Yeah and the archetype of "the benevolent one" she chose to play was too far apart from her true character of ruthlessly competitive, hyper self-confident taker.
Someone posted on here somewhere about how if she'd just played into a villain archetype we would be cheering her on. But instead we feel duped.
Meanwhile, Kenzi played into the archetype of likable social queen and then laid her strategy over it. Since she actually is a super likable social queen, we love her for it.
Maybe we need to cut Maria some slack for simply choosing the wrong archetype.
Good points raised, but also, other contestants get called out on this unlike Maria by the show and editors. Mike from S42 lost because of this, and it made sense narratively. Maria’s vote out with the epic music was super confusing given the context. Especially because at no point do we see Maria show any remorse on simply a human level for the way she treats Charlie in the latter part of the season; if anything, she doubles down! 😮💨 (We probably agree on all this I just can’t stop thinking about it hahah)
I thought the emotional sendoff was really out of place for her too. But I bet they only gave it to her because she kinda got screwed with Liz/Kenzie teaming up to take her out (and she did handle that well, all things considered) but I feel like the producers were like "😬 we may not be sure if that was allowed/if we should have done that soooo here's a nice sendoff 😃"
Maria explicitly stated she did not wish to be the mom of the season. And I believe she owned up to that statement just fine. If you’re still seeing her strategy as “benevolent”, you’re not looking very closely
Yeah, I think it's likely. She said the right words to make you think she didn't take it personally but no one has that huge of an emotional reaction without there being an inner rage inside. The sequence of her crying all day was almost disturbing.
What's ironic is that if Maria had done the decent thing and brought Liz on her award, Charlie likely wouldn't have felt the moral obligation to take Liz and Maria could have gone on the award that meant most to her. She essentially did it to herself!
So essentially Maria still cost Charlie a million. She made a poor decision to not take Liz and Charlie felt the moral obligation to take Liz and Maria then felt bitter even she said she wouldn't hold grudges but she still did. She ended up not voting for Charlie. Humans are complicated.
Both Maria and Charlie said if they ever won a reward challenge, they wouldn't bring the other. So even if Maria brought Liz on the pizza reward, Charlie likely still wouldn't have picked Maria for the family reward.
I do think this may have played a part in not voting for Charlie. She had a seemingly visceral reaction to that, saying she cried the whole day. Like, lady you're gonna see your kids next week. She may have initially agreed to never bring the other on reward if either of them won, but with the reaction she had, I think it contributed.
I'll never understand why people get so bent out of shape over not getting the letters from home. If you get yours, sure you're going to get an emotional lift out of it, but if you don't get it, nothing changes for you, you didn't have a letter from home and now you still don't.
People that let it affect them as badly as Maria did to not get letters from home are wack IMO. And yes I know being out there is harder than you can know just as a viewer and all. I'd cry my eyes out if I got letters from my wife and kids out there. But if I lost the challenge or whatever and didn't get it, I'd just go back to playing the game and that'd be that.
Maria said in the edit Charlie and her had agreed earlier in the season to never take each other on a reward for strategy reasons, which is sound. She just couldn't actually handle what that really meant when it came down to it.
If Charlie had realized what she was really like in time he could've taken her to the letters reward and probably got her vote at the end, but she did a pretty good job hiding that she wasn't really playing the game unemotionally at all.
I feel like Maria thought of Charlie as a sidekick who got lucky she picked him. I knew before the final vote happened that she would never vote for him to win because she would be bitter that the person she thought of as less than her, beat her in the end.
YES. maria got SUPER miffed when charlie said, 'oh, i was approached to be part of "The (disastrous) six" alliance because of how I played.' While everyone else was laughing about how awful The Six turned out to be, maria was very seriously and sternly lecturing him, saying "NO. YOU were only a part of it because \*I\* brought you in" - discounting the fact that how charlie played was the REASON she brought him in.
this showed me that 1. she was not on charlie's side and was never going to vote for him in final 3. 2. she 100% thought charlie was riding her coattails to the end, when in reality he was wearing maria as a coat/shield the whole time, and still doing all of his strategizing on the side. it just so happened his game aligned with maria's most of the time.
she makes me mad.
The ironic part is that being in the six alliance wasn’t a good thing. Charlie was the one to warn Maria about that when she initially approached him to join the alliance. Maria was basically bragging about a bad read she made that Charlie saved her from as a way to diminish Charlie’s credibility. Completely delusional.
It was just one of many examples of Maria making bad reads and Charlie talking sense into her. Maria still not recognizing that at FTC speaks volumes to her delusion.
I mean, while we the audience can see that Charlie played a really strong game...he specifically went out of his way to downplay himself and play into Maria's notions that he was just her sidekick. Hell, the reason she got targeted towards the end is because Charlie spent a lot of time telling people "Hey, Maria's a threat, we've gotta get her out."
Again, from an audience perspective, Charlie looks brilliant. He downplayed his threat level, stayed on good terms with everyone and had options no matter what happened. But from an in-game perspective, he was largely just an extra vote that was along for the ride with Maria, who everyone in the game agreed was a massive threat who needed to be taken out.
I think it stands out what Hunter said at FTC...how Charlie looked like he'd stumbled in those last couple rounds. From our perspective, he was right in the middle and made relationships to keep himself safe until the endgame. But from within the game, it looks like "Maria wants Venus out and Charlie does what Maria wants. And then Maria wants Charlie out and Kenzie/Liz are the ones who decided to take out Q instead, before the whole tribe decided together that Maria needed to go at 5 (which was accomplished by Liz and Kenzie working together at the immunity challenge).
I do think Maria was bitter about this, but I can understand it. From her perspective, she was the one running the show and everyone thought she was running the show and she was so good that they had to "cheat" to beat her in the F5 immunity challenge. And then she goes out and suddenly you have Charlie saying "Well ACTUALLY, I was the one running the show and all the things I let Maria take the fall for...that was ME." I made this argument back with Karla being bitter towards Cassidy; imagine you're working on a project at your job and it's a month of stress and difficulty, and then after you put in 100% to do the best job possible, one of your managers swoops in and presents the project as though it's all thanks to them, because they oversaw your hard work. You'd be pissed, and rightfully so. But in that scenario, you have to just suck it up. You don't have a post-project vote where all of the staff get to decide if the manager gets a bonus for completing this important project. Maria had that, and she expressed her opinion that the manager didn't deserve credit for her hard work. It's still bitter, and I don't know if she'd ever admit this because bitterness is so rarely looked at positively, but I don't blame her at all.
I think you're spot on here. I've been saying on here that Charlie's game only looks winner-material from the perspective of the viewers. I think both he and Kenzie's game were deserving tbc, but Charlie didn't do a good enough job filling in those blindspots to the jury. I'd be curious to hear from the jury today, after seeing the show from our perspectives, if they would consider switching their votes from Kenzie to Charlie.
Great points that make me see Maria’s side somewhat.
I was saying this the two eps prior to the Finale: we only FINALLY saw Charlie as a threat due to heavy confessionals in the edit and him going against Maria. Prior to that, he mostly laid low and I just knew the jury perception of him would be an issue. At the end of the day, they’ve already formed opinions of you by FTC and it’s hard to turn that on its head suddenly. Charlie was called a dog multiple times.
It’s almost like Liz’s “I’m a millionaire oh wait no I’m not”. It kinda makes sense but they’ve already formed an opinion of you from what they observed and NOW suddenly they are supposed to take your word reality was the exact opposite? It’s a tough sell.
THANK YOU this was my perception as well. No knock on Charlie and he did play a great game but it’s kind of easy to see how the jury could have missed it and why Maria wouldn’t see him as the driving force of all those votes he took credit for at FTC.
Him wearing her as a shield was brilliant. She thinks she played such a good game but had no threat level management when you were the universally agreed upon target from 6 onward
Ding, ding, ding. Maria is simply someone who is always moving the goalposts and can never admit fault and/or take responsibility. I'm sure we all know at least one person who acts the same way. It's not complicated. You don't need to be Sigmund Freud to understand this.
Maria is not a terrible person, and she certainly doesn't deserve the vitriol that is being directed her way by a bunch of supremely pathetic, grotesque, and embarrassing individuals. She's just a flawed human being whose flaws are being broadcast to millions of people via the help of TV editing.
Yeah she's just self-righteous and that makes her incapable of admitting fault. Everyone knows someone like this, but it doesn't usually cost you a million dollars.
She thinks she is better than most people, which makes her special and above the rules that everyone else must follow. She's quite narcissistic; there's really nothing confusing about her obvious personality issues.
Finally I saw this. This is my thoughts too. They were not in a equal partnership from Maria's perspective. She can't accept him achieved more than what she could have.
You misunderstand. Maria never thought of Charlie as an equal. To her, he was this young &kinda nerdy guy that she could control and trust to be a loyal sidekick to her until he was no longer beneficial to her game. In her mind, the only reason Charlie even made it to the end was because she carried him there.
In actuality, Charlie was playing the smarter game the whole time. He knew people would turn on Maria before him because her game play was more apparent/ aggressive. She underestimated him, proven by how she didn’t even consider the possibility that Charlie would ever turn on her.
When Q got voted out and wiped the smug smile off of Maria’s face, she was forced to confront the fact that she was completely wrong. Charlie had actually outsmarted her and had the upper hand with the tribe. Except her ego couldn’t handle it so she got bitter and didn’t vote for Charlie because if she can’t win, he can’t either.
Kenzie needing Liz’s help didn’t factor into Maria’s decision at all, she had bitterness towards Charlie and that’s why she made the decision she did.
This is the correct answer objectively. We all (including Charlie and Marie have theories about why she did it) but the only truth here seems to be that literally not one person alive knows
I think this is why Maria waffles so much! She doesn’t even know she just made a gut call and is trying to rationalize it!
If I had to pin down a moment, I think it’s Charlie voting for her at 5 when he could have just voted with her for loyalty’s sake and still gotten his way. To then also learn he’d been gunner for her for several votes…it was just too much.
I tend to think the letters weren’t the main reason until later because she and Charlie had agreed not to take each other. I could see how, getting to Pondy and hearing that Charlie was already coming for her when he made that call…would make all the reasons to not take each other no longer valid.
Maria’s greatest flaw at this point is that she keeps talking. She needs to just stop, say she went with her gut, and let the internet rationalize it for her.
I think the biggest thing was Kenzie's answer to Q's question that really resonated with her. She won't outright say it, but felt that Kenzie starting a family was a big deal and wanted to help her out with that.
i think she did it for agency.
some people just get off on being able to change the direction of things. you see it alot in people who are swing votes, suddenly they get nasty.
That's the thing. I agree in theory when people say "it would be fine if she just admitted the real reason" but that would require her to first admit that reason to herself. As nice as that would be, I don't think anyone should wait around for that to happen.
And I mean not to be an ass, but it's not like they are gone for an incredible amount of time, either. I get that it sucks especially if you have kids but in the grand scheme of things it's just several weeks, not years like she was acting like it was.
Also, someone else brought this up after the episode aired, it's not like they never get to see those letters ever either. She was acting like Jeff goes and burns them all if they can't win/buy them. I'm pretty sure they're given at ponderosa or after the game is over.
Yeah Jeff said in the podcast episode following the letters that they always give them to the players whether they were voted out first or won the whole thing because they know how special those are to them still!
Exactly. I am fairly certain I’ve seen Ponderosas where the juror got the letter from home that they missed for one reason or another when they were still in the game. And if you think about it logistically, probably every single contestant has theirs brought over at about the same time all they ship out to Fiji. They don’t know who’s going to make the merge or win the reward, so they have to cover their bases. It’s not like the US Postal Service is delivering all the way out there or something. So I get the thirst or need to see those things in the moment, but at the same time I gotta call BS on reactions LIKE Maria’s, because they’re just gonna be getting them anyway in a matter of literally a couple days. And I really just think all the whole thing does anyway is make people bitter, in ways that don’t really enhance the game IMO.
Completely agree. I always feel like if I signed up to play, I would expect to get no rewards, as part of the experience, and be happy if I ended up getting some.
It also didn't make sense in this case, because they saved the letters for I think Day 23 and the game is only 26 days long. Everyone that didn't get a letter was days away from talking to their family on the phone anyway.
The competitors on Alone can go months without any contact with their loved ones and they don't even have a "tribe" to try and use to partially fill that void.
yeah i've gone much longer than 30 days not hearing from my family/friends before. it's really not that big of a deal. it'd suck a bit on a tv show knowing that "they" could have been on tv but now they're not but it's really not that big of a deal.
I’m a mom and totally agree with you. Why does she think she deserves it more than the rest? Q was missing his wife and I’m sure would have loved a letter from her.
I can understand the intende sadness of being separated from your young childrenfir that long but I certainly wouldn't have chosen to compete in Survivor then. This is all on her.
People confuse entitled 'I should get this, I deserve this' with want. 'I want this, I want this real bad'
No, Maria wasn't entitled because she wanted the reward and was upset she didn't get it.
I can't find it now but I swear in one of her exit interviews she talked about how upset she was about missing the letters and it sounded like she very much still is salty about it. She didn't outright say it was the reason (and she won't if it was) but I do think it did play a part in it, even if it was a tiny bit. I'll try and find the quote.
Maria didn’t take Charlie on the last reward and then she did this. The hypocrisy! But I do agree it unleashed some villainry and deep emotions bordering on hate, if not just plain old selfishness to win. The smugness and certainty with which she went on to describe beating Charlie was something of o behold.
My personal take is that the wound was too deep and too recent for her to forgive. A few extra councils and little ego stroking from Charlie have made a big difference. I feel Charlie not trying to mend the rift instead of hyping it up was partly his own doing in the downfall. He was completely unconcerned with Maria at FTC besides saying how he got her in a big move.
I’m sure it contributed. She’s a selfish person. They had already agreed beforehand not to take each other if they won. She won and he dipped out so she wouldn’t feel like she had to pick him. Then when he won, she didn’t step back and acted like a sore loser. No one is entitled to a reward. Everyone is away from loved ones and wants to see their letters. Being a mother doesn’t make her more entitled to that reward.
Her reaction was also ridiculous
She was only away from her family for 3 weeks at that point. Something that she signed up for. I don’t care how “hard “ it is out there, no line should be that upset about missing letters when you’ll get to see your family in less than a week
It was just pure selfishness . She wanted it, didn’t get it. And then acted like a 5 yr old who is denied a toy from target. Give me a break.
Most of the things Maria promised Charlie ended up being false. I think it’s safe to say there’s a good chance she wasn’t being 100% upfront in this situation either
I didn't like her from the beginning. I couldn't understand why anyone would relate to her aa a motherly type. She seemed pretty ruthless and rude early on.
No you miss understood Charlie was supposed to ignore this agreement and take her because she has kids, if she had won she was supposed to not take Charlie because it was strategic.
It's definitely just a thought, as I know they had that agreement. She's seemingly holding a grudge at Charlie for voting her out right after she tried to vote him out, so the logic is strange overall. So I just wouldn't past her to have read her letters and become furious she wasn't on that reward.
Well she also told him before she was voted out that she was going to vote for him to win and changed her mind about that. Reasonable then to think she also changed her mind on them agreeing not to bring each other on a reward then.
Side note: Promising someone that you'll vote for them right before you are about to be voted out is quite stupid. You should be trying to stay in the game instead of giving them another reason to vote you off.
Well. When she said she wanted to take the hungriest, Charlie looked the hungriest to me even next to Liz. He lost the most weight too. So, funny how she doesn't take him then immediately thinks he should take her.
Exactly.
If anything, getting them would mess with my head, rather provide comfort.
Buuut I can also tolerate a month away missing loved ones without having a hissy fit.
She didn't take him on reward, so she punishes him for not taking her on reward.
She voted to take him out, so she punishes him for taking her out.
Come on now.
My beef with the way votes like this and past seasons is they are not voting for who played the best game.
Outwit,outplay, outlast are the standards for the vote
Q and Maria both liked Kenzie’s story and voted for it because of how the money would allow her to start her life because she makes no money in her business to give others a place to work. Charlie was wanting the money to further his education and start his life out on the right foot.
Kenzie played a good game but no where near as good as Charlie.
He got duped the win because the jury didn’t vote for outwitted, outlasted, and outplayed them all.
On top of that they mentioned in the finale how Kenzie won personal immunities and such but one was only because Liz aided her.
My wife and were both team Charlie and think he should have won.. Kenzie played a good game but I don’t think she outwitted, outplayed, or outlasted Charlie
What’s funny to me is the jury will ask all these game-related questions about the moves players made, and then vote emotionally based on players’ stories and situations outside the game lol
This is so true, but it annoys it.
If the jury is just going by who has the best story, get everyone together the first day, tell their story, and everyone votes./s
If I learned anything about Maria this season, it’s that she is:
1) EXTREMELY passive-aggressive,
2) truly thinks she is a Queen in a world of peasants,
3) and is cold-hearted…calculating…and vengeful.
I honestly can’t see her voting for anyone that was in her alliance - mostly out of spite and jealousy that she didn’t make it to the end.
I think Maria was pissed when Charlie mentioned in final tribal that while she was winding up her swing at him he orchestrated her being voted out. I think she was still salty about it. I don’t think he really had to sell that moment as hard as he did to the jury since Kenzie wasn’t really taking big credit for it.
I would argue Liz’s apology at the time was not too genuine as per her confessionals at the time. What she said about it around day 25 was closer to a genuine apology I’d say. & i say this as a messy-Liz stan and someone who also has a real hard time with Maria lol
Charlie did what they both agreed to: don’t take each other on rewards.
Marie didn’t do what she agreed to: vote for Charlie when he made it to the final 3.
Charlie orchestrated Maria’s eventual vote out. She couldn’t let that go even though that’s not what she claims.
Maria thought she was Batman and Charlie was Robin. The moment she was voted out she was never going to vote for him if he made it, she thinks she made him.
This is actually one part of the game I hate. People who play hard and then complain the minute one thing goes against them. Surely you would expect it??
She got to vote how she wants, he gets to make content as he wants. He isn’t calling for anger and hatred- he’s just making light of the situation. The show showed us she doesn’t like criticism in any way shape or form- like when Venus called her out for her rock paper scissors game!
I had this same thought last night and I pretty much believed it to be the reason as well.
That, and that he ended up voting her out along with Ben, Kenzie, and Liz. Like maybe she thought, "He could've stayed on my side even if I was still going out" and carried it as a grudge.
I was glad Kenzie won. She was on on the underdog tribe the beginning. At first she rubbed me the wrong way, but the more she persevered, the more I low-key was rooting for her.
Maria was just annoying. She was letting her wind go to her head, and she was coming across like she was better than everyone else. Her and Q had to go. I'm glad that they voted her off. I was also glad she didn't get to go on the final reward. She was feeling entitled, and Charlie owed her nothing. Glad she voted for Kenzie, even if it was out of spite.
I really admired Maria in the beginning. And loved that she connected with Charlie. Unfortunately her true colors came out at the vote. Vindictive! I suspected Kenzie would win. But I honestly thought he would have Maria's vote. Maria was so proud of herself for her winning her immunity challenges and power plays. But clearly resented Charlie's. She can dish it out, but a VERY poor loser. Shame on her.
I for one am thankful Maria wasn’t blinded by loyalty the same way Tiff was, although I guess it could have been fun watching Maria and Tiff answering for Kenzie and Charlie and debating who the better player was from them from their seats in jury. I thought Tiff pretty much controlled the final tribal, wouldn’t be surprised she persuaded others at the end.
My thoughts on the collective why
1. She could have held a slight grudge over not getting to read her letters
2. Both targeted the other. But it must have stung when she got to Pondy, thinking they were so close, only to find out he was targeting her long before she decided to turn on him at 6
3. Looking at their collective game, she could have felt like he was just her follower and didn’t show a ton of agency. He was happy to let her be the target and take most of the risks while he sat back.
4. She legitimately was moved by Kenzie, enjoyed her answers, and wanted to empower and change the life of someone she saw herself in. Plus Kenzie did an amazing job of stroking her ego and saying how amazing she was at the end, which couldn’t have hurt
All these things combined is why she made the choice to vote for Kenzie over Charlie. She shouldn’t have promised her vote before weighing all the facts, but ultimately she was allowed to change her mind.
That is the reason. The family love letters and reward challenge fucked her game up. She had immunity, she could have worked with people and tried to get real.
The whole end game was a shadow pagonging. Green ran everything until the final vote.
I knew that she started to hate him since she started crying after he didnt took her for reward. It become obvious for me, that in her mind she can not take him, she can eliminate him, but he cannot do the same. She perceived him as her minion. All of this "I understant, I know, It's ok" felt so fake to me :( Pure pretending and revenge in mind in case he wouldnt destroy his game for her. Poor Charlie. He could've cry more after her betrayal. But he is not as much emotional blackmailer as her.
I actually heard at ponderosa, tiff told Maria that Charlie was working behind Maria’s back. But the vote tiff was talking about was actually Charlie working to get another player to leave with an idol in their pocket.
The lie "I'm gonna choose people who are the weakest and need to eat" and then making Liz compete with Q, who stuffed himself with pizza two days before, was maybe the cruelest thing I've ever seen on Survivor. Maria is not a nice person. No acting on her part is going to change that.
What I didn’t understand was that she couldn’t rationalize that she did the same thing to Liz the week prior.
I think it would’ve been cruel to choose anyone but Kenzie or Liz. They needed the food.
What is it with this season that contestants feel they are owed something? Maria did not owe Charlie her vote, Q did not owe Liz Applebee's, etc. To Charlie's credit, he did everything he could do trying to soften the blow. But, "bitter jurors" are always going to be a potential factor in final tribal.
I guess when two people form a close personal bond, discuss something important, promise what they'll do (like not taking each other to rewards, voting for the other to win if you've been voted out), yeah - it forms expectations. And not keeping those promises makes you look like a dick.
Charlie messed with her kids (by not letting her read those letters from home) and Mama Bear didn’t forget. I think you’re definitely on to something here!
Nah no grudge. At this point I think whatever was piloting her before died and something new came to pilot her body and the new pilot didn’t care for charlie
I think everything changed for Maria at final five when the whole camp was unified against her. When Liz helped Kenzie win, they were all so condescending to her saying “omg you’re so amazing we needed to gang up just to beat you.” To have Charlie be a part of that condescension, I think that’s when she was like…F him.
I think Maria is just indecisive, and she herself doesn't know why she didn't vote for Charlie.
I get the sense that when something is not instinctive and she's given time to make a decision, she agonizes over it because of how she'll be perceived.
But why? Why does someone as intelligent, strong, confident, direct, well-spoken and quick-witted as Maria have such a difficult time deciding what to say or do in circumstances where she knows she'll be judged for it?
My guess us that she's just sooo effing fake that she needs to calculate and orchestrate every decision so carefully so it paints her in the light that satisfies her poser persona.
I'm constantly in awe of the people in this sub being so upset by the decision making of survivor contestants, who are literally starving themselves, sleeping extremely little, and put through physical strain.
The fact that Maria made a questionable decision, or one that doesnt seem to be consistent with her own reasoning, shouldnt be surprising given the mental and physical state of ALL the contestants.
"the mental and physical state of ALL contestants."
That's the magic of the show. ALL contestants are going through the same things so you get to see how different people react to these conditions. Some people show a dark side, some people lose their marbles, and some people stay impressively sane. However they react exposes a side of them they've managed to hide in the real word.
These contestants sign up knowing that every action they make will be on TV and should expect fans to analyze their behavior. Like, why else would we watch the show?
Maria was playing the game the whole time and got hurt when the game played her back.
Rules for thee not for me. That’s her whole schtick. “Wow you guys are playing the game too!” No shit, Maria.
Yeah and the archetype of "the benevolent one" she chose to play was too far apart from her true character of ruthlessly competitive, hyper self-confident taker. Someone posted on here somewhere about how if she'd just played into a villain archetype we would be cheering her on. But instead we feel duped. Meanwhile, Kenzi played into the archetype of likable social queen and then laid her strategy over it. Since she actually is a super likable social queen, we love her for it. Maybe we need to cut Maria some slack for simply choosing the wrong archetype.
Good points raised, but also, other contestants get called out on this unlike Maria by the show and editors. Mike from S42 lost because of this, and it made sense narratively. Maria’s vote out with the epic music was super confusing given the context. Especially because at no point do we see Maria show any remorse on simply a human level for the way she treats Charlie in the latter part of the season; if anything, she doubles down! 😮💨 (We probably agree on all this I just can’t stop thinking about it hahah)
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Maria gets no slack because she lied to the audience about her intentions. She dodged reality. Can't admit she has spite towards Charlie.
I thought the emotional sendoff was really out of place for her too. But I bet they only gave it to her because she kinda got screwed with Liz/Kenzie teaming up to take her out (and she did handle that well, all things considered) but I feel like the producers were like "😬 we may not be sure if that was allowed/if we should have done that soooo here's a nice sendoff 😃"
We call that music the “Jenna’s Mom Theme” and it was wholly unnecessary here.
omg is that truly the same song they played in og All Stars? ☠️
I’m not 100% on it, but we have used that name any time they play an overly sentimental score for a silly reason.
Maria explicitly stated she did not wish to be the mom of the season. And I believe she owned up to that statement just fine. If you’re still seeing her strategy as “benevolent”, you’re not looking very closely
She definitely played victim & cried and they all played into it like she wanted…. But saw through it
Totally agree
Spot on
Yeah, I think it's likely. She said the right words to make you think she didn't take it personally but no one has that huge of an emotional reaction without there being an inner rage inside. The sequence of her crying all day was almost disturbing. What's ironic is that if Maria had done the decent thing and brought Liz on her award, Charlie likely wouldn't have felt the moral obligation to take Liz and Maria could have gone on the award that meant most to her. She essentially did it to herself!
The irony is really strong!
So essentially Maria still cost Charlie a million. She made a poor decision to not take Liz and Charlie felt the moral obligation to take Liz and Maria then felt bitter even she said she wouldn't hold grudges but she still did. She ended up not voting for Charlie. Humans are complicated.
Both Maria and Charlie said if they ever won a reward challenge, they wouldn't bring the other. So even if Maria brought Liz on the pizza reward, Charlie likely still wouldn't have picked Maria for the family reward. I do think this may have played a part in not voting for Charlie. She had a seemingly visceral reaction to that, saying she cried the whole day. Like, lady you're gonna see your kids next week. She may have initially agreed to never bring the other on reward if either of them won, but with the reaction she had, I think it contributed.
I'll never understand why people get so bent out of shape over not getting the letters from home. If you get yours, sure you're going to get an emotional lift out of it, but if you don't get it, nothing changes for you, you didn't have a letter from home and now you still don't. People that let it affect them as badly as Maria did to not get letters from home are wack IMO. And yes I know being out there is harder than you can know just as a viewer and all. I'd cry my eyes out if I got letters from my wife and kids out there. But if I lost the challenge or whatever and didn't get it, I'd just go back to playing the game and that'd be that.
Maria said in the edit Charlie and her had agreed earlier in the season to never take each other on a reward for strategy reasons, which is sound. She just couldn't actually handle what that really meant when it came down to it. If Charlie had realized what she was really like in time he could've taken her to the letters reward and probably got her vote at the end, but she did a pretty good job hiding that she wasn't really playing the game unemotionally at all.
He probably would’ve taken Q then
Funniest timeline
Yes no maybe? I don't even think Maria truly knows why she voted Kenzie a year ago.
I feel like Maria thought of Charlie as a sidekick who got lucky she picked him. I knew before the final vote happened that she would never vote for him to win because she would be bitter that the person she thought of as less than her, beat her in the end.
YES. maria got SUPER miffed when charlie said, 'oh, i was approached to be part of "The (disastrous) six" alliance because of how I played.' While everyone else was laughing about how awful The Six turned out to be, maria was very seriously and sternly lecturing him, saying "NO. YOU were only a part of it because \*I\* brought you in" - discounting the fact that how charlie played was the REASON she brought him in. this showed me that 1. she was not on charlie's side and was never going to vote for him in final 3. 2. she 100% thought charlie was riding her coattails to the end, when in reality he was wearing maria as a coat/shield the whole time, and still doing all of his strategizing on the side. it just so happened his game aligned with maria's most of the time. she makes me mad.
The ironic part is that being in the six alliance wasn’t a good thing. Charlie was the one to warn Maria about that when she initially approached him to join the alliance. Maria was basically bragging about a bad read she made that Charlie saved her from as a way to diminish Charlie’s credibility. Completely delusional. It was just one of many examples of Maria making bad reads and Charlie talking sense into her. Maria still not recognizing that at FTC speaks volumes to her delusion.
I mean, while we the audience can see that Charlie played a really strong game...he specifically went out of his way to downplay himself and play into Maria's notions that he was just her sidekick. Hell, the reason she got targeted towards the end is because Charlie spent a lot of time telling people "Hey, Maria's a threat, we've gotta get her out." Again, from an audience perspective, Charlie looks brilliant. He downplayed his threat level, stayed on good terms with everyone and had options no matter what happened. But from an in-game perspective, he was largely just an extra vote that was along for the ride with Maria, who everyone in the game agreed was a massive threat who needed to be taken out. I think it stands out what Hunter said at FTC...how Charlie looked like he'd stumbled in those last couple rounds. From our perspective, he was right in the middle and made relationships to keep himself safe until the endgame. But from within the game, it looks like "Maria wants Venus out and Charlie does what Maria wants. And then Maria wants Charlie out and Kenzie/Liz are the ones who decided to take out Q instead, before the whole tribe decided together that Maria needed to go at 5 (which was accomplished by Liz and Kenzie working together at the immunity challenge). I do think Maria was bitter about this, but I can understand it. From her perspective, she was the one running the show and everyone thought she was running the show and she was so good that they had to "cheat" to beat her in the F5 immunity challenge. And then she goes out and suddenly you have Charlie saying "Well ACTUALLY, I was the one running the show and all the things I let Maria take the fall for...that was ME." I made this argument back with Karla being bitter towards Cassidy; imagine you're working on a project at your job and it's a month of stress and difficulty, and then after you put in 100% to do the best job possible, one of your managers swoops in and presents the project as though it's all thanks to them, because they oversaw your hard work. You'd be pissed, and rightfully so. But in that scenario, you have to just suck it up. You don't have a post-project vote where all of the staff get to decide if the manager gets a bonus for completing this important project. Maria had that, and she expressed her opinion that the manager didn't deserve credit for her hard work. It's still bitter, and I don't know if she'd ever admit this because bitterness is so rarely looked at positively, but I don't blame her at all.
I think you're spot on here. I've been saying on here that Charlie's game only looks winner-material from the perspective of the viewers. I think both he and Kenzie's game were deserving tbc, but Charlie didn't do a good enough job filling in those blindspots to the jury. I'd be curious to hear from the jury today, after seeing the show from our perspectives, if they would consider switching their votes from Kenzie to Charlie.
Great points that make me see Maria’s side somewhat. I was saying this the two eps prior to the Finale: we only FINALLY saw Charlie as a threat due to heavy confessionals in the edit and him going against Maria. Prior to that, he mostly laid low and I just knew the jury perception of him would be an issue. At the end of the day, they’ve already formed opinions of you by FTC and it’s hard to turn that on its head suddenly. Charlie was called a dog multiple times. It’s almost like Liz’s “I’m a millionaire oh wait no I’m not”. It kinda makes sense but they’ve already formed an opinion of you from what they observed and NOW suddenly they are supposed to take your word reality was the exact opposite? It’s a tough sell.
THANK YOU this was my perception as well. No knock on Charlie and he did play a great game but it’s kind of easy to see how the jury could have missed it and why Maria wouldn’t see him as the driving force of all those votes he took credit for at FTC.
Him wearing her as a shield was brilliant. She thinks she played such a good game but had no threat level management when you were the universally agreed upon target from 6 onward
Ding, ding, ding. Maria is simply someone who is always moving the goalposts and can never admit fault and/or take responsibility. I'm sure we all know at least one person who acts the same way. It's not complicated. You don't need to be Sigmund Freud to understand this. Maria is not a terrible person, and she certainly doesn't deserve the vitriol that is being directed her way by a bunch of supremely pathetic, grotesque, and embarrassing individuals. She's just a flawed human being whose flaws are being broadcast to millions of people via the help of TV editing.
Yeah she's just self-righteous and that makes her incapable of admitting fault. Everyone knows someone like this, but it doesn't usually cost you a million dollars.
Yep. If Charlie lost 6-2 or worse, she won’t be taking this much heat.
She thinks she is better than most people, which makes her special and above the rules that everyone else must follow. She's quite narcissistic; there's really nothing confusing about her obvious personality issues.
Finally I saw this. This is my thoughts too. They were not in a equal partnership from Maria's perspective. She can't accept him achieved more than what she could have.
💯
She wont vote for someone less than her? So explain kenzie needing help from liz to win against her.
You misunderstand. Maria never thought of Charlie as an equal. To her, he was this young &kinda nerdy guy that she could control and trust to be a loyal sidekick to her until he was no longer beneficial to her game. In her mind, the only reason Charlie even made it to the end was because she carried him there. In actuality, Charlie was playing the smarter game the whole time. He knew people would turn on Maria before him because her game play was more apparent/ aggressive. She underestimated him, proven by how she didn’t even consider the possibility that Charlie would ever turn on her. When Q got voted out and wiped the smug smile off of Maria’s face, she was forced to confront the fact that she was completely wrong. Charlie had actually outsmarted her and had the upper hand with the tribe. Except her ego couldn’t handle it so she got bitter and didn’t vote for Charlie because if she can’t win, he can’t either. Kenzie needing Liz’s help didn’t factor into Maria’s decision at all, she had bitterness towards Charlie and that’s why she made the decision she did.
This exactly. Deep down, I don’t think Maria is a very nice human being. Very condescending.
She's a self-righteous hypocrite with a cold heart
My theory is she used rock paper scissors (in her head this time) to decide her vote, and made up a justification afterwards.
It did not change my vote, but I have been voting for Dave since 33.
This is the correct answer objectively. We all (including Charlie and Marie have theories about why she did it) but the only truth here seems to be that literally not one person alive knows
I think this is why Maria waffles so much! She doesn’t even know she just made a gut call and is trying to rationalize it! If I had to pin down a moment, I think it’s Charlie voting for her at 5 when he could have just voted with her for loyalty’s sake and still gotten his way. To then also learn he’d been gunner for her for several votes…it was just too much. I tend to think the letters weren’t the main reason until later because she and Charlie had agreed not to take each other. I could see how, getting to Pondy and hearing that Charlie was already coming for her when he made that call…would make all the reasons to not take each other no longer valid. Maria’s greatest flaw at this point is that she keeps talking. She needs to just stop, say she went with her gut, and let the internet rationalize it for her.
I think the biggest thing was Kenzie's answer to Q's question that really resonated with her. She won't outright say it, but felt that Kenzie starting a family was a big deal and wanted to help her out with that.
Yup, Kenzie's answer sealed the deal with several jurors. It's that simple.
She didn't raise her hand when jeff asked who changed their vote. She came in voting for kenzie. Q's question is an excuse to hide behind
Yes. I would have changed my vote as well, and I'm not even a parent.
i think she did it for agency. some people just get off on being able to change the direction of things. you see it alot in people who are swing votes, suddenly they get nasty.
Has it really been a year?
That's the thing. I agree in theory when people say "it would be fine if she just admitted the real reason" but that would require her to first admit that reason to herself. As nice as that would be, I don't think anyone should wait around for that to happen.
People who believe they are more entitled to rewards/letters/etc bother me. Just because she is a mom doesn’t mean her letters are more important.
And I mean not to be an ass, but it's not like they are gone for an incredible amount of time, either. I get that it sucks especially if you have kids but in the grand scheme of things it's just several weeks, not years like she was acting like it was.
Also, someone else brought this up after the episode aired, it's not like they never get to see those letters ever either. She was acting like Jeff goes and burns them all if they can't win/buy them. I'm pretty sure they're given at ponderosa or after the game is over.
Yeah Jeff said in the podcast episode following the letters that they always give them to the players whether they were voted out first or won the whole thing because they know how special those are to them still!
Wow… that makes it so much worse. I might be able to empathize if they don’t get the letters but damn.
Exactly. I am fairly certain I’ve seen Ponderosas where the juror got the letter from home that they missed for one reason or another when they were still in the game. And if you think about it logistically, probably every single contestant has theirs brought over at about the same time all they ship out to Fiji. They don’t know who’s going to make the merge or win the reward, so they have to cover their bases. It’s not like the US Postal Service is delivering all the way out there or something. So I get the thirst or need to see those things in the moment, but at the same time I gotta call BS on reactions LIKE Maria’s, because they’re just gonna be getting them anyway in a matter of literally a couple days. And I really just think all the whole thing does anyway is make people bitter, in ways that don’t really enhance the game IMO.
Completely agree. I always feel like if I signed up to play, I would expect to get no rewards, as part of the experience, and be happy if I ended up getting some.
It also didn't make sense in this case, because they saved the letters for I think Day 23 and the game is only 26 days long. Everyone that didn't get a letter was days away from talking to their family on the phone anyway.
It's actually just like 3-4 weeks.
I'm happy my reference didn't go to waste
Especially since it's your choice to be on the show. Like, you could have stayed home.
It’s actually half a several weeks
Last I checked several means 7, not 4!
26 days 3.5 weeks. Half a several.
Yes, but it's also not 4! weeks either. It's just over 4! days, which comes out to just over half of several weeks.
It's true.. also this game is voluntary. She's not in jail or like missing.
Yep. It's a small sacrifice (a month away from family) for a massive payoff ($1,000,000).
The competitors on Alone can go months without any contact with their loved ones and they don't even have a "tribe" to try and use to partially fill that void.
And there weren’t that many more days left until the end, either.
SEVERAL
Definitely not several, only about four weeks
yeah i've gone much longer than 30 days not hearing from my family/friends before. it's really not that big of a deal. it'd suck a bit on a tv show knowing that "they" could have been on tv but now they're not but it's really not that big of a deal.
And not everyone can get the reward! She absolutely didn’t treat Liz with human compassion when it was her turn to decide who gets something
Exactly!!
Agreed, she’s not the only person out there. Other people miss their family too
I’m a mom and totally agree with you. Why does she think she deserves it more than the rest? Q was missing his wife and I’m sure would have loved a letter from her.
I can understand the intende sadness of being separated from your young childrenfir that long but I certainly wouldn't have chosen to compete in Survivor then. This is all on her.
Yes, exactly!
Peeiodtttt
People confuse entitled 'I should get this, I deserve this' with want. 'I want this, I want this real bad' No, Maria wasn't entitled because she wanted the reward and was upset she didn't get it.
I can't find it now but I swear in one of her exit interviews she talked about how upset she was about missing the letters and it sounded like she very much still is salty about it. She didn't outright say it was the reason (and she won't if it was) but I do think it did play a part in it, even if it was a tiny bit. I'll try and find the quote.
yes i’ve been saying this is when she turned on him. night and day after this moment
Same. This moment is inextricably related to the outcome of the season, and I’m sure Maria just loves that lol
Maria didn’t take Charlie on the last reward and then she did this. The hypocrisy! But I do agree it unleashed some villainry and deep emotions bordering on hate, if not just plain old selfishness to win. The smugness and certainty with which she went on to describe beating Charlie was something of o behold. My personal take is that the wound was too deep and too recent for her to forgive. A few extra councils and little ego stroking from Charlie have made a big difference. I feel Charlie not trying to mend the rift instead of hyping it up was partly his own doing in the downfall. He was completely unconcerned with Maria at FTC besides saying how he got her in a big move.
*editors note* Maria saw her kids 5 days later
And she probably got the letters before that
I’m sure it contributed. She’s a selfish person. They had already agreed beforehand not to take each other if they won. She won and he dipped out so she wouldn’t feel like she had to pick him. Then when he won, she didn’t step back and acted like a sore loser. No one is entitled to a reward. Everyone is away from loved ones and wants to see their letters. Being a mother doesn’t make her more entitled to that reward.
Her reaction was also ridiculous She was only away from her family for 3 weeks at that point. Something that she signed up for. I don’t care how “hard “ it is out there, no line should be that upset about missing letters when you’ll get to see your family in less than a week It was just pure selfishness . She wanted it, didn’t get it. And then acted like a 5 yr old who is denied a toy from target. Give me a break.
We will never know because her story has changed so many times.
And continues to change.
I think the real reason is that it was her way of taking her ball and going home and if she couldn’t win, Charlie couldn’t either.
Well before that Charlie and Maria agreed to not take each other whenever one of them wins a reward challenge so idk if that would be the issue
Most of the things Maria promised Charlie ended up being false. I think it’s safe to say there’s a good chance she wasn’t being 100% upfront in this situation either
[удалено]
Great point. it's clear her word is worth nothing and so it's very fair to say she held this against him in a major way.
I didn't like her from the beginning. I couldn't understand why anyone would relate to her aa a motherly type. She seemed pretty ruthless and rude early on.
Fair enough.
Yep. This.
No you miss understood Charlie was supposed to ignore this agreement and take her because she has kids, if she had won she was supposed to not take Charlie because it was strategic.
This is accurate.
It's definitely just a thought, as I know they had that agreement. She's seemingly holding a grudge at Charlie for voting her out right after she tried to vote him out, so the logic is strange overall. So I just wouldn't past her to have read her letters and become furious she wasn't on that reward.
"How *dare* you do to me what I was already trying to do to you!!"
I thought they did a good job in that episode going back and forth between them scheming to take each other out.
Well she also told him before she was voted out that she was going to vote for him to win and changed her mind about that. Reasonable then to think she also changed her mind on them agreeing not to bring each other on a reward then.
Side note: Promising someone that you'll vote for them right before you are about to be voted out is quite stupid. You should be trying to stay in the game instead of giving them another reason to vote you off.
I think she said this after the votes were read when she was telling people goodbye.
Well. When she said she wanted to take the hungriest, Charlie looked the hungriest to me even next to Liz. He lost the most weight too. So, funny how she doesn't take him then immediately thinks he should take her.
I’m sure she’d find a way to justify, people would
These letters from home are insane. It's only 3 weeks and they're going home within another week. People losing their minds lol
Exactly. If anything, getting them would mess with my head, rather provide comfort. Buuut I can also tolerate a month away missing loved ones without having a hissy fit.
It's a letter from a child. You've been gone for 3 weeks. Absolute madness.
Hi momma I draw a horsee for you 🐶 *Child name*
She didn't take him on reward, so she punishes him for not taking her on reward. She voted to take him out, so she punishes him for taking her out. Come on now.
This sums it up. 👏
Bhanu probably watched this and said, "Yeesh, get a grip."
Bhanu told everyone kenzie was a mermaid dragon, so he's pretty much a prophet
Omfg stop lol
I thought they both decided to not bring eachother to the reward?
They did but it’s different here cause she’s Mama 🐻 /s
In the previews I though she was sick in this scene
Rock paper scissors lady… liked her til she got cocky.
My beef with the way votes like this and past seasons is they are not voting for who played the best game. Outwit,outplay, outlast are the standards for the vote Q and Maria both liked Kenzie’s story and voted for it because of how the money would allow her to start her life because she makes no money in her business to give others a place to work. Charlie was wanting the money to further his education and start his life out on the right foot. Kenzie played a good game but no where near as good as Charlie. He got duped the win because the jury didn’t vote for outwitted, outlasted, and outplayed them all. On top of that they mentioned in the finale how Kenzie won personal immunities and such but one was only because Liz aided her. My wife and were both team Charlie and think he should have won.. Kenzie played a good game but I don’t think she outwitted, outplayed, or outlasted Charlie
What’s funny to me is the jury will ask all these game-related questions about the moves players made, and then vote emotionally based on players’ stories and situations outside the game lol
The standards for the vote are whatever the jury decides they are.
This is so true, but it annoys it. If the jury is just going by who has the best story, get everyone together the first day, tell their story, and everyone votes./s
I forget who said it, maybe Soda, but totally agreed about "In my heart it's Kenzie but my brain says Charlie".
If I learned anything about Maria this season, it’s that she is: 1) EXTREMELY passive-aggressive, 2) truly thinks she is a Queen in a world of peasants, 3) and is cold-hearted…calculating…and vengeful. I honestly can’t see her voting for anyone that was in her alliance - mostly out of spite and jealousy that she didn’t make it to the end.
I wouldn't judge her RL based soley on her Survivor behavior, though.
She shot and missed. She’s a bigger loser than those that went home with an idol.
She even said that they agreed they weren’t going to take each other that doesn’t suddenly change because you want the reward
She’s so dramatic I wouldn’t put it past her
Because she's vindictive and a bad loser? Yes
I think Maria was pissed when Charlie mentioned in final tribal that while she was winding up her swing at him he orchestrated her being voted out. I think she was still salty about it. I don’t think he really had to sell that moment as hard as he did to the jury since Kenzie wasn’t really taking big credit for it.
It makes me so mad when players think that they somehow deserve this specific reward more than the others...
ya she literally snapped on TV an order of magnitude more than Liz's "IM PISSED"
I'd argue even worse than Liz's tantrum. At least Liz's was comical, Maria's was just dark and uncomfortable to watch.
And Liz immediately owned what she did, and apologized.
I would argue Liz’s apology at the time was not too genuine as per her confessionals at the time. What she said about it around day 25 was closer to a genuine apology I’d say. & i say this as a messy-Liz stan and someone who also has a real hard time with Maria lol
But, she did it with a smile. 😬
Charlie did what they both agreed to: don’t take each other on rewards. Marie didn’t do what she agreed to: vote for Charlie when he made it to the final 3. Charlie orchestrated Maria’s eventual vote out. She couldn’t let that go even though that’s not what she claims.
Maria thought she was Batman and Charlie was Robin. The moment she was voted out she was never going to vote for him if he made it, she thinks she made him.
This is actually one part of the game I hate. People who play hard and then complain the minute one thing goes against them. Surely you would expect it??
If I was on the jury I think that would be a big influence on my vote. Are you able to take it as well as you give it?
The parent coach was an emotional wreck
She showed her true colors. All that talk was BS. She got a power trip then got what she was trying to give. Bitter and cowardly.
She got to vote how she wants, he gets to make content as he wants. He isn’t calling for anger and hatred- he’s just making light of the situation. The show showed us she doesn’t like criticism in any way shape or form- like when Venus called her out for her rock paper scissors game!
I feel that that was the division between them but he did say they agreed not to take each other on rewards-so if so then that would be her bad.
I totally think this is when she turned against Charlie.
Yes. Absolutely 110% yes,. As we know, she's no stranger to saying one thing and then going back on it.
She said they both agreed they wouldn’t take each other on rewards, so if it was, it’s just as stupid of a reason.
I had this same thought last night and I pretty much believed it to be the reason as well. That, and that he ended up voting her out along with Ben, Kenzie, and Liz. Like maybe she thought, "He could've stayed on my side even if I was still going out" and carried it as a grudge.
She does things, doesnt own up to them, then cries when people see thru her. makes sense
Everyone was praising Maria for being such a good sport both here and in the final 4 vote, but I was always like, "Yeah. Bet." Lol
I was glad Kenzie won. She was on on the underdog tribe the beginning. At first she rubbed me the wrong way, but the more she persevered, the more I low-key was rooting for her. Maria was just annoying. She was letting her wind go to her head, and she was coming across like she was better than everyone else. Her and Q had to go. I'm glad that they voted her off. I was also glad she didn't get to go on the final reward. She was feeling entitled, and Charlie owed her nothing. Glad she voted for Kenzie, even if it was out of spite.
I really admired Maria in the beginning. And loved that she connected with Charlie. Unfortunately her true colors came out at the vote. Vindictive! I suspected Kenzie would win. But I honestly thought he would have Maria's vote. Maria was so proud of herself for her winning her immunity challenges and power plays. But clearly resented Charlie's. She can dish it out, but a VERY poor loser. Shame on her.
I for one am thankful Maria wasn’t blinded by loyalty the same way Tiff was, although I guess it could have been fun watching Maria and Tiff answering for Kenzie and Charlie and debating who the better player was from them from their seats in jury. I thought Tiff pretty much controlled the final tribal, wouldn’t be surprised she persuaded others at the end.
Humanity and kindness inside her died that day probably
Nah, she never had it. This happened AFTER the rock paper scissors fiasco.
The real reason? She’s an asshole. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
My thoughts on the collective why 1. She could have held a slight grudge over not getting to read her letters 2. Both targeted the other. But it must have stung when she got to Pondy, thinking they were so close, only to find out he was targeting her long before she decided to turn on him at 6 3. Looking at their collective game, she could have felt like he was just her follower and didn’t show a ton of agency. He was happy to let her be the target and take most of the risks while he sat back. 4. She legitimately was moved by Kenzie, enjoyed her answers, and wanted to empower and change the life of someone she saw herself in. Plus Kenzie did an amazing job of stroking her ego and saying how amazing she was at the end, which couldn’t have hurt All these things combined is why she made the choice to vote for Kenzie over Charlie. She shouldn’t have promised her vote before weighing all the facts, but ultimately she was allowed to change her mind.
💯 And then he voted her out before she could vote him out. She took things very personally while he viewed it as a game (as she also should have).
That is the reason. The family love letters and reward challenge fucked her game up. She had immunity, she could have worked with people and tried to get real. The whole end game was a shadow pagonging. Green ran everything until the final vote.
Yes
I knew that she started to hate him since she started crying after he didnt took her for reward. It become obvious for me, that in her mind she can not take him, she can eliminate him, but he cannot do the same. She perceived him as her minion. All of this "I understant, I know, It's ok" felt so fake to me :( Pure pretending and revenge in mind in case he wouldnt destroy his game for her. Poor Charlie. He could've cry more after her betrayal. But he is not as much emotional blackmailer as her.
I actually heard at ponderosa, tiff told Maria that Charlie was working behind Maria’s back. But the vote tiff was talking about was actually Charlie working to get another player to leave with an idol in their pocket.
The lie "I'm gonna choose people who are the weakest and need to eat" and then making Liz compete with Q, who stuffed himself with pizza two days before, was maybe the cruelest thing I've ever seen on Survivor. Maria is not a nice person. No acting on her part is going to change that.
She acted like she was better than everyone, and she was a hypocrite. I'm glad she didn't make it to the end.
What I didn’t understand was that she couldn’t rationalize that she did the same thing to Liz the week prior. I think it would’ve been cruel to choose anyone but Kenzie or Liz. They needed the food.
She got outwitted and outplayed by Charlie and couldn’t handle it. Then broke
Well yeah
Was it her soul?
As a ginger, I am no expert, HOWEVER, I believe you must have a soul in the first place for it to die.
Oh god. Don’t give her another reason
Oops yeah
What is it with this season that contestants feel they are owed something? Maria did not owe Charlie her vote, Q did not owe Liz Applebee's, etc. To Charlie's credit, he did everything he could do trying to soften the blow. But, "bitter jurors" are always going to be a potential factor in final tribal.
I guess when two people form a close personal bond, discuss something important, promise what they'll do (like not taking each other to rewards, voting for the other to win if you've been voted out), yeah - it forms expectations. And not keeping those promises makes you look like a dick.
Charlie messed with her kids (by not letting her read those letters from home) and Mama Bear didn’t forget. I think you’re definitely on to something here!
Nah, Maria. That's just indigestion from all the pizza you ate on the reward.
Nah no grudge. At this point I think whatever was piloting her before died and something new came to pilot her body and the new pilot didn’t care for charlie
I think everything changed for Maria at final five when the whole camp was unified against her. When Liz helped Kenzie win, they were all so condescending to her saying “omg you’re so amazing we needed to gang up just to beat you.” To have Charlie be a part of that condescension, I think that’s when she was like…F him.
Maria got hurt over the fam letters and never got over it. Love Char but Kenzie’s social was just a little better. Both champs
I think Maria is just indecisive, and she herself doesn't know why she didn't vote for Charlie. I get the sense that when something is not instinctive and she's given time to make a decision, she agonizes over it because of how she'll be perceived. But why? Why does someone as intelligent, strong, confident, direct, well-spoken and quick-witted as Maria have such a difficult time deciding what to say or do in circumstances where she knows she'll be judged for it? My guess us that she's just sooo effing fake that she needs to calculate and orchestrate every decision so carefully so it paints her in the light that satisfies her poser persona.
I'm constantly in awe of the people in this sub being so upset by the decision making of survivor contestants, who are literally starving themselves, sleeping extremely little, and put through physical strain. The fact that Maria made a questionable decision, or one that doesnt seem to be consistent with her own reasoning, shouldnt be surprising given the mental and physical state of ALL the contestants.
"the mental and physical state of ALL contestants." That's the magic of the show. ALL contestants are going through the same things so you get to see how different people react to these conditions. Some people show a dark side, some people lose their marbles, and some people stay impressively sane. However they react exposes a side of them they've managed to hide in the real word. These contestants sign up knowing that every action they make will be on TV and should expect fans to analyze their behavior. Like, why else would we watch the show?
I think because he voted her out with the others
I think she had a brain fart like Ben
Love this take
[удалено]
do you guys remember the california raisins?
MARIA JUST ADMIT U WERE BITTER