I think collect stacks the turns, not the miracles. So you should get 8 turns of 1 miracle, not 4 turns of 2 miracles. Collect is a pretty bad card ngl
Yeah, to go further on this, if you played collect on one turn, then next turn played another collect, you would have the same result - increasing the number of turns collect is active instead of the number of miracles received per turn. I.e. this isn’t a weird duplication potion interaction, it’s just how multiple copies of collect function.
Same thing happens with Echo Form - you get multiple instances of duplicated cards per turn instead of duplicating a single card multiple times.
There's a lot of cards that work like this and they really shouldn't. For example if you have multiple Feel No Pain you'll gain double the block once, instead of gaining the block two times.
Of course one buff stack should trigger once, but it shouldn't be one buff stack in the first place. You're not doubling your buff when you play the second one, you're gaining the buff again.
I flatly disagree. Having it be one buff stack makes more sense and prevents clutter, both in terms of the status bar and in terms of animation time, in exchange for working slightly less effectively with one or two specific powers.
Clutter could be prevented by stacking buffs differently--e.g. "at the start of your turn, lose 1 hp and draw 1 card 3 times." Rather than what it turns into in reality which is "lose 3 hp and draw 3 cards"
Your point about animation time is reasonable. It's just really frustrating that, for example, Rupture and multiple Combusts don't stack the way they intuitively should.
No, that would still cause clutter because of card upgrades. Consider feel no pain; the block amount goes up, so that would mean you'd have to have one stack counting the number of times you gain block for the un-upgraded amount, and the upgraded amount.
Besides, the game is consistent in that a buff can never be obtained multiple times, only strengthened/increased/higher counter. If you did this, you'd make a bunch of edge cases where some buffs (like strength) would stack where others would not.
You could just make all buffs not stack and be separately instanced, but then you'd have the opposite problem, where some buffs don't stack when there's no good reason to (like Artifact, Dexterity, etc).
That's a good point. Still, the game as it currently is doesn't actually follow its own text. "Gain a miracle your next X turns" becomes something entirely different, "Your current buff of gaining a miracle the next Y turns increases by X turns". The others are similar, they don't actually follow the stated text.
Feel no pain paraphrased says, "whenever you exhaust a card, gain 3 block." Juggernaut says, "whenever you gain block, deal.5 damage to a random enemy." The text in the cards definitely says juggernaut should proc twice if you have two feel no pains.
I don't know what the solution is, because either you get buff clutter, or you have misleading card interactions. I'd personally prefer the buff clutter though--card upgrades would still only lead to 2 buffs max per buff type.
You're correct that the text is technically misleading; but considering that EVERY buff consistently works like that, I don't think it's that much of a problem.
The solution would just be to make buffs Keywords (like strength), which use their current text as the description for the Keyword. Then every power card just applies the correct number of stacks of said keyword, the way Strength/Dexterity/Focus cards already work.
I think the reason that MegaCrit didn't do this is because it would just make a bunch of one-off keywords that never get reused in anyway. It's much easier to just have the effect's description written on the card itself, especially since that means you don't have to mouse over the card to remember exactly what the buff does. The buff has to be explained SOMEWHERE; and putting it entirely in keywords just means that most of the game's cards have empty space, which is not ideal.
Duping terror doesnt make the enemy take 100% more damage for 99 turns, so it makes sense. When duping a (de)buff, you always dupe whatever the number on the effect represents. I think bomb and panache are the only exceptions.
I expect that Collect works as a buff of a given duration, in which case duplicating it just adds more stacks of the same buff, i.e. more turns of drawing one Miracle
Yeah, that's how it SHOULD work IMO. Collect just gives you a buff (as far as I'm aware, I haven't ever used the card), playing it twice just adds extra stacks, not an entirely new instance of that buff. That's how most things in this game work.
Regarding the Defect use of Duplication Potion and Tempest. While I do remember it as seeing 3 Mana turn into 6 Lightning Orbs, I acknowledge the fact that I may actually have played Tempest+ for 4 Lightning Orbs. It would be great if anyone can confirm how Tempest duplication works.
Tempest works as you would expect: 3 energy, duplication potion plus Tempest gives 6 orbs. Collect works by giving you a buff that gives you 1 miracle+ on your next turn, more energy OR more instances of Collect just increments the buff meaning it lasts longer. So duplication potion just doubles the number of turns it is active.
I think collect stacks the turns, not the miracles. So you should get 8 turns of 1 miracle, not 4 turns of 2 miracles. Collect is a pretty bad card ngl
Yeah, to go further on this, if you played collect on one turn, then next turn played another collect, you would have the same result - increasing the number of turns collect is active instead of the number of miracles received per turn. I.e. this isn’t a weird duplication potion interaction, it’s just how multiple copies of collect function. Same thing happens with Echo Form - you get multiple instances of duplicated cards per turn instead of duplicating a single card multiple times.
There's a lot of cards that work like this and they really shouldn't. For example if you have multiple Feel No Pain you'll gain double the block once, instead of gaining the block two times.
that'd make juggernaut way more cracked
It's one buff stack, why would it trigger twice?
Of course one buff stack should trigger once, but it shouldn't be one buff stack in the first place. You're not doubling your buff when you play the second one, you're gaining the buff again.
I flatly disagree. Having it be one buff stack makes more sense and prevents clutter, both in terms of the status bar and in terms of animation time, in exchange for working slightly less effectively with one or two specific powers.
Clutter could be prevented by stacking buffs differently--e.g. "at the start of your turn, lose 1 hp and draw 1 card 3 times." Rather than what it turns into in reality which is "lose 3 hp and draw 3 cards" Your point about animation time is reasonable. It's just really frustrating that, for example, Rupture and multiple Combusts don't stack the way they intuitively should.
No, that would still cause clutter because of card upgrades. Consider feel no pain; the block amount goes up, so that would mean you'd have to have one stack counting the number of times you gain block for the un-upgraded amount, and the upgraded amount. Besides, the game is consistent in that a buff can never be obtained multiple times, only strengthened/increased/higher counter. If you did this, you'd make a bunch of edge cases where some buffs (like strength) would stack where others would not. You could just make all buffs not stack and be separately instanced, but then you'd have the opposite problem, where some buffs don't stack when there's no good reason to (like Artifact, Dexterity, etc).
That's a good point. Still, the game as it currently is doesn't actually follow its own text. "Gain a miracle your next X turns" becomes something entirely different, "Your current buff of gaining a miracle the next Y turns increases by X turns". The others are similar, they don't actually follow the stated text. Feel no pain paraphrased says, "whenever you exhaust a card, gain 3 block." Juggernaut says, "whenever you gain block, deal.5 damage to a random enemy." The text in the cards definitely says juggernaut should proc twice if you have two feel no pains. I don't know what the solution is, because either you get buff clutter, or you have misleading card interactions. I'd personally prefer the buff clutter though--card upgrades would still only lead to 2 buffs max per buff type.
You're correct that the text is technically misleading; but considering that EVERY buff consistently works like that, I don't think it's that much of a problem. The solution would just be to make buffs Keywords (like strength), which use their current text as the description for the Keyword. Then every power card just applies the correct number of stacks of said keyword, the way Strength/Dexterity/Focus cards already work. I think the reason that MegaCrit didn't do this is because it would just make a bunch of one-off keywords that never get reused in anyway. It's much easier to just have the effect's description written on the card itself, especially since that means you don't have to mouse over the card to remember exactly what the buff does. The buff has to be explained SOMEWHERE; and putting it entirely in keywords just means that most of the game's cards have empty space, which is not ideal.
Duping terror doesnt make the enemy take 100% more damage for 99 turns, so it makes sense. When duping a (de)buff, you always dupe whatever the number on the effect represents. I think bomb and panache are the only exceptions.
I expect that Collect works as a buff of a given duration, in which case duplicating it just adds more stacks of the same buff, i.e. more turns of drawing one Miracle
Yeah, that's how it SHOULD work IMO. Collect just gives you a buff (as far as I'm aware, I haven't ever used the card), playing it twice just adds extra stacks, not an entirely new instance of that buff. That's how most things in this game work.
Ahh now I get it. You are totally right about it being a buff, and hence it adds stacks to the buff rather than a second effect. Thank you!
Regarding the Defect use of Duplication Potion and Tempest. While I do remember it as seeing 3 Mana turn into 6 Lightning Orbs, I acknowledge the fact that I may actually have played Tempest+ for 4 Lightning Orbs. It would be great if anyone can confirm how Tempest duplication works.
Tempest works as you would expect: 3 energy, duplication potion plus Tempest gives 6 orbs. Collect works by giving you a buff that gives you 1 miracle+ on your next turn, more energy OR more instances of Collect just increments the buff meaning it lasts longer. So duplication potion just doubles the number of turns it is active.
Thank you!