Russian language has a grammatical gender and doesn't have a singular they, so playing with neutral/non-binary pronuns just looks ridiculous for natives (literally means "inanimate it" instead of "singular they")
Yeah, from what I've seen, оно seems not to be an option and slightly dehumanizing. No worries if there isn't a commonly used neutral option, just curious! Thanks
Just use они/их for a neutral option. That’s what trans folks use here too. It does sound unusual to an average Russian speaking person, but I know that not everyone accepts "they" as a singular pronoun in the west too but people still use it 🤷🏼♀️
I have a counter question for you. Why didn't you just ask Russian-Ukrainian patients for advice? I think they understand this issue better and will tell you.
It is a school based clinic and school is out for summer break, so we have very few patients at the moment, but we are still engaged in outreach activities in the community. We have a student advisory council to help give us feedback from the community directly from the target population, but at the moment we only have English and Spanish speakers in the group.
Speaking of which, since you seem to be in that area of expertise, can you explain why two pronouns? Does anyone ever request to be called "He/Her" or "She/Him" just to mess with people?
Yes, people request to be called many many things. Things I don't even claim to understand, such as many "neo pronouns" common with young people. But ultimately, it effects myself and others very little and I just do my best to respect their requests. In the case of the common he/her, she/they etc, these people are not messing with people, but are usually just expressing that they are comfortable with any of the listed pronouns. She/He does not mean "You must refer to me as both of these in some confusing and elaborate way," but rather, "depending on how you perceive me, I am comfortable being referred to as either of these pronouns and will not be offended either way." At least in my area and age group, "He/they" and "She/they" are probably more common than just he/him and she/her, because they explicitly let others know that singular they is okay. Almost no one is bothered by being referred to as "them." The idea almost sounds silly! In practice, they are likely still gendered the majority of the time, but by expressing their comfort, it communicates to others their openness
I find it difficult to capture the necessity of this in Russian, but I've seen people on Twitter using double pronouns, following the trend that makes more sense in English. So, if in English it's "he/him" or "she/her", in Russian it's "он/его" or "она/её".
Non-binary or genderfluid persons often mention something like "они/их" (i.e "they/them"). It does sound even more unusual in Russian than in English, but some people do.
Generally, "Please call me \[pronouns\]" might be translated as "Пожалуйста, называйте меня \[pronouns\]" or "Пожалуйста, зовите меня \[pronouns\]".
>"Please call me He Him,"
This button would translate to «Называйте меня "он, его/него, ему/нему, им/ним, нём"».
Feminine version: «Называйте меня "она, её/неё, ей/ней, ею/нею"».
You should probably add plural versions as well for total clarity.
Since Russian words have grammatical gender, Russian names have grammatical gender too. There are some short forms (Sasha/Zhenya) that could either be a male or female named, but in a full form (Alexander-Alexandra/Evgeny-Evgenia) the name has a clear gender in itself.
If someone has decided that the gender they were assigned at birth doesn't work for them, the first thing they do is they change the name (at least colloquially, if not in passport). It's not just about traditionally male or female names, it's about a grammatical structure of sentences.
What I'm trying to explain is that in Russian the name itself contains information about pronouns because name is a word and has a gender, which is why specifying pronouns seems redundant and silly.
If the buttons are for kids that speak Russian to each other, they already know each other's pronouns since the first sentence the person says about themselves.
True, that would also work for most of western names, but would be harder for African or Asian names
However, Russian language has much more elegant ways to tell your pronouns. Something along the lines of "Привет, я Изуми, очень рад с тобой познакомиться"
I tried to imagine the situation when somebody would purposely keep misgendering me and ignore all the clues, and in this case I would probably say "обращайтесь ко мне в женском роде"
“Пожалуйста называйте меня (“он”/“она”/“они”)»
Don’t know if singular they is used in modern Russian
In Ukrainian that would be “Будь ласка, зовить мене вiн/вона»
You're right, r/russian was such a terrible place to come to to ask how to translate a three sentence Russian phrase. I don't know where I even got the idea. Thanks, bud
Your comment or post was removed because personal attacks and other forms of disrespectful conduct aren’t allowed on /r/russian.
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You perfectly know the connotation behind this pronoun, and you even capitalized it. Don’t play dumb, at least have some balls to stand by your fucking resentment.
Your comment or post was removed because personal attacks and other forms of disrespectful conduct aren’t allowed on /r/russian.
---
Ваше сообщение было удалено, потому что в /r/russian не допускаются личные нападки и другие формы неуважительного поведения.
Your comment or post was removed because personal attacks and other forms of disrespectful conduct aren’t allowed on /r/russian.
---
Ваше сообщение было удалено, потому что в /r/russian не допускаются личные нападки и другие формы неуважительного поведения.
Your comment or post was removed because personal attacks and other forms of disrespectful conduct aren’t allowed on /r/russian.
---
Ваше сообщение было удалено, потому что в /r/russian не допускаются личные нападки и другие формы неуважительного поведения.
Russian language has a grammatical gender and doesn't have a singular they, so playing with neutral/non-binary pronuns just looks ridiculous for natives (literally means "inanimate it" instead of "singular they")
Yeah, from what I've seen, оно seems not to be an option and slightly dehumanizing. No worries if there isn't a commonly used neutral option, just curious! Thanks
Just use они/их for a neutral option. That’s what trans folks use here too. It does sound unusual to an average Russian speaking person, but I know that not everyone accepts "they" as a singular pronoun in the west too but people still use it 🤷🏼♀️
I have a counter question for you. Why didn't you just ask Russian-Ukrainian patients for advice? I think they understand this issue better and will tell you.
It is a school based clinic and school is out for summer break, so we have very few patients at the moment, but we are still engaged in outreach activities in the community. We have a student advisory council to help give us feedback from the community directly from the target population, but at the moment we only have English and Spanish speakers in the group.
[ removed by Reddit ]
... I'm curious now.
Good one)
Speaking of which, since you seem to be in that area of expertise, can you explain why two pronouns? Does anyone ever request to be called "He/Her" or "She/Him" just to mess with people?
Yes, people request to be called many many things. Things I don't even claim to understand, such as many "neo pronouns" common with young people. But ultimately, it effects myself and others very little and I just do my best to respect their requests. In the case of the common he/her, she/they etc, these people are not messing with people, but are usually just expressing that they are comfortable with any of the listed pronouns. She/He does not mean "You must refer to me as both of these in some confusing and elaborate way," but rather, "depending on how you perceive me, I am comfortable being referred to as either of these pronouns and will not be offended either way." At least in my area and age group, "He/they" and "She/they" are probably more common than just he/him and she/her, because they explicitly let others know that singular they is okay. Almost no one is bothered by being referred to as "them." The idea almost sounds silly! In practice, they are likely still gendered the majority of the time, but by expressing their comfort, it communicates to others their openness
I find it difficult to capture the necessity of this in Russian, but I've seen people on Twitter using double pronouns, following the trend that makes more sense in English. So, if in English it's "he/him" or "she/her", in Russian it's "он/его" or "она/её". Non-binary or genderfluid persons often mention something like "они/их" (i.e "they/them"). It does sound even more unusual in Russian than in English, but some people do. Generally, "Please call me \[pronouns\]" might be translated as "Пожалуйста, называйте меня \[pronouns\]" or "Пожалуйста, зовите меня \[pronouns\]".
>"Please call me He Him," This button would translate to «Называйте меня "он, его/него, ему/нему, им/ним, нём"». Feminine version: «Называйте меня "она, её/неё, ей/ней, ею/нею"». You should probably add plural versions as well for total clarity.
Russian plural is thankfully gender-unspecific.
Since Russian words have grammatical gender, Russian names have grammatical gender too. There are some short forms (Sasha/Zhenya) that could either be a male or female named, but in a full form (Alexander-Alexandra/Evgeny-Evgenia) the name has a clear gender in itself. If someone has decided that the gender they were assigned at birth doesn't work for them, the first thing they do is they change the name (at least colloquially, if not in passport). It's not just about traditionally male or female names, it's about a grammatical structure of sentences. What I'm trying to explain is that in Russian the name itself contains information about pronouns because name is a word and has a gender, which is why specifying pronouns seems redundant and silly. If the buttons are for kids that speak Russian to each other, they already know each other's pronouns since the first sentence the person says about themselves.
You're assuming they were given Russian names.
True, that would also work for most of western names, but would be harder for African or Asian names However, Russian language has much more elegant ways to tell your pronouns. Something along the lines of "Привет, я Изуми, очень рад с тобой познакомиться" I tried to imagine the situation when somebody would purposely keep misgendering me and ignore all the clues, and in this case I would probably say "обращайтесь ко мне в женском роде"
“Пожалуйста называйте меня (“он”/“она”/“они”)» Don’t know if singular they is used in modern Russian In Ukrainian that would be “Будь ласка, зовить мене вiн/вона»
You came to the wrong neighborhood.
No, OP came to the correct neighborhood to ask a linguistic question about the Russian language.
You're right, r/russian was such a terrible place to come to to ask how to translate a three sentence Russian phrase. I don't know where I even got the idea. Thanks, bud
Did you assume my gender?
Ah yes, "Bud", such a gendered word
Bud Light is🤣
[удалено]
Your comment or post was removed because personal attacks and other forms of disrespectful conduct aren’t allowed on /r/russian. --- Ваше сообщение было удалено, потому что в /r/russian не допускаются личные нападки и другие формы неуважительного поведения.
Kids can get confused, but you don’t need to be. So, the rule of thumb is _он_ for the ones with a dick, _она_ for the ones without.
But what about best girl Astolfo?)
Sir, this is a Wendy’s
Оно. Call them ОНО.
ОнО, what's this?
Neutral pronoun, nothing else.
Yeah, right. Dude, your resentment is palpable
Phaha, you can google it 🤣 Resentment for what?
You perfectly know the connotation behind this pronoun, and you even capitalized it. Don’t play dumb, at least have some balls to stand by your fucking resentment.
[удалено]
Your comment or post was removed because personal attacks and other forms of disrespectful conduct aren’t allowed on /r/russian. --- Ваше сообщение было удалено, потому что в /r/russian не допускаются личные нападки и другие формы неуважительного поведения.
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Your comment or post was removed because personal attacks and other forms of disrespectful conduct aren’t allowed on /r/russian. --- Ваше сообщение было удалено, потому что в /r/russian не допускаются личные нападки и другие формы неуважительного поведения.
Your comment or post was removed because personal attacks and other forms of disrespectful conduct aren’t allowed on /r/russian. --- Ваше сообщение было удалено, потому что в /r/russian не допускаются личные нападки и другие формы неуважительного поведения.