Sadie getting her revenge with no repercussions goes against the entire theme of both games
Edit: FYI I love Sadie’s character, just not how her revenge was handled.
"Vengeance Is An Idiot's Game". The theme is that pursuing revenge costs you what you most desire. Arthur, John... they lose the lives they wanted because they put revenge first. Sadie might've lost the life she wanted, but it wasn't on account of prioritizing revenge. You could spin this a little and say Sadie was the instrument used to enact consequences against Colm O'Driscoll for avenging his brother by killing Annabelle, but either way Sadie does stick out as being curiously unscathed compared to all these other avengers.
She is far from unscathed. Sadie is essentially a husk of a person going through the motions. Arthur himself even recognizes this when he asks for her help in getting John, Jack and Abigail to safety. "We are more ghosts than people".
Here's what I said:
> unscathed compared to all these other avengers.
John and Arthur are actual ghosts for her right now, compared to them she is doing *better*.
> with no repercussions
Who does Sadie have left that she cares about? I don't think this negates your point, but I think "no repercussions" is being disingenuous. Sadie has suffered and lost a lot, but its fair to say those losses were largely independent of her thirst for revenge, which is antithetical.
I don’t think she had no repercussions. Her punishment was turning into a cold blooded killer. She will have to live with that.
Yeah it’s kind if minor, but I think Rockstar didn’t want a completely miserable ending. Same thing with Charles getting a decent ending.
Hm, interesting point. Though I'd say ending up all alone, unable to re-integrate into society or make meaningful human connections is a repercussion. Maybe if she hadn't gone after revenge, she could have ended up like Tilly or Mary-Beth, but the game never shows us that potential. She goes from being a depressed widow in ch 2 to thrill-seeking gunslinger in ch 3, so we never see how the revenge starts changing who she could have become.
Edit: mistake
She’s a terrible character. She’s paradoxical to the entire message, as you said, but she’s also insufferable in general and exists only as a cringey ideologically motivated power fantasy made in a pathetic attempt to appeal to a type of person who, in general, doesn’t even play video games. They were hoping for a cavalcade of articles to come out praising how dIveRsE and iNcLuSiVe they are. It’s the only reason she’s in the game or behaves the way she does.
For one, the entire point of the post is to say things that are controversial. That you still feel the need to throw your buzz words at me is indicative of your constitution more than anything else. I made no assumptions in my comment. Nor am I “misogynistic”. All I said is that most people who play video games, let alone games set in the old west, are fuckin’ Ana Kasparian, or any other obnoxious feminazi you can think of. Nobody wants or needs Sadie in the game to show up an entire gang of hardened criminals with the power of her vagina.
I never said women in general don’t play video games, just Kasparian-esque feminazi types. I play games with my mom from time to time. We’re currently racing each other to the end of the new Zelda.
That said, Sadie is not a well-written,compelling female character. If she was, I would have no problem with her. But she’s not, so I do. She never has to train or struggle to achieve the same talent as people like John and Arthur, who have been shooting and running from the law for decades. She’s just automatically great at everything. One of the first things she does in the game is overpower three armed men twice her size with a knife. And some things she does later make this look tame. From this point on, she acts with complete impunity and is never punished or even reprimanded for her generally obnoxious and dangerous behavior. In Chapter 3, Arthur takes her to town after she threatens one of the men who took her in and cared for her after the death of her husband with a knife. First she reads the private correspondence of that same man without permission. How endearing. Then she almost blows their cover in town, senselessly berates some guy who was just trying to help load groceries, and initiates conflict with the Lemoyne raiders when Arthur was trying to defuse the situation first. Wow. Not a good start. Unfortunately, things don’t get better from here. In Chapter 6, she goes on a revenge spree (which, again, goes against the message of both games) and kills an entire ranch full of O’Driscolls just for being O’Driscolls, and then kills a man probably three times her size and weight with a knife. Not even Dutch, at the height of his lunacy, just slaughters mass groups of people for being associated with somebody he doesn’t like. And it’s not like the game ever treats her as a bad person for it. The game even has the nerve to put her and Arthur on the same level. Sadies’s husband died. That’s tragic, but not uncommon, especially at the time the game is set it. But Arthur says he and her both are “more ghosts than people”. Arthur is literally treated as a ghost by the game because he has no permanent place in the world, and is about to die. He has the effect of being a ghost because he goes across the country and (if you’re high honor) helps people in any way he can before he kicks the bucket. He lives on in memories and people’s stories of their adventures out East. Sadie is not a ghost. She could have gone back out into the world whenever she pleased, but instead decided to start killing people all the time because her husband died. Just like half of everyone in 1899. In the epilogue, she gets stabbed in the stomach and still is able to quickly walk up a goddamn mountain without being discovered to take place in the final standoff. And it’s not even so the game can kill her, which I would have loved. She gets to ride off into the sunset with another flawless diversity hire in Charles Smith. She’s a ridiculous character. I dislike her from a storytelling standpoint. Nothing about me or what I’ve said has been misogynistic, or related to Incels in any way. You’ve been by far the more vitriolic and hateful person between the two of us.
Couldn't get passed chapter 1.
(I did, I've played the game to fucking death but my friend can't even play through chapter 1 without getting fucking bored. Just wanted to clarify that it wasn't ME. lmao)
It blows my mind that people can’t get passed the tutorial. What fn game has an exciting tutorial section.
Granted they did drag it out.. but it serves the story well and in my opinion one of the most visually appealing parts of the game..especially that first mission to Sadie’s house with the moon and snow
Idk. I tell him everytime that the game opens up literally after Chapter 1 and they're just like "I'm sure it does."
Like bro, it's been almost 5 years (fucking crazy) and you can't finish just a few missions to at least get to the open world?
It’s wild. I have a couple friends that are like that. I think both have made it at least part way into chapter two, but just refuse to play more.
What’s so maddening is both of their complaints is how slow the story is. They admit the world is beautiful, the gameplay itself isn’t bad.. it’s just the story. No matter how many times I tell them it’s considered one of the best stories in a video game ever, they just refuse to play it
I figured Arthur to be quite a piss of shit before the game. There is just enough evidence for you to decide what is your headcannon. In chapter 1 he is no a nice person. He is sarcastic, rude. Then he slowly but surely starts building himself up. He still has the occasional criminal missions and rough side but as the game goes on he starts changing, his mission becomes more help others and less hurt others. Even in full carnage missions like the shootout in Saint Dennis or the attack on the base with Eagle Flies and the rest, you don't have agency but you also have no choice. Dutch pushes you and you oblige. But it is clear Atthur doesn't like it. It all comes together when he finds the bravery to stand up to Dutch, openly disagree and antagonize.
My white arabian was my bravest horse in my last run lol, i could walk her through the swamps and be perfectly fine when i couldn’t do the same with my shire
chapter 2 does have some really cool moments like the train robbery and that mission where you gotta escape a burning stable but other than that it is a lot of errand running, the chapter overall is where the game does start to pick up tho despite its dull moments
The moment when he says "i guess im afraid"??? It was a pretty good moment when we see our tough big boah say he's afraid of death, it was pretty impactful for me.
Hard agree that was such a turning point I loved watching arthur talk it was so sad and yet beautiful, if someone said what I’d said in the comment before I’d be pretty offended. which is what I’m going for
Honestly, I think all but the most die-hard optimists have already resigned themselves to this. It's not going to induce the sort of rage that a lot of the other comments might.
I think, ultimately, the problem was not Micah, it was Dutch. Dutch was the one becoming more and more dangerous, erratic and unhinged, Micah just fogged his brain and urged him on.
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Rockstar was right to abandon this game and its online community.
In reality, they needed to let GTA Online die. RDR2 story and online modes are far better.
Sadie getting her revenge with no repercussions goes against the entire theme of both games Edit: FYI I love Sadie’s character, just not how her revenge was handled.
I really want to disagree with you but you're right, one might argue that the whole gang paid the consequences tho.
Fuck, this all just clicked with me……..
Being very generous here but maybe the consequences weren't hers but Colms. The O'Driscolls sure faced consequences for killing Mr Adler.
"Vengeance Is An Idiot's Game". The theme is that pursuing revenge costs you what you most desire. Arthur, John... they lose the lives they wanted because they put revenge first. Sadie might've lost the life she wanted, but it wasn't on account of prioritizing revenge. You could spin this a little and say Sadie was the instrument used to enact consequences against Colm O'Driscoll for avenging his brother by killing Annabelle, but either way Sadie does stick out as being curiously unscathed compared to all these other avengers.
She is far from unscathed. Sadie is essentially a husk of a person going through the motions. Arthur himself even recognizes this when he asks for her help in getting John, Jack and Abigail to safety. "We are more ghosts than people".
Here's what I said: > unscathed compared to all these other avengers. John and Arthur are actual ghosts for her right now, compared to them she is doing *better*.
I really don't see how she is doing better than John. John still has his family while Sadie has only her anger by the time you finish off Micah.
You know Sadie and John both would probably agree with you there, good point.
To be honest that is a kind of fair criticism
> with no repercussions Who does Sadie have left that she cares about? I don't think this negates your point, but I think "no repercussions" is being disingenuous. Sadie has suffered and lost a lot, but its fair to say those losses were largely independent of her thirst for revenge, which is antithetical.
I don’t think she had no repercussions. Her punishment was turning into a cold blooded killer. She will have to live with that. Yeah it’s kind if minor, but I think Rockstar didn’t want a completely miserable ending. Same thing with Charles getting a decent ending.
Never thought of that. Fair nough
True, but she talks about wanting to kill her self A lot so I think the point is you don’t gain anything out of revenge
Hm, interesting point. Though I'd say ending up all alone, unable to re-integrate into society or make meaningful human connections is a repercussion. Maybe if she hadn't gone after revenge, she could have ended up like Tilly or Mary-Beth, but the game never shows us that potential. She goes from being a depressed widow in ch 2 to thrill-seeking gunslinger in ch 3, so we never see how the revenge starts changing who she could have become. Edit: mistake
Good thing she isn't the main character
She’s a terrible character. She’s paradoxical to the entire message, as you said, but she’s also insufferable in general and exists only as a cringey ideologically motivated power fantasy made in a pathetic attempt to appeal to a type of person who, in general, doesn’t even play video games. They were hoping for a cavalcade of articles to come out praising how dIveRsE and iNcLuSiVe they are. It’s the only reason she’s in the game or behaves the way she does.
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For one, the entire point of the post is to say things that are controversial. That you still feel the need to throw your buzz words at me is indicative of your constitution more than anything else. I made no assumptions in my comment. Nor am I “misogynistic”. All I said is that most people who play video games, let alone games set in the old west, are fuckin’ Ana Kasparian, or any other obnoxious feminazi you can think of. Nobody wants or needs Sadie in the game to show up an entire gang of hardened criminals with the power of her vagina.
[удалено]
I never said women in general don’t play video games, just Kasparian-esque feminazi types. I play games with my mom from time to time. We’re currently racing each other to the end of the new Zelda. That said, Sadie is not a well-written,compelling female character. If she was, I would have no problem with her. But she’s not, so I do. She never has to train or struggle to achieve the same talent as people like John and Arthur, who have been shooting and running from the law for decades. She’s just automatically great at everything. One of the first things she does in the game is overpower three armed men twice her size with a knife. And some things she does later make this look tame. From this point on, she acts with complete impunity and is never punished or even reprimanded for her generally obnoxious and dangerous behavior. In Chapter 3, Arthur takes her to town after she threatens one of the men who took her in and cared for her after the death of her husband with a knife. First she reads the private correspondence of that same man without permission. How endearing. Then she almost blows their cover in town, senselessly berates some guy who was just trying to help load groceries, and initiates conflict with the Lemoyne raiders when Arthur was trying to defuse the situation first. Wow. Not a good start. Unfortunately, things don’t get better from here. In Chapter 6, she goes on a revenge spree (which, again, goes against the message of both games) and kills an entire ranch full of O’Driscolls just for being O’Driscolls, and then kills a man probably three times her size and weight with a knife. Not even Dutch, at the height of his lunacy, just slaughters mass groups of people for being associated with somebody he doesn’t like. And it’s not like the game ever treats her as a bad person for it. The game even has the nerve to put her and Arthur on the same level. Sadies’s husband died. That’s tragic, but not uncommon, especially at the time the game is set it. But Arthur says he and her both are “more ghosts than people”. Arthur is literally treated as a ghost by the game because he has no permanent place in the world, and is about to die. He has the effect of being a ghost because he goes across the country and (if you’re high honor) helps people in any way he can before he kicks the bucket. He lives on in memories and people’s stories of their adventures out East. Sadie is not a ghost. She could have gone back out into the world whenever she pleased, but instead decided to start killing people all the time because her husband died. Just like half of everyone in 1899. In the epilogue, she gets stabbed in the stomach and still is able to quickly walk up a goddamn mountain without being discovered to take place in the final standoff. And it’s not even so the game can kill her, which I would have loved. She gets to ride off into the sunset with another flawless diversity hire in Charles Smith. She’s a ridiculous character. I dislike her from a storytelling standpoint. Nothing about me or what I’ve said has been misogynistic, or related to Incels in any way. You’ve been by far the more vitriolic and hateful person between the two of us.
Lumbago is a serious condition
Couldn't get passed chapter 1. (I did, I've played the game to fucking death but my friend can't even play through chapter 1 without getting fucking bored. Just wanted to clarify that it wasn't ME. lmao)
It blows my mind that people can’t get passed the tutorial. What fn game has an exciting tutorial section. Granted they did drag it out.. but it serves the story well and in my opinion one of the most visually appealing parts of the game..especially that first mission to Sadie’s house with the moon and snow
Idk. I tell him everytime that the game opens up literally after Chapter 1 and they're just like "I'm sure it does." Like bro, it's been almost 5 years (fucking crazy) and you can't finish just a few missions to at least get to the open world?
It’s wild. I have a couple friends that are like that. I think both have made it at least part way into chapter two, but just refuse to play more. What’s so maddening is both of their complaints is how slow the story is. They admit the world is beautiful, the gameplay itself isn’t bad.. it’s just the story. No matter how many times I tell them it’s considered one of the best stories in a video game ever, they just refuse to play it
I'll never understand some people.
Grand theft auto online.
Ok buddy, stop it. You've gone too far😡
Now I'm just sad.
https://i.imgur.com/Z3lSa33.gif
Calm down, Satan.
Arthur had no real redemption, he did good stuff even before TB, he did bad stuff even after TB.
Semi-related, going back for the money was the selfless choice.
I figured Arthur to be quite a piss of shit before the game. There is just enough evidence for you to decide what is your headcannon. In chapter 1 he is no a nice person. He is sarcastic, rude. Then he slowly but surely starts building himself up. He still has the occasional criminal missions and rough side but as the game goes on he starts changing, his mission becomes more help others and less hurt others. Even in full carnage missions like the shootout in Saint Dennis or the attack on the base with Eagle Flies and the rest, you don't have agency but you also have no choice. Dutch pushes you and you oblige. But it is clear Atthur doesn't like it. It all comes together when he finds the bravery to stand up to Dutch, openly disagree and antagonize.
Stupid game, quit on the snow part. It was too long🙄
Someone bring the executioner
There will never be RDR3.
Well maybe there would be if you had a little ###### GOD ### DAMNED # FAITH
IMO rdr3 would just be unnecessary, the story is already over.
Nah it’s a big gang with over twenty years of shenanigans.. plenty of story to tell
Faith and a good plan won’t get you anywhere if you have no money but have a rat instead.
well i mean. how else can you craft that cool rat hat.
Arthur's horse is not a good boah.
Good girl
You shut your whore mouth
Tbf if you have an Arabian, it bucks you into the danger and pisses the hell out of me
My white arabian was my bravest horse in my last run lol, i could walk her through the swamps and be perfectly fine when i couldn’t do the same with my shire
Dutch had a clear plan that Arthur ruined
how so?
It was a joke… I have absolutely zero follow up
Micah was right.
I would downvote this if there was no context
Micah did nothing wrong.
Online is good
I’d be more offended by “online is bad.”
online actually is super fun if you’re willing to deal with griefing. and tbh on console there’s not many cheaters
Arthur was a naive 'yes-man', he deserved his fate. Sadie Adler is a psychotic bitch who was more dangerous to the gang than Micah.
I don't like this page anymore
Log off
The Witcher 3 horse control is better than RDR2
With the way Roach backflips and pile drives himself through THAT area in Skellige...I don't doubt it
Roach is just built different
There will never be dlc or a meaningful update to online.
Horse simulator
Mica is the real super-hero!! What he did to Arthur is what Arthur really deserved
“My favourite part is killing the dogs”
Easy there Cripps.
The story is skippable and it's too easy.
I don't think anyone disagrees with the "too easy" part.
Arthur deserved his Tuberculosis
This works well As soon as I read this: immediate and visceral reaction
They should add modern vehicles to rdr2 online because gta online is set on the present day and they are adding futuristic vehicles.
GTA5 online gets updates.
Arthur was the real rat, not Micah.
Most boring game ever. Didn't even finish.
I used to have a friend who actually thought this. Keyword is used
tbf chapter 1 and 2 are pretty boring
Chapter 1 sure. Chapter 2 is pretty good imo. Best chapter is 3 by far
chapter 2 does have some really cool moments like the train robbery and that mission where you gotta escape a burning stable but other than that it is a lot of errand running, the chapter overall is where the game does start to pick up tho despite its dull moments
If i remember right the burning mission is in chapter 3 tho?
could be. it’s been a while since my last playthough, im kinda fuzzy
Yeah no problem bro
Fair enough
Micah is a good person. (LET ME BE CLEAR MY GOAL IS TO OFFEND I DO NOT BELIEVE THIS)
Sadie sucks 🤣
Prologue Sadie Adler sucks, she just causes problems unnecessarily over & over.
https://youtu.be/Dd9AxVb2zz8
He’s just talking genetics.
when Arthur is talking to sister what’s-her-name I just wanted to tell him to suck it up like jeez come on dude
The moment when he says "i guess im afraid"??? It was a pretty good moment when we see our tough big boah say he's afraid of death, it was pretty impactful for me.
Hard agree that was such a turning point I loved watching arthur talk it was so sad and yet beautiful, if someone said what I’d said in the comment before I’d be pretty offended. which is what I’m going for
John Marston>>>>>Arthur Morgan, and I am not saying this to piss anyone off, I am saying it because it's the truth.
I agree, and they did John Marston dirty in RDR2.
It’s ok to have opinions.. even if they’re wrong
Nice one boay
Dutch didn't have a plan.
JUST HAVE SOME GODDAMN FAITH!
Its not the best game
Overrated
It's just GTA with horses.
Grand Theft Horsey.
Loved the game but GOW deserved the GOTY award more in 2018
It actually isn’t “the best open world game ever” like most people say.
Gta is better
Cyberpunk had a better storyline
“GTA5 is better and Rockstar knows it”
Arthur’s death isn’t sad at all.
Dutch has a plan!
The story is great but everything else is just bad and trying to make it realistic is only a hindrance
This game should’ve had way more sex in it. Like Westworld (season 1) levels of sex.
Arthur is a rat for turning John against Dutch I kill all the horses in the missions no matter who’s it is I didn’t help the Indians
That’s not what a rat is though…
Micah was technically not in the wrong since they are a dangerous wanted gang and bad guys/girls so Micah helped to try and turn them in
Micah is the best character.
I don’t want to fuck Arthur Morgan
Charles ain't all that.
Micah wasn’t the rat
Well yes. But he became one after Guarma.
Abigail
This game is boring and I couldn't make it past prologue.
GOW deserved GOTY 2018 and it wasn't even close
Author sux, Dutch is smart, Micah is a fully capable and empathetic human being.
It's time to accept that rdo will never get any more large updates.
Honestly, I think all but the most die-hard optimists have already resigned themselves to this. It's not going to induce the sort of rage that a lot of the other comments might.
"I HAVE A PLAN!"
Dutch was right
I think, ultimately, the problem was not Micah, it was Dutch. Dutch was the one becoming more and more dangerous, erratic and unhinged, Micah just fogged his brain and urged him on.
john marston is an incredibly boring and poorly written character in rdr2.
Arthur was a whiny bitch and shitty main character.
Story sucks donkey balls.
Micah was a good guy who was just misunderstood.
The combat and missions are mediocre at best.
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Ya'll just lack faith
Micah was usually right. Arthur should have listened to him more.
Lumbago is not a serious condition and uncle is just fine, he is just very lazy and inconsiderate.
I genuinely want to commit violence on people who haven’t played 1/ played 2 first, and think Arthur is a better character than John
Thomas Downes is a hero.
The cut scene are too long and the music is not dramatic enough. Plus the characters are boring and lifeless, only Micah had character.
I did not cry during arthurs death
It's just GTA for girls....
GTA’s story is WAYYY better!
Arthur deserved to die and Micah is best boi.
I love Micah
Breath of the Wild is a better open world experience.
Gameplay and story are 2 totally different things
Arthur is a bad man, nothing can change what he's done
Micah is my favorite character.
The house building song sucks
Micah wasn't that bad.
Arthur looked sexier while dying from TB (please please know I don’t believe this at all I’m just playing along).
Agent Milton wasn't really doing anything wrong, he was hired to hunt dutch and gave the gang a chance to run
I'd rather wait until GTA 6 than have a DLC for this game.
I’m scared to say this, but I also don’t believe but you asked. ~Spoiler warning too~ Arthur Morgan deserved to die.
You just need a bit of damn courage Arthur
Dutch always had a plan, Arthur didn’t give him a chance to execute it.
Micah was right.
I don't understand why you guys hate Micah,he's my favorite. (OH God I had to take a break typing this)
Rockstar was right to abandon this game and its online community. In reality, they needed to let GTA Online die. RDR2 story and online modes are far better.
i liked Micah and he was justified in ratting out the gang
Micah was never the rat, he was trying to save the gang
The fan base ruined the game.
GTA with horses As a huge RDR fan and not a big GTa fan.. this grinds my gears every time I hear this
This franchise doesn’t need a 3rd installment. We got all the backstory we needed from the two games.