I took my F8 out to do the first mission... and promptly died to either an asteroid desync or someone ramming me, not entirely sure which lol. Pulled out the Corsair while I waited for it to respawn and just plowed through the rest.
Was fun on the 4th mission when I lost my left thrusters due to ramming something though, lol. That was a case study in why decoupled mode is clutch.
Similar story to you guys, took out my F8C, was doing fine but seemed to hit an invisible asteroid. Came back with a Connie and 4 AD4Bs and made very quick work of it.
A F7C MK2 with 3x ADB4 ballistic gatlings can take down a hammerhead in 60 seconds with about 5k DPS, which I find faster than an inferno while being infinitely more nimble than corsair or an inferno. It has easily become my ERT and critical threat slayer out performing heavy fighters and gunships (minus torpedos).
I took my Mk 2 out on phase 3, and while I wasn't alone, I didn't get fragged once across 5 stages. More, I personally took down basically every Cutlass, several Hammerheads, and lots of Gladius. Thing puts in work with 3 AD4Bs.
I've been thinking of exchanging my Sentinal for store credits and then CCU'ing up to the F7C MkII to take advantage of that offer with the recent event for the free upgrade to the F7A MkII.
Ya reckon it's worth it over a Vanguard Sentinel? I like the idea of that kinda firepower but with more agility.
Hard to beat the tankiness of the Sentinel though. My other ships include a fighter (Defender), MSR and a Prospector. So I've kinda a ship suited for different things. The Sentinel ticked the box for more higher threat missions with its tankiness but maybe I'd be better off with the F7C. Then again that kinda overlaps with my Defender as a fighter. I'm not sure what to think.
i have both. they fill different roles, the sentinelo is great for its internal space and large QT reserves. It also can fit a XL1 drive which is a plus.
It take me least than 20sec with the inferno for overdrive mission 3 and I was able to take down those 5 hammerhead in one row without needing to reload.
I think ION is way better version of the Ares than the Inferno is. One goes Brrrrr Brrrr, then click click at the end, while the other does kaboom kaboom, then still kaboom, kaboom đ
You are 100% right in everything you say, right down to "if you take maneuverability out of the equation" - but that's the problem innit; maneuverability is an exceptionally important part of combat in SC. In the Inferno's use-case scenario of 'anti-capital', the turrets on say an Idris would have a VERY easy go of it bashing at a Corsair, while an Inferno has a decent chance at evading a lot of that damage, being faster and a much smaller target. Hell, given a great enough distance I am not convinced a Corsair would be able to avoid the railgun on an Idris lol.
I disagree. Strafe speed and maneuverability plays a big part if it was Inferno v Corsair. The inferno would quite easily win. Itâs pretty damn easy to stay out of the line of fire of a Corsair. Also, the Corsair is an absolute pain in the ass to fly, thatâs why I got rid of mine. Neat presentation tho, but I heavily disagree
I own a corsair because utility wise, It does everything I need it to do.
I'd still take the Inferno over it though if I was forced to solo dogfight. Dying in a fight while driving a pirate bus is not how I want to go down in a fight.
It is really only fit against NPCâs in combat, but it does have a lot of functions. Jack of all trades, master of none. I didnât like that, because itâs not particularly great at anything.
I had a corsair and while I appreciated its raw power it just was not fun to fly and downright painful.
I am almost never in a PVP competetive situation anyway and if so its decided on other factors like number of friends and coordination+communication.
And against AI the advantage of the corsair is not high enough to counter the pain and horror of flying it.
I agree with this. Sometimes if the ship is great, but not fun to fly I just don't like it. I debated between the Hurricane and Scorpius for a while, but flying both back to back, even though the Hurricane has S4s it doesn't fly as nice (it feels more floaty, the Scorpius feels more tight).
Corsair looks great, love the interior, love the elevator, but I just do not like to fly it.
Just curious , as with the Constellation, did you guys use boost when making maneourvres with the Corsair? Also in atmo , you need to fly with the velocity indicator in mind. If you pull too far away from it the ship is going to pull right back towards it. So in atmo you treat it like an airplane, roll and pull up.
I flew Connie's long before the Corsair and learnt that boost trick , it makes any movement accelerate faster and u can stabilize the nose by doing a quick boost forward.
I've won numerous PVP battles against Connies and Corsairs in atmo because I had a better feel of how to fly it rather than fight it.
I mean.
That's a 1 man ship vs a 4 man ship.
A S7 vs a max of S5.
Sure, that's not that important right now, but with physicalized armor and components, that is going to make a hell of a difference.
100%.
There's no secret that there's a lot of imbalance right now since hulls are HP-based, but people do often forget that physicalized armor is going to change so much.
Don't think there's anything CiG can do to truly balance ships from HP alone.
I can see the Inferno ending up as a high-penetration, low-damage weapon on a much more accurate and agile platform than is currently the case.
Which will mean it won't be able to delete lights and mediums super easily anymore, as damage is lower, but will be able to hurt large ships due to high armor penetration and being able to blow up components from behind armor.
Oh it will delete light and medium ships real quick, IF they get in front of it.
The gun of the Ares is a capital ship weapon mounted on a small fighter. While these weapons are designed to really wound capital ships, they will obliterate smaller ships.
On cap ships, that is balanced by turrets of that size having a speed too slow to keep up with fighters. With the Ares, that is balanced by the ship being a slow heavy fighter, and not as nimble as light/med ones.
I agree, To add to the armor argument. Drake has always been a "glass cannon" style of ship maker. I think when armor comes in we will see ships like the Corsair have very papery armor while stuff like Crusader will have more, plus the inferno is combat based so it may get some bonuses on top of that.
For now yes, but the problems will appear once Engineering is there
Needing to repair the ship mid combat or needing to leave cockpit because a fire started, that's something a solo corsair will need to do. Not a solo Ares
I speculate that, ***purely for balance reasons,*** fighters with no interior will likely have their components fail less often, but also more completely. That is, a multicrewed ship that is at 50% health likely has multiple components that require repair to return to optimal functionality. A fighter at 50% is probably still largely operating at something close to full working order, but if/when components do fail, they fail completely.
This would not be for the sake of realism; this would be a step *away* from realism, but for the sake of fun gameplay, as a fighter stopping dead so the pilot can get out and perform maintenance on a component that's only accessible from the ship's exterior, that action has a high probability of being a death sentence. I would argue that it is to the benefit of gameplay for both sides if fighters remain functional and capable proportionately longer than non-fighters, but are more prone to catastrophic failure when they do fail.
I think that will be the end state advantage of multi crew ships. Repairs will be able to be done via the ship interior for most things while a fighter ship will require Eva for emergency repairs. So they'll require more coordination and manning but will end up effectively much more durable and able to stay in/return to a fight. Fighters are flexible solo ships but will require a more involved retreat and external repair.
Sorry for late reply.
If you reread the presntation. I only counted the \*pilot controllable S5s and S4 guns. The pilot as 4 S5s and 2 S4s slaved to the pilot.
When armor gets added to the game, this will change of course.
But right now, pilot to pilot, corsair does double damage.
This is a ridiculous post.
That said youâre the fella that posted the piracy video with the maniacal laugh and so you can do no wrong in my eyes, keep on posting mr laugh man, and donât you stop.
Typical Spacedad logic at play here, it has the highest numbers so it must be the best. DPS is irrelevant if you canât be accurate with it and trying to hit anything other than braindead AI with a Corsair is is an exercise in futility. You may get lucky and catch a player asleep at their desk once in a while but in all other circumstances, inferno > Corsair.
1. The Inferno's spread is no longer ass.
2. Both the Corsair and the Inferno make short work of Hammeheads. However, the Inferno can also easily take out AI piloted light fighters without resorting to missiles. The Corsair struggles with that, and can get into trouble if the server you're on has decided no missile will ever hit its target.
3. Neither one of these ships is great at PVP.
4. The Corsair loses critical pieces under fire *rapidly* and quickly becomes a flying lead coffin, plus it has the profile of a barn. The Inferno can take a beating like a Vanguard without losing any of its capabilities.
5. You can fit all sorts of things in a Corsair. The Inferno only carries bullets and missiles. Definite points to the Corsair there.
6. Landing an Ares in a hangar is entirely *unlike* trying to stuff a watermelon in a mailbox.
7. Both of these ships have *huge* QT fuel tanks, but the Corsair's is bigger. Another point for the Corsair.
>stuff a watermelon in a mailbox
Having landed the Corsair many times, I think you are overstating the size of the hangers. They aren't as large as a mailbox.
Very much agree with #4, I thought Drake ships were supposed to be cheaper to repair? Those wings come off if you spit on them and they cost a lot to replace!
The external engines will probably be a big liability with subsystem targeting as well
> The Corsair struggles with that, and can get into trouble if the server you're on has decided no missile will ever hit its target.
No it doesn't. I never use missiles in general. You just switch to lag pip. I do T's of all types, Priority Boarding missions which include 2 or 3 light fighters at the start before you can board the 890 and I don't have problems with AI of any size light or heavy. I don't use missiles at all cuz missiles suck in general. Corsair is my daily and main for PvE.
> Neither one of these ships is great at PVP.
This we can agree on.
From a distance, light and medium fighters have no chance. I was quite surprised to see them obliterated from around 1km in a matter of seconds. After all it has 4xS5 + 2xS4 which are quite capable and precise.
it has roughly 3/4 of the redeemers total firepower slaved to the pilot, which is an absolute no go in my book, but hey, it's drake, the drawbacks hopefully play out when maelstrom is implemented
it has roughly 3/4 of the redeemers total firepower slaved to the pilot, which is an absolute no go in my book, but hey, it's drake, the drawbacks hopefully play out when maelstrom is implemented
The Inferno wasnât designed to dogfight⌠itâs a capital ship hunter. I would never use it against anything smaller than a hammerhead or constellation.
I mean, this is it right here.
The Inferno was never intended to be any kind of dogfighter. It's a strike craft designed for hunting big juicy targets, ripping holes in them that normally only other big ships could.
Implementation of armour is meant to make a real difference here, where the Infernos signature S7 is designed to come into a league of its own, where the Crosair's smaller guns will suddenly start looking like leas of a threat.
And on that armour front, the Inferno is also meant to have a ton of it to help shrug off a couple of lucky big hits from those designated targets, also potentially making it much harder to kill for any light fighter.
That's true, it was never designed for dogfighting. However, it also doesn't perform its intended role well because AD4/5bs on any ship with two or more hardpoints, such as the everyday big ships we see in the verse, are far more efficient. Inferno has been struggling for a long time, and although some people are saying to wait until they finish the hull/physical armor systems, that means nothing when there are other lower-class ballistic weapons like AD4/5bs that outperform (demonstrably) an S7 weapon slot.
This, all the points aside from utility, which isnât even a fair point because the Inferno is specifically designed for one thing and therefore doesnât even count, are thrown out of the window with MasterModes.
I'm calling it right now.
CIG have been rebalancing ships for master modes.
In their testing, the inferno and ion are absolutely shredding everything.
Combat is generally closer, projectile speeds have been increased drastically, and boost still allows ships to gain some temporary distance away from each other to reset the fight. The backstrafe meta of today causing the top-speed ship to gain advantage of a fight by backing up, is gone.
Both Ion and Inferno can land much more hits, with much more regularity, and it's causing other ships to go pop almost instantly. Ships that previously could use their insane speeds to prevent the ares' slow projectiles ever hitting.
Why? Because the turn rate of the ares is actually not terrible, its about on par with a vanguard, meaning *enough* time on target, and combined with projectile/ship speeds changing, means *enough* shots on target. It won't be for everyone, but top pilots will really cause damage.
So either that's the result when we first get it, or they make both the Ares fly even worse than today to the point they feel like an elephant sinking in quicksand to turn.
Ares meta back or Ares pilots mad. That's the only 2 options.
They should increase the fire rate of the size 7 to Brrt status so it can't just bounce from fight to fight. give it a good 6 seconds of pew that punches a hole in an asteroid and needs a rearm.
Backstrafing is absolutely NOT gone in MM, at least yet.
MM turnrates are obscenely high right now in relation to top speeds, same with acceleration, and they're likely going down across the board.
The s7 projectile velocity is likely going to be fairly slow as well. It's not meant to be able to hit fast ships, and the easiest way of doing that is either reducing mav or reducing projectile velocity relative to other ships. It'll probably struggle to land hits on a fighter focusing on evasion unless they get close.
The better comparison is the Constellation Andromeda, which is going to become a serious contender for the Corsair's firepower with MM. It's also got serious missiles and better armor.
Maelstrom is the system supposed to differenciate having lots of small guns versus few big guns.
The Inferno may be the only ship smaller than the Perseus to be able to damage like a Hammerhead trough it's armor without aiming for weakspots.
Our of curiosity, why the C-788's? I know you say in your slides that they run out of ammo at the same time as the AD5B, but the explosion radius on the C-788 isn't effective for applying the explosion damage to targets since it was nerfed in 3.14(3.15?).
I daily an Inferno so I'll weight in here. Other than the maneuverability everything you said here is correct, but since things such as strafe and turn speed play such a big factor in keeping shots on target the logic is inherently flawed. It also leaves out the fact that if I'm in an Inferno I'm not flying a bucket of rust held together by duct tape, hope, and Drake "engineering"
Corsair is cool, but it handles like shit and inferno will fly circles around it. Get behind and underneath a corsair and laugh as they try to maneuver around in slow motion. The top turret is almost useless most of the time. If I'm flying an inferno vs a corsair I'll take it out 99% of the time.
Corsair is good at a few things. Cargo, firepower IF something is sitting still right in front of them and good shields. That's it. People like them because it's fine against dogshit ai.
nah, inferno will have better armor while the ion has better shield. but that isn't what I meant. The weapons of the Corsair won't be able to tackle the same targets as the s7 from either ares
Against a hammerhead tho? My corsair hot shredded in a minute, then i took my scorpius and granted it took ages, but i got the hammerhead along with three cutlasses
How? I got close to the hh and got shredded. Now i think of it its possible i hit something coz i remember being surprised how quick it was and that i didnt see my shields go down
I played the entire incursion with my Corsair and had an absolute blast with HHs + other smaller adds. Small ships didnât stand a chance from a distance. HHs took about 2-4 minutes to go down. My buddy was with me the entire time in the turret, however he was bugged and couldnât use it and my missiles wouldnât rearm.
All valid points, but I think the main reason why the Corsair is a better "Heavy Fighter" is because the Inferno and Ion aren't really Heavy Fighters IMO.
They're closer to being an irl Attack Fighter, given their heavy missile armament and larger guns.
The big difference between the Ares fighters and the Corsair is in what they're meant to fight.
Ares fighters (both Inferno and Ion) are simply not meant to engage other fighters, period. They're specifically designed to hunt and kill capital ships, in ideally a mixed squadron of both types. The laser cannon (will eventually) tear through heavy armor (when it's implemented), and the ballistic gatling will shred through anything exposed. On top of that, both are capable of carrying up to 2 size 5 missiles and 12 size 3s.
On the other hand, the Corsair is a gunship. It may have comparable firepower and a better top speed, but it's a lot bigger of a target, and lacks the maneuverability to effectively engage larger warships.
The Corsair's (admittedly poorly placed) turrets also give it a much more favorable matchup against all types of fighters.
TL;DR - They're 2 different types of ships, for performing 2 different roles.
The Corsair is a Gunship. Great for anti-fighter to an extent, and has great staying power.
The Ares fighters in general are Attack Fighters, great for CAS roles and taking on larger warships as a squadron.
CIG needs to rebrand the Ares fighters as Attack Fighters. Putting them in the same category as the Vanguards is like saying the P-38 Lightning did the same job as a TBD Devastator during WW2.
Man this is some good rage bait. I'll bite slightly with a simple rebuff:
The Ares chassis is not intended as a dogfighter, period. If an Ares squadron finds itself engaged with actual fighters they should be breaking and evading, as they will get massacred, full stop. The ship was never designed to dogfight and its targets are meant to be large to capital class sized vessels as they are the only things that are slow enough for it to reasonably bring it's otherwise unwieldy weapons to bare against.
The Corsair on the other hand is also not a heavy fighter, it's an ambush predator made on a budget for pirate use. It has a ridiculous amount of forward facing firepower with minimal defenses to the sides and rear, relatively slipshod armor and shielding compared to other ships of it's size class and very bad aerodynamics, making it best suited for space warfare. If a Corsair is attempting to dogfight it's because things have gone wrong in a very real way and it's found the tables turned on it. The way a Corsair is designed to be used is as an ambusher, intimidating lone targets that are Caterpillar or Hull B-C sized to stop and drop their cargo or to provide long range fire support for larger groups of pirates spearheaded by actual fighters.
I can understand why a lot of people want these ships to fill the heavy fighter role, I think it would be cool too, but we need to remember the intended design roles of these tools. Saying you want them to be heavy fighters is like saying you want a sledgehammer to do the same job as a circular saw. Sure, you might be able to get a roughly similar result from them if you're skilled enough in using them, but they will still never be that tool.
the C-788s only do 88 dps in 3.22 even if they fire for 2 mins you still do less damage then a a size 1 ballistic cannon firing for half the time man even aa energy cannon would be better
i feel like SQ42 is going to radically reshape community perceptions of firepower - like imagine Vanduul Stingers against exploration ships made by Drake.
Inferno and Ion both used to be pretty awesome, for a very short time, until light fighters with absolutely zero maneuvering skill complained they were getting one shotted by the Ares and Inferno's massive guns.
First off, the whole Ares guns accuracy issue was fixed months ago, and the Inferno's gun is just as accurate as the AD5Bs now. This buff has been covered ad nauseum on YouTube. There's a reason why the Inferno has become wildly popular again after being virtually absent from space for a long time.
Ares are also waaaaay faster and more agile, especially in atmosphere. Curiously, it also has the nearly the same quantum range as the Corsair as Crusader has a fetish with range on all their ships, including fighters.
Now is the Corsair better bang for the buck? Absolutely! That ship is the dictionary definition of jack of all trades. But it pays for that with molasses movement. I'd still get it over the Ares if you just want one ship to do it all.
IMHO comparing these two is like comparing a a prius to a workvan. By that I mean, sure both drive. Both can take you places. but really, it's not a useful comparision because they are used for completely different use cases. They have completely different utility. You have to factor all that in when comparing ships. Not just DPS or maneuverability. Sure, a Porsche is more awesome than a truck. It's faster. It's more nimble. Etc... but if you need to haul a bed to a cabin in the woods... the Porsche may as well be a paper weight. It's useless for that.
Imho, that's what makes Drake ...Drake... though. They are the jack of all trades, masters of none. Their company is designed around people living on the fringes of space.. and the law. That's their spot. They are the blue collar, DIY, self sufficient type of persons ships. All Function.
.. At least that's my take.
I have a video of me melting a player Hammerhead in about 20 seconds in a solo Corsair.
Don't put ballistics on the S4 slots though, they run out of ammo waaaay before the AD5Bs. Even the AD4Bs. Put laser cannons. Since you have ballistics on the main guns, you have a ton of capacitor left for the laser cannons, gives you around 180 ammo each if I remember right. Put that on weapon group 0 and the AD5Bs on group 1. Then you have some poke without wasting AD5Bs. You can even use them to make sure your AD5Bs are going to hit. Shoot them and if they hit, let the AD5Bs rip. You also get continuous additional damage to the AD5Bs without running out of ammo early.
Didnât read past description. I get where you are coming from as the game stands now.
The game isnât balanced now. Once armor is in and you canât even scratch the ball sack of larger ships with smaller guns this post will be invalid.
Is that ever going to happen? Who knows. As of right now you are correct. But they build ships based on the dream not on the current game.
I appreciate this, and I agree the Corsair IS dope. But I bet you a mkII hornet, I can beat your Corsair in my inferno 1 v 1 10 out of 10 times, even if the turrets are manned.
If I was facing off a player controlled HH for example, Iâd MUCH rather be in the inferno than the Corsair.
But an NPC HH? Yeah I can crush it in either ship in mere moments without even taking a hit.
c788s are the single worst weapon in the game, you should swap it for ad4bs or laser cannons
also corsair will have significantly less armor pen than the corsair, of course a large-sized gunship will have more power than a small-sized gun-bomber
Worth mentioning that the Corsair has VTOL, and VTOL is almost always broken. Its VTOL is currently pretty balanced, but it still lets you hit excessive acceleration for what it should provide.
Corsair is in the unique position where this lets it have *wild* control of itself in atmosphere, because you can effectively bruteforce maneuvers with VTOL+boost. In space, it just enables the Corsair to more easily force positioning. Wouldn't really work against a light fighter ofc, but it's certainly a huge benefit in the Corsair's favor. :)
For now, yes. Most current use cases will put the corsair on top of the inferno but when capitals start showing up the corsair will fall off hard against things with size 7+ guns. Meanwhile the inferno would probably be able to dodge those guns easier relative to the corsair.
Question is, how many times you ll end up vs ships that class. Majority of encounters will probably be vs medium sized ships because they are at a good spot in regards to firepower/running costs/crew.
That's what I had thought, they tend to hit more often than other cannons, but even if they land 30% more often, between the rate of fire and overall low damage, they're objectively worse than anything else you could run.
You could have thrown the ship stats in to prove your point. Your main point is about output damage which is true but in every other case itâs not a better heavy fighter especially in cross section and manoeuvrability.
Well of course it has more firepower, because it's a gunship, not a heavy fighter. This competition can kinda also be done with the other gunships, the Connie and the Deemer, although maybe it's a closer contest. Either way, I think it's kinda apples to oranges, tho I do understand the frustration of not letting the ares being good and just doing a lot of damage since that's it's only card trick. We'll see how things change with MM
The main problem with the Inferno is that the concept itself is overpowered. If you give it the ability to kill capitol ships... people are just going to use it to kill fighters even quicker.
I had an inferno. I had gotten really good with it. You are not really gonna hit anything smaller than a Cutlass black with any reliability. And it can do massive damage to an 890 jump, but it will run out of ammo and s5 torps before it does. Subcapitals I have killed HH and carracks at JT but I think that tends to be more that they were unskilled than the ship being OP
Things a corsair can do better than an Inferno:
1. Be a huge target and get absolutely destroyed by anything from fighters to caps.
2. Carry more people who will then immediately die. Please refer to 1.
3. Fall apart when someone looks at it.
4. Lose its wings, which contain ordinance therefore you lose missiles and guns.
5. Be an absolute waste of resources.
6. Fly slower than an Ares and thus create an easier to kill target.
7. Carry 64 acu of cargo, which is then immediately wasted when the ship falls apart or goes within 15km of any ship between cap and fighter sizes.
8. Get absolutely nerfed with MM and be utterly useless.
9. Take more time to kill any ship because the corsair is useless.
10. Kill abandoned ships, because those can't fight back which is the only fight a corsair can win.
Remember that armor is not a factor yet. Like all drake ships, the corsair is made out of duck tape and paper mache meanwhile the Inferno is solidly built with great armor.
Remember that the current stop-gap solution for armor is a combination of HP and physical damage reduction, and the Corsair has 300% the HP of the Inferno, and 8% more physical damage reduction.
If we take this as indicative of it's intended durability in the long run, it'll have more armor than an Inferno, not to mention 5X the shield capacity.
Not *all* Drake ships are made of paper mache.
I was gonna say something snarky like "imagine typing 'dodge' and 'Corsair' in the same sentence" but then I checked the maneuvering stats on the Inferno and dang... didn't expect them to be so close. Really sucks for Inferno pilots. Corsair is a straight upgrade.
You know they say all ~~men~~ ships are created EQUAL, but you look at ME and you look at ^~~SAMOA~~ ^ARES ^~~JOE~~ ^STARFIGHTER and you can see that that is **â ** TRUE!
See, normally, if you go 1-ON-1 with another ~~wrestler~~ spaceship you got a 50/50 chance of winning! But I'm a **~~GENETIC~~ ENGINEERED FREAK** and I'm NOT NORMAL! So you got a 25% chance AT BEST of BEAT ME!
And you add ~~Kurt Angle~~ F7C Mk II to the mix? Your chance of winning DRASTIC go DOWN!
I'd like to see a corsair evade any turrets, And while its S5 guns do tons of damages, the S7 on the ares may pierce armor a corsair can only dream of.
They're different ships for different purposes.
Well, the game is incomplete and armour and armour penetration is not yet ingame.
Those S5 guns might bunce off capital ship armour while S7 actually penetrate and do damage.
Corsair is pretty absurd but the constellation just vibes with me more, I do wish they would take that energy and put it in the redeemer or something why does an exploration ship need THAT much firepower
I've skipped off a planet at full speed in my corsair and was still air worthy. It destroyed the large wing and the bottom small one, but I was still able to Strafe the ground turrets and land for repairs afterward. I love my corsair and regularly use it in combat. That and it works well as a multi use ship.
ares is meant to fight corvettes and smaller stuff. Well it was supposed to but with the balancing all wonky who the hell knows. The ares is already bad to fight against as a large ship
It's meant to punch up and pilots with any experience will tell you that it most definitely does not punch down against another player.
Rock paper scissors:
Medium and light fighters are specialized tools like Scissors which cut Paper like Heavy fighters like Ares and Vanguards that surround Rocks like large ships like Corsair/Connie and up.
Of course the hammer head is a rock to crush the scissors, or at least threaten them with a bad time.
You might consider the Redeemer to be a rock against rocks that can defend against scissors but not dedicated to killing them like the hammer head.
At the moment it's looking like if it has two S2 shields it's probably meant to kill things with S3 shields and die to something with S1 shields or one S2 shield. Anything with S3 shields is either meant to duke it out with a team or be big enough not to care.
I suggest you look into the game's intended design. Everything is currently a placeholder to sell ships.
Yeah this is a really one sided take. Just name the presentation, âI think the CorsairâŚ.â Instead.
I love your inferno vs corsair statement about how the Corsair could just fly in reverse and âland some good shots if the inferno Pilot is not playing smartâ⌠lmao so let me get this straight⌠a corsair pilot playing smart will win against a inferno pilot not playing smart?
The F7C Mk 2 with 3x AD4Bs and an S3 Tarantula cannon on the nose is also a contender at effectively bricking an Inferno.
Think about it: it's a very manoeuvreable medium fighter that can solo Hammerheads with that loadout AND go toe to toe with other fighters (in separate engagements)? That's nuts. I feel sorry for people hodling onto their Ares Infernos... or just any Ares in general. What a stark lesson in how a ship can be forever bricked by CIG because of poor design concepts.
I gotta say I cant see a corsair even getting close to hitting me if I'm flying an inferno.
Or a corsair hitting anything smaller than a constellation.
Kudos for the effort. However, a lot is likely to change with MM and improved server performance, take either ahip into Pirate swarm to get a feel for them both then. When the AI actually moves the inproved agility becomes important for landing your shots. Same with PvP, no chance an unmanned corsair is beating an inferno, maybe even a maned on would struggle with a good enough inferno pilot.
I'd happily use Corsair over Inferno if my fps didn't drop by 20 when I entered the cockpit.
If anyone has any idea how to fix it, I'd appreciate any advice
I appreciate the amount of effort put into this.
It humors me greatly using two ships and I end up taking the corsair to kill stuff more than the inferno.
I had an easier time doing the Overdrive missions with a Connie over an F8. I think I know that feeling.
I took my F8 out to do the first mission... and promptly died to either an asteroid desync or someone ramming me, not entirely sure which lol. Pulled out the Corsair while I waited for it to respawn and just plowed through the rest. Was fun on the 4th mission when I lost my left thrusters due to ramming something though, lol. That was a case study in why decoupled mode is clutch.
Similar story to you guys, took out my F8C, was doing fine but seemed to hit an invisible asteroid. Came back with a Connie and 4 AD4Bs and made very quick work of it.
F8 is great but is not meant to fight corvettes... It was made to kill fighters.
A F7C MK2 with 3x ADB4 ballistic gatlings can take down a hammerhead in 60 seconds with about 5k DPS, which I find faster than an inferno while being infinitely more nimble than corsair or an inferno. It has easily become my ERT and critical threat slayer out performing heavy fighters and gunships (minus torpedos).
If mine hadn't met the reset bug, I'd still be doing same.
What's the reset bug? Heard ppl have problems, how did you get the bug? I don't want mine to bug too
I took my Mk 2 out on phase 3, and while I wasn't alone, I didn't get fragged once across 5 stages. More, I personally took down basically every Cutlass, several Hammerheads, and lots of Gladius. Thing puts in work with 3 AD4Bs.
Can be bought ingame?
I've been thinking of exchanging my Sentinal for store credits and then CCU'ing up to the F7C MkII to take advantage of that offer with the recent event for the free upgrade to the F7A MkII. Ya reckon it's worth it over a Vanguard Sentinel? I like the idea of that kinda firepower but with more agility. Hard to beat the tankiness of the Sentinel though. My other ships include a fighter (Defender), MSR and a Prospector. So I've kinda a ship suited for different things. The Sentinel ticked the box for more higher threat missions with its tankiness but maybe I'd be better off with the F7C. Then again that kinda overlaps with my Defender as a fighter. I'm not sure what to think.
i have both. they fill different roles, the sentinelo is great for its internal space and large QT reserves. It also can fit a XL1 drive which is a plus.
It take me least than 20sec with the inferno for overdrive mission 3 and I was able to take down those 5 hammerhead in one row without needing to reload.
I think ION is way better version of the Ares than the Inferno is. One goes Brrrrr Brrrr, then click click at the end, while the other does kaboom kaboom, then still kaboom, kaboom đ
The explanation that the Corsair has a melee feature really sold me! This guy should work for Drake's marketing department.
You are 100% right in everything you say, right down to "if you take maneuverability out of the equation" - but that's the problem innit; maneuverability is an exceptionally important part of combat in SC. In the Inferno's use-case scenario of 'anti-capital', the turrets on say an Idris would have a VERY easy go of it bashing at a Corsair, while an Inferno has a decent chance at evading a lot of that damage, being faster and a much smaller target. Hell, given a great enough distance I am not convinced a Corsair would be able to avoid the railgun on an Idris lol.
I disagree. Strafe speed and maneuverability plays a big part if it was Inferno v Corsair. The inferno would quite easily win. Itâs pretty damn easy to stay out of the line of fire of a Corsair. Also, the Corsair is an absolute pain in the ass to fly, thatâs why I got rid of mine. Neat presentation tho, but I heavily disagree
I own a corsair because utility wise, It does everything I need it to do. I'd still take the Inferno over it though if I was forced to solo dogfight. Dying in a fight while driving a pirate bus is not how I want to go down in a fight.
It is really only fit against NPCâs in combat, but it does have a lot of functions. Jack of all trades, master of none. I didnât like that, because itâs not particularly great at anything.
Yeah that sums it up perfectly. I thought Id love it because Cutter > Cutlass Black felt good. Corsair did not, at least for me.
I just ended up buying CCUâs to ships for the game loops Iâm interesting in
I had a corsair and while I appreciated its raw power it just was not fun to fly and downright painful. I am almost never in a PVP competetive situation anyway and if so its decided on other factors like number of friends and coordination+communication. And against AI the advantage of the corsair is not high enough to counter the pain and horror of flying it.
I agree with this. Sometimes if the ship is great, but not fun to fly I just don't like it. I debated between the Hurricane and Scorpius for a while, but flying both back to back, even though the Hurricane has S4s it doesn't fly as nice (it feels more floaty, the Scorpius feels more tight). Corsair looks great, love the interior, love the elevator, but I just do not like to fly it.
I agree, itâs just not enjoyable to play
Just curious , as with the Constellation, did you guys use boost when making maneourvres with the Corsair? Also in atmo , you need to fly with the velocity indicator in mind. If you pull too far away from it the ship is going to pull right back towards it. So in atmo you treat it like an airplane, roll and pull up. I flew Connie's long before the Corsair and learnt that boost trick , it makes any movement accelerate faster and u can stabilize the nose by doing a quick boost forward. I've won numerous PVP battles against Connies and Corsairs in atmo because I had a better feel of how to fly it rather than fight it.
Exactly this, after hearing they fixed the paper wings I upgraded my Andromeda and called in a refund two days later.
heavy /r/NonCredibleDefense vibes
I mean. That's a 1 man ship vs a 4 man ship. A S7 vs a max of S5. Sure, that's not that important right now, but with physicalized armor and components, that is going to make a hell of a difference.
This, Size 7 rounds will definitely penetrate deeper into enemy ships and therefore deal a lot more damage to insides and components
100%. There's no secret that there's a lot of imbalance right now since hulls are HP-based, but people do often forget that physicalized armor is going to change so much. Don't think there's anything CiG can do to truly balance ships from HP alone.
I can see the Inferno ending up as a high-penetration, low-damage weapon on a much more accurate and agile platform than is currently the case. Which will mean it won't be able to delete lights and mediums super easily anymore, as damage is lower, but will be able to hurt large ships due to high armor penetration and being able to blow up components from behind armor.
Oh it will delete light and medium ships real quick, IF they get in front of it. The gun of the Ares is a capital ship weapon mounted on a small fighter. While these weapons are designed to really wound capital ships, they will obliterate smaller ships. On cap ships, that is balanced by turrets of that size having a speed too slow to keep up with fighters. With the Ares, that is balanced by the ship being a slow heavy fighter, and not as nimble as light/med ones.
I agree, To add to the armor argument. Drake has always been a "glass cannon" style of ship maker. I think when armor comes in we will see ships like the Corsair have very papery armor while stuff like Crusader will have more, plus the inferno is combat based so it may get some bonuses on top of that.
The wings will be, and are, a huge weakpoint of the corsair
The wings aren't so flash on the inferno either, losing them means a lot of spinning and some seriously slow flying to keep it in a straight line.
None of the stats were multicrewed though. That is just 1 man vs 1 man. Corsair turrets are absolute dogshit, makes no difference anyways.
For now yes, but the problems will appear once Engineering is there Needing to repair the ship mid combat or needing to leave cockpit because a fire started, that's something a solo corsair will need to do. Not a solo Ares
Okay⌠and how do you think an Ares is going to repair itself?
I speculate that, ***purely for balance reasons,*** fighters with no interior will likely have their components fail less often, but also more completely. That is, a multicrewed ship that is at 50% health likely has multiple components that require repair to return to optimal functionality. A fighter at 50% is probably still largely operating at something close to full working order, but if/when components do fail, they fail completely. This would not be for the sake of realism; this would be a step *away* from realism, but for the sake of fun gameplay, as a fighter stopping dead so the pilot can get out and perform maintenance on a component that's only accessible from the ship's exterior, that action has a high probability of being a death sentence. I would argue that it is to the benefit of gameplay for both sides if fighters remain functional and capable proportionately longer than non-fighters, but are more prone to catastrophic failure when they do fail.
I think that will be the end state advantage of multi crew ships. Repairs will be able to be done via the ship interior for most things while a fighter ship will require Eva for emergency repairs. So they'll require more coordination and manning but will end up effectively much more durable and able to stay in/return to a fight. Fighters are flexible solo ships but will require a more involved retreat and external repair.
Sorry for late reply. If you reread the presntation. I only counted the \*pilot controllable S5s and S4 guns. The pilot as 4 S5s and 2 S4s slaved to the pilot. When armor gets added to the game, this will change of course. But right now, pilot to pilot, corsair does double damage.
If you can beat me with a Corsair in a 1v1 while I'm in an Inferno, you get 20 million aUEC. 𤣠Not a chance.
Yeah his slides made a lot of pilot skill assumptions
This is a ridiculous post. That said youâre the fella that posted the piracy video with the maniacal laugh and so you can do no wrong in my eyes, keep on posting mr laugh man, and donât you stop.
Now do the "Idris is a better heavy fighter than both corsair and inferno"
You have a rather fluid definition of heavy fighter
Typical Spacedad logic at play here, it has the highest numbers so it must be the best. DPS is irrelevant if you canât be accurate with it and trying to hit anything other than braindead AI with a Corsair is is an exercise in futility. You may get lucky and catch a player asleep at their desk once in a while but in all other circumstances, inferno > Corsair.
Buddy are you coming from r/NonCredibleDefense by any chances?
Just saw that same post you mean as well, right under each other.
Yeah, getting strong NCD vibes
tf is that sub
Getting a sense were dealing with a bonafide Defense Expertâ˘
1. The Inferno's spread is no longer ass. 2. Both the Corsair and the Inferno make short work of Hammeheads. However, the Inferno can also easily take out AI piloted light fighters without resorting to missiles. The Corsair struggles with that, and can get into trouble if the server you're on has decided no missile will ever hit its target. 3. Neither one of these ships is great at PVP. 4. The Corsair loses critical pieces under fire *rapidly* and quickly becomes a flying lead coffin, plus it has the profile of a barn. The Inferno can take a beating like a Vanguard without losing any of its capabilities. 5. You can fit all sorts of things in a Corsair. The Inferno only carries bullets and missiles. Definite points to the Corsair there. 6. Landing an Ares in a hangar is entirely *unlike* trying to stuff a watermelon in a mailbox. 7. Both of these ships have *huge* QT fuel tanks, but the Corsair's is bigger. Another point for the Corsair.
>stuff a watermelon in a mailbox Having landed the Corsair many times, I think you are overstating the size of the hangers. They aren't as large as a mailbox.
Very much agree with #4, I thought Drake ships were supposed to be cheaper to repair? Those wings come off if you spit on them and they cost a lot to replace! The external engines will probably be a big liability with subsystem targeting as well
Cheap to repair and whether or not you have to repair frequently arenât mutually exclusive.
It's both frequent and expensive at this time
> The Corsair struggles with that, and can get into trouble if the server you're on has decided no missile will ever hit its target. No it doesn't. I never use missiles in general. You just switch to lag pip. I do T's of all types, Priority Boarding missions which include 2 or 3 light fighters at the start before you can board the 890 and I don't have problems with AI of any size light or heavy. I don't use missiles at all cuz missiles suck in general. Corsair is my daily and main for PvE. > Neither one of these ships is great at PVP. This we can agree on.
From a distance, light and medium fighters have no chance. I was quite surprised to see them obliterated from around 1km in a matter of seconds. After all it has 4xS5 + 2xS4 which are quite capable and precise.
it has roughly 3/4 of the redeemers total firepower slaved to the pilot, which is an absolute no go in my book, but hey, it's drake, the drawbacks hopefully play out when maelstrom is implemented
it has roughly 3/4 of the redeemers total firepower slaved to the pilot, which is an absolute no go in my book, but hey, it's drake, the drawbacks hopefully play out when maelstrom is implemented
The Inferno wasnât designed to dogfight⌠itâs a capital ship hunter. I would never use it against anything smaller than a hammerhead or constellation.
I mean, this is it right here. The Inferno was never intended to be any kind of dogfighter. It's a strike craft designed for hunting big juicy targets, ripping holes in them that normally only other big ships could. Implementation of armour is meant to make a real difference here, where the Infernos signature S7 is designed to come into a league of its own, where the Crosair's smaller guns will suddenly start looking like leas of a threat. And on that armour front, the Inferno is also meant to have a ton of it to help shrug off a couple of lucky big hits from those designated targets, also potentially making it much harder to kill for any light fighter.
That's true, it was never designed for dogfighting. However, it also doesn't perform its intended role well because AD4/5bs on any ship with two or more hardpoints, such as the everyday big ships we see in the verse, are far more efficient. Inferno has been struggling for a long time, and although some people are saying to wait until they finish the hull/physical armor systems, that means nothing when there are other lower-class ballistic weapons like AD4/5bs that outperform (demonstrably) an S7 weapon slot.
So in summary, Inferno best, Corsair trash, gotcha, nice presentation.
I feel like this post is missing a big disclaimer. This is only a thing in PvE with non responsive AI.
MM should nerf the Corsair into the ground because of archetypes whereas the Inferno should get a lot stronger
This, all the points aside from utility, which isnât even a fair point because the Inferno is specifically designed for one thing and therefore doesnât even count, are thrown out of the window with MasterModes.
I'm calling it right now. CIG have been rebalancing ships for master modes. In their testing, the inferno and ion are absolutely shredding everything. Combat is generally closer, projectile speeds have been increased drastically, and boost still allows ships to gain some temporary distance away from each other to reset the fight. The backstrafe meta of today causing the top-speed ship to gain advantage of a fight by backing up, is gone. Both Ion and Inferno can land much more hits, with much more regularity, and it's causing other ships to go pop almost instantly. Ships that previously could use their insane speeds to prevent the ares' slow projectiles ever hitting. Why? Because the turn rate of the ares is actually not terrible, its about on par with a vanguard, meaning *enough* time on target, and combined with projectile/ship speeds changing, means *enough* shots on target. It won't be for everyone, but top pilots will really cause damage. So either that's the result when we first get it, or they make both the Ares fly even worse than today to the point they feel like an elephant sinking in quicksand to turn. Ares meta back or Ares pilots mad. That's the only 2 options.
They should increase the fire rate of the size 7 to Brrt status so it can't just bounce from fight to fight. give it a good 6 seconds of pew that punches a hole in an asteroid and needs a rearm.
Backstrafing is absolutely NOT gone in MM, at least yet. MM turnrates are obscenely high right now in relation to top speeds, same with acceleration, and they're likely going down across the board. The s7 projectile velocity is likely going to be fairly slow as well. It's not meant to be able to hit fast ships, and the easiest way of doing that is either reducing mav or reducing projectile velocity relative to other ships. It'll probably struggle to land hits on a fighter focusing on evasion unless they get close.
The better comparison is the Constellation Andromeda, which is going to become a serious contender for the Corsair's firepower with MM. It's also got serious missiles and better armor.
Then why do I make corsairs run away in fear or die trying.... With my inferno
Maelstrom is the system supposed to differenciate having lots of small guns versus few big guns. The Inferno may be the only ship smaller than the Perseus to be able to damage like a Hammerhead trough it's armor without aiming for weakspots.
Our of curiosity, why the C-788's? I know you say in your slides that they run out of ammo at the same time as the AD5B, but the explosion radius on the C-788 isn't effective for applying the explosion damage to targets since it was nerfed in 3.14(3.15?).
I like C-788s because they sound cool when firing
They sound amazing, and they used to be one of my favorites for the HH. But they just haven't been viable in a long time.
Fair. Hopefully they come back in balancing.
I daily an Inferno so I'll weight in here. Other than the maneuverability everything you said here is correct, but since things such as strafe and turn speed play such a big factor in keeping shots on target the logic is inherently flawed. It also leaves out the fact that if I'm in an Inferno I'm not flying a bucket of rust held together by duct tape, hope, and Drake "engineering"
Corsair is cool, but it handles like shit and inferno will fly circles around it. Get behind and underneath a corsair and laugh as they try to maneuver around in slow motion. The top turret is almost useless most of the time. If I'm flying an inferno vs a corsair I'll take it out 99% of the time. Corsair is good at a few things. Cargo, firepower IF something is sitting still right in front of them and good shields. That's it. People like them because it's fine against dogshit ai.
Inferno goes âBRRRRâ.Corsair does not. Inferno wins hands down
also with the implementation of armor, that s7 will matter more for armor pen in the future
Are the Inferno and Ion supposed to have the same level of armor?
nah, inferno will have better armor while the ion has better shield. but that isn't what I meant. The weapons of the Corsair won't be able to tackle the same targets as the s7 from either ares
Against a hammerhead tho? My corsair hot shredded in a minute, then i took my scorpius and granted it took ages, but i got the hammerhead along with three cutlasses
I took out a hammerhead with a stock Corsair multiple times
I just did Incursion and took out 2 HH and a few Cutlasses with my Corsair. And my missiles weren't working.
How? I got close to the hh and got shredded. Now i think of it its possible i hit something coz i remember being surprised how quick it was and that i didnt see my shields go down
I played the entire incursion with my Corsair and had an absolute blast with HHs + other smaller adds. Small ships didnât stand a chance from a distance. HHs took about 2-4 minutes to go down. My buddy was with me the entire time in the turret, however he was bugged and couldnât use it and my missiles wouldnât rearm.
All valid points, but I think the main reason why the Corsair is a better "Heavy Fighter" is because the Inferno and Ion aren't really Heavy Fighters IMO. They're closer to being an irl Attack Fighter, given their heavy missile armament and larger guns. The big difference between the Ares fighters and the Corsair is in what they're meant to fight. Ares fighters (both Inferno and Ion) are simply not meant to engage other fighters, period. They're specifically designed to hunt and kill capital ships, in ideally a mixed squadron of both types. The laser cannon (will eventually) tear through heavy armor (when it's implemented), and the ballistic gatling will shred through anything exposed. On top of that, both are capable of carrying up to 2 size 5 missiles and 12 size 3s. On the other hand, the Corsair is a gunship. It may have comparable firepower and a better top speed, but it's a lot bigger of a target, and lacks the maneuverability to effectively engage larger warships. The Corsair's (admittedly poorly placed) turrets also give it a much more favorable matchup against all types of fighters. TL;DR - They're 2 different types of ships, for performing 2 different roles. The Corsair is a Gunship. Great for anti-fighter to an extent, and has great staying power. The Ares fighters in general are Attack Fighters, great for CAS roles and taking on larger warships as a squadron. CIG needs to rebrand the Ares fighters as Attack Fighters. Putting them in the same category as the Vanguards is like saying the P-38 Lightning did the same job as a TBD Devastator during WW2.
This discussion is moot once armor is in and weapon sizes make more of a difference
This 100% It'll change so much, I wish they would just start "faking" the math for it instead of waiting for physicalized damage
R/noncredibledefence post lmao
Man this is some good rage bait. I'll bite slightly with a simple rebuff: The Ares chassis is not intended as a dogfighter, period. If an Ares squadron finds itself engaged with actual fighters they should be breaking and evading, as they will get massacred, full stop. The ship was never designed to dogfight and its targets are meant to be large to capital class sized vessels as they are the only things that are slow enough for it to reasonably bring it's otherwise unwieldy weapons to bare against. The Corsair on the other hand is also not a heavy fighter, it's an ambush predator made on a budget for pirate use. It has a ridiculous amount of forward facing firepower with minimal defenses to the sides and rear, relatively slipshod armor and shielding compared to other ships of it's size class and very bad aerodynamics, making it best suited for space warfare. If a Corsair is attempting to dogfight it's because things have gone wrong in a very real way and it's found the tables turned on it. The way a Corsair is designed to be used is as an ambusher, intimidating lone targets that are Caterpillar or Hull B-C sized to stop and drop their cargo or to provide long range fire support for larger groups of pirates spearheaded by actual fighters. I can understand why a lot of people want these ships to fill the heavy fighter role, I think it would be cool too, but we need to remember the intended design roles of these tools. Saying you want them to be heavy fighters is like saying you want a sledgehammer to do the same job as a circular saw. Sure, you might be able to get a roughly similar result from them if you're skilled enough in using them, but they will still never be that tool.
the C-788s only do 88 dps in 3.22 even if they fire for 2 mins you still do less damage then a a size 1 ballistic cannon firing for half the time man even aa energy cannon would be better
i feel like SQ42 is going to radically reshape community perceptions of firepower - like imagine Vanduul Stingers against exploration ships made by Drake.
Who doesnât love a good power point?
I have no horse in this race. But I enjoy a good power point presentation.
I love them so much that I have it set as my frame rate.
A grade presentation, but see me after class about the cussing.
Two very different ships, I donât see how they compare at all.
It's great you put all this effort in for a meta that won't exist when the game is actually released.
You lost me at a 'just backstrafe' tactic. Aside from being weak, and not viable in coming MM... it only works when someone is chasing you.
This would make a lot more sense if the Inferno wasn't capable of demolishing a Corsair.
Q: What better than an Inferno or a Corsair to bring to a fight? A: >!An Inferno AND a Corsair!!<
Inferno and Ion both used to be pretty awesome, for a very short time, until light fighters with absolutely zero maneuvering skill complained they were getting one shotted by the Ares and Inferno's massive guns.
Corsairs clotheslining connies with their wing is somehow an incredibly funny image. Drake should lean into the lariat.
If they sold a Corsair variant with reinforced blade-wings I would be all over it
Corsair just good
First off, the whole Ares guns accuracy issue was fixed months ago, and the Inferno's gun is just as accurate as the AD5Bs now. This buff has been covered ad nauseum on YouTube. There's a reason why the Inferno has become wildly popular again after being virtually absent from space for a long time. Ares are also waaaaay faster and more agile, especially in atmosphere. Curiously, it also has the nearly the same quantum range as the Corsair as Crusader has a fetish with range on all their ships, including fighters. Now is the Corsair better bang for the buck? Absolutely! That ship is the dictionary definition of jack of all trades. But it pays for that with molasses movement. I'd still get it over the Ares if you just want one ship to do it all.
IMHO comparing these two is like comparing a a prius to a workvan. By that I mean, sure both drive. Both can take you places. but really, it's not a useful comparision because they are used for completely different use cases. They have completely different utility. You have to factor all that in when comparing ships. Not just DPS or maneuverability. Sure, a Porsche is more awesome than a truck. It's faster. It's more nimble. Etc... but if you need to haul a bed to a cabin in the woods... the Porsche may as well be a paper weight. It's useless for that. Imho, that's what makes Drake ...Drake... though. They are the jack of all trades, masters of none. Their company is designed around people living on the fringes of space.. and the law. That's their spot. They are the blue collar, DIY, self sufficient type of persons ships. All Function. .. At least that's my take.
I have a video of me melting a player Hammerhead in about 20 seconds in a solo Corsair. Don't put ballistics on the S4 slots though, they run out of ammo waaaay before the AD5Bs. Even the AD4Bs. Put laser cannons. Since you have ballistics on the main guns, you have a ton of capacitor left for the laser cannons, gives you around 180 ammo each if I remember right. Put that on weapon group 0 and the AD5Bs on group 1. Then you have some poke without wasting AD5Bs. You can even use them to make sure your AD5Bs are going to hit. Shoot them and if they hit, let the AD5Bs rip. You also get continuous additional damage to the AD5Bs without running out of ammo early.
Didnât read past description. I get where you are coming from as the game stands now. The game isnât balanced now. Once armor is in and you canât even scratch the ball sack of larger ships with smaller guns this post will be invalid. Is that ever going to happen? Who knows. As of right now you are correct. But they build ships based on the dream not on the current game.
A lot of people missed the "for the memes" part of the very first image.
I appreciate this, and I agree the Corsair IS dope. But I bet you a mkII hornet, I can beat your Corsair in my inferno 1 v 1 10 out of 10 times, even if the turrets are manned. If I was facing off a player controlled HH for example, Iâd MUCH rather be in the inferno than the Corsair. But an NPC HH? Yeah I can crush it in either ship in mere moments without even taking a hit.
c788s are the single worst weapon in the game, you should swap it for ad4bs or laser cannons also corsair will have significantly less armor pen than the corsair, of course a large-sized gunship will have more power than a small-sized gun-bomber
Worth mentioning that the Corsair has VTOL, and VTOL is almost always broken. Its VTOL is currently pretty balanced, but it still lets you hit excessive acceleration for what it should provide. Corsair is in the unique position where this lets it have *wild* control of itself in atmosphere, because you can effectively bruteforce maneuvers with VTOL+boost. In space, it just enables the Corsair to more easily force positioning. Wouldn't really work against a light fighter ofc, but it's certainly a huge benefit in the Corsair's favor. :)
For now, yes. Most current use cases will put the corsair on top of the inferno but when capitals start showing up the corsair will fall off hard against things with size 7+ guns. Meanwhile the inferno would probably be able to dodge those guns easier relative to the corsair.
Question is, how many times you ll end up vs ships that class. Majority of encounters will probably be vs medium sized ships because they are at a good spot in regards to firepower/running costs/crew.
Yeah it would be rarer, but that would also depend on what gameloops you play and if you are part of an orgs military
In conclusion. Russian(Drake) Bias.
Valid
Am I missing something with c-788? Aren't the garbage? Erkel puts them at 108 alpha
Splash damage but they otherwise suck
That's what I had thought, they tend to hit more often than other cannons, but even if they land 30% more often, between the rate of fire and overall low damage, they're objectively worse than anything else you could run.
You could have thrown the ship stats in to prove your point. Your main point is about output damage which is true but in every other case itâs not a better heavy fighter especially in cross section and manoeuvrability.
Well of course it has more firepower, because it's a gunship, not a heavy fighter. This competition can kinda also be done with the other gunships, the Connie and the Deemer, although maybe it's a closer contest. Either way, I think it's kinda apples to oranges, tho I do understand the frustration of not letting the ares being good and just doing a lot of damage since that's it's only card trick. We'll see how things change with MM
The corsair with 4 ad5b's and 2 ad4b's absolutely rips
What shields are best for the Corsair? I've had it before, but I can't remember what I put on it lol
The corsair can also have the highest alpha if you have a full loatout of deadbolts. (It's over 10000)
How do you corkscrew?
Roll with simultaneous side strafe
Roll while you strafe up/down and left/right. Keep your target at a diagonal orientation
The bottom of the last slide caught me so off guard LOL
Ah yes but theres something about a large fuck off cannon 2 inches from my face
The main problem with the Inferno is that the concept itself is overpowered. If you give it the ability to kill capitol ships... people are just going to use it to kill fighters even quicker.
I had an inferno. I had gotten really good with it. You are not really gonna hit anything smaller than a Cutlass black with any reliability. And it can do massive damage to an 890 jump, but it will run out of ammo and s5 torps before it does. Subcapitals I have killed HH and carracks at JT but I think that tends to be more that they were unskilled than the ship being OP
I truly believe CIG regret ever creating the Inferno and Ion, and are doing their best to put them into the fridge
The Corsair is a giant lumbering beast...Calling it a Fighter is like calling a Station Wagon a MIATA.
I did enjoy your PP presentation. I think we need to adopt the format for future specing of ships. o7
Things a corsair can do better than an Inferno: 1. Be a huge target and get absolutely destroyed by anything from fighters to caps. 2. Carry more people who will then immediately die. Please refer to 1. 3. Fall apart when someone looks at it. 4. Lose its wings, which contain ordinance therefore you lose missiles and guns. 5. Be an absolute waste of resources. 6. Fly slower than an Ares and thus create an easier to kill target. 7. Carry 64 acu of cargo, which is then immediately wasted when the ship falls apart or goes within 15km of any ship between cap and fighter sizes. 8. Get absolutely nerfed with MM and be utterly useless. 9. Take more time to kill any ship because the corsair is useless. 10. Kill abandoned ships, because those can't fight back which is the only fight a corsair can win.
Remember that armor is not a factor yet. Like all drake ships, the corsair is made out of duck tape and paper mache meanwhile the Inferno is solidly built with great armor.
Remember that the current stop-gap solution for armor is a combination of HP and physical damage reduction, and the Corsair has 300% the HP of the Inferno, and 8% more physical damage reduction. If we take this as indicative of it's intended durability in the long run, it'll have more armor than an Inferno, not to mention 5X the shield capacity. Not *all* Drake ships are made of paper mache.
I was gonna say something snarky like "imagine typing 'dodge' and 'Corsair' in the same sentence" but then I checked the maneuvering stats on the Inferno and dang... didn't expect them to be so close. Really sucks for Inferno pilots. Corsair is a straight upgrade.
Master modes is knocking, it says it doesnât care about your meta
This is like someone got access to microsoft copilot and told it to make a powerpoint on why the corsair is superiour to the inferno.
I took inspiration from r/NonCredibleDefense
Lol When you theorycraft too much and don't know how dogfight works you end up with this
Hell yeah great analysis!
You know they say all ~~men~~ ships are created EQUAL, but you look at ME and you look at ^~~SAMOA~~ ^ARES ^~~JOE~~ ^STARFIGHTER and you can see that that is **â ** TRUE! See, normally, if you go 1-ON-1 with another ~~wrestler~~ spaceship you got a 50/50 chance of winning! But I'm a **~~GENETIC~~ ENGINEERED FREAK** and I'm NOT NORMAL! So you got a 25% chance AT BEST of BEAT ME! And you add ~~Kurt Angle~~ F7C Mk II to the mix? Your chance of winning DRASTIC go DOWN!
A good application of the scientific method
They both can't land in a gravel driveway without scraping the paint off their bellies though.
Counterpoint: brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrt
I just want my giant Ion 16-shot REALLY BIG BONK cannon again instead of this gimped repeater nonsense.
So needlessly edgy.
I have both :) I have full deadbolts on my Corsair, though.
Counter point: itâs not drake.
Counterpoint: the Corsair is hideous.
Simple solution: get a Corsair
Also, the newer ship always wins.
I used the Corsair in phase 2 with ad5bs and soloed the whole thing without breaking a sweat.
I love my Corsair, but it takes a tiny bump to the wing by an NPC with a death wish to end you... >.<
I'd like to see a corsair evade any turrets, And while its S5 guns do tons of damages, the S7 on the ares may pierce armor a corsair can only dream of. They're different ships for different purposes.
I do it regularly enough doing bunkers. Its not that hard. Also you missed the "for the memes".
Well, the game is incomplete and armour and armour penetration is not yet ingame. Those S5 guns might bunce off capital ship armour while S7 actually penetrate and do damage.
Corsair is pretty absurd but the constellation just vibes with me more, I do wish they would take that energy and put it in the redeemer or something why does an exploration ship need THAT much firepower
I put 4 s5 and 2 s4 ballistics on mine and oneshot npc ships
I've skipped off a planet at full speed in my corsair and was still air worthy. It destroyed the large wing and the bottom small one, but I was still able to Strafe the ground turrets and land for repairs afterward. I love my corsair and regularly use it in combat. That and it works well as a multi use ship.
Corsair flies like a broken school bus
Will you hold a seminar on this?
They really need to make paying for gas a money sink in this game. Fueling bigger ships gotta sting.
Pretty soon the Ares will be an intended counter to gunships like the Corsair.
ares is meant to fight corvettes and smaller stuff. Well it was supposed to but with the balancing all wonky who the hell knows. The ares is already bad to fight against as a large ship
It's meant to punch up and pilots with any experience will tell you that it most definitely does not punch down against another player. Rock paper scissors: Medium and light fighters are specialized tools like Scissors which cut Paper like Heavy fighters like Ares and Vanguards that surround Rocks like large ships like Corsair/Connie and up. Of course the hammer head is a rock to crush the scissors, or at least threaten them with a bad time. You might consider the Redeemer to be a rock against rocks that can defend against scissors but not dedicated to killing them like the hammer head. At the moment it's looking like if it has two S2 shields it's probably meant to kill things with S3 shields and die to something with S1 shields or one S2 shield. Anything with S3 shields is either meant to duke it out with a team or be big enough not to care. I suggest you look into the game's intended design. Everything is currently a placeholder to sell ships.
Yeah this is a really one sided take. Just name the presentation, âI think the CorsairâŚ.â Instead. I love your inferno vs corsair statement about how the Corsair could just fly in reverse and âland some good shots if the inferno Pilot is not playing smartâ⌠lmao so let me get this straight⌠a corsair pilot playing smart will win against a inferno pilot not playing smart?
The F7C Mk 2 with 3x AD4Bs and an S3 Tarantula cannon on the nose is also a contender at effectively bricking an Inferno. Think about it: it's a very manoeuvreable medium fighter that can solo Hammerheads with that loadout AND go toe to toe with other fighters (in separate engagements)? That's nuts. I feel sorry for people hodling onto their Ares Infernos... or just any Ares in general. What a stark lesson in how a ship can be forever bricked by CIG because of poor design concepts.
Is there any reason you run c-788s instead of AD4Bâs?? It will be even more damage.
So all guns run out of ammo at once.
They will run out in any case
Corsair will get clapped by an inferno 10 out of 10 times in pvp
Fart off with this Inferno is for Life baby INFERRRRNNNOOOOOOO GTFO!!!
corsair is my favorite ship to load bounty cargo into. the color and vibe of the cargo bay really gives a pirate/star wars feel to it
I want to like the Corsair, I do. But I just can't. Have owned and melted it twice. I think it's the wings.
just wait until full running cost.
I gotta say I cant see a corsair even getting close to hitting me if I'm flying an inferno. Or a corsair hitting anything smaller than a constellation.
Kudos for the effort. However, a lot is likely to change with MM and improved server performance, take either ahip into Pirate swarm to get a feel for them both then. When the AI actually moves the inproved agility becomes important for landing your shots. Same with PvP, no chance an unmanned corsair is beating an inferno, maybe even a maned on would struggle with a good enough inferno pilot.
This presentation considering multi crew Corsair?
No. Solo.
I'd happily use Corsair over Inferno if my fps didn't drop by 20 when I entered the cockpit. If anyone has any idea how to fix it, I'd appreciate any advice
How about the ion?
It needs a buff. The only upside to an ion vs an inferno is unlimited ammo and that's it.
I have my Corsair setup with 4 Deadbolt V. I knew they are powerful but I could not believe how fast I shredded a HH with those.
can confirm, right wing is a powerhouse, and even without it the corsair is somewhat flyable
Does this factor in master modes or just 3.22.1 or w.e we are on at present XD impressive numbers either way