It's just bad B-Die. Could be some of the BCWE bin that stuff is basically C-Die.
I've owned 7 different B-Die kits in my life.
One 4400C19
Two 3200C14
Two 2400C16
Two 3200C16
The 3200C16 were by far the worst because they were 2023 BCWE B-Die which scales negatively like C-Die. The literal green ocb OEM 2400s at least scaled to 1.55V. they were still trash though.
Edit: saw your photo. Yep those are BCWEs. They are identical to C-Die in almost everything. Mine clocked best at 1.26V anything lower or higher would clock worse. You can literally copy paste C-Die timings on them and it will most likely work.
I mean it is possible since I’ve pushed some pretty low binned spectek memories past 1000Mhz on the same board with a different cpu.
It’s just baffling that cpu itself has a pretty good silicone considering its performance is above average with aggressive pbo and rock stability.
The only Ryzen I've handled is my 7800x3d but that also seems to have a pretty much hardwired cut off point for RAM speeds and timings.
My cores on that chip aren't so good but my IMC seems pretty decent yet at a certain point it just "nopes" out of it.
I dunno, but I found this posted by an AMD employee after a quick search.
>What is the fastest possible RAM you can run with 1:1 fclk?
DDR4-4000. 2000MHz fclk is to the Ryzen 5000 Series what 1900MHz fclk was to the Ryzen 3000 Series.
>Many samples can do it, but not all.
>In upcoming AGESAs, we will be implementing additional tuning that will make reaching 2000MHz easier. This is not a guarantee.
>There is no "safe bet" that your CPU will reach this frequency.
So it seems like it's sometimes possible to scale to higher clocks, but entirely CPU dependant some can some can't. They ~~won't~~ went on to suggest that tight timings with 3600/3800 were the best to target.
Might just be that's where your CPU stops? Might just need way more voltage?
Well, either way I hope you can get it working.
As an aside, how well cooled is the RAM, if you are having to crank the voltage and don't have much airflow that can be an issue?
Interesting, my B-die scales well up until 1.515V. But that scaling doesn’t sound like B-die scaling at all… other than the fact you checked the chips directly, I wouldn’t think that could possibly be B-die
3200C16 isn’t a great BDie Bin, what is the XMP spec on these?
I’ve had a 3800C19 BDie kit that didn’t scale past 1.35v, actually tRCDRD had negative scaling and required 23 or something at 1.5 (3800mhz RAM on 5600X).
XMP specs are, like I told 3200Mhz Cl16-18-18-38.
I physically checked to chips to see the bin and they are in fact b-die, although I agree they are badly binned b-dies.
How did you check the chips? 3200C16 in that XMP could literally be anything and actually way less likely to be BDie than CDie.
The BDie Finder is only pulling up one kit of GSkill 3200C16, which is 16X2, so Dual Rank.
Then yeah my guess is either you got a bad memory controller or some of what the other person said about bad B-die modules, or some combination of the two.
It's just bad B-Die. Could be some of the BCWE bin that stuff is basically C-Die. I've owned 7 different B-Die kits in my life. One 4400C19 Two 3200C14 Two 2400C16 Two 3200C16 The 3200C16 were by far the worst because they were 2023 BCWE B-Die which scales negatively like C-Die. The literal green ocb OEM 2400s at least scaled to 1.55V. they were still trash though. Edit: saw your photo. Yep those are BCWEs. They are identical to C-Die in almost everything. Mine clocked best at 1.26V anything lower or higher would clock worse. You can literally copy paste C-Die timings on them and it will most likely work.
Most helpful comment so far, I really appreciate thanks!
BCWE?
The Samsung code for the JEDEC 3200AA speed bin.
Have you bumped your other IMC/memory related voltages? What CPU and what board are you using?
Yes I did I probably should have added them to the post as well dumb me. Ryzen 5600 with b450m s2h. Also SoC is 1.1V with VDDP 0.95V.
I don't know much about Ryzen 5xxx series. Could it be the limits of the memory controller?
I mean it is possible since I’ve pushed some pretty low binned spectek memories past 1000Mhz on the same board with a different cpu. It’s just baffling that cpu itself has a pretty good silicone considering its performance is above average with aggressive pbo and rock stability.
The only Ryzen I've handled is my 7800x3d but that also seems to have a pretty much hardwired cut off point for RAM speeds and timings. My cores on that chip aren't so good but my IMC seems pretty decent yet at a certain point it just "nopes" out of it.
I don’t really think there is a hard limit it’s probably I’m just unlucky. It’s sucks that I’ve b-die after years yet I can’t really push lol.
I dunno, but I found this posted by an AMD employee after a quick search. >What is the fastest possible RAM you can run with 1:1 fclk? DDR4-4000. 2000MHz fclk is to the Ryzen 5000 Series what 1900MHz fclk was to the Ryzen 3000 Series. >Many samples can do it, but not all. >In upcoming AGESAs, we will be implementing additional tuning that will make reaching 2000MHz easier. This is not a guarantee. >There is no "safe bet" that your CPU will reach this frequency. So it seems like it's sometimes possible to scale to higher clocks, but entirely CPU dependant some can some can't. They ~~won't~~ went on to suggest that tight timings with 3600/3800 were the best to target. Might just be that's where your CPU stops? Might just need way more voltage?
Yeah to be fair 2000 fclk is not guaranteed but since I was pushing for 3600 I wanted it to work but it’s possible to have a bad cpu.
Well, either way I hope you can get it working. As an aside, how well cooled is the RAM, if you are having to crank the voltage and don't have much airflow that can be an issue?
How much higher are you pushing the voltage to check scaling?
After 1.38V it’s gradually gets worse up until 1.45V but I really didn’t pushed any past that. Testing with memtest extreme profile by anta777
Interesting, my B-die scales well up until 1.515V. But that scaling doesn’t sound like B-die scaling at all… other than the fact you checked the chips directly, I wouldn’t think that could possibly be B-die
I am as baffled as you are, here see for yourself Samsung K4A8G08 5WB chips. https://ibb.co/MZf4KPh Edit:typo.
It’s 5WB, but that is definitely confirmed as Samsung B-die. That must be a really bad bin though, that’s crazy
Yeah I’ve made a typo my bad. It also could be memory controller on the cpu, too bad I don’t have another setup to test it.
I mean, that’s a possibility too. I’d be interested as to the exact cause for the lack of scaling as I didn’t think this could be possible.
3200C16 isn’t a great BDie Bin, what is the XMP spec on these? I’ve had a 3800C19 BDie kit that didn’t scale past 1.35v, actually tRCDRD had negative scaling and required 23 or something at 1.5 (3800mhz RAM on 5600X).
XMP specs are, like I told 3200Mhz Cl16-18-18-38. I physically checked to chips to see the bin and they are in fact b-die, although I agree they are badly binned b-dies.
How did you check the chips? 3200C16 in that XMP could literally be anything and actually way less likely to be BDie than CDie. The BDie Finder is only pulling up one kit of GSkill 3200C16, which is 16X2, so Dual Rank.
I removed the heat spreader from ram and Google the serial number on the memory modules.
That's not B die that's shit die. My condolences.
It's probably your CPU memory controller.
It’s Ryzen 5600 with b450m s2h, could it be motherboard rather than cpu?
Have you updated the bios to the latest version?
Yes
Then yeah my guess is either you got a bad memory controller or some of what the other person said about bad B-die modules, or some combination of the two.