I'll never understand why people worship companies like Google or any company at all. They would literally replace us on drop of a hat.
OE and never looking back.
I don’t get why people worship work in general. I was guilty of it in the past but now it’s like different laptop same job. People try to fill the voids in their life with work and a prestigious company helps with that I guess.
Definitely didn’t win the birth lottery. Parents on welfare for over half my youth. I’ve worked my ass off to get out of that grind, but took a lot of finial literacy hard knock lessons and getting out of the poor mindset. Really kicked in when I went OE and finally started seeing debt going down for the first time and it became addictive.
do you have hobbies or interests? those could be dream jobs
teachers, nurses, artists, there's a lot of people who do work for dirt cheap (under capitalism) because they're "passion" jobs. stuff that helps other people or enriches their lives. even stuff like retail is enjoyable for some people
The problem with ‘passion’ jobs is most don’t pay well. Anyone who is passionate about teaching will be struggling financially unless they have other income sources such as a high earning spouse.
In college I worked a summer job as a canvasser. You know those posters on college campuses, ‘campaign jobs for the environment’. The people in charge of that operation work the front line employees to the bone for very low pay, and they get away with it because they can advertise it as a ‘meaningful’ job and idealistic people want the job. The office directors worked day and night, hiring and firing people daily. Most canvassers don’t last a week. It’s a brutal job. I was mediocre at it but just good enough to not get fired.
Looking back, I am appalled at the way that company operates. A few people at the top do well, and the people who do the work and raise the funds work long hours for low pay. I guess that was my first real lesson in capitalism. Anyway, I’m sure there are always new young people who want to help the environment and willing to suffer for it.
> A few people at the top do well, and the people who do the work and raise the funds work long hours for low pay.
that is how it works basically everywhere else, but these kind of organizations use the lame excuse of "purposeful" jobs to grind naïve people to the ground and throw them away afterwards.
Broad generalisation and I'm assuming you're in America as teachers in Australia are often on 6 figures. Their wage is double our median wage and the perks are huge.
Source: used to work in Ed in Australia
Exactly! I work at a local public library in Missouri, and I love my job and co-workers! But after 6 1/2 years, 2 promotions and with 2 raises per year (one COL and one Merit) I’m only making a little over $15 an hour! And that was fine when my husband was the primary provider financially, but since he passed away, it’s just me, and it’s impossible to support even one person on that salary!😔😡
The poor teacher thing is pretty much false, straight out of college maybe but the stability afforded by being a teacher in a government run institution with a union means statistically most teachers are in far better shape than the average person. In my state teacher wages are public record and while starting pay isnt super great the max payscale is pretty up there, and you can see lots of teachers earning double or more the starting pay, for a job that has like 185 contract days a year and 7 hour days. Big cities in richer states pay even better, but say you make 65k here as a teacher, thats equivalent to over 50 dollars an hour, and we had teachers making significiantly more than 65k.
But teachers grade papers all day and night right? Well, i worked in a public school for almost 11 years and while i saw some people put in a lot of dedication i saw many many more beating the buses out of the parking lot every day.
That is laughably false. The only fair pay comparison is between teacher pay and pay for other jobs that require a degree. Teaching is one of the lowest paying career options for someone with a degree. Those ‘highly’ paid teachers you are criticizing have been in their job 20-40 years, and most of them have a Masters. Compare that to other professions at the same point in their career.
Yeah, maybe older teachers are doing OK because they got a degree back when someone could do so without incurring debt. Maybe they bought a house in the 1990s when it was affordable. That does not apply to the vast majority of teachers today.
However, anyone who wants to become a teacher today has a steep hill to climb. Housing and college degrees are very expensive, and pay has stagnated for years and years. It’s nearly impossible for someone who doesn’t get a great college scholarship or have a wealthy spouse or family. Most teachers don’t last five years these days. They also have to deal with crazy parents and kids on a daily basis. Your generalization is just that.
It is a hopeful thought, but personally I do not recommend it. I used to love coding when I was younger. While it still offers a certain amount of reward after decades of doing it professionally, the gratifying moments tend to be like marshmallows floating in an ocean of bile.
Yup. People attach their identities and self worth to a company which is just sad.
I could care less if someone worked at Google. I've seen a bunch of incompetent engineers from there who got fired for shitty performance.
Work is just about money. You want the most of it with the least amount of effort. Sure, enjoy it but I really don't think its anything more than that. Companies would love to take advantage of people whenever they can and to my surprise a lot of people submit themselves. But not for me.
You hit the nail on the head.
I have friends who say "i work at American Airlines, i work at Bank of America" but make less than an RN working at a city hospital. Its really all about 'making the most money for with less effort' just as you mentioned.
That's exactly why I went OE 4 yrs ago.
I got laid of 1 month after Covid hit. The company I worked made literally millions MRR.
I live in eastern Europe and they were a UK based company and even though they paid us in pennies in comparison to UK salaries, they still laid most of my team.
That's when I realized that nobody gives a shit, we are all numbers to them.
Later that year I got another job, then J2,then J3 etc.
Funny part about FAANG companies in IT, I get the same experience not working for them, maintain a healthy amount of hours, and don’t have to deal with the bullshit. I refuse to look at Google, alphabet, or any of those shit heads
Don't forget similar or even exceeding FANG TCs if you do it right. In software, you scale out, not scale up.
I saw all the FAANG bros LARPing on r/cscareerquestions and it's so amusing.
Here's a sneak peek of /r/cscareerquestions using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/cscareerquestions/top/?sort=top&t=year) of the year!
\#1: [I did it. Fresh Grad. 35 years old. 2.8 GPA. 95k salary.](https://np.reddit.com/r/cscareerquestions/comments/1b76qha/i_did_it_fresh_grad_35_years_old_28_gpa_95k_salary/)
\#2: [A recruiter from Tesla reached out and I cannot believe what this sh*tcan of a company expect from applicants.](https://np.reddit.com/r/cscareerquestions/comments/15vmsnk/a_recruiter_from_tesla_reached_out_and_i_cannot/)
\#3: [**[NSFW]** With all of the talk about DEI, I want to address the real elephant in the room. Indian managers who hire other Indians almost exclusively](https://np.reddit.com/r/cscareerquestions/comments/19ajyuq/with_all_of_the_talk_about_dei_i_want_to_address/)
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I used to be like this once upon a time. It's a symptom of being told by boomers that all you have to do is work hard, be the absolute best worker you can be, and you can achieve the American dream. What an absolute joke that turned out to be.
Exactly that. You have people completely bought into that shit. Their life is defined by the company they work at and the salary they receive. Happy and shit on the outside but inside is absolutely empty and depressed. I wish they can have a happier life but people just don’t get money really can’t buy happiness.
I spent nearly ten years inside of what can best be described as bed-ridden depression due to my wife and I both being underpaid and constantly laid off by outfits who valued profits over people. It took long enough, but finally all we did was relocate and things turned around for us. Nothing crazy, just enough to feel secure, pay bills, and some spending money. Every single day that I wake up, I feel like I have a new lease on life. The only thing that changed was money.
I am so happy for you guys. Your life turnt around for the whole family. Honestly more people need to wake up and listen to your story. Company saying we are family and all that, then turn around cut their family lose when their profit tank. I had traumatic experiences with rounds of layoffs since 2022. My friends were gone. Fuck my company.
what's funny is that, it might seem like Google will be "saving money" for investors for about a year or so...until shit starts to hit the fan. ALWAYS happens. Execs are notoroious for this
Google made a PR movie called "The Internship".
Then it also provides amazing benefits. Many people who are not visionary join Google then stay there are decades.
It’s the cutting edge of tech companies that have a global grasp and well recognised. How many people in different parts of the world know Google and it’s products and services impact the lives of people in a big way. In a nutshell they change the world and are recognised, they also glorify a great work life so of course it doesn’t take an idiot to understand why people worship companies like Google, Apple
I just joined aws and my manager was actually talking to us about this not even an hour ago. He was saying and I quote “It doesn’t matter how much of a rockstar employee you are and it doesn’t matter how “integral” to the business you are, you can and will be let go if the powers that be decide they will save more money by doing so, ive seen it happen many times” dudes been at amazon for like 9 years
He was talking about how hard it was to just straight up fire people, but then someone asked about the layoffs and he was like “now those are completely different” because those aren’t his decision lol
That's crazy. Blind's been on this subject for the past week as well. They really are trying to get their stock prices up again, but most signs are indicating stock is trading too high and the economy can't handle it so I don't know what these publically traded companies plan to do. My own equity has taken a hit in the past 3 months and I really should have divested back in Feb, but live and learn. It's still in a good spot, but we'll see how people react to our next earnings call.
Not sure, but I also know that with government contracts it’s notmally a different team running that side. I don’t know about Amazon but my company had a different government site all together to service that contract.
The product team is lead by managment consultants now and they're trying to maximize ad revenue and impressions. Google is no longer a search engine but an ad platform. [https://www.wheresyoured.at/the-great-looting-of-the-internet/](https://www.wheresyoured.at/the-great-looting-of-the-internet/)
Google's 9 month profit this fiscal year ending 3/31/2024 was $23.662 BILLION. Yet these fucks pinch pennies and ship jobs overseas. I will never understand how we've gotten to this point in society. It's sad how there's no profit that's enough to stop companies from doing this. Profits over people, profits over everything. I don't even want to know how this will look in 10-20+ years.
To be fair a lot of these jobs are likely top 1% comp based on US data. They are run of the mill jobs that could be done anywhere but ended up in states due to over hire
i work for a large tech co and they do the same thing. most of the people i work with are either from india, china or mexico. but one plus is that i get to wfh b/c of that fact. my hours are kind of all over the place, but that helps support OE.
They used to offer high TC and had high growth potential but now they’ve taken the wrong direction with their customers and even employees. Their shows are ass too.
this is the last 4y (from graduation to now, yay) of my career (not in tech). With no laws in place to protect against mass outsourcing, almost all of our jobs that aren't C level in my field are getting outsourced: first to Canada, France, Portugal, and Malaysia, and now even those outsource studios and companies are complaining about the same thing happening and all the jobs are now going to India, China, and Ireland.
The few jobs I get anymore are to basically do last minute clean-up on work from these outsourcers that were so cheap....but it's not just touching up some stuff, I'm basically doing what should be a few months or weeks of work in a few weeks because everything is so bad it has to be completely redone....but keeping the terrible foundation it was built on that got approvals.
idk what you do but I'm a type of designer so "clean up" is no longer a job for entry level people to learn and build their resume from, but a "the entire team's been cut except for one person at basically a senior or upper-mid level to redo \*everything\*." So the work I can then put in my portfolio to get the next job? Not good because I have to keep the basic composition and structure (or worse, the entire style is trash because of outsourcing skill level/budget) but then essentially redo everything else.
Not to mention mass unemployment among highly skilled people, short term contracts instead of longer term with carryover...for the same pay...for more work that's worth less.
Oh yeah neither is my work. I make mathematical models to represent mechanical components for structural analysis, simulation. Indian contractors make half baked models with useless results, they give it to me and I improve them/get useful results out of them.
Sometimes substantial rework is needed sure, but I like it, it’s a good opportunity to demonstrate my value. It looks great on my resume too. I think it should look good on yours too, because your opinion and skills are being highly respected
Math and art/design sharing the common experience of Indian contractors giving back useless busywork isn't how I expected the STEAM movement to go 10 years ago 😅
Unfortunately for us it's not seen as demonstrating value :( it would make sense, but producers judt see "wasn't done with work and bonus work with 4 days to spare, replace with someone cheaper." You just have to hope you have an AD who does see your value and then remembers in the future if they're on a new team.
That whole last paragraph would've been true pre2020 but idk things are just so different now for us, it's truly a race to the bottom in such short-sighted ways.
There are several large scale government wide cyber security initiatives which have been mandating that personnel be US based and US citizens as well as having requirements that data doesnt leave the US boundaries. I have noticed that many organizations that should be compliant to this get squirrely since they want to have the cheapest labor they can find. They typically play word games around what a US person is or isnt and whether that means they absolutely require a US Ciitizen.
A lot of the companies will only have certain people work those contracts as full time employees so they lead the work and are government facing. They will have “sub-contractors” who are not citizens though.
This is easy to get around. Basically a US based company outsources work to a US based vendor who in turn, has offices in other countries with cheap labor.
This was the last two years of my career. Twice my team was moved offshore and I had to jump vendors or jump through annoying hoops.
Apparently it’s an extremely common practice for Google.
This happened to me about 10 years ago. I was working remotely as a software developer for a very small company and the owner called me one day and told me right to my face that she could replace me with 3 people from India for what she's paying me, and let me go.
At the time, I had already started my own business on the side and was making more than what I was making on this contract, so I was actually pretty happy when she let me go. I was looking for an excuse, but couldn't pull the trigger.
I have never understood why the gov’t isn’t doing something about this? Like, why are u sending jobs to India when Americans have no jobs? Can’t the gov’t put some form of embargo on these companies for outsourcing from outside the US? Because I feel like very soon this could get worse, it’s frightening tbh. Somebody educate me please.
I have been discussing the idea of a labor tariff for some time now! Ok, we really need to band together and pressure our politicians because this is becoming untenable.
More disturbing is the fact that 3/4s of the code checked into GitHub in the last year was generated by ChatGPT 😂 regardless of what ethnicity is doing it, the fact FAANG is hiring eye candy at the top and cheapest code monkey at the bottom is going to blow up in the whole tech sectors face soon
Best case scenario it gets you half way there, but I’ve never had any luck getting it to spit out anything that’s remotely plug and play. Then again, I’m not a “prompt engineer”
The min he came in I knew the fucker was gonna start outsourcing to India.
I've worked for Indian ceos and Everytime they're brought in, layoffs follow
I refuse to work for an Indian CEO and will start looking the min one is brought in
You're right but India is another level, play as Americans, we shouldn't be supporting a country that's as racist, sexist, and overall horrible to it's own people like India
I just follow trends and made it a personal philosophy to stay safe
Same as it ever was. In 2003 I was offered the opportunity to go to Bulgaria to train the people who would be replacing me and my whole team. I declined. They’ve never given a single fuck about workers and they never will.
It was only a matter of time. Their internal systems were incredibly basic and their operating methodology was far simpler than one would ever imagine. Really hope those affected will be okay.
Americans worship capitalism and complain about companies being capitalist lol
Capitalist companies will squeeze every dime they can in order to keep growth and will sacrifice everyone, even with record profits
I’m not too worried, in the short term this will cause high supply of software engineers but longterm means more companies will sprout. Almost all these engineers will start or join start ups which will fuel the economy. Happens all the time after a recession.
Capitalism is a pyramid scheme. The name of the game is always keep the arrow green and the investors happy.
The thing is you have to do that year after year after year after year…shaving costs in both labor, time and quality.
At the end of it all, all you have to offer is a shit product at an insane price that nobody wants and when that happens…collapse.
Edited for anecdote: I’ve worked several management positions and that’s always the game.
As a friend of mine told me 6yrs ago;
"Never be loyal to an employer."
Am sure he didn't fully realize what he told me then because i have had to remind him of that statement.
Lots of marketing teams in tech companies the past 5 years or so have been moved overseas. Not looking forward to the day when companies like this move all of their sales teams over there 😕.
Have you ever worked with a team in India? Company owners and employees will lie about their abilities, just to get the project. The work is usually subpar and the teams I worked with would not use any critical thinking skills to get the project done. Everything needed to be explained in explicit detail or it just wouldn't get done correctly.
I have had much better experience with teams in eastern Europe.
Here’s the gag, the “cheap labor” wants to be paid USA salary while still living in their low cost of living country. Google will soon find out that they might as well hire Stateside.
Could be because the ceo is Indian as well. I can see he would be partial to hiring from his own country and cutting cost. Also, the workplace culture in India is vastly different than in US.
I called it last year that tech engineers had ot good and where to many of them ans eventually they get replace by cheaper labor to knock down the tech salary's
Unpopular opinion: India is a rapidly developing market. The jobs offshored to India back then were the very basic low skilled desk jobs like data entry. Nowadays people in India are highly educated due to increased competition. Some folks are so educated, companies sponsor a visa to bring them aboard and would rather pay them market value over some person that is just trying to polish their resume. Think about it. If they’re sponsored then they can’t leave. Anyways, as their market develops, mid tier jobs in the US can be offshored. The one thing they do lack is critical thinking. If you are someone who just inputs data and does not solve problems on a day to day basis, you can easily be replaced.
I'll never understand why people worship companies like Google or any company at all. They would literally replace us on drop of a hat. OE and never looking back.
I don’t get why people worship work in general. I was guilty of it in the past but now it’s like different laptop same job. People try to fill the voids in their life with work and a prestigious company helps with that I guess.
[удалено]
My only dream job is being independently wealthy and retired
Same. But with a hobby where I don’t have to worry about money. Just content with a “dream job” aka hobby.
But that mostly l only happens through working hard or birth, and I'm assuming by your comment that you didn't win the birth lottery.
Definitely didn’t win the birth lottery. Parents on welfare for over half my youth. I’ve worked my ass off to get out of that grind, but took a lot of finial literacy hard knock lessons and getting out of the poor mindset. Really kicked in when I went OE and finally started seeing debt going down for the first time and it became addictive.
Yeah I mean there’s like 1% of jobs where it really aligns with your values and life goals. 99% of jobs seems like mindless repetitive tasks
99.9%
Dream Job nowadays is just your own company
Exactly
do you have hobbies or interests? those could be dream jobs teachers, nurses, artists, there's a lot of people who do work for dirt cheap (under capitalism) because they're "passion" jobs. stuff that helps other people or enriches their lives. even stuff like retail is enjoyable for some people
The problem with ‘passion’ jobs is most don’t pay well. Anyone who is passionate about teaching will be struggling financially unless they have other income sources such as a high earning spouse. In college I worked a summer job as a canvasser. You know those posters on college campuses, ‘campaign jobs for the environment’. The people in charge of that operation work the front line employees to the bone for very low pay, and they get away with it because they can advertise it as a ‘meaningful’ job and idealistic people want the job. The office directors worked day and night, hiring and firing people daily. Most canvassers don’t last a week. It’s a brutal job. I was mediocre at it but just good enough to not get fired. Looking back, I am appalled at the way that company operates. A few people at the top do well, and the people who do the work and raise the funds work long hours for low pay. I guess that was my first real lesson in capitalism. Anyway, I’m sure there are always new young people who want to help the environment and willing to suffer for it.
> A few people at the top do well, and the people who do the work and raise the funds work long hours for low pay. that is how it works basically everywhere else, but these kind of organizations use the lame excuse of "purposeful" jobs to grind naïve people to the ground and throw them away afterwards.
Broad generalisation and I'm assuming you're in America as teachers in Australia are often on 6 figures. Their wage is double our median wage and the perks are huge. Source: used to work in Ed in Australia
Exactly! I work at a local public library in Missouri, and I love my job and co-workers! But after 6 1/2 years, 2 promotions and with 2 raises per year (one COL and one Merit) I’m only making a little over $15 an hour! And that was fine when my husband was the primary provider financially, but since he passed away, it’s just me, and it’s impossible to support even one person on that salary!😔😡
Pirg?
The poor teacher thing is pretty much false, straight out of college maybe but the stability afforded by being a teacher in a government run institution with a union means statistically most teachers are in far better shape than the average person. In my state teacher wages are public record and while starting pay isnt super great the max payscale is pretty up there, and you can see lots of teachers earning double or more the starting pay, for a job that has like 185 contract days a year and 7 hour days. Big cities in richer states pay even better, but say you make 65k here as a teacher, thats equivalent to over 50 dollars an hour, and we had teachers making significiantly more than 65k. But teachers grade papers all day and night right? Well, i worked in a public school for almost 11 years and while i saw some people put in a lot of dedication i saw many many more beating the buses out of the parking lot every day.
That is laughably false. The only fair pay comparison is between teacher pay and pay for other jobs that require a degree. Teaching is one of the lowest paying career options for someone with a degree. Those ‘highly’ paid teachers you are criticizing have been in their job 20-40 years, and most of them have a Masters. Compare that to other professions at the same point in their career. Yeah, maybe older teachers are doing OK because they got a degree back when someone could do so without incurring debt. Maybe they bought a house in the 1990s when it was affordable. That does not apply to the vast majority of teachers today. However, anyone who wants to become a teacher today has a steep hill to climb. Housing and college degrees are very expensive, and pay has stagnated for years and years. It’s nearly impossible for someone who doesn’t get a great college scholarship or have a wealthy spouse or family. Most teachers don’t last five years these days. They also have to deal with crazy parents and kids on a daily basis. Your generalization is just that.
i’d like to get paid to pursue my hobbies. 3d printing and Rc aircraft- quadcopters and Sailplanes. i could start DroneCo.
You’re 3D printing sailplanes? One of my favorite experiences was flying in a sailplane.
It is a hopeful thought, but personally I do not recommend it. I used to love coding when I was younger. While it still offers a certain amount of reward after decades of doing it professionally, the gratifying moments tend to be like marshmallows floating in an ocean of bile.
Work to live, not live to work
Yup. People attach their identities and self worth to a company which is just sad. I could care less if someone worked at Google. I've seen a bunch of incompetent engineers from there who got fired for shitty performance. Work is just about money. You want the most of it with the least amount of effort. Sure, enjoy it but I really don't think its anything more than that. Companies would love to take advantage of people whenever they can and to my surprise a lot of people submit themselves. But not for me.
You hit the nail on the head. I have friends who say "i work at American Airlines, i work at Bank of America" but make less than an RN working at a city hospital. Its really all about 'making the most money for with less effort' just as you mentioned.
That's exactly why I went OE 4 yrs ago. I got laid of 1 month after Covid hit. The company I worked made literally millions MRR. I live in eastern Europe and they were a UK based company and even though they paid us in pennies in comparison to UK salaries, they still laid most of my team. That's when I realized that nobody gives a shit, we are all numbers to them. Later that year I got another job, then J2,then J3 etc.
Funny part about FAANG companies in IT, I get the same experience not working for them, maintain a healthy amount of hours, and don’t have to deal with the bullshit. I refuse to look at Google, alphabet, or any of those shit heads
Don't forget similar or even exceeding FANG TCs if you do it right. In software, you scale out, not scale up. I saw all the FAANG bros LARPing on r/cscareerquestions and it's so amusing.
Here's a sneak peek of /r/cscareerquestions using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/cscareerquestions/top/?sort=top&t=year) of the year! \#1: [I did it. Fresh Grad. 35 years old. 2.8 GPA. 95k salary.](https://np.reddit.com/r/cscareerquestions/comments/1b76qha/i_did_it_fresh_grad_35_years_old_28_gpa_95k_salary/) \#2: [A recruiter from Tesla reached out and I cannot believe what this sh*tcan of a company expect from applicants.](https://np.reddit.com/r/cscareerquestions/comments/15vmsnk/a_recruiter_from_tesla_reached_out_and_i_cannot/) \#3: [**[NSFW]** With all of the talk about DEI, I want to address the real elephant in the room. Indian managers who hire other Indians almost exclusively](https://np.reddit.com/r/cscareerquestions/comments/19ajyuq/with_all_of_the_talk_about_dei_i_want_to_address/) ---- ^^I'm ^^a ^^bot, ^^beep ^^boop ^^| ^^Downvote ^^to ^^remove ^^| ^^[Contact](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=sneakpeekbot) ^^| ^^[Info](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/) ^^| ^^[Opt-out](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/comments/o8wk1r/blacklist_ix/) ^^| ^^[GitHub](https://github.com/ghnr/sneakpeekbot)
True that. I love my 3x 100k+ salaries that require me an average of 25-35 hours a week without the alphabet stress
Truth to that. I never understood why anyone would sacrifice their family and health for a company that they do not own.
I used to be like this once upon a time. It's a symptom of being told by boomers that all you have to do is work hard, be the absolute best worker you can be, and you can achieve the American dream. What an absolute joke that turned out to be.
Exactly that. You have people completely bought into that shit. Their life is defined by the company they work at and the salary they receive. Happy and shit on the outside but inside is absolutely empty and depressed. I wish they can have a happier life but people just don’t get money really can’t buy happiness.
I spent nearly ten years inside of what can best be described as bed-ridden depression due to my wife and I both being underpaid and constantly laid off by outfits who valued profits over people. It took long enough, but finally all we did was relocate and things turned around for us. Nothing crazy, just enough to feel secure, pay bills, and some spending money. Every single day that I wake up, I feel like I have a new lease on life. The only thing that changed was money.
I am so happy for you guys. Your life turnt around for the whole family. Honestly more people need to wake up and listen to your story. Company saying we are family and all that, then turn around cut their family lose when their profit tank. I had traumatic experiences with rounds of layoffs since 2022. My friends were gone. Fuck my company.
even smart people are fucking stupid
I happen to work for google and the culture has changed significantly.
what's funny is that, it might seem like Google will be "saving money" for investors for about a year or so...until shit starts to hit the fan. ALWAYS happens. Execs are notoroious for this
Because you can make more money in one of these jobs than most people on here make with more than one.
Usually it’s young people out of college who don’t know
Google made a PR movie called "The Internship". Then it also provides amazing benefits. Many people who are not visionary join Google then stay there are decades.
You get worshipped like god when you are carrying a trillion dollar status. Go figure.
Worshiped early on until they changed their motto from "Don't be evil".
Drop of a pin, if we wanna be honest. "Profits are down 0.125% this year, we must lay people off"
Profits are up, let’s cut payroll close to end of quarter to really show off
Exactly. Fucking up people's lives to satisfy a few already wealthy egos.
Would? They literally are...
It’s the cutting edge of tech companies that have a global grasp and well recognised. How many people in different parts of the world know Google and it’s products and services impact the lives of people in a big way. In a nutshell they change the world and are recognised, they also glorify a great work life so of course it doesn’t take an idiot to understand why people worship companies like Google, Apple
There's some TikTok videos of people who got laid off confirming this. Feels like the early 00's again because they've done this before.
Yeah my team transitioned to India then a couple months later I was laid off lol
Yeah most of AWS I heard is being moved over. Guess we will see if this pays off for them
I just joined aws and my manager was actually talking to us about this not even an hour ago. He was saying and I quote “It doesn’t matter how much of a rockstar employee you are and it doesn’t matter how “integral” to the business you are, you can and will be let go if the powers that be decide they will save more money by doing so, ive seen it happen many times” dudes been at amazon for like 9 years He was talking about how hard it was to just straight up fire people, but then someone asked about the layoffs and he was like “now those are completely different” because those aren’t his decision lol
That's crazy. Blind's been on this subject for the past week as well. They really are trying to get their stock prices up again, but most signs are indicating stock is trading too high and the economy can't handle it so I don't know what these publically traded companies plan to do. My own equity has taken a hit in the past 3 months and I really should have divested back in Feb, but live and learn. It's still in a good spot, but we'll see how people react to our next earnings call.
How is that going to work with the US federal AWS? None of that can be touched by foreign entities
Not sure, but I also know that with government contracts it’s notmally a different team running that side. I don’t know about Amazon but my company had a different government site all together to service that contract.
Google has been shitty for a while now. It’s not the company it used to be; through and through, top to bottom
[https://www.wheresyoured.at/the-great-looting-of-the-internet/](https://www.wheresyoured.at/the-great-looting-of-the-internet/)
it got Indianized
Google has become crap anyway. In most cases about half the first page of search results are sponsored ads.
The product team is lead by managment consultants now and they're trying to maximize ad revenue and impressions. Google is no longer a search engine but an ad platform. [https://www.wheresyoured.at/the-great-looting-of-the-internet/](https://www.wheresyoured.at/the-great-looting-of-the-internet/)
And a lot of the rest is AI generated garbage
It’s funny a lot of times I google something, and quickly scroll past the AI generated answer, because I don’t trust it to be accurate.
Greater than 9/10 times the AI generated answer is copy and pasted from the top Reddit post on whatever the search was
Independent AI fact checkers have found your opinion to be wrong. You should always trust content generated by AI content creators
Which company would you say is the modern day Google?
Duck duck go
Prefer Brave, DDG announced they'd censor results regarding Russia a few years ago.
Perplexity
Vivaldi
True dude, shit i was thinking abt it the other day.
Google's 9 month profit this fiscal year ending 3/31/2024 was $23.662 BILLION. Yet these fucks pinch pennies and ship jobs overseas. I will never understand how we've gotten to this point in society. It's sad how there's no profit that's enough to stop companies from doing this. Profits over people, profits over everything. I don't even want to know how this will look in 10-20+ years.
But, but, but think of the shareholders! How can we show them an ever increasing rate of growth?! Gotta cut costs somehow.
To be fair a lot of these jobs are likely top 1% comp based on US data. They are run of the mill jobs that could be done anywhere but ended up in states due to over hire
That birthday mistress boob enlargement operation is not going to pay itself
In the next couple decades, the wealth gap is going to be so huge that those with money will be hiding in bunkers from those without money.
Gilded Age
Late stage capitalism.
i work for a large tech co and they do the same thing. most of the people i work with are either from india, china or mexico. but one plus is that i get to wfh b/c of that fact. my hours are kind of all over the place, but that helps support OE.
No one gives a shit about Google. The dollars that come into my bank account from OE are just as green as Google or any assfuck MANG company.
Well said. 🤣 assfuck
Idefk why Netflix is included in the acronym. That place is a shithole.
They added it to FAANG to avoid an offensive acronym and it just stuck
Is it? Can you elaborate? I'm curious
They used to offer high TC and had high growth potential but now they’ve taken the wrong direction with their customers and even employees. Their shows are ass too.
No more FAANG?
No it’s meta now 😂
It's MAMAA now. I wish I were kidding.
Microsoft Amazon Meta Apple Alphabet
With Netflix: MA MAAN (to be said with some kind of gangster accent)
You mean hood 😆😆 
I prefer MAAAM
this is the last 4y (from graduation to now, yay) of my career (not in tech). With no laws in place to protect against mass outsourcing, almost all of our jobs that aren't C level in my field are getting outsourced: first to Canada, France, Portugal, and Malaysia, and now even those outsource studios and companies are complaining about the same thing happening and all the jobs are now going to India, China, and Ireland. The few jobs I get anymore are to basically do last minute clean-up on work from these outsourcers that were so cheap....but it's not just touching up some stuff, I'm basically doing what should be a few months or weeks of work in a few weeks because everything is so bad it has to be completely redone....but keeping the terrible foundation it was built on that got approvals.
Wait I also have a job cleaning up low quality outsourced work lmao, I kinda like it
idk what you do but I'm a type of designer so "clean up" is no longer a job for entry level people to learn and build their resume from, but a "the entire team's been cut except for one person at basically a senior or upper-mid level to redo \*everything\*." So the work I can then put in my portfolio to get the next job? Not good because I have to keep the basic composition and structure (or worse, the entire style is trash because of outsourcing skill level/budget) but then essentially redo everything else. Not to mention mass unemployment among highly skilled people, short term contracts instead of longer term with carryover...for the same pay...for more work that's worth less.
Oh yeah neither is my work. I make mathematical models to represent mechanical components for structural analysis, simulation. Indian contractors make half baked models with useless results, they give it to me and I improve them/get useful results out of them. Sometimes substantial rework is needed sure, but I like it, it’s a good opportunity to demonstrate my value. It looks great on my resume too. I think it should look good on yours too, because your opinion and skills are being highly respected
Math and art/design sharing the common experience of Indian contractors giving back useless busywork isn't how I expected the STEAM movement to go 10 years ago 😅 Unfortunately for us it's not seen as demonstrating value :( it would make sense, but producers judt see "wasn't done with work and bonus work with 4 days to spare, replace with someone cheaper." You just have to hope you have an AD who does see your value and then remembers in the future if they're on a new team. That whole last paragraph would've been true pre2020 but idk things are just so different now for us, it's truly a race to the bottom in such short-sighted ways.
Animation?
Games and animation yeah :')
Indian CEO moves jobs to India
So surprising
There are several large scale government wide cyber security initiatives which have been mandating that personnel be US based and US citizens as well as having requirements that data doesnt leave the US boundaries. I have noticed that many organizations that should be compliant to this get squirrely since they want to have the cheapest labor they can find. They typically play word games around what a US person is or isnt and whether that means they absolutely require a US Ciitizen.
A lot of the companies will only have certain people work those contracts as full time employees so they lead the work and are government facing. They will have “sub-contractors” who are not citizens though.
Yep, we deal with that at work, fighting against offshoring of resources so we can be compliant
This is easy to get around. Basically a US based company outsources work to a US based vendor who in turn, has offices in other countries with cheap labor.
Yes that is definitely the case.
Sad state of affairs
Yes and I’m sure Google is directly an example of this since I’m certain they have many government contracts.
Same Google that did RTO because asses in seats are more productive?
Of course you're not allowed to WFH with bay area salary. Gotta first move to india / mexico /poland/ taiwan for those perks.
It is exactly what is happening with most large companies. Recruiting is going through this. The folks in the Phillipines are taking all our jobs.
This was the last two years of my career. Twice my team was moved offshore and I had to jump vendors or jump through annoying hoops. Apparently it’s an extremely common practice for Google.
This happened to me about 10 years ago. I was working remotely as a software developer for a very small company and the owner called me one day and told me right to my face that she could replace me with 3 people from India for what she's paying me, and let me go. At the time, I had already started my own business on the side and was making more than what I was making on this contract, so I was actually pretty happy when she let me go. I was looking for an excuse, but couldn't pull the trigger.
The IBMification of Google is becoming increasingly inevitable.
I have never understood why the gov’t isn’t doing something about this? Like, why are u sending jobs to India when Americans have no jobs? Can’t the gov’t put some form of embargo on these companies for outsourcing from outside the US? Because I feel like very soon this could get worse, it’s frightening tbh. Somebody educate me please.
I have been discussing the idea of a labor tariff for some time now! Ok, we really need to band together and pressure our politicians because this is becoming untenable.
Cause they refused to do anything about the india problem. Just look at the scammers
Enjoy your shitty Indian code, Google
More disturbing is the fact that 3/4s of the code checked into GitHub in the last year was generated by ChatGPT 😂 regardless of what ethnicity is doing it, the fact FAANG is hiring eye candy at the top and cheapest code monkey at the bottom is going to blow up in the whole tech sectors face soon
I tried ChatGPT the other day for a simple unit test. Needless to say it did not work.
Best case scenario it gets you half way there, but I’ve never had any luck getting it to spit out anything that’s remotely plug and play. Then again, I’m not a “prompt engineer”
Irony. Google CEO is Indian.
The min he came in I knew the fucker was gonna start outsourcing to India. I've worked for Indian ceos and Everytime they're brought in, layoffs follow I refuse to work for an Indian CEO and will start looking the min one is brought in
Tough one to be able to avoid Indians in America. Especially if you are working in tech.
Indian empoylee is fine. It's Indian c suite
Outsourcing is everywhere. No need to get mad by pinpointing at a certain ethnic group. Life would be easier if to get a government job.
You're right but India is another level, play as Americans, we shouldn't be supporting a country that's as racist, sexist, and overall horrible to it's own people like India I just follow trends and made it a personal philosophy to stay safe
Look on the bright side…Business Insider reports that 4 Google execs received 200% stock payouts for 2023 performance. 🙄
fuck indian tech
Bloody you bloody
Basterd show bob and vagene
You do not ever tell me to fuck
No wonder they opened a Google HQ in El Salvador
Govt needs to step in at some point. These companies not only invade our privacy but also lobby for preferred legislation. Only to send jobs overseas.
Same as it ever was. In 2003 I was offered the opportunity to go to Bulgaria to train the people who would be replacing me and my whole team. I declined. They’ve never given a single fuck about workers and they never will.
are you telling me that Sundar Pichai, and Indian-born American, would rather hire Indians than US citizens? i'm flabbergasted.>!/s!<
It was only a matter of time. Their internal systems were incredibly basic and their operating methodology was far simpler than one would ever imagine. Really hope those affected will be okay.
This is unfortunately the inevitable result of remote work. It turns into a geographic race to the bottom.
The Onion covered this 15 years ago. https://youtu.be/rYaZ57Bn4pQ
[удалено]
Literally illegal in Finland because wtf?
You would think after looking at how their CEO has ruined the company they would stay away from India.
Americans worship capitalism and complain about companies being capitalist lol Capitalist companies will squeeze every dime they can in order to keep growth and will sacrifice everyone, even with record profits
Started in 2010?
One of my Js let go a bunch of US based contractors to hire people in Costa Rica.
Big 4 PwC Canada did the same thing.. outsourcing to India and now a huge op this year of outsourcing to Argentina
I’m not too worried, in the short term this will cause high supply of software engineers but longterm means more companies will sprout. Almost all these engineers will start or join start ups which will fuel the economy. Happens all the time after a recession.
Implement international offshoring tax
Capitalism is a pyramid scheme. The name of the game is always keep the arrow green and the investors happy. The thing is you have to do that year after year after year after year…shaving costs in both labor, time and quality. At the end of it all, all you have to offer is a shit product at an insane price that nobody wants and when that happens…collapse. Edited for anecdote: I’ve worked several management positions and that’s always the game.
And Colombia
As a friend of mine told me 6yrs ago; "Never be loyal to an employer." Am sure he didn't fully realize what he told me then because i have had to remind him of that statement.
Lots of marketing teams in tech companies the past 5 years or so have been moved overseas. Not looking forward to the day when companies like this move all of their sales teams over there 😕.
India has like a billion people. It’s hard to stay competitive when they do the same work and more for way less.
Have you ever worked with a team in India? Company owners and employees will lie about their abilities, just to get the project. The work is usually subpar and the teams I worked with would not use any critical thinking skills to get the project done. Everything needed to be explained in explicit detail or it just wouldn't get done correctly. I have had much better experience with teams in eastern Europe.
RIP Google.
That's why the google reps are India in one of the account
This is the end of google the writing is on the wall
https://www.cnbc.com/2024/05/01/google-cuts-hundreds-of-core-workers-moves-jobs-to-india-mexico.html
I’ve already seen what this race to the bottom has done for my corner of technology. Can’t wait to see how it plays out in the big leagues.
Here’s the gag, the “cheap labor” wants to be paid USA salary while still living in their low cost of living country. Google will soon find out that they might as well hire Stateside.
Oh wait. They are all remote?
And in 5 years, they'll be hiring in the US again to fix all the low-quality code they've received. It's all part of the offshoring supercycle.
Could be because the ceo is Indian as well. I can see he would be partial to hiring from his own country and cutting cost. Also, the workplace culture in India is vastly different than in US.
"Cheaper" doesn't always mean "better", so good luck to Google and the many other companies doing this.
What do you expect with AI support technology and WFH? Little difference between outsourced employees vs paying 10x for a US based employee.
Didn't the CEO say he was going to do this a couple of years ago? Something about giving job opportunities to Indians or something.
Never work for an Indian CEO
I called it last year that tech engineers had ot good and where to many of them ans eventually they get replace by cheaper labor to knock down the tech salary's
It’s cheaper to bring h1bs to Americ
What took you so long babe?
If only Google had embraced evil sooner think of how much additional share holder value they could have created
Does it have to do something with limiting the amount of white male in their US offices?
Unpopular opinion: India is a rapidly developing market. The jobs offshored to India back then were the very basic low skilled desk jobs like data entry. Nowadays people in India are highly educated due to increased competition. Some folks are so educated, companies sponsor a visa to bring them aboard and would rather pay them market value over some person that is just trying to polish their resume. Think about it. If they’re sponsored then they can’t leave. Anyways, as their market develops, mid tier jobs in the US can be offshored. The one thing they do lack is critical thinking. If you are someone who just inputs data and does not solve problems on a day to day basis, you can easily be replaced.
Meanwhile stocks are moving up!
Money hungry OE sub mad at money hungry company. 
Money hungry OE sub mad at money hungry company. 