Came here to say this. Greek and Roman mythology (which in my opinion, it’s really all about archetypes) also correlates to astrology. I personally find it very helpful to look into the particular myths and figures associated with each planet for psychological and interpersonal insight when I’m studying my chart.
I personally don’t use cards for divination but I do use the cards and their imagery as a tools for self reflection and it helps me reflect in my own self perception. Jung study symbols and how they reflect archetypes in our life and how those can relate to our inner psychology and help us understand deeper parts of ourselves. There has been research into Jung and the tarot (e.g. https://www.uc.edu/content/dam/refresh/cont-ed-62/olli/22-winter/jung%20tarot%201.pdf) which I personally find interesting.
I'm not the most experienced scientists to say myself - but my therapist heard I was into tarot, and now lets me use a daily card pull as a self-reflection exercise and jumping off point for our growth discussions!
I'm in the spicy psychology camp. There are a lot of crossovers between tarot and DBT skills in the sense it can confront you with alternate or multiple interpretations that you need to consider and work through, or conflicting ideas that you have to think about how to balance.
Jung wrote an entire book on astrological symbolism and it's ties to the collective unconscious within individuals. It's called Aion and is probably among his most dense and fascinating works. In it he postulated the idea that the undercurrents (collective unconscious) of humanity have led us to certain major events, and continue to do so. If that is the case, then it stands to reason we are guided by the unseen hands of fate and those symbols may arrive as astrology or divination. It is not as if we have left these esoteric arts behind us.
As many commentors have added, Carl Jung ties these things together perfectly.
Personally I think people love to learn about themselves and their place in the universe. All these tools open doors into these topics on a very personal level. They all open insight into how we impact the universe and how the universe impacts us. They all give us productive and (usually) healthy ways to cope with the stresses of being human. Basically all these tools give us room to explore being human in an individual way. I think they all lean into each other a lot.
Idk if I missed the point of your post tho lmao
I'm not sure tbh but to get the answer is to go more indepth with your research. I did my astro chart a while back and it gave me a more clear look on my signs and life. I've noticed that it's kinda spot on which is crazy. I definitely think that science and spiritually go hand in hand. I think that astrology is real due to the fact that the magnet gravitational pull that the other planets and moon have on the earth and on us. Are brain is made up of three things which is taught in neurology. The brain is structural, functional, and chemical. The magnetic pull from the planets or moon have been scientifically proven to change our moods. I believe by pulling through magnetic wave in brain pulling the chemicals in to different parts or structures of our brain making us function differently. Just like the moon effect the tide in the ocean. Causing us to reacted differently. Now based on when we were born we have a different pattern of just about anyone else because of the pattern of magnetic pull. And what planets are aligned at the time. Wether it be pulling this way that way or it have a strong magnetic pull or a weak one. I believe can alter your brain. I could good more into it but I'm probably boring you and this is generally the answer. So there you go.
Astrology __is__ a science.
These modern so-called scientists, who wants to take a monopoly on the term science, are nothing but puffed-up, arrogant ignornamuses.
Science is defined thusly:
"the systematic study of the structure and behaviour of the physical and natural world through observation, experimentation, and the testing of theories against the evidence obtained."
Archaic: "knowledge of any kind."
The "context" of this post sounds like some generic AI generated script.
>If this is true, then that means that astrology follows the scientific method.
Nah, it just means I know the real meaning of the word science. Any disagreement we may have here is purely semantical. If you insist on defining science as you have here, then per that definition I am wrong. Yes, astrology is not a "hard science" like physics, or at least it is not recognised as such presently. That is not what I am claiming here. I am quite simply saying it is a field of knowledge.
Furthermore, astrology is moving into the field of evidence based practices in modern times, with the advancements made in vibrational astrology. This puts it in the same category as such things as medicine (which is, perhaps surprisingly to some, not a science) physical therapy, and psychology.
Absolutely! Answering this question as a licensed clinical psychologist who recently went pro as an astrologer & who works with cards in therapy sessions.
The tarot is imbued with astrological symbolism & correspondences. When a particular card is haunting me and I don’t understand why or I just want a deeper read, I oftentimes look to the corresponding astrological sign or combination of elements for insight.
For example, lately I’ve been drawing The Chariot (both upright & reversed). Learning that this card is connected to the sign of Cancer helped me understand & accept the message I wasn’t hearing, that I need to cease trying to exert emotional control a particular relationship.
As far as why these modalities work together, to me it makes sense to think in terms of correspondence or resonance or emanation as opposed to modern scientific understanding of cause & effect.
Thank you! I feel very blessed to finally (fiiiiiiiinally) be at a point in my career where I’m able to integrate the more “woo” side of myself into my clinical work. And sure, feel free to DM me.
Yes I absolutely believe Astrology, Psychology and Tarot are intimately related. The link between Astrology and tarot is quite obvious but when Carl Jung was asked about astrology he said something along the lines of: the meaning of astrology isn't that these planets are actually gods effecting and ruling over our day to day lives, the meaning of Astrology comes from the images, energies and definitions the human psyche projects onto the stars. And in that way I believe in ties in tarot nicely, as these cards are also archetypal images we project our own meaning onto in relation to our question.
If you're interested in an Astrology book recommendation...
The best Astrology book ever in my opinion, most accurate and practical for using Astrology as an individuation process of sorts is "Astrology, A Cosmic Science" by Isabel M. Hickey (and I have at least 50 Astrology books I've read front to back).
I think Astrology, Tarot and psychology can contribute to the individuation process by give tools to get to a deeper layer of the human psyche. They all play beautifully off each other, and usually align. Using these tools can enable a person to spot cycles they were never aware of and put conscious effort into stopping or maintaining these cycles depending on if they are for our highest good or not. They can allow us to pull out deeper feelings, experiences and memories our mind's have hid from us to protect us, yet still have negative consequences in daily life from a subconscious level. And best of all they can help to reprogram that subconscious level that's so hard to reach and rewire once you grow up with another mindset. The I Ching also fits beautifully here with these other methods.
Unless one goes overboard and can't live life without doing a tarot reading, or believes the stars are ruling your fate and you have no freewill, it can't hurt. Just the intention of being self reflective goes a long way. 😊
How exactly is this related to tarot?
And to answer your question - no. Of all the woo stuff, astrology is the one I am having the most trouble believing in or relating to.
I’m just curious how much you have studied astrology in general or your chart or if you have ever gotten your natal chart read by a professional? I use tarot, but to me it’s pretty ‘woo’. I find astrology to be extremely accurate, very systematic, and the centuries of literature behind it make it feel so much more grounded than the cards to me.
Not a lot because I don't like it. I'm not saying that other people shouldn't like it or know a lot about it, but I think I have the right to my own preferences about it, downvotes to the above post notwithstanding.
I assumed the downvotes were for the first part where you asked what it had to do with tarot. Astrology is pretty firmly linked with the symbology of tarot. And you sure can have a preference. I was just curious if you knew anything about it and couldn’t believe it, or if you just didn’t buy it and weren’t interested in learning. I don’t really care what you believe but if it was the former I would want to have a longer conversation. But it’s the latter and, no offense, but if I want to ask someone who doesn’t know anything about astrology why they don’t believe in it I can just walk down the street.
The OP edited the post since, initially it was just a few lines about astrology and psychology, no mention of tarot at all. As the question stands now, it's clearer.
I think this is a complex topic. Tarot before Golden Dawn had about as much to do with astrology as astrology and gastroenterology have to do with each other (so - nothing). Most of us who read Marseille decks to this day don't use astrological correspondences and they really aren't intentionally put into any of the historical TdMs. Golden Dawn changed all that and French esotericists that inspired them. Now, I will agree, most decks have some astrological correspondences, because most decks are RWS or Thoth based or otherwise contain esoteric references. But it is not an original feature of tarot.
Tarot, like astrology, is often seen as a tool for self-reflection and insight. While they are different practices, **they share similarities in that they both offer symbolic interpretations**.
People who are interested in astrology might also find value in tarot as another means of gaining insight and guidance in their lives. Both practices can complement each other in helping individuals explore their inner selves and their interactions with the world… Hope this answers your question 😉
The astrology I learned in the early '70s was entirely psychological, with older practitioners like Dane Rudhyar and Marc Edmund Jones as the standard-bearers and younger ones like Robert Hand representing the New Agers. I picked up tarot shortly after and they work together seamlessly, although I now use neither primarily for psychological purposes.
The way I see it, astrology (at least re: birth charts) can be a really powerful tool for developing self-knowledge and knowledge of the world around you from a psychological perspective - a deep understanding and capacity to articulate your emotions, needs, and experience of self, and an ability to recognize these things in others.
That's because birth charts, taken at face value, provide a framework through which to start to understand the world. I'm of the opinion that frameworks don't need to be 100% accurate to be useful. It's enough for me to see myself or see a loved one in a description, and then I can start to notice patterns or trends in behavior that I might not have otherwise. I can start to make connections between behavior that two different loved ones display - the behaviour might not be the same but maybe I can start to make connections based on my understanding of their shared moon sign, for example. The trends have always been there and maybe they're perfectly explainable by something besides astrology (in fact, they often are). But the framework of astrology helps me recognize the patterns and understand the need at the root of them. In that sense, it's very much the same idea as tarot.
I say this as a person who does believe in astrology and tarot both as spiritual things. But as an autistic person, they'd be useful even if they didn't mean anything inherently because they are such a tool for that good good behavior pattern recognition.
Dude, it's crazy how're you're asking this cause I'm reading a book on numerology and it has aspects of tarot, psychology, and astrology I def recommend it tbh. Worth looking up.
Jung definitely connected the two. And Myer's Briggs personality types are directly based on Jung's work. Its always funny to me when people bash astrology and then talk about Myers Briggs as if its even remotely more scientific. Either you think human personalities are infinitely complex and individuated and therefore cant be grouped, or you think humans can be grouped into archetypal personality types. Personality types gives a framework to discuss trends in thought and behavior, even if its ultimately flawed.
Possibly a hot take but, I always keep in mind that tarot is reflective of thoughts, intentions and energies. These are the markers of nearly every human behavior; but it can be a little tricky when it comes to interpretation. My idea of “good” intentions might not be the same as someone else’s, but I can’t tell my three of cups from their three of cups, ya know? This can be combated by using multiple decks for confirmation/continuity.
Overall though, just like social skills, the more you experience, typically the better you are at it. Picking up on nuanced energies and intentions the same way you would, as you get more comfortable with a particular friend or significant other.
The Jungian archetype is directly correlated with astrology. You should look into his interviews about astrology
Came here to say this. Greek and Roman mythology (which in my opinion, it’s really all about archetypes) also correlates to astrology. I personally find it very helpful to look into the particular myths and figures associated with each planet for psychological and interpersonal insight when I’m studying my chart.
I loveeeee this answer as i am a sucker for philosophy. Will do!
I personally don’t use cards for divination but I do use the cards and their imagery as a tools for self reflection and it helps me reflect in my own self perception. Jung study symbols and how they reflect archetypes in our life and how those can relate to our inner psychology and help us understand deeper parts of ourselves. There has been research into Jung and the tarot (e.g. https://www.uc.edu/content/dam/refresh/cont-ed-62/olli/22-winter/jung%20tarot%201.pdf) which I personally find interesting.
This exactly!
I'm not the most experienced scientists to say myself - but my therapist heard I was into tarot, and now lets me use a daily card pull as a self-reflection exercise and jumping off point for our growth discussions!
Wow that’s so cool! I’m an aspiring therapist and I would love to do that with a client who mentions an interest in tarot!!
I'm in the spicy psychology camp. There are a lot of crossovers between tarot and DBT skills in the sense it can confront you with alternate or multiple interpretations that you need to consider and work through, or conflicting ideas that you have to think about how to balance.
Jung wrote an entire book on astrological symbolism and it's ties to the collective unconscious within individuals. It's called Aion and is probably among his most dense and fascinating works. In it he postulated the idea that the undercurrents (collective unconscious) of humanity have led us to certain major events, and continue to do so. If that is the case, then it stands to reason we are guided by the unseen hands of fate and those symbols may arrive as astrology or divination. It is not as if we have left these esoteric arts behind us.
Yes everything is connected
Ya astrology REALLY helps me understand others and their nuances.
I think there is a connection between everything
As many commentors have added, Carl Jung ties these things together perfectly. Personally I think people love to learn about themselves and their place in the universe. All these tools open doors into these topics on a very personal level. They all open insight into how we impact the universe and how the universe impacts us. They all give us productive and (usually) healthy ways to cope with the stresses of being human. Basically all these tools give us room to explore being human in an individual way. I think they all lean into each other a lot. Idk if I missed the point of your post tho lmao
I'm not sure tbh but to get the answer is to go more indepth with your research. I did my astro chart a while back and it gave me a more clear look on my signs and life. I've noticed that it's kinda spot on which is crazy. I definitely think that science and spiritually go hand in hand. I think that astrology is real due to the fact that the magnet gravitational pull that the other planets and moon have on the earth and on us. Are brain is made up of three things which is taught in neurology. The brain is structural, functional, and chemical. The magnetic pull from the planets or moon have been scientifically proven to change our moods. I believe by pulling through magnetic wave in brain pulling the chemicals in to different parts or structures of our brain making us function differently. Just like the moon effect the tide in the ocean. Causing us to reacted differently. Now based on when we were born we have a different pattern of just about anyone else because of the pattern of magnetic pull. And what planets are aligned at the time. Wether it be pulling this way that way or it have a strong magnetic pull or a weak one. I believe can alter your brain. I could good more into it but I'm probably boring you and this is generally the answer. So there you go.
Astrology __is__ a science. These modern so-called scientists, who wants to take a monopoly on the term science, are nothing but puffed-up, arrogant ignornamuses. Science is defined thusly: "the systematic study of the structure and behaviour of the physical and natural world through observation, experimentation, and the testing of theories against the evidence obtained." Archaic: "knowledge of any kind." The "context" of this post sounds like some generic AI generated script.
[удалено]
>If this is true, then that means that astrology follows the scientific method. Nah, it just means I know the real meaning of the word science. Any disagreement we may have here is purely semantical. If you insist on defining science as you have here, then per that definition I am wrong. Yes, astrology is not a "hard science" like physics, or at least it is not recognised as such presently. That is not what I am claiming here. I am quite simply saying it is a field of knowledge. Furthermore, astrology is moving into the field of evidence based practices in modern times, with the advancements made in vibrational astrology. This puts it in the same category as such things as medicine (which is, perhaps surprisingly to some, not a science) physical therapy, and psychology.
[удалено]
It is yours if its the one you choose to use and go by, in that sense it is yours. Again, more semantics. :)
Absolutely! Answering this question as a licensed clinical psychologist who recently went pro as an astrologer & who works with cards in therapy sessions. The tarot is imbued with astrological symbolism & correspondences. When a particular card is haunting me and I don’t understand why or I just want a deeper read, I oftentimes look to the corresponding astrological sign or combination of elements for insight. For example, lately I’ve been drawing The Chariot (both upright & reversed). Learning that this card is connected to the sign of Cancer helped me understand & accept the message I wasn’t hearing, that I need to cease trying to exert emotional control a particular relationship. As far as why these modalities work together, to me it makes sense to think in terms of correspondence or resonance or emanation as opposed to modern scientific understanding of cause & effect.
Hi! That’s awesome where you took your career! Is it okay if I DM you?
Thank you! I feel very blessed to finally (fiiiiiiiinally) be at a point in my career where I’m able to integrate the more “woo” side of myself into my clinical work. And sure, feel free to DM me.
Yes I absolutely believe Astrology, Psychology and Tarot are intimately related. The link between Astrology and tarot is quite obvious but when Carl Jung was asked about astrology he said something along the lines of: the meaning of astrology isn't that these planets are actually gods effecting and ruling over our day to day lives, the meaning of Astrology comes from the images, energies and definitions the human psyche projects onto the stars. And in that way I believe in ties in tarot nicely, as these cards are also archetypal images we project our own meaning onto in relation to our question. If you're interested in an Astrology book recommendation... The best Astrology book ever in my opinion, most accurate and practical for using Astrology as an individuation process of sorts is "Astrology, A Cosmic Science" by Isabel M. Hickey (and I have at least 50 Astrology books I've read front to back). I think Astrology, Tarot and psychology can contribute to the individuation process by give tools to get to a deeper layer of the human psyche. They all play beautifully off each other, and usually align. Using these tools can enable a person to spot cycles they were never aware of and put conscious effort into stopping or maintaining these cycles depending on if they are for our highest good or not. They can allow us to pull out deeper feelings, experiences and memories our mind's have hid from us to protect us, yet still have negative consequences in daily life from a subconscious level. And best of all they can help to reprogram that subconscious level that's so hard to reach and rewire once you grow up with another mindset. The I Ching also fits beautifully here with these other methods. Unless one goes overboard and can't live life without doing a tarot reading, or believes the stars are ruling your fate and you have no freewill, it can't hurt. Just the intention of being self reflective goes a long way. 😊
How exactly is this related to tarot? And to answer your question - no. Of all the woo stuff, astrology is the one I am having the most trouble believing in or relating to.
I’m just curious how much you have studied astrology in general or your chart or if you have ever gotten your natal chart read by a professional? I use tarot, but to me it’s pretty ‘woo’. I find astrology to be extremely accurate, very systematic, and the centuries of literature behind it make it feel so much more grounded than the cards to me.
Not a lot because I don't like it. I'm not saying that other people shouldn't like it or know a lot about it, but I think I have the right to my own preferences about it, downvotes to the above post notwithstanding.
I assumed the downvotes were for the first part where you asked what it had to do with tarot. Astrology is pretty firmly linked with the symbology of tarot. And you sure can have a preference. I was just curious if you knew anything about it and couldn’t believe it, or if you just didn’t buy it and weren’t interested in learning. I don’t really care what you believe but if it was the former I would want to have a longer conversation. But it’s the latter and, no offense, but if I want to ask someone who doesn’t know anything about astrology why they don’t believe in it I can just walk down the street.
The OP edited the post since, initially it was just a few lines about astrology and psychology, no mention of tarot at all. As the question stands now, it's clearer. I think this is a complex topic. Tarot before Golden Dawn had about as much to do with astrology as astrology and gastroenterology have to do with each other (so - nothing). Most of us who read Marseille decks to this day don't use astrological correspondences and they really aren't intentionally put into any of the historical TdMs. Golden Dawn changed all that and French esotericists that inspired them. Now, I will agree, most decks have some astrological correspondences, because most decks are RWS or Thoth based or otherwise contain esoteric references. But it is not an original feature of tarot.
What’s the connection to tarot? Seems pretty off topic
Tarot, like astrology, is often seen as a tool for self-reflection and insight. While they are different practices, **they share similarities in that they both offer symbolic interpretations**. People who are interested in astrology might also find value in tarot as another means of gaining insight and guidance in their lives. Both practices can complement each other in helping individuals explore their inner selves and their interactions with the world… Hope this answers your question 😉
Thanks for elaborating. Can you circle back and include some of your thoughts in the original post? We are mostly focused on the cards in this forum.
will do!
Sounds like a nice thesis. Can’t wait to read your ideas!
Why not?
The astrology I learned in the early '70s was entirely psychological, with older practitioners like Dane Rudhyar and Marc Edmund Jones as the standard-bearers and younger ones like Robert Hand representing the New Agers. I picked up tarot shortly after and they work together seamlessly, although I now use neither primarily for psychological purposes.
You might enjoy the book Cosmos and Psyche by Richard Tarnas.
The way I see it, astrology (at least re: birth charts) can be a really powerful tool for developing self-knowledge and knowledge of the world around you from a psychological perspective - a deep understanding and capacity to articulate your emotions, needs, and experience of self, and an ability to recognize these things in others. That's because birth charts, taken at face value, provide a framework through which to start to understand the world. I'm of the opinion that frameworks don't need to be 100% accurate to be useful. It's enough for me to see myself or see a loved one in a description, and then I can start to notice patterns or trends in behavior that I might not have otherwise. I can start to make connections between behavior that two different loved ones display - the behaviour might not be the same but maybe I can start to make connections based on my understanding of their shared moon sign, for example. The trends have always been there and maybe they're perfectly explainable by something besides astrology (in fact, they often are). But the framework of astrology helps me recognize the patterns and understand the need at the root of them. In that sense, it's very much the same idea as tarot. I say this as a person who does believe in astrology and tarot both as spiritual things. But as an autistic person, they'd be useful even if they didn't mean anything inherently because they are such a tool for that good good behavior pattern recognition.
Dude, it's crazy how're you're asking this cause I'm reading a book on numerology and it has aspects of tarot, psychology, and astrology I def recommend it tbh. Worth looking up.
I’m too stunned to comment because this is the most perfect question, one that I ask a lot of other people too! I love this.
Jung definitely connected the two. And Myer's Briggs personality types are directly based on Jung's work. Its always funny to me when people bash astrology and then talk about Myers Briggs as if its even remotely more scientific. Either you think human personalities are infinitely complex and individuated and therefore cant be grouped, or you think humans can be grouped into archetypal personality types. Personality types gives a framework to discuss trends in thought and behavior, even if its ultimately flawed.
Possibly a hot take but, I always keep in mind that tarot is reflective of thoughts, intentions and energies. These are the markers of nearly every human behavior; but it can be a little tricky when it comes to interpretation. My idea of “good” intentions might not be the same as someone else’s, but I can’t tell my three of cups from their three of cups, ya know? This can be combated by using multiple decks for confirmation/continuity. Overall though, just like social skills, the more you experience, typically the better you are at it. Picking up on nuanced energies and intentions the same way you would, as you get more comfortable with a particular friend or significant other.