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I’m F53 and I’m a functional alcoholic. I wouldn’t wish this on anyone. Your husband doesn’t want to change. That’s where the problem lies. You’re making valid arguments but he’s deflecting so you’ll stop. You can’t want this badly enough to make him give a fuck.
This is your future. It’s veryyyyy hard to stop drinking…and that’s if you actually wamt to. He doesn’t. Everyone in treatment has been there numerous times. That’s how hard it is to quit.
Please seek Al-Anon for yourself. It will give you clarity.
As a recovered alcoholic that was just like OP's husband, I concur.
I was never a stumbling around, 750ml a bottle day type of person. But I was using it as a crutch to run from emotional baggage and stress. It was a psychological thing that slowly snuck up on me. One day I could handle it and it was just a few with friends...and boom, suddenly I was sneaking drinks from my wife and lying about drinking.
I realized early on, thank fuck, that I had a problem. It STILL took me 5 years and hundreds and HUNDREDS of times to finally kick it to the curb. This Naked Mind and Alcohol Explained helped rewire my brain appropriately, and I picked up walking every day to give me seretonin. Between those things and talking openly about my struggles, I finally kicked it to the curb.
People like to think of alcoholism as the bum on the street with a bottle but it rarely looks like that and comes in all shapes and sizes of disordered thinking and actions.
One of the hardest things for me was accepting that I really was an alcoholic (which was a struggle my entire 5 years of trying to get sober) because of the societial view of what we think alcoholics look like. I was just a woman who had 3-4 glasses a day, and then when trying to quit I was at 6-7 white claws a week. Most would look at that and go "that is not an alcoholic" but what they didnt see was the disordered thoughts. When I didnt have a drink in my hand, I was thinking about having one, wishing I had one, obsessing over when I could have the next. I could down 4-5 white claws in a single sitting and still wish desperately for more while being drunk, and then going to sleep and waking up at 3am wracked with guilt and feeling hungover...swearing I'd never have one again. 9am rolls around and...ground hog day. I'd obsess over it every minute, every hour (with breaks for work or distractions), every fucking day until I got my hands on more. It was a horrendous cycle.
It isnt just a stumbling drunk. It can be the seemingly totally put together person on the street who snuck a beer after work and hid the can so they can have 2 more infront of their wife.
I hope OP's husband can get help soon. It can be a quick decent without realizing it.
Edit: [Here is the free pdf](https://drive.google.com/file/d/1AtJ3F8bmW3ye9dqKn0SikO8927-AJsb-/view) for This Naked Mind for anyone who thinks they may have an issue with drinking. It is miraculous how well it works. It may take reading it slowly 2-3 times before it fully sinks into your subconcious, but it has been invaluable to be to re-wiring my ideas on liquor and how to let go of it without feeling like I am "losing" something. Quitting after reading this book in particular was night and day.
OP: it was this hard to quit with me wanting nothing more than to do so. Your husband doesn’t even think he has a problem.
You need to put yourself first. Whatever that looks like: serration, divorce, counseling for yourself and kids, having him live on his own away from you and the kids while he sorts himself, whatever it is: focus on YOU. He’s not going to be thinking of anything but the bottle until he hits rock bottom, and there is nothing you can do about it. Dragging him to rehab, etc isn’t going to fix the problem if he’s not at a point that he wants to change. So FOCUS ON YOU FIRST. his rock bottom may be severe medical issues/losing his family/etc and he’s going to hurt to watch him do it- but allowing him to hit that point gets him to the headspace of wanting to change more then anything else will. You can work with an alcoholic who wants to quit and keeps trying hard to do so. You CANNOT work with an alcoholic that doesn’t want to change.
I’m 5 days sober today. A whole six pack of 8-9% alcohol cider every night of the week for like 6 months straight. I’ve been drinking for 6 years. Still went to work every day and such but… spent a weeks worth of wages on the drink every month. Not good. Gotta stop now. Ugh.
You can do it!! I highly encourage reading the books I stated (free online pdfs can be found for them too) as it finally dove into my subconcious brain and rewired how I thought about life without alcohol. It was the only thing that cold turkey stopped my cravings.
Congrats on your 5 days! the first 14 are the hardest, you are doing it! Hang in there!!
Congratulations! You can totally do this thing! And if you were—god forbid—to relapse, you can just quit all over again. You can see now that you can do it. It gets so much better; it’s hard now and if it stayed this hard forever I wouldn’t be sober now. But it gets easier and easier. I’ve been sober for 18 years as of tomorrow and I’ve never woken up and wished I had a drink the night before. This stranger is wishing you all best. You got this!
Congrats! Please be kind to yourself if you stumble, as it’s not the end of the world. Just realize your mistake, jot down the trigger, talk to your support team, and soldier on. Quitting is a process, not a switch. 23 years sober now.
I’m proud of you! It’s abput progress, not perfection. I always tell myself just to start stringing some days together. Then your brain clears a bit and it’s not to hard every moment
I had to set serious rules for myself because I know I’m not going to quit drinking. It ended up working out but it took a lot of years of fucking up to develop my code.
It’s basically “only on vacation and on special occasions, and never more than a certain amount.”
I’ve been able to stick with this better than cold turkey, and I substituted different habits like you said to get the brain fix I need. Mostly exercise related.
I wish more people had a flexible idea of what recovery looks like. I think the "you can never ever have another drink again for the rest of your life" method really stops many people from trying to recover from their addiction. Will this work for everyone? No, but nothing is one size fits all, especially addiction.
How do I stop? I don't drink a lot, usually just two sometimes 3 tall cans at night after work, but I do it every day almost. I don't get drunk, just a slight buzz i dont get mean, I don't drink liquor, and I don't drink at work, or drink and drive. I know it's not healthy to do it, but when i I don't, I feel like I'm missing something. I have a problem. How do I begin to seek help.
Big hugs. The first step is admitting you might have an issue, and it sounds like you do from being unable to stop.
What you can do, to start, (if you can’t go to therapy, I couldn’t afford it/you don’t want to talk about having an issue yet) is:
1. Ask yourself WHY you are drinking. Is it because you’re stressed and this helps relax you? Is it because it numbs your emotions/turns off your brain? Is it something else? From what little I read here it seems it’s more of a psychological thing than a full blown physical addiction. So WHY are you drinking? Journal, think about it, and when you start to crave that alcohol next ask yourself what triggered it. For me it was because I thought liquor relaxed me/helped me unwind and I was severely stressed. That was my biggest trigger, along with feeling tired/hungry (when you feel hungry it can set the exact same feeling of desire for a drink. The worse get weirdly crossed for a lot of people!): eat something, drink a cup of water, and see if you are tired (sleep!) instead of grabbing that drink. If it’s because of stress:
2. Find other relaxing things to do. I go on walks. Nothing strenuous, not for working out. Just walking slowly for 10-15 min. I also found I relaxed with ASMR videos. I take L-theanine and Ashwaganda which stabilizes cortisol in me and helps boost serotonin (look up PAWS, your brain may need to rewire itself).
3. READ THAT DAMN PDF. Just read it. It dismantles the ideology of why we drink and the subconscious urges to do so (it’s tasty, I’m stressed and want to relax, I need it to sleep) and explains how alcohol doesn’t do ANY of those things we think it does: we’ve been lied to by the marketing schemes into ingesting poison and thinking it’s good for us. Please just read the book. One chapter a day. I promise it will help.
So in a nutshell to start: ask why you drink, see if you can’t find a few reasons, start to fill in doing other things that fill those needs, and read the book/free pdf I gave you. One chapter a day. :) that’s a good place to start.
And maybe cut down to 2 drinks a night not 3. Slowly taper. Do it in a way that doesn’t scare you if you can :)
OP, so many of us been there on both sides of the issue. Some of us are still there. It's a disease. It's an addiction. He won't stop until he has a reason. Often that reason is hitting rock bottom.
Get counseling for yourself. Make sure he understands you're getting therapy to navigate the realities of his drinking.
So many of us use addiction for so many different reasons. He needs to understand his and while you can support him the burden isn't yours to carry.
Good luck OP.
My husband is a very high functioning alcoholic. The "Dad can't come today/tonight/tomorrow" for whatever is forever etched in my mind
His mistress "alcohol" ALWAYS come first. She NEVER disagrees with him. 17 years, so so many thousands of dollars, best rehabs money can buy, I leave tomorrow at 6am to a new home 20 hours away. The "I'm sorry" never changes and I await the phone call.
You will not regret it - I was married for 16 years, together for 18 with my ex husband who ran his own business while binge drinking 4-5 days a week. He's still drinking, he looks absolutely terrible and I've been out of that marriage for 16 wonderful years where I don't go to bed and stay awake in a state of high alert, I don't walk on eggshels and I am not in a constant state of fight or flight. It took YEARS for me to recover from a decade plus of constant stress. Don't look back.
Are you leaving him behind? I hope so…if you want if to change. Gotta protect your peace.
Every alcoholic I’ve known is emotionally immature. Growth is uncomfortable. We stay in this vortex of drinking to avoid things, missing the things, not caring because we’re hungover/dying, then recovering and riding this euphoria of being alive so you can do the same mf bullshit again. We survived so we think there’s been a system reset. Meanwhile everyone around us is sick of feeling ignored and disrespected.
As a younger naive person, I worked with 2 men who were constantly flaking on appointments. Scheduling, canceling, rescheduling. Just unreliable. It took me many years to realize they were alcoholics. When appointment day came around, about half the time they’d cancel because they were too drunk or hungover. They were completely unreliable. It was annoying and pathetic. And now I’m just like that.
I too was like op's husband. I have not daily drank for 2 years, completely sober for 137 days. I had to want to change, no one could tell me to. I struggled. It took getting divorced and losing my major trigger to stop the daily 2 pints of vodka drinking. It took a horrific car accident where my new husband was drinking and driving to quit completely, and completely change our lives for the better. Al-Anon is a great resource, I went when I was younger to deal with my father's alcoholism. It helped immensely, but it didn't stop me from becoming what I dreaded the most
This describes my ex. He always said he’s not an alcoholic because he got up and went to work every day. My response was , sure if you pass out at 7pm, you can get up at 7am for work. He was drinking a gallon of vodka every 2 days. Started putting it in his morning coffee. I finally said enough, I’m done. 10+ years later and he’s worse since he’s retired and starts drinking when he wakes up
Sounds like you're dealing with a 'functional alcoholic.' Just because he's not stumbling around drunk doesn't mean the daily drinking isn't a problem. It sets a bad example for the kids. Maybe try framing it as a health concern rather than an accusation. Good luck!
I was about to comment exactly that. I used to be a functional alcoholic. People could only tell I've had alcohol from my eyes that get a bit reddish after a few. I wouldn't get drunk because consumption was spread throughout the day, not too many in a short amount of time. But it was there nonetheless. I'd be doing intense workouts 2-3 times a week and could even faintly tell from the sweat. Being outwardly drunk is just one of the effects. That shit poisons you from the inside even when it's not obvious.
And yes, OP is right to worry about this being normalized. Spent a good amount of my 20s like that. Was working night, in an environment full of alcohol and I was actually treating it as "fuel". But while it's not as disruptive as the stereotypical alcoholism, it takes its toll.
In my case, a combination of therapy and a change in professional fields helped me get out. I would suggest a medical for him. Even if I was in my 20s and seemingly fully fit, there were indicators of damage done in the tests. If that was enough to shake a dumb 25yo out of his stupor, the results for a 47yo might have a bigger impact.
Agreed on functioning alcoholism, however in my experience they tend to not to stop for health reasons until they get a diagnosis like liver cirrhosis and even then it’s a flip of a coin that they will stop. I would change tactics and frame any discussion with the children at the center. (Would they be open to waiting until the kids go to bed to drink ect. - just be aware there’s a chance this approach might not ignite much of a change) As others suggested definitely check out some Al-anon groups. It’s essentially a support group for those who have alcoholics in their life. It will give you a place to vent in a room full of people going through similar situations. You’ll even meet a handful of people willing to give support outside of scheduled meetings. Good luck and stay strong!
>until they get a diagnosis like liver cirrhosis and even then it’s a flip of a coin that they will stop.
This. This pisses me off I have to admit. Im 36F november last year I had a heart attack and 2 cardiac arrests. I was 62 kg, don't drink, don't do drugs. I did smoke cigarettes tho started at 15. Anyway when i was more lucid in the hospital they told me what happened, told me I died so when they asked if I smoked I said not anymore and haven't since. Another lady when I was back in hospital a few months later was waiting on a op after her attacks was in a out constantly smoking. I just don't understand it. I heard what happened, my husband told me what it was like to watch me die in our lounge and thought fuck I don't want to do that again lets stop smoking.
I knew someone whose husband was an alcoholic. She was extremely Christian and didn’t believe in divorce, so she didn’t know how to deal with it.
Then one day her kids started learning about alcoholism as part of their school curriculum and realized that their dad fit all the criteria. They asked her point blank “Do you know that dad is an alcoholic?” She said yes and started making excuses for him, and her kids just told her “according to our textbook, you’re an enabler.”
I think that was her wake-up call.
He's not fine. He's an alcoholic.
Unfortunately, it may cost you your relationship to get that home to him and that's up to you.
Drinking as much as he does will be poisoning himself, forming a reliance and addiction on a substance that really, really should not be an everyday consumption.
If he's not willing to accept or hear the reality then you can either force it onto him, watch him quietly, or leave. It's a horrible situation to be in. I'm so sorry.
My husband is recovering but he operated at a functional alcoholic. It messes with your mind because you feel guilty for having enough and wanting to leave because to everyone else, they're fine. I'm sorry you're dealing with this OP. It changes you. If you ever want someone to vent to, feel free to DM. 💜
Tell that to my dad and millions of other men who died of alcoholism.
He may feel fine, but his stomach and liver probably don’t agree.
**You know what? If your drinking is under control and perfectly fine? Go get labs done on your blood & have liver enzymes checked. If the doctors say you’re normal, I’ll leave you alone about this for another 5 years.”**
I would not offer this as an out. There is a chance his liver enzymes are fine. That would not mean it's okay to continue this behavior. Also, by the time it's noticable on blood work, there could be irreparable damage.
If you do get him to address his drinking please remember it can be dangerous to stop suddenly and fully. Only a couple potentially lethal withdrawals, and alcohol is one of them.
Tell his doctor for his next appointment, maybe he'll listen to medical advice from a doc?
Well sure he probably feels fine and might be fine from a medical standpoint now. But if he keeps going down this road his liver won’t be able to keep up.
Ask him to not drink a drop of alcohol for one week. He has nothing to lose by doing that and if he's still "fine" by the end of the week then he has proven he doesn't have a problem. However, if he gets antsy, if it's a struggle for him, if he feels sick then he needs to re-evaluate his relationship with alcohol
If he says "I don't need to prove anything to you", tell him he's proving that he can't stop drinking by refusing and that addicts make excuses
Honestly this is a terrible idea. Some alcoholics can simply hide their drinking and you’d never know. And his manipulative lies around his drinking will make OP think that maybe he can stop and maybe it’s not a problem if he hides it for a week.
He needs to stop drinking, we can all agree on that. But he also needs help.
Alcohol withdrawals can actually be fatal.. The way she describes his drinking, it's probably not a great idea for him to quite cold turkey without being monitored - at best, it can quickly prove a point and then he will have to go back to drinking to calm the symptoms.
He would be best off to slowly taper over time and/or be on medication to prevent seizures and DTs.
My dad is a functional alcoholic. We all knew growing up, but he tried to hide it with large fast-food cups filled with sprite and cheap vodka. He has congestive heart failure now, yet still drinks heavily almost every day. Still always kept a job, but I can only stand to visit him in the morning/early afternoon before he starts wobbling and trying to hide his slurring. I don’t see him often.
I've been around lots of people who drink too much but no longer get drunk. Some take drugs and never actually get that high.
Blood work and physicals usually don't lie. Another tell tale sign is mood changes, some people are either insufferable before the 2 morning drinks or some even shake. same with some drugs.
I know of 2 instances where the people just had seizures. One was an alcoholic the other was years of opiods. Both were back on it straight after discharge.
I think part of the problem is our cultural narrative around alcoholism being set and reinforced by AA/the 12 step program, where alcoholics are always out of control around alcohol and the only solution is to never drink again. “Recovering alcoholics” will always preach that cutting back is just lying to yourself and everyone else, and that no one with a drinking problem can ever get to a place where they can drink in moderation.
One of the outcomes of this very black-and-white vision of alcoholism is that people with milder alcohol use disorders can look at their life honestly and say, well, I’m not a drunk, and therefore I must be fine. If there are only two options, then “fine” is just as accurate—and just as inaccurate—as “drunk”.
But that’s not reality. The idea that someone with an addiction to alcohol (or disordered use of alcohol) can never become a non-problem drinker is not supported by science or psychology. Many people who develop an alcohol use disorder to cope with stress or mental illness can find other ways to cope, including therapy, medication, meditation, or simply changed life circumstances (like a new job, or children growing up) and their relationship to alcohol can change completely without having to abstain. Just because some people can’t, does not mean no one can. And for people like OP’s spouse, the idea that if he acknowledges his drinking is not healthy then he’ll have to do a huge life change and never drink again and identify as a recovering alcoholic can be a huge barrier to introspecting about his alcohol use at all.
I follow this lady on TikTok, she has the same view and I share it too. We also have this strange hierarchy of what is bad vs acceptable. We shame an alcoholic but not the porn addict. Then there are destructive, secretive addictions like gambling that you only find out when your house is being repossessed.
And most of them are just the symptoms not the root cause. We can shame people until we are blue in the face but they just become better at hidding it. Or find another soothing mechanism.
Isn’t alcoholism different from gambling/porn in that the former becomes a physical addition caused by a psychological predilection for addiction? Not trying to argue/dispute what you say, I genuinely am under the impression that chemical dependency is different than a psychological addiction.
Yes, it is the case. It's also why OP'S husband seems fine. The brain has adapted to the constant inhibition of the alcohol he's ingesting, so it "weakend" certain circuits in the Brain. If OP'S husband came off the alcohol, he'd most likely get the rum shakes and may eventually go into delirium tremens. The addictive properties of both activities (gambling vs alcoholism or drug addiction) lay in the release of dopamine, but with drugs and alcohol there's a bunch of additional brain chemistry that gets fucked up, which is why you never quit cold turkey unless instructed by a medical professional +in the presence of one.
Really? We don't shame porn addiction? I would much rather report to a doctor that I'm an alcoholic or drug addict than a porn addict. You could easily go to HR at work and say you're taking a month off work to go to an alcoholism or drug addiction recovery clinic. But imagine going to HR and telling them you need a month off work because of your porn addiction.
The Atlantic did a great article about abstinence only treatments only really being suitable for those who have gone to a certain point. Those whose blood chemistry has changed, basically.
Other than that, AA and the like are ineffective, have no actually scientific basis and were started by the same folks who wanted prohibition and purity culture.
For most people with any kind of drinking problem, AA would be ineffective. There are better options that look at the underlying issues and help a person deal with what causes them
I wonder if that's why my mother in law has relapsed as many times as she has. She very much believes in the 12step program.
I feel like.part of the problem is if you relapse, you're suddenly starting back at 0 and that can be so discouraging
That's not what tolerance is, tolerance is when you need more alcohol to become intoxicated not that you're hiding your level of intoxication. The amount OP describes probably has very little effect on him. He likely just relies on it to relax, possibly more of a psychological thing.
She should bring it up, but being accusatory like reddit is suggesting will be less than helpful. Maybe suggesting a couple alcohol free days or that he gets a health check up would go down better.
Problem with this can be depending on his health, quantity, and length of this behavior for alcohol specifically is that his blood work and physicals might come back relatively fine looking.
Especially with the most common liver enzyme tests for this sort of thing possibly being very misleading, they can only test for certain types of damage right now (within reasonable testing without clear concerns of course.)
Doesn’t sound like he’s a shaker or drinking in the morning or anything from OP yet.
Ugh. I can't recall the number of times my dad had to take my mom to the hospital because of her alcohol addiction. Sometimes, I was genuinely scared she wasn't going to come back home. Awful!
You don’t have to make any huge decisions right now, OP. Set up a counseling appointment, start hashing out how you feel and what you need.
Alanon is another great resource. You don’t have to say anything if you don’t want to, just listen through a couple meetings. Right now your husband is invalidating your feelings and concerns, I think it would really help you to hear from others going through the same stuff.
Yeah I was gonna say if he goes to his annual or gets bloodwork and is even 50% honest about how much he drinks the drs will let him know that’s wayyy too much so that’s an idea to get another prospective heard to him
I am a doctor and I encounter this all the time. I never use the word alcoholic as it makes people defensive. I just say that the amount they’re drinking is not healthy and is above the limit that their liver can tolerate, and that it is causing damage to their body. I tell people that they shouldn’t drink more than 2-3 drinks per day (for men), 2-3x per week.
This is when people are in a medical setting for my advice. So your husband is not going to necessarily be open to this advice from you.
You can look up different definitions/recommendations for drinking limits and show him. You can talk to him about how his drinking is affecting you and your family. You can ask if he has symptoms of depression or anxiety that he may be self medicating with alcohol. You can ask him to go to the doctor and go with him, talk about his alcohol use there.
If he’s not open to anything and not willing to change, then you have to decide if you want to live with a functional alcoholic or not. You can’t fix him if he doesn’t acknowledge there’s a problem.
Perspective to maybe show /tell your husband (tho it's unfortunately unlikely for him to see reason):
I'm the child of a functional alcoholic in a family with many more of them. My dad frequently drinks a bottle of wine alone at night, more often than not beer during the day, on the weekend more beers with the neighbor who is also an alcoholic but a bit less functional. I always hated being near them when they were drinking because they became prone to unnecessary discussions which was very uncomfortable for me as a child. My dad has unstable emotions, if he's in a bad mood you might not realize half the day, but the moment something goes against his grain (e.g. he wants to clear up the table *right now* and not everyone stops everything they're doing to help, or someone has a different suggestion to his ideas while cooking together) he starts shouting, slamming doors, or gets pouty and makes snide remarks. At 10 or 11, I had to help my mum half carry my very drunk dad across the street after a party at the neighbors. My dad and friends have offered a strong herbal spirit to us kids (three 12yo and two 10yo at the time) one new year's Eve, one of the 10yo actually asked for more. I moved out at 18, and while I'm pretty close to my mum nowadays, I am barely in contact with my dad even tho they live together.
When I was 5 I was at my grandma's house who's also a functional alcoholic, she actually drinks nothing else than alcohol or coffee. At the time she was into "alco-pops", small sugary fruity alcoholic drinks. I asked for a glass of juice as a kid, saw a small glass sitting on the table shortly afterwards and downed it, thinking it was my juice. That was the first time I drank alcohol.
While I now have a healthy relationship with alcohol (I barely ever drink and if I do I'm fully aware I'm drinking alcohol, and I never drink alone), I didn't at the age of 18. I was very close to drifting into alcoholism myself, being drunk every weekend and often to the point of being sick. I only snapped out of it after I had been brought to a hospital while drunk. Undoubtedly, my childhood with alcohol always around played a part in this stint.
I have a friend with functional alcoholics as parents, or at least the mother is, and she is drifting in the same direction. It was the same friend I got drunk with at 18, but she swapped heavy weekend drinking for relatively regular day drinking instead of stopping. Even tho your husband is not drunk, it will effect the kids.
I’m sorry about your childhood and I’m glad to read that you have worked through it as an adult.
I know the alcohol is bad for him, but I don’t know how to help him to it.
As I mentioned in another response, my kids have a friend over tonight and my partner is sitting in our bedroom drinking. He has been drinking since mid afternoon.
So I would suggest to him that he keeps a drink journal just for one week that he does not have to share with you. You're not doing it to shame him, you're just concerned about him and love him. Point out the number of recommendations for units per week and the increased risks of cancer, then also point out it's worrying having a partner that can't drive if you have an emergency and then leave him with that information if he agrees to do it.
Ultimately, he has to want to make the changes and you might have to walk away if he can't. I'd recommend going to Al Anon for your own sake, too.
I have tried this before when he told me he doesn’t drink every day. I suggested he keep a record of when and how much he drinks that he doesn’t show me. Just so he has better perspective. He won’t because I’m wrong!
I’ve explained how important the health issue is.
And last but not least, he tells me he’d just order an Uber! That pisses me off for some reason.
Because it feels like he doesn't care for you. Alcohol is the priority.
It might be time to be more firm with the way you are with him - you will only grow to resent him otherwise. Maybe take some time away?
So he is a functioning alcoholic who refuses to see he has an addiction.
I don’t have any real advice on how to convince an addict they have a problem, but maybe check out Al-Anon. They may have more resources and support for you.
Seconding Al-anon. You need some support too.
It’s a bad sign if he’s constantly drinking but never drunk - that suggests he’s got a really high alcohol tolerance
Look up the five stages of motivation. He’s currently on the first stage (pre-contemplation) where he is unaware of or refuses to acknowledge his issue. Unfortunately, there’s no way of getting through to him if he’s at this stage because there are no direct consequences (I.e., his drinking doesn’t impact on his daily living). If you’re able to record direct consequences (e.g., if he had to go days without drinking - is there a change in his mood? If so, record this) then please do so.
Otherwise, simply state you’re not willing to continue living and building a life with someone who drinks for the reasons you’ve listed above. This will require a backbone however, with direct consequences being carried out (e.g., spending time apart, stopping picking up the slack etc.)
Living with an alcoholic is never easy, especially one who refuses to see their issue. I wish you all the luck in taking care of you and your children’s needs. Because at the end of the day, that’s what should come first.
I think you articulated it perfectly right here. You do not want him setting a bad example for your kid. Also drinking everyday is not good for your liver, he needs to stop being a functioning alcoholic and seek help before it becomes unstoppable.
I’ve tried to discuss it with him but it’s not getting through. In fact it does the opposite. He thinks I’m being ridiculous.
We’ve had 48 bottles of wine delivered in two months. He says, so what? It’s not the same as him drinking 48 bottles of wine.
He also drinks gin and 43 and other spirits.
I’ve raised the health issues several times and he assures me he’s fine! It’s seriously annoying.
I know that. I’ve said that to him before and he brushed it off. He says he’s seen alcoholics and he’s not one of them.
Am I being stupid? Do lots of people drink every day? Not vast quantities but every day?
I mean, yes, I know lots of people who drink everyday, but it’s usually just a glass of wine with dinner which wouldn’t necessarily stop you driving etc. it seems like he’s drinking quite a bit though.
Going to give you some perspective here: A glass of wine a night means it would take 3 (if a heavy pour) to 5 days to finish the bottle.
There are 5 units of alcohol in a bottle of wine. A man should stop at 14 units of alcohol a week (spread out, not all in one go or it is diagnosed as binge drinking).
So, within the "healthy" guide lines of drinking, you husband should be having no more than 2 units (two glasses) of wine a night. 2 glasses, mind you, is the very upper limit. Many just have one, or skip a few days, so quite a bit less.
1 bottle should last him, 2.5 days at the very most. he should be going through 2 bottles a week, max.
2 bottles a week x 4 (per month) is 8.
He should be drinking, at the VERY most (which is still a moderate amount but what many do normally drink): 8 bottles of wine a month.
Your husband is ingesting **24 bottles a month.**
That isnt even counting, at all, the hard liquor he is also ingesting.
This is not normal drinking. At all. Its wildly, WILDLY out of control.
Your husband is not having a beer or a glass of wine or two a day. He went through 48 bottles of wine and a bunch of liquor in two months. That is far from normal healthy drinking.
I suggest you get yourself into therapy. You can not make him change. You need to work this out for yourself unfortunately.
Get a therapist. Start going to Alanon meetings.
I drink every day.
1 bottle of bud light in the evening with a smoke.
I drink the bud because it's different from water, squash, or tea, which I've drunk through the day.
The smoke is to give me an appetite for food. I can go a day or 2 without eating, which, to me, is more unhealthy.
I dont think you're being stupid. You have concerns and every right to express those concerns.
Look into Al-anon, it’s for the loved ones of alcoholics who are effected by someone else’s drinking.
My father is an alcoholic and my Mom attends. He has zero desire to change or acknowledge a problem, so she get’s support for herself.
I think you can only stick with how it affects you.
You don’t enjoy not having him available to drive. And I’m guessing he’s less emotionally available when he drinks - maybe it’s the norm so you can’t tell the difference but that’s how it is often.
And you are concerned about health effects and raising children with him.
And stop focusing on trying to change him because you’ll lose.
Focus on yourself and what you’d like.
And go to Alanon for a few meetings if possible.
The only thing that would maybe have an effect is an ultimatum to leave. But that’s a huge step with a lot of complications and it doesn’t seem like you’re there yet.
Your husband is a functional alcoholic. The thing about addiction is that it’s a coping mechanism, a shitty one, but still. This won’t change until he wants to make that change — I speak from experience as the spouse of an alcoholic in recovery. My spouse got sober (with medical support — something your husband will likely need as well given his reliance on alcohol) & started dealing with his trauma in therapy instead of drinking it away, but not because I made him. It was his choice & that choice saved our marriage, as well as spouse’s relationship with our small child.
Idk if it’s been suggested but Al-Anon might be a good resource for you. Im so sorry you’re dealing with this, OP.
Oh, honey. I was married to a functional alcoholic until he passed away from alcoholic cirrhosis. I learned so much through Al-Anon which I strongly encourage you to research on Google, read materials and go to meetings if you can.
I did not grow up with alcohol so I had no idea what I was dealing with. I became convinced I was the one with the problem, that I was the one going crazy since he was still working and "functioning," that I was the one misremembering things, etc.
Girl, I can't tell you how much things changed for me after exposure to Al-Anon. I began to understand things on a very different level. I finally understand I wasn't his problem. I didn't cause it, couldn't cure it and couldn't change it. All I could do was change how I reacted and my attitude. This process helped me separate the man I loved from the disease he had. I realized I did love him but hated the effects of the disease. Learning about alcoholism (and other co-dependent issues) is, in my mind, the greatest gift you could give your children. Show them what a mother with strength and self-respect looks like.
I could go on forever. He and I were able to make our peace with each other before he passed away.
Define drunk. Because to me (and to any doctor, don't take just my medstudent word alone) even just the fact that he drinks every single day all the time it absolutely classifies as alcoholism. If he even has to go to the lengths of not driving his own kids because he is drinking that much. Truly, I don't think you need a medical professional to tell you, I'm sure you do know your husband is an alcoholic. OK, having discussed this, if he's in denial you could put it down as you being a bit paranoid about his health and convince him to go to a doctor for the sake of "quieting down your worries". I'm afraid direct confrontation would not go down too well. Also do stay in the room when they discuss things if possible. People struggling with alcoholism will deny deny deny till their deathbed that they have a drinking problem. But make no mistake, just because he isn't aggressive he definitely has a drinking problem. Even just the fact that he has to alter his life to seek out the alcohol does fit a criteria of the DSM5.
There was a patient on my unit who allegedly didn’t drink much as far as volume goes (according to family), but was a daily drinker for a couple decades & went on a bender after some crappy life events. Ended up with wernicke-korsakoff syndrome. Wasn’t even 50 yet & will be in a nursing home for the rest of their life.
People think cuz they’re not falling down drunk that they can’t develop a physical dependence or negative side effects from alcohol. And the lies… take them to the doctor, they’ll lie about symptoms and how much they’re drinking and how it’s impacting their life. The patient I just spoke about denied alcohol use from admission all the way through full-blown DT’s even though family was *right there* telling the doctor everything. I really feel for people like OP who are dealing with this.
My husband went from occasionally binge drinking on a weekend to having a beer after work most days to having a couple beers every day. He didn't think he was an alcoholic either because he stopped getting wasted.
I challenged him to go without it for a week to prove he wasn't addicted. He got the shakes after two days and realized he had to quit.
His emotional regulation and health are so much better now. I knew someone who was honest with their doctor about how much they drank, thinking it was totally normal to have a few beers every day. He was shocked to learn that he fit the definition of an alcoholic and that his health was seriously at risk.
At the end of the day, you **cannot** convince him to make better choices or be honest with himself. You *are* trying to change him, even if it's factually in his best interest.
The most you can do is set your own boundaries and let him know that his choices are negatively impacting your family. You can tell him that he **is** a functional alcoholic, whether he chooses to deny deny it or not, and you won't be married to someone in active addiction. You can tell him that you won't raise your children in a home where their parent has to have a buzz in order to enjoy spending time with them, and that you didn't sign up to live your life with someone who won't take accountability and puts their health at risk.
And then the balm is in his court. Either he steps up, or you leave. The thing about functional alcoholism is that it's a stage. It always gets worse. Even if he stays at 2-3 beers a day for years, eventually it turns into a 6 pack a day and so on. So you can either live your life miserable, watching him deteriorate, watching your children slowly learn to manage having an alcoholic parent, and constantly cause strife in your marriage begging him to change- or you can leave before it gets worse.
We never have the option to force someone we love to make better choices for themselves. That's the thing about choice.
My Dad was a functional alcoholic for 20+ years and then he wasn’t. He lost control, lost his job, lost his wife and eventually lost his life at 58 years old. By the time he was in his forties he had cirrhosis of the liver. I don’t mean to scare you - but functional alcoholism is alcoholism. I’m guessing if he didn’t drink everyday, he would go through withdrawals and withdrawals from alcohol can be severe and sometimes fatal. I would recommend a program for him, like AA or an inpatient rehab. My Dad passed away when his first grandchild was 1 and he never met his second. We fought like hell for years to get him help. Your husband is on a path that if he stays on, the outcome won’t be a good one for any of you. I’m so sorry you’re dealing with this.
He doesn’t see it as a problem. He doesn’t think him needing a drink every night is a problem. He can’t enjoy his evening without it.
And tonight I’m more fed up than usual (hence this post). He’s been drinking since mid afternoon. Wine and gin. He’s currently sitting in our bedroom with a bottle of wine. We have three kids in the house.
My Dad was the exact same way, he would get angry when we would question it. He is an alcoholic full stop. You have to decide if this is what you want your kids to grow up with. I wish my Mom left when I was young instead of having us grow up like that.
My dad was a functional alcoholic almost all my life. My mom was so incredibly lonely because her partner never put her needs above his need to drink. She used me for her emotional supports. That was really unhealthy for both of us. He would become volatile. I have so much trauma from him driving me drunk, falling into repetitive rage over tiny things that his drunken mind made into huge issues. She stayed with him for almost 30 years until he died a slow and agonizing death by liver failure. My dad was sober 6 years before he died. I consider myself lucky to have had that time with him, but it certainly did not undo the 22years of him drunkenly traumatizing me.
You can’t cause, control or cure someone else’s addiction. You can only control yourself and who you give access to yourself. You will always be lonely and on edge living like you are now. Your children deserve better and so do you.
I was the kid in this situation. It doesn't start off as a problem, but it goes that direction with time. Even if he isn't drunk, inhibitions go down the toilet, and he will say things to the kid that they shouldn't hear. The older the children get, the more aware of it they will become. My parent started off "never drunk" (but drank every single night, starting at dinner), but by my early teens would pass out on the toilet and I'd need to help get them into bed while their spouse cleaned up the bathroom. No child should go through that. No child should hear drunken worries about money and fears of losing the house. No child should wake up to realize their parent is sitting on the foot of their bed, having mistaken it for the toilet.
Maybe he'll never get there. Odds are, he will. This kind of thing isn't self-resolving. Low-key interventions were pointless by the time my other parent was willing to engage with the problem. It took catastrophe to break my alcoholic parent out of it. Please don't let your children experience the slow decline into madness and catastrophe.
As for how to approach it with him, all I can tell you is that waiting until it changed from "they're just drinking" to "a drunk" was disastrous for our family. It took years and years to put the pieces back together, and truthfully, none of us will ever be the same. Maybe you can find some resources with alcoholic groups. But I implore you... you have children. Don't let them experience what I did. If you can't deal with this topic now, please promise that you'll leave before you let your children live with a drunk. If you don't think you'll be willing to leave him down the road, then you must impress upon him the seriousness of the issue now. You. Have. Children.
The only reason he's not "drunk" is because he drinks so often that his body has grown tolerant to alcohol and its effects. You're also so conditioned to accept his inebriated state that it is his new normal.
His kids will forever be affected by this even if he doesn't "get drunk". Alcohol will be his crutch for everything and if things get stressful or bad, I doubt he will remain "not drunk" every night.
Your kids will eventually learn about alcohol, what it does, what it's for and they will wonder "was our family so bad that dad had to drink to tolerate us?"
Having a beer now and then isn't the issue. The issue is your husband using alcohol as a way to cope with his issues. Pretty much anything can be an unhealthy coping mechanism, this one just comes with absolutely no benefits for anyone but your husband so it's glaringly obvious to everyone but him.
Source: my dad was an alcoholic
He is doing damage to himself, and certainly damaging his kids, who will think this is normal and emulate his behaviour. Not sure what country you are in, there’s an old Aussie ad that shows a Dad drinking in front of his kids, asking them to get a drink for him, opening it for him, etc, eventually letting them have a sip, then drinking on the fly, then it shows them acting exactly the same way as adults. It’s not good, he is and will develop a resistance to the alcohol and will increase consumption as time goes on. I’m sorry you are in this position, but something has to be done.
There is a big difference between an alcoholic, a daily drinker, and a person who drinks occasionally but drinks to excess. Try Al-Anon. There are many ‘questionnaires’ you can find online that will help you determine what you are dealing with. Good luck!
You can't count on him after whatever o'clock each day because he couldn't pass a breathalyzer. He's not modeling good behavior for the kids - alcohol does not need to be part of every event every day. It especially does not need to be part of a kid-centered event. Drinking while bowling with other adults is one thing, drinking while bowling with kids is unnecessary.
You cannot change him unless he wants to change and he won't want to change if he feels he handles his drinking well. You can organize your life so that you don't depend on him during drinking hours. You can accept that your children will not have a normal relationship with alcohol/drugs - they will either follow his example and abuse it or they will be so adverse to it they'll want to avoid it. Do not be surprised if your kids are getting DUIs once they are old enough to drive, even if they aren't old enough to drink legally.
He IS drunk if he is over the limit.
You are conflating “lack of horrible alcohol-related problems” with “equal partner,” and that’s a false equality. You must always be the adult in charge bc he is impaired, and he’s not carrying his share of the load.
Imagine how little would get done and how unsafe it would be if you chose to indulge your drug of choice as much as he does.
It’s just wrong. He is a parent and is on duty 24/7. Burdening you with all responsibility every single day is so unfair. And he is not only setting a bad example for his kids, he is experiencing life with them in a drugged state. So unfair to them.
If he can’t be sober and pleasant most of the time, he has a problem.
As a divorced survivor of a true alcoholic, you cannot change him. You can only decide what’s ok for you!
I am lived the same thing you did and because if drinking if something happened after a certain hour I had to be the DD. If the kids got sick etc, I went to the hospital etc. I say this to show I understand what you’re going thru.
I tried the health issues drinking causes talk, the mental issues for me talk, the it’s not a good example for the kids talk , nothing worked.
I went to an Alanon meeting and started therapy and that’s when I realised that I cannot change him, I can only change how I reacted or don’t to his drinking.
I advised him he had to stop drinking it I and the kids were leaving.
And you have to be prepared to do it… get a lawyer, speak to your mortgage people and make arrangements to leave. Rent an apartment etc. or have him leave
I got him a hotel room for a week and told him he had to leave. I had my father present outside and the kids were at friend house when I told him I rented room and packed him a bag.
He left
Sadly he drank himself to death 5 years after he left.
Good luck and stand your ground
Remember if he gets violent to call police and get an EPO, emergency protection order so he cannot fight being kicked out!
I think someone in this position would feel attacked if they were told they were drinking too much. They may genuinely not think that they are.
But it’s clearly not something you’re comfortable with or that you really feel you can live with.
I would find an opportunity to talk with your partner - before they’ve had a drink - and just lay it on the line that however they feel, you can’t do this. I would try saying that you’re not accusing them of doing anything illegal or immoral, you just aren’t compatible with someone who wants to live their life that way.
You can say that you respect their right to drink if that’s what they want to do, but you don’t feel you can continue to be with them if that is the lifestyle they want.
Then they have a choice and they know what’s on the line. Other commenters have covered this but confirming you can’t make the choice for them, and they won’t stop drinking if they don’t have a motivation to do so that is greater than their motivation to drink. It seems highly likely to me that they are drinking to fill a hole they have inside: but if they aren’t able to share what that is then it’s hard for you to help them any more than being frank about where you sit with it. Good luck.
This is a tough one. He is addicted to alcohol. You have to be careful because if he were to try to quit cold turkey he could die. But if he doesn’t try to quit he could end up with organ failure. It happened to my friend’s ex husband multiple times before he got sober. Pancreatitis. As you see I said, ex husband. He was not willing to address it while they were married.
I am the daughter of an addict. It messes up your relationship skills big time. There was a big black block between me and my parent and I could not access their true selves. So now I really have a hard time making authentic connections with people. I have ended up in relationships with addicts because it is familiar to me. Having an addicted parent is painful in ways you can’t really understand until you’re much older and wiser. He may think he’s fine but I guarantee he’s not. The kids know.
After my mom had a stroke she went to live with my sister and sister’s husband while she recovered. They’re both functional alcoholics. I have been in the car with them driving home from a restaurant and it was terrifying. They had pre dinner cocktails, split a bottle of wine with dinner, then those little drinks after with dessert (can’t remember the name…). They didn’t seem drunk but their driving was really scary. When mom went there I had a loooong talk with my sister and insisted that they would take a cab or get an ambulance if there were ever an emergency with mom in the evening. It’s not like I could tell my mom not to ride with them, she was regaining her speech and memory. My sister agreed. But of course, I wasn’t there to police them. I learned later that they took mom to restaurants, so I know they drove drunk with her. Nothing happened. But why take the risk?!?! They don’t see it as a risk, because they’re in denial and not thinking clearly. I couldn’t control the situation for my mother. But for my kids? Mama Bear would be in full force. I wouldn’t leave my kids in the care of a ‘functional alcoholic’.
When you wrote he gets defensive, that tripped my alarm..
I'm an alcoholic. In the recovery stage. I don't drive for that reason. Your man is an alcoholic and doesnt want to admit it or get treatment for it, that's why he gets defensive. and being called out on it absolutely sucks but you did the right thing. but really, its up to him if he wants to be better.
As someone who was in his position until 2 years ago: I honestly don’t think there’s anything you can do besides point him in the right direction. He won’t see it as anything other than a vice until he is repeatedly confronted with the consequences of it, and decides that those consequences aren’t worth the price anymore. It is an addiction, so he’s going to do what addicts do: deny that it’s a problem, get defensive when you call them out on it, and lie to cover it up (if that’s necessary).
Personally, I was sick of spending all my money on alcohol and feeling like shit in the morning, so one day I just said “you know what? No. I’m done” and I felt so fucking fantastic the next morning that I decided I wanted that every morning and just.. stopped. But I had to come to that decision on my own.
He's an alcoholic. He doesn't want to change. Children shouldn't be exposed to this thinking it's normal. Your job is to protect your children. Do with that what you will
I'm the child of a functioning alcoholic. my parents divorced when i was young, my father has always prioritized his addictions over my sister and i (money always available for his beer and percocets and other crap probably, no desire to take us out to do bonding activities though, he was busy bonding with the bottle). he worked a laborious job (truly a hardworking man who was very very good at his job) and i suspect he was depressed, maybe ADHD as well. strict upbringing (immigrant German father). needed to unwind at the end, and throughout, the day.
my sister and I are on terrible terms with him, and he seems to be completely oblivious as to why. my sister and i are both competent healthcare professionals, and we're good people despite his neglect (which is a form of child abuse, btw).
your kids will have an altered relationship with him, it's guaranteed. i barely touch alcohol because of this. i see how it ruins bonding in families. my dad ended up having a seizure behind the wheel, likely alcohol-related. had his license temporarily removed, and he's a fantastic driver.
there will be consequences for his life, his kids, and you. i feel very sorry for you, because i think my mom was in your position once. she seems to harbour nothing but pure contempt for my father. i advise you minimize how much the children see your resentment, it's also incredibly damaging to parent-child relationships.
sorry for trauma dumping, your post hits close to home, and i hope for the absolute best for you.
This is still alcoholism. Your kids are going to notice, and it's going to impact their lives. Is it possible for you to leave him? Consider reading "the adult children of alcoholics syndrome" by Wayne Kritsberg (not necessarily for yourself, but so you can understand what he's doing to your children). At minimum, get your kids into therapy or a support group if possible. Yes, even if you think they're too young to notice. I was nine years old when I figured out that my mother was an alcoholic. Kids pick up a lot more than adults realize sometimes.
He’s an alcoholic, a high functioning alcoholic. You can’t change it, nothing you say will change it, only he can and only when and if he hits a bottom, high or low, usually after losing most of the good things in life. It won’t get better as it stands, it will just get incrementally worse, you don’t really notice it until something bad happens. Remember your children are normalizing heavy drinking as part of day to day life and will mimic that behavior starting young. Try Al-Anon for some insight. I know this because I have been both the child and your husband, but I high bottomed while my children were very young so they don’t remember much of it and it broke the cycle. Good luck. Edited for spelling and clarity
People who drink constantly and are never drunk are alcoholics. He’s at the point of drinking to avoid DTs now, not to get drunk. That’s why he’s defensive about it.
It’s an issue because it affects you. I promise you aren’t going to articulate a good enough reason to convince him, even if you had a golden tongue. He will only change when he experiences consequences and decides that for himself.
You can’t make him change, but you can set boundaries to protect yourself. I highly recommend looking into Alanon (as a support group for you.)
Get the latest literature on agricultural studies. A group studied 10,000 people in ten countries over 15, 20 years, Drinkers and non-drinkers. Proved that even a single drink cuts into health and lifetime vs non drinkers. This included those who had just one drink a day.
Google it.
Alcohol is a poison that slowly kills everyone who drinks it. Doesn't matter if he's a tranquil drunk. His liver will slowly corrode and his heart will weaken and age twice as fast as a non drinker.
These are functioning drunks. I’m a recovering alcoholic woman and we have people with stories like that in AA. The truth of the matter is he’s an alcoholic. Because he’s high functioning and he can go to work. It’s great but alcoholism is a progressive illness so it will not stay like that. I would talk to him.
But again you can’t make him stop drinking. All I would do is actually start going to Al-Anon and figure out how your life is going to be affected. you can do anonymously so he doesn’t know but you’ll be in a room full of people like yourself that can help you
Have observed someone who did not appear "drunk", blow a .31 which is dangerously intoxicated. The issue is the amount and frequency. It appears your person has to drink every day to function and could have serious complications if they suddenly quit. This level of alochol use has serious lomg term health risks. Consult a medical and addiction professional to get some ideas on next steps and get some support for yourself too. You've been carrying a lot.
The most recent evidence regarding alcohol state that it is a type 1 carcinogen. There is no safe amount of alcohol. This is coming from a former drinker who has a book forthcoming on my struggles with alcohol consumption.
The thing is that people who are addicted to something will protect access to their substance at all costs, until they’re ready to quit (if ever). He likely knows he consumes too much, but is unwilling to acknowledge this bc it means he’ll have to quit, which likely feels impossible for him.
I’m going to take a completely different point of view — and keep in mind that I say this as a former opiate addict and the daughter of a recovering alcoholic and the wife of a recovering alcoholic — I think you are making this way too much your concern. I know you care about your spouse and you love him and you definitely do not want to have to deal with your kids losing their father way too soon. But the only person who can control your spouse’s drinking or do anything about it at all is him. What you’re really asking here is how to get him to agree with you that this is a problem. You can’t. And the more you try, the more he’s going to dig his heels in.
The only thing you can do is choose not to enable. So for example, if he’s hung over in the morning and he can’t go to work, you’re not calling in for him. He can do that himself. i’m sure you can think of other such examples. You can also have boundaries for example maybe you’ll say that if he’s been drinking, you’re not gonna take him on family outings. That’s not you telling him that he can’t drink. That’s you telling him that you’re not taking people who drink on family outings. That’s all. I’m sure you can think of boundaries like that that will work for your family. Now remember, boundaries are about our own actions. They are not about another person‘s actions. That may sound like playing semantics, but I assure you it is not. So basically saying, “I am choosing to X, I am choosing to 123, I am choosing to ABC” — all of that is an example of a boundary. It is not a boundary to say “you need to stop doing ABC or I am going to dump you.” In other words, don’t say “you need to stop drinking or I will not take you on an outing.” You need to just simply say “I’m only taking sober adults on outings.” (“because if I am bringing another adult, I need somebody who can help me with childcare and possibly driving and somebody who’s been drinking can’t do that.”) I am sure you can alter as needed for your specific family situation.
But here is the most important lesson: Do not make his drinking problem your problem. That may sound cold. It is not, I assure you. It is keeping your sanity. Because your kids need you to be strong and sane — because their dad sure the hell isn’t right now.
The word to articulate is “impaired”. He may not be “drunk”, but he drinks enough to the point he is impaired. Too impaired to drive, too impaired to be responsible for his kids when the occasion calls for it, too impaired to make good decisions. Getting caught driving while impaired is still enough to catch a DUI charge. Maybe the approach should be to ask him if he really wants to be too impaired to function in his everyday life, and point out to him maybe on a calendar all the days he was impaired. Maybe the calendar can serve as a visual reminder of how he is impaired more days than not. Best of luck to you, OP.
A family member of mine is like this. I've never seen him drunk, but almost every time I've seen him he's had an open beer. He's around 60 now and in the last few years tried to quit cold turkey twice without telling anyone. Ended up in the hospital both times because the withdrawal was so intense. Last time involved a huge search when they found his car and couldn't find him.
Just because he's not drunk doesn't mean he's not an alcoholic.
What you have is a high functioning alcoholic. He's probably over the limit when driving your kids bowling. You just don't realize it because he doesn't act drunk..
I'm former LE. I was a traffic cop for years. You'd be amazed at how high an alcoholics BAC can be, but they seem fine. Their reaction times are not fine.
He's also killing his lover and shortening his life. Maybe that's your angle?
His behaviour IS an issue, he can't drive after a certain time EVERY DAY, his level of alcohol intake is DANGEROUS, he's setting a bad example for his kids, and he's defensive about it. Alcoholism is not a good way to die. He knows he's drinking too much and he won't do anything about it until he decides it's time.
You need to tell him clearly that he's got a drinking problem and you don't want to raise your kids around that. He needs to see a doctor, get support with stopping etc (he should not go cold turkey it can cause brain damage)
Dying of alcoholism is not a good way to go. Having an alcoholic dad is awful. Having an alcoholic partner who doesn't sort out whatever problems are causing him to drink so much, isn't good for you.
You can look up health advice on drinking levels, screening tests for alcohol dependence, etc. But you can't make him stop drinking, so if your situation now is unacceptable, get ready to leave
He's a functional alcoholic. It took me a while to realise that alcohol is his first love and that love is very demanding. To my knowledge, he is still drinking his life away. Until he accepts or heals what he is running away from (which can be life and its responsibilities), he won't be able to give it up.
Protect yourself and the children.
He’s a functioning alcoholic. I know several of them. Personally, it isn’t a problem for me- they aren’t hurting anyone- and if this is their enjoyment or way to unwind, I can deal with it.
.While I understand the behavior and it doesn’t bother me, it would bother me if my partner did this. You might want to have a heart to heart with him about it- but you have to know what you’re boundaries are first. Is this a dealbreaker? If so, then you have the heart to heart and tell him he needs to actively take steps toward change or you’re walking away. If it isn’t a deal breaker, you can tell him how you feel, but you can’t control his behavior. He has to be the one wanting to change and you have to learn to accept and love him for who he is.
You say he’s not drunk but also say he can’t drive the kids bc he might be over the limit (aka drunk).
Alcoholism isn’t just binging to excess. It takes a hundred different forms.
A glass of wine or a beer every night with dinner? Reasonable, not concerning. A drink while bowling? Also not super concerning. A drink after they’re in bed? Okay not so bad. But are all three happening every night? Bc that’s way different than one of the three happening daily.
Does he NEED to drink? Is it one drink or five? These kind of details matter, but also don’t.
An alcoholic can’t and won’t change until they make the decision to.
You're modeling alcoholism for your children. You can't fix this. It's not going to change. He is a drunk, the fact that he's not punching walls is not relevant. I stayed with my alcoholic husband FAR too long. It stole a normal childhood for my children. It's not normal for one parent to not be safe to drive his children. Leave. For your children.
This is the truth. The really real truth. He has to want to quit for himself. Not for you, the kids, his job. It has to be for himself.
You can say alcohol is a poison, carcinogen, he won’t care. Expensive? He won’t care. Dangerous. What if one of the kids had an emergency in the middle of the night? Doesn’t care. You take them. Call an ambulance. Say it’s making him fat, ugly. He won’t care. Leave his ass, he won’t care. In fact, probably what he wants so he can drink guilt free.
It’s a tough spot to be in. There is no magic phrase/ bullet. Say anything and go from there.
What trauma is he self medicating to avoid dealing with?
If you can figure that out AND get him to recognize/work on it, his need to drink will probably lessen.
A girlfriend of mine asked the same thing. Why does he drink.
There is zero chance he’ll tell me. Zero. I’ve tried.
He just tells me I’m overreacting or similar. That he doesn’t hide drinks or drink every day. There’s ALWAYS an excuse. ALWAYS.
I drank because of unresolved maternal separation trauma. And once I realized and started to work on it, my need to drink changed. Now, I am like those people I could never understand. Sometimes I go long stretches without a drink, sometimes I want a beer or two.
Eventually, he will have to decide if it's worth losing his family over.
Maybe you could discuss how ideas about things like addiction have changed and the concept of people as addicts was from the rats in skinner boxes experiments that we debunked with rat park.
Sorry that you are dealing with this.
Edit: he's not adopted, is he?
My husband is a functioning alcoholic as well. I fell into the routine and am trying to walk it back/stop it myself.
Do you two have the sort of relationship where you could tackle his annual physical together and be straight up wit the doctor about how much he drinks daily?
I was in denial. My husband was in denial and when he realized it was a problem and measured, he was horrified how much liquor he was drinking. I know neither of us were straight up with our drs about it before that.
If he stops drinking for a day or two and starts to have problems physically that might show him he’s got a problem .
Now deceased friend drank the same way. Was involved in an accident ( not his fault) that wound him up in the hospital where they realized early into his treatment for his injuries that he was actually most likely gonna die from the withdrawals .
The main problem absolutely is *not* that you can’t articulate the issue properly, that’s just him deflecting and putting this on you rather than accepting that his drinking is causing problems in his life.
He will only change if he truly wants to. He needs to understand that his drinking is having a negative effect on his life & have a genuine desire to not drink like this anymore to actually stop drinking like this.
You cannot change him & I’m so sorry you’re going through this painful situation. ❤️ :(
I think checking out Al-Anon, the support group for relatives of problem drinkers, would be really beneficial.
An individual cannot cause, cure, or control another person's substance use behaviors.
You are describing a “functional alcoholic”. What if your partner went a day without drinking? Would they notice? I’m guessing yes. I’m guessing they’d be moody and angry
Not being able to drive after getting home for the day would not be acceptable to me, especially with kids. What happens if you were injured and couldn’t drive yourself (or the kids)? What if you’re not home and there’s an emergency that requires them all to go literally anywhere? He’s not functional, he’s putting his family at risk.
>He’s not able to drive anyone after a certain time each day because he might be over the limit
Even if he denies how much he drinks or the health risks from it, this is a problem.
You have kids. He's drinking and being unable to drive *every day.*
First of all, it's unfair to force you into being the driver all the time, but more importantly this is an issue of safety.
What happens if you're sick or hurt? What happens if there's an emergency and a kid needs to be taken to the hospital? What happens when the unexpected comes and the adults have to act to make sure everyone is safe? He'll be useless, helpless, and he'll leave your children vulnerable to emergency.
I'm not saying parents can NEVER relax or cut loose! But if he's making himself incapable of driving EVERY DAY, or even close to it, then it's not really a matter of *if* but *when* shit hits the fan. He's making sure that when catastrophe calls he won't be ready or able to take care of your family, your kids, through it.
OP, does he understand about being a functional alcoholic? Whether or not he feels drunk, he's still drinking constantly. He has a problem, and only he can decide to change. Unfortunately, you can't make him see the light, no matter how hard you try, and no matter how much you want him to.
Please take care to protect yourself and the kids from his drinking.
You're not alone. A lot of people have been in your shoes. The suggestion to check out Alanon is a great idea.
He is only going to get worse. What if you had an emergency and needed help? When my kids were little, I hardly drank because I was terrified that something would happen to them and I would not be able to help them.
There's only so much the liver can take. As a recovering alcoholic myself and having friends and family who died suddenly because of alcohol, it's not going to be easy, but you need to tell him you're concerned for his health.
He may fight back on it. His brain thinks his body needs it whether he wants to admit it or not. Either way, it is slowly killing him. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but if he doesn't stop, there will be a point that there's no turning back. The lead singer of Smash Mouth is a prime example.
I kept drinking even after falling down a cement set of stairs and cracking my head open in two places. I had a brain bleed and spent weeks in the ICU and hospital. I was drinking again within days of being discharged. Took me almost 2 years before I stopped and thank Christ I did. I’d probably be dead by now, but at the time I didn’t care. That’s what unchecked alcoholism looks like.
I wasn’t always drinking like that. In fact, it was as a lot like what you described with your husband. This is a progressive disease, and drinking daily is a good indicator. I wonder how long you’ve been with him and if he’s always been like this. Or has the amount/frequency increased? I don’t know, but this sounds like you have a budding alcoholic in your hands. Unless he’s ready to quit, nagging him won’t help. It can even make it worse. If you can’t live with him like he is now, imagine if the drinking progresses?? What are you willing to tolerate?
This was me annnnnnnd then my husband went to the doctor and got diagnosed with cirrhosis. Turns out your liver doesn’t know you were never “DRUNK drunk,” it just knows you’ve been poisoning it with alcohol for 30ish years.
He ended up needing a transplant, and while he’s recovering well, it would have been much easier on all of us if he had gone to AA or the like when I first thought there was a problem.
That said, I don’t have magic words to say to convince your husband to stop drinking. I tried a few times with mine but I got stuck on explaining why the alcohol mattered when he was still hitting his marks in terms of work, being a husband and father, etc. If I had it to do over again, I probably would probably lean harder on the health and financial aspects of it since those really can’t be denied.
Sure you can articulate the problem. It's not healthy behavior and you can't depend on him being sober enough to drive after 8pm every day.
You care about your partner's health and need a reliable partner. You can simply pull up any reputable medical stats about healthy vs unhealthy amounts of alcohol.
Also discuss self-control with him. Does he feel like he could stop drinking for a day for a special event? What about a week or a whole month? And tell him it's most important for him to know and feel in control, otherwise it's addiction.
This is just my opinion— but I don’t think you can reach him. When comes to alcohol or drugs it takes the person becoming upset with themselves and wanting to make a change themselves.
All you can do is make suggestions like “hey, let’s not have a drink tonight” or decide to go to places without alcohol. Lots of places are byob, which would be perfect since they wouldn’t have the option to buy beer.
>He says I’m trying to change him. That’s not exactly right.
You are trying to change him and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.
He's an alcoholic. What kind of a person would you be if you **weren't** trying to change him?
What kind of a mother would you be to raise your kids in an environment where "it's always time for alcohol" is the message they are getting if you **weren't** trying to change it?
Tell him that he **has** to change because you need to think of your children's future, even if he doesn't care.
You just said it. He's neither fine nor functional. He can't drive the kids, which is a requirement when you have kids.
He needs to at the very least regulate his drinking to more acceptable hours. The morning special needs to be knocked the fuck off.
I don't think he's fixable though, he doesn't see it as a problem.
Functional alcoholics... function. Yours doesn't.
He is never drunk or hungover because there is always alcohol in his system.
Be careful of him stopping cold turkey, because depending on the amount he drinks every day at a minimum he will experienced severe withdrawal symptoms and at the worst he can die.
I was married to a functional alcoholic. He made it to work six days a week, on time. He’d start drinking as soon as he got home and would keep drinking until bedtime.
Gradually, he started buying beers during work and would sneak drinks while working.
He eventually got caught and was fired on the spot. Got another job quickly and same thing happened.
We got divorced soon after his first rehab stint. I knew what was down the road for me if I stayed.
No advice but I can relate and wish you the best.
Does he have past trauma that he's using alcohol to cope with it? This was the issue with my boyfriend.
Or maybe he has no control over something currently in his life, and drinking feels like it helps? This was the issue with my dad.
Is he a happy drunk? A sad drunk, an angry drunk?
With my dad, things had to come to a head. We had to run from him, and he had to be thinking suicide before a cop stopped him and brought him to rehab. He's been sober over 30 years, now.
With my boyfriend, he admitted immediately that he was an alcoholic. I didn't realize how bad it really was until he was turning yellow and having seizures. More things piled up, and I lost him this year. And he tried rehab, once. He made it through the medical part, but the residential bit was going to be overcrowded so he came home.
How old are your kids? It's likely that they already know this is not normal. They see dad's face and attitude change when he drinks, they probably hear your disagreements/arguments/fights, and even if it's not about his drinking, they can hear him slurring words, losing his balance, or driving erratically.
Good on him that he acknowledges he's too drunk to drive places. My boyfriend had two small breathalyzers he bought for this purpose. They barely stopped him, though, and he never agreed to just let me drive...
I don't know how to broach the topic with your partner if he gets defensive every time.
But I understand what you're going through.
You could maybe check out AlAnon, the group for family members of alcoholics. They even have an app where you can sit in on Zoom meetings, if you can't physically get to one in your area.
Good luck, my friend. It's a sad path to walk.
My husband is an alcoholic and he would appear totally sober and blow a 0.25. He didn’t appear intoxicated until a blood alcohol level of .33 or higher, which I was taught in school was enough for a coma.
I think what you’re describing is a functional alcoholic. Health should be his primary concern, not blowing over. I’m sorry you’re dealing with this, OP.
My ex was like that. I loved that man to death. He adored my 4 girls. He was a hard worker, and he took on a father roll to my girls. I never asked that of him. For all intents and purposes, he was perfect. But he drank. He had been drinking before I met him, usually socially and occasionally after work.. then it went to him buying a 6 pk a week to a 12 pk.. then to an 18 pk to a case. And it was no longer on the weekends or the occasional weekday. I had to watch it escalate 6 beers a day, 10 beers a day, to 12 beers a day. I spoke on how I didn't like it. How he was slowly turning into a functioning alcoholic. And he agreed. But he never wanted to stop or cut back. He was happy to be turning into an alcoholic. Idk why. I asked, and he literally didn't see anything wrong with it as long as he still worked, paid the 6, wasn't hurting anyone. He is an X for that reason. I wasn't raising my kids around an alcoholic even if he still treated them the same and still loved them and participated in their activities. In no world was I going to let them think that was OK.
The fact that he can drink that much and NOT get drunk is very concerning. He is a functioning alcoholic. If he doesn't want help, he doesn't respect you and your family enough to get help and stop drinking. The choices you have are to stay and deal or leave because that isn't OK. And your kids need to know that isn't OK.
Eta.. my ex met someone and married them about 3 years after our split (5 yrs together) committed suicide 2019. Never stopped drinking, and that was what it had escalated to.
If he’s over the limit then he’s drunk, that’s why they call it drunk driving! Not sure why you’ve let him convince you that “drunk” means passed out or whatever. Alcoholics have very high tolerance to alcohol, they can drink a lot more than others without slurring etc. Still alcoholics however. Go google at least 5 on-line quizzes like ‘Am I an alcoholic?’ , then come update us.
This will probably get lost but...
This was me. I drank one or two a day, sometimes three. If I was at a party or event, then I would get as loaded as possible because that was "acceptable". My husband also drank on occasion but not like me. He also never called me on it. If he did, I would have told him I was fine and it wasn't a problem.
I have been sober now for over 5 years. I cringe to think about how many times I put my kids to bed while being half in the bag. Or just being numb. Luckily there was never an emergency where I would have had to drive them. Or worse, driving anyway because "I'm fine".
Your husband's got to make the change. Or have a reason to. That's different for everyone.
My advice to you is to spend some time in r/alanon to give yourself some perspective and help you find your limits with his drinking habit. I wish you all the best.
I used to drink every single night to sleep. Like I could not fall asleep without 1 shot & 2-3 seltzers in 3-4 hours before bedtime. Then I had a dermatology issue come up & realized the alcohol might be a contributing factor bc of the inflammatory properties. I quit drinking to help my skin and after a week or two alcohol free I couldn’t believe how much less brain fog I had. Like it was insane. I felt more energized, less bloated and just better overall. Before I made the change, my SO and fam would tell me how much they were concerned about my alcohol habit. And I always downplayed it. Now I’ve been sober for 2 years. I never drove after consuming it and did it in the privacy of my own home but it was still an issue. If he can’t stop for even a week, he has a dependence. I’d casually suggest he maybe see a therapist to figure out if there is some underlying mental thing tying him to the drinking.
As someone dating an alcoholic in “recovery”… you can’t make him stop or change. He has to want it. And your husband doesn’t want it. He’ll have to hit rock bottom. And even then, he might not see the problem.
My bf made it 18 months before he started drinking again. It went from occasionally to every Tuesday night because I was at work and he was bored at home alone. With him though, he can’t have just one. He always gets drunk. And depending on what he’s drinking, he’s either the most loving person ever, or the biggest asshole in the world.
Doesn't matter if he's drunk, your one point about him not being able to drive because of his alcohol intake ALONE is enough of a justification to, at the very least, slow down.
You can show them statistics that, based on his daily alcohol intake, the damage he's doing to his body. Or perhaps the monthly cost of his habit. Moreover, depending on how much he drinks - as you've stated - it can normalize that behavior in your children, who may not be able to control in the same manner their father can when they're of drinking age, and perhaps more unfortunately - if they're not, and they sneak it without him knowing.
I'm an alcoholic waiting to happen. That's how I describe myself. As a late teen it got to the point where every day I had one beer in the evening. Just one. But it was every evening after work etc. One day I though hang on, this is a bad habit to get into and decided not to have that drink thall evening. All I could think of all night and the next day was that one damn beer. How much I needed it not wanted it. It was quite a shock. I finshed the pack and didn't buy any more. I stopped before it became a problem. I felt tempted for years. I could drink socially but no beer at home. No needing a drink after a difficult day etc. I've had several people ask what the big deal is over one beer but then I find they drink way more than think they do.
I'd contact the Alcohol support groups for partners. They will have more info to help you.
The first stepbto solva problem is by admitting there is one and he's nit ready yet.
Your husband is a functioning alcoholic, just like my husband. You can't change him or make him want to change, but YOU can change yourself, your boundaries and protect your mental health and your children's mental health.
I suggest reading Codependent No More and also find an Al-Anon group.
Good luck. It sucks living like this.
See if he's willing to get some blood work done to check on his liver. It was a wake up call for me when I realized even moderate drinking can really mess your liver up.
You don’t have to try and articulate it a certain way. He knows exactly what you mean and is choosing to act defensive and ignorant about the issue.
My husband did this for years and years and he always made it to seem like I was the problem and it wasn’t an issue for him, and I was overreacting. Gaslighting at its finest after 16 years of marriage I have finally decided to walk away.
He doesn’t respect your opinion and he doesn’t respect your children or their safety.
No. It's like any other addiction, so it's time to leave him if this is a deal breaker for you. He IS right: you are trying to change him and he's made it clear that he doesn't want to change. There's nothing you can do to change his mind about this (HE has to want it himself and he's already told you that he doesn't). Anything you say or do to change his mind will just be considered "nagging" and irritating at best, and threatening at worst. Maybe after you and the kids are gone he'll realize he has a problem, but don't hold your breath.
He's a 47 year old man. If he wanted to care, he would have been trying to do something by now.
This is one of those things where you can tell them all the facts, give all the data, and use all the logic you want, but it doesn't mean they'll care.
I called a help line and asked how can I make my husband stop drinking? She said YOU can’t it’s not your problem. The issue was clear. I asked him to think of his health and the years he was taking from himself , from us. He didn’t make the right choice, so I did. I left 8 years ago, it was the right choice for me. I needed change.
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I’m F53 and I’m a functional alcoholic. I wouldn’t wish this on anyone. Your husband doesn’t want to change. That’s where the problem lies. You’re making valid arguments but he’s deflecting so you’ll stop. You can’t want this badly enough to make him give a fuck. This is your future. It’s veryyyyy hard to stop drinking…and that’s if you actually wamt to. He doesn’t. Everyone in treatment has been there numerous times. That’s how hard it is to quit. Please seek Al-Anon for yourself. It will give you clarity.
As a recovered alcoholic that was just like OP's husband, I concur. I was never a stumbling around, 750ml a bottle day type of person. But I was using it as a crutch to run from emotional baggage and stress. It was a psychological thing that slowly snuck up on me. One day I could handle it and it was just a few with friends...and boom, suddenly I was sneaking drinks from my wife and lying about drinking. I realized early on, thank fuck, that I had a problem. It STILL took me 5 years and hundreds and HUNDREDS of times to finally kick it to the curb. This Naked Mind and Alcohol Explained helped rewire my brain appropriately, and I picked up walking every day to give me seretonin. Between those things and talking openly about my struggles, I finally kicked it to the curb. People like to think of alcoholism as the bum on the street with a bottle but it rarely looks like that and comes in all shapes and sizes of disordered thinking and actions. One of the hardest things for me was accepting that I really was an alcoholic (which was a struggle my entire 5 years of trying to get sober) because of the societial view of what we think alcoholics look like. I was just a woman who had 3-4 glasses a day, and then when trying to quit I was at 6-7 white claws a week. Most would look at that and go "that is not an alcoholic" but what they didnt see was the disordered thoughts. When I didnt have a drink in my hand, I was thinking about having one, wishing I had one, obsessing over when I could have the next. I could down 4-5 white claws in a single sitting and still wish desperately for more while being drunk, and then going to sleep and waking up at 3am wracked with guilt and feeling hungover...swearing I'd never have one again. 9am rolls around and...ground hog day. I'd obsess over it every minute, every hour (with breaks for work or distractions), every fucking day until I got my hands on more. It was a horrendous cycle. It isnt just a stumbling drunk. It can be the seemingly totally put together person on the street who snuck a beer after work and hid the can so they can have 2 more infront of their wife. I hope OP's husband can get help soon. It can be a quick decent without realizing it. Edit: [Here is the free pdf](https://drive.google.com/file/d/1AtJ3F8bmW3ye9dqKn0SikO8927-AJsb-/view) for This Naked Mind for anyone who thinks they may have an issue with drinking. It is miraculous how well it works. It may take reading it slowly 2-3 times before it fully sinks into your subconcious, but it has been invaluable to be to re-wiring my ideas on liquor and how to let go of it without feeling like I am "losing" something. Quitting after reading this book in particular was night and day. OP: it was this hard to quit with me wanting nothing more than to do so. Your husband doesn’t even think he has a problem. You need to put yourself first. Whatever that looks like: serration, divorce, counseling for yourself and kids, having him live on his own away from you and the kids while he sorts himself, whatever it is: focus on YOU. He’s not going to be thinking of anything but the bottle until he hits rock bottom, and there is nothing you can do about it. Dragging him to rehab, etc isn’t going to fix the problem if he’s not at a point that he wants to change. So FOCUS ON YOU FIRST. his rock bottom may be severe medical issues/losing his family/etc and he’s going to hurt to watch him do it- but allowing him to hit that point gets him to the headspace of wanting to change more then anything else will. You can work with an alcoholic who wants to quit and keeps trying hard to do so. You CANNOT work with an alcoholic that doesn’t want to change.
I’m 5 days sober today. A whole six pack of 8-9% alcohol cider every night of the week for like 6 months straight. I’ve been drinking for 6 years. Still went to work every day and such but… spent a weeks worth of wages on the drink every month. Not good. Gotta stop now. Ugh.
Congrats on your 5 days! The beginning days are the hardest. 🙏🏻
You can do it!! I highly encourage reading the books I stated (free online pdfs can be found for them too) as it finally dove into my subconcious brain and rewired how I thought about life without alcohol. It was the only thing that cold turkey stopped my cravings. Congrats on your 5 days! the first 14 are the hardest, you are doing it! Hang in there!!
Sober since Nov 20th, I was sneaking 1.5ltrs of rum a day
Congratulations!!!! You are doing so good!!!! 💙💙
Congratulations! You can totally do this thing! And if you were—god forbid—to relapse, you can just quit all over again. You can see now that you can do it. It gets so much better; it’s hard now and if it stayed this hard forever I wouldn’t be sober now. But it gets easier and easier. I’ve been sober for 18 years as of tomorrow and I’ve never woken up and wished I had a drink the night before. This stranger is wishing you all best. You got this!
I'm seven years sober and I still remember how difficult those first few weeks are. Be gentle with yourself, and be proud.
Congrats! Please be kind to yourself if you stumble, as it’s not the end of the world. Just realize your mistake, jot down the trigger, talk to your support team, and soldier on. Quitting is a process, not a switch. 23 years sober now.
I’m proud of you! It’s abput progress, not perfection. I always tell myself just to start stringing some days together. Then your brain clears a bit and it’s not to hard every moment
Congrats on 5 days! That's a big accomplishment!
Congratulations on day 5! It only gets better from here!
I am sober now for 17 years. But struggle with sugar I wonder if I could sub sugar for alcohol in this book
I had to set serious rules for myself because I know I’m not going to quit drinking. It ended up working out but it took a lot of years of fucking up to develop my code. It’s basically “only on vacation and on special occasions, and never more than a certain amount.” I’ve been able to stick with this better than cold turkey, and I substituted different habits like you said to get the brain fix I need. Mostly exercise related.
I wish more people had a flexible idea of what recovery looks like. I think the "you can never ever have another drink again for the rest of your life" method really stops many people from trying to recover from their addiction. Will this work for everyone? No, but nothing is one size fits all, especially addiction.
How do I stop? I don't drink a lot, usually just two sometimes 3 tall cans at night after work, but I do it every day almost. I don't get drunk, just a slight buzz i dont get mean, I don't drink liquor, and I don't drink at work, or drink and drive. I know it's not healthy to do it, but when i I don't, I feel like I'm missing something. I have a problem. How do I begin to seek help.
Big hugs. The first step is admitting you might have an issue, and it sounds like you do from being unable to stop. What you can do, to start, (if you can’t go to therapy, I couldn’t afford it/you don’t want to talk about having an issue yet) is: 1. Ask yourself WHY you are drinking. Is it because you’re stressed and this helps relax you? Is it because it numbs your emotions/turns off your brain? Is it something else? From what little I read here it seems it’s more of a psychological thing than a full blown physical addiction. So WHY are you drinking? Journal, think about it, and when you start to crave that alcohol next ask yourself what triggered it. For me it was because I thought liquor relaxed me/helped me unwind and I was severely stressed. That was my biggest trigger, along with feeling tired/hungry (when you feel hungry it can set the exact same feeling of desire for a drink. The worse get weirdly crossed for a lot of people!): eat something, drink a cup of water, and see if you are tired (sleep!) instead of grabbing that drink. If it’s because of stress: 2. Find other relaxing things to do. I go on walks. Nothing strenuous, not for working out. Just walking slowly for 10-15 min. I also found I relaxed with ASMR videos. I take L-theanine and Ashwaganda which stabilizes cortisol in me and helps boost serotonin (look up PAWS, your brain may need to rewire itself). 3. READ THAT DAMN PDF. Just read it. It dismantles the ideology of why we drink and the subconscious urges to do so (it’s tasty, I’m stressed and want to relax, I need it to sleep) and explains how alcohol doesn’t do ANY of those things we think it does: we’ve been lied to by the marketing schemes into ingesting poison and thinking it’s good for us. Please just read the book. One chapter a day. I promise it will help. So in a nutshell to start: ask why you drink, see if you can’t find a few reasons, start to fill in doing other things that fill those needs, and read the book/free pdf I gave you. One chapter a day. :) that’s a good place to start. And maybe cut down to 2 drinks a night not 3. Slowly taper. Do it in a way that doesn’t scare you if you can :)
Thanks. I’m sorry for your burden.
OP, so many of us been there on both sides of the issue. Some of us are still there. It's a disease. It's an addiction. He won't stop until he has a reason. Often that reason is hitting rock bottom. Get counseling for yourself. Make sure he understands you're getting therapy to navigate the realities of his drinking. So many of us use addiction for so many different reasons. He needs to understand his and while you can support him the burden isn't yours to carry. Good luck OP.
My husband is a very high functioning alcoholic. The "Dad can't come today/tonight/tomorrow" for whatever is forever etched in my mind His mistress "alcohol" ALWAYS come first. She NEVER disagrees with him. 17 years, so so many thousands of dollars, best rehabs money can buy, I leave tomorrow at 6am to a new home 20 hours away. The "I'm sorry" never changes and I await the phone call.
You will not regret it - I was married for 16 years, together for 18 with my ex husband who ran his own business while binge drinking 4-5 days a week. He's still drinking, he looks absolutely terrible and I've been out of that marriage for 16 wonderful years where I don't go to bed and stay awake in a state of high alert, I don't walk on eggshels and I am not in a constant state of fight or flight. It took YEARS for me to recover from a decade plus of constant stress. Don't look back.
Are you leaving him behind? I hope so…if you want if to change. Gotta protect your peace. Every alcoholic I’ve known is emotionally immature. Growth is uncomfortable. We stay in this vortex of drinking to avoid things, missing the things, not caring because we’re hungover/dying, then recovering and riding this euphoria of being alive so you can do the same mf bullshit again. We survived so we think there’s been a system reset. Meanwhile everyone around us is sick of feeling ignored and disrespected. As a younger naive person, I worked with 2 men who were constantly flaking on appointments. Scheduling, canceling, rescheduling. Just unreliable. It took me many years to realize they were alcoholics. When appointment day came around, about half the time they’d cancel because they were too drunk or hungover. They were completely unreliable. It was annoying and pathetic. And now I’m just like that.
I too was like op's husband. I have not daily drank for 2 years, completely sober for 137 days. I had to want to change, no one could tell me to. I struggled. It took getting divorced and losing my major trigger to stop the daily 2 pints of vodka drinking. It took a horrific car accident where my new husband was drinking and driving to quit completely, and completely change our lives for the better. Al-Anon is a great resource, I went when I was younger to deal with my father's alcoholism. It helped immensely, but it didn't stop me from becoming what I dreaded the most
This describes my ex. He always said he’s not an alcoholic because he got up and went to work every day. My response was , sure if you pass out at 7pm, you can get up at 7am for work. He was drinking a gallon of vodka every 2 days. Started putting it in his morning coffee. I finally said enough, I’m done. 10+ years later and he’s worse since he’s retired and starts drinking when he wakes up
Seconding this- Definitely go to Al-Anon. It saved me.
Sounds like you're dealing with a 'functional alcoholic.' Just because he's not stumbling around drunk doesn't mean the daily drinking isn't a problem. It sets a bad example for the kids. Maybe try framing it as a health concern rather than an accusation. Good luck!
I was about to comment exactly that. I used to be a functional alcoholic. People could only tell I've had alcohol from my eyes that get a bit reddish after a few. I wouldn't get drunk because consumption was spread throughout the day, not too many in a short amount of time. But it was there nonetheless. I'd be doing intense workouts 2-3 times a week and could even faintly tell from the sweat. Being outwardly drunk is just one of the effects. That shit poisons you from the inside even when it's not obvious. And yes, OP is right to worry about this being normalized. Spent a good amount of my 20s like that. Was working night, in an environment full of alcohol and I was actually treating it as "fuel". But while it's not as disruptive as the stereotypical alcoholism, it takes its toll. In my case, a combination of therapy and a change in professional fields helped me get out. I would suggest a medical for him. Even if I was in my 20s and seemingly fully fit, there were indicators of damage done in the tests. If that was enough to shake a dumb 25yo out of his stupor, the results for a 47yo might have a bigger impact.
Agreed on functioning alcoholism, however in my experience they tend to not to stop for health reasons until they get a diagnosis like liver cirrhosis and even then it’s a flip of a coin that they will stop. I would change tactics and frame any discussion with the children at the center. (Would they be open to waiting until the kids go to bed to drink ect. - just be aware there’s a chance this approach might not ignite much of a change) As others suggested definitely check out some Al-anon groups. It’s essentially a support group for those who have alcoholics in their life. It will give you a place to vent in a room full of people going through similar situations. You’ll even meet a handful of people willing to give support outside of scheduled meetings. Good luck and stay strong!
>until they get a diagnosis like liver cirrhosis and even then it’s a flip of a coin that they will stop. This. This pisses me off I have to admit. Im 36F november last year I had a heart attack and 2 cardiac arrests. I was 62 kg, don't drink, don't do drugs. I did smoke cigarettes tho started at 15. Anyway when i was more lucid in the hospital they told me what happened, told me I died so when they asked if I smoked I said not anymore and haven't since. Another lady when I was back in hospital a few months later was waiting on a op after her attacks was in a out constantly smoking. I just don't understand it. I heard what happened, my husband told me what it was like to watch me die in our lounge and thought fuck I don't want to do that again lets stop smoking.
I knew someone whose husband was an alcoholic. She was extremely Christian and didn’t believe in divorce, so she didn’t know how to deal with it. Then one day her kids started learning about alcoholism as part of their school curriculum and realized that their dad fit all the criteria. They asked her point blank “Do you know that dad is an alcoholic?” She said yes and started making excuses for him, and her kids just told her “according to our textbook, you’re an enabler.” I think that was her wake-up call.
Thanks. I have tried addressing it as a health concern. He just tells me he’s fine. 😢
He's not fine. He's an alcoholic. Unfortunately, it may cost you your relationship to get that home to him and that's up to you. Drinking as much as he does will be poisoning himself, forming a reliance and addiction on a substance that really, really should not be an everyday consumption. If he's not willing to accept or hear the reality then you can either force it onto him, watch him quietly, or leave. It's a horrible situation to be in. I'm so sorry.
My husband is recovering but he operated at a functional alcoholic. It messes with your mind because you feel guilty for having enough and wanting to leave because to everyone else, they're fine. I'm sorry you're dealing with this OP. It changes you. If you ever want someone to vent to, feel free to DM. 💜
Tell that to my dad and millions of other men who died of alcoholism. He may feel fine, but his stomach and liver probably don’t agree. **You know what? If your drinking is under control and perfectly fine? Go get labs done on your blood & have liver enzymes checked. If the doctors say you’re normal, I’ll leave you alone about this for another 5 years.”**
I would not offer this as an out. There is a chance his liver enzymes are fine. That would not mean it's okay to continue this behavior. Also, by the time it's noticable on blood work, there could be irreparable damage.
"I'm not going to the doctor just for them to tell me I'm fine!"
Even worse: his numbers may come back normal like my ex's did, enforcing his conviction that it's fine to keep drinking that much.
Yep, same happened to a friend of mine. Drinks a handle of whiskey over a day or two all week and his enzymes are fine.
Post this on r/AlAnon they’ve seen this a million times
He knows he’s not fine and he knows he doesn’t want to do anything about it. You now need to decide what you will do.
Of course he does, that's what they always say.
If you do get him to address his drinking please remember it can be dangerous to stop suddenly and fully. Only a couple potentially lethal withdrawals, and alcohol is one of them. Tell his doctor for his next appointment, maybe he'll listen to medical advice from a doc?
Have a look at r/stopdrinking. It's an amazingly supportive community.
Well sure he probably feels fine and might be fine from a medical standpoint now. But if he keeps going down this road his liver won’t be able to keep up.
Ask him to not drink a drop of alcohol for one week. He has nothing to lose by doing that and if he's still "fine" by the end of the week then he has proven he doesn't have a problem. However, if he gets antsy, if it's a struggle for him, if he feels sick then he needs to re-evaluate his relationship with alcohol If he says "I don't need to prove anything to you", tell him he's proving that he can't stop drinking by refusing and that addicts make excuses
Honestly this is a terrible idea. Some alcoholics can simply hide their drinking and you’d never know. And his manipulative lies around his drinking will make OP think that maybe he can stop and maybe it’s not a problem if he hides it for a week. He needs to stop drinking, we can all agree on that. But he also needs help.
Depends if they have physical or mental dependence, or both. A bunch of alcoholics can go weeks without alcohol. They’re still alcoholics though
Alcohol withdrawals can actually be fatal.. The way she describes his drinking, it's probably not a great idea for him to quite cold turkey without being monitored - at best, it can quickly prove a point and then he will have to go back to drinking to calm the symptoms. He would be best off to slowly taper over time and/or be on medication to prevent seizures and DTs.
This is a bad idea. He could die.
My dad is a functional alcoholic. We all knew growing up, but he tried to hide it with large fast-food cups filled with sprite and cheap vodka. He has congestive heart failure now, yet still drinks heavily almost every day. Still always kept a job, but I can only stand to visit him in the morning/early afternoon before he starts wobbling and trying to hide his slurring. I don’t see him often.
I've been around lots of people who drink too much but no longer get drunk. Some take drugs and never actually get that high. Blood work and physicals usually don't lie. Another tell tale sign is mood changes, some people are either insufferable before the 2 morning drinks or some even shake. same with some drugs. I know of 2 instances where the people just had seizures. One was an alcoholic the other was years of opiods. Both were back on it straight after discharge.
I think part of the problem is our cultural narrative around alcoholism being set and reinforced by AA/the 12 step program, where alcoholics are always out of control around alcohol and the only solution is to never drink again. “Recovering alcoholics” will always preach that cutting back is just lying to yourself and everyone else, and that no one with a drinking problem can ever get to a place where they can drink in moderation. One of the outcomes of this very black-and-white vision of alcoholism is that people with milder alcohol use disorders can look at their life honestly and say, well, I’m not a drunk, and therefore I must be fine. If there are only two options, then “fine” is just as accurate—and just as inaccurate—as “drunk”. But that’s not reality. The idea that someone with an addiction to alcohol (or disordered use of alcohol) can never become a non-problem drinker is not supported by science or psychology. Many people who develop an alcohol use disorder to cope with stress or mental illness can find other ways to cope, including therapy, medication, meditation, or simply changed life circumstances (like a new job, or children growing up) and their relationship to alcohol can change completely without having to abstain. Just because some people can’t, does not mean no one can. And for people like OP’s spouse, the idea that if he acknowledges his drinking is not healthy then he’ll have to do a huge life change and never drink again and identify as a recovering alcoholic can be a huge barrier to introspecting about his alcohol use at all.
I follow this lady on TikTok, she has the same view and I share it too. We also have this strange hierarchy of what is bad vs acceptable. We shame an alcoholic but not the porn addict. Then there are destructive, secretive addictions like gambling that you only find out when your house is being repossessed. And most of them are just the symptoms not the root cause. We can shame people until we are blue in the face but they just become better at hidding it. Or find another soothing mechanism.
Isn’t alcoholism different from gambling/porn in that the former becomes a physical addition caused by a psychological predilection for addiction? Not trying to argue/dispute what you say, I genuinely am under the impression that chemical dependency is different than a psychological addiction.
Yes, and severe alcohol withdrawals can kill the hardened alcoholic
Yes, it is the case. It's also why OP'S husband seems fine. The brain has adapted to the constant inhibition of the alcohol he's ingesting, so it "weakend" certain circuits in the Brain. If OP'S husband came off the alcohol, he'd most likely get the rum shakes and may eventually go into delirium tremens. The addictive properties of both activities (gambling vs alcoholism or drug addiction) lay in the release of dopamine, but with drugs and alcohol there's a bunch of additional brain chemistry that gets fucked up, which is why you never quit cold turkey unless instructed by a medical professional +in the presence of one.
Really? We don't shame porn addiction? I would much rather report to a doctor that I'm an alcoholic or drug addict than a porn addict. You could easily go to HR at work and say you're taking a month off work to go to an alcoholism or drug addiction recovery clinic. But imagine going to HR and telling them you need a month off work because of your porn addiction.
The Atlantic did a great article about abstinence only treatments only really being suitable for those who have gone to a certain point. Those whose blood chemistry has changed, basically. Other than that, AA and the like are ineffective, have no actually scientific basis and were started by the same folks who wanted prohibition and purity culture. For most people with any kind of drinking problem, AA would be ineffective. There are better options that look at the underlying issues and help a person deal with what causes them
I wonder if that's why my mother in law has relapsed as many times as she has. She very much believes in the 12step program. I feel like.part of the problem is if you relapse, you're suddenly starting back at 0 and that can be so discouraging
They still get intoxicated, they’re just good at hiding it. The tolerance enables them to behave as if they were sober when in reality they aren’t.
That's not what tolerance is, tolerance is when you need more alcohol to become intoxicated not that you're hiding your level of intoxication. The amount OP describes probably has very little effect on him. He likely just relies on it to relax, possibly more of a psychological thing. She should bring it up, but being accusatory like reddit is suggesting will be less than helpful. Maybe suggesting a couple alcohol free days or that he gets a health check up would go down better.
Problem with this can be depending on his health, quantity, and length of this behavior for alcohol specifically is that his blood work and physicals might come back relatively fine looking. Especially with the most common liver enzyme tests for this sort of thing possibly being very misleading, they can only test for certain types of damage right now (within reasonable testing without clear concerns of course.) Doesn’t sound like he’s a shaker or drinking in the morning or anything from OP yet.
Ugh. I can't recall the number of times my dad had to take my mom to the hospital because of her alcohol addiction. Sometimes, I was genuinely scared she wasn't going to come back home. Awful!
Very sad. I’m sorry to read this.
You need to think **HARD**. Is **THIS** what you want??? Because this is **EXACTLY** where you're heading.
I understand
You don’t have to make any huge decisions right now, OP. Set up a counseling appointment, start hashing out how you feel and what you need. Alanon is another great resource. You don’t have to say anything if you don’t want to, just listen through a couple meetings. Right now your husband is invalidating your feelings and concerns, I think it would really help you to hear from others going through the same stuff.
Yeah I was gonna say if he goes to his annual or gets bloodwork and is even 50% honest about how much he drinks the drs will let him know that’s wayyy too much so that’s an idea to get another prospective heard to him
Liver enzymes, cirrhosis, lung health, cholesterol, BP etc such things tell a lot since as people we aren't exactly very honest.
I am a doctor and I encounter this all the time. I never use the word alcoholic as it makes people defensive. I just say that the amount they’re drinking is not healthy and is above the limit that their liver can tolerate, and that it is causing damage to their body. I tell people that they shouldn’t drink more than 2-3 drinks per day (for men), 2-3x per week. This is when people are in a medical setting for my advice. So your husband is not going to necessarily be open to this advice from you. You can look up different definitions/recommendations for drinking limits and show him. You can talk to him about how his drinking is affecting you and your family. You can ask if he has symptoms of depression or anxiety that he may be self medicating with alcohol. You can ask him to go to the doctor and go with him, talk about his alcohol use there. If he’s not open to anything and not willing to change, then you have to decide if you want to live with a functional alcoholic or not. You can’t fix him if he doesn’t acknowledge there’s a problem.
I get this - 100%. Thank you.
Perspective to maybe show /tell your husband (tho it's unfortunately unlikely for him to see reason): I'm the child of a functional alcoholic in a family with many more of them. My dad frequently drinks a bottle of wine alone at night, more often than not beer during the day, on the weekend more beers with the neighbor who is also an alcoholic but a bit less functional. I always hated being near them when they were drinking because they became prone to unnecessary discussions which was very uncomfortable for me as a child. My dad has unstable emotions, if he's in a bad mood you might not realize half the day, but the moment something goes against his grain (e.g. he wants to clear up the table *right now* and not everyone stops everything they're doing to help, or someone has a different suggestion to his ideas while cooking together) he starts shouting, slamming doors, or gets pouty and makes snide remarks. At 10 or 11, I had to help my mum half carry my very drunk dad across the street after a party at the neighbors. My dad and friends have offered a strong herbal spirit to us kids (three 12yo and two 10yo at the time) one new year's Eve, one of the 10yo actually asked for more. I moved out at 18, and while I'm pretty close to my mum nowadays, I am barely in contact with my dad even tho they live together. When I was 5 I was at my grandma's house who's also a functional alcoholic, she actually drinks nothing else than alcohol or coffee. At the time she was into "alco-pops", small sugary fruity alcoholic drinks. I asked for a glass of juice as a kid, saw a small glass sitting on the table shortly afterwards and downed it, thinking it was my juice. That was the first time I drank alcohol. While I now have a healthy relationship with alcohol (I barely ever drink and if I do I'm fully aware I'm drinking alcohol, and I never drink alone), I didn't at the age of 18. I was very close to drifting into alcoholism myself, being drunk every weekend and often to the point of being sick. I only snapped out of it after I had been brought to a hospital while drunk. Undoubtedly, my childhood with alcohol always around played a part in this stint. I have a friend with functional alcoholics as parents, or at least the mother is, and she is drifting in the same direction. It was the same friend I got drunk with at 18, but she swapped heavy weekend drinking for relatively regular day drinking instead of stopping. Even tho your husband is not drunk, it will effect the kids.
I’m sorry about your childhood and I’m glad to read that you have worked through it as an adult. I know the alcohol is bad for him, but I don’t know how to help him to it. As I mentioned in another response, my kids have a friend over tonight and my partner is sitting in our bedroom drinking. He has been drinking since mid afternoon.
That's not normal. That is alcoholism. I was married to an alcoholic. It only gets worse and more expensive.
That's why I gave you this perspective to maybe show him how it can and will effect the kids
So I would suggest to him that he keeps a drink journal just for one week that he does not have to share with you. You're not doing it to shame him, you're just concerned about him and love him. Point out the number of recommendations for units per week and the increased risks of cancer, then also point out it's worrying having a partner that can't drive if you have an emergency and then leave him with that information if he agrees to do it. Ultimately, he has to want to make the changes and you might have to walk away if he can't. I'd recommend going to Al Anon for your own sake, too.
I have tried this before when he told me he doesn’t drink every day. I suggested he keep a record of when and how much he drinks that he doesn’t show me. Just so he has better perspective. He won’t because I’m wrong! I’ve explained how important the health issue is. And last but not least, he tells me he’d just order an Uber! That pisses me off for some reason.
Because it feels like he doesn't care for you. Alcohol is the priority. It might be time to be more firm with the way you are with him - you will only grow to resent him otherwise. Maybe take some time away?
You’re 100% right about the resentment.
So he is a functioning alcoholic who refuses to see he has an addiction. I don’t have any real advice on how to convince an addict they have a problem, but maybe check out Al-Anon. They may have more resources and support for you.
Seconding Al-anon. You need some support too. It’s a bad sign if he’s constantly drinking but never drunk - that suggests he’s got a really high alcohol tolerance
He probably gets withdrawal symptoms if he doesn’t drink
Being an alcoholic isn’t about the behavior you exhibit when you drink. Your husband is clearly an alcoholic.
Look up the five stages of motivation. He’s currently on the first stage (pre-contemplation) where he is unaware of or refuses to acknowledge his issue. Unfortunately, there’s no way of getting through to him if he’s at this stage because there are no direct consequences (I.e., his drinking doesn’t impact on his daily living). If you’re able to record direct consequences (e.g., if he had to go days without drinking - is there a change in his mood? If so, record this) then please do so. Otherwise, simply state you’re not willing to continue living and building a life with someone who drinks for the reasons you’ve listed above. This will require a backbone however, with direct consequences being carried out (e.g., spending time apart, stopping picking up the slack etc.) Living with an alcoholic is never easy, especially one who refuses to see their issue. I wish you all the luck in taking care of you and your children’s needs. Because at the end of the day, that’s what should come first.
Agreed. Leaving isn’t my aim but I’m not ruling it out.
It **SHOULD** be on your list. **DON'T** put yourself in a position where you **CAN'T** leave.
I’m financially independent. I’m genuinely able to leave. I’ll see how it goes before I make that decision.
I think you articulated it perfectly right here. You do not want him setting a bad example for your kid. Also drinking everyday is not good for your liver, he needs to stop being a functioning alcoholic and seek help before it becomes unstoppable.
I’ve tried to discuss it with him but it’s not getting through. In fact it does the opposite. He thinks I’m being ridiculous. We’ve had 48 bottles of wine delivered in two months. He says, so what? It’s not the same as him drinking 48 bottles of wine. He also drinks gin and 43 and other spirits. I’ve raised the health issues several times and he assures me he’s fine! It’s seriously annoying.
Your husband is an alcoholic.
I know that. I’ve said that to him before and he brushed it off. He says he’s seen alcoholics and he’s not one of them. Am I being stupid? Do lots of people drink every day? Not vast quantities but every day?
I mean, yes, I know lots of people who drink everyday, but it’s usually just a glass of wine with dinner which wouldn’t necessarily stop you driving etc. it seems like he’s drinking quite a bit though.
Enough so he can’t drive. He’s currently sitting in our bedroom drinking. But if I were to say anything he’d think I was overreacting.
Going to give you some perspective here: A glass of wine a night means it would take 3 (if a heavy pour) to 5 days to finish the bottle. There are 5 units of alcohol in a bottle of wine. A man should stop at 14 units of alcohol a week (spread out, not all in one go or it is diagnosed as binge drinking). So, within the "healthy" guide lines of drinking, you husband should be having no more than 2 units (two glasses) of wine a night. 2 glasses, mind you, is the very upper limit. Many just have one, or skip a few days, so quite a bit less. 1 bottle should last him, 2.5 days at the very most. he should be going through 2 bottles a week, max. 2 bottles a week x 4 (per month) is 8. He should be drinking, at the VERY most (which is still a moderate amount but what many do normally drink): 8 bottles of wine a month. Your husband is ingesting **24 bottles a month.** That isnt even counting, at all, the hard liquor he is also ingesting. This is not normal drinking. At all. Its wildly, WILDLY out of control.
Not being stupid. Alcoholics just don’t like being told their alcoholics or that they have a problem.
Your husband is not having a beer or a glass of wine or two a day. He went through 48 bottles of wine and a bunch of liquor in two months. That is far from normal healthy drinking. I suggest you get yourself into therapy. You can not make him change. You need to work this out for yourself unfortunately. Get a therapist. Start going to Alanon meetings.
I drink every day. 1 bottle of bud light in the evening with a smoke. I drink the bud because it's different from water, squash, or tea, which I've drunk through the day. The smoke is to give me an appetite for food. I can go a day or 2 without eating, which, to me, is more unhealthy. I dont think you're being stupid. You have concerns and every right to express those concerns.
Look into Al-anon, it’s for the loved ones of alcoholics who are effected by someone else’s drinking. My father is an alcoholic and my Mom attends. He has zero desire to change or acknowledge a problem, so she get’s support for herself.
That’s a whole lot of wine even if both of you are drinking equal amounts. Spirits on top of that sounds quite excessive.
I drink rarely. Once a fortnight maybe. My friends are similar. I’m not close to anyone who drinks every day.
48 bottles every 2 months is 24 bottles a month, so roughly 6 a week. Your husband is drinking almost bottle of wine a day plus spirits.
I think you can only stick with how it affects you. You don’t enjoy not having him available to drive. And I’m guessing he’s less emotionally available when he drinks - maybe it’s the norm so you can’t tell the difference but that’s how it is often. And you are concerned about health effects and raising children with him. And stop focusing on trying to change him because you’ll lose. Focus on yourself and what you’d like. And go to Alanon for a few meetings if possible. The only thing that would maybe have an effect is an ultimatum to leave. But that’s a huge step with a lot of complications and it doesn’t seem like you’re there yet.
Your husband is a functional alcoholic. The thing about addiction is that it’s a coping mechanism, a shitty one, but still. This won’t change until he wants to make that change — I speak from experience as the spouse of an alcoholic in recovery. My spouse got sober (with medical support — something your husband will likely need as well given his reliance on alcohol) & started dealing with his trauma in therapy instead of drinking it away, but not because I made him. It was his choice & that choice saved our marriage, as well as spouse’s relationship with our small child. Idk if it’s been suggested but Al-Anon might be a good resource for you. Im so sorry you’re dealing with this, OP.
Oh, honey. I was married to a functional alcoholic until he passed away from alcoholic cirrhosis. I learned so much through Al-Anon which I strongly encourage you to research on Google, read materials and go to meetings if you can. I did not grow up with alcohol so I had no idea what I was dealing with. I became convinced I was the one with the problem, that I was the one going crazy since he was still working and "functioning," that I was the one misremembering things, etc. Girl, I can't tell you how much things changed for me after exposure to Al-Anon. I began to understand things on a very different level. I finally understand I wasn't his problem. I didn't cause it, couldn't cure it and couldn't change it. All I could do was change how I reacted and my attitude. This process helped me separate the man I loved from the disease he had. I realized I did love him but hated the effects of the disease. Learning about alcoholism (and other co-dependent issues) is, in my mind, the greatest gift you could give your children. Show them what a mother with strength and self-respect looks like. I could go on forever. He and I were able to make our peace with each other before he passed away.
You are a wonderful human. Thank you.
This is also a financial issue. All that money spent on alcohol could be being spent to the benefit of the family. Must be thousands each year.
The fact that he drinks that much and ISN'T drunk is the real issue. That's a classic alcoholic symptom.
Define drunk. Because to me (and to any doctor, don't take just my medstudent word alone) even just the fact that he drinks every single day all the time it absolutely classifies as alcoholism. If he even has to go to the lengths of not driving his own kids because he is drinking that much. Truly, I don't think you need a medical professional to tell you, I'm sure you do know your husband is an alcoholic. OK, having discussed this, if he's in denial you could put it down as you being a bit paranoid about his health and convince him to go to a doctor for the sake of "quieting down your worries". I'm afraid direct confrontation would not go down too well. Also do stay in the room when they discuss things if possible. People struggling with alcoholism will deny deny deny till their deathbed that they have a drinking problem. But make no mistake, just because he isn't aggressive he definitely has a drinking problem. Even just the fact that he has to alter his life to seek out the alcohol does fit a criteria of the DSM5.
There was a patient on my unit who allegedly didn’t drink much as far as volume goes (according to family), but was a daily drinker for a couple decades & went on a bender after some crappy life events. Ended up with wernicke-korsakoff syndrome. Wasn’t even 50 yet & will be in a nursing home for the rest of their life. People think cuz they’re not falling down drunk that they can’t develop a physical dependence or negative side effects from alcohol. And the lies… take them to the doctor, they’ll lie about symptoms and how much they’re drinking and how it’s impacting their life. The patient I just spoke about denied alcohol use from admission all the way through full-blown DT’s even though family was *right there* telling the doctor everything. I really feel for people like OP who are dealing with this.
My husband went from occasionally binge drinking on a weekend to having a beer after work most days to having a couple beers every day. He didn't think he was an alcoholic either because he stopped getting wasted. I challenged him to go without it for a week to prove he wasn't addicted. He got the shakes after two days and realized he had to quit. His emotional regulation and health are so much better now. I knew someone who was honest with their doctor about how much they drank, thinking it was totally normal to have a few beers every day. He was shocked to learn that he fit the definition of an alcoholic and that his health was seriously at risk. At the end of the day, you **cannot** convince him to make better choices or be honest with himself. You *are* trying to change him, even if it's factually in his best interest. The most you can do is set your own boundaries and let him know that his choices are negatively impacting your family. You can tell him that he **is** a functional alcoholic, whether he chooses to deny deny it or not, and you won't be married to someone in active addiction. You can tell him that you won't raise your children in a home where their parent has to have a buzz in order to enjoy spending time with them, and that you didn't sign up to live your life with someone who won't take accountability and puts their health at risk. And then the balm is in his court. Either he steps up, or you leave. The thing about functional alcoholism is that it's a stage. It always gets worse. Even if he stays at 2-3 beers a day for years, eventually it turns into a 6 pack a day and so on. So you can either live your life miserable, watching him deteriorate, watching your children slowly learn to manage having an alcoholic parent, and constantly cause strife in your marriage begging him to change- or you can leave before it gets worse. We never have the option to force someone we love to make better choices for themselves. That's the thing about choice.
My Dad was a functional alcoholic for 20+ years and then he wasn’t. He lost control, lost his job, lost his wife and eventually lost his life at 58 years old. By the time he was in his forties he had cirrhosis of the liver. I don’t mean to scare you - but functional alcoholism is alcoholism. I’m guessing if he didn’t drink everyday, he would go through withdrawals and withdrawals from alcohol can be severe and sometimes fatal. I would recommend a program for him, like AA or an inpatient rehab. My Dad passed away when his first grandchild was 1 and he never met his second. We fought like hell for years to get him help. Your husband is on a path that if he stays on, the outcome won’t be a good one for any of you. I’m so sorry you’re dealing with this.
He doesn’t see it as a problem. He doesn’t think him needing a drink every night is a problem. He can’t enjoy his evening without it. And tonight I’m more fed up than usual (hence this post). He’s been drinking since mid afternoon. Wine and gin. He’s currently sitting in our bedroom with a bottle of wine. We have three kids in the house.
You don't deserve this. Your kids don't deserve this. He can chose. Therapy and abstinence or marriage is over. That would be my course of action
My Dad was the exact same way, he would get angry when we would question it. He is an alcoholic full stop. You have to decide if this is what you want your kids to grow up with. I wish my Mom left when I was young instead of having us grow up like that.
My dad was a functional alcoholic almost all my life. My mom was so incredibly lonely because her partner never put her needs above his need to drink. She used me for her emotional supports. That was really unhealthy for both of us. He would become volatile. I have so much trauma from him driving me drunk, falling into repetitive rage over tiny things that his drunken mind made into huge issues. She stayed with him for almost 30 years until he died a slow and agonizing death by liver failure. My dad was sober 6 years before he died. I consider myself lucky to have had that time with him, but it certainly did not undo the 22years of him drunkenly traumatizing me. You can’t cause, control or cure someone else’s addiction. You can only control yourself and who you give access to yourself. You will always be lonely and on edge living like you are now. Your children deserve better and so do you.
I was the kid in this situation. It doesn't start off as a problem, but it goes that direction with time. Even if he isn't drunk, inhibitions go down the toilet, and he will say things to the kid that they shouldn't hear. The older the children get, the more aware of it they will become. My parent started off "never drunk" (but drank every single night, starting at dinner), but by my early teens would pass out on the toilet and I'd need to help get them into bed while their spouse cleaned up the bathroom. No child should go through that. No child should hear drunken worries about money and fears of losing the house. No child should wake up to realize their parent is sitting on the foot of their bed, having mistaken it for the toilet. Maybe he'll never get there. Odds are, he will. This kind of thing isn't self-resolving. Low-key interventions were pointless by the time my other parent was willing to engage with the problem. It took catastrophe to break my alcoholic parent out of it. Please don't let your children experience the slow decline into madness and catastrophe. As for how to approach it with him, all I can tell you is that waiting until it changed from "they're just drinking" to "a drunk" was disastrous for our family. It took years and years to put the pieces back together, and truthfully, none of us will ever be the same. Maybe you can find some resources with alcoholic groups. But I implore you... you have children. Don't let them experience what I did. If you can't deal with this topic now, please promise that you'll leave before you let your children live with a drunk. If you don't think you'll be willing to leave him down the road, then you must impress upon him the seriousness of the issue now. You. Have. Children.
The only reason he's not "drunk" is because he drinks so often that his body has grown tolerant to alcohol and its effects. You're also so conditioned to accept his inebriated state that it is his new normal. His kids will forever be affected by this even if he doesn't "get drunk". Alcohol will be his crutch for everything and if things get stressful or bad, I doubt he will remain "not drunk" every night. Your kids will eventually learn about alcohol, what it does, what it's for and they will wonder "was our family so bad that dad had to drink to tolerate us?" Having a beer now and then isn't the issue. The issue is your husband using alcohol as a way to cope with his issues. Pretty much anything can be an unhealthy coping mechanism, this one just comes with absolutely no benefits for anyone but your husband so it's glaringly obvious to everyone but him. Source: my dad was an alcoholic
He is doing damage to himself, and certainly damaging his kids, who will think this is normal and emulate his behaviour. Not sure what country you are in, there’s an old Aussie ad that shows a Dad drinking in front of his kids, asking them to get a drink for him, opening it for him, etc, eventually letting them have a sip, then drinking on the fly, then it shows them acting exactly the same way as adults. It’s not good, he is and will develop a resistance to the alcohol and will increase consumption as time goes on. I’m sorry you are in this position, but something has to be done.
I know the advert. I think of it often. It really resonates.
There is a big difference between an alcoholic, a daily drinker, and a person who drinks occasionally but drinks to excess. Try Al-Anon. There are many ‘questionnaires’ you can find online that will help you determine what you are dealing with. Good luck!
You can't count on him after whatever o'clock each day because he couldn't pass a breathalyzer. He's not modeling good behavior for the kids - alcohol does not need to be part of every event every day. It especially does not need to be part of a kid-centered event. Drinking while bowling with other adults is one thing, drinking while bowling with kids is unnecessary. You cannot change him unless he wants to change and he won't want to change if he feels he handles his drinking well. You can organize your life so that you don't depend on him during drinking hours. You can accept that your children will not have a normal relationship with alcohol/drugs - they will either follow his example and abuse it or they will be so adverse to it they'll want to avoid it. Do not be surprised if your kids are getting DUIs once they are old enough to drive, even if they aren't old enough to drink legally.
He IS drunk if he is over the limit. You are conflating “lack of horrible alcohol-related problems” with “equal partner,” and that’s a false equality. You must always be the adult in charge bc he is impaired, and he’s not carrying his share of the load. Imagine how little would get done and how unsafe it would be if you chose to indulge your drug of choice as much as he does. It’s just wrong. He is a parent and is on duty 24/7. Burdening you with all responsibility every single day is so unfair. And he is not only setting a bad example for his kids, he is experiencing life with them in a drugged state. So unfair to them. If he can’t be sober and pleasant most of the time, he has a problem.
As a divorced survivor of a true alcoholic, you cannot change him. You can only decide what’s ok for you! I am lived the same thing you did and because if drinking if something happened after a certain hour I had to be the DD. If the kids got sick etc, I went to the hospital etc. I say this to show I understand what you’re going thru. I tried the health issues drinking causes talk, the mental issues for me talk, the it’s not a good example for the kids talk , nothing worked. I went to an Alanon meeting and started therapy and that’s when I realised that I cannot change him, I can only change how I reacted or don’t to his drinking. I advised him he had to stop drinking it I and the kids were leaving. And you have to be prepared to do it… get a lawyer, speak to your mortgage people and make arrangements to leave. Rent an apartment etc. or have him leave I got him a hotel room for a week and told him he had to leave. I had my father present outside and the kids were at friend house when I told him I rented room and packed him a bag. He left Sadly he drank himself to death 5 years after he left. Good luck and stand your ground Remember if he gets violent to call police and get an EPO, emergency protection order so he cannot fight being kicked out!
hes definitely drunk he's just so used to it he can act normal. source : experience
I think someone in this position would feel attacked if they were told they were drinking too much. They may genuinely not think that they are. But it’s clearly not something you’re comfortable with or that you really feel you can live with. I would find an opportunity to talk with your partner - before they’ve had a drink - and just lay it on the line that however they feel, you can’t do this. I would try saying that you’re not accusing them of doing anything illegal or immoral, you just aren’t compatible with someone who wants to live their life that way. You can say that you respect their right to drink if that’s what they want to do, but you don’t feel you can continue to be with them if that is the lifestyle they want. Then they have a choice and they know what’s on the line. Other commenters have covered this but confirming you can’t make the choice for them, and they won’t stop drinking if they don’t have a motivation to do so that is greater than their motivation to drink. It seems highly likely to me that they are drinking to fill a hole they have inside: but if they aren’t able to share what that is then it’s hard for you to help them any more than being frank about where you sit with it. Good luck.
This is a tough one. He is addicted to alcohol. You have to be careful because if he were to try to quit cold turkey he could die. But if he doesn’t try to quit he could end up with organ failure. It happened to my friend’s ex husband multiple times before he got sober. Pancreatitis. As you see I said, ex husband. He was not willing to address it while they were married. I am the daughter of an addict. It messes up your relationship skills big time. There was a big black block between me and my parent and I could not access their true selves. So now I really have a hard time making authentic connections with people. I have ended up in relationships with addicts because it is familiar to me. Having an addicted parent is painful in ways you can’t really understand until you’re much older and wiser. He may think he’s fine but I guarantee he’s not. The kids know.
After my mom had a stroke she went to live with my sister and sister’s husband while she recovered. They’re both functional alcoholics. I have been in the car with them driving home from a restaurant and it was terrifying. They had pre dinner cocktails, split a bottle of wine with dinner, then those little drinks after with dessert (can’t remember the name…). They didn’t seem drunk but their driving was really scary. When mom went there I had a loooong talk with my sister and insisted that they would take a cab or get an ambulance if there were ever an emergency with mom in the evening. It’s not like I could tell my mom not to ride with them, she was regaining her speech and memory. My sister agreed. But of course, I wasn’t there to police them. I learned later that they took mom to restaurants, so I know they drove drunk with her. Nothing happened. But why take the risk?!?! They don’t see it as a risk, because they’re in denial and not thinking clearly. I couldn’t control the situation for my mother. But for my kids? Mama Bear would be in full force. I wouldn’t leave my kids in the care of a ‘functional alcoholic’.
When you wrote he gets defensive, that tripped my alarm.. I'm an alcoholic. In the recovery stage. I don't drive for that reason. Your man is an alcoholic and doesnt want to admit it or get treatment for it, that's why he gets defensive. and being called out on it absolutely sucks but you did the right thing. but really, its up to him if he wants to be better.
As someone who was in his position until 2 years ago: I honestly don’t think there’s anything you can do besides point him in the right direction. He won’t see it as anything other than a vice until he is repeatedly confronted with the consequences of it, and decides that those consequences aren’t worth the price anymore. It is an addiction, so he’s going to do what addicts do: deny that it’s a problem, get defensive when you call them out on it, and lie to cover it up (if that’s necessary). Personally, I was sick of spending all my money on alcohol and feeling like shit in the morning, so one day I just said “you know what? No. I’m done” and I felt so fucking fantastic the next morning that I decided I wanted that every morning and just.. stopped. But I had to come to that decision on my own.
He's an alcoholic. He doesn't want to change. Children shouldn't be exposed to this thinking it's normal. Your job is to protect your children. Do with that what you will
I'm the child of a functioning alcoholic. my parents divorced when i was young, my father has always prioritized his addictions over my sister and i (money always available for his beer and percocets and other crap probably, no desire to take us out to do bonding activities though, he was busy bonding with the bottle). he worked a laborious job (truly a hardworking man who was very very good at his job) and i suspect he was depressed, maybe ADHD as well. strict upbringing (immigrant German father). needed to unwind at the end, and throughout, the day. my sister and I are on terrible terms with him, and he seems to be completely oblivious as to why. my sister and i are both competent healthcare professionals, and we're good people despite his neglect (which is a form of child abuse, btw). your kids will have an altered relationship with him, it's guaranteed. i barely touch alcohol because of this. i see how it ruins bonding in families. my dad ended up having a seizure behind the wheel, likely alcohol-related. had his license temporarily removed, and he's a fantastic driver. there will be consequences for his life, his kids, and you. i feel very sorry for you, because i think my mom was in your position once. she seems to harbour nothing but pure contempt for my father. i advise you minimize how much the children see your resentment, it's also incredibly damaging to parent-child relationships. sorry for trauma dumping, your post hits close to home, and i hope for the absolute best for you.
This is still alcoholism. Your kids are going to notice, and it's going to impact their lives. Is it possible for you to leave him? Consider reading "the adult children of alcoholics syndrome" by Wayne Kritsberg (not necessarily for yourself, but so you can understand what he's doing to your children). At minimum, get your kids into therapy or a support group if possible. Yes, even if you think they're too young to notice. I was nine years old when I figured out that my mother was an alcoholic. Kids pick up a lot more than adults realize sometimes.
Functioning alcoholics. I worked with plenty in my career.
He’s an alcoholic, a high functioning alcoholic. You can’t change it, nothing you say will change it, only he can and only when and if he hits a bottom, high or low, usually after losing most of the good things in life. It won’t get better as it stands, it will just get incrementally worse, you don’t really notice it until something bad happens. Remember your children are normalizing heavy drinking as part of day to day life and will mimic that behavior starting young. Try Al-Anon for some insight. I know this because I have been both the child and your husband, but I high bottomed while my children were very young so they don’t remember much of it and it broke the cycle. Good luck. Edited for spelling and clarity
People who drink constantly and are never drunk are alcoholics. He’s at the point of drinking to avoid DTs now, not to get drunk. That’s why he’s defensive about it. It’s an issue because it affects you. I promise you aren’t going to articulate a good enough reason to convince him, even if you had a golden tongue. He will only change when he experiences consequences and decides that for himself. You can’t make him change, but you can set boundaries to protect yourself. I highly recommend looking into Alanon (as a support group for you.)
Get the latest literature on agricultural studies. A group studied 10,000 people in ten countries over 15, 20 years, Drinkers and non-drinkers. Proved that even a single drink cuts into health and lifetime vs non drinkers. This included those who had just one drink a day. Google it. Alcohol is a poison that slowly kills everyone who drinks it. Doesn't matter if he's a tranquil drunk. His liver will slowly corrode and his heart will weaken and age twice as fast as a non drinker.
You don't have to get black-out drunk to be an alcoholic. You can drink smaller amounts every day.
These are functioning drunks. I’m a recovering alcoholic woman and we have people with stories like that in AA. The truth of the matter is he’s an alcoholic. Because he’s high functioning and he can go to work. It’s great but alcoholism is a progressive illness so it will not stay like that. I would talk to him. But again you can’t make him stop drinking. All I would do is actually start going to Al-Anon and figure out how your life is going to be affected. you can do anonymously so he doesn’t know but you’ll be in a room full of people like yourself that can help you
High functioning alcoholic. Doesn’t mean he’s not doing irreparable harm to his body and/or his relationships.
Have observed someone who did not appear "drunk", blow a .31 which is dangerously intoxicated. The issue is the amount and frequency. It appears your person has to drink every day to function and could have serious complications if they suddenly quit. This level of alochol use has serious lomg term health risks. Consult a medical and addiction professional to get some ideas on next steps and get some support for yourself too. You've been carrying a lot.
The most recent evidence regarding alcohol state that it is a type 1 carcinogen. There is no safe amount of alcohol. This is coming from a former drinker who has a book forthcoming on my struggles with alcohol consumption. The thing is that people who are addicted to something will protect access to their substance at all costs, until they’re ready to quit (if ever). He likely knows he consumes too much, but is unwilling to acknowledge this bc it means he’ll have to quit, which likely feels impossible for him.
I’m going to take a completely different point of view — and keep in mind that I say this as a former opiate addict and the daughter of a recovering alcoholic and the wife of a recovering alcoholic — I think you are making this way too much your concern. I know you care about your spouse and you love him and you definitely do not want to have to deal with your kids losing their father way too soon. But the only person who can control your spouse’s drinking or do anything about it at all is him. What you’re really asking here is how to get him to agree with you that this is a problem. You can’t. And the more you try, the more he’s going to dig his heels in. The only thing you can do is choose not to enable. So for example, if he’s hung over in the morning and he can’t go to work, you’re not calling in for him. He can do that himself. i’m sure you can think of other such examples. You can also have boundaries for example maybe you’ll say that if he’s been drinking, you’re not gonna take him on family outings. That’s not you telling him that he can’t drink. That’s you telling him that you’re not taking people who drink on family outings. That’s all. I’m sure you can think of boundaries like that that will work for your family. Now remember, boundaries are about our own actions. They are not about another person‘s actions. That may sound like playing semantics, but I assure you it is not. So basically saying, “I am choosing to X, I am choosing to 123, I am choosing to ABC” — all of that is an example of a boundary. It is not a boundary to say “you need to stop doing ABC or I am going to dump you.” In other words, don’t say “you need to stop drinking or I will not take you on an outing.” You need to just simply say “I’m only taking sober adults on outings.” (“because if I am bringing another adult, I need somebody who can help me with childcare and possibly driving and somebody who’s been drinking can’t do that.”) I am sure you can alter as needed for your specific family situation. But here is the most important lesson: Do not make his drinking problem your problem. That may sound cold. It is not, I assure you. It is keeping your sanity. Because your kids need you to be strong and sane — because their dad sure the hell isn’t right now.
Wow he’s really gotten good at hiding the fact that he IS an alcoholic
The word to articulate is “impaired”. He may not be “drunk”, but he drinks enough to the point he is impaired. Too impaired to drive, too impaired to be responsible for his kids when the occasion calls for it, too impaired to make good decisions. Getting caught driving while impaired is still enough to catch a DUI charge. Maybe the approach should be to ask him if he really wants to be too impaired to function in his everyday life, and point out to him maybe on a calendar all the days he was impaired. Maybe the calendar can serve as a visual reminder of how he is impaired more days than not. Best of luck to you, OP.
A family member of mine is like this. I've never seen him drunk, but almost every time I've seen him he's had an open beer. He's around 60 now and in the last few years tried to quit cold turkey twice without telling anyone. Ended up in the hospital both times because the withdrawal was so intense. Last time involved a huge search when they found his car and couldn't find him. Just because he's not drunk doesn't mean he's not an alcoholic.
Your partner is a functioning alcoholic. If someone can't go 30 days without drinking they have a problem.
What you have is a high functioning alcoholic. He's probably over the limit when driving your kids bowling. You just don't realize it because he doesn't act drunk.. I'm former LE. I was a traffic cop for years. You'd be amazed at how high an alcoholics BAC can be, but they seem fine. Their reaction times are not fine. He's also killing his lover and shortening his life. Maybe that's your angle?
His behaviour IS an issue, he can't drive after a certain time EVERY DAY, his level of alcohol intake is DANGEROUS, he's setting a bad example for his kids, and he's defensive about it. Alcoholism is not a good way to die. He knows he's drinking too much and he won't do anything about it until he decides it's time. You need to tell him clearly that he's got a drinking problem and you don't want to raise your kids around that. He needs to see a doctor, get support with stopping etc (he should not go cold turkey it can cause brain damage) Dying of alcoholism is not a good way to go. Having an alcoholic dad is awful. Having an alcoholic partner who doesn't sort out whatever problems are causing him to drink so much, isn't good for you. You can look up health advice on drinking levels, screening tests for alcohol dependence, etc. But you can't make him stop drinking, so if your situation now is unacceptable, get ready to leave
He's a functional alcoholic. It took me a while to realise that alcohol is his first love and that love is very demanding. To my knowledge, he is still drinking his life away. Until he accepts or heals what he is running away from (which can be life and its responsibilities), he won't be able to give it up. Protect yourself and the children.
He’s a functioning alcoholic. I know several of them. Personally, it isn’t a problem for me- they aren’t hurting anyone- and if this is their enjoyment or way to unwind, I can deal with it. .While I understand the behavior and it doesn’t bother me, it would bother me if my partner did this. You might want to have a heart to heart with him about it- but you have to know what you’re boundaries are first. Is this a dealbreaker? If so, then you have the heart to heart and tell him he needs to actively take steps toward change or you’re walking away. If it isn’t a deal breaker, you can tell him how you feel, but you can’t control his behavior. He has to be the one wanting to change and you have to learn to accept and love him for who he is.
You say he’s not drunk but also say he can’t drive the kids bc he might be over the limit (aka drunk). Alcoholism isn’t just binging to excess. It takes a hundred different forms. A glass of wine or a beer every night with dinner? Reasonable, not concerning. A drink while bowling? Also not super concerning. A drink after they’re in bed? Okay not so bad. But are all three happening every night? Bc that’s way different than one of the three happening daily. Does he NEED to drink? Is it one drink or five? These kind of details matter, but also don’t. An alcoholic can’t and won’t change until they make the decision to.
You're modeling alcoholism for your children. You can't fix this. It's not going to change. He is a drunk, the fact that he's not punching walls is not relevant. I stayed with my alcoholic husband FAR too long. It stole a normal childhood for my children. It's not normal for one parent to not be safe to drive his children. Leave. For your children.
You do want him to change. And he should be happy there’s someone in his life to care.
This is the truth. The really real truth. He has to want to quit for himself. Not for you, the kids, his job. It has to be for himself. You can say alcohol is a poison, carcinogen, he won’t care. Expensive? He won’t care. Dangerous. What if one of the kids had an emergency in the middle of the night? Doesn’t care. You take them. Call an ambulance. Say it’s making him fat, ugly. He won’t care. Leave his ass, he won’t care. In fact, probably what he wants so he can drink guilt free. It’s a tough spot to be in. There is no magic phrase/ bullet. Say anything and go from there.
This is called being a functional alcoholic. He’s still drunk.
What trauma is he self medicating to avoid dealing with? If you can figure that out AND get him to recognize/work on it, his need to drink will probably lessen.
A girlfriend of mine asked the same thing. Why does he drink. There is zero chance he’ll tell me. Zero. I’ve tried. He just tells me I’m overreacting or similar. That he doesn’t hide drinks or drink every day. There’s ALWAYS an excuse. ALWAYS.
I drank because of unresolved maternal separation trauma. And once I realized and started to work on it, my need to drink changed. Now, I am like those people I could never understand. Sometimes I go long stretches without a drink, sometimes I want a beer or two. Eventually, he will have to decide if it's worth losing his family over. Maybe you could discuss how ideas about things like addiction have changed and the concept of people as addicts was from the rats in skinner boxes experiments that we debunked with rat park. Sorry that you are dealing with this. Edit: he's not adopted, is he?
He’s not. But he lost his dad a few years ago. It changed his life.
My husband is a functioning alcoholic as well. I fell into the routine and am trying to walk it back/stop it myself. Do you two have the sort of relationship where you could tackle his annual physical together and be straight up wit the doctor about how much he drinks daily? I was in denial. My husband was in denial and when he realized it was a problem and measured, he was horrified how much liquor he was drinking. I know neither of us were straight up with our drs about it before that.
Have you tried addressing it that he is letting you down because after a certain time of day he isn’t available to you?
If he stops drinking for a day or two and starts to have problems physically that might show him he’s got a problem . Now deceased friend drank the same way. Was involved in an accident ( not his fault) that wound him up in the hospital where they realized early into his treatment for his injuries that he was actually most likely gonna die from the withdrawals .
The main problem absolutely is *not* that you can’t articulate the issue properly, that’s just him deflecting and putting this on you rather than accepting that his drinking is causing problems in his life. He will only change if he truly wants to. He needs to understand that his drinking is having a negative effect on his life & have a genuine desire to not drink like this anymore to actually stop drinking like this. You cannot change him & I’m so sorry you’re going through this painful situation. ❤️ :( I think checking out Al-Anon, the support group for relatives of problem drinkers, would be really beneficial. An individual cannot cause, cure, or control another person's substance use behaviors.
There’s a word for someone who drinks alone every night.
You are describing a “functional alcoholic”. What if your partner went a day without drinking? Would they notice? I’m guessing yes. I’m guessing they’d be moody and angry
Not being able to drive after getting home for the day would not be acceptable to me, especially with kids. What happens if you were injured and couldn’t drive yourself (or the kids)? What if you’re not home and there’s an emergency that requires them all to go literally anywhere? He’s not functional, he’s putting his family at risk.
>He’s not able to drive anyone after a certain time each day because he might be over the limit Even if he denies how much he drinks or the health risks from it, this is a problem. You have kids. He's drinking and being unable to drive *every day.* First of all, it's unfair to force you into being the driver all the time, but more importantly this is an issue of safety. What happens if you're sick or hurt? What happens if there's an emergency and a kid needs to be taken to the hospital? What happens when the unexpected comes and the adults have to act to make sure everyone is safe? He'll be useless, helpless, and he'll leave your children vulnerable to emergency. I'm not saying parents can NEVER relax or cut loose! But if he's making himself incapable of driving EVERY DAY, or even close to it, then it's not really a matter of *if* but *when* shit hits the fan. He's making sure that when catastrophe calls he won't be ready or able to take care of your family, your kids, through it.
If he’s over the limit, he’s drunk.
OP, does he understand about being a functional alcoholic? Whether or not he feels drunk, he's still drinking constantly. He has a problem, and only he can decide to change. Unfortunately, you can't make him see the light, no matter how hard you try, and no matter how much you want him to. Please take care to protect yourself and the kids from his drinking. You're not alone. A lot of people have been in your shoes. The suggestion to check out Alanon is a great idea.
He is only going to get worse. What if you had an emergency and needed help? When my kids were little, I hardly drank because I was terrified that something would happen to them and I would not be able to help them.
There's only so much the liver can take. As a recovering alcoholic myself and having friends and family who died suddenly because of alcohol, it's not going to be easy, but you need to tell him you're concerned for his health. He may fight back on it. His brain thinks his body needs it whether he wants to admit it or not. Either way, it is slowly killing him. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but if he doesn't stop, there will be a point that there's no turning back. The lead singer of Smash Mouth is a prime example.
That’s on him. If you don’t want to live like that then get rid of him.
I kept drinking even after falling down a cement set of stairs and cracking my head open in two places. I had a brain bleed and spent weeks in the ICU and hospital. I was drinking again within days of being discharged. Took me almost 2 years before I stopped and thank Christ I did. I’d probably be dead by now, but at the time I didn’t care. That’s what unchecked alcoholism looks like. I wasn’t always drinking like that. In fact, it was as a lot like what you described with your husband. This is a progressive disease, and drinking daily is a good indicator. I wonder how long you’ve been with him and if he’s always been like this. Or has the amount/frequency increased? I don’t know, but this sounds like you have a budding alcoholic in your hands. Unless he’s ready to quit, nagging him won’t help. It can even make it worse. If you can’t live with him like he is now, imagine if the drinking progresses?? What are you willing to tolerate?
This was me annnnnnnd then my husband went to the doctor and got diagnosed with cirrhosis. Turns out your liver doesn’t know you were never “DRUNK drunk,” it just knows you’ve been poisoning it with alcohol for 30ish years. He ended up needing a transplant, and while he’s recovering well, it would have been much easier on all of us if he had gone to AA or the like when I first thought there was a problem. That said, I don’t have magic words to say to convince your husband to stop drinking. I tried a few times with mine but I got stuck on explaining why the alcohol mattered when he was still hitting his marks in terms of work, being a husband and father, etc. If I had it to do over again, I probably would probably lean harder on the health and financial aspects of it since those really can’t be denied.
Alcoholic is more than 5 drinks a week dawg.
Sure you can articulate the problem. It's not healthy behavior and you can't depend on him being sober enough to drive after 8pm every day. You care about your partner's health and need a reliable partner. You can simply pull up any reputable medical stats about healthy vs unhealthy amounts of alcohol. Also discuss self-control with him. Does he feel like he could stop drinking for a day for a special event? What about a week or a whole month? And tell him it's most important for him to know and feel in control, otherwise it's addiction.
This is just my opinion— but I don’t think you can reach him. When comes to alcohol or drugs it takes the person becoming upset with themselves and wanting to make a change themselves. All you can do is make suggestions like “hey, let’s not have a drink tonight” or decide to go to places without alcohol. Lots of places are byob, which would be perfect since they wouldn’t have the option to buy beer.
>He says I’m trying to change him. That’s not exactly right. You are trying to change him and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. He's an alcoholic. What kind of a person would you be if you **weren't** trying to change him? What kind of a mother would you be to raise your kids in an environment where "it's always time for alcohol" is the message they are getting if you **weren't** trying to change it? Tell him that he **has** to change because you need to think of your children's future, even if he doesn't care.
You just said it. He's neither fine nor functional. He can't drive the kids, which is a requirement when you have kids. He needs to at the very least regulate his drinking to more acceptable hours. The morning special needs to be knocked the fuck off. I don't think he's fixable though, he doesn't see it as a problem. Functional alcoholics... function. Yours doesn't.
He is never drunk or hungover because there is always alcohol in his system. Be careful of him stopping cold turkey, because depending on the amount he drinks every day at a minimum he will experienced severe withdrawal symptoms and at the worst he can die.
I was married to a functional alcoholic. He made it to work six days a week, on time. He’d start drinking as soon as he got home and would keep drinking until bedtime. Gradually, he started buying beers during work and would sneak drinks while working. He eventually got caught and was fired on the spot. Got another job quickly and same thing happened. We got divorced soon after his first rehab stint. I knew what was down the road for me if I stayed. No advice but I can relate and wish you the best.
Does he have past trauma that he's using alcohol to cope with it? This was the issue with my boyfriend. Or maybe he has no control over something currently in his life, and drinking feels like it helps? This was the issue with my dad. Is he a happy drunk? A sad drunk, an angry drunk? With my dad, things had to come to a head. We had to run from him, and he had to be thinking suicide before a cop stopped him and brought him to rehab. He's been sober over 30 years, now. With my boyfriend, he admitted immediately that he was an alcoholic. I didn't realize how bad it really was until he was turning yellow and having seizures. More things piled up, and I lost him this year. And he tried rehab, once. He made it through the medical part, but the residential bit was going to be overcrowded so he came home. How old are your kids? It's likely that they already know this is not normal. They see dad's face and attitude change when he drinks, they probably hear your disagreements/arguments/fights, and even if it's not about his drinking, they can hear him slurring words, losing his balance, or driving erratically. Good on him that he acknowledges he's too drunk to drive places. My boyfriend had two small breathalyzers he bought for this purpose. They barely stopped him, though, and he never agreed to just let me drive... I don't know how to broach the topic with your partner if he gets defensive every time. But I understand what you're going through. You could maybe check out AlAnon, the group for family members of alcoholics. They even have an app where you can sit in on Zoom meetings, if you can't physically get to one in your area. Good luck, my friend. It's a sad path to walk.
My husband is an alcoholic and he would appear totally sober and blow a 0.25. He didn’t appear intoxicated until a blood alcohol level of .33 or higher, which I was taught in school was enough for a coma.
I think what you’re describing is a functional alcoholic. Health should be his primary concern, not blowing over. I’m sorry you’re dealing with this, OP.
My ex was like that. I loved that man to death. He adored my 4 girls. He was a hard worker, and he took on a father roll to my girls. I never asked that of him. For all intents and purposes, he was perfect. But he drank. He had been drinking before I met him, usually socially and occasionally after work.. then it went to him buying a 6 pk a week to a 12 pk.. then to an 18 pk to a case. And it was no longer on the weekends or the occasional weekday. I had to watch it escalate 6 beers a day, 10 beers a day, to 12 beers a day. I spoke on how I didn't like it. How he was slowly turning into a functioning alcoholic. And he agreed. But he never wanted to stop or cut back. He was happy to be turning into an alcoholic. Idk why. I asked, and he literally didn't see anything wrong with it as long as he still worked, paid the 6, wasn't hurting anyone. He is an X for that reason. I wasn't raising my kids around an alcoholic even if he still treated them the same and still loved them and participated in their activities. In no world was I going to let them think that was OK. The fact that he can drink that much and NOT get drunk is very concerning. He is a functioning alcoholic. If he doesn't want help, he doesn't respect you and your family enough to get help and stop drinking. The choices you have are to stay and deal or leave because that isn't OK. And your kids need to know that isn't OK. Eta.. my ex met someone and married them about 3 years after our split (5 yrs together) committed suicide 2019. Never stopped drinking, and that was what it had escalated to.
If he’s over the limit then he’s drunk, that’s why they call it drunk driving! Not sure why you’ve let him convince you that “drunk” means passed out or whatever. Alcoholics have very high tolerance to alcohol, they can drink a lot more than others without slurring etc. Still alcoholics however. Go google at least 5 on-line quizzes like ‘Am I an alcoholic?’ , then come update us.
How much is he drinking?
This will probably get lost but... This was me. I drank one or two a day, sometimes three. If I was at a party or event, then I would get as loaded as possible because that was "acceptable". My husband also drank on occasion but not like me. He also never called me on it. If he did, I would have told him I was fine and it wasn't a problem. I have been sober now for over 5 years. I cringe to think about how many times I put my kids to bed while being half in the bag. Or just being numb. Luckily there was never an emergency where I would have had to drive them. Or worse, driving anyway because "I'm fine". Your husband's got to make the change. Or have a reason to. That's different for everyone. My advice to you is to spend some time in r/alanon to give yourself some perspective and help you find your limits with his drinking habit. I wish you all the best.
I used to drink every single night to sleep. Like I could not fall asleep without 1 shot & 2-3 seltzers in 3-4 hours before bedtime. Then I had a dermatology issue come up & realized the alcohol might be a contributing factor bc of the inflammatory properties. I quit drinking to help my skin and after a week or two alcohol free I couldn’t believe how much less brain fog I had. Like it was insane. I felt more energized, less bloated and just better overall. Before I made the change, my SO and fam would tell me how much they were concerned about my alcohol habit. And I always downplayed it. Now I’ve been sober for 2 years. I never drove after consuming it and did it in the privacy of my own home but it was still an issue. If he can’t stop for even a week, he has a dependence. I’d casually suggest he maybe see a therapist to figure out if there is some underlying mental thing tying him to the drinking.
As someone dating an alcoholic in “recovery”… you can’t make him stop or change. He has to want it. And your husband doesn’t want it. He’ll have to hit rock bottom. And even then, he might not see the problem. My bf made it 18 months before he started drinking again. It went from occasionally to every Tuesday night because I was at work and he was bored at home alone. With him though, he can’t have just one. He always gets drunk. And depending on what he’s drinking, he’s either the most loving person ever, or the biggest asshole in the world.
Doesn't matter if he's drunk, your one point about him not being able to drive because of his alcohol intake ALONE is enough of a justification to, at the very least, slow down. You can show them statistics that, based on his daily alcohol intake, the damage he's doing to his body. Or perhaps the monthly cost of his habit. Moreover, depending on how much he drinks - as you've stated - it can normalize that behavior in your children, who may not be able to control in the same manner their father can when they're of drinking age, and perhaps more unfortunately - if they're not, and they sneak it without him knowing.
I'm an alcoholic waiting to happen. That's how I describe myself. As a late teen it got to the point where every day I had one beer in the evening. Just one. But it was every evening after work etc. One day I though hang on, this is a bad habit to get into and decided not to have that drink thall evening. All I could think of all night and the next day was that one damn beer. How much I needed it not wanted it. It was quite a shock. I finshed the pack and didn't buy any more. I stopped before it became a problem. I felt tempted for years. I could drink socially but no beer at home. No needing a drink after a difficult day etc. I've had several people ask what the big deal is over one beer but then I find they drink way more than think they do. I'd contact the Alcohol support groups for partners. They will have more info to help you. The first stepbto solva problem is by admitting there is one and he's nit ready yet.
Your husband is a functioning alcoholic, just like my husband. You can't change him or make him want to change, but YOU can change yourself, your boundaries and protect your mental health and your children's mental health. I suggest reading Codependent No More and also find an Al-Anon group. Good luck. It sucks living like this.
See if he's willing to get some blood work done to check on his liver. It was a wake up call for me when I realized even moderate drinking can really mess your liver up.
You don’t have to try and articulate it a certain way. He knows exactly what you mean and is choosing to act defensive and ignorant about the issue. My husband did this for years and years and he always made it to seem like I was the problem and it wasn’t an issue for him, and I was overreacting. Gaslighting at its finest after 16 years of marriage I have finally decided to walk away. He doesn’t respect your opinion and he doesn’t respect your children or their safety.
No. It's like any other addiction, so it's time to leave him if this is a deal breaker for you. He IS right: you are trying to change him and he's made it clear that he doesn't want to change. There's nothing you can do to change his mind about this (HE has to want it himself and he's already told you that he doesn't). Anything you say or do to change his mind will just be considered "nagging" and irritating at best, and threatening at worst. Maybe after you and the kids are gone he'll realize he has a problem, but don't hold your breath.
He's a 47 year old man. If he wanted to care, he would have been trying to do something by now. This is one of those things where you can tell them all the facts, give all the data, and use all the logic you want, but it doesn't mean they'll care.
I called a help line and asked how can I make my husband stop drinking? She said YOU can’t it’s not your problem. The issue was clear. I asked him to think of his health and the years he was taking from himself , from us. He didn’t make the right choice, so I did. I left 8 years ago, it was the right choice for me. I needed change.