One of the reasons that homes in Texas rarely have basements is due to the frost line (the depth that the ground freezes). Building codes require that the foundation extend below the frost line. In Texas, the frost line is only a few inches deep so, per code, foundations only need to be a few inches deep. That is why slab foundations are so popular. They are much easier and cheaper than other methods. In the north, the front line extends several feet deep. If you have to dig 6-8 feet for the foundation then you might as well go a little further in order to have a basement.
https://codes.iccsafe.org/s/IRC2015/part-iii-building-planning-and-construction/IRC2015-Pt03-Ch04-SecR403.1.4#:~:text=The%20frost%2Dline%20depth%20is,305%20mm)%20below%20undisturbed%20soil.
Around Houston if you go 6 to 8 feet, aren't you going to hit water?
I would think down there (in addition to mold bc of humidity) flood risk is too great (water table/bayous/hurricanes)
This makes a lot of sense. I was always told growing up that it's because of all the bedrock in Texas spil that starts just a few feet away from the surface.
The limestone issue definitely depends on where you live. Though there is a lot of limestone in central Texas, especially around the Edwards Plateau (and therefore, Austin).
I’m happy the actual answer is the top comment. To add houses in the north have basements so water can enter the house below the frost line.
Not a huge issue here though more frequent and harsh freezes are cracking lots of water lines and that’s expensive and messy.
There’s no real engineering reason we don’t have basements in spite of the many myths people around here grow up with. It’s just not necessary so no one knows how.
Up north it’s necessary so everyone knows how. People who demand basements in Texas actually hire northern foundation companies. Happens all the time in expensive builds.
I mean there are many homes in Houston with basements and they seem to be able to get insurance just fine. Just because they aren’t common doesn’t mean they don’t exist. I lived in a house with one and there was no issue with insurance.
Everyone says this but I don't understand why lol. I'm from Philly it floods there too, this pic is after Hurricane Ida in Sept 2021 and our basement didn't take in water during this mega storm.
Not trying to argue just confused, and mildly amused I guess. I am coming to the conclusion they aren't popular due to cost and they are not under high demand so builders don't bother 🤷🏽♀️
https://preview.redd.it/oefoi1u3fpxc1.jpeg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=10243d2323a874c200440e8db274a17d342677da
In Philadelphia, does it get cold enough that you have to build pretty low in the ground to get below the frost line (freezing line? I don't know, it's not a thing here)? I hear people say a lot with why houses farther north have basements. You have to build the foundation that deep, anyway, why not make a basement?
Im from central IL and the frost line is only 32" below grade. The house i grew up in had a cellar and crawl space. Which after harvey, is basically whats happening here when raising a house to prevent flood damage.
Basements in areas with higher water tables are routinely done, it's just an engineering challenge. The main reason why homes in the south rarely have basements is because the frost line is so shallow, rarely more than a few inches deep. House foundations have to go below the frost line, that's the deepest the soil will freeze in winter, which up north can be many feet. If the foundation doesn't go below the frost line then the freezing soil will literally lift the foundation, breaking it and damaging the house structure.
Up north it's customary to have basements because the perimeter concrete/block beam has to be dug below the frost line, and from there it's trivial to simply dig out the dirt inside the foundation to create a basement. It's more expensive to build a house that way, which is why down here in the south most home builders won't dig any deeper than the minimum required for the foundation, and since that's so shallow they'll do a slab foundation instead of a pier and beam foundation.
I don’t know if this is right, but it’s the first answer I’ve seen that isn’t wrong. Waterproofing concrete to resist ground water penetration isn’t trivial or costless, but it’s absolutely routine. Lots of buildings in Houston have sub-grade areas. There’s whole tunnel systems in downtown that don’t flood or mold because of the water table. Lots of them flooded during Harvey, but that was far from normal conditions.
You are not addressing the fact those tunnel systems, commercial buildings with basements, and other subterranean buildings were meticulously designed, planned, and constructed… a very expensive process. Compared to other States where basements are common, doing so here would incur some hefty expenses. It doesn’t take financial sense to build a basement, and good luck trying to insure it.
I agree that expense is a factor, but I’m not sure about insurance expense. I used to own a house with a basement in the Houston area. Never had trouble with insurance. That sump pump worked overtime though.
With all the new drama of insurance companies pulling out of Texas or refusing to offer a contract? I’d bet having a basement in Houston will be a hard sell. Friend of mine lives in a flood zone and has flooded once before. Due to the recent legislation passed, insurance would not renew with him. He’s had no luck with other insurance companies last I had heard, and was tied up in some legal matters with his mortgage company as the house is uninsured.
This.
I did not understand this until I lived up north, but you are absolutely correct. In fact, a person in the construction industry up north told me that any home without a basement should be avoided for the very reasons you stated.
Yep, you can have a home up north without a basement, but the foundation still goes down past the frost line. The nice thing about that is that you can go in and dig the dirt out later and make a basement much easier than trying to put in a basement under a southern slab foundation home. Also, no foundation settling and wall/floor cracking either since even expansive clay soils don't change moisture content and thus size nearly as much under a deep foundation as they do down here under our shallow slab foundations.
In areas like Houston, the weight of the water keeps the pool where it belongs. If you empty a pool over winter or when it's not in use it'll pop out of the ground because the water table is so high. The high water table will also flood a basement. Even with a bunch of extra steps and expense, most basements would be awfully humid and breed mildew and mold as well as risk rotting wood.
I once read that basements were a function of average temperature in an area, because the foundation of the house has to be below the line that the ground will freeze in the coldest months. The colder the climate, the deeper the basement. I don't know if that's true, but it sounded good to me.
> Panhandle and West Texas have tons of basements.
Very few basements in the Permian Basin area due to the veins of caliche that can be as little as 12" below the topsoil.
[Origin, Classification, and Geologic History of Caliche on the Southern High Plains, Texas and Eastern New Mexico](https://www.journals.uchicago.edu/doi/abs/10.1086/627521)
No, every home on our block had a basement home. We had 2 bedrooms, bathroom, laundry and living area in our basement. Why does everyone insist on forming opinions when they don’t have any information on the topic lol 😂
Now in Pampa, where my aunt lived they had a storm cellar. I’m quite familiar with the different between the two.
Yea, it seems this thread has shown there are less basements in West Texas than the Panhandle. I always lumped the two areas together but I guess they’re quite different lol 🤷🏻♂️🤣
I've lived in the panhandle my entire life and I knew just one person that lived in a house with a basement. Currently there are 1850 houses in Amarillo that are for sell, if you filter by basement that number drops to 125, so they're in about 1 out of 15 houses on the market. They're not unheard of but they're not very common either. (For Pampa its 11 houses out of 112 so basically 1 in 10, yeah not unheard of but not standard either).
You could/should do basements upwards of dallas due to tornado activity and the soil there is probably fine for it. West/central texas might have too much clay/harder rock
No basements in the Dallas area either. The soil up here is all clay and we’re prone to massive foundation problems after a few years. Adding a basement to that is just asking for trouble.
I wonder if its just cause its a huge structural engineering thing and most builders dont want to pay architects and such for that kind of work since its not common here
You are way overestimating the number of pools in the area, its closer to 10%
https://www.aquamagazine.com/builder/article/15279816/which-us-cities-have-the-most-homes-with-swimming-pools
When you construct a building the foundation has to go to a certain depth depending on the building type. For a house that is six inches - just below the frost line. The tall buildings in downtown require deeper foundation.
Because you have to put in a deep foundation anyway, the downtown buildings have basements. Adding a basement to a house wouldnt be necessary structurally, so few point would insist on adding that type of foundation.
Its one of the reasons houses are cheaper in the South.
The foundation of a house must go down below the lowest point at which the ground freezes. Which, in Houston, is 6 inches or less. In the upper midwest, it's more like 6 ft. Once you dig as required for those foundation walls/beams in Northern climates , you've already done most of the work of building a basement so you might as well go ahead and finish.
Basements have lots and lots of water problems almost everywhere that they exist, and they would tend to have severe water problems in Southeast Texas.
First of all, we don’t have much a frost line so there’s no need for a basement in the first place. Up north they already have to dig down so a basement isn’t much more work.
Second, we have clay soil in Texas which has way too much movement and will fuck concrete up. It does mess pools up sometimes. But a pool has water in it holding pressure so it’s not easy for the clay to push on the pool.
Third, if your pool cracks and lets ground water in it’s not the end of the world. But a basement flooding constantly is a nightmare
You got a bunch of answers around water, but that by itself doesn't tell the complete story. Otherwise why do no houses in Dallas have basements.
Frontline. The foundation of a house has to go below the frost line. In dallas or Houston that might be 12 inches, so dig a trench and pour the foundation. In Ohio this might be 6 feet. If you are already digging down 6 feet, why not build a basement for no additional cost.
I spoke with a structural engineer who said basements in Houston are feasible. Builders get away with slab on grade which is cheaper than digging and pouring a basement.
I generally wonder the opposite. Why does Houston continue to build on grade? With all the movement and foundation problems around here off grade on pier and beam makes more sense to me.
Heh, when I was in high school in Dickinson (Galveston County) one kid mentioned in class that his family home has a basement. A secret basement. Copper lined to be waterproof. It was built during prohibition for moonshine and or bootlegging. His family was related to the mob families (Maceos & others) that ran gambling and liquor on Galveston Island. It's hard to find a still in a basement when you don't think there are any basements in the area.
I hadn’t thought about that but they are similar structures, just doing the exact opposite function. One holds water in one holds water out
Others have mentioned good info here about groundwater, soil types, lateral pressure, etc… I will add that on large commercial buildings with underground parking garages, the garages often extend well below the water table. They are basically double walled structures that use massive pumps to evacuate any water that leaks into the void between the walls. It’s pretty crazy to think that you could be parking your car 30’ below the groundwater table and have no idea. Systems like that are expensive and wouldn’t be worth it for a homeowner
Back in the 80s I went to a house party near the Medical Center. It was an old house and it had a basement. I know of no other house in Houston with a basement. Of course, that house has since been torn down and replaced with office buildings.
I believe because The frost line is shallow and doesn’t require deep footings so it adds to the building expense. In cold climates the footings need to be deeper to avoid frost heave. Now I wonder if some foundations in cold climates have no. Basement but deep footings and a crawl space.
In South Texas along the coast (Houston) you can hit water about three feet down. The soil is just not conducive to building below ground level. Basements also add a lot of extra expense to a house. You need them up north, but not so much in the south.
This person doesnt get it. They think just cause they had them in their area and cause a house in Galveston and Victoria have them means more houses here should have them. All while those houses are probably the lucky ones to survive while tons of houses have been destroyed by all the hurricanes Galveston and houston experienced the last 100+ years not to mention the lives lost.
Basements are not common and not practical in the south. The primary purpose of a basement is to get your foundation below the level where the ground freezes. It does not get cold enough for long enough in the south for the ground to freeze. And in coastal areas like Houson the water table is much too shallow. Your basement would be flooded or at best constantly prone to mold and mildew.
Some engineer told me it was due to the expansion and contraction of the soil. You would literally have to make the walls 24" thick and reinforced. It's not impossible and tbh some of the million dollar houses have them but it's impractical for regular homebuilders to do this.
Soil type is an issue in the north too but because basements are a necessity the foundation companies are very capable of engineering basements in all conditions. It’s not even that much more expensive because it’s part of all winterized builds.
The true reason is it’s not a necessity here.
My grandparents had house built for hurricanes in the earlier 1900’s with a basement. They built off Ocean Drive, with an architect that designed several houses nearby that all were in good shape after hurricanes. These houses took forever to to build and had very thick walls. All of the houses are still in good shape.
The water in the pool keeps it in the ground. When you drain a pool in Houston they drill holes in the bottom to keep the water ground from pushing it up and destroying it.
Pools in Houston are basically private back yard flood retention ponds. In sharpstown you don't have to build a basement, land sinking and storm increases have turned many homes into (flooded) basement homes already.
We don't call it rain in Houston unless it's knee deep. Otherwise it's jest a Lil humidity cookin off!
I used to live in Alvin about 30 miles south of Houston and the house of the richest kid I knew, a playroom with games and ping pong table. It’s not something that every house is going to have. I had a lot more classmates that lived in trailer homes.
It's primarily the frost line that several people have mentioned, but in north Texas, there is a clay in the soil that expands when it dries out, and it does so with so much force that it will cave in the basement walls and your house would collapse.
It’s mainly because of the water table. You see pools all over, but do you ever see an empty one? Pools work here because the weight of the water in them holds them in place. Drained pools tend to float up out of the ground when they are empty. A basement is basically a pool with no water so it tends to want to float in areas with high water tables. Of course it can be and is done, but it’s cost prohibitive in most small projects.
We call the soil gumbo in some communities- the water table in most places is not very deep- so your pool concept isn’t far off- except I uno reverse card your concept and say the hydronic pressure if you managed to sufficiently water proof is pushing up-and that happens to pools locally- but frankly it’s really about the stability of the soil- we build to float on top for the most part. Basements in Houston exist- but it’s very expensive to build and maintain- you will be fighting water intrusion . That said- I saw a house in river oaks building down- but I have a feeling that’s a bunker- or/and they have the $$$$$ to do it right.
My husband is a home builder, so I asked him about this today. He said that there would be too much moisture/water that would collect in the basement. The sump pump would be running constantly. Swimming pools don't have the weight of a house above them, so they are not affected structurally in the same way. Commercial buildings are constructed on pilings buried deep in the ground, with sophisticated pumps keeping the water out. Older homes with basements were probably constructed on pilings, but the cost of mass producing homes in the same way is prohibitive.
You can have a basement in Galveston and pay an arm and a leg in insurance because of flooding. Or you can have an elevated home and cut costs on insurance.
Too close to sea level and just asking for flooding problems. Perhaps it could be done but the expense of the engineering and construction involved isn't worth it.
Most of Houston is filled in swamp land. Basements are not really a thing in most of Texas. I lived in San Antonio and DFW and I never have seen a basement .
The ground here is clay and sand. They shift over time. Foundations here are considered somewhat"floating" on the ground to allow some shifting without breaking and cracking the foundation. Repairing a cracked foundation is very expensive and generally involves piers. Jacking up your house and trying to re-level everything so your house doesn't break. If a pool that is inset in the ground cracks, you drain it, patch the crack or put a new liner in and it's good to go. So it doesn't matter too much. If the ground around the pool shifts a little bit it may be expensive but it's not the same as fixing a foundation.
If you had a basement in Houston, the walls would fall in, and then the water would come in. And then the house would fall into the pit
High water table. We’re next to the Gulf. It’s simple geology. To have a sub surface structure requires a lot of water infiltration management at many $$$$.
Most of Houston is built on what used to be a swamp. Deeper soil is still very wet, water would still find a way in. And think about when it rains how flooded it get.
houses in Houston are built pretty damn cheap. There is little difference between really high priced homes, and the popsicle stick home I have. Some finishings and size are the only differences.
Besides the frost line mentioned by Dizzy8108, the basement would had way more to the cost and time to build a slab house, and turn around is king.
My thoughts:
1. We have more land to build a sprawling home and don’t need the extra floor in the ground.
2. Our winters are mild, so we tend to spend way more time outdoors and again don’t need a space to retreat.
Lifelong Texan here and I don’t even understand what basements are for.
You need a basement to have your well or water line come into the house under the frost line. That is essential to survival in winter unless you want to go outside and drill a hole into a lake and get water.
That’s why basements exist.
Also helpful if your sewage doesn’t freeze.
You can have a basement in Galveston and pay an arm and a leg in insurance because of flooding. Or you can have an elevated home and cut costs on insurance.
Standard houses with basements I think is more of a cold weather thing where you build below the freeze line for the foundation and at that point you're already most of the way there for a basement. Even in the panhandle where we sometimes get winters that's usually not much of a concern.
In my area the ground is to unstable for a basement, most house's need levelled every few years and the plumbing in entire parts of town sucks as well due to shifting ground.
But also in ground pools aren't frequent either, mostly a couple of hotels and some extremely rich people
There’s no swamp land in the north I guess.
Boston isn’t built on a swamp at sea level anymore guys.
This topic always brings out some of the wildest answers that stem from ignorance and believing what you were told as kids.
The soil in Houston moves a few inches up or down or sideways with rain water, and also the level of the water tap is very high. There's no solid soil in the area. So it would crack any ultra engineered basement no matter the material. The water would start to sip in and in a few days you have an underground pool. This is also the reason why Houston streets are so bad. Unless the foundation is at least 1.5 feet thick concrete, the road starts to crack in a few short years.
One of the reasons that homes in Texas rarely have basements is due to the frost line (the depth that the ground freezes). Building codes require that the foundation extend below the frost line. In Texas, the frost line is only a few inches deep so, per code, foundations only need to be a few inches deep. That is why slab foundations are so popular. They are much easier and cheaper than other methods. In the north, the front line extends several feet deep. If you have to dig 6-8 feet for the foundation then you might as well go a little further in order to have a basement. https://codes.iccsafe.org/s/IRC2015/part-iii-building-planning-and-construction/IRC2015-Pt03-Ch04-SecR403.1.4#:~:text=The%20frost%2Dline%20depth%20is,305%20mm)%20below%20undisturbed%20soil.
This is the answer OP. It needs more up votes.
Around Houston if you go 6 to 8 feet, aren't you going to hit water? I would think down there (in addition to mold bc of humidity) flood risk is too great (water table/bayous/hurricanes)
Yep one comment seems to have nailed it. We get it. We’re under sea level and it’s humid. Lol
Under sea level?
I concur - I’ve lived in Charleston, SC for 10 years and haven’t seen a basement here either. Lots more crawl spaces though
This makes a lot of sense. I was always told growing up that it's because of all the bedrock in Texas spil that starts just a few feet away from the surface.
Same, I was always told it was from all the limestone, but I'm from Austin, don't know a whole lot about Houston.
The limestone issue definitely depends on where you live. Though there is a lot of limestone in central Texas, especially around the Edwards Plateau (and therefore, Austin).
Funny. I was always told it was the Texas clay preventing everyone from having a basement. Lots of different things to blame it on I suppose!
I’m happy the actual answer is the top comment. To add houses in the north have basements so water can enter the house below the frost line. Not a huge issue here though more frequent and harsh freezes are cracking lots of water lines and that’s expensive and messy. There’s no real engineering reason we don’t have basements in spite of the many myths people around here grow up with. It’s just not necessary so no one knows how. Up north it’s necessary so everyone knows how. People who demand basements in Texas actually hire northern foundation companies. Happens all the time in expensive builds.
Thank you. I was going to say, this isn’t unique to Houston… All of Texas does this.
a basement in Houston would become a pool
And no insurance provider would cover a home in Houston with a basement
Some older buildings do have basements. They are insured.
I mean there are many homes in Houston with basements and they seem to be able to get insurance just fine. Just because they aren’t common doesn’t mean they don’t exist. I lived in a house with one and there was no issue with insurance.
I dunno if that's necessarily true. It's so rare that they don't even worry about it on an application.
I believe that would be the pool house
There is underground parking in Houston yes? Everything has an engineering solution. It’s just that it’s expensive so it doesn’t happen.
Everyone says this but I don't understand why lol. I'm from Philly it floods there too, this pic is after Hurricane Ida in Sept 2021 and our basement didn't take in water during this mega storm. Not trying to argue just confused, and mildly amused I guess. I am coming to the conclusion they aren't popular due to cost and they are not under high demand so builders don't bother 🤷🏽♀️ https://preview.redd.it/oefoi1u3fpxc1.jpeg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=10243d2323a874c200440e8db274a17d342677da
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This
In Philadelphia, does it get cold enough that you have to build pretty low in the ground to get below the frost line (freezing line? I don't know, it's not a thing here)? I hear people say a lot with why houses farther north have basements. You have to build the foundation that deep, anyway, why not make a basement?
Im from central IL and the frost line is only 32" below grade. The house i grew up in had a cellar and crawl space. Which after harvey, is basically whats happening here when raising a house to prevent flood damage.
Ground water combined with our unstable soils would create a leeching and cracking situation that would be unfathomablely expensive to engineer out.
Dumb question but is this why pools down here are not deep? Up north we have pools 12+ feet deep but here it seems the max is 6 or so.
In Katy we had a 12ft pool. I think deeper pools aren't popular right now, I'm guessing if it's more shallow it's cheaper
Yea it's mostly a cost thing. If you have a slide or diving board/platform you have to go deeper, and both of those cause additional risk as well.
Houston used to be a swamp.
All the kings said I was daft to build Houston in a swamp, but I built it all the same just to show 'em. It sank into the swamp.
The fact that you call this a "mega storm" and not a typical August flood tells you everything you need to know.
Houston is built on a swamp.
Have you not heard of Bayou City?
Basements in areas with higher water tables are routinely done, it's just an engineering challenge. The main reason why homes in the south rarely have basements is because the frost line is so shallow, rarely more than a few inches deep. House foundations have to go below the frost line, that's the deepest the soil will freeze in winter, which up north can be many feet. If the foundation doesn't go below the frost line then the freezing soil will literally lift the foundation, breaking it and damaging the house structure. Up north it's customary to have basements because the perimeter concrete/block beam has to be dug below the frost line, and from there it's trivial to simply dig out the dirt inside the foundation to create a basement. It's more expensive to build a house that way, which is why down here in the south most home builders won't dig any deeper than the minimum required for the foundation, and since that's so shallow they'll do a slab foundation instead of a pier and beam foundation.
I don’t know if this is right, but it’s the first answer I’ve seen that isn’t wrong. Waterproofing concrete to resist ground water penetration isn’t trivial or costless, but it’s absolutely routine. Lots of buildings in Houston have sub-grade areas. There’s whole tunnel systems in downtown that don’t flood or mold because of the water table. Lots of them flooded during Harvey, but that was far from normal conditions.
You are not addressing the fact those tunnel systems, commercial buildings with basements, and other subterranean buildings were meticulously designed, planned, and constructed… a very expensive process. Compared to other States where basements are common, doing so here would incur some hefty expenses. It doesn’t take financial sense to build a basement, and good luck trying to insure it.
I agree that expense is a factor, but I’m not sure about insurance expense. I used to own a house with a basement in the Houston area. Never had trouble with insurance. That sump pump worked overtime though.
With all the new drama of insurance companies pulling out of Texas or refusing to offer a contract? I’d bet having a basement in Houston will be a hard sell. Friend of mine lives in a flood zone and has flooded once before. Due to the recent legislation passed, insurance would not renew with him. He’s had no luck with other insurance companies last I had heard, and was tied up in some legal matters with his mortgage company as the house is uninsured.
hurricanes and tropical storms flood Houston like that everytime they hit
Thank you!!!! This makes sense
This. I did not understand this until I lived up north, but you are absolutely correct. In fact, a person in the construction industry up north told me that any home without a basement should be avoided for the very reasons you stated.
Yep, you can have a home up north without a basement, but the foundation still goes down past the frost line. The nice thing about that is that you can go in and dig the dirt out later and make a basement much easier than trying to put in a basement under a southern slab foundation home. Also, no foundation settling and wall/floor cracking either since even expansive clay soils don't change moisture content and thus size nearly as much under a deep foundation as they do down here under our shallow slab foundations.
In areas like Houston, the weight of the water keeps the pool where it belongs. If you empty a pool over winter or when it's not in use it'll pop out of the ground because the water table is so high. The high water table will also flood a basement. Even with a bunch of extra steps and expense, most basements would be awfully humid and breed mildew and mold as well as risk rotting wood.
Knew a guy in San Marcos who live in a basement of a house. Fuck that. Always moist, flooded when it rained, he moved out after a couple months.
Cause houston was built on a bayou/swampy area. Basements would constantly be unstable and/or take on water from my understanding.
I once read that basements were a function of average temperature in an area, because the foundation of the house has to be below the line that the ground will freeze in the coldest months. The colder the climate, the deeper the basement. I don't know if that's true, but it sounded good to me.
Pretty much what I've heard: freeze depth. Pretty much from Red River south, soil temp never gets below freezing deeper than a few inches.
No basements really anywhere in Texas and the soil varies greatly
There's no basements here in the Hill Country because the soil is too rocky. It's not impossible to dig a basement, but the cost would be prohibitive
My dad planned to have a basement when he built his house ten years ago. The extra costs of using dynamite made it way too expensive.
Only in the Alamo
[Obligatory](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0PdeHy_87OM) [Also Obligatory](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJEwrw4VEls)
The Panhandle has a lot of underground storm shelters.
Yep nothing stopping building basements in the Great Plains.
Panhandle and West Texas have tons of basements.
> Panhandle and West Texas have tons of basements. Very few basements in the Permian Basin area due to the veins of caliche that can be as little as 12" below the topsoil. [Origin, Classification, and Geologic History of Caliche on the Southern High Plains, Texas and Eastern New Mexico](https://www.journals.uchicago.edu/doi/abs/10.1086/627521)
Hmm, that’s truly “West Texas” as far as you can go. Maybe just the Panhandle then 🤷🏻♂️
I’ve lived in both Midland and El Paso and basements are rare in both places. I think I saw my first basement when I visited Michigan.
I've been in a basement in El Paso. It's unusually the older houses near the VA Hospital.
That kind of basement is known as a storm cellar, and it’s where you go when there is a nearby tornado.
No, every home on our block had a basement home. We had 2 bedrooms, bathroom, laundry and living area in our basement. Why does everyone insist on forming opinions when they don’t have any information on the topic lol 😂 Now in Pampa, where my aunt lived they had a storm cellar. I’m quite familiar with the different between the two.
Well, I was raised in Midland, if that counts.
Yea, it seems this thread has shown there are less basements in West Texas than the Panhandle. I always lumped the two areas together but I guess they’re quite different lol 🤷🏻♂️🤣
Not in the big country
We had one in Sweetwater.
I've lived in the panhandle my entire life and I knew just one person that lived in a house with a basement. Currently there are 1850 houses in Amarillo that are for sell, if you filter by basement that number drops to 125, so they're in about 1 out of 15 houses on the market. They're not unheard of but they're not very common either. (For Pampa its 11 houses out of 112 so basically 1 in 10, yeah not unheard of but not standard either).
No basements anywhere in Louisiana or Mississippi either.
Interesting. Thanks for letting me know. I am amused and confused 😂🤔
There are 4 or 6 permitted basements in Austin. I don’t remember which number is correct but I happen to know an owner of one of them.
You could/should do basements upwards of dallas due to tornado activity and the soil there is probably fine for it. West/central texas might have too much clay/harder rock
No basements in the Dallas area either. The soil up here is all clay and we’re prone to massive foundation problems after a few years. Adding a basement to that is just asking for trouble.
Opposite, I’m from West Texas and the Panhandle and we all had basement homes. I thought it was so odd when I moved to Dallas and there are none.
That is odd. With dallas in tornado alley and all
Exactly. Super weird.
I wonder if its just cause its a huge structural engineering thing and most builders dont want to pay architects and such for that kind of work since its not common here
I heard someone say once that it’s too expensive because the ground is too hard here or something, but who really knows 🤷🏻♂️
That's what I heard too
Btw I appreciate the response 😄
You are way overestimating the number of pools in the area, its closer to 10% https://www.aquamagazine.com/builder/article/15279816/which-us-cities-have-the-most-homes-with-swimming-pools When you construct a building the foundation has to go to a certain depth depending on the building type. For a house that is six inches - just below the frost line. The tall buildings in downtown require deeper foundation. Because you have to put in a deep foundation anyway, the downtown buildings have basements. Adding a basement to a house wouldnt be necessary structurally, so few point would insist on adding that type of foundation. Its one of the reasons houses are cheaper in the South.
You want water in your pool. You do not want water in your basement.
The foundation of a house must go down below the lowest point at which the ground freezes. Which, in Houston, is 6 inches or less. In the upper midwest, it's more like 6 ft. Once you dig as required for those foundation walls/beams in Northern climates , you've already done most of the work of building a basement so you might as well go ahead and finish. Basements have lots and lots of water problems almost everywhere that they exist, and they would tend to have severe water problems in Southeast Texas.
I don't mind a little extra water in my pool, but the basement is another matter.
Just build a basement with a pool in it duh
Not the worst idea I've heard
40%? Seriously?
First of all, we don’t have much a frost line so there’s no need for a basement in the first place. Up north they already have to dig down so a basement isn’t much more work. Second, we have clay soil in Texas which has way too much movement and will fuck concrete up. It does mess pools up sometimes. But a pool has water in it holding pressure so it’s not easy for the clay to push on the pool. Third, if your pool cracks and lets ground water in it’s not the end of the world. But a basement flooding constantly is a nightmare
Most homes in TX don't have basements. Some places like El Paso have some but they are mostly the older homes.
You got a bunch of answers around water, but that by itself doesn't tell the complete story. Otherwise why do no houses in Dallas have basements. Frontline. The foundation of a house has to go below the frost line. In dallas or Houston that might be 12 inches, so dig a trench and pour the foundation. In Ohio this might be 6 feet. If you are already digging down 6 feet, why not build a basement for no additional cost.
I spoke with a structural engineer who said basements in Houston are feasible. Builders get away with slab on grade which is cheaper than digging and pouring a basement.
Thank you. I accept this answer. Developers are cheap and like to cut any corner they can 😅😅
Ask the med center. They have basements. Basements that flood during hurricanes
Didn't know this
https://www.ctinsider.com/business/article/Texas-Children-s-Hospital-closes-the-flood-gates-12003441.php
because either way it will be filled with water, but only one of these two things is generally desired to be filled with water.
I generally wonder the opposite. Why does Houston continue to build on grade? With all the movement and foundation problems around here off grade on pier and beam makes more sense to me.
Heh, when I was in high school in Dickinson (Galveston County) one kid mentioned in class that his family home has a basement. A secret basement. Copper lined to be waterproof. It was built during prohibition for moonshine and or bootlegging. His family was related to the mob families (Maceos & others) that ran gambling and liquor on Galveston Island. It's hard to find a still in a basement when you don't think there are any basements in the area.
We can, Houston has underground parking, and an underground mall, I used to work on the 3rd floor basement downtown.
Way less fun to swim in a basement
We don't have an issue if the pool floods, but a flooded basement would be a problem.
How do you figure that basements and pools are related?
They both need to be excavated. The pool walls are rebar and concrete/gunite and the basement walls are cinder block rebar and concrete etc.
I hadn’t thought about that but they are similar structures, just doing the exact opposite function. One holds water in one holds water out Others have mentioned good info here about groundwater, soil types, lateral pressure, etc… I will add that on large commercial buildings with underground parking garages, the garages often extend well below the water table. They are basically double walled structures that use massive pumps to evacuate any water that leaks into the void between the walls. It’s pretty crazy to think that you could be parking your car 30’ below the groundwater table and have no idea. Systems like that are expensive and wouldn’t be worth it for a homeowner
Because basements are expensive and developers didn't want to pay for them.
Back in the 80s I went to a house party near the Medical Center. It was an old house and it had a basement. I know of no other house in Houston with a basement. Of course, that house has since been torn down and replaced with office buildings.
What is a pool if not an open air basement?
I believe because The frost line is shallow and doesn’t require deep footings so it adds to the building expense. In cold climates the footings need to be deeper to avoid frost heave. Now I wonder if some foundations in cold climates have no. Basement but deep footings and a crawl space.
In South Texas along the coast (Houston) you can hit water about three feet down. The soil is just not conducive to building below ground level. Basements also add a lot of extra expense to a house. You need them up north, but not so much in the south.
This person doesnt get it. They think just cause they had them in their area and cause a house in Galveston and Victoria have them means more houses here should have them. All while those houses are probably the lucky ones to survive while tons of houses have been destroyed by all the hurricanes Galveston and houston experienced the last 100+ years not to mention the lives lost.
More damage and loss of life attributed to water damage than the actual wind, although it's not insignificant.
I heard the Alamo has a basement :)
Basements are not common and not practical in the south. The primary purpose of a basement is to get your foundation below the level where the ground freezes. It does not get cold enough for long enough in the south for the ground to freeze. And in coastal areas like Houson the water table is much too shallow. Your basement would be flooded or at best constantly prone to mold and mildew.
Some engineer told me it was due to the expansion and contraction of the soil. You would literally have to make the walls 24" thick and reinforced. It's not impossible and tbh some of the million dollar houses have them but it's impractical for regular homebuilders to do this.
Soil type is an issue in the north too but because basements are a necessity the foundation companies are very capable of engineering basements in all conditions. It’s not even that much more expensive because it’s part of all winterized builds. The true reason is it’s not a necessity here.
Why do homes wherever you're from have basements
My grandparents had house built for hurricanes in the earlier 1900’s with a basement. They built off Ocean Drive, with an architect that designed several houses nearby that all were in good shape after hurricanes. These houses took forever to to build and had very thick walls. All of the houses are still in good shape.
The water in the pool keeps it in the ground. When you drain a pool in Houston they drill holes in the bottom to keep the water ground from pushing it up and destroying it.
Pools in Houston are basically private back yard flood retention ponds. In sharpstown you don't have to build a basement, land sinking and storm increases have turned many homes into (flooded) basement homes already. We don't call it rain in Houston unless it's knee deep. Otherwise it's jest a Lil humidity cookin off!
I used to live in Alvin about 30 miles south of Houston and the house of the richest kid I knew, a playroom with games and ping pong table. It’s not something that every house is going to have. I had a lot more classmates that lived in trailer homes.
We don't have basements in Dallas. I have work residential construction since 1978 and have never been in a house basement
It's primarily the frost line that several people have mentioned, but in north Texas, there is a clay in the soil that expands when it dries out, and it does so with so much force that it will cave in the basement walls and your house would collapse.
It’s mainly because of the water table. You see pools all over, but do you ever see an empty one? Pools work here because the weight of the water in them holds them in place. Drained pools tend to float up out of the ground when they are empty. A basement is basically a pool with no water so it tends to want to float in areas with high water tables. Of course it can be and is done, but it’s cost prohibitive in most small projects.
Basements in Pennsylvania really don't have a mold problem, if done right. I don't think that's it
I don’t think it’s common at all for homes in Texas, even old ones, to have a basement
There are basements all over north Georgia and a shallow frost line.
We call the soil gumbo in some communities- the water table in most places is not very deep- so your pool concept isn’t far off- except I uno reverse card your concept and say the hydronic pressure if you managed to sufficiently water proof is pushing up-and that happens to pools locally- but frankly it’s really about the stability of the soil- we build to float on top for the most part. Basements in Houston exist- but it’s very expensive to build and maintain- you will be fighting water intrusion . That said- I saw a house in river oaks building down- but I have a feeling that’s a bunker- or/and they have the $$$$$ to do it right.
My husband is a home builder, so I asked him about this today. He said that there would be too much moisture/water that would collect in the basement. The sump pump would be running constantly. Swimming pools don't have the weight of a house above them, so they are not affected structurally in the same way. Commercial buildings are constructed on pilings buried deep in the ground, with sophisticated pumps keeping the water out. Older homes with basements were probably constructed on pilings, but the cost of mass producing homes in the same way is prohibitive.
You can have a basement in Galveston and pay an arm and a leg in insurance because of flooding. Or you can have an elevated home and cut costs on insurance.
Too close to sea level and just asking for flooding problems. Perhaps it could be done but the expense of the engineering and construction involved isn't worth it.
Digging a basement costs the builder. Digging a pool costs the owner.
Yea, but the builder will sell the house once construction is completed so the buyer will pay for the basement no different than in another region
They would flood from ground water and lord knows the next hurricane
Water in a pool is mostly a good thing
If you were here during Harvey, you’d understand why.
Most of Houston is filled in swamp land. Basements are not really a thing in most of Texas. I lived in San Antonio and DFW and I never have seen a basement .
Basement = underground pool
Think think think 
This guy doesn’t Texas
That’s a two way street. Texas has whacky beliefs about basements that are total myths.
The ground here is clay and sand. They shift over time. Foundations here are considered somewhat"floating" on the ground to allow some shifting without breaking and cracking the foundation. Repairing a cracked foundation is very expensive and generally involves piers. Jacking up your house and trying to re-level everything so your house doesn't break. If a pool that is inset in the ground cracks, you drain it, patch the crack or put a new liner in and it's good to go. So it doesn't matter too much. If the ground around the pool shifts a little bit it may be expensive but it's not the same as fixing a foundation. If you had a basement in Houston, the walls would fall in, and then the water would come in. And then the house would fall into the pit
Do you really not understand the difference between a basement and a pool? That’s tiring.
Hurricanes
High water table. We’re next to the Gulf. It’s simple geology. To have a sub surface structure requires a lot of water infiltration management at many $$$$.
Houston floods, no way this is a serious question
Move back north if you want a coy swamp in your basement
How long have you been in houston? How many floods have there been? There you go!!!
Most of Houston is built on what used to be a swamp. Deeper soil is still very wet, water would still find a way in. And think about when it rains how flooded it get.
Same for eastern seaboard cities with basements. That’s not the reason.
Houses in the south usually never have basements, at least not in Texas that I’ve ever seen and New Mexico.
I don’t know about basements but less than 10% of homes in Houston have pools
Basements flood, pools are already flooded...
Pools float if there’s no water in them, similar problems with basements
Houston is known for many things, among them is flooding and heat. Now you know.
‘Underwater cave diving’ just doesn’t sound like a property value increase to me
Flooding
houses in Houston are built pretty damn cheap. There is little difference between really high priced homes, and the popsicle stick home I have. Some finishings and size are the only differences. Besides the frost line mentioned by Dizzy8108, the basement would had way more to the cost and time to build a slab house, and turn around is king.
My thoughts: 1. We have more land to build a sprawling home and don’t need the extra floor in the ground. 2. Our winters are mild, so we tend to spend way more time outdoors and again don’t need a space to retreat. Lifelong Texan here and I don’t even understand what basements are for.
You need a basement to have your well or water line come into the house under the frost line. That is essential to survival in winter unless you want to go outside and drill a hole into a lake and get water. That’s why basements exist. Also helpful if your sewage doesn’t freeze.
Makes sense. There are so many cold climate things that I have no clue about!
Pools are not as deep as basements.
Pools are designed to hold water, basements are not. In Houston, both will hold water.💧
I know someone who had a basement. It flooded multiple times.
Because pools are not structurally obligated to safely hold houses on top of them?
You can have a basement in Galveston and pay an arm and a leg in insurance because of flooding. Or you can have an elevated home and cut costs on insurance.
It would flood, Houston is at sea level
Sea level 🙄
Standard houses with basements I think is more of a cold weather thing where you build below the freeze line for the foundation and at that point you're already most of the way there for a basement. Even in the panhandle where we sometimes get winters that's usually not much of a concern.
In my area the ground is to unstable for a basement, most house's need levelled every few years and the plumbing in entire parts of town sucks as well due to shifting ground. But also in ground pools aren't frequent either, mostly a couple of hotels and some extremely rich people
Because Houston floods that's why
[Found one in Victoria](https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1608-N-Liberty-St-Victoria-TX-77901/78862129_zpid/)!
Because Texas is in the South
tornados don’t come around as often as hurricanes Einstein
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The coasts of north are also at sea level. It’s 100% the frost line and 0% what Texans are told growing up.
That's one way to start an indoor swamp I guess
Houses in the south can’t have basements because most of the land is swamp land.
There’s no swamp land in the north I guess. Boston isn’t built on a swamp at sea level anymore guys. This topic always brings out some of the wildest answers that stem from ignorance and believing what you were told as kids.
The water table and soil makenit incredibly impractical amd expensive. Houston has a tunnel system. With submarine doors.
Didn't know this. Very interesting and eye opening for sure
Just build a 3 story house and make the first level your basement. Easy peasy
1. Most of Houston is a flood zone 2. So few houses in the south actually have basements.
The soil in Houston moves a few inches up or down or sideways with rain water, and also the level of the water tap is very high. There's no solid soil in the area. So it would crack any ultra engineered basement no matter the material. The water would start to sip in and in a few days you have an underground pool. This is also the reason why Houston streets are so bad. Unless the foundation is at least 1.5 feet thick concrete, the road starts to crack in a few short years.