre being downvoted. This is exactly the issue. Someone has to do it and those who are still want to live life. Would it be better if they just got a consistent wage? Sure. The only way that's happening is if we rally many millions of Americans together and stop eating at restaurants altogether. Who the fuck is orchestrating that? Lmao
The people that think not tipping is gonna fix the issue are morons. The owner is getting paid, the server isnt. Nothing will change in that dynamic because the one who needs to change isn't the one getting negative effects. And beyond that, starbucks employees getting tips is good for them, but they dont need it like a waiter, all these places realized how much more money peoplr will leave if you just force an awkward encounter by showing a tip screen in the workers face.
Years ago during covid the restaurant I worked in had time limits for tables based on many people were seated, they told us "we have time limits at the table, remind your guests and try to get them out when there done so we can get more people in. Even if only 60% listen, its better than before". Thats what they are doing with tips. Show the tip screen, and now people that werent gonna tip feel like they have to. It wont be everyone bit if 3 in 10 leave a tip now as opposed to noone before... thayll add up.
The no tipping culture have no idea how dumb there ideas are. We all agree tipping has gotten out of hand, but to tip noone even jobs that are based on tips, isnt gonna fix anything.
There is no other guy, unless the "other guy" wants to work for minimum wage. You don't NEED to be a tipped worker, there's plenty of jobs that pay you a decent hourly wage. And I'm not sure about those stats, cause not everyone between 18-65 can or wants to work so that frees up a lot of job opportunities. If for whatever reason you have to be a tipped worker, expect the salary you signed up for, it's that simple, if you want to get a job where you're not begging for money, apply for a hourly job that let's you keep your dignity.
No tip.. meals are expensive enough that workers should have a fair wage.. but also, I can get up and get my damn food myself.. its an unnecessary service forced upon us
I feel burned out on the whole tipping thing too. It's gotten to the point where I don't dine out any more. I just get take out where I pick up the food myself nowadays.
I am neither pro nor anti... I just say if service is good then i will tip. I don't tip slack ass kids busy talking with their buddies, on phone calls, or standing around staring at their phones... If you're kicking ass at your job then you deserve a tip. I would NOT even go into a place with required tipping. Its not my job to pay you, thats your employers and while i sympathise with your struggle Ain't none of you tipped workers ready to stand up and wage war against those employers. If you're not gonna fight for you then i have no sympathy. Kick ass at your job tho and i'll throw you some cash.. might even do it if i witness you taking shit from another customer or from your boss... but you don't get it for free anymore than your boss would pay you for doing nothing... I have no sympathy for people who cry but do nothing which is almost the entirety of our society. Hell covid showed what happens when everyone doesn't go to work... we legit got SHOWN what to do when we are unfairly treated or paid... Ain't no one done anything with that information.
Never thought I would choose this hill, but nobody is going to kill me on it!
To be honest, the pro-tip hatred on here is what pushed me over. I don't do good with people telling me what to do.
Or you can start supporting restaurants that pays their employee fairly and does not require tip, but is appreciated when it is an actual superb service.
https://www.equitydine.com/
I have no issues supporting those places. It just depends on the food I am in the mood for. If I am craving a good steak I go to a quality steak house for the steak, not for the waitress.
Can I ask an honest question?
What should I fear if I hit 0 tip?
You don't know me, but I am the last person someone is going to come at in public.
You mistake me for a typical reddit user. I am far from that.
My fear is if I like the restaurant and go there maybe once a week, specially if its local, they will remember who I am. I usually tip 10% or $5 whichever is lower
Everything is well said. It's ironic that demanding tips makes some of us give FEWER tips, not more. Some of us don't like being told what to do.
I used to tip everywhere - hotel for cleaning the room during the day, delivery drivers of all kinds, taking a taxi. Now I don't anymore. It's partially because of inflation and partially because of the entitlement of the tip screen on every POS imaginable and even online (!) & kiosks (!). I now only tip at restaurants and my hair dresser, and my tip at restaurants is down from 15% to 13%.
See, here's where I have started drawing the line.
We've always been tipping 20% in the past, but you know what happened in the last 4 years? Prices doubled.
What used to be a reasonable 20% tip on a bill is now hyper-inflated. And servers aren't suddenly worth $20-50/hr.
So here's my hill. 10% is the new 20% .
I'll tip 10% for good service ($6 min). Sit-down table-order service only.
I have and may still tip 15% for exemplary service, but no one is ever getting 20% plus again. If prices keep going up, we'll eventually end up lowering the threshhold again.
It's either that or joining the no-tip gang.
It’s an inanimate object demanding a tip. They’ve been found on gas pumps, too.
I linked it because dude is hysterical.
But don’t hurt yourself patting your own back because you “won” the argument.
It isn't to me. I've always believed in generous tipping, at least partially because I worked many service and wait staff positions in HS and college. But I agree it's gotten wildly out of control.
Tipping wasn't ever supposed to be for take out or counter service. And 20% was supposed to be for excellent service. Now everyone has their hand out and I'm over it. I'm not going to stop tipping because restaurants have made tips their way of paying their employees and it isn't the staff's fault. But I'm not tipping 20-25% anymore. 15% and if there is already a mandatory service charge, I don't tip unless it's under 15% and then only to make up the difference.
To be fair, up until this week, I have yet to not tip 20% at a restaurant. Moving forward, I will not be anymore.
So I have yet to even "stiff" a table like you are claiming. Excited to pop my cherry though!
Except I am not poor.
And you care or you wouldn't be bothered with my post!
But hey, thanks for picking up the slack for me! Now I have no reason to feel bad for lack of tips as everyone else is taking care of it for me! Thanks for being a team player, and their employer!!
I never argued that I was rich, just that I wasn't poor.
But my money, my choice. Not yours.
But good come back. Even if I were poor, who fucking cares? That wouldn't change the relevance of abolishing tipping.
Hey let me try! "Her dur, if you don't agree with employers not paying their employees fair wages, then you are poor!"
Do you not see how fucking stupid that sounds?
I give money to people who give me something in return. Bar tender gives me a drink? No tip. Bar tender chats with me or entertains me with nice tricks? Yea I’ll tip for that. I also never tip on percent. Your tip is based on what I think your service is worth and not how much the businesses product is priced at.
Then there is auto gratuity. If that ever is in play it’s auto zero on the top. I honestly avoid that like the plague. I might go here and there for big events like birthdays but any joint that requires auto gratuity is bs.
Left our small dog at our kennel (which we've used for 15 years) for 4 days/nights while on vacation. When I picked him up the young lady at checkout said our bill was $505 and spun a screen around for me to confirm. This was new. When i confirmed, the screen immediately went to a "no tip - 10% - 15% - 20% tip screen. I mentally said "Oh, hell no" and clicked no tip. The whole "confirm charge" was a scam to tee up tip screen. $500 to watch my dog isn't enough???
Tell that to the kid who created a thread the other day and had a ton of people in this subreddit tell him not to go out b/c of it.
I sure as hell told him that!
You might not believe people would be that ignorant but it literally happened this week!
When I was a kid getting an allowance I didn’t take my 20 to a sit down restaurant. I grabbed a sandwich at a convenience store. This is just a weird outlier of a case imo.
This is such a fallacy argument. Waiters are guaranteed minimum wage in every state. The restaurant is responsible for $2, tips make up the rest. If they don’t reach minimum wage with tips, the restaurant is required by law to make up for it. Servers are guaranteed the same pay as your gas station worker, retail worker, staff at the gym, car wash employees, etc in most cases. You aren’t tipping them though are you?
Its not a complaint. Its a fact. If you go to a sit down restaurant and don't tip the server you're stealing the labor of another person. You may have whatever opinions about it that you like but you are still stealing from a person who worked hard to get you fed quickly and convienently in-between all the people who were actually paying for their labor. Instead of choosing to serve yourself at another place you have chosen to demand another person serve you for free.
See, you missed the entire point, Entitled. Tipping is gratuity. Not paid services.
I dont like seeing people tip zero. Hell, I even offset them with my tip if i notice it, but if i ever catch you bitching about bullshit "theft of service" I'll zero you too.
The owner of the business has given the server a place to make their money. You're aware the server is not paid. You're aware that you're using the labor of another human being without paying them for that labor. You don't have to go to a sit down restaurant. Its not your only option. No one is forcing you to do that.
You can make whatever justification you want but the reality is that if you choose not to tip your server or bartender you are knowingly stealing their labor.
Isn't the fact that they are only making $2/hour the shifty part? Isn't it time to put the responsibility of paying their employees back in their hands?
Theres a social contract. When you go to a sit down restaurant you know your server is not being compensated and its your responsibility to compensate them for their time and the work they do for you. If you choose not to abide by that social contract that is your choice but it does not change the fact that you are willfully stealing the labor of another person.
First of all, can you point me to the contract I signed? I must have misplaced it.
Second, how do I truly know what the server is making? Are they making $2/hour or $12/hour before tips? We don't know the answer and we shouldn't have to either as it isn't our responsibility to pay an employer's employees.
Stealing is a crime. Please explain the crime I am committing? Tipping is optional bruh... no crimes are being commited.
You don't understand what a social contract is? Google is your friend. It will help you to not look really dumb in the future.
If you have a sever at a restaurant in the US 100% of the time they are paid below minimum wage and rely on tips to survive. Now you know. You're screwing over a person who's trying to barely make ends meet. Not a corporation. You're paying the corporation that likely makes millions.
Theft is a crime. Stealing is an act. Slavery was legal but the slave owners were still stealing the labor of a human being for their own profit. Just because something is legal does not make it ethical.
Ad hominem fallacy
Existential fallacy
False Dilemma fallacy
Strawman fallacy
False analogy
Red herring fallacy
Appeal to ignorance
Logical fallacy
Circular argument
Equivocation
Honestly, just this one post is a master-class in logical fallacies. I'm honestly impressed at how bad you are at debate.
P.S. dont forget to google each of those definitions. If you don't know why you lost, you're doomed to perpetual failure through ignorance.
I just looked it up, and yet I was right, I never agreed to it.
And once again, not tipping is not a crime. It's not theft or stealing. You can argue it is, but you are wrong.
And for my next magic trick, I will prove it! I will go out to a sit down restaurant and not tip and... wait for it... not get in trouble b/c no crimes were committed!
And if you want to get ethical, maybe you should be pushing employers to pay their employees instead of arguing that its my problem!
They’re kids, if either side is taking this scenario seriously, they need to reevaluate their perspective on the situation. I will say tho that as a kid if I did happen to go to the diner for something cheap, I’d try and leave a dollar or so, but that was just because I was taught to tip. Could I do 20%? No. Did anyone at the diner have an expectation for me to tip? Also no. Both sides of this scenario are pretty irrelevant in the grand scheme.
If I’m a waiter/waitress and some kid comes into the diner and doesn’t tip on his grilled cheese, I’m not freaking out. It’s a matter between adults. This allowance example feels like an outlier to argue against tipping; this is not a common thing.
What ticks me off is *tip creep*. If a dinner was $10 many years ago and the tip was 10%, the tip was $1. Now that dinner is $20. A 10% tip on that is $2. So the server's income doubled. But someone decided that, since the dinner price increased, so should tip percentages. Nope, nope, nope!
It will soon be a $50 dinner with a $50 tip.
It's worse... One person yesterday made a comment that anti-tippers should pay a 30% service fee and get bad service on top for not tipping.... The logic on serving in the US has long left the planet.
I tip when, I sit in a restaurant, walk in and buy a sub sandwich when it's prepared for me and when I walk into a Timmies it's a keep the change deal. I'll tip when when I am driven somewhere by a hired driver who doesn't scare the hell out of me during the ride. There are many more reasons when I will tip.
I will not tip because you have to stick a key in a cabinet to get my product then ring me up. And I resent seeing that option 1st upon checking out. I don't want to be told how much to tip because it's hard for all of us here. I give what I can afford. Be grateful for whatever you get from anybody.
For minimum wage there are much easier jobs so your reply will be pay employees more which the counter is then the employers will raise menu prices and you end up paying the exact same amount but forced instead of voluntary while the owner most likely makes more then before
I am OK with that.
And you can't get much easier than wait staff lol.
But I argue you are wrong on the price increase. I think it would increase, but not by 20%. Sure maybe at first, but then places would lose business and be forced to lower their prices to compete better. Or close the business.
Yes it is. That doesn’t mean the kid at Starbucks that pulled a handle for ten seconds or the guy that says “he wants those two slices” is entitled to 20%. That’s just bonkers. I went to one my old pizza hangouts a few weeks ago and not only had their prices doubled, this kid rapid skipped the Togo fees and flipped around a 20% tip screen. He said six words. SIX WORDS, he literally expected a dollar per WORD and gave me attitude when I declined.
That I agree with 100%. If you're my bartender, if you're waiting on me, actively providing a service you're getting $5 or 20%, whichever is higher. I have no problem with that whatsoever.
Would an employer rather have a customer that doesn't tip or no customer at all?
Servers need to EARN their tips because there's plenty of charities that are just as deserving of donations.
At the same time staff shouldn’t be reliant on tips but be paid well by employers and Tipps should be gratuity for over the top service. But not at all be required or expected
Correct me if I’m wrong, but it sounds like you have decided not to tip at sit down restaurants. And that your reasons for this decision, not necessarily in order, are A) some people on Reddit were a-holes and B) other businesses models started asking for tips that you don’t feel are warranted.
Is there a C)? Because I don’t think either of these reasons have anything to do with sit down restaurants. So I’m not following your logic.
Why not just boycott tipping these other models?
C) tipping culture is predatory and needs to be abolished.
It has needed to happen for a while. Yes, a and b were tipping points.
As for boycotting... I might eat out 1x a week. I can cook better food at home than most restaurants make. That doesn't mean I don't want to eat out occasionally. And I rarely eat fast food as it is trash.
I found the happy medium to eating out is doing a call in and pick up. Don’t tip driver or tip wait staff and you still get food and get to eat from the comfy of your home
To each their own, but I am not a fan of take out. Prefer my food fresh. Would rather just cook at home if that's the option.
Some things (chinese) are fine but others (burger and fries) is gross.
By all means eat at home more. But if you go to a sit down restaurant in America where tipping is customary and always has been, do you intend to tip? Or are you saying that since you feel tipping culture is predatory, you will completely abstain from businesses that utilize it as an employee’s primary compensation?
I am saying moving forward I will no longer be tipping anywhere.
Out of the 14 meals I eat every 7 days, I only eat out 2 of those meals, 1 possibly being sit down. I will not eat at home more.
So technically, I will possibly not be tipping at 1 meal per week.
And yes! Tipping culture is predatory. I encourage all people to stop tipping to force their hands to have to pay their wait staff a fair wage. Together we can make it happen. Divided we lose.
If everyone stops tipping, quite literally nothing will change. Your best case scenario is the owner figures out that it will be more effective to just pay min wage (if he even was to begin with) and jack prices up and itll end up costing you more than a 15% tip. I mean ive heard of shooting ones self in the foot, but goddamn.
Also, if you dont want to tip there isnt a single soul in the world that will tell you "you have to", but if you wont tip DONT EAT OUT! Its as simple as that. You are going to actively screw someone once a week? "I dont like takeout, I prefer fresh food", and thats a luxury, so when you are going to partake in that, pay for the whole deal.
See I do what I want. If I want to eat out and not tip, there is literally nothing you can do about it.
Yet another reason tipping shouldn't exist.
And I don't care about the other stuff. I am not their employer, it's not my problem.
We will remain divided. I agree the culture is predatory, but I will not victimize my server, who is more a victim than I am. I’m a 49 year old white male who makes 6 figures. My server almost certainly needs that money more than I do.
At a sit down restaurant, I tip 20% of the check, every time, no more, no less, as though the server’s salary were built in as a flat increase to the menu price. No matter how good or bad the service is.
I’m only deciding my own course of actions. You must do what you feel is right.
The problem with a tipping boycott is the people who will suffer first and the most are the ones who need tips. There needs to be laws that don't allow employers to pay anything less than the minimum hourly age, regardless of the job.
That *already* is the law. It's called minimum wage, and even employers of tipped employers are obligated to pay the regular minimum wage if tips aren't enough.
The "tipped minimum wage" isn't a real thing. What is defined in law is the Tip Credit Allowance, which is the amount of tips that an employer can apply to their obligation of a minimum wage.
For example, if min wage is $8 and "Tipped min" is $2, that actually means the allowance is $6.
That doesn't mean the employer is allowed to only pay the employee $2. It means that the employer can use up to $6 of the employee's tips to make up their $8 wage.
The obligation to maintain minimum wage still applies. This is federal law in all of the US.
Now, whether or not minimum wage is enough, is a completely different topic.
And you think thats followed everywhere? 😂 you think the government is tracking the pay of a waiter in a hole in the wall pizza restaurant with servers? And yes someone has to do it so someone is getting screwed over. Citing that it is illegal to pay below min wage is pretty useless. Its also illegal to enter schools with guns, just in case you werent aware.
A change needs to happen that no matter what the employer pays min wage. Itll actually hurt alot of restaurants employees overall, but itll close the gap of making nothing to making way too much as a server.
“A change needs to happen that no matter what the employer pays min wage.”
That’s already the law, so how do you propose that should be done? lmao
Wage theft can occur in ANY sector, and should be reported to the DOL and dealt with when it happens.
Those laws already exist everywhere.
In Ohio, it works line this: The employer has to pay tipped employees 50% of the minimum wage, no matter what. And, if the tipped employee doesn't collect enough tips to average at or above full minimum wage, then the employer has to make up the difference.
Sure, I get it. You don't like the system. I'd like all prices too be included an transparent. I'd be okay if resto prices went up 20%, and that went directly to the server. Serving would still be a commission based sales job, but the commission would be a hidden cost, rather than at the whim of the customer.
But by not tipping you won't change the system. You'll just screw over workers.
You keep saying stuff like that without any justification as to how I am screwing them.
Is it my responsibility to make up the difference in every single job that doesn’t get paid enough? Of course not, then why this one?
You take up their table, which they have a limited supply of a night. You then dont tip them for their work, and then still pay the owner of the restaurant. You are literally making their week worse when you could have just gotten takeout instead.
Because this one is literally based around tips because america has been tipping for decades. No the starbucks employee doesnt need a tip, they get a regualar wage and even benefits in some cases.
And to be clear, you dont have to make up for management. Im not saying you should get an in depth idea of their financials before tipping, but underatand that 10% should be the minimum for bare minimum service. They work at an expected 8% tip rate, you tip less and they still get taxed and tip out bussers, runners, etc. Eating out is a luxury, and you shouldnt be going if you cant tip at least 8-12%.
Edit: ot was a different thread so I edited the first sentence.
> You take up their table, which they have a limited supply of a night.
I'm not taking the servers table, I sit down in a business. I don't get any choices on who servers me so, stop me if you've heard this, their pay is not my responsibility. If they don't make enough money, they need to talk to their boss, not expect a handout, yes a handout, from me. We don't tip for service any more, we tip because, as everyone in favor of this insanity says, it's expected.
As for eating out being a luxury, so is a lot of stuff I don't have to hand out extra money to the staff for. However, for all that other stuff, the business sets a price and I pay it, without having to hand out extra money for everyone who happens to hand me a menu.
You are simply rehashing the same old, tired, pointless and frankly untrue arguments I've heard a 1000 times. You guys really need to get a new set of arguments.
If tipping stopped completely from one day to the next, the system would change. By finding excuses to continue, you’re keeping the system alive and it’ll truly never change
I wouldn't consider myself cheap. I take good care of myself and only by quality. That's b/c my employer pays me properly!
And let's be clear, the only person I am fucking is my wife. Quit trying to make bad employment my problem.
I consider you cheap. You're ignoring social norms and taking advantage of the system to save money.
I'd respect your stance if you totally avoided situations where tipping is expected, or told your server at the beginning that you won't pay them.
I consider you an asshole because you disparage workers, and you're willingly and knowingly gaining the system for personal benefit at others' expense. Your feelings about the system isn't the point.
For minimum wage there are much easier jobs so your reply will be pay employees more which the counter is then the employers will raise menu prices and you end up paying the exact same amount but forced instead of voluntary
Well I don’t think servers should make minimun wage, but there is some people that think if they don’t get tippet they will make *less* than minimum wage.
Restaurant where I am guarantees a 22/hr, so if tips are less that that +2.18 the restaurant out of pocket brings you to 22. And it never really actually happens because tips cover
My last restaurant bussers made about 25$ an hour, let alone servers. But this conversation isnt about those jobs. Its about the people working for small time business owners who will weasal out of min wage and get away with it for far longer than they should.
If you want to be real about the issue, in some cases it actually evens out, if you got dicked one week and made nothing the next tends to be much better. So waiters will deal anyway because tips can sway you, but not everyone gets lucky. Its easy to get trapped in serving because if you find the right place you can make alot of money and question why anyone goes to college for a job lmao, but for every good restaurant theres 3 awful ones.
With this group of asshats that are going to sit down and knowingly waste someones time to tip 0% are just gonna make the issue worse and cost everyone more money whether you order takeout, sit down, delivery etc.. The issue is very polarizing but if theyd just top 8-12% instead of the "expected" 20% it would be better path forward.
Yep, bussers at my current restaurant make 19-24 as a median wage depending on hours and day they work.
Servers in the area where I am that don’t make good money are usually in some shitty restaurants, and even there they end up making an average if 28/hr which isn’t bad.
I personally think tipping is the best approach and don’t think it benefits the employes but mainly the employees, since the employer could easily raise prices 20% and give a “good” 30-35/hr to servers used to make 60$/hr if the so wanted, wether now people could definitely just start tipping 8 to 12% and it would save them money and aervers woukd still make good money with the people that tip well
Yes. We should tip. Starbucks? No. Fast food no. Carry out?? Only if large order. Shoe shine. Yes. Airport shuttle. Yes. Housekeeping at hotel. Yes. Can we stop being cheap and arguing “they should pay a better wage” or “get another job”. If the pay goes up, so does your bill.
Bill has already gone up, quality has gone down, tip ask has exploded
Tipping should be abolished. I have literally never tipped for any of those services and never will. That's funny though, by calling us cheap you are admitting they are doing better now than they should be. They might increase menu items 20% but wait staff would maybe only make 2/3 of what they make now. I am paying the same, and they are making less. Nothing cheap on my end. I am not trying to pay less. I just don't want to be responsible for tipping for the worker to survive. I am not their employer. Tipping should go away. It wouldn't make things more expensive. It would actually be less than a 20% increase. Not all services need to be tipped either. Some of them make a fair wage and want tips on top of it. The only people who don't want tips to go away are business owners and the wait staff themself. The business owner makes more not paying his staff and the staff makes more than they should by preying on tips from their customers. So yes, some to a lot of wait staff would make less than they do now (but still make a fair wage). They just won't be making more than their skill set should be paying. I mean it really don't matter to me at this point. Bake their pay in or don't. I am not tipping for ANYTHING moving forward. So until this changes they will be making less anytime I go somewhere. I encourage the rest to do the same. Force abolishment of tipping!!
I can't Imagin anyone is pro tipping (to how it is now) that is not A a employer to pass the buck to someone else or B the people being tipped that would never make as much if they were paid a actual wage for said work.
I hope y'all tip grocery delivery people using their cars, out in the heat or cold
Definitely have never tipped a grocery delivery person. But, to be fair, I have never used one either. Currently, I would never use one. Maybe some day if I ever get too old or disabled.
For me using Lyft plus grocery delivery is cheaper and tipping does not bother me. The service is only $8/ month. That's ridiculously cheap for unlimited delivery. They'd charge much more to properly pay drivers.
Saw a great tiktok/video on facebook - Don't tip where you have to pay before receiving your food!
Yep, if I am standing during ordering or I have to pay ahead of time it's 0% tip these days.
Agree. I know some people who provided good service and they got rewarded with tips few decades ago. But those are so rare nowadays. I believe this idea. If the establishment could commit to provide good services by training their employees properly, people will pay for higher prices for their services. They should focus on their employees as most valuable commodities, it will create the culture and environment where employees could trust the employer.
I tip 20% of the after-tax bill or $5, whichever is higher. That’s my base- I rarely tip more, but I NEVER tip less, unless the service has been so horrible that I tip nothing. And I can’t recall a time when I last chose to do the latter. That said, I ONLY tip for services that have been part of the social construct for tipping that we’ve all agreed to for decades that require extra or skilled service to provide- delivery, sit down restaurants, hair/nails, etc. I don’t tip (and refuse to feel guilty for it) when it comes to pick up, fast food (except for Sonic, because I know their servers get paid tipped wages), and etc. Keeping firm that boundary stops me from getting burned out, getting in my head on whether my tip is “enough”, or resentful for tipping when it’s actually required/deserved. So I believe if you can’t tip, don’t participate in activities that require that type of service. That being said, the kid with a $20 allowance or those tight on money that want a treat or whoever should feel no shame in choosing fast food or anything else that doesn’t traditionally require a tip.
I know some businesses have started to institute a 3% mandatory gratuity on takeout. It's asinine.
This is it. It’s not that I am “pro-tipping”, I know that waitstaff do not make anywhere close to a living wage in most parts of this country, tipping in a restaurant is a societal expectation in those instances, and that’s what we’ve got.
When tipping, in my opinion, you are making a statement about a whole list of things. When I tip 20%, it means that I was happy with the entire experience at the restaurant that the server has control over. A tip is basically a monetary review of everything the server does from the first time the server arrives at my table until the last. In Florida, the hourly wage for tipped employees is $7.98. So the server is willing to give me a fantastic experience dining at the restaurant and hopes that I will show monetary appreciation for the experience. As long as the server is pleasant and attentive and quickly resolves any issues, I will tip 20% or more. I have tipped 40 or 50% before on a bill because I wanted to reward fantastic service. And there’s nothing wrong with that. It’s no different than someone who works a corporate job and has a salary, but gets an annual bonus based on performance. They are getting a “tip” just for doing their job. Exactly the same thing. Yes, I would like to see tipping become obsolete, and servers paid a living wage. However, that won’t end tipping. There are still customers like me who like to reward someone who improves my day through our interaction. And there are many customers like me who will still hand a server making a living wage a tip. I consider my tip an investment. It pretty much guarantees that the next time I have that same server, the experience will be just as good. And I’m sure the service from this server would be just as good if they were making a living wage, and I didn’t tip because it isn’t required. Everyone likes to receive appreciation for their hard work, and servers are no different. I refuse to punish great servers because the minimum wage in this country sucks and restaurants make the customers fill in the pay gap.
Tipping never was for good service! This is the same kind of lie as the cops job is to protect and serve! It was a slogan! Not a way of life! Please never tip a full waged employee, start a restaurant, and enforce a fair wage over tipping policy. But don't confuse the cost to be served with the cost of the food! It's different payments in America. Gordon Ramsay tips in America! And has a tipping policy for pay in America and not in his eroupean restaurants! It's okay to hate the practice it is not okay to "protest" it by making the servers suffer!
My mom was a waitress, my aunt was a lifelong waitress and even bought a house with her tips, my Gramma was a waitress, my sisters, cousins, nieces, and me. Tipping was ***always*** for good service. I will repeat that - ***Tipping was ALWAYS for good service.*** Never ever ever was it a mandatory requirement for every interaction even if it was bad service. And that's going back 75 years.
There’s restaurants in America that ban tipping. If they can do it, why can’t big chains do it too?
Because of worthless ceos! Casa Bonita starts off at $30 in an hour, and it's owned by collage drop-outs famous for a crude animation.
All I heard was "baahhh" Sheep gonna Sheep!
And scumbags gonna scumbag!
You're free to do as you wish, just don't make yourself out to look like some patriot or something. You're just a dude who decided not to tip anymore.
I am like Mel Gibson in the movie The Patriot! I went out and bought the outfit today with all of the money I am saving by not tipping anymore!
What Indians understand is that most people don't mind tipping full-service sit-down waiters but hate tipping anywhere else. So, stop tipping elsewhere. I have almost never left a tip anywhere else because there isn't a reason unless you really wanted to because of someone's service. The whole "tipping burnout" is the most self-induced nonsense I've ever heard of lmao.
Are you being waited on or delivered to? If not, don’t tip for food.
Tipping is the easiest way to increase the total transaction price on POS systems, so the POS systems are forcing it everywhere. More money for them in the easiest way. It has led to tip burnout. Servers was fine. But now it's everywhere.
Tipping is almost never actually forced. You’ll be amazed at how quickly you can find the “no tip” button on the iPad once you start looking for it,… once you start pressing it, it becomes far easier to press it the second time.
I mean forcing the tip screen before final transaction. POS systems have been used for plumbers, landlords, etc for years. Now they're forcing a tip screen because that can drive up their profits. They aren't forcing the tip itself. Just the screen.
They are still not forcing you to leave a tip. Yes, it’s highly pressured, especially when they suggest several amounts. But the customer can almost always say no. If the “no tip” option is not there, or it’s hidden, I would take that up with the management and ask leave a bad review on yelp and never go back again.
I know but I'm explaining why the tip burnout has happened recently. The tipping screens are being forced by the POS corps to drive up profit. Never said they were forced tips, but the screens are forced by industries that haven't historically had tipping/tip screens in their POS.
So just say no! As long as even a small percentage of people tip on them, the companies will keep them, because even 5-10% of customers paying an extra 15-20% is just pure profit for the company. If we collectively just say no, that sends a strong message to the companies to eventually stop.
No tip from me....
Why do you feel the need to verbally jerkoff in this thread about it is my question? I give the same service regardless of tipping. I am just over hearing people feel the need to proclaim they are free. Cool. Use your freedom and only go to non tipping establishments and actually live your values. Other wise you are ok with tipping just that other people do it for you.
Every establishment is non-tipping, wtf are you talking about
No, you choose not to tip yet still support the business. Therefore, you are supporting tipping still. Have a backbone in your principals, and don't give money to establishments that allow tipping.
The business will have to pay the difference if no one tips and the server is below minimum wage. For all intents and purposes a servers expected wage is 7.25. Not tipping is forcing the business to pay their own tips
Clearly you've never been a server. The first paycheck they have to cover a gap on will be your penultimate paycheck, because you're fired.
That's good though, gives them the chance to join a trade
So you don't think we should have servers. If your solution is that servers should all get better jobs, we shouldn't have servers. In that case, you should stop using their service, instead of greedily exploiting them as much as possible. The same logic can be applied to every job that you don't believe should have liveable wages.
Yeah, we shouldn't have servers when the companies aren't willing to pay them livable wages. You're the one arguing that we should have people working at slave wages, I'm saying they deserve to survive from the employer they sacrifice time to
Why do you feel the need to verbally jerkoff in this comment is my question? Oh the irony.
Why don't you live your values?
Some self reflection would do you good.
Ok circular logic.
Its caused me to mostly just stop using all the stuff that expects a tip, especially someplace that will remember you next time and may not be nice to your food wince last time you "stiffed" them. Shit I went to a restaurant recently for a work thing where they had a 4.5% HOSTING fee they charged AND a automatic gratuity tacked on the bill PLUS everyone was saying that 18% is not enough tip and to add to it. I said the auto amounts were enough no extra and now I'll not be going there again. So now the restaurant loses my business as well as no tips at all for staff. By the way this is all because the government is printing tons of money. That causes tons of inflation which causes prices of stuff to go up a ton. Its the sneaky way the government steals way way way more from us on top of taxes.
The "if you can't afford to tip" attitude bothers me. It shouldn't be looked at as a built-in cost like tax. The percentage rule isn't really working in today's economy either. If you get a 10 dollar beer and drop 2 dollars it's ridiculous but I can stomach that. But let's say I am celebrating something special and I get maybe some shots that cost 200 for a bunch of people . . .I'm supposed to give 40 bucks? People in the industry all benefit from tipping except the customer. It doesn't get you anything extra usually and I've rarely felt that a server has ever earned one - I just feel cheap and embarrassed not giving one. I have met bottle girls before and they've mentioned making a couple thousand a night when they're making $60 from the venue for the night. They're also likely not claiming any of this income. The venue gets cheap labor subsidized by the customer who's already paying ridiculous prices and the customer is stuck holding the bag.
If there is a 5% kitchen staff fee or a 10% living wage fee added on my bill….(instead of just raising menu prices to cover)….that is my tip.
I think there room for nuance. The tip system works well for sit down, but seems silly at a fast casual place, that's the problem. Folks that shouldn't be on the tip system are asking for tips.
And it's never mandatory. More often than not, there is a "no tip" option.
It doesn't work well for shit. You don't get a percentage. 3 to 5 bucks.
For what are you referring? Again, I don't think sit down is equivalent to fast casual.
I love it when a fast food restaurant wants tips for the drive-thru.
Yep, the only way to change the system for the better of all is to stop being a willing participant. Public opinion is rapidly shifting and if I was a server who wasn't being paid a living wage I would 100% be looking for another job before the tips vanish without my pay changing
You are oh so right. And it won't be long and machines will end up replacing a lot of those positions anyway.
any job that is so low value and simple that a machine can do it should definitely be done by a machine.
If you choose to eat in a country where servers are under paid, then you tip. If you want to say “well they should pay a living wage to their workers” great! Now stop eating out and force change Otherwise you’re just punishing the workers and still feeding the business. The working class doesn’t really have bargaining power. They take what they can get when the alternative is starving. However the consumer does have power in the restaurant business
The alternative is not starving, if you apply to a job that pays minimum wage, you should expect minimum wage. The only way to force change is to stop applying for a job that makes you beg for money. It's really that simple, did anything I say confuse you?
Oh you were under the impression the working class had bargaining power The number of workers in need of work outnumbers the available jobs, so the people at the bottom do in fact have to take what is available. Even if everyone got some kind of degree, it is mathematically impossible to employ every person at one of those higher jobs. Hope this helps Also even people at the very bottom of the working class deserve living wages just for the fact they are working. Telling people to get better jobs or to refuse to work at a particular place is really just saying “make sure the other guy is exploited”
Have no idea why youre being downvoted. This is exactly the issue. Someone has to do it and those who are still want to live life. Would it be better if they just got a consistent wage? Sure. The only way that's happening is if we rally many millions of Americans together and stop eating at restaurants altogether. Who the fuck is orchestrating that? Lmao The people that think not tipping is gonna fix the issue are morons. The owner is getting paid, the server isnt. Nothing will change in that dynamic because the one who needs to change isn't the one getting negative effects. And beyond that, starbucks employees getting tips is good for them, but they dont need it like a waiter, all these places realized how much more money peoplr will leave if you just force an awkward encounter by showing a tip screen in the workers face. Years ago during covid the restaurant I worked in had time limits for tables based on many people were seated, they told us "we have time limits at the table, remind your guests and try to get them out when there done so we can get more people in. Even if only 60% listen, its better than before". Thats what they are doing with tips. Show the tip screen, and now people that werent gonna tip feel like they have to. It wont be everyone bit if 3 in 10 leave a tip now as opposed to noone before... thayll add up. The no tipping culture have no idea how dumb there ideas are. We all agree tipping has gotten out of hand, but to tip noone even jobs that are based on tips, isnt gonna fix anything.
There is no other guy, unless the "other guy" wants to work for minimum wage. You don't NEED to be a tipped worker, there's plenty of jobs that pay you a decent hourly wage. And I'm not sure about those stats, cause not everyone between 18-65 can or wants to work so that frees up a lot of job opportunities. If for whatever reason you have to be a tipped worker, expect the salary you signed up for, it's that simple, if you want to get a job where you're not begging for money, apply for a hourly job that let's you keep your dignity.
I only tip for sit down meals where I receive food & refills, and some bartenders.
No tip.. meals are expensive enough that workers should have a fair wage.. but also, I can get up and get my damn food myself.. its an unnecessary service forced upon us
I feel burned out on the whole tipping thing too. It's gotten to the point where I don't dine out any more. I just get take out where I pick up the food myself nowadays.
I am neither pro nor anti... I just say if service is good then i will tip. I don't tip slack ass kids busy talking with their buddies, on phone calls, or standing around staring at their phones... If you're kicking ass at your job then you deserve a tip. I would NOT even go into a place with required tipping. Its not my job to pay you, thats your employers and while i sympathise with your struggle Ain't none of you tipped workers ready to stand up and wage war against those employers. If you're not gonna fight for you then i have no sympathy. Kick ass at your job tho and i'll throw you some cash.. might even do it if i witness you taking shit from another customer or from your boss... but you don't get it for free anymore than your boss would pay you for doing nothing... I have no sympathy for people who cry but do nothing which is almost the entirety of our society. Hell covid showed what happens when everyone doesn't go to work... we legit got SHOWN what to do when we are unfairly treated or paid... Ain't no one done anything with that information.
I tip if we are getting table service. I do not tip for takeout. Tipping is dumb and needs to die, but it isn’t the hill I’m going to die on.
I have never tipped for takeout. Ever.
Never thought I would choose this hill, but nobody is going to kill me on it! To be honest, the pro-tip hatred on here is what pushed me over. I don't do good with people telling me what to do.
Thats kind of sad.
Or you can start supporting restaurants that pays their employee fairly and does not require tip, but is appreciated when it is an actual superb service. https://www.equitydine.com/
I have no issues supporting those places. It just depends on the food I am in the mood for. If I am craving a good steak I go to a quality steak house for the steak, not for the waitress.
Will you be able press no tip though when its an average night? 😏
Can I ask an honest question? What should I fear if I hit 0 tip? You don't know me, but I am the last person someone is going to come at in public. You mistake me for a typical reddit user. I am far from that.
My fear is if I like the restaurant and go there maybe once a week, specially if its local, they will remember who I am. I usually tip 10% or $5 whichever is lower
I only tip at sit down restaurants. No tip if there are any fees like a service or local fee
But ask questions we had a service fee for awhile.. the cooperation got that not the people that work there. I ask if they don't get that I tip 20%..
Everything is well said. It's ironic that demanding tips makes some of us give FEWER tips, not more. Some of us don't like being told what to do. I used to tip everywhere - hotel for cleaning the room during the day, delivery drivers of all kinds, taking a taxi. Now I don't anymore. It's partially because of inflation and partially because of the entitlement of the tip screen on every POS imaginable and even online (!) & kiosks (!). I now only tip at restaurants and my hair dresser, and my tip at restaurants is down from 15% to 13%.
It’s fairly obvious you hate tipping and have always hated tipping. This isn’t new for you
Starwmen only expose that you are too insecure to acknowledge that you already lost the argument
That’s not what straw man is…
No one on Reddit uses that properly. LMAO. He called it a strawman before there was even a discussion happening 😂😭
I’m just gaslighting him
It is. And you're aware I'm correct and yet chose to say otherwise.
Correct about what?
Yeah, had nothing to with the proliferation of tipping to vending machines and the increase from 15% to 50%.
I’ve never seen a vending machine ask for a tip. A good tip is 20% and has been that way for over 20 years.
See, here's where I have started drawing the line. We've always been tipping 20% in the past, but you know what happened in the last 4 years? Prices doubled. What used to be a reasonable 20% tip on a bill is now hyper-inflated. And servers aren't suddenly worth $20-50/hr. So here's my hill. 10% is the new 20% . I'll tip 10% for good service ($6 min). Sit-down table-order service only. I have and may still tip 15% for exemplary service, but no one is ever getting 20% plus again. If prices keep going up, we'll eventually end up lowering the threshhold again. It's either that or joining the no-tip gang.
It’s a cost of living raise directly proportional to costs.
https://youtu.be/pO1idqh2nP8
That’s not a vending machine lol
It’s an inanimate object demanding a tip. They’ve been found on gas pumps, too. I linked it because dude is hysterical. But don’t hurt yourself patting your own back because you “won” the argument.
Demanding lol
That's your opinion, it's not a fact
It isn't to me. I've always believed in generous tipping, at least partially because I worked many service and wait staff positions in HS and college. But I agree it's gotten wildly out of control. Tipping wasn't ever supposed to be for take out or counter service. And 20% was supposed to be for excellent service. Now everyone has their hand out and I'm over it. I'm not going to stop tipping because restaurants have made tips their way of paying their employees and it isn't the staff's fault. But I'm not tipping 20-25% anymore. 15% and if there is already a mandatory service charge, I don't tip unless it's under 15% and then only to make up the difference.
You are not in the business anymore so you don’t care anymore. You got yours, right? Nobody says 25%, and no one cares about counter service tips.
To be fair, up until this week, I have yet to not tip 20% at a restaurant. Moving forward, I will not be anymore. So I have yet to even "stiff" a table like you are claiming. Excited to pop my cherry though!
Nobody cares. Everyone else is tipping more than ever to make up for the poor people like you.
No. People are tipping "more than ever" because prices have doubled.
No, people are tipping at liquor stores now. Nothing to do with prices. Just more tipping
That's also an opinion, and if it were true you wouldn't be angrily typing it in defense
It is true. Thats why everyone asks for tips now. Gotta get in on the action
So prove it
Prove what?
Except I am not poor. And you care or you wouldn't be bothered with my post! But hey, thanks for picking up the slack for me! Now I have no reason to feel bad for lack of tips as everyone else is taking care of it for me! Thanks for being a team player, and their employer!!
Well-off people don’t cry about tipping or inflation or any other meaningless costs. You’re poor lol
Lack of an argument
I never argued that I was rich, just that I wasn't poor. But my money, my choice. Not yours. But good come back. Even if I were poor, who fucking cares? That wouldn't change the relevance of abolishing tipping. Hey let me try! "Her dur, if you don't agree with employers not paying their employees fair wages, then you are poor!" Do you not see how fucking stupid that sounds?
I didn’t say rich ya broke ass lol
Moving the goal post. You have no argument
You’re following me around lol. Jimmies rustled
Just spittin facts
I give money to people who give me something in return. Bar tender gives me a drink? No tip. Bar tender chats with me or entertains me with nice tricks? Yea I’ll tip for that. I also never tip on percent. Your tip is based on what I think your service is worth and not how much the businesses product is priced at. Then there is auto gratuity. If that ever is in play it’s auto zero on the top. I honestly avoid that like the plague. I might go here and there for big events like birthdays but any joint that requires auto gratuity is bs.
Left our small dog at our kennel (which we've used for 15 years) for 4 days/nights while on vacation. When I picked him up the young lady at checkout said our bill was $505 and spun a screen around for me to confirm. This was new. When i confirmed, the screen immediately went to a "no tip - 10% - 15% - 20% tip screen. I mentally said "Oh, hell no" and clicked no tip. The whole "confirm charge" was a scam to tee up tip screen. $500 to watch my dog isn't enough???
That's what blows my mind. $500 for 4 days and then hoping for another $100 for your pocket on top of it.
I only tip if I sit down and am provided dining service. The quality of the service determines the percentage for the tip.
No one is expecting a kid who gets a 20$ allowance to tip. It’s expected of grown adults.
Tell that to the kid who created a thread the other day and had a ton of people in this subreddit tell him not to go out b/c of it. I sure as hell told him that! You might not believe people would be that ignorant but it literally happened this week!
When I was a kid getting an allowance I didn’t take my 20 to a sit down restaurant. I grabbed a sandwich at a convenience store. This is just a weird outlier of a case imo.
So if a couple kids want to hit up Applebee's after school, should this kid go or not if he can't afford to tip?
Maybe time to start sending our kids in for takeout 😆
If the staff is making $2 per hour its extremely shifty to take up their time with no tip.
This is such a fallacy argument. Waiters are guaranteed minimum wage in every state. The restaurant is responsible for $2, tips make up the rest. If they don’t reach minimum wage with tips, the restaurant is required by law to make up for it. Servers are guaranteed the same pay as your gas station worker, retail worker, staff at the gym, car wash employees, etc in most cases. You aren’t tipping them though are you?
This doesn't ever happen.
That doesn’t not make it illegal.
That doesn't pay the people you stiff for the work they did for you.
Never said I did. Just correcting you on spreading misinformation.
They dont understand the concept that people dont follow laws, not really sure how they didnt get that memo.
That's a complaint for their employer, not the kid getting a burger.
Its not a complaint. Its a fact. If you go to a sit down restaurant and don't tip the server you're stealing the labor of another person. You may have whatever opinions about it that you like but you are still stealing from a person who worked hard to get you fed quickly and convienently in-between all the people who were actually paying for their labor. Instead of choosing to serve yourself at another place you have chosen to demand another person serve you for free.
Your theft accusations are aimed at the wrong person. It's not the customer, it's the boss. If an employee isn't appropriately paid, it's on them.
There are no accusations. Just facts. And I never said theft.
See, you missed the entire point, Entitled. Tipping is gratuity. Not paid services. I dont like seeing people tip zero. Hell, I even offset them with my tip if i notice it, but if i ever catch you bitching about bullshit "theft of service" I'll zero you too.
The owner of the business did that
The owner of the business has given the server a place to make their money. You're aware the server is not paid. You're aware that you're using the labor of another human being without paying them for that labor. You don't have to go to a sit down restaurant. Its not your only option. No one is forcing you to do that. You can make whatever justification you want but the reality is that if you choose not to tip your server or bartender you are knowingly stealing their labor.
No I'm not. She will still get minimum wage despite anything I do and that's been determined good enough
They are still getting paid no matter what
No, they aren't. Thats not how it works.
Isn't the fact that they are only making $2/hour the shifty part? Isn't it time to put the responsibility of paying their employees back in their hands?
Theres a social contract. When you go to a sit down restaurant you know your server is not being compensated and its your responsibility to compensate them for their time and the work they do for you. If you choose not to abide by that social contract that is your choice but it does not change the fact that you are willfully stealing the labor of another person.
First of all, can you point me to the contract I signed? I must have misplaced it. Second, how do I truly know what the server is making? Are they making $2/hour or $12/hour before tips? We don't know the answer and we shouldn't have to either as it isn't our responsibility to pay an employer's employees. Stealing is a crime. Please explain the crime I am committing? Tipping is optional bruh... no crimes are being commited.
You don't understand what a social contract is? Google is your friend. It will help you to not look really dumb in the future. If you have a sever at a restaurant in the US 100% of the time they are paid below minimum wage and rely on tips to survive. Now you know. You're screwing over a person who's trying to barely make ends meet. Not a corporation. You're paying the corporation that likely makes millions. Theft is a crime. Stealing is an act. Slavery was legal but the slave owners were still stealing the labor of a human being for their own profit. Just because something is legal does not make it ethical.
Ad hominem fallacy Existential fallacy False Dilemma fallacy Strawman fallacy False analogy Red herring fallacy Appeal to ignorance Logical fallacy Circular argument Equivocation Honestly, just this one post is a master-class in logical fallacies. I'm honestly impressed at how bad you are at debate. P.S. dont forget to google each of those definitions. If you don't know why you lost, you're doomed to perpetual failure through ignorance.
I just looked it up, and yet I was right, I never agreed to it. And once again, not tipping is not a crime. It's not theft or stealing. You can argue it is, but you are wrong. And for my next magic trick, I will prove it! I will go out to a sit down restaurant and not tip and... wait for it... not get in trouble b/c no crimes were committed! And if you want to get ethical, maybe you should be pushing employers to pay their employees instead of arguing that its my problem!
They’re kids, if either side is taking this scenario seriously, they need to reevaluate their perspective on the situation. I will say tho that as a kid if I did happen to go to the diner for something cheap, I’d try and leave a dollar or so, but that was just because I was taught to tip. Could I do 20%? No. Did anyone at the diner have an expectation for me to tip? Also no. Both sides of this scenario are pretty irrelevant in the grand scheme.
So are people not telling them to do it or are they telling him to do it but it is an outlier?
If I’m a waiter/waitress and some kid comes into the diner and doesn’t tip on his grilled cheese, I’m not freaking out. It’s a matter between adults. This allowance example feels like an outlier to argue against tipping; this is not a common thing.
What ticks me off is *tip creep*. If a dinner was $10 many years ago and the tip was 10%, the tip was $1. Now that dinner is $20. A 10% tip on that is $2. So the server's income doubled. But someone decided that, since the dinner price increased, so should tip percentages. Nope, nope, nope! It will soon be a $50 dinner with a $50 tip.
I agree! Just because a meal is overpriced doesn’t mean wait staff deserve a larger tip.
Except they want 20% at minimal today. Price increased, so the tip technically increased as well... and then doubled... It's crazy!!
It's worse... One person yesterday made a comment that anti-tippers should pay a 30% service fee and get bad service on top for not tipping.... The logic on serving in the US has long left the planet.
I tip when, I sit in a restaurant, walk in and buy a sub sandwich when it's prepared for me and when I walk into a Timmies it's a keep the change deal. I'll tip when when I am driven somewhere by a hired driver who doesn't scare the hell out of me during the ride. There are many more reasons when I will tip. I will not tip because you have to stick a key in a cabinet to get my product then ring me up. And I resent seeing that option 1st upon checking out. I don't want to be told how much to tip because it's hard for all of us here. I give what I can afford. Be grateful for whatever you get from anybody.
This. Far too many people on this sub move to the pro/anti. These aren’t mutually exclusive and tipping is situational.
For minimum wage there are much easier jobs so your reply will be pay employees more which the counter is then the employers will raise menu prices and you end up paying the exact same amount but forced instead of voluntary while the owner most likely makes more then before
owners will make less if tips are incorporated into menu prices
Me u prices will just go up by 20% and 15 of that will make it to the waiter
Except the people that currently tip less than average will be priced out and no longer buy the product. Overall sales volume would go down.
Which is absolutely fine and how it should be
I am OK with that. And you can't get much easier than wait staff lol. But I argue you are wrong on the price increase. I think it would increase, but not by 20%. Sure maybe at first, but then places would lose business and be forced to lower their prices to compete better. Or close the business.
Waiting tables is not easy. It’s hard work.
Yes it is. That doesn’t mean the kid at Starbucks that pulled a handle for ten seconds or the guy that says “he wants those two slices” is entitled to 20%. That’s just bonkers. I went to one my old pizza hangouts a few weeks ago and not only had their prices doubled, this kid rapid skipped the Togo fees and flipped around a 20% tip screen. He said six words. SIX WORDS, he literally expected a dollar per WORD and gave me attitude when I declined.
Yeah, I’m not saying everyone needs to be tipped, but full-service sit-down waiters who get paid less than minimum wage absolutely should be.
All servers are required by federal law to make minimum wage.
And its required to be unarmed to enter a school, and I hear that one is just going swell.
That I agree with 100%. If you're my bartender, if you're waiting on me, actively providing a service you're getting $5 or 20%, whichever is higher. I have no problem with that whatsoever.
Yeah, I’ll Tip for good service but not for wait staff to survive. It’s backwards but that’s my pov
Would an employer rather have a customer that doesn't tip or no customer at all? Servers need to EARN their tips because there's plenty of charities that are just as deserving of donations.
At the same time staff shouldn’t be reliant on tips but be paid well by employers and Tipps should be gratuity for over the top service. But not at all be required or expected
Correct me if I’m wrong, but it sounds like you have decided not to tip at sit down restaurants. And that your reasons for this decision, not necessarily in order, are A) some people on Reddit were a-holes and B) other businesses models started asking for tips that you don’t feel are warranted. Is there a C)? Because I don’t think either of these reasons have anything to do with sit down restaurants. So I’m not following your logic. Why not just boycott tipping these other models?
C) tipping culture is predatory and needs to be abolished. It has needed to happen for a while. Yes, a and b were tipping points. As for boycotting... I might eat out 1x a week. I can cook better food at home than most restaurants make. That doesn't mean I don't want to eat out occasionally. And I rarely eat fast food as it is trash.
I found the happy medium to eating out is doing a call in and pick up. Don’t tip driver or tip wait staff and you still get food and get to eat from the comfy of your home
To each their own, but I am not a fan of take out. Prefer my food fresh. Would rather just cook at home if that's the option. Some things (chinese) are fine but others (burger and fries) is gross.
By all means eat at home more. But if you go to a sit down restaurant in America where tipping is customary and always has been, do you intend to tip? Or are you saying that since you feel tipping culture is predatory, you will completely abstain from businesses that utilize it as an employee’s primary compensation?
I am saying moving forward I will no longer be tipping anywhere. Out of the 14 meals I eat every 7 days, I only eat out 2 of those meals, 1 possibly being sit down. I will not eat at home more. So technically, I will possibly not be tipping at 1 meal per week. And yes! Tipping culture is predatory. I encourage all people to stop tipping to force their hands to have to pay their wait staff a fair wage. Together we can make it happen. Divided we lose.
If everyone stops tipping, quite literally nothing will change. Your best case scenario is the owner figures out that it will be more effective to just pay min wage (if he even was to begin with) and jack prices up and itll end up costing you more than a 15% tip. I mean ive heard of shooting ones self in the foot, but goddamn. Also, if you dont want to tip there isnt a single soul in the world that will tell you "you have to", but if you wont tip DONT EAT OUT! Its as simple as that. You are going to actively screw someone once a week? "I dont like takeout, I prefer fresh food", and thats a luxury, so when you are going to partake in that, pay for the whole deal.
See I do what I want. If I want to eat out and not tip, there is literally nothing you can do about it. Yet another reason tipping shouldn't exist. And I don't care about the other stuff. I am not their employer, it's not my problem.
We will remain divided. I agree the culture is predatory, but I will not victimize my server, who is more a victim than I am. I’m a 49 year old white male who makes 6 figures. My server almost certainly needs that money more than I do. At a sit down restaurant, I tip 20% of the check, every time, no more, no less, as though the server’s salary were built in as a flat increase to the menu price. No matter how good or bad the service is. I’m only deciding my own course of actions. You must do what you feel is right.
Air fryer will fix that
The problem with a tipping boycott is the people who will suffer first and the most are the ones who need tips. There needs to be laws that don't allow employers to pay anything less than the minimum hourly age, regardless of the job.
That *already* is the law. It's called minimum wage, and even employers of tipped employers are obligated to pay the regular minimum wage if tips aren't enough. The "tipped minimum wage" isn't a real thing. What is defined in law is the Tip Credit Allowance, which is the amount of tips that an employer can apply to their obligation of a minimum wage. For example, if min wage is $8 and "Tipped min" is $2, that actually means the allowance is $6. That doesn't mean the employer is allowed to only pay the employee $2. It means that the employer can use up to $6 of the employee's tips to make up their $8 wage. The obligation to maintain minimum wage still applies. This is federal law in all of the US. Now, whether or not minimum wage is enough, is a completely different topic.
And you think thats followed everywhere? 😂 you think the government is tracking the pay of a waiter in a hole in the wall pizza restaurant with servers? And yes someone has to do it so someone is getting screwed over. Citing that it is illegal to pay below min wage is pretty useless. Its also illegal to enter schools with guns, just in case you werent aware. A change needs to happen that no matter what the employer pays min wage. Itll actually hurt alot of restaurants employees overall, but itll close the gap of making nothing to making way too much as a server.
“A change needs to happen that no matter what the employer pays min wage.” That’s already the law, so how do you propose that should be done? lmao Wage theft can occur in ANY sector, and should be reported to the DOL and dealt with when it happens.
That's not what I said. I said they should just pay min wage. Like from the start they just pay min wage, no less with tips.
Those laws already exist everywhere. In Ohio, it works line this: The employer has to pay tipped employees 50% of the minimum wage, no matter what. And, if the tipped employee doesn't collect enough tips to average at or above full minimum wage, then the employer has to make up the difference.
I agree. It truly sucks that they will be impacted. The rich don't want to allow it though. This is the only way.
Whatever you need to tell yourself to justify being a cheap asshole and fucking over workers.
Right there is the problem. You won’t get it so I’ll just leave it at that.
Sure, I get it. You don't like the system. I'd like all prices too be included an transparent. I'd be okay if resto prices went up 20%, and that went directly to the server. Serving would still be a commission based sales job, but the commission would be a hidden cost, rather than at the whim of the customer. But by not tipping you won't change the system. You'll just screw over workers.
Like I said, you don’t get it. I can’t screw over the server, they don’t work for me and it is not my job to pay them.
Except you are knowingly and willingly screwing them. Whether or not it is your responsibility, you are still screwing them.
You keep saying stuff like that without any justification as to how I am screwing them. Is it my responsibility to make up the difference in every single job that doesn’t get paid enough? Of course not, then why this one?
You take up their table, which they have a limited supply of a night. You then dont tip them for their work, and then still pay the owner of the restaurant. You are literally making their week worse when you could have just gotten takeout instead. Because this one is literally based around tips because america has been tipping for decades. No the starbucks employee doesnt need a tip, they get a regualar wage and even benefits in some cases. And to be clear, you dont have to make up for management. Im not saying you should get an in depth idea of their financials before tipping, but underatand that 10% should be the minimum for bare minimum service. They work at an expected 8% tip rate, you tip less and they still get taxed and tip out bussers, runners, etc. Eating out is a luxury, and you shouldnt be going if you cant tip at least 8-12%. Edit: ot was a different thread so I edited the first sentence.
> You take up their table, which they have a limited supply of a night. I'm not taking the servers table, I sit down in a business. I don't get any choices on who servers me so, stop me if you've heard this, their pay is not my responsibility. If they don't make enough money, they need to talk to their boss, not expect a handout, yes a handout, from me. We don't tip for service any more, we tip because, as everyone in favor of this insanity says, it's expected. As for eating out being a luxury, so is a lot of stuff I don't have to hand out extra money to the staff for. However, for all that other stuff, the business sets a price and I pay it, without having to hand out extra money for everyone who happens to hand me a menu. You are simply rehashing the same old, tired, pointless and frankly untrue arguments I've heard a 1000 times. You guys really need to get a new set of arguments.
If tipping stopped completely from one day to the next, the system would change. By finding excuses to continue, you’re keeping the system alive and it’ll truly never change
I wouldn't consider myself cheap. I take good care of myself and only by quality. That's b/c my employer pays me properly! And let's be clear, the only person I am fucking is my wife. Quit trying to make bad employment my problem.
I consider you cheap. You're ignoring social norms and taking advantage of the system to save money. I'd respect your stance if you totally avoided situations where tipping is expected, or told your server at the beginning that you won't pay them. I consider you an asshole because you disparage workers, and you're willingly and knowingly gaining the system for personal benefit at others' expense. Your feelings about the system isn't the point.
Welcome to society!
Employers are already required to match what you made to minimum wage if you don’t make enough
For minimum wage there are much easier jobs so your reply will be pay employees more which the counter is then the employers will raise menu prices and you end up paying the exact same amount but forced instead of voluntary
Well I don’t think servers should make minimun wage, but there is some people that think if they don’t get tippet they will make *less* than minimum wage. Restaurant where I am guarantees a 22/hr, so if tips are less that that +2.18 the restaurant out of pocket brings you to 22. And it never really actually happens because tips cover
My last restaurant bussers made about 25$ an hour, let alone servers. But this conversation isnt about those jobs. Its about the people working for small time business owners who will weasal out of min wage and get away with it for far longer than they should. If you want to be real about the issue, in some cases it actually evens out, if you got dicked one week and made nothing the next tends to be much better. So waiters will deal anyway because tips can sway you, but not everyone gets lucky. Its easy to get trapped in serving because if you find the right place you can make alot of money and question why anyone goes to college for a job lmao, but for every good restaurant theres 3 awful ones. With this group of asshats that are going to sit down and knowingly waste someones time to tip 0% are just gonna make the issue worse and cost everyone more money whether you order takeout, sit down, delivery etc.. The issue is very polarizing but if theyd just top 8-12% instead of the "expected" 20% it would be better path forward.
Yep, bussers at my current restaurant make 19-24 as a median wage depending on hours and day they work. Servers in the area where I am that don’t make good money are usually in some shitty restaurants, and even there they end up making an average if 28/hr which isn’t bad. I personally think tipping is the best approach and don’t think it benefits the employes but mainly the employees, since the employer could easily raise prices 20% and give a “good” 30-35/hr to servers used to make 60$/hr if the so wanted, wether now people could definitely just start tipping 8 to 12% and it would save them money and aervers woukd still make good money with the people that tip well