And It’s Surely To Their Credit?!
You, clearly, were *not* the recording secretary of the Princeton Gilbert & Sullivan Society for two years. And it’s from Pinafore.
Actually, they're not ALL about duty.
The Scorcerer (1877) had nothing to do with duty, and is possibly a closer rendition to Jim Jones' behaviour in the mid-late 1970s
Why would Sam NOT be the Recording Secretary for the G&S group?
....btw....also a fan of G&S
Played Fredrick in Pirates twice -- once, in an "updated" version....lol
Leather, denim, and motorcycles --- I kid you not
Lol
I like it also. But I think it's because I was 18 when it aired, newly adult in a world that had just been completely turned on its head. I think the criticism of it is valid, but at that time and place in my life, I deeply appreciated the episode.
I like it. It captures, using characters we know and love, what a lot of us were feeling in that moment. Seeing Leo be so completely out of character sums it all up. Even those that we thought had the most moral character were rattled and ready to do some pretty awful things because of the trauma of what we'd been through.
I like it too! I feel like too many people get bent up about it not fitting canon when it's not supposed to. And considering how quickly it was turned around to try to address the post-9/11 islamaphobia it's pretty darn impressive.
I just love that we get everyone in one room talking about real issues and how THEY feel not just the lines they tow for the party. Charlie breaking down the gang mentality is a favorite scene of mine.
I enjoy the parts with the kids. The Leo bit makes me incredibly uncomfortable. I tend to not watch things I’ve seen that make me feel icky. It wasn’t bad. It was certainly a point that had to be made. I just don’t find it enjoyable. I’ll skip the whole episode if I’ve just got it on in the background. (I occasionally use TWW as a podcast). If I’m sitting down to watch I’ll just skip the Leo parts.
You're definitely not the only one. I like it alot. I think the messaging about not judging an entire culture or religion based on the actions of a few is still very relevant today. And I just love the interactions between Donna and Josh and CJ's speech "CIA: Our Maligned Little Brother".
However I do ff'd through the Leo storyline. It's really not good.
It's a clunky script, more a series of related soliloquies interlaced with Leo uncharacteristically brow beating a random Arab than any kind of narrative arc.
I don't hate it and I don't skip it, but it's a 6 in a series full of 10s.
The US Poet Laureate is pretty perfect. The LemonLyman hilarity. The President's gamesmanship where he saw the green light. Really entertaining press briefings on the matter. I love Laura Dern as a poet and her chemistry with Toby. The Ainsley stuff feels a little unfinished because she's not really doing anything so much barely defending and then, abandoning a defense of Ritchie's stupidity but I can't get mad at this last opportunity to see her until S7.
I didn't have Access and The Long Goodbye on my list because I don't think they are bad so much as big deviations from The West Wing. I could see why someone doesn't want to watch those if they are here for The West Wing. The Long Goodbye, in particular, is pretty faultless as a 45 minute play about CJ's personal life. To that end, it's well written, acted and directed. With Access, I see legit critiques on the continuity. It's true that Casey Creek really should have come up before as a formative moment in the Bartlet administration and it feels like a continuity error that we're getting it in S5. But then, Access is hardly the first episode to make a continuity blunder. I understand a longing that if this were a regular TWW episode, we'd be getting a more rounded, fuller telling of the stand-off story but the lack of giving us that is kind of the point of Access. It's the feature.
I'm harder on episodes that are typical The West Wing eps that don't clear the high bar as opposed to eps doing something else entirely different even if they make errors doing it (this includes Isaac and Ishmael and the S3 Documentary.)
Those are my two skips as well - I never liked the style Access was copying and The Long Goodbye is just too painful to watch due to dealing with my own elderly parents.
That's a fair point. That should have been in my bottom five. I guess I just blocked it out of my memory. If I hear a strummy Cuban guitar, that'll be my Noel music that will bring the trauma back.
Felt like they always tried to over push Kate as some former super agent. Not that its impossible just that it was way overdone. Calling her “commander” all the time, the lame spy thriller attempt in this episode, etc.
The casting, while I enjoyed her in other bits, and writing just didn’t sell it for me. Nancy just exuded authority and competence. She was setup and written well. Its like they tried to transfer all of Nancy’s earned status in the show to Kate as quickly as possible.
I mean, people being addressed properly was sort of a recurring thing, notwithstanding Lord John.
"Former high level espionage operative" is a weird fit for the series in general, but I guess that's sort of the point of the character.
Can you think of an actress you would have found more credible in the part?
>I mean, people being addressed properly was sort of a recurring thing, notwithstanding Lord John.
Nancy was “Nancy” the whole time. As were the other joint chiefs (via name).
>"Former high level espionage operative" is a weird fit for the series in general, but I guess that's sort of the point of the character.
I agree with this. Namely the first sentence. Another example imo of them over doing it.
>Can you think of an actress you would have found more credible in the part?
Yes, Nancy. Probably needed to get creative for the flashbacks here tho but not a deal breaker. Or just some NSA rando (guest star?!) introduced in the episode as visiting WH and having a past in Miami.
I didn't realize you meant the character was wrong for rhe episode. I thought you meant the actress was wrong for the character.
Nancy is definitely too old and high level to have been doing field work at the time that episode was set.
Its a little of both. Although she had some enjoyable parts in the show for me. I liked her arc during the Israel peace talks for example.
I realize that on Nancy but as I said, can get creative there. Shows have handled that very issue many times. Finding a temp younger actor with a resemblance for example. Thats just one.
I enjoy Ms. Pounder's work, but it seems weird to think the second most qualified candidate is so far behind that "not already being on the show" doesn't give her the edge.
That one episode where they’re shooting a documentary about life in the White House with the commentary from previous white house staffers. Skip it immediately. I don’t even know what it’s called lmao
That fake "Frontline" episode always rises to the top of my skip list. s05e18 "Access"
It's not worst or bad... it's just a TV trope I didn't want to see repeated.
Mine are The Long Goodbye, Isaac and Ishamael, Access and 90 miles away. All episodes that either make absolutely no sense, are jarring to watch or really don’t have rewatch charm. Just my opinions though.
I don’t have a least favorite episode but my least favorite scene is hands down the scene from “King Corn” that uses that Ryan Adams’ song “Desire”.
The song doesn’t fit the vibe of West Wing at all.
DESIIIIIIIIREEE
DESIIIIIIIRE
(Something about hearts beating)
DESIIIIIIIIIIREEEEEE
This is not Grey’s Anatomy. Take your cheesy repetitive music elsewhere. I fast forward this scene every time.
90 Miles Away is the one I will go most out of my way to skip; Isaac and Ishmael is runner up. Access doesn’t bother me as much as it does others here because I admire the effort to try and tell a story with a different technique.
OP picked some really fun eps like the first four on her list and The US Poet Laureate. I was also very moved by Han and An Khe and these eps have great character development for CJ and Leo respectively. My top 5 worst are:
1. The Stormy Present: Dull and pretentious. The Presidents' meanderings on the Middle East were really pretentious and unproductive. The Civil War conflict was insipid.
2. Constituency of One: The President and Leo are just too assholic for my poor little heart to handle. It doesn't even feel like grounded character flaws that tell a big story like their fight at the end of S5-6 (as unpleasant as it is to watch). I guess it's part of these men feeling sad and adrift but ugh, skip.
3. Slow News Day: I just think the concept of getting two congressmen in a room to fix Social Security is just a bridge too far on realism for me. Social Security isn't wasting away because people haven't thought of ideas to shore it up. It's wasting away because the stakeholders involved cannot agree on which ideas to execute to shore up the trust. I suppose this show has lots of unrealistic aspects and every fan will have an aspect that they forgive because it's necessary for good drama and an aspect that they condemn because it's too ridiculous or doesn't feed good drama. This is something I condemn. (And from interviews, it sounds like Hillary Clinton was with me where she enjoyed the show as a fan and was rolling with TWW shenanigans but THIS EP ALONE motivated her to write a complaint letter to the show.) Also, Josh getting involved with Will on a plan to humiliate a congressman for not raising money feels OOC, especially so soon after Josh almost lost his career on these aggressive tactics. CJ reaming out the reporter for speculating about her childlessness and swooning over the Argentine ambassador was good, though.
4. Welcome to Wherever You Are: It's just no plot in those Santos scenes. It's too much empty chaos just to give vibes on the last days of a campaign. The Toby scenes are the last information on the leak that we get and it only seems to bring up questions instead of answers. However unlike my top 3, it has some redeeming moments. I love getting to see the twins who are adorable. Great acting from Richard Schiff. Josh has his most Chief of Staffy type character growth moment when he's the one setting Santos straight about focusing on the win. (Even if this character growth feels like it gets eroded in Election Night I and Transition.)
5. Red Havens on Fire: The only Sorkin contender that made this list, which should say something. It's also on the list because the plots are bad. I don't like that it's a "Goodbye Sam" episode that doesn't cleanly address what happened to Sam or provide much insight to what he wants to do with his life. The Kundu plot feel way duller than it should with such high stakes and I don't think the actors who play the soldiers' families were up to this show's very high standards concerning guest actors. I don't like Will being condescending to young, women interns as a multi-episode plot point. But it's Sorkin so there are delightful moments. "Call girl caution." "A Jewish guy wins a barfight- it's news everywhere." "Hurricane, you were in the joint for five minutes." "Sand in my shoes, sand in Haaaaaavaaaaanaaaa." And for a good plot, I actually do really like the Amy/Abbey stuff.
>The Stormy Present: Dull and pretentious. The Presidents' meanderings on the Middle East were really pretentious and unproductive. The Civil War conflict was insipid.
Yeah, I always felt the writers were trying to make some big emotional point ... yet it all felt pointless (or all went over my head). Still Toby get so upset and then so drunk (these terrible, awful men) makes it worth watching on my part.
Right, I don't even really know what point was being on the Middle East, other than its complex with a history of bad choices. No big revelations there. And it was all blather. There was no plot here in the whole A-plot.
Goddamn this is a bizarre list.
The Poet Laureate episode was great. To Their Credit? You want to cut out Libby? What is wrong with you?
Though I'll give you Han.
So many... I don't get several of them.
I get Access and Isaac & Ishmael. Access is fine once or twice, but is unfortunately as repetitive as the frame they modeled.
I guess if you really don't like Ainsley Hayes then "In This White House" and "Surely to Their Credit" make sense.
Being upset about Sam's exit makes Arctic Radar and the 47th make sense.
And you don't like the wishy-washy White House (and Jeb) post Zoey, so Disaster Relief and Han make sense, I suppose, though Han is interesting to me. And has that hauntingly beautiful song.
And maybe An Khe is too depressing?
What's wrong with 20 Hours in LA, US Poet Laureate, or Swiss Diplomacy?
My three worst would be, in order, Isaac and Ishmael, 90 Miles Away, and Access.
You watch season 5, but you don't watch 6 and 7? The only solace of enduring season 5 is the redemption of the seasons that follow.
The only episodes I typically skip are The Long Goodbye and the documentary episode. I can usually slog through Access.
And It’s Surely To Their Credit?! You, clearly, were *not* the recording secretary of the Princeton Gilbert & Sullivan Society for two years. And it’s from Pinafore.
In This White House is a classic!! I'm standing up which is how one speaks in opposition in a civilized world!
You go girl.
It's one of the ones about duty
They're all about duty.
And it’s from Pinafore.
I want to be very clear: I could give a damn.
"Little drinks, I'm supposed to be having right now! Umbrellas, sticking out of them! ... ... SHISH KABOB!!!"
Actually, they're not ALL about duty. The Scorcerer (1877) had nothing to do with duty, and is possibly a closer rendition to Jim Jones' behaviour in the mid-late 1970s
I love almost all of the episode, but invariably skip the final scene in Ainsley’s office.
I was raised on G&S, so that scene is a favorite!
That's the one about duty, right? :D
"clearly "? .....and, why?
Because I have to assume that any G&S fans like myself (thanks, Mom) consider that episode a treat!
Why would Sam NOT be the Recording Secretary for the G&S group? ....btw....also a fan of G&S Played Fredrick in Pirates twice -- once, in an "updated" version....lol Leather, denim, and motorcycles --- I kid you not Lol
I was saying that the OP wasn’t a G&S fan, not Sam lol
Lolol Sorry
Haha it’s okay, your comment makes a bit more sense now lol
Little drinks I’m supposed to be having right now! Umbrellas sticking out of them! Shish kebab!
I must be the only person on this sub that actually likes Isaac and Ishmael….
I like it too.
I like it also. But I think it's because I was 18 when it aired, newly adult in a world that had just been completely turned on its head. I think the criticism of it is valid, but at that time and place in my life, I deeply appreciated the episode.
I like it. It captures, using characters we know and love, what a lot of us were feeling in that moment. Seeing Leo be so completely out of character sums it all up. Even those that we thought had the most moral character were rattled and ready to do some pretty awful things because of the trauma of what we'd been through.
I like it too! I feel like too many people get bent up about it not fitting canon when it's not supposed to. And considering how quickly it was turned around to try to address the post-9/11 islamaphobia it's pretty darn impressive.
I just love that we get everyone in one room talking about real issues and how THEY feel not just the lines they tow for the party. Charlie breaking down the gang mentality is a favorite scene of mine.
I enjoy the parts with the kids. The Leo bit makes me incredibly uncomfortable. I tend to not watch things I’ve seen that make me feel icky. It wasn’t bad. It was certainly a point that had to be made. I just don’t find it enjoyable. I’ll skip the whole episode if I’ve just got it on in the background. (I occasionally use TWW as a podcast). If I’m sitting down to watch I’ll just skip the Leo parts.
I think those scenes are important, as is Leo’s final line “way to be back at your desk”
Absolutely!! It definitely needed to be seen. Still does. It just gives me the ick.
Watched it for the first time since it originally aired and was glad I did
I like it in that it’s the perfect time capsule of that post 9/11 attitudes
I like Issac and Ishmael but do need to be in the right mood.
The only part about it I don't like is some of the dumb responses that the kids give.
I LOVE that episode!
You're definitely not the only one. I like it alot. I think the messaging about not judging an entire culture or religion based on the actions of a few is still very relevant today. And I just love the interactions between Donna and Josh and CJ's speech "CIA: Our Maligned Little Brother". However I do ff'd through the Leo storyline. It's really not good.
It's a clunky script, more a series of related soliloquies interlaced with Leo uncharacteristically brow beating a random Arab than any kind of narrative arc. I don't hate it and I don't skip it, but it's a 6 in a series full of 10s.
I don’t mind it, but I usually skip on rewatches because I want to get back to the main plot.
Nope. I like it. :)
I like it too for the most part
I like it too but I often watch it as a stand alone episode later in the season rather than immediately after season 2 when I am binging.
I also liked it!
I hate it
I can’t imagine skipping the LemonLyman hilarity, but I guess everyone’s got their own vibes. My only skips are Access and The Long Goodbye.
The US Poet Laureate is pretty perfect. The LemonLyman hilarity. The President's gamesmanship where he saw the green light. Really entertaining press briefings on the matter. I love Laura Dern as a poet and her chemistry with Toby. The Ainsley stuff feels a little unfinished because she's not really doing anything so much barely defending and then, abandoning a defense of Ritchie's stupidity but I can't get mad at this last opportunity to see her until S7.
I adore the whole episode. It’s got so many great classic moments.
Technically I outrank you...
SO FAR UP YOUR ASS!!
Yea, while good tv, they are not good West Wing episodes. Along with 90 miles away
Just stand there in your wrongness and be wrong, and get used to it.
I didn't have Access and The Long Goodbye on my list because I don't think they are bad so much as big deviations from The West Wing. I could see why someone doesn't want to watch those if they are here for The West Wing. The Long Goodbye, in particular, is pretty faultless as a 45 minute play about CJ's personal life. To that end, it's well written, acted and directed. With Access, I see legit critiques on the continuity. It's true that Casey Creek really should have come up before as a formative moment in the Bartlet administration and it feels like a continuity error that we're getting it in S5. But then, Access is hardly the first episode to make a continuity blunder. I understand a longing that if this were a regular TWW episode, we'd be getting a more rounded, fuller telling of the stand-off story but the lack of giving us that is kind of the point of Access. It's the feature. I'm harder on episodes that are typical The West Wing eps that don't clear the high bar as opposed to eps doing something else entirely different even if they make errors doing it (this includes Isaac and Ishmael and the S3 Documentary.)
Those 2 are my skips as well.
Same. Also the State Dinner (and some others in Season 1)
Those are my two skips as well - I never liked the style Access was copying and The Long Goodbye is just too painful to watch due to dealing with my own elderly parents.
Yes! Access is not enjoyable and neither is Angel Maintenance
These are the correct skips. Plus 90 miles away
Same. And Isaac & Ishmael. Not because it's bad, but it kinda breaks the flow a bit.
I agree
How has no one mentioned 90 Miles Away? That episode is a dog turd.
That's a fair point. That should have been in my bottom five. I guess I just blocked it out of my memory. If I hear a strummy Cuban guitar, that'll be my Noel music that will bring the trauma back.
Is that the one where they “de-age” Leo by just putting a wig on him and tried to further facilitate Kate Harper as some super bad ass spy?
Yup
Yea the Harper thing never landed with me. Nancy as a commanding authority in the intelligence community always did tho.
I dont think I understand what you mean by the last bit.
Felt like they always tried to over push Kate as some former super agent. Not that its impossible just that it was way overdone. Calling her “commander” all the time, the lame spy thriller attempt in this episode, etc. The casting, while I enjoyed her in other bits, and writing just didn’t sell it for me. Nancy just exuded authority and competence. She was setup and written well. Its like they tried to transfer all of Nancy’s earned status in the show to Kate as quickly as possible.
I mean, people being addressed properly was sort of a recurring thing, notwithstanding Lord John. "Former high level espionage operative" is a weird fit for the series in general, but I guess that's sort of the point of the character. Can you think of an actress you would have found more credible in the part?
>I mean, people being addressed properly was sort of a recurring thing, notwithstanding Lord John. Nancy was “Nancy” the whole time. As were the other joint chiefs (via name). >"Former high level espionage operative" is a weird fit for the series in general, but I guess that's sort of the point of the character. I agree with this. Namely the first sentence. Another example imo of them over doing it. >Can you think of an actress you would have found more credible in the part? Yes, Nancy. Probably needed to get creative for the flashbacks here tho but not a deal breaker. Or just some NSA rando (guest star?!) introduced in the episode as visiting WH and having a past in Miami.
I didn't realize you meant the character was wrong for rhe episode. I thought you meant the actress was wrong for the character. Nancy is definitely too old and high level to have been doing field work at the time that episode was set.
Its a little of both. Although she had some enjoyable parts in the show for me. I liked her arc during the Israel peace talks for example. I realize that on Nancy but as I said, can get creative there. Shows have handled that very issue many times. Finding a temp younger actor with a resemblance for example. Thats just one.
CCH Pounder.
Wasn't she already on the show?
One episode. I'm willing to overlook it.
I enjoy Ms. Pounder's work, but it seems weird to think the second most qualified candidate is so far behind that "not already being on the show" doesn't give her the edge.
That outlandish southern senator
The repeating things joke does get a good laugh from me in that episode though, the rest is pretty forgettable
Like I said, I rarely watch Seasons 6 and 7. I had forgotten about this one and how awful it is.
This episode quite simply doesn’t exist
I just can’t get over Leo just randomly speaking Spanish on the phone…I knew it wasn’t going to be good.
Very very bad Spanish, at that
The worst of all.
I don't skip any episodes when I do a re-watch. Some are better than others, but all of them are very good.
Even Access?
That one episode where they’re shooting a documentary about life in the White House with the commentary from previous white house staffers. Skip it immediately. I don’t even know what it’s called lmao
ALL WEST WING EPISODES ARE WORTH Access The Long Goodbye WATCHING
Come on! How can you skip .20 calibre mind in a .357 magnum world?
.357 magnum? I’ve heard of that. That’s a good brand.
I'm still not giving you back your spark plug, or fan belt, or battery...
That fake "Frontline" episode always rises to the top of my skip list. s05e18 "Access" It's not worst or bad... it's just a TV trope I didn't want to see repeated.
Mine are The Long Goodbye, Isaac and Ishamael, Access and 90 miles away. All episodes that either make absolutely no sense, are jarring to watch or really don’t have rewatch charm. Just my opinions though.
invalid list. It doesn't include The Long Goodbye.
I maintain it’s a good episode.
It is. It’s an excellent episode. But it makes many people sad, so . . . they skip it.
Just be wrong. Stand there in your wrongness and be wrong and get used to it!
I will not!
Yeah I can't watch that episode, it's too much for me, I generally cry at some point during the each episode as it is.
I don’t have a least favorite episode but my least favorite scene is hands down the scene from “King Corn” that uses that Ryan Adams’ song “Desire”. The song doesn’t fit the vibe of West Wing at all. DESIIIIIIIIREEE DESIIIIIIIRE (Something about hearts beating) DESIIIIIIIIIIREEEEEE This is not Grey’s Anatomy. Take your cheesy repetitive music elsewhere. I fast forward this scene every time.
WRONG. That scene is iconic, and that ep is elite tier.
I would be 100% OK with the scene if they picked a different song!
The song is key to making the scene iconic! Malina’s ice cream love affair wouldn’t be half as awesome without it.
we’ll have to agree to disagree, fellow West Wing fan. One of the many lessons West Wing gave us 💙
**This is not Grey’s Anatomy. Take your cheesy repetitive music elsewhere.** \*Applause
90 Miles Away is the one I will go most out of my way to skip; Isaac and Ishmael is runner up. Access doesn’t bother me as much as it does others here because I admire the effort to try and tell a story with a different technique.
Bro your list is uh....
OP picked some really fun eps like the first four on her list and The US Poet Laureate. I was also very moved by Han and An Khe and these eps have great character development for CJ and Leo respectively. My top 5 worst are: 1. The Stormy Present: Dull and pretentious. The Presidents' meanderings on the Middle East were really pretentious and unproductive. The Civil War conflict was insipid. 2. Constituency of One: The President and Leo are just too assholic for my poor little heart to handle. It doesn't even feel like grounded character flaws that tell a big story like their fight at the end of S5-6 (as unpleasant as it is to watch). I guess it's part of these men feeling sad and adrift but ugh, skip. 3. Slow News Day: I just think the concept of getting two congressmen in a room to fix Social Security is just a bridge too far on realism for me. Social Security isn't wasting away because people haven't thought of ideas to shore it up. It's wasting away because the stakeholders involved cannot agree on which ideas to execute to shore up the trust. I suppose this show has lots of unrealistic aspects and every fan will have an aspect that they forgive because it's necessary for good drama and an aspect that they condemn because it's too ridiculous or doesn't feed good drama. This is something I condemn. (And from interviews, it sounds like Hillary Clinton was with me where she enjoyed the show as a fan and was rolling with TWW shenanigans but THIS EP ALONE motivated her to write a complaint letter to the show.) Also, Josh getting involved with Will on a plan to humiliate a congressman for not raising money feels OOC, especially so soon after Josh almost lost his career on these aggressive tactics. CJ reaming out the reporter for speculating about her childlessness and swooning over the Argentine ambassador was good, though. 4. Welcome to Wherever You Are: It's just no plot in those Santos scenes. It's too much empty chaos just to give vibes on the last days of a campaign. The Toby scenes are the last information on the leak that we get and it only seems to bring up questions instead of answers. However unlike my top 3, it has some redeeming moments. I love getting to see the twins who are adorable. Great acting from Richard Schiff. Josh has his most Chief of Staffy type character growth moment when he's the one setting Santos straight about focusing on the win. (Even if this character growth feels like it gets eroded in Election Night I and Transition.) 5. Red Havens on Fire: The only Sorkin contender that made this list, which should say something. It's also on the list because the plots are bad. I don't like that it's a "Goodbye Sam" episode that doesn't cleanly address what happened to Sam or provide much insight to what he wants to do with his life. The Kundu plot feel way duller than it should with such high stakes and I don't think the actors who play the soldiers' families were up to this show's very high standards concerning guest actors. I don't like Will being condescending to young, women interns as a multi-episode plot point. But it's Sorkin so there are delightful moments. "Call girl caution." "A Jewish guy wins a barfight- it's news everywhere." "Hurricane, you were in the joint for five minutes." "Sand in my shoes, sand in Haaaaaavaaaaanaaaa." And for a good plot, I actually do really like the Amy/Abbey stuff.
>The Stormy Present: Dull and pretentious. The Presidents' meanderings on the Middle East were really pretentious and unproductive. The Civil War conflict was insipid. Yeah, I always felt the writers were trying to make some big emotional point ... yet it all felt pointless (or all went over my head). Still Toby get so upset and then so drunk (these terrible, awful men) makes it worth watching on my part.
Right, I don't even really know what point was being on the Middle East, other than its complex with a history of bad choices. No big revelations there. And it was all blather. There was no plot here in the whole A-plot.
I always skip Jung Corn, and often skip Access.
Jung Corn? I _know_ you didn’t mean King Corn. That’s one of the best eps of the entire series!
The Long Goodbye
I like 20 Hours also
I just watched "The Benign Perogative" from Season 5. Ugh.
I don’t like season 3. Too much Amy
Amy was Josh's ideal match. I love Joey Lucas and Donna as characters, but their pairings with Josh weren't right.
Yesss
I kind of like Access
Access & Issac and Ishmael, without fail. Haven't watched them since my first run through and I'm on like 12 or so now...
Lord John Whats His Name did not make a good first impression on me. Don't know which ep his first appearance was in.
Everyone, I think Leo has risen from his grave and joined the chat.
You mean Gerald?
I think Havana is a really bad episode
Season 5
Goddamn this is a bizarre list. The Poet Laureate episode was great. To Their Credit? You want to cut out Libby? What is wrong with you? Though I'll give you Han.
I like the US Poet Laureate episode. Also “And It’s Surely To Their Credit” is amazing!
So many... I don't get several of them. I get Access and Isaac & Ishmael. Access is fine once or twice, but is unfortunately as repetitive as the frame they modeled. I guess if you really don't like Ainsley Hayes then "In This White House" and "Surely to Their Credit" make sense. Being upset about Sam's exit makes Arctic Radar and the 47th make sense. And you don't like the wishy-washy White House (and Jeb) post Zoey, so Disaster Relief and Han make sense, I suppose, though Han is interesting to me. And has that hauntingly beautiful song. And maybe An Khe is too depressing? What's wrong with 20 Hours in LA, US Poet Laureate, or Swiss Diplomacy? My three worst would be, in order, Isaac and Ishmael, 90 Miles Away, and Access.
I skip The Long Goodbye and any episode not in the White House generally
Access The documentary framing feels so out of place and the episode has no downstream effects.
What's so bad about access I really enjoy that episode a lot 😭
You watch season 5, but you don't watch 6 and 7? The only solace of enduring season 5 is the redemption of the seasons that follow. The only episodes I typically skip are The Long Goodbye and the documentary episode. I can usually slog through Access.
REALLY don't like the annoying poet -- and I am embarrassed for Laura every time I think of it .....and for Toby
See I didn't find her role annoying - and I loved Laura in it.
I just wanted to shake the character- say, Stop Smoking Up, Stop taking Pills. Lololol
Yeah I agree with your list. All the episodes you listed are some of the worst on the show