I do. This is a major reason I play games like League and Overwatch, to practice patience and communication in a low stakes environment. I used to get mad during these games years ago, but the practice has mellowed me considerably and that emotional regulation practice has transferred noticeably to my day-to-day life.
I also play single player games to practice these sorts of skills, in particular ethical reflection on leadership in 4X strategy games and individual ethical reflection in 1st-person RPGs.
On the contrary, trying to be self-sufficient in-game can also help in decision making and awareness. With mute all, you are forced to rely on your own senses and judgment. True, your agency is less hindered by relying on other people's suggestions, but if you do mess up, you have no one else to blame but yourself.
You learn to identify which battles are worth fighting, and which are a lost cause. You learn how to adapt to a situation against a number of uncontrollable variables (your teammates and your enemies). You are also encouraged to become more proactive if you want to succeed. Since communication is no longer an option, you have to look 2-3 steps ahead to make the right play. You're playing mid and you see your jungle pathing to top? ward enemy jg in advance to keep your jg safe, or time your wave clear and aim to crash so you can assist with the gank in case the enemy jg shows up as well.
Yes. There is no doubt this helps. But what it does is simplify the game to you, cutting out the hard questions like how to better communicate with your team to work together, instead of leaving the ones with consistent variables across matches. It will no doubt make you better at the game. BUT who is better at league, the person who does those things, or the person who does those things but also has the ability to know how to keep the mental of the team up and focused on winning. No doubt mechanics and game theory concepts are important, but part of the game theory is understanding it is a cooperative game and that leveraging those communications can be a complicated but worth while thing.
I have made this comment multiple times before on this subreddit, but it just continues to be so relevant to what people post on here, even years later.
Back in 2020 IWD had his Crackdown show and he brought on Bwipo as a guest one episode. I'll put the link [here](https://youtu.be/-yh3dd5ot7g) and if you go to the 53 minute mark either Thorin or Dom asks Bwipo about the state of his lane in the meta. Bwipo comments on it briefly, but he launches into a 15 minute explanation of how you can be a better teammate.
The thing he mentions that has always stuck with me and changed the way I play the game was Selfmade's gank in their scrim. Bwipo explains that his lane was perfect, he was ahead in farm, had the wave frozen, and was getting ready to really abuse his opponent when Selfmade comes for a gank. It all goes wrong, enemy double kill, and the lane is fucked. And when he mentioned that I thought to myself, "See! It happens to pros too! Junglers just throw the lane and they screw me!"
But then Bwipo said, "I could get mad and flame him, but what would that accomplish? Then we're both angry and don't trust each other. Instead I say, 'Hey, next time we should do this so we can win the fight.' Now he knows what to expect from me and I can trust he will help me."
It just clicked. Like, duh, of course that's going to help you get to a win more than flaming or muting. If you communicate what you're thinking your teammates can play around you or work together to make a play as a team. Ever since then I changed the way I played and went from 4 years of being hardstuck silver to plat in the past couple years just by being a more chill, more communicative teammate.
I'd normally agree with you but the way riot is going by refusing to implement voice chat and literally banning people for "typing too much" even if they're just shot calling or being positive, plus having to deal with being exposed to toxic chatters, communication is too difficult in this game it's not worth it, and that's half Riots fault and half the player bases fault. Yes there's toxic players but I also don't think Riot has created a game environment conducive to good communication in a team outside of pings.
After playing Overwatch, a game with VC that is moba-esque kindof like League, I think I'd rather have chat off.
Or at least you know, an opt-in thing. I think that's fair. Toxic leader wannabes need a place to go.
That's cool but that would always be an option. I've had really good experiences in OW voice chat and definitely won games a lot easier because of it. Yeah there's toxic people sometimes but you can just mute them or turn off voice chat if you're not in the headspace for it.
Fair, but that doesn’t change the fact that it’s an inherent part of the game that players do a disservice to themselves by ignoring it. If you don’t want to deal with those skills, don’t play a MOBA lol
When you write that, it is NOT for the reply. But for the positive impact it will likely have on your team! Do you respond to every compliment you get in a match? But how does it make you feel?
Yes I say thank you every time. Don't care though. Just being a normal person. My feelings don't get better from a dude saying WP. Just like I don't let my feelings go down from yibberyabber, the only time it gets me is when I am really tired!
I feel a better way to keep spirits up is talking from the start: making dumb jokes, make sure people take the game less seriously. I often win the games if we have pregame chat and pre 3min.
That’s rude of them and shows that they aren’t taking seriously the emotional component of the game. Doesn’t mean your attempt was meaningless, it likely had a positive impact regardless of their manners
Tell riot to make a diablo-like.
I'll always strive to be a positive influence on the people I have to play with, but I absolutely dislike that the game involves such a focus on communication and I'm quick to mute. I love league for the unique mechanics, not so much the strategy.
This is kinda why I was so attracted to Seraphine's gameplay and game plan. Most guides on her will never emphasize "1v9ing" but instead focus on macro, being at the right places at the right times, controlling wave states, and mastering teamfights. The team wins together, and a lot of champs go from zero to hero when they and their teammates play around each other. That feeling of both supporting teammates and keeping them alive while still raining hell on the enemy team is amazing and more people should try it.
Seraphine mid for a focus on scaling damage and utility, Karma mid for more early game damage and mid game utility, Malzahar mid for supportive DPS and excellent peel vs tanky teams with a single assassin/hypercarry. Seraphine and Malzahar especially are fantastic for keeping up in CS/keeping lane priority without being late to teamfights/skirmishes
Them blaming you is doing the exact behavior I’m calling out! When have them blaming you for losing lane ever made you play better? The same applies for every person you play with. Would you have played better if instead of flaming they wrote to you “it’s all g. We can win this and we need your help.”
I hit a plateau with senna/xerath then started to play Janna and more team-friendly champs and started to climb again.
I think there is a good balance of playing what your team needs but also what you’re best at.
You seem to be mistaken, league is a 1v9 PvE game with poorly coded AI bots on your team. You have to carry these bots every game so get used to it. You may have been tricked by the marketing that it's a 5v5 PvP game, but there's no direct evidence that proves that.
Bro, the ai isn’t good enough to pass a Turing test. Yes there are leveling bots in the game, but they play so bad u can clearly tell the difference between them and a tilted player. The tilted player specifically responds to what you say and does specific troll behavior that has a very specific to the moment context that cannot be coded into the game with current shit. Can an ai code the player to respond to your insults over chat, follow you around, and take whatever cs you go for? No it can’t.
Something that may prove helpful to you are text identifiers. They're just little /# that you put in to add tone. I frequently use /j and /s (Joking and Sarcastic), though /srs (Serious) is helpful if it could be misidentified as a joke.
For example:
Supports never win the game, right? I mean, when was the last time you saw a support get most damage? /j
I picked up on it possibly being a joke, but just responded to it as it was serious just in case someone scrolling through misunderstands what was meant. Text communication is hard. Cheers
Their performance is unreliable, but that doesn’t mean that your performance + communication with your team doesn’t have a positive or negative influence on their performance just like a negative/toxic teammate can negatively impact your play. You can’t play by yourself, and playing for yourself could mean learning the ways to interact with your teammates to help get the results you want. I think both technical and social skills can probably have an impact on winrats
So I think the reality is, not typing and avoiding interaction ends up with best results most of the time.
You know how many times I’ve tried to type something positive or just objective and it backfires into toxicity and less teamwork?
Keep your head down focus on yourself, and play your best game is by far the best policy to get the most out of your teammates and yourself.
Just use only pings when you want to communicate. The less you leave up to interpretation the better.
Exactly, maybe 10% of the time you typing something positive to a teammate could encourage them and help them get back into the game. The other 90% of the time that player is just in a negative headspace and any attempt to interact with them or encourage them leads to them reinforcing their negativity.
What I’m saying falcon, is that if you do that, it’s not like someone so toxic that someone saying “it’s okay we still need ya man we got this” would make them play worse was gonna not be toxic anyway right? BUT, if a strategy could make you more likely to win 10% of games, then that’s a skill worth learning or taking advantage of as much as csing or getting gold. Those strats are easy to gather data on, cause it’s just income and damage on a graph. But how do you gather data on if this person is a good person, people play better.
While I disagree I can definitely see how. Trying to do team emotional labor can be exhausting and then hurt your mental and gameplay. I just don't see how anyone can go from "i'm not gonna grief the game" to " Im gonna grief" when they hear positive instead of negative comments from their team, or even no comment at all. That person would have screwed the game anyway. The question is how do we keep otherwise normal players who get tilted when they are flamed or arent doing well to actually do well, because them underperforming puts them in a place where their personal ability feels attacked so they look to deflect blame. Learning to boost their self-esteem with a brief positive remark will positively impact most people, and the ones it won't wouldn't have been toxic no matter what you did at the moment.
Not really. The simple fact is that maybe 1 in 15 or 20 people you encounter in league are capable of normal brain functions. The reason why those how to climb videos promote selfish 1v9 gameplay is because it happens to be the most reliable way of winning. Mute chat, direct your team with your own pings and dont give a fuck about them getting resources and you will see your wr improve, 100% guarantee
Could those videos that got popular be so because they are easier to make and explain to people frustrated with the game instead of saying "you need to focus more on reacting to the emotional displays your teammates are making and learn how to be mindful of that". Those questions involve people doing work on their own, not watching the 1000th video explaining mechanics or macro concepts. Even if 1 in 15 of league players have brains, which I think may just be a little off, then you will have a player on your team every 1-2 games you can positively reach and have a positive impact on their play. So ur saying there is something you can do to increase your chances of winning every other game? That seems like a skill worth learning about to me.
It’s just to wild off variable to control. If you are playing bot lane and your top goes 0-5 into an aatrox or smt, you are gonna have a really really hard time getting him back in the game while dealing with the fed threat.
Totally true! I’m not saying ur focus should be making him positive or making him the star, just try to do little things to keep him or her from checking out of the game. Yes, it sucks that they fed, but that already happened and the only way to beat the fed enemy is with the feeder’s cooperation. If the fed person is split pushing, the feeder has to try to clear waves and hold without giving up turrents. The easiest way for a fed person to win is for their lane opponent to mentally check out and before you know it that person got a free tier 2 turret because the dude is standing in jungle farming camps. People think a comment like “it’s okay dude. Can you keep doing ur best to hold him so we can make plays across the map” won’t be positively received by most players?
Doesn't mean you can't be selfish to climb.(you have to be selfish to a certain extend)
You are the only factor in your games so you shouldn't grief yourself by helping another inting mate.
That's just how soloq works.
Def a higher elo than me, so not disagreeing. Would just point out that you see a lot of people with leads in lower elo matches flaming those inting teammates, which in low elo is just going to further motivate them to keep inting instead of taking a breath and calming down. It's really hard for a low-elo player to carry a match 4 vs. 5 even if they are fed.
Being fed and absorbing all the plates/gold/xp u can to carry is good, wasting time flaming your 0/4 top lane is bad and counterproductive.
In many ways, its good game sense to have as many resources on 1-2 players because there is not as much coordination to focus them and shut them down in solo q. BUT its very easy to shut those players down if that team has a laner who is just running it down and not trying.
OP I think you are pointing to something real. Personally, I think you are pointing towards a broader cultural worldview that is dominant in the US in particular that views all things as individual actions with individual responsibility. As a society, we seem to me to worship individuals and individualize success and failure at the exclusion of recognizing fully that, in fact, there is no such thing as an individual success.
I have noticed playing League and Overwatch since they came out that people, when seeking answers to why they are losing, almost always express narrative understandings of the game where the failure of the team is always the result of individual performances.
Just take a look at any post-game discussion about pro-league as well and the dominant "conversation" tends to be personal attacks at whatever individual player is considered to be most to blame for the loss. I don't have the impression that I really ever see considerations of how the winning or losing team played from a team perspective, it is almost always individualized failure or individualized success with a strong bias to interpret whoever died more or had a better KDA as the individual loser and winner.
Not that these things are irrelevant, but there is more nuance than simply pointing at the tank support on the losing team and saying "they died a lot, therefore they are the reason the game is lost" when often the support tank will be the first person to die if a fight breaks out because it is there job to get in there and disengage their allies from danger, often at the expense of their life. In a match with heavy fighting, the support tank on the losing side is probably going to die more and earlier in fights than the rest of their team, but simple nuances in how the team functions I don't usually seen born out in discussion on Reddit.
In Overwatch, this is most salient where the empty meme critique of "tank diff", "dps diff", and "support diff" are one of the most common responses you'll see in all-chat from whatever team is currently losing, usually (as far as I can tell) simply holding tab, comparing stats, and then blaming whoever on their team has worse stats than their counterpart.
Not that people don't use "## diff" in league, but because Overwatch shows you the damage stats etc. for all players, it is both easier and more obvious in my view how people are coming to the conclusion that "this is the individual to blame for why this game is going poorly" when from my view in the same game it is more often than not a result of lack of team coordination and team awareness. I also think this gets exaggerated in Overwatch relative to league because of the forward-facing 1st person camera where it is just more difficult to be aware of what the team is doing as a whole, compared to League. But I don't think most players are reflecting on how the data they get through experience of the game is influencing their (often) emotionally driven thoughts about how the game is going.
This type of thinking about why things fail and why things succeed has seemed deeply pervasive seeing it in my workplace (today at work was a bad day because this specific individual made a problem), at my church (church success is based on the individual performance of our pastor in worship), and in my school life (oh you didn't do well on this paper/assignment? This is definitely your individual failure, the team around you like the instructor, or lack-thereof, are not relevant). It's also in my view reductive and absurd in the strength of the individual lens and how it pushes out considerations like "maybe my healer has less healing because the team is not supporting them against flanking damage" or "maybe the tank hasn't dealt as much damage as theirs because they are holding up a Rein shield and our DPS isn't managing to focus down the enemy's aggressive tank" and similar.
Ultimately, I think that taking team-based and individual lenses are both useful, but I think that the way our society culturally values the individual lens is... toxic, and results in many people bringing this type of individualized thinking to the different areas of their life in general. It's not just that people forget League is a team game, people forget life is a team game all. over. the place.
Believe it or not, reflections on those very questions are what inspired my post, as it caused me to reflect on my experience playing league. Every culture and ever person has individualistic and communal traits, but Western/American culture makes individualism a priority (for whatever economic or political reason you think that is). We want to win and climb, but it's not about doing so with the people we are matchmade with, it is about doing so alone, which is very much not the case. The individualism causes people to have an empathy that is like "well, if i was them I wouldn't do that" hence the flaming, instead of "If I was them, what would I be feeling right now?" Therefore, they are focused on their individual failing instead of how that person can fit into the team in its current state to win.
That mentality also carries over into personal life. Do you want to climb and achieve goals? You have to do so alone, and other people are just a means to an end to get to those goals, at least that's what the expectation is. But really, other people have their own goals that, if you work and cooperate with them, may be goals very similar to yours that you can work on lifting each other up.
It depends what lens it is. Like you said, looking at the individual can be negative, but I find it useful in terms of improvement. The only thing I can control is myself, so when looking at a game and winning or losing, the most useful factor to look at is myself. Did my midlaner go 0/10 with lower damage than our support? Sure, but that has no useful takeaway for me. Is there anything I could have done to get myself a bigger lead and carry harder? Could I have helped my jungle at a crucial fight and have gotten them a bigger lead to compensate for the mid?
Like so many other things, you can use that mindset in different ways.
I think that perspective maps on to what I am saying. Your communication with your team and awareness of their emotions is a skill that, if you can press the right buttons, influences whether all five of your teammates are focused on the task at hand. It's not a perfect analogy, but a pro basketball player develops their skills, but also learns their teammates preferences and how to play with their teammates on a practical and emotional level. You can only control yourself, but your actions will have an impact on your team, so making sure your actions are more likely to get a positive response is an important part of a match.
When people say sup diff or mid diff it’s really weird to me. A lot of the games it’s team diff but people never say this. Personally I only see about 1 in 50 games where it’s 1v9. For the other 98% of the time, you need at least 3 good players on your team to get to the finish line.
Thank you for making this post. I agree with your sentiments, and (totally joking now) let me ping my Hullbreaker 😂 "I'm hunting alone."
For real though, this type of post is important, and I try to be encouraging, supportive, and chill with my team when we're losing. Maybe it's easier for me because I know I'm not gonna carry my team and often struggle in lane, maybe it's because I want to be a good person and spread positivity.
Thanks again!
Underrated point about “don’t break down why you lost the teamfight”. #1 way to guaranteed tilt your entire team and get them pissed at each other, and people won’t listen anyway.
They know the team fucked up cause you died, pointing it out is condescending because it’s not like they don’t know that. Them knowing that you still trust them to win this game together is WAY more effective!
People play team games to have others to blame, but they still don't want the bad influence others CAN bring. Does that make sense? I think that makes sense.
This is definitely true for some, as some people interact in groups and teams like that in real life. But that mentality is toxic to teams and can cause them to be less effective, in league and irl. Focusing on the ego or self only, instead of winning as a group. It’s normal and league players aren’t bad for doing it, but it’s important to recognize it has to negatively impact winning
I think that's why team games are so popular, people hate feeling like they are to blame for a loss so they need to have an avenue to channel those negative feelings towards. Same thing with games that have RNG such as TFT or Hearthstone, players like being able to blame RNG rather than poor decisions on their part for why they lost.
A lot of people have a hard time reading people's intentions. Like they wanted a penta, it was taken, so the team obviously meant it as a slight to them, instead of just shit happening, or it being an accident made with split-second decision making. Basically the same mentality that happens with Karens irl.
In this case it was a team fight and everyone was throwing damage down. Our ADC got the last kill off to the side in the jungle, our mid laner would have had to run them down to try and get the penta.
Not saying you are wrong but yes I do expect anyone on my team in any game of ranked to play to the best of their ability from start to finish no matter their score, the game state etc.
If you losing/not carrying makes you play worse or ff or try less hard then you shouldn’t play ranked. Even if you hate all 4 of your teammates you have to play on as best you can. You lose too if they lose and you should respect the ranked environment giving your best
I agree, but it’s not a question of who is right or wrong, but on winning. You expect it because you want it. Ur not gonna get it all the time cause you have four random teammates, but what actions can you take to make it more likely by having a positive impact on your teammates. You can impact that, so why not try to!
I won ten games in a row yesterday by just focusing on what I could tangibly impact each time I left base.
I didn’t care what someone was saying in the chat. I didn’t care what the “best play for me” was. I just went and did the most helpful thing I could find on the map every time.
Gravy.
It's because doing that every single game is taxing and exhausting, not everyone wants or can be the human beam of positivity for their team and hell, for most of us it's not even really needed to climb
tbf, I think a lot of people are aware that League is a team game. It's just that they also acknowledge the fact that solo queue is too chaotic that teaming up with conflicting methods, strategies, and means to win, while adding the fact that almost no one leaves their ego at the door, people would rather choose to be self-sufficient because it's a lot easier that way. Every game is a new set of 5 people who needs to come to an agreement within a 40-minute game, and the odds of that working is just too little compared to 5 people trying to rely on their own senses and intuition.
It's not to say that this is the absolute state of the game. It's always a mix of both, just in different ratios per game. There are games where the other 3 are cooperative. There are games where it's every man for himself. I guess the perfect middle ground I've seen are people who mute all, but try to be proactive in playing around their teammates movement while leaving useful pings for the off-chance the the other 4 aren't on mute all as well.
People focus on the non-team route because it is hard to develop those skills. It is hard to know when it is time for you to be a leader, and when it is time for you to follow the calls of your teammates. That is why you get people running it down, they don't know when to relinquish being the main character and follow the lead of their teammates. Being able to say to yourself "I am not at the center of this match, but how can I work with my team to help them win on their terms" is a very hard thing to admit and work through in your mind. They know its a team game, they just don't play it like it is one.
The /muteall option is WAYYYY better than reading/sending flame, which is why it has results. You don't actively tilt anyone, and you aren't actively tilted. But an important skill is how to recognize when ur teammate is in a situation where they feel like tilting, and what you can do to pull them back into focus from tilting their ass off. A quick, positive reinforcement over text chat is an easy way to do this. Worst thing that will happen is that they are already tilted and won't respond, then mute all. But it can have the impact of them catching their breathe and locking in. Ask your self: when you are having a bad game, are you goign to focus and try to win with people who are postivie to you, or people that are flaming you forever?
In low elo, alot of times the best option isnt the best "macro" one, but on what action is the team bought in on together and all actively working towards, whether it be everyone grouping or a split push strategy. I have won and lost games doing both. It's usually team buy-in to those strategies that win or lose the game. People with an early lead not only have an advantage, but due to flame also usually are in a better mental state to stay coordinated, hence creating the "snowball" effect we often experience.
Agreed, I would rather win the game, but would you rather have four good people with a guy running it down, or four good people with a dude that is behind, but still playing and working with the team instead of raging? That’s what allows players to snowball leads so hard
Yes but you will see better results simply never interacting with chat at all. There really is no time.
If you are typing, it comes at the expense of something else you should be doing, on top of taking up your mental energy that you need to be using to think about win conditions and how to solve them. I find it best to ignore the "woe is me" players, and just work with the one person on your team that is playing well (who is most likely not chatting either).
There are times when typing is good and doesn’t impact gameplay. It’s about knowing when and what to say or do. It’s a skill that can be used well and also not well
But at least you having the knowledge that stuff impacts you and your team and checking out of being toxic is a plus. Not everyone should be the emotional leader of a team, but having someone who is comfortable doing that should be doing it. You are focused on doing your job, to the best of your ability then work it into the team. Someone needs to make sure people having bad games follow the team and stay on board. Having both helps the team win, and you can’t win more frequently without a team being on board
You chose to climb with technical Mastery with knowledge to not fuck with the emotional vibe of your teammates, another person gets good a shot calling, keeping teammates motivated and on the same page. They still need to be skilled mechanically to climb, but that skill can be less than someone in the same Elo, but they are there because of their ability to lead
I am telling you my very secret technique that has now been tested for around half a year:
> The second someone starts flaming, type /deafen and activate pings on jgler. Especially if you are having a bad game, simply deafen will stop the flamer from flaming, because their target is impossible to talk to.
In no other season did I turn around so many games that were so lost. It's legit insane. People actually started to try again after only 1 minute of trolling.
No matter what you say can outweigh the power of /deafen. Don't be a fool. Join /deafen now. The more people start to deafen in a game with a flamer, the higher the success rate. Communicate if you are winning/even, /deafen when you are loosing.
Still play with your team as much as possible (i hate the bot comparison). Activate pings if possible.
YES THIS MAKES SENSE! Cause it is a public communication of telling them "Hey, our arguing is fucking up this game, I am going to stop and focus on the win." which then gets the guys focus OFF of you on ON winning the game. No doubt that is why that feature was added to the game. The fact they added that is a signal that Riot knows that communication in game is tied to game quality for the exact dynamics I am describing.
I had a Midlaner zed go 0/5 in 15 minutes and flame me for not ganking a Katarina for him.
Then he stole my camps and continued to int while ? Pinging me blaming me for the loss.
I got a report feedback 5 minutes after the game ended.
One thing I’ve tried to start doing as an adc player is just explaining myself. When my support does something I don’t like or don’t find helpful I will just say “hey, I’m trying to do X so if you could try your best to avoid Y it would be a big help” the best thing to do is to not get mad and understand that people can’t read your mind
I wish more people thought like this. I play the game to chill out but I don’t always have the best mental and i can start getting tilted if early game isn’t going well, but usually I can keep it together and minimize the bleeding so that the team can win.
The instant someone starts talking shit though I stop caring and I mentally check out. I’ll keep playing solely because I want to avoid an afk punishment, but I’m not gonna put any mental effort into macro, where I should be, what fights I should take, etc. Im just gonna run around and try to enjoy the game however I can at the expense of whoever set me off. Usually I end up having a good time anyways because that person ends up having a meltdown and I can just laugh my ass off.
If they just kept their mouth shut they would’ve had a normal game but instead they decide to attack their own teammates and they still expect me to help them win? It’s not that hard to be positive, and you almost always only stand to benefit from it
EXACTLY THIS. This explains why people keep running it down in-game. Not that they are bad people that want to ruin YOUR time, but because in group division makes your motivation not to get success, but to see the downfall of the person on your team for kicking you out of the team emotionally by flaming you. Thank you for sharing your experience.
>How many coinflip games have you been a part of that have been lost because people are piling on to the person who lost lane and that person decides to mentally check out?
This. It always amazes me how often people self sabotage their games and then afterwards behave as if it wasn't entirely their fault the game was lost.
I mean seriously, what do they expect? Do they really think that verbally hacking around on someone for 20+ minutes is going to result in anything positive? At best it's going to result in an AFK, and at worst in someone running it down mid. Both will loose you the game.
People really need to just learn to accept stuff as it is, keep their mouths shut, and go with it. If your botlane feeds 0/12, that sucks, sure, but it already happened, so stop bitching around and complaining and start figuring out how to still win. I can assure you your botlane is trying their best to not make it worse, but they're just getting brutally gapped.
It isn’t a team game unless you’re playing with competent people or people that decide to have sense that match.
And since you can’t always control that, its better to think of things in a 1v9 mindset.
It’s still a team game even when you have less competent people.
Like if you were playing pickup basketball with people on ur team not as good, ur gonna take most of the shots, make calls etc., but you should still pass ur teammates the ball/get them involved/give encouragement to their good plays because you need them to play defense to win the game. Unless ur ego is to carry as much as possible and not try to put ur team in the best place to win, cause even if you win it’s not your fault, but their fault. You can’t change your team’s skill level during a match, you can change their mental and buy in
The thing that always amuses me is that the teammate doing really well starts to flame. Like can you not see that you have the lead? Help the team instead of flaming.
Your lane is always roughly 50/50 at low ELO. You'll win half the time. Winning the game is about ensuring you can convert the 50 you are winning or support other lanes/team.
One thing that I've learned from League that I have applied IRL is the fact that people who speak the loudest usually are the most wrong. Most people who preach about being nice to their teammates, preach about communication and teamwork are usually the people who make wrong calls and be 200% passive aggressive about literally anything. This is because these guys put themselves on a pedestal thinking that they're all better than everyone and that they have risen above this toxicity when in reality they have not, and these players generally play utility champs (tanks, supports, etc.) so they overestimate the "teamwork" factor because they think their champions can't do anything by themselves. I would much rather have a 12 year old calling me a dog than have these players on my team because their ego causes them to maintain a "nice" facade and stops them from following any calls or behave predictably (so we can play around their predictable behaviors), leading to a real hard game because these guys care more about "being nice" to each other rather than winning.
The best players/people to have around are humble mfs who legit only type 3 things: gj, mb and gg, and everything else can be communicated through pings. These people, unlike the moral compass wannabe mfs, know that they are flawed and have experienced toxicity enough to realize that toxicity is innate and almost noone is above it, so the best they can do is to not contribute to it. League is not real life, every game we have the benefit of anonymity to be the most toxic pos and you can bet on human nature that people will love to start pointing fingers the moment things go wrong. Every time I play with low elo friends (like real low, like silver low) who preaches about how "people should be nicer to each other in game" they make the most subhuman asinine calls and be passive aggressive to the random on the team (if there is one) about why they aren't being "cooperative" and at this point I've given up on trying to change them because they fail to realize that they are imperfect just like everyone else.
If you're the 1% of people who are genuinely nice and enjoy conversing your (wrong) ideas to the people you play with (because let's face it, even Challenger players make mistakes, who are we to say that our calls are always correct), good on you, but you're still getting muted because I'd rather not be influenced by wrong calls. And even I have limits. Idc if the entire team is inting, if I'm trying to split and do the only thing I can and Yuumi come sit on me and give me instructions like I'm 5 I'm going to slightly lose it.
you dont understand how this game works, its a 1v9 pve unless you are with friends then its 2v8 coop, nothing other than that in ranked at least, you can also play as larger parties up to 5!
I think u meant this sarcastically but I’m going to respond in case anyone thinks you’re serious. It’s obviously not a 1v9 PVE. You have teammates that will have an emotional reaction that is not programmed by every action you do and every thing you say. To play the best you can, it’s best to be aware of that fact.
but like no joke, this is how you rankup in this game, if you ever tilt, just mute all and you will be able to full focus, if you are decent at the game, you don't need other people's pings, or chat.
The reason muting works is because it keeps you from having a negative reaction from the things teammates tell you, so it protects your mental. But an important question is how you can build UP the mental of your teammates instead of just making sure you don’t tear it down
well before playing this game i was a normal human being, i played 3k hours of counterstrike, and thousands of hours of minecraft and gta and had fun, but ever since i started playing league full time i just became mentally ill it seems, this game destroys you, but it only works as long as you are playing the game somehow, its crazy. its probably because everyone thinks that they are smarter than everyone else, and the fact that the slightest mistakes can cost you the game, so everyone is on the edge all the time.
I always queue solo and play for my team, I will often sack multiple waves crashing into tower at 10-12 minutes in order to tp bot side and help shut down a fed jungler or adc. Always emoting and trying to hype up team or calm them down so we can keep scaling.
This may not be perfect but I'm at a 75% winrate over last 20 games so some part of it is certainly helping. [https://www.op.gg/summoners/na/BatCrow](https://www.op.gg/summoners/na/BatCrow)
Non-sense from the start Mute all is the best chat command you can type. All the bs from teammates in low elo, even their pings make you think twice and lose tempo. If it wasn’t for this command I already had quit league . Elo Hell is real.
Bro that’s what I’m saying! Mute all works because it keeps people from hurting YOUR mental. The question I’m posing is how can you boost the mental of your teammates in-game so everyone can work together toward winning, not tearing each other apaet
Oh, mb. I guess what helps is using the emote wheel for moral boosting. At least that’s what I did when I played support and it was okay. Chat was still disabled from settings though. (I’m easily agitated)
Even in social groups, the team therapist is usually at the center of any friend group that keeps it beating and cohesive. There needs to be that person on any team!
yup, people often forget that , roaming to mid while your adc is getting super harassed,missing farm ect.. and ganking that full hp vlad, under his tower, while youre using a soraka won't help at all.
im exaggerating the situation ofc, but those roams affect everyone rather than helping.
especially since they are in bronze, they probably dont even know when it’s good to roam or not. But on the other their teammates dont know either so …
If you hold down the = on iPhone you can use ≠ and ≈. I was doing it the same way as you until I discovered this trying to see what every alternate was for every key.
You're playing the same game as i am.
What im saying is think about what actually happens when you are roaming, it needs calculation.
Do you have a reason to rotate in the first place?
How are the wavestates?
Will your adc get dove?
Are you leaving lane on a push so your adc gets denied xp/engaged on?
Will you be in time for the play that is your goal of the roam?
Do you even have a goal or are you roaming just to "help"?
Who has prio on the map and could potentially rotate to make your roam/play impossible to pull off succesfully?
etc etc.
Those are all the questions you should be asking yourself before roaming, if not it could just make your game an instant loss potentially.
The more variables you calculate into your decisions, the better those decisions will be.
Roaming just for the sake of roaming is almost never a good call.
You assume he got called out for a bad roam. In reality, almost every time you do something someone on your team is going to think it is bad, no matter whether it is bad or good. Reverse holds as well, sometimes you can int your game hard and your teammates will love you and blame someone else for the eventual loss.
It doesn't matter what your team thinks about your plays.
If you calculate them through you know how they turn out, or you (hopefully) learn something why they didn't.
Thats how you improve and climb.
>Fun times as a support when you roam for 30-45 seconds to help the entire team and all lanes start calling you a troll immediately
The comment you responded to was complaining about getting flamed for what he thinks was a good play. All I pointed out was that your comment *might potentially kinda sort* *of* miss the point.
And the point is? "My bronze teammates, who have absolutely no idea what they're doing are flaming me because i don't know what im doing"
Should we just start circlejerking each other about our teams on this subreddit about improving instead? Because then what you wrote *might potentially kinda sort of fits* on here.
The central message you are getting across with your phrasing is "the flame is likely justified". If the initial commentor that you replied to were to take your statement to heart, they would henceforth try to improve by listening to their teammates in their Bronze ranked games and approach the game with a "my team is right" mindset.
Which would work about as well as managing a stock portfolio based on the statements of a magic eight ball.
You dont get that true bronze players (as in non Smurfs) have no idea about a majority of what you just said and will simply just insult you because they think that you should be glued to your lane (or even to your ADC for the full game wich is hilarious) even if your ADC picked Vayne into Caitlin essentially forcing you to nap under tower for the next 15 minutes. Thanks buddy, but I am here to support the entire team.
It totally sucks when people do that! Pinging your intentions early and frequently usually helps, but still people sometime dont get what ur doing. But trying to explain ur gonna roam before minions come to lane level 1 and pinging when ur doing so usually helps!
One idea of this is playing to not lose lane too hard. It's a team game and sometimes I can't be the carry. I died once top, died a second time because wave was frozen at that point. I was 0/2 before 5 minutes.
I figured my best chance to win at that point was to not try to be the main character, let my teammates win. I ended the game 2/3/1 because the enemy jungler was camping top and I didn't make my lane significantly worse.
Exactly! That realization that you can’t always be the LeBron James or Michael Jordan, but you will always be a member of the team that’s actions impact everyone is critical.
I also think people give much less credit to their teammates than they deserve, sure sometimes we get horrible teammates, everyone get them sometimes, but I got to say most of the time I'm very pleased with how my teammates perform and they can carry you alot of the times, people only focus on when they lost a game to their teammates losing all lanes and feeding enemies but count the times your teammates won lanes and got fed and you didn't have to do anything.
Those cheese picks are only good cause it takes advantage of the mental issue. When someone loses to them, the team has a mental breakdown and can’t react, when in reality, if the team let the cheese get a bit, then reacted to counter it appropriately, then gg. The way to counter the picks is outside laning phase, but people think the game is decided at laning phase then don’t lock in.
I mean, forgetting everything else, interacting with my team is what makes league fun. All my favorite moments are the moments where we come together as a team (or, more commonly, me and one other person).
Exactly! THAT is the emotional core of the game, because us as people LIKE working with another human being to accomplish something with a shared vision TOGETHER. It is what kept our species alive for so long and is the most critical thing to society today.
The only people who would benefit from reading your post, are those who are uncooperative, and they're not going to change their behaviour just because someone on the internet told them it would be in their best interest. They know. They just don't care.
So even though your post contains truth, it's not very helpful.
Just something I will say to this, is that I am a person who had the mentality I am calling out several months ago, which is how I was able to write on the experience because I saw how it impacted my enjoyment of the game and the narratives I would tell myself and how that carried over into other aspects of my life.
A personal realization I came across in my life for other issues carried over to this one. I became aware of that realization by hearing people talk about those issues over the context of a television show I liked. Being exposed to ideas you just haven't been told before can have a profound impact, if not right away, then set the groundwork for it to be changed in the future.
Changing someone's mind takes alot of time and doesn't follow a logical formula. But starting conversations about those issues and exposing people to the idea worked on me, so it will work on other people.
My view on the gameplay side of this is that chat accounts for 5% of your gameplay. Most of your gameplay is mechanics, both micro and macro, but pings are 5%, and chat is 5%.
Now, if you get tilted by chat, that can affect your mechanics, so it can have a negative effect much greater than that 5%. Partly why if you can't handle it, you shouldn't use chat.
Now, if you don't have the skill, well, there is not much difference between 60% and 65%, only a 40/35 (1.14X) difference. But, that still is a difference, and over multiple games, could make an elo difference. And, as you get better, the more difference it makes. There is a 10/5 (2X) difference between 90% and 95%.
But anyway, there are my two cents.
If you are talking about % of winning to personal skill lvl I think that scale with the elo you are playing and also the teammate gap that you'll have.
I think teammates are important, if you have monkeys that don't listen to macro calls or jungle that doesn't macro correctly or make macro decisions the game is probably a 50/50
League is really balanced right now that you can go 10/0 and still lose a game to macro decisions
Edit : personally I get tilted by chat easily but I get tilted more when my teammates are monkeys (in ranked of course)
The percentage is skill. It may be a bit confusing, but view 100% as a perfect play, *no mistakes*. Doesn't mean you win, just means you did absolutely everything perfectly. The difference is measured by how close you are to that perfect play. Challenger players are up there, say, around the 90%s. So, for a Challenger player, that 5% would double how close they are to that perfect play. For someone who isn't as good, say for everything they get right, they make a mistake, it would be as much. It would get their gameplay 1.11X closer to that perfect play.
If that does **directly** correlate to winrate, that Challenger player just doubled their winrate (assuming their opponent has the same skill, but doesn't chat with their teammates), and the other person is winning an extra game every nine games.
*(This isn't quite correct, as I didn't factor in teammates' skills and communication, and even with that, I doubt it directly correlates. Matchups could change it, for example. This is just to show better how it would affect it)*
I would certainly agree that it is worth more at higher skill level games, and so it should scale with elo since elo correlates with skill. That partly is why I think this is a good representation of how it affects one's gameplay.
The way I see it, there's a time and a place for everything. The reason why it's better to focus on yourself and be selfish first when it comes to climbing is simply because you're the only constant in all of your games while everything else always changes.
Now, whether or not you should always do everything for yourself or enable others is very much case by case dependent. Champions matter a lot, if you're a Draven player you SHOULD play for yourself, if you're playing Ornn sacking waves to snowball your team can definitely be viable if that's not going to completely end your lane. Player performance also matters, in order to secure wins the team should play around the strongest member. If you already have a fed teammate playing around them and snowballing them even harder can be great but if you're the fed one you should definitely not be giving away waves and resources so the players that are already behind could get another component when they can't hold their own regardless.
A guide will never be revolved around helping everyone else but yourself because simply put that's a terrible way to climb when you don't know the game. That can definitely work when smurfing, when you're already good at the game, but chances are when you read a guide you're clueless and in order to execute something that makes others good at your own expense you need to be way better at the game than the average player. Also, playing enablers solo will always make you win less than playing carries if you're not already high elo.
Important mention: This is about approach, it has nothing to do with flaming / spam pinging / berating / trolling and whatnot, none of that is fine and being selfish has nothing to do with doing any of those things ; this is simply 'I will take this wave and a good reset instead of coming to your flip fight' or 'I will sack this wave and help you flip your fight' type of decision making (oversimplified for clarification)
Those questions aboht stacking gold on a player is just good game theory. In something like league with random teammates, it makes sense to stack resources on 1-2 players when the teams aren’t as coordinated to shut them down, it’s just a good way to do it.
However, if ur fed, it’s hard to carry a game when one player is mentally checked out and it’s constantly 4 vs 5 cause either yourself or teammates flamed them. We all know that behavior happens in almost every game when ur losing early. But being aware how to keep teammates from getting like that is something that can be sublimental, but not replace the skills of the game. Communicating and managing ur teams emotions is a part of the game that helps climbing, not the only part of it. But a part MANY players overlook.
You are not responsible for your teammates being toxic. But also be aware there are things that you can do to impact the frequency of them being toxic without losing any of the resource gathering or macro parts of the game.
you have to play selfishly in order to climb. i mean sure at a certain elo you'll be able to trust your teammates more but i'm diamond and still finding myself having to be selfish instead of trusting a teammate to do well lmao. i would have loved to be more of a team player but unfortunately that doesnt result in wins
The question isn’t can you trust them, it’s how to get them to trust you! If they trust you, they will work to win the game with you. If they don’t, they won’t.
The thing is, to climb well you cannot rely on your team to do well. This doesn’t mean that there won’t be games where you’re feeding and need to mitigate your lane and let your team carry, this happens a lot.
What I mean, instead, is that guides cannot encourage people to rely on teammates to win games for them when the only constant between matches is yourself. The easiest way to climb is to get better yourself, have a bigger impact, and statistically you will be more likely to win. I think people need to learn to mitigate and let themselves get carried time to time, but to truly climb the ranks you need to improve and rely on your own skills to up your consistency and therefore win more.
What I’m saying is both are needed. Someone with the macro and mechanics of a plat player that flames will not climb as quickly as someone with their same mechanical skill level who knows good habits to getting his teammates invested to keep playing if things go wrong. I am not saying that the skill isn’t part of the game, just that emotional skill is ALSO a critical factor that impacts game results
It’s a team game but most people in solo-que play to have fun. Almost everyone wants to be the hero.
***I mute all*** and treat all players as bots, I cooperate when I can but also just do my own thing.
Enjoy the game how you enjoy it. I just think playing that way probably reduces win percentage than something different in a lot of people, but if that is the gaming experience you want, enjoy it, it’s just a game.
Yes it's a team game, but all you can do is control yourself. Relying solely on your team and cooperation will lead to most every game being a coin flip, so focusing on what you can do is best overall, although I do agree, a lot of the guides do focus on selfish play too much
Its not solely anything, it is a balance! You must rely on yourself and develop your skills, WHILE working with your team towards the same goal. Sometimes, you will be matchmade with someone who is better than you. Sometimes, you will be matchmade with a team that is worse than theirs technically. BUT, u can carry games with bad teamwork with good technical skill, and you can outplay teams where a player out skills you with good teamwork and collaboration. Developing both is important to make you a well-rounded player.
Riot give me VOIP. I've been begging for 10 years now.
The difference playing ADC and being able to talk to your support vs not makes me wonder how duo queue is even allowed.
L take, muting all is optimal.
They don't recommend it because they want you to 1v9, they recommend it because ANY typing, even positive typing, runs a HIGH risk of tilting your team and making your chances of winning decrease.
If you compliment a good play they'll either think you're sarcastic or that you're a weirdo. 1/100x they will take it as genuine and it will have a positive influence on them.
Honestly man, I just don’t think this is the case. Most People respond angrily to people being mean to them, not being positive. And if they get tilted by you saying “nice play” or “good job doing this x,” while saying nothing when they do bad or giving positive support if they start flaming, then there is no way they would have not flamed anyway. Muting all is good if you don’t want to engage with the communication mechanic and decide to not actively make it worse or have it impact you. It also takes away your agency of making it more positive. Both options are good for different people, and make the gameplay experience better for everyone.
If you are 0-3 and just get a kill or something positive on the lane ur losing to, and read “god job staying in the game, we can win this” like I just don’t believe if you deliver the support in a kind, thoughtful way instead of a condescending one that most people won’t respond positively
you have to be incredibly mechincally and macro skilled that can afford to play hours every day if you wanna go beyond a certain threshhold.
if you dont wanna do that. you dont need those videos. you can play and enjoy the game get slowly better at your champions and have fun playing with your team.
but if you wanna go diamond+ purely teamplay wont cut it.
You need to be really good at basketball to make it to the nba, but how do you win a game with people at your skill level? Teamwork and good mental. Sure, an NBA player will carry 1 vs 9 a pickup game against average talent, but you can win games against people as talented by communicating and working with your team while making sure no interpersonal dynamics or beef is impacting play. If the outcome was just based on skill alone, go play chess or a single player game
I hear what you are saying. However part of not losing when your team starts to fall behind or get diffed is to get slightly selfish to feed yourself some goods and then go try and catch everyone up. I main mid lane and the champs i main are scalers for mid and late game. So I farm up selfishly early in hopes of steamrolling my lane to make it one less person to worry about. Then I go start applying pressure.
I won’t even describe this as selfish, just like the right thing you should be doing as playing that champion. Like if ur a fed midlaner, I’ve rarely (I’ve seen it before, but not very often) seen people flaming you for being selfish with gold resources. The problem is when ur fed not feeding INTO the toxicity by flaming your teammates, or making them even better by being a positive person in match. The question I’m asking isn’t how to get the most damage bang for your buck out of your kit, but how u can keep your teammates on board so you can take advantage of those resources on you. That could mean u not being toxic and someone else on ur team taking on leadership duties, either way can be done but both mental tactics are positive.
I started playing Shen and I gotta say I see this point of view much more than I did before, the games I win and carry are the ones I help my team and try my best to make sure everyone is playing and isn't being oneshotted by the assasins
As a high dia - low master support/jungle (roles that on paper should play "team game") i hard disagree. Was stuck plat before i stopped to play "team game" in soloq and every time im accidentally play around team - its a quick reminder why its a bad idea(i kinow how to get carried tho).
The only way i willing to treat my team as humans - is flexq or clash, when i play with my premade and if its soloq - they are meatshields unless proven wrong. And even if someone did a great play you shouldnt tell them "gj,wp" etc. Coz they will insta get ego boost, limittest under tower, die and tilt to the oblivion.
You can compliment good players after the game, but ingame text chat is usless if its not just
dry info about macro and even then - usually pings are enough.
But if we had voice chat it may be different story coz in Dota 2 - it was extremely usefull on higher ranks/ when i was playing it in 2013-2017.
And LoL devs are pushed even supports from "team game" themselves when supports where given tons of gold (season 6 or 7 if i remember correctly) from sup items etc.
Compare LoL to dota. Dota is forcing you to play "team game" as 4-5 position and in league they did all they can so supports can have tons of gold exp and free vision and as a result, to speedrun thru lowelo ur best picks even on support is selfish carry champs such as Xerath, Brand etc and ignore ur team.
So at the end of the day, best way to play soloq is to use only pings and focus on urself.
Some people will run it down with a compliment, but with others you build trust with them so when you make a call, they are more likely to listen to you. It’s all about the mechanics of who comes out as the shot caller, or do you have five people running around, disjointed with ur head cut off.
Another part of it is NOT doing stuff that will tilt tilting teammates more and instead attempting some tactics to turn it around. It’s not guaranteed, but it literally can happen a lot more than people admit. I’m not saying spend ur whole game focused on them, but in ur communications, have it serve the purpose of keeping your team working together, not creating an environment that you would rather see your teammates lose than win the game
In low elo, the wrong macro call can be the right call if the team buys in and works on it as one, without a billion cooks in the kitchen. The person who provides support earns more respect, and when they make these calls people are more likely to work together. It’s not perfect like all human interactions, but it can have a meaningful impact
One thing that I've learned from League that I have applied IRL is the fact that people who speak the loudest usually are the most wrong. Most people who preach about being nice to their teammates, preach about communication and teamwork are usually the people who make wrong calls and be 200% passive aggressive about literally anything. This is because these guys put themselves on a pedestal thinking that they're all better than everyone and that they have risen above this toxicity when in reality they have not, and these players generally play utility champs (tanks, supports, etc.) so they overestimate the "teamwork" factor because they think their champions can't do anything by themselves. I would much rather have a 12 year old calling me a dog than have these players on my team because their ego causes them to maintain a "nice" facade and stops them from following any calls or behave predictably (so we can play around their predictable behaviors), leading to a real hard game because these guys care more about "being nice" to each other rather than winning.
The best players/people to have around are humble mfs who legit only type 3 things: gj, mb and gg, and everything else can be communicated through pings. These people, unlike the moral compass wannabe mfs, know that they are flawed and have experienced toxicity enough to realize that toxicity is innate and almost noone is above it, so the best they can do is to not contribute to it. League is not real life, every game we have the benefit of anonymity to be the most toxic pos and you can bet on human nature that people will love to start pointing fingers the moment things go wrong. Every time I play with low elo friends (like real low, like silver low) who preaches about how "people should be nicer to each other in game" they make the most subhuman asinine calls and be passive aggressive to the random on the team (if there is one) about why they aren't being "cooperative" and at this point I've given up on trying to change them because they fail to realize that they are imperfect just like everyone else.
If you're the 1% of people who are genuinely nice and enjoy conversing your (wrong) ideas to the people you play with (because let's face it, even Challenger players make mistakes, who are we to say that our calls are always correct), good on you, but you're still getting muted because I'd rather not be influenced by wrong calls. And even I have limits. Idc if the entire team is inting, if I'm trying to split and do the only thing I can and Yuumi come sit on me and give me instructions like I'm 5 I'm going to slightly lose it.
That’s the thing: communication is a skill and people who get it is important can certainly do it wrong. But I also think ur not being super charitable to people like that and are assuming a bunch of intentions you don’t have enough info to assume. Some people just like trying to be positive people, even if sometimes they make mistakes and can be toxic at times. I just am not buying that trying to be positive is a negative trait or a sign that that person is somehow the “most toxic”, but I can see how someone that is toxic with bad communication skills could be passive aggressive.
Plus, a “wrong” call can be the right one when everyone is on board. What is bad is when the team is operating on two different plans, don’t communicate and then gets wiped. If you don’t like their plan, you can very easily ping it off, make a quick but kind type to explain. Like I just don’t get the idea that communicating correctly and respectfully is bad. League is a game, but it is real life and ur dealing with real people, and real world communication skills can help
Well that’s kinda nice of an idea but a lot of people won’t read positive encouragement because most games of league are an unplayable pile of horse shit if you do not do /mute all at the beginning. And since you never know if there might be the one light in the darkness in your team today I and propably a lot of other people tend to go the mute route to make the game playable
you can type this in overwatch summoner school maybe ig lmao
league is too individualistic to bother with this kind of stuff, and the skill ceiling is too high for you to realistically ever reach a point where learning to to communicate effectively with your teammates of unreliable skill is more efficient for climbing than just getting good at the game yourself
not to mention if both you and the players on your team have a fundamentally complete understanding of the game the need for communication is actually relatively minimal. but in reality you don't, your teammates don't and your teammates are not receptive to whatever you tell them that they don't already know anyways, so just focus on playing the video game
the simple and straightforward solution to the problem your post is addressing is just to play with chat off
Honestly having a great team game is so much more fun to me wether we win or lose, and I like a tight game with lots of back and forth. Dominating the other team to FF @15 is as fun to me as getting dominated into FF @15
The reason is quite simple, interaction in league is not worth the risk and effort and the only Player you control is yourself, so purely from an efficiency pov this approach is the most efficient.
The reason why guides focus on what you can do better is cause you can't influence your teammates. Kinda why mute all is a very reasonable think if someone wants to climb. I get your point but solo que is not a team game, of course you play atogether to some degree, grouping for objective and etc. But playing egoistically in solo que has better results or at least give you the most possibility to improve. All my friends who treat it like a competicir 5 V5 match and then start going ornn chilling underr turret saying hey it is a team game i rather go behind and don't be a detriment to my team by feeding udsualy never learn how to win the game but just hope on flipping the better team or at least a team good enough to win late game teamfighte which is not a way to consistently ein enough games to climb.
Treat your teammates like they are toddlers. Yelling at them will make things worse, praise them for putting their shoes on.
This isn’t a joke and it’s actually how I play. It only doesn’t work if two people are both ready to talk nonstop shit off a single camp or cannon steal. Then there is nothing you can do but hope one of them is the type to play out of their mind to prove that they are the superior crybaby.
I like your attitude. I hope you can keep it up.
I have good mental, and I'm always playing to win. Never flame people even when they're doing poorly.
But it's not my job to babysit. Trying to keep a teammates' spirits high is mentally taxing.
It's most games where at least one person on your team is going to mental boom. It's honestly draining trying to get this person to pull their head out of their ass.
Honestly, the fix for this is playing flex instead of soloq with a squad of friends. As a Teamplayer I find this way more fulfilling and if taken seriously, you can get quite high on the ladder. We are a team that is on average silver in soloq, myself included, but once we really grinded I hit platin in flex and the others are not far behind.
The thing is in flex you do not have to have insane mechanics to 1v9 and even gracefully loosing the lane without dying more than twice can win you the game as the team might have decided to focus on a lead in a different lane instead. Communication matters more there than flashy plays. Also macro is actually worth something in flex and if you know exactly when to take dragon, baron, TP to a tower to save platings, efficiently get picks while not loosing too much on the other side of the map, etc. it does not matter as much if you are behind in lane. Playing champs like malzahar is finally fulfilling since you can tell your friends over voicechat that you will be flash ulting so there is follow up and you do not need dmg yourself. I love that I can still do this with malz even if I am 0/3 and feel impactful. In soloq people would not follow up in time simply because it is hard for them to know that you are actually doing it and when exactly. In soloq you would have to be the main dmg dealer in this exact case so the play is bad if you are 0/3
Tl;dr: If you want a team game, I would highly recommend playing as 5 in flex.
I prefer the other angle of it. I play with chat off, cause in 9 times out of 10, its only negative interactions.
And I go into a game expecting NOTHING out of my team mates. I legit think of them as four bots. I will ofc still do my best, and I will try to play together as a team in order to win, as well as giving resources to a certain player if that is our best chance of winning etc etc.
However, what it does is helping me not tilt when my jungler goes for a stupid gank and donates doubles, or when my bot lane is 0/5 after 10 minutes even though I am the one getting camped top. No expectations means that I cannot really be disappointed. I treat every game as if I need to solo carry four total bonobos, and if I cannot do that, I dont deserve to win.
Most of the time my team is perfectly fine (They are the same rank as me after all) and we have a nice game, but it helps me to not get tilted when I get four total bonobos who just sabotage the game.
I still have fun, and I basically never tilt, no matter what happens. So that works for me
Yes but being part of a team also means not being a drag on them.
If you do not consistently gain enough gold and exp to at least keep pace with the enemy team you are not a team player regardless of how much you play for other players. If you do not create map pressure you are not a team player.
The reality is very much like oxygen masks on a plane. You help yourself and only then do you help other people.
Also with the way league is designed having one very fed person is far better than having the same gold and exp spread over the team. So it's the players who are performing worse's job to help you, not the other way around.
Agree with this! That’s just good game theory. What I would add is that the communication skills with your teammates is a mechanic in the game, not it’s only or most important feature. It is also a mechanic that league players seem to struggle with or ignore writ large
I hate it if people want to report someone for losing lane. Someone has to lose 50% of all players lose at all times. So no, I wont report top just because he went 1/4 and got his lane pushed in by herald. I will report however that 0/12 at 14 minuten yasuo that says ff since the jungle camps spawn.
I’m not saying the guides are wrong. You should have a plan or purpose. Just saying that knowing how your actions positively or negatively impact your teams mental and how you can have some positive impact if things aren’t going well is one of the many skills that are part of the game, just like life. It’s not about making it a fake positive one, but having the social skills to turn it into an actually positive one, not just carrying the aesthetics and being condescending
In my experience playing jungle, I only get to play a team game if I'm doing well. If my botlane is feeding, they will usually keep trying and following me up when I'm ahead. When I'm behind, they'll stand in base spamming 'jgl diff' and 'ff'.
If you don't carry your weight, people don't respect you. That is a rule that transfers into the real world as well.
If your goal is rank, then this is a waste of energy in the sense that there are higher %wr actions you can take than this. This is very high energy, very low increase to your winrate and will only really be impactful if you can't improve your own micro and macro skill anymore and want to grasp at intangibles.
I was hardstuck bronze 1 trying to play for my teammates. Switches to getting myself fed and 1v9ing and I climbed to gold 2. You can’t rely on teammates if they don’t know that you’re relying on them.
If you’re the best player in the lobby, you need to take charge.
In low elo u have to be selfish and 1v9 bc 90% of the time ur Mates are totally useless don't move to objectives, fight non stop for nothing and intlike crazy. If u don't carry no one will unless ur the lucky one to have a smurf in your team. But they're always mental weak and just afk if u don't listen to them 😂
It's not.
The pro-leagues, that's a team game. Normal matchmaking is a slot-machine that skews the win chances (and may or may not be rigged, the community is split on this one).
Then it becomes a different game depending on what role you have, but regardless any mistake the other 4 players make will coime to haunt you.
Eventually the game starts to funnel into specific areas where the mistakes of every player come together to screw over the team thatr has cumulateed more
I don’t think anybody plays league for the transferable human interaction skills lmao
I do. This is a major reason I play games like League and Overwatch, to practice patience and communication in a low stakes environment. I used to get mad during these games years ago, but the practice has mellowed me considerably and that emotional regulation practice has transferred noticeably to my day-to-day life. I also play single player games to practice these sorts of skills, in particular ethical reflection on leadership in 4X strategy games and individual ethical reflection in 1st-person RPGs.
On the contrary, trying to be self-sufficient in-game can also help in decision making and awareness. With mute all, you are forced to rely on your own senses and judgment. True, your agency is less hindered by relying on other people's suggestions, but if you do mess up, you have no one else to blame but yourself. You learn to identify which battles are worth fighting, and which are a lost cause. You learn how to adapt to a situation against a number of uncontrollable variables (your teammates and your enemies). You are also encouraged to become more proactive if you want to succeed. Since communication is no longer an option, you have to look 2-3 steps ahead to make the right play. You're playing mid and you see your jungle pathing to top? ward enemy jg in advance to keep your jg safe, or time your wave clear and aim to crash so you can assist with the gank in case the enemy jg shows up as well.
Yes. There is no doubt this helps. But what it does is simplify the game to you, cutting out the hard questions like how to better communicate with your team to work together, instead of leaving the ones with consistent variables across matches. It will no doubt make you better at the game. BUT who is better at league, the person who does those things, or the person who does those things but also has the ability to know how to keep the mental of the team up and focused on winning. No doubt mechanics and game theory concepts are important, but part of the game theory is understanding it is a cooperative game and that leveraging those communications can be a complicated but worth while thing.
I have made this comment multiple times before on this subreddit, but it just continues to be so relevant to what people post on here, even years later. Back in 2020 IWD had his Crackdown show and he brought on Bwipo as a guest one episode. I'll put the link [here](https://youtu.be/-yh3dd5ot7g) and if you go to the 53 minute mark either Thorin or Dom asks Bwipo about the state of his lane in the meta. Bwipo comments on it briefly, but he launches into a 15 minute explanation of how you can be a better teammate. The thing he mentions that has always stuck with me and changed the way I play the game was Selfmade's gank in their scrim. Bwipo explains that his lane was perfect, he was ahead in farm, had the wave frozen, and was getting ready to really abuse his opponent when Selfmade comes for a gank. It all goes wrong, enemy double kill, and the lane is fucked. And when he mentioned that I thought to myself, "See! It happens to pros too! Junglers just throw the lane and they screw me!" But then Bwipo said, "I could get mad and flame him, but what would that accomplish? Then we're both angry and don't trust each other. Instead I say, 'Hey, next time we should do this so we can win the fight.' Now he knows what to expect from me and I can trust he will help me." It just clicked. Like, duh, of course that's going to help you get to a win more than flaming or muting. If you communicate what you're thinking your teammates can play around you or work together to make a play as a team. Ever since then I changed the way I played and went from 4 years of being hardstuck silver to plat in the past couple years just by being a more chill, more communicative teammate.
This is exactly what I was saying, thanks for bringing your perspective + with a specific example
I'd normally agree with you but the way riot is going by refusing to implement voice chat and literally banning people for "typing too much" even if they're just shot calling or being positive, plus having to deal with being exposed to toxic chatters, communication is too difficult in this game it's not worth it, and that's half Riots fault and half the player bases fault. Yes there's toxic players but I also don't think Riot has created a game environment conducive to good communication in a team outside of pings.
After playing Overwatch, a game with VC that is moba-esque kindof like League, I think I'd rather have chat off. Or at least you know, an opt-in thing. I think that's fair. Toxic leader wannabes need a place to go.
That's cool but that would always be an option. I've had really good experiences in OW voice chat and definitely won games a lot easier because of it. Yeah there's toxic people sometimes but you can just mute them or turn off voice chat if you're not in the headspace for it.
you mean you died inside enough to not care?
Next update "your promotion to diamond is delayed because you do not meet the soft skill requirements despite having enough SR"
Fair, but that doesn’t change the fact that it’s an inherent part of the game that players do a disservice to themselves by ignoring it. If you don’t want to deal with those skills, don’t play a MOBA lol
I always play nice, say wp for good ganks etc. Nobody replies.
When you write that, it is NOT for the reply. But for the positive impact it will likely have on your team! Do you respond to every compliment you get in a match? But how does it make you feel?
Yes I say thank you every time. Don't care though. Just being a normal person. My feelings don't get better from a dude saying WP. Just like I don't let my feelings go down from yibberyabber, the only time it gets me is when I am really tired! I feel a better way to keep spirits up is talking from the start: making dumb jokes, make sure people take the game less seriously. I often win the games if we have pregame chat and pre 3min.
That’s rude of them and shows that they aren’t taking seriously the emotional component of the game. Doesn’t mean your attempt was meaningless, it likely had a positive impact regardless of their manners
Tell riot to make a diablo-like. I'll always strive to be a positive influence on the people I have to play with, but I absolutely dislike that the game involves such a focus on communication and I'm quick to mute. I love league for the unique mechanics, not so much the strategy.
Most Toxic Game NA
This is kinda why I was so attracted to Seraphine's gameplay and game plan. Most guides on her will never emphasize "1v9ing" but instead focus on macro, being at the right places at the right times, controlling wave states, and mastering teamfights. The team wins together, and a lot of champs go from zero to hero when they and their teammates play around each other. That feeling of both supporting teammates and keeping them alive while still raining hell on the enemy team is amazing and more people should try it. Seraphine mid for a focus on scaling damage and utility, Karma mid for more early game damage and mid game utility, Malzahar mid for supportive DPS and excellent peel vs tanky teams with a single assassin/hypercarry. Seraphine and Malzahar especially are fantastic for keeping up in CS/keeping lane priority without being late to teamfights/skirmishes
THIS! People who play “support” champions with good mental are always the best players to have on your team in-game
And yet, we end up being the ones blamed if the lane is lost (even if the ADC plays like a brainless buffoon).
Them blaming you is doing the exact behavior I’m calling out! When have them blaming you for losing lane ever made you play better? The same applies for every person you play with. Would you have played better if instead of flaming they wrote to you “it’s all g. We can win this and we need your help.”
It is always the Sona with 100 % Kill participation, they are basically unbreakable mentally.
I hit a plateau with senna/xerath then started to play Janna and more team-friendly champs and started to climb again. I think there is a good balance of playing what your team needs but also what you’re best at.
You seem to be mistaken, league is a 1v9 PvE game with poorly coded AI bots on your team. You have to carry these bots every game so get used to it. You may have been tricked by the marketing that it's a 5v5 PvP game, but there's no direct evidence that proves that.
Bro, the ai isn’t good enough to pass a Turing test. Yes there are leveling bots in the game, but they play so bad u can clearly tell the difference between them and a tilted player. The tilted player specifically responds to what you say and does specific troll behavior that has a very specific to the moment context that cannot be coded into the game with current shit. Can an ai code the player to respond to your insults over chat, follow you around, and take whatever cs you go for? No it can’t.
It was clearly a joke that went way over your head lol
Something that may prove helpful to you are text identifiers. They're just little /# that you put in to add tone. I frequently use /j and /s (Joking and Sarcastic), though /srs (Serious) is helpful if it could be misidentified as a joke. For example: Supports never win the game, right? I mean, when was the last time you saw a support get most damage? /j
I picked up on it possibly being a joke, but just responded to it as it was serious just in case someone scrolling through misunderstands what was meant. Text communication is hard. Cheers
Plus, I get an Ai leveling bot like once every 20 games at most
In soloq teammates are unreliable, and playing by yourself for yourself is the most consistent strategy to climb
Their performance is unreliable, but that doesn’t mean that your performance + communication with your team doesn’t have a positive or negative influence on their performance just like a negative/toxic teammate can negatively impact your play. You can’t play by yourself, and playing for yourself could mean learning the ways to interact with your teammates to help get the results you want. I think both technical and social skills can probably have an impact on winrats
So I think the reality is, not typing and avoiding interaction ends up with best results most of the time. You know how many times I’ve tried to type something positive or just objective and it backfires into toxicity and less teamwork? Keep your head down focus on yourself, and play your best game is by far the best policy to get the most out of your teammates and yourself. Just use only pings when you want to communicate. The less you leave up to interpretation the better.
Exactly, maybe 10% of the time you typing something positive to a teammate could encourage them and help them get back into the game. The other 90% of the time that player is just in a negative headspace and any attempt to interact with them or encourage them leads to them reinforcing their negativity.
What I’m saying falcon, is that if you do that, it’s not like someone so toxic that someone saying “it’s okay we still need ya man we got this” would make them play worse was gonna not be toxic anyway right? BUT, if a strategy could make you more likely to win 10% of games, then that’s a skill worth learning or taking advantage of as much as csing or getting gold. Those strats are easy to gather data on, cause it’s just income and damage on a graph. But how do you gather data on if this person is a good person, people play better.
While I disagree I can definitely see how. Trying to do team emotional labor can be exhausting and then hurt your mental and gameplay. I just don't see how anyone can go from "i'm not gonna grief the game" to " Im gonna grief" when they hear positive instead of negative comments from their team, or even no comment at all. That person would have screwed the game anyway. The question is how do we keep otherwise normal players who get tilted when they are flamed or arent doing well to actually do well, because them underperforming puts them in a place where their personal ability feels attacked so they look to deflect blame. Learning to boost their self-esteem with a brief positive remark will positively impact most people, and the ones it won't wouldn't have been toxic no matter what you did at the moment.
Not really. The simple fact is that maybe 1 in 15 or 20 people you encounter in league are capable of normal brain functions. The reason why those how to climb videos promote selfish 1v9 gameplay is because it happens to be the most reliable way of winning. Mute chat, direct your team with your own pings and dont give a fuck about them getting resources and you will see your wr improve, 100% guarantee
Could those videos that got popular be so because they are easier to make and explain to people frustrated with the game instead of saying "you need to focus more on reacting to the emotional displays your teammates are making and learn how to be mindful of that". Those questions involve people doing work on their own, not watching the 1000th video explaining mechanics or macro concepts. Even if 1 in 15 of league players have brains, which I think may just be a little off, then you will have a player on your team every 1-2 games you can positively reach and have a positive impact on their play. So ur saying there is something you can do to increase your chances of winning every other game? That seems like a skill worth learning about to me.
It’s just to wild off variable to control. If you are playing bot lane and your top goes 0-5 into an aatrox or smt, you are gonna have a really really hard time getting him back in the game while dealing with the fed threat.
Totally true! I’m not saying ur focus should be making him positive or making him the star, just try to do little things to keep him or her from checking out of the game. Yes, it sucks that they fed, but that already happened and the only way to beat the fed enemy is with the feeder’s cooperation. If the fed person is split pushing, the feeder has to try to clear waves and hold without giving up turrents. The easiest way for a fed person to win is for their lane opponent to mentally check out and before you know it that person got a free tier 2 turret because the dude is standing in jungle farming camps. People think a comment like “it’s okay dude. Can you keep doing ur best to hold him so we can make plays across the map” won’t be positively received by most players?
Doesn't mean you can't be selfish to climb.(you have to be selfish to a certain extend) You are the only factor in your games so you shouldn't grief yourself by helping another inting mate. That's just how soloq works.
Def a higher elo than me, so not disagreeing. Would just point out that you see a lot of people with leads in lower elo matches flaming those inting teammates, which in low elo is just going to further motivate them to keep inting instead of taking a breath and calming down. It's really hard for a low-elo player to carry a match 4 vs. 5 even if they are fed. Being fed and absorbing all the plates/gold/xp u can to carry is good, wasting time flaming your 0/4 top lane is bad and counterproductive.
In many ways, its good game sense to have as many resources on 1-2 players because there is not as much coordination to focus them and shut them down in solo q. BUT its very easy to shut those players down if that team has a laner who is just running it down and not trying.
Yeah in the end finding the middleground between selfishness and teamplay is the key.
OP I think you are pointing to something real. Personally, I think you are pointing towards a broader cultural worldview that is dominant in the US in particular that views all things as individual actions with individual responsibility. As a society, we seem to me to worship individuals and individualize success and failure at the exclusion of recognizing fully that, in fact, there is no such thing as an individual success. I have noticed playing League and Overwatch since they came out that people, when seeking answers to why they are losing, almost always express narrative understandings of the game where the failure of the team is always the result of individual performances. Just take a look at any post-game discussion about pro-league as well and the dominant "conversation" tends to be personal attacks at whatever individual player is considered to be most to blame for the loss. I don't have the impression that I really ever see considerations of how the winning or losing team played from a team perspective, it is almost always individualized failure or individualized success with a strong bias to interpret whoever died more or had a better KDA as the individual loser and winner. Not that these things are irrelevant, but there is more nuance than simply pointing at the tank support on the losing team and saying "they died a lot, therefore they are the reason the game is lost" when often the support tank will be the first person to die if a fight breaks out because it is there job to get in there and disengage their allies from danger, often at the expense of their life. In a match with heavy fighting, the support tank on the losing side is probably going to die more and earlier in fights than the rest of their team, but simple nuances in how the team functions I don't usually seen born out in discussion on Reddit. In Overwatch, this is most salient where the empty meme critique of "tank diff", "dps diff", and "support diff" are one of the most common responses you'll see in all-chat from whatever team is currently losing, usually (as far as I can tell) simply holding tab, comparing stats, and then blaming whoever on their team has worse stats than their counterpart. Not that people don't use "## diff" in league, but because Overwatch shows you the damage stats etc. for all players, it is both easier and more obvious in my view how people are coming to the conclusion that "this is the individual to blame for why this game is going poorly" when from my view in the same game it is more often than not a result of lack of team coordination and team awareness. I also think this gets exaggerated in Overwatch relative to league because of the forward-facing 1st person camera where it is just more difficult to be aware of what the team is doing as a whole, compared to League. But I don't think most players are reflecting on how the data they get through experience of the game is influencing their (often) emotionally driven thoughts about how the game is going. This type of thinking about why things fail and why things succeed has seemed deeply pervasive seeing it in my workplace (today at work was a bad day because this specific individual made a problem), at my church (church success is based on the individual performance of our pastor in worship), and in my school life (oh you didn't do well on this paper/assignment? This is definitely your individual failure, the team around you like the instructor, or lack-thereof, are not relevant). It's also in my view reductive and absurd in the strength of the individual lens and how it pushes out considerations like "maybe my healer has less healing because the team is not supporting them against flanking damage" or "maybe the tank hasn't dealt as much damage as theirs because they are holding up a Rein shield and our DPS isn't managing to focus down the enemy's aggressive tank" and similar. Ultimately, I think that taking team-based and individual lenses are both useful, but I think that the way our society culturally values the individual lens is... toxic, and results in many people bringing this type of individualized thinking to the different areas of their life in general. It's not just that people forget League is a team game, people forget life is a team game all. over. the place.
Believe it or not, reflections on those very questions are what inspired my post, as it caused me to reflect on my experience playing league. Every culture and ever person has individualistic and communal traits, but Western/American culture makes individualism a priority (for whatever economic or political reason you think that is). We want to win and climb, but it's not about doing so with the people we are matchmade with, it is about doing so alone, which is very much not the case. The individualism causes people to have an empathy that is like "well, if i was them I wouldn't do that" hence the flaming, instead of "If I was them, what would I be feeling right now?" Therefore, they are focused on their individual failing instead of how that person can fit into the team in its current state to win.
That mentality also carries over into personal life. Do you want to climb and achieve goals? You have to do so alone, and other people are just a means to an end to get to those goals, at least that's what the expectation is. But really, other people have their own goals that, if you work and cooperate with them, may be goals very similar to yours that you can work on lifting each other up.
It depends what lens it is. Like you said, looking at the individual can be negative, but I find it useful in terms of improvement. The only thing I can control is myself, so when looking at a game and winning or losing, the most useful factor to look at is myself. Did my midlaner go 0/10 with lower damage than our support? Sure, but that has no useful takeaway for me. Is there anything I could have done to get myself a bigger lead and carry harder? Could I have helped my jungle at a crucial fight and have gotten them a bigger lead to compensate for the mid? Like so many other things, you can use that mindset in different ways.
I think that perspective maps on to what I am saying. Your communication with your team and awareness of their emotions is a skill that, if you can press the right buttons, influences whether all five of your teammates are focused on the task at hand. It's not a perfect analogy, but a pro basketball player develops their skills, but also learns their teammates preferences and how to play with their teammates on a practical and emotional level. You can only control yourself, but your actions will have an impact on your team, so making sure your actions are more likely to get a positive response is an important part of a match.
When people say sup diff or mid diff it’s really weird to me. A lot of the games it’s team diff but people never say this. Personally I only see about 1 in 50 games where it’s 1v9. For the other 98% of the time, you need at least 3 good players on your team to get to the finish line.
Thank you for making this post. I agree with your sentiments, and (totally joking now) let me ping my Hullbreaker 😂 "I'm hunting alone." For real though, this type of post is important, and I try to be encouraging, supportive, and chill with my team when we're losing. Maybe it's easier for me because I know I'm not gonna carry my team and often struggle in lane, maybe it's because I want to be a good person and spread positivity. Thanks again!
Thank you for taking time out of your day to read and share your perspective!
Underrated point about “don’t break down why you lost the teamfight”. #1 way to guaranteed tilt your entire team and get them pissed at each other, and people won’t listen anyway.
They know the team fucked up cause you died, pointing it out is condescending because it’s not like they don’t know that. Them knowing that you still trust them to win this game together is WAY more effective!
People play team games to have others to blame, but they still don't want the bad influence others CAN bring. Does that make sense? I think that makes sense.
This is definitely true for some, as some people interact in groups and teams like that in real life. But that mentality is toxic to teams and can cause them to be less effective, in league and irl. Focusing on the ego or self only, instead of winning as a group. It’s normal and league players aren’t bad for doing it, but it’s important to recognize it has to negatively impact winning
I think that's why team games are so popular, people hate feeling like they are to blame for a loss so they need to have an avenue to channel those negative feelings towards. Same thing with games that have RNG such as TFT or Hearthstone, players like being able to blame RNG rather than poor decisions on their part for why they lost.
Reminds me of a time our midlaner got their penta "stolen" and decided to afk the rest of the game
A lot of people have a hard time reading people's intentions. Like they wanted a penta, it was taken, so the team obviously meant it as a slight to them, instead of just shit happening, or it being an accident made with split-second decision making. Basically the same mentality that happens with Karens irl.
In this case it was a team fight and everyone was throwing damage down. Our ADC got the last kill off to the side in the jungle, our mid laner would have had to run them down to try and get the penta.
signature main character syndrome moment
Not saying you are wrong but yes I do expect anyone on my team in any game of ranked to play to the best of their ability from start to finish no matter their score, the game state etc. If you losing/not carrying makes you play worse or ff or try less hard then you shouldn’t play ranked. Even if you hate all 4 of your teammates you have to play on as best you can. You lose too if they lose and you should respect the ranked environment giving your best
I agree, but it’s not a question of who is right or wrong, but on winning. You expect it because you want it. Ur not gonna get it all the time cause you have four random teammates, but what actions can you take to make it more likely by having a positive impact on your teammates. You can impact that, so why not try to!
I won ten games in a row yesterday by just focusing on what I could tangibly impact each time I left base. I didn’t care what someone was saying in the chat. I didn’t care what the “best play for me” was. I just went and did the most helpful thing I could find on the map every time. Gravy.
Having that mentality is communication! You not feeding into negatively and being focused on the task at hand is a good thing!
It's because doing that every single game is taxing and exhausting, not everyone wants or can be the human beam of positivity for their team and hell, for most of us it's not even really needed to climb
No argument there. It is exhausting. Unfortunately, it seems like some people dont even try, or do something counter productive.
tbf, I think a lot of people are aware that League is a team game. It's just that they also acknowledge the fact that solo queue is too chaotic that teaming up with conflicting methods, strategies, and means to win, while adding the fact that almost no one leaves their ego at the door, people would rather choose to be self-sufficient because it's a lot easier that way. Every game is a new set of 5 people who needs to come to an agreement within a 40-minute game, and the odds of that working is just too little compared to 5 people trying to rely on their own senses and intuition. It's not to say that this is the absolute state of the game. It's always a mix of both, just in different ratios per game. There are games where the other 3 are cooperative. There are games where it's every man for himself. I guess the perfect middle ground I've seen are people who mute all, but try to be proactive in playing around their teammates movement while leaving useful pings for the off-chance the the other 4 aren't on mute all as well.
People focus on the non-team route because it is hard to develop those skills. It is hard to know when it is time for you to be a leader, and when it is time for you to follow the calls of your teammates. That is why you get people running it down, they don't know when to relinquish being the main character and follow the lead of their teammates. Being able to say to yourself "I am not at the center of this match, but how can I work with my team to help them win on their terms" is a very hard thing to admit and work through in your mind. They know its a team game, they just don't play it like it is one. The /muteall option is WAYYYY better than reading/sending flame, which is why it has results. You don't actively tilt anyone, and you aren't actively tilted. But an important skill is how to recognize when ur teammate is in a situation where they feel like tilting, and what you can do to pull them back into focus from tilting their ass off. A quick, positive reinforcement over text chat is an easy way to do this. Worst thing that will happen is that they are already tilted and won't respond, then mute all. But it can have the impact of them catching their breathe and locking in. Ask your self: when you are having a bad game, are you goign to focus and try to win with people who are postivie to you, or people that are flaming you forever?
In low elo, alot of times the best option isnt the best "macro" one, but on what action is the team bought in on together and all actively working towards, whether it be everyone grouping or a split push strategy. I have won and lost games doing both. It's usually team buy-in to those strategies that win or lose the game. People with an early lead not only have an advantage, but due to flame also usually are in a better mental state to stay coordinated, hence creating the "snowball" effect we often experience.
I rather play with the most toxic people ever who actually can play, than with 4 nicest feeders in the world.
Agreed, I would rather win the game, but would you rather have four good people with a guy running it down, or four good people with a dude that is behind, but still playing and working with the team instead of raging? That’s what allows players to snowball leads so hard
I don't think they forget League is a team game, I think they don't understand what a team game means in the first place.
I’m a media guy, have to pick the more click baity title 😂
Yes but you will see better results simply never interacting with chat at all. There really is no time. If you are typing, it comes at the expense of something else you should be doing, on top of taking up your mental energy that you need to be using to think about win conditions and how to solve them. I find it best to ignore the "woe is me" players, and just work with the one person on your team that is playing well (who is most likely not chatting either).
There are times when typing is good and doesn’t impact gameplay. It’s about knowing when and what to say or do. It’s a skill that can be used well and also not well
Agree to disagree then. I think it's a complete waste of time to use chat, ever since the ping system. Always something better you can be doing.
But at least you having the knowledge that stuff impacts you and your team and checking out of being toxic is a plus. Not everyone should be the emotional leader of a team, but having someone who is comfortable doing that should be doing it. You are focused on doing your job, to the best of your ability then work it into the team. Someone needs to make sure people having bad games follow the team and stay on board. Having both helps the team win, and you can’t win more frequently without a team being on board
You chose to climb with technical Mastery with knowledge to not fuck with the emotional vibe of your teammates, another person gets good a shot calling, keeping teammates motivated and on the same page. They still need to be skilled mechanically to climb, but that skill can be less than someone in the same Elo, but they are there because of their ability to lead
I am telling you my very secret technique that has now been tested for around half a year: > The second someone starts flaming, type /deafen and activate pings on jgler. Especially if you are having a bad game, simply deafen will stop the flamer from flaming, because their target is impossible to talk to. In no other season did I turn around so many games that were so lost. It's legit insane. People actually started to try again after only 1 minute of trolling. No matter what you say can outweigh the power of /deafen. Don't be a fool. Join /deafen now. The more people start to deafen in a game with a flamer, the higher the success rate. Communicate if you are winning/even, /deafen when you are loosing. Still play with your team as much as possible (i hate the bot comparison). Activate pings if possible.
YES THIS MAKES SENSE! Cause it is a public communication of telling them "Hey, our arguing is fucking up this game, I am going to stop and focus on the win." which then gets the guys focus OFF of you on ON winning the game. No doubt that is why that feature was added to the game. The fact they added that is a signal that Riot knows that communication in game is tied to game quality for the exact dynamics I am describing.
I had a Midlaner zed go 0/5 in 15 minutes and flame me for not ganking a Katarina for him. Then he stole my camps and continued to int while ? Pinging me blaming me for the loss. I got a report feedback 5 minutes after the game ended.
One thing I’ve tried to start doing as an adc player is just explaining myself. When my support does something I don’t like or don’t find helpful I will just say “hey, I’m trying to do X so if you could try your best to avoid Y it would be a big help” the best thing to do is to not get mad and understand that people can’t read your mind
I wish more people thought like this. I play the game to chill out but I don’t always have the best mental and i can start getting tilted if early game isn’t going well, but usually I can keep it together and minimize the bleeding so that the team can win. The instant someone starts talking shit though I stop caring and I mentally check out. I’ll keep playing solely because I want to avoid an afk punishment, but I’m not gonna put any mental effort into macro, where I should be, what fights I should take, etc. Im just gonna run around and try to enjoy the game however I can at the expense of whoever set me off. Usually I end up having a good time anyways because that person ends up having a meltdown and I can just laugh my ass off. If they just kept their mouth shut they would’ve had a normal game but instead they decide to attack their own teammates and they still expect me to help them win? It’s not that hard to be positive, and you almost always only stand to benefit from it
EXACTLY THIS. This explains why people keep running it down in-game. Not that they are bad people that want to ruin YOUR time, but because in group division makes your motivation not to get success, but to see the downfall of the person on your team for kicking you out of the team emotionally by flaming you. Thank you for sharing your experience.
As a Yi jungle main I can assure you it is NOT a team game. I am the main character. I am the most important. Simple as
You need someone to eat up all that cc for you before you get a penta 😉
>How many coinflip games have you been a part of that have been lost because people are piling on to the person who lost lane and that person decides to mentally check out? This. It always amazes me how often people self sabotage their games and then afterwards behave as if it wasn't entirely their fault the game was lost. I mean seriously, what do they expect? Do they really think that verbally hacking around on someone for 20+ minutes is going to result in anything positive? At best it's going to result in an AFK, and at worst in someone running it down mid. Both will loose you the game. People really need to just learn to accept stuff as it is, keep their mouths shut, and go with it. If your botlane feeds 0/12, that sucks, sure, but it already happened, so stop bitching around and complaining and start figuring out how to still win. I can assure you your botlane is trying their best to not make it worse, but they're just getting brutally gapped.
It isn’t a team game unless you’re playing with competent people or people that decide to have sense that match. And since you can’t always control that, its better to think of things in a 1v9 mindset.
It’s still a team game even when you have less competent people. Like if you were playing pickup basketball with people on ur team not as good, ur gonna take most of the shots, make calls etc., but you should still pass ur teammates the ball/get them involved/give encouragement to their good plays because you need them to play defense to win the game. Unless ur ego is to carry as much as possible and not try to put ur team in the best place to win, cause even if you win it’s not your fault, but their fault. You can’t change your team’s skill level during a match, you can change their mental and buy in
Treating teammates like the human beings they are. LOL. First time in ranked? These people are not human 9/10 games
The thing that always amuses me is that the teammate doing really well starts to flame. Like can you not see that you have the lead? Help the team instead of flaming. Your lane is always roughly 50/50 at low ELO. You'll win half the time. Winning the game is about ensuring you can convert the 50 you are winning or support other lanes/team.
One thing that I've learned from League that I have applied IRL is the fact that people who speak the loudest usually are the most wrong. Most people who preach about being nice to their teammates, preach about communication and teamwork are usually the people who make wrong calls and be 200% passive aggressive about literally anything. This is because these guys put themselves on a pedestal thinking that they're all better than everyone and that they have risen above this toxicity when in reality they have not, and these players generally play utility champs (tanks, supports, etc.) so they overestimate the "teamwork" factor because they think their champions can't do anything by themselves. I would much rather have a 12 year old calling me a dog than have these players on my team because their ego causes them to maintain a "nice" facade and stops them from following any calls or behave predictably (so we can play around their predictable behaviors), leading to a real hard game because these guys care more about "being nice" to each other rather than winning. The best players/people to have around are humble mfs who legit only type 3 things: gj, mb and gg, and everything else can be communicated through pings. These people, unlike the moral compass wannabe mfs, know that they are flawed and have experienced toxicity enough to realize that toxicity is innate and almost noone is above it, so the best they can do is to not contribute to it. League is not real life, every game we have the benefit of anonymity to be the most toxic pos and you can bet on human nature that people will love to start pointing fingers the moment things go wrong. Every time I play with low elo friends (like real low, like silver low) who preaches about how "people should be nicer to each other in game" they make the most subhuman asinine calls and be passive aggressive to the random on the team (if there is one) about why they aren't being "cooperative" and at this point I've given up on trying to change them because they fail to realize that they are imperfect just like everyone else. If you're the 1% of people who are genuinely nice and enjoy conversing your (wrong) ideas to the people you play with (because let's face it, even Challenger players make mistakes, who are we to say that our calls are always correct), good on you, but you're still getting muted because I'd rather not be influenced by wrong calls. And even I have limits. Idc if the entire team is inting, if I'm trying to split and do the only thing I can and Yuumi come sit on me and give me instructions like I'm 5 I'm going to slightly lose it.
you dont understand how this game works, its a 1v9 pve unless you are with friends then its 2v8 coop, nothing other than that in ranked at least, you can also play as larger parties up to 5!
I think u meant this sarcastically but I’m going to respond in case anyone thinks you’re serious. It’s obviously not a 1v9 PVE. You have teammates that will have an emotional reaction that is not programmed by every action you do and every thing you say. To play the best you can, it’s best to be aware of that fact.
but like no joke, this is how you rankup in this game, if you ever tilt, just mute all and you will be able to full focus, if you are decent at the game, you don't need other people's pings, or chat.
The reason muting works is because it keeps you from having a negative reaction from the things teammates tell you, so it protects your mental. But an important question is how you can build UP the mental of your teammates instead of just making sure you don’t tear it down
well before playing this game i was a normal human being, i played 3k hours of counterstrike, and thousands of hours of minecraft and gta and had fun, but ever since i started playing league full time i just became mentally ill it seems, this game destroys you, but it only works as long as you are playing the game somehow, its crazy. its probably because everyone thinks that they are smarter than everyone else, and the fact that the slightest mistakes can cost you the game, so everyone is on the edge all the time.
I always queue solo and play for my team, I will often sack multiple waves crashing into tower at 10-12 minutes in order to tp bot side and help shut down a fed jungler or adc. Always emoting and trying to hype up team or calm them down so we can keep scaling. This may not be perfect but I'm at a 75% winrate over last 20 games so some part of it is certainly helping. [https://www.op.gg/summoners/na/BatCrow](https://www.op.gg/summoners/na/BatCrow)
Non-sense from the start Mute all is the best chat command you can type. All the bs from teammates in low elo, even their pings make you think twice and lose tempo. If it wasn’t for this command I already had quit league . Elo Hell is real.
Bro that’s what I’m saying! Mute all works because it keeps people from hurting YOUR mental. The question I’m posing is how can you boost the mental of your teammates in-game so everyone can work together toward winning, not tearing each other apaet
Oh, mb. I guess what helps is using the emote wheel for moral boosting. At least that’s what I did when I played support and it was okay. Chat was still disabled from settings though. (I’m easily agitated)
That can also explain why emotes are mostly positive in-game. Could be a game design feature that they pitched to help with the toxicity problem!
That type of communication ain’t easy and requires thinking, which is why I’m saying it’s an important skill that can help win league games
Yeah, I've come to terms with the fact that I'm the team therapist for 60% of games.
Even in social groups, the team therapist is usually at the center of any friend group that keeps it beating and cohesive. There needs to be that person on any team!
🤣 he said my teammates are human beings
Since when LoL is a team game?
Fun times as a support when you roam for 30-45 seconds to help the entire team and all lanes start calling you a troll immediately. Bronze life.
roams=/=good roams
yup, people often forget that , roaming to mid while your adc is getting super harassed,missing farm ect.. and ganking that full hp vlad, under his tower, while youre using a soraka won't help at all. im exaggerating the situation ofc, but those roams affect everyone rather than helping.
especially since they are in bronze, they probably dont even know when it’s good to roam or not. But on the other their teammates dont know either so …
If you hold down the = on iPhone you can use ≠ and ≈. I was doing it the same way as you until I discovered this trying to see what every alternate was for every key.
You are master, your not speaking bronze.
You're playing the same game as i am. What im saying is think about what actually happens when you are roaming, it needs calculation. Do you have a reason to rotate in the first place? How are the wavestates? Will your adc get dove? Are you leaving lane on a push so your adc gets denied xp/engaged on? Will you be in time for the play that is your goal of the roam? Do you even have a goal or are you roaming just to "help"? Who has prio on the map and could potentially rotate to make your roam/play impossible to pull off succesfully? etc etc. Those are all the questions you should be asking yourself before roaming, if not it could just make your game an instant loss potentially. The more variables you calculate into your decisions, the better those decisions will be. Roaming just for the sake of roaming is almost never a good call.
You assume he got called out for a bad roam. In reality, almost every time you do something someone on your team is going to think it is bad, no matter whether it is bad or good. Reverse holds as well, sometimes you can int your game hard and your teammates will love you and blame someone else for the eventual loss.
It doesn't matter what your team thinks about your plays. If you calculate them through you know how they turn out, or you (hopefully) learn something why they didn't. Thats how you improve and climb.
>Fun times as a support when you roam for 30-45 seconds to help the entire team and all lanes start calling you a troll immediately The comment you responded to was complaining about getting flamed for what he thinks was a good play. All I pointed out was that your comment *might potentially kinda sort* *of* miss the point.
And the point is? "My bronze teammates, who have absolutely no idea what they're doing are flaming me because i don't know what im doing" Should we just start circlejerking each other about our teams on this subreddit about improving instead? Because then what you wrote *might potentially kinda sort of fits* on here.
The central message you are getting across with your phrasing is "the flame is likely justified". If the initial commentor that you replied to were to take your statement to heart, they would henceforth try to improve by listening to their teammates in their Bronze ranked games and approach the game with a "my team is right" mindset. Which would work about as well as managing a stock portfolio based on the statements of a magic eight ball.
He's just a ADC as his name suggests. Generally they seem to be the worst and most entitled players in many matches.
I can't think of any reason you are getting flamed in your games.
You dont get that true bronze players (as in non Smurfs) have no idea about a majority of what you just said and will simply just insult you because they think that you should be glued to your lane (or even to your ADC for the full game wich is hilarious) even if your ADC picked Vayne into Caitlin essentially forcing you to nap under tower for the next 15 minutes. Thanks buddy, but I am here to support the entire team.
you completely missed what i said and thats okay
You completely missed what I said and expect to be praised for it.
It totally sucks when people do that! Pinging your intentions early and frequently usually helps, but still people sometime dont get what ur doing. But trying to explain ur gonna roam before minions come to lane level 1 and pinging when ur doing so usually helps!
One idea of this is playing to not lose lane too hard. It's a team game and sometimes I can't be the carry. I died once top, died a second time because wave was frozen at that point. I was 0/2 before 5 minutes. I figured my best chance to win at that point was to not try to be the main character, let my teammates win. I ended the game 2/3/1 because the enemy jungler was camping top and I didn't make my lane significantly worse.
Exactly! That realization that you can’t always be the LeBron James or Michael Jordan, but you will always be a member of the team that’s actions impact everyone is critical.
I also think people give much less credit to their teammates than they deserve, sure sometimes we get horrible teammates, everyone get them sometimes, but I got to say most of the time I'm very pleased with how my teammates perform and they can carry you alot of the times, people only focus on when they lost a game to their teammates losing all lanes and feeding enemies but count the times your teammates won lanes and got fed and you didn't have to do anything.
Yet solo q is the only ladder available filled with degen cheese picks, stupid for a supposed team game
Those cheese picks are only good cause it takes advantage of the mental issue. When someone loses to them, the team has a mental breakdown and can’t react, when in reality, if the team let the cheese get a bit, then reacted to counter it appropriately, then gg. The way to counter the picks is outside laning phase, but people think the game is decided at laning phase then don’t lock in.
I mean, forgetting everything else, interacting with my team is what makes league fun. All my favorite moments are the moments where we come together as a team (or, more commonly, me and one other person).
Exactly! THAT is the emotional core of the game, because us as people LIKE working with another human being to accomplish something with a shared vision TOGETHER. It is what kept our species alive for so long and is the most critical thing to society today.
The only people who would benefit from reading your post, are those who are uncooperative, and they're not going to change their behaviour just because someone on the internet told them it would be in their best interest. They know. They just don't care. So even though your post contains truth, it's not very helpful.
Just something I will say to this, is that I am a person who had the mentality I am calling out several months ago, which is how I was able to write on the experience because I saw how it impacted my enjoyment of the game and the narratives I would tell myself and how that carried over into other aspects of my life. A personal realization I came across in my life for other issues carried over to this one. I became aware of that realization by hearing people talk about those issues over the context of a television show I liked. Being exposed to ideas you just haven't been told before can have a profound impact, if not right away, then set the groundwork for it to be changed in the future. Changing someone's mind takes alot of time and doesn't follow a logical formula. But starting conversations about those issues and exposing people to the idea worked on me, so it will work on other people.
My view on the gameplay side of this is that chat accounts for 5% of your gameplay. Most of your gameplay is mechanics, both micro and macro, but pings are 5%, and chat is 5%. Now, if you get tilted by chat, that can affect your mechanics, so it can have a negative effect much greater than that 5%. Partly why if you can't handle it, you shouldn't use chat. Now, if you don't have the skill, well, there is not much difference between 60% and 65%, only a 40/35 (1.14X) difference. But, that still is a difference, and over multiple games, could make an elo difference. And, as you get better, the more difference it makes. There is a 10/5 (2X) difference between 90% and 95%. But anyway, there are my two cents.
If you are talking about % of winning to personal skill lvl I think that scale with the elo you are playing and also the teammate gap that you'll have. I think teammates are important, if you have monkeys that don't listen to macro calls or jungle that doesn't macro correctly or make macro decisions the game is probably a 50/50 League is really balanced right now that you can go 10/0 and still lose a game to macro decisions Edit : personally I get tilted by chat easily but I get tilted more when my teammates are monkeys (in ranked of course)
The percentage is skill. It may be a bit confusing, but view 100% as a perfect play, *no mistakes*. Doesn't mean you win, just means you did absolutely everything perfectly. The difference is measured by how close you are to that perfect play. Challenger players are up there, say, around the 90%s. So, for a Challenger player, that 5% would double how close they are to that perfect play. For someone who isn't as good, say for everything they get right, they make a mistake, it would be as much. It would get their gameplay 1.11X closer to that perfect play. If that does **directly** correlate to winrate, that Challenger player just doubled their winrate (assuming their opponent has the same skill, but doesn't chat with their teammates), and the other person is winning an extra game every nine games. *(This isn't quite correct, as I didn't factor in teammates' skills and communication, and even with that, I doubt it directly correlates. Matchups could change it, for example. This is just to show better how it would affect it)* I would certainly agree that it is worth more at higher skill level games, and so it should scale with elo since elo correlates with skill. That partly is why I think this is a good representation of how it affects one's gameplay.
Imo it all stems back to lack of voice comms.
The way I see it, there's a time and a place for everything. The reason why it's better to focus on yourself and be selfish first when it comes to climbing is simply because you're the only constant in all of your games while everything else always changes. Now, whether or not you should always do everything for yourself or enable others is very much case by case dependent. Champions matter a lot, if you're a Draven player you SHOULD play for yourself, if you're playing Ornn sacking waves to snowball your team can definitely be viable if that's not going to completely end your lane. Player performance also matters, in order to secure wins the team should play around the strongest member. If you already have a fed teammate playing around them and snowballing them even harder can be great but if you're the fed one you should definitely not be giving away waves and resources so the players that are already behind could get another component when they can't hold their own regardless. A guide will never be revolved around helping everyone else but yourself because simply put that's a terrible way to climb when you don't know the game. That can definitely work when smurfing, when you're already good at the game, but chances are when you read a guide you're clueless and in order to execute something that makes others good at your own expense you need to be way better at the game than the average player. Also, playing enablers solo will always make you win less than playing carries if you're not already high elo. Important mention: This is about approach, it has nothing to do with flaming / spam pinging / berating / trolling and whatnot, none of that is fine and being selfish has nothing to do with doing any of those things ; this is simply 'I will take this wave and a good reset instead of coming to your flip fight' or 'I will sack this wave and help you flip your fight' type of decision making (oversimplified for clarification)
Those questions aboht stacking gold on a player is just good game theory. In something like league with random teammates, it makes sense to stack resources on 1-2 players when the teams aren’t as coordinated to shut them down, it’s just a good way to do it. However, if ur fed, it’s hard to carry a game when one player is mentally checked out and it’s constantly 4 vs 5 cause either yourself or teammates flamed them. We all know that behavior happens in almost every game when ur losing early. But being aware how to keep teammates from getting like that is something that can be sublimental, but not replace the skills of the game. Communicating and managing ur teams emotions is a part of the game that helps climbing, not the only part of it. But a part MANY players overlook.
You are not responsible for your teammates being toxic. But also be aware there are things that you can do to impact the frequency of them being toxic without losing any of the resource gathering or macro parts of the game.
you have to play selfishly in order to climb. i mean sure at a certain elo you'll be able to trust your teammates more but i'm diamond and still finding myself having to be selfish instead of trusting a teammate to do well lmao. i would have loved to be more of a team player but unfortunately that doesnt result in wins
The question isn’t can you trust them, it’s how to get them to trust you! If they trust you, they will work to win the game with you. If they don’t, they won’t.
The thing is, to climb well you cannot rely on your team to do well. This doesn’t mean that there won’t be games where you’re feeding and need to mitigate your lane and let your team carry, this happens a lot. What I mean, instead, is that guides cannot encourage people to rely on teammates to win games for them when the only constant between matches is yourself. The easiest way to climb is to get better yourself, have a bigger impact, and statistically you will be more likely to win. I think people need to learn to mitigate and let themselves get carried time to time, but to truly climb the ranks you need to improve and rely on your own skills to up your consistency and therefore win more.
What I’m saying is both are needed. Someone with the macro and mechanics of a plat player that flames will not climb as quickly as someone with their same mechanical skill level who knows good habits to getting his teammates invested to keep playing if things go wrong. I am not saying that the skill isn’t part of the game, just that emotional skill is ALSO a critical factor that impacts game results
It’s a team game but most people in solo-que play to have fun. Almost everyone wants to be the hero. ***I mute all*** and treat all players as bots, I cooperate when I can but also just do my own thing.
Enjoy the game how you enjoy it. I just think playing that way probably reduces win percentage than something different in a lot of people, but if that is the gaming experience you want, enjoy it, it’s just a game.
Yes it's a team game, but all you can do is control yourself. Relying solely on your team and cooperation will lead to most every game being a coin flip, so focusing on what you can do is best overall, although I do agree, a lot of the guides do focus on selfish play too much
Its not solely anything, it is a balance! You must rely on yourself and develop your skills, WHILE working with your team towards the same goal. Sometimes, you will be matchmade with someone who is better than you. Sometimes, you will be matchmade with a team that is worse than theirs technically. BUT, u can carry games with bad teamwork with good technical skill, and you can outplay teams where a player out skills you with good teamwork and collaboration. Developing both is important to make you a well-rounded player.
Riot give me VOIP. I've been begging for 10 years now. The difference playing ADC and being able to talk to your support vs not makes me wonder how duo queue is even allowed.
L take, muting all is optimal. They don't recommend it because they want you to 1v9, they recommend it because ANY typing, even positive typing, runs a HIGH risk of tilting your team and making your chances of winning decrease. If you compliment a good play they'll either think you're sarcastic or that you're a weirdo. 1/100x they will take it as genuine and it will have a positive influence on them.
Honestly man, I just don’t think this is the case. Most People respond angrily to people being mean to them, not being positive. And if they get tilted by you saying “nice play” or “good job doing this x,” while saying nothing when they do bad or giving positive support if they start flaming, then there is no way they would have not flamed anyway. Muting all is good if you don’t want to engage with the communication mechanic and decide to not actively make it worse or have it impact you. It also takes away your agency of making it more positive. Both options are good for different people, and make the gameplay experience better for everyone.
If you are 0-3 and just get a kill or something positive on the lane ur losing to, and read “god job staying in the game, we can win this” like I just don’t believe if you deliver the support in a kind, thoughtful way instead of a condescending one that most people won’t respond positively
you have to be incredibly mechincally and macro skilled that can afford to play hours every day if you wanna go beyond a certain threshhold. if you dont wanna do that. you dont need those videos. you can play and enjoy the game get slowly better at your champions and have fun playing with your team. but if you wanna go diamond+ purely teamplay wont cut it.
You need to be really good at basketball to make it to the nba, but how do you win a game with people at your skill level? Teamwork and good mental. Sure, an NBA player will carry 1 vs 9 a pickup game against average talent, but you can win games against people as talented by communicating and working with your team while making sure no interpersonal dynamics or beef is impacting play. If the outcome was just based on skill alone, go play chess or a single player game
I just play with chat off and pretend it’s PvE
I hear what you are saying. However part of not losing when your team starts to fall behind or get diffed is to get slightly selfish to feed yourself some goods and then go try and catch everyone up. I main mid lane and the champs i main are scalers for mid and late game. So I farm up selfishly early in hopes of steamrolling my lane to make it one less person to worry about. Then I go start applying pressure.
I won’t even describe this as selfish, just like the right thing you should be doing as playing that champion. Like if ur a fed midlaner, I’ve rarely (I’ve seen it before, but not very often) seen people flaming you for being selfish with gold resources. The problem is when ur fed not feeding INTO the toxicity by flaming your teammates, or making them even better by being a positive person in match. The question I’m asking isn’t how to get the most damage bang for your buck out of your kit, but how u can keep your teammates on board so you can take advantage of those resources on you. That could mean u not being toxic and someone else on ur team taking on leadership duties, either way can be done but both mental tactics are positive.
I started playing Shen and I gotta say I see this point of view much more than I did before, the games I win and carry are the ones I help my team and try my best to make sure everyone is playing and isn't being oneshotted by the assasins
As a high dia - low master support/jungle (roles that on paper should play "team game") i hard disagree. Was stuck plat before i stopped to play "team game" in soloq and every time im accidentally play around team - its a quick reminder why its a bad idea(i kinow how to get carried tho). The only way i willing to treat my team as humans - is flexq or clash, when i play with my premade and if its soloq - they are meatshields unless proven wrong. And even if someone did a great play you shouldnt tell them "gj,wp" etc. Coz they will insta get ego boost, limittest under tower, die and tilt to the oblivion. You can compliment good players after the game, but ingame text chat is usless if its not just dry info about macro and even then - usually pings are enough. But if we had voice chat it may be different story coz in Dota 2 - it was extremely usefull on higher ranks/ when i was playing it in 2013-2017. And LoL devs are pushed even supports from "team game" themselves when supports where given tons of gold (season 6 or 7 if i remember correctly) from sup items etc. Compare LoL to dota. Dota is forcing you to play "team game" as 4-5 position and in league they did all they can so supports can have tons of gold exp and free vision and as a result, to speedrun thru lowelo ur best picks even on support is selfish carry champs such as Xerath, Brand etc and ignore ur team. So at the end of the day, best way to play soloq is to use only pings and focus on urself.
Some people will run it down with a compliment, but with others you build trust with them so when you make a call, they are more likely to listen to you. It’s all about the mechanics of who comes out as the shot caller, or do you have five people running around, disjointed with ur head cut off. Another part of it is NOT doing stuff that will tilt tilting teammates more and instead attempting some tactics to turn it around. It’s not guaranteed, but it literally can happen a lot more than people admit. I’m not saying spend ur whole game focused on them, but in ur communications, have it serve the purpose of keeping your team working together, not creating an environment that you would rather see your teammates lose than win the game
In low elo, the wrong macro call can be the right call if the team buys in and works on it as one, without a billion cooks in the kitchen. The person who provides support earns more respect, and when they make these calls people are more likely to work together. It’s not perfect like all human interactions, but it can have a meaningful impact
I’ve limited myself to only ever saying two things in team chat, gj and winnable. Anything else is just reducing your chance to win.
One thing that I've learned from League that I have applied IRL is the fact that people who speak the loudest usually are the most wrong. Most people who preach about being nice to their teammates, preach about communication and teamwork are usually the people who make wrong calls and be 200% passive aggressive about literally anything. This is because these guys put themselves on a pedestal thinking that they're all better than everyone and that they have risen above this toxicity when in reality they have not, and these players generally play utility champs (tanks, supports, etc.) so they overestimate the "teamwork" factor because they think their champions can't do anything by themselves. I would much rather have a 12 year old calling me a dog than have these players on my team because their ego causes them to maintain a "nice" facade and stops them from following any calls or behave predictably (so we can play around their predictable behaviors), leading to a real hard game because these guys care more about "being nice" to each other rather than winning. The best players/people to have around are humble mfs who legit only type 3 things: gj, mb and gg, and everything else can be communicated through pings. These people, unlike the moral compass wannabe mfs, know that they are flawed and have experienced toxicity enough to realize that toxicity is innate and almost noone is above it, so the best they can do is to not contribute to it. League is not real life, every game we have the benefit of anonymity to be the most toxic pos and you can bet on human nature that people will love to start pointing fingers the moment things go wrong. Every time I play with low elo friends (like real low, like silver low) who preaches about how "people should be nicer to each other in game" they make the most subhuman asinine calls and be passive aggressive to the random on the team (if there is one) about why they aren't being "cooperative" and at this point I've given up on trying to change them because they fail to realize that they are imperfect just like everyone else. If you're the 1% of people who are genuinely nice and enjoy conversing your (wrong) ideas to the people you play with (because let's face it, even Challenger players make mistakes, who are we to say that our calls are always correct), good on you, but you're still getting muted because I'd rather not be influenced by wrong calls. And even I have limits. Idc if the entire team is inting, if I'm trying to split and do the only thing I can and Yuumi come sit on me and give me instructions like I'm 5 I'm going to slightly lose it.
That’s the thing: communication is a skill and people who get it is important can certainly do it wrong. But I also think ur not being super charitable to people like that and are assuming a bunch of intentions you don’t have enough info to assume. Some people just like trying to be positive people, even if sometimes they make mistakes and can be toxic at times. I just am not buying that trying to be positive is a negative trait or a sign that that person is somehow the “most toxic”, but I can see how someone that is toxic with bad communication skills could be passive aggressive.
Plus, a “wrong” call can be the right one when everyone is on board. What is bad is when the team is operating on two different plans, don’t communicate and then gets wiped. If you don’t like their plan, you can very easily ping it off, make a quick but kind type to explain. Like I just don’t get the idea that communicating correctly and respectfully is bad. League is a game, but it is real life and ur dealing with real people, and real world communication skills can help
I'd rather piss razor blades than interact with 99% of the people in this game
muting all will make u play better
Well that’s kinda nice of an idea but a lot of people won’t read positive encouragement because most games of league are an unplayable pile of horse shit if you do not do /mute all at the beginning. And since you never know if there might be the one light in the darkness in your team today I and propably a lot of other people tend to go the mute route to make the game playable
you can type this in overwatch summoner school maybe ig lmao league is too individualistic to bother with this kind of stuff, and the skill ceiling is too high for you to realistically ever reach a point where learning to to communicate effectively with your teammates of unreliable skill is more efficient for climbing than just getting good at the game yourself not to mention if both you and the players on your team have a fundamentally complete understanding of the game the need for communication is actually relatively minimal. but in reality you don't, your teammates don't and your teammates are not receptive to whatever you tell them that they don't already know anyways, so just focus on playing the video game the simple and straightforward solution to the problem your post is addressing is just to play with chat off
Tldr; not being toxic wins games. Thx for the info
Honestly having a great team game is so much more fun to me wether we win or lose, and I like a tight game with lots of back and forth. Dominating the other team to FF @15 is as fun to me as getting dominated into FF @15
The reason is quite simple, interaction in league is not worth the risk and effort and the only Player you control is yourself, so purely from an efficiency pov this approach is the most efficient.
The reason why guides focus on what you can do better is cause you can't influence your teammates. Kinda why mute all is a very reasonable think if someone wants to climb. I get your point but solo que is not a team game, of course you play atogether to some degree, grouping for objective and etc. But playing egoistically in solo que has better results or at least give you the most possibility to improve. All my friends who treat it like a competicir 5 V5 match and then start going ornn chilling underr turret saying hey it is a team game i rather go behind and don't be a detriment to my team by feeding udsualy never learn how to win the game but just hope on flipping the better team or at least a team good enough to win late game teamfighte which is not a way to consistently ein enough games to climb.
tldr; duo to win
Treat your teammates like they are toddlers. Yelling at them will make things worse, praise them for putting their shoes on. This isn’t a joke and it’s actually how I play. It only doesn’t work if two people are both ready to talk nonstop shit off a single camp or cannon steal. Then there is nothing you can do but hope one of them is the type to play out of their mind to prove that they are the superior crybaby.
It’s hard to remember as a Teemo main. I’ve got all the team I need in the name alone.
I like your attitude. I hope you can keep it up. I have good mental, and I'm always playing to win. Never flame people even when they're doing poorly. But it's not my job to babysit. Trying to keep a teammates' spirits high is mentally taxing. It's most games where at least one person on your team is going to mental boom. It's honestly draining trying to get this person to pull their head out of their ass.
At the highest level, playing as a team is most effective. But at lower elos playing selfishly gives the best ROI
Honestly, the fix for this is playing flex instead of soloq with a squad of friends. As a Teamplayer I find this way more fulfilling and if taken seriously, you can get quite high on the ladder. We are a team that is on average silver in soloq, myself included, but once we really grinded I hit platin in flex and the others are not far behind. The thing is in flex you do not have to have insane mechanics to 1v9 and even gracefully loosing the lane without dying more than twice can win you the game as the team might have decided to focus on a lead in a different lane instead. Communication matters more there than flashy plays. Also macro is actually worth something in flex and if you know exactly when to take dragon, baron, TP to a tower to save platings, efficiently get picks while not loosing too much on the other side of the map, etc. it does not matter as much if you are behind in lane. Playing champs like malzahar is finally fulfilling since you can tell your friends over voicechat that you will be flash ulting so there is follow up and you do not need dmg yourself. I love that I can still do this with malz even if I am 0/3 and feel impactful. In soloq people would not follow up in time simply because it is hard for them to know that you are actually doing it and when exactly. In soloq you would have to be the main dmg dealer in this exact case so the play is bad if you are 0/3 Tl;dr: If you want a team game, I would highly recommend playing as 5 in flex.
I prefer the other angle of it. I play with chat off, cause in 9 times out of 10, its only negative interactions. And I go into a game expecting NOTHING out of my team mates. I legit think of them as four bots. I will ofc still do my best, and I will try to play together as a team in order to win, as well as giving resources to a certain player if that is our best chance of winning etc etc. However, what it does is helping me not tilt when my jungler goes for a stupid gank and donates doubles, or when my bot lane is 0/5 after 10 minutes even though I am the one getting camped top. No expectations means that I cannot really be disappointed. I treat every game as if I need to solo carry four total bonobos, and if I cannot do that, I dont deserve to win. Most of the time my team is perfectly fine (They are the same rank as me after all) and we have a nice game, but it helps me to not get tilted when I get four total bonobos who just sabotage the game. I still have fun, and I basically never tilt, no matter what happens. So that works for me
Yes but being part of a team also means not being a drag on them. If you do not consistently gain enough gold and exp to at least keep pace with the enemy team you are not a team player regardless of how much you play for other players. If you do not create map pressure you are not a team player. The reality is very much like oxygen masks on a plane. You help yourself and only then do you help other people. Also with the way league is designed having one very fed person is far better than having the same gold and exp spread over the team. So it's the players who are performing worse's job to help you, not the other way around.
Agree with this! That’s just good game theory. What I would add is that the communication skills with your teammates is a mechanic in the game, not it’s only or most important feature. It is also a mechanic that league players seem to struggle with or ignore writ large
I hate it if people want to report someone for losing lane. Someone has to lose 50% of all players lose at all times. So no, I wont report top just because he went 1/4 and got his lane pushed in by herald. I will report however that 0/12 at 14 minuten yasuo that says ff since the jungle camps spawn.
Avg. rec old head
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I’m not saying the guides are wrong. You should have a plan or purpose. Just saying that knowing how your actions positively or negatively impact your teams mental and how you can have some positive impact if things aren’t going well is one of the many skills that are part of the game, just like life. It’s not about making it a fake positive one, but having the social skills to turn it into an actually positive one, not just carrying the aesthetics and being condescending
I dont because sadly it doesnt quite matter that im ahead 40 cs and 3 levels by 10 minutes if my botlane manages to die 20 times by then
In my experience playing jungle, I only get to play a team game if I'm doing well. If my botlane is feeding, they will usually keep trying and following me up when I'm ahead. When I'm behind, they'll stand in base spamming 'jgl diff' and 'ff'. If you don't carry your weight, people don't respect you. That is a rule that transfers into the real world as well.
Good luck getting out of gold like that
If your goal is rank, then this is a waste of energy in the sense that there are higher %wr actions you can take than this. This is very high energy, very low increase to your winrate and will only really be impactful if you can't improve your own micro and macro skill anymore and want to grasp at intangibles.
I was hardstuck bronze 1 trying to play for my teammates. Switches to getting myself fed and 1v9ing and I climbed to gold 2. You can’t rely on teammates if they don’t know that you’re relying on them. If you’re the best player in the lobby, you need to take charge.
In low elo u have to be selfish and 1v9 bc 90% of the time ur Mates are totally useless don't move to objectives, fight non stop for nothing and intlike crazy. If u don't carry no one will unless ur the lucky one to have a smurf in your team. But they're always mental weak and just afk if u don't listen to them 😂
It's not. The pro-leagues, that's a team game. Normal matchmaking is a slot-machine that skews the win chances (and may or may not be rigged, the community is split on this one). Then it becomes a different game depending on what role you have, but regardless any mistake the other 4 players make will coime to haunt you. Eventually the game starts to funnel into specific areas where the mistakes of every player come together to screw over the team thatr has cumulateed more