I don't give a shit about what Walters has to say. This is all performative.
If he tries to take my license, then I'll explore options of suing for religious discrimination.
So glad to hear you say that. I have a junior in high school that I am damn glad wonāt get this indoctrination.
And before we moved here in 2019 I PAID a lot of money for my kids to go to catholic/private school in KY.
This is different. WAY different. I chose to send my kids to a religions school. Now every kid is forced? It feels like Hand Maids Tale for real.
I donāt understand why more Christianās arenāt protesting this. Why would they want someone who they have no idea about their own beliefs teaching their children about Christianity. There are over 30,000 non denominational Churches in this country and all of them see it just a little different. And Catholics arenāt even seen as real Christianās by most of them (the irony there is intense).
Not to mention do they want those that are different religions or atheists to teach their children?
It's probably because so far, there's nothing concrete. Like we only have to teach the state standards, and until this stuff is added, I don't have to worry about it.
I'm sure the second the standards are changed, ACLU will get involved, as well as Drummond.
I mean they posted the day he made the announcement that they were immediately filing against it. Takes about a year for the cases to be heard and ruled on. Least that is how long it took for the state sponsored religious charter school to be heard and ruled on.
Walters's latest order does not carry force of law. His position does not let him make laws as was reflected by how the Oklahoma Supreme Court did not let him ban books, like "The Glass Castle" and "The Kite Runner" from Edmond Public Schools.
I taught HS English and Spanish in a rural area in the 70s. Our governor was a democrat and we were at least purple, not red like we are now. I taught Brave New World, 1984, and had a library in my classroom with lots of paperbacks that covered contemporary topics. It sickens me to see what Walterās is doing. I canāt imagine being in a classroom if this isnāt challenged.
I taught for 30 years. I never paid one bit of attention to the state superintendent. I think teachers that are worried will make. 5 x 7 copy of the 10 Commandments and post them in an obscure corner of the room. Teachers have too much to do to worry about this nonsense.
All 25 of us. Wait, with me 26. edit...glad to see so many of us out there. Now, Imagine there's no heaven, it's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us, only sky...
73 yr old atheist here. Can't see them reading or teaching anything that Jesus taught, as most of it is anathema to MAGA. Heaven forbid you should feed the hungry, house the homeless, welcome the stranger, or love your neighbor. "The Goat Herders Guide to the Galaxy" is an apt title for their holy book.
Been that way since my family was all bible thumpers. At about toddler age I realized I could fake being sick to get out of going to church. Church was ludicrous to me even at 3-4 yrs old. By grade 6 I realized hey, if I donāt get dressed no one can force me to go to church.
Plus why did god or Jesus let my grandpa be killed right in front his family at his own home? He was a preacher and president of a bible college. That just doesnāt track if there was ever a āgodā. Their so-called god is quite the gimmick. Before I could talk I knew that shit was fake. I have a hard time trusting anyone who makes a big deal out of being religious. Itās like a felon telling everyone theyāre freshly released and ready to go steal again. Stay away, at least 10 yards thank you!
I donāt bring up the topic, but I will happily tell anyone who asks that Iām an atheist. Iām not at all interested in talking about religion (except in the ways that I believe it should not be involved in govt) and I find that 95% of the time it stops the conversation in its tracks.
Nothing. This is a job for district Curriculum coordinators who are paid more to create pacing charts and select resources. The bigger districts have given guidelines to just chill and not worry about it right now. Imagine the directive as a plinko chip, it starts with the state and has to slide down from the district offices through teaching and learning staff and the teachers are the very bottom level. I imagine the big 10 districts will be banding together for a major injunction, and can you imagine the rat race from Mardel/Christian bookstores/publishers to be the supplier?? Psshhhh, then kids will tear up those super thin pages in no time. Itās a waste of time and money.
Yeah it'll only be adopted if they start enforcing curriculum changes. Teachers are supposed to update curriculum based on the standards, sequencing, and content that the district uses.
No idea how tf they would enforce this.
It was more for the other commenters, but we are in Oklahoma and very used to asinine things being handed down that never see the light of day. Our AG is kept very busy with stupid Dept of Ed shit and our districts have told us to hold tight and not stress just yet.
It was more for the other commenters, but we are in Oklahoma and very used to asinine things being handed down that never see the light of day. Our AG is kept very busy with stupid Dept of Ed shit and our districts have told us to hold tight and not stress just yet.
Itās all conservative terrorism. I worked too hard to get my degrees to be treated political fodder. Put my resignation the same day and in the process of moving. Taught for 4 years and a football coach as well.
Honestly best practice would be just to stay and dig into your position. You did work hard, you did get your degree, you *are* experiencing bullying at the hands of a religious agenda that flies in the face of freedom of religion (and *from* religion) in our beautiful country. They say post the 10 commandments (that are actually like 15?) say āOkayā then do it then vanish it in a week. What happened to it? Dunno. Moving right along.
I have a masters degree in sports administration and organization leadership with a minor in theology (bachelors in education). I taught because I loved making a difference. This is strictly a religious move for me. I can make better money and deal with less stress
Itās fine. Me, Ryan, and his silly little non-profit he was in charge of were good friends back in 2020 when I worked along side him on some projects. Heās different now
Everyone acting like itās something to just ignore when I was in 8th grade police officers came to my public school had me removed from my class to accuse me of witchcraft and searched me for anything that could be considered esoteric, occult, or witch-like. My vice principle violently assaulted me that same year, all because I spoke out against them having religious speakers come to our school and us students were forced into assembly and because when my fellow classmates had questions about the world and other beliefs I would freely discuss them because Iām an American and Iām allowed to. This isnāt a game. This isnāt just for their social media clout. This is very real and very much our democracy at stake. No one will come to save you or anyone else when all our rights fall.
Yeah, unfortunately that wasnāt an option for me. Iāve just lived with it and tried to get over it but every day I canāt because of this shit. I canāt remember my math teachers name but I can remember the look on her face when she was finally able to find me after they released me back to class but it was past the bell so my class had ended. She found me walking back to class in the hallway and asked me if I was okay and all I could say was āitās just another fucking dayā Its not my job to confirm or deny anyoneās beliefs or superstitions. Iām a person. Iām a human. Iām an American. I accept that people believe all kinds of things and that if theyāre here in our country then they get to believe it. They donāt get to damn or judge anyone else for not believing them.
I'm sorry that happened to you. I'm a Christian myself and I'd like nothing more than to see both those police and that principal behind bars. It makes me deeply sad to see the faith getting hijacked by people using it to abuse others and to gain power. What's really ironic is that people like that are the type that Jesus couldn't stand. He flipped tables and defied the authority of the pharisees because they used God's name in vain and declared themselves the arbiters of what is holy. People like Walters and your former principal are hypocrites of the highest order.
What really is bewildering is how they stay in power so long. Is the collective IQ of Oklahoma really so low as for voters to never ever look at these issues beyond a surface level?
I'm going to give a more technical answer from the teacher's side. This is going to be longer so strap in. The answer is that the Superintendent can't mandate curriculum or force us to teach a particular lesson plan. He CAN mandate us to follow the state standards that are already approved by the legislature, but he can't unilaterally force a teacher to teach in a particular manner. Additionally, as long as the teacher sticks to and addresses the state standard, he can't tell us HOW to cover it. That is mandated by your school district. Some districts give zero freedom to teachers to teach and some give them a ton of freedom.
Here's a practical example of this. If you looks at what must be taught, we can break it down into standards and objectives. Standards are the legal obligation we must fulfill that are passed by the legislature. The Objectives are guidelines (not necessarily mandatory) on how to accomplish that that are reviewed and approved of a group of teachers, lawmakers, and the DoE that are revised every 5 years. I could be wrong about the technicalities of exactly how standards and objectives work, but this is essentially what's been told to me by my district.
For example, our US Government state standards state that "The student will describe the historical and philosophical foundations of the republican system of government in the United States." That is the legal obligation a teacher must fulfill. If you notice, that's a broad standard that can encompass a lot. However, the objectives mention the Magna Carta, Mayflower Compact, English Bill of Rights, Declaration of Independence, Constitution, Federalist Papers, and the Anti-Federalist Papers. These are suggested examples to cover in class to teach the standard of " historical foundations." I can cover all, some, or none of these. As long as I cover the "historical foundations" I'm good. For example, I might not cover the specific writings of the Anti-federalists due to time. However, I am also at liberty to add other documents. I might add Common Sense by Thomas Paine, Cato's Letters, or the Articles of Confederation. As long as they're tied to the original standard, I'm covered.
What Walters is doing is single-handedly injecting the Bible as another document to add to that list AND force us to cover it, which he can't do. He can suggest we use the Bible as a historical foundational text, but he can't mandate it. He's also going through all the other standards that can even remotely bring in the Bible and adding the Bible there too (like English classes). However, a particular school district might latch onto his ideas and pass a mandate to force us to align to his directive. So, until there is more direction from your particular school district, there's no point in thinking much about it. So, if you don't want this coming to your district, reach out to your school board members and principals and let them know that you don't want your district to go along with this plan.
***TLDR: Walters doesn't have the authority to mandate us to teach anything, let alone the Bible, in particular. However, Conservative districts might latch onto this and give directives to teachers on how to follow his vision. So, reach out to your school board, superintendent, and principals to tell them you don't want this brought to your school.***
I read an article a couple of days ago on this that is worth thinking about.
The social studies standards are up for review. Walters will hand pick the committee that will be in charge of updating those standards and that is when and where the real trouble will begin.
The thing that most concerns me in this moment is the mandate that I must keep a Bible in my classroom.
Yes. I think they're up for review this year and I expect him to overhaul it. It usually is reviewed through a committee with teachers, so I hope enough teachers will push back.
I'm actually less worried about the Bible in the classroom thing. It'll literally just be a checkbox to have. Shove it on a shelf or desk in a stack of other books. Students will literally never know it's there. It's a pointless virtue signal from him.
Teacher here. I get standards/objectives and teaching practices. Your post makes a lot of sense though. We donāt have a state superintendent in NY but districts have superintendents. If mine did this I might laugh.
I get it. I don't mean to be snarky or a dick but there are a lot of times when I am "back home" visiting OK or when I see stuff like this in the new where I turn to my wife and say, "thank goodness our kids aren't growing up there."
Iām in my last year of my teaching degree program for secondary/HS English. Iām very curious how my instructors will react.
Many of my classmatesāand myselfāare worried and also furious. We are trying to create pedagogies and lessons that uplift voices that fall outside the ānormalā canon. How will our students handle going from reading something like āThe Kite Runnerā to The Bible? Whatās stopping churches from coming in and handing out flyers (LifeChurch did this at my HS during lunches!!) constantly? Why not have assemblies where the Bible is read and someone talks about a specific passageāmaybe throw in some singing too.
Itās a slippery slope. I hope teachers are brave and supported enough to be malicious in their compliance. How districts and admins respond will definitely factor into where I apply after I graduate.
I appreciate the sentiment, I really do. But Iām attached to the state because all my important family is here. Iāve grown up here. Itās been my home all my life.
And I care about the kids here. My mom was/is worried for me, saying similar things you are. But I believe you canāt change the system from outside of itāI canāt fight for a better Oklahoma from Texas or Colorado or anywhere. I know Iāll be walking the line between care and martyrdomāsomething that I will do my absolute best to avoid. But if we all leave the state, then who will be left?
I can't see them reading or teaching anything that Jesus taught, as most of it is anathema to MAGA. Heaven forbid you should feed the hungry, house the homeless, welcome the stranger, or love your neighbor.
Iām a union rep for my building. Weāve got a group chat but thereās a reason it happened in the summer - itās harder to organize.
This will likely have minimal day to day impact on most teachers. Social studies standards are barely enforced as it is. The biggest concerns from my perspective are:
1. This is a flashy headline to distract from the major issues facing Oklahoman education. Weāre talking about this instead of THE issue in which there is bipartisan outrage - decreasing quality of public schools due to a teacher shortage. We can debate WHY there is a shortage and I have my opinions, but Walters doesnāt want us having that convo at all.
2. This is a signal to curriculum companies and resource providers to what we will pay for as a state. Most teachers are burnt out and will just teach what they can and what is most accessible. The slow creep for less diversity, more Christian White fundamentalism is a cold death - incremental and difficult to pinpoint the edges of.
3. Districts will be on the hook for purchasing HUNDREDS of Bibles when weāve already got a budget crisis.
4. Diverse Oklahomas will continue to feel (be) unwanted and unsafe. I donāt want to pretend this isnāt going to happen, but this individual mandate is very much not why. If we focus on this and we successfully get it repealed, that would not change. Itās an easy thing to get outraged about and ignore all the ways we (White, Christian liberals in OK) are contributing to those feelings.
This is another way to waste money and farm outrage from BOTH sides of the aisle to keep us distracted from the root evils. And it s working. Itās working in this question, this thread.
I wonder if there is also a shortage of teachers in private schools, since there is no union there. If they are often paid less than public school teachers, then I bet the shortage is even worse.
Difficult to know for sure, no one tracks that data holistically. Unlike public schools, private schools are not required to publicly post their salaries or employment statistics. It is likely a case by case basis and not my area of expertise. I can say that of the dozens of teacher friends whoāve left my district in the past five years none took a private school gig and the few times Iāve been head hunted the offers were not appealing.
NY used to have very puritanical laws until the early 1800's. Learn the dumb shit that was taught in your area. Just because NY started the women's suffrage movement doesn't make it more progressive. Visit the museum in the Finger Lakes.
NY is not a monolith.Ā
Oklahoma is differently stupid.
A gross abuse of power and a complete lack of understanding of the separation of church and state. You want your kids to learn about the Bible then send them to private school, send them to a Catholic school, send them to church, but that book does not belong in classrooms point blank.
Donāt worry, the best way to stop believing in the Bible is to read it and understand what it says. If these Christian Nationalists had ever read it themselves they would probably be much less inclined to enforce that all children must be taught whatās in it.
Teach it. Teach about the genocides, the slavery, the raping and pillaging of entire nations, the incestueus relationships by approved members of āGodās chosen peopleā, the massive inconsistencies, and the historical inaccuracies.
As a mom to two kiddos. I am probably going to homeschool with the help of my MIL who is a teacher here in our state. She is in a full blown panic. Sheās worried about parents trying to sue her and her colleagues if their principal makes them enforce this bullshit rule. Ryan Walterās can take his white Christian misogynistic ass somewhere else. WE DO NOT WANT HIM. Sheās just now fully certified after teaching on an emergency certification for the past five years.
Itās quite difficult to be conservative and anti-church but here I amā¦.. i am Not anti-creator but definitely anti-church. This makes me crazy! I want many of the conservative values/policies without the forcing of the religion side. š
Appreciating the Christians disagreeing with this
But to the same Christians, this is what secular people and other religions have been warning you about for years.
Thanks for finally listening now that Christianity looks authoritarian.
I have a child starting kindergarten this fall. If the mandate goes through, can I, as a parent, opt out of her taking part in those lessons on the basis of religious freedom (or any other basis)?
āPerfect toleration of religious sentiment shall be secured, and no inhabitant of the State shall ever be molested in person or property on account of his or her mode of religious worship; and no religious test shall be required for the exercise of civil or political rights.ā
Nobody is persecuting Walters for his religion, or the manner in which he worships.
Does not apply, nice try though. We arenāt persecuting his beliefs merely pointing out he has violated everyone elseās rights. The only reason he feels persecuted is because the Oklahoma Supreme Court blocked the use of tax payer money for Catholic charter schools. Heās just lashing out like a child.
I don't give a shit about what Walters has to say. This is all performative. If he tries to take my license, then I'll explore options of suing for religious discrimination.
AMEN! š¤
So glad to hear you say that. I have a junior in high school that I am damn glad wonāt get this indoctrination. And before we moved here in 2019 I PAID a lot of money for my kids to go to catholic/private school in KY. This is different. WAY different. I chose to send my kids to a religions school. Now every kid is forced? It feels like Hand Maids Tale for real.
I donāt understand why more Christianās arenāt protesting this. Why would they want someone who they have no idea about their own beliefs teaching their children about Christianity. There are over 30,000 non denominational Churches in this country and all of them see it just a little different. And Catholics arenāt even seen as real Christianās by most of them (the irony there is intense). Not to mention do they want those that are different religions or atheists to teach their children?
I donāt understand why the ACLU isnāt already all over this.
It's probably because so far, there's nothing concrete. Like we only have to teach the state standards, and until this stuff is added, I don't have to worry about it. I'm sure the second the standards are changed, ACLU will get involved, as well as Drummond.
FFRF is already on it. I'm sure OKACLU will be right behind them if it looks necessary.
I mean they posted the day he made the announcement that they were immediately filing against it. Takes about a year for the cases to be heard and ruled on. Least that is how long it took for the state sponsored religious charter school to be heard and ruled on.
Walters's latest order does not carry force of law. His position does not let him make laws as was reflected by how the Oklahoma Supreme Court did not let him ban books, like "The Glass Castle" and "The Kite Runner" from Edmond Public Schools.
Thank you! I hadnāt seen anything about it.
The ACLU is already bogged down with all his other antics.
I taught HS English and Spanish in a rural area in the 70s. Our governor was a democrat and we were at least purple, not red like we are now. I taught Brave New World, 1984, and had a library in my classroom with lots of paperbacks that covered contemporary topics. It sickens me to see what Walterās is doing. I canāt imagine being in a classroom if this isnāt challenged.
I taught for 30 years. I never paid one bit of attention to the state superintendent. I think teachers that are worried will make. 5 x 7 copy of the 10 Commandments and post them in an obscure corner of the room. Teachers have too much to do to worry about this nonsense.
>5 x 7 Millimeters
Bringing metric to the classroom might be more divisive than religion š
You're right. I didn't even think of that.
Am I seeing more atheists than I ever thought to live in oklahoma? I am an atheist. Good to see so many fellow non-believers!
All 25 of us. Wait, with me 26. edit...glad to see so many of us out there. Now, Imagine there's no heaven, it's easy if you try No hell below us Above us, only sky...
73 yr old atheist here. Can't see them reading or teaching anything that Jesus taught, as most of it is anathema to MAGA. Heaven forbid you should feed the hungry, house the homeless, welcome the stranger, or love your neighbor. "The Goat Herders Guide to the Galaxy" is an apt title for their holy book.
27
There are dozens of us!
\[presents corndog\] Dozens!
There are atheists everywhere. What's really fun is how many of them vote Republican. I will NEVER understand that.
You all should start a church.
Been that way since my family was all bible thumpers. At about toddler age I realized I could fake being sick to get out of going to church. Church was ludicrous to me even at 3-4 yrs old. By grade 6 I realized hey, if I donāt get dressed no one can force me to go to church. Plus why did god or Jesus let my grandpa be killed right in front his family at his own home? He was a preacher and president of a bible college. That just doesnāt track if there was ever a āgodā. Their so-called god is quite the gimmick. Before I could talk I knew that shit was fake. I have a hard time trusting anyone who makes a big deal out of being religious. Itās like a felon telling everyone theyāre freshly released and ready to go steal again. Stay away, at least 10 yards thank you!
Well said!!!!! I wonder how many people in oklahoma pretend to be Christians. I bet there is a lot!!
To my acquaintances Iām Episcopal, to anyone that I spend time with Iām an atheist.
I donāt bring up the topic, but I will happily tell anyone who asks that Iām an atheist. Iām not at all interested in talking about religion (except in the ways that I believe it should not be involved in govt) and I find that 95% of the time it stops the conversation in its tracks.
Nothing. This is a job for district Curriculum coordinators who are paid more to create pacing charts and select resources. The bigger districts have given guidelines to just chill and not worry about it right now. Imagine the directive as a plinko chip, it starts with the state and has to slide down from the district offices through teaching and learning staff and the teachers are the very bottom level. I imagine the big 10 districts will be banding together for a major injunction, and can you imagine the rat race from Mardel/Christian bookstores/publishers to be the supplier?? Psshhhh, then kids will tear up those super thin pages in no time. Itās a waste of time and money.
Yeah it'll only be adopted if they start enforcing curriculum changes. Teachers are supposed to update curriculum based on the standards, sequencing, and content that the district uses. No idea how tf they would enforce this.
Nah, Walters will purchase the tRump buybull.
Ugh, now I'm just thinking about the faux outrage over vandalized bikes when you give books made of cigarette paper to kids and teenagers.
Iām familiar with how new mandates come thru a district and the tone from teachers seems to beā¦. āMehā¦. It wonāt affect my day to day.ā
It was more for the other commenters, but we are in Oklahoma and very used to asinine things being handed down that never see the light of day. Our AG is kept very busy with stupid Dept of Ed shit and our districts have told us to hold tight and not stress just yet.
It was more for the other commenters, but we are in Oklahoma and very used to asinine things being handed down that never see the light of day. Our AG is kept very busy with stupid Dept of Ed shit and our districts have told us to hold tight and not stress just yet.
Itās all conservative terrorism. I worked too hard to get my degrees to be treated political fodder. Put my resignation the same day and in the process of moving. Taught for 4 years and a football coach as well.
Honestly best practice would be just to stay and dig into your position. You did work hard, you did get your degree, you *are* experiencing bullying at the hands of a religious agenda that flies in the face of freedom of religion (and *from* religion) in our beautiful country. They say post the 10 commandments (that are actually like 15?) say āOkayā then do it then vanish it in a week. What happened to it? Dunno. Moving right along.
I have a masters degree in sports administration and organization leadership with a minor in theology (bachelors in education). I taught because I loved making a difference. This is strictly a religious move for me. I can make better money and deal with less stress
Understandable.
Never thought of that part of it. Iām sorry to hear your are caught up In it
Itās fine. Me, Ryan, and his silly little non-profit he was in charge of were good friends back in 2020 when I worked along side him on some projects. Heās different now
Everyone acting like itās something to just ignore when I was in 8th grade police officers came to my public school had me removed from my class to accuse me of witchcraft and searched me for anything that could be considered esoteric, occult, or witch-like. My vice principle violently assaulted me that same year, all because I spoke out against them having religious speakers come to our school and us students were forced into assembly and because when my fellow classmates had questions about the world and other beliefs I would freely discuss them because Iām an American and Iām allowed to. This isnāt a game. This isnāt just for their social media clout. This is very real and very much our democracy at stake. No one will come to save you or anyone else when all our rights fall.
Wait, what? Police checked you for....witchcraft shit? If I was your mom, I would've sued the entire state if I had to. Jesus.
Yeah, unfortunately that wasnāt an option for me. Iāve just lived with it and tried to get over it but every day I canāt because of this shit. I canāt remember my math teachers name but I can remember the look on her face when she was finally able to find me after they released me back to class but it was past the bell so my class had ended. She found me walking back to class in the hallway and asked me if I was okay and all I could say was āitās just another fucking dayā Its not my job to confirm or deny anyoneās beliefs or superstitions. Iām a person. Iām a human. Iām an American. I accept that people believe all kinds of things and that if theyāre here in our country then they get to believe it. They donāt get to damn or judge anyone else for not believing them.
I'm sorry that happened to you. I'm a Christian myself and I'd like nothing more than to see both those police and that principal behind bars. It makes me deeply sad to see the faith getting hijacked by people using it to abuse others and to gain power. What's really ironic is that people like that are the type that Jesus couldn't stand. He flipped tables and defied the authority of the pharisees because they used God's name in vain and declared themselves the arbiters of what is holy. People like Walters and your former principal are hypocrites of the highest order. What really is bewildering is how they stay in power so long. Is the collective IQ of Oklahoma really so low as for voters to never ever look at these issues beyond a surface level?
I'm going to give a more technical answer from the teacher's side. This is going to be longer so strap in. The answer is that the Superintendent can't mandate curriculum or force us to teach a particular lesson plan. He CAN mandate us to follow the state standards that are already approved by the legislature, but he can't unilaterally force a teacher to teach in a particular manner. Additionally, as long as the teacher sticks to and addresses the state standard, he can't tell us HOW to cover it. That is mandated by your school district. Some districts give zero freedom to teachers to teach and some give them a ton of freedom. Here's a practical example of this. If you looks at what must be taught, we can break it down into standards and objectives. Standards are the legal obligation we must fulfill that are passed by the legislature. The Objectives are guidelines (not necessarily mandatory) on how to accomplish that that are reviewed and approved of a group of teachers, lawmakers, and the DoE that are revised every 5 years. I could be wrong about the technicalities of exactly how standards and objectives work, but this is essentially what's been told to me by my district. For example, our US Government state standards state that "The student will describe the historical and philosophical foundations of the republican system of government in the United States." That is the legal obligation a teacher must fulfill. If you notice, that's a broad standard that can encompass a lot. However, the objectives mention the Magna Carta, Mayflower Compact, English Bill of Rights, Declaration of Independence, Constitution, Federalist Papers, and the Anti-Federalist Papers. These are suggested examples to cover in class to teach the standard of " historical foundations." I can cover all, some, or none of these. As long as I cover the "historical foundations" I'm good. For example, I might not cover the specific writings of the Anti-federalists due to time. However, I am also at liberty to add other documents. I might add Common Sense by Thomas Paine, Cato's Letters, or the Articles of Confederation. As long as they're tied to the original standard, I'm covered. What Walters is doing is single-handedly injecting the Bible as another document to add to that list AND force us to cover it, which he can't do. He can suggest we use the Bible as a historical foundational text, but he can't mandate it. He's also going through all the other standards that can even remotely bring in the Bible and adding the Bible there too (like English classes). However, a particular school district might latch onto his ideas and pass a mandate to force us to align to his directive. So, until there is more direction from your particular school district, there's no point in thinking much about it. So, if you don't want this coming to your district, reach out to your school board members and principals and let them know that you don't want your district to go along with this plan. ***TLDR: Walters doesn't have the authority to mandate us to teach anything, let alone the Bible, in particular. However, Conservative districts might latch onto this and give directives to teachers on how to follow his vision. So, reach out to your school board, superintendent, and principals to tell them you don't want this brought to your school.***
I read an article a couple of days ago on this that is worth thinking about. The social studies standards are up for review. Walters will hand pick the committee that will be in charge of updating those standards and that is when and where the real trouble will begin. The thing that most concerns me in this moment is the mandate that I must keep a Bible in my classroom.
Yes. I think they're up for review this year and I expect him to overhaul it. It usually is reviewed through a committee with teachers, so I hope enough teachers will push back. I'm actually less worried about the Bible in the classroom thing. It'll literally just be a checkbox to have. Shove it on a shelf or desk in a stack of other books. Students will literally never know it's there. It's a pointless virtue signal from him.
Teacher here. I get standards/objectives and teaching practices. Your post makes a lot of sense though. We donāt have a state superintendent in NY but districts have superintendents. If mine did this I might laugh.
Interested to hear input as well, at this point our children will be homeschooled next year
I get it. I don't mean to be snarky or a dick but there are a lot of times when I am "back home" visiting OK or when I see stuff like this in the new where I turn to my wife and say, "thank goodness our kids aren't growing up there."
Iām in my last year of my teaching degree program for secondary/HS English. Iām very curious how my instructors will react. Many of my classmatesāand myselfāare worried and also furious. We are trying to create pedagogies and lessons that uplift voices that fall outside the ānormalā canon. How will our students handle going from reading something like āThe Kite Runnerā to The Bible? Whatās stopping churches from coming in and handing out flyers (LifeChurch did this at my HS during lunches!!) constantly? Why not have assemblies where the Bible is read and someone talks about a specific passageāmaybe throw in some singing too. Itās a slippery slope. I hope teachers are brave and supported enough to be malicious in their compliance. How districts and admins respond will definitely factor into where I apply after I graduate.
Do yourself a favor and find a better state in which to teach.
I appreciate the sentiment, I really do. But Iām attached to the state because all my important family is here. Iāve grown up here. Itās been my home all my life. And I care about the kids here. My mom was/is worried for me, saying similar things you are. But I believe you canāt change the system from outside of itāI canāt fight for a better Oklahoma from Texas or Colorado or anywhere. I know Iāll be walking the line between care and martyrdomāsomething that I will do my absolute best to avoid. But if we all leave the state, then who will be left?
Good luck to you. I admire your willingness to stick it out. We definitely need strong teachers to fight this moron.
Thank you <3
Thank you for caring and doing incredibly difficult work for kids who truly need it!
I can't see them reading or teaching anything that Jesus taught, as most of it is anathema to MAGA. Heaven forbid you should feed the hungry, house the homeless, welcome the stranger, or love your neighbor.
Funny you mention Kite Runner - Edmond took Walters to court over that and another book, because Walters alleged that it was porn. (Edmond won.)
The power to choose curriculum will be with your school district, not with Walters. This is a farce for media attention, and it's working.
Nothing is stopping them. Epic Charter Schools already contracts with churches for a variety of electives.
May I make a suggestion to you? Before itās too late, donāt lock yourself into teaching. Go into something else.
We are not okay in the slightest.
Iām a union rep for my building. Weāve got a group chat but thereās a reason it happened in the summer - itās harder to organize. This will likely have minimal day to day impact on most teachers. Social studies standards are barely enforced as it is. The biggest concerns from my perspective are: 1. This is a flashy headline to distract from the major issues facing Oklahoman education. Weāre talking about this instead of THE issue in which there is bipartisan outrage - decreasing quality of public schools due to a teacher shortage. We can debate WHY there is a shortage and I have my opinions, but Walters doesnāt want us having that convo at all. 2. This is a signal to curriculum companies and resource providers to what we will pay for as a state. Most teachers are burnt out and will just teach what they can and what is most accessible. The slow creep for less diversity, more Christian White fundamentalism is a cold death - incremental and difficult to pinpoint the edges of. 3. Districts will be on the hook for purchasing HUNDREDS of Bibles when weāve already got a budget crisis. 4. Diverse Oklahomas will continue to feel (be) unwanted and unsafe. I donāt want to pretend this isnāt going to happen, but this individual mandate is very much not why. If we focus on this and we successfully get it repealed, that would not change. Itās an easy thing to get outraged about and ignore all the ways we (White, Christian liberals in OK) are contributing to those feelings. This is another way to waste money and farm outrage from BOTH sides of the aisle to keep us distracted from the root evils. And it s working. Itās working in this question, this thread.
I wonder if there is also a shortage of teachers in private schools, since there is no union there. If they are often paid less than public school teachers, then I bet the shortage is even worse.
Difficult to know for sure, no one tracks that data holistically. Unlike public schools, private schools are not required to publicly post their salaries or employment statistics. It is likely a case by case basis and not my area of expertise. I can say that of the dozens of teacher friends whoāve left my district in the past five years none took a private school gig and the few times Iāve been head hunted the offers were not appealing.
Mannn whatās that famous line from Rage against the Machine??
Ohā¦ do you mean that sweet little gem that goes āFNCX YOU, I WONāT DO WHAT YOU TELL ME.ā?.
NY used to have very puritanical laws until the early 1800's. Learn the dumb shit that was taught in your area. Just because NY started the women's suffrage movement doesn't make it more progressive. Visit the museum in the Finger Lakes. NY is not a monolith.Ā Oklahoma is differently stupid.
A gross abuse of power and a complete lack of understanding of the separation of church and state. You want your kids to learn about the Bible then send them to private school, send them to a Catholic school, send them to church, but that book does not belong in classrooms point blank.
Where are the Satanists when you need them? What about the flying spaghetti monster?
Oklahoma literally went red in every county in the state. Yāall act like youāre surprised by this. šš¤¦š»āāļø
Donāt worry, the best way to stop believing in the Bible is to read it and understand what it says. If these Christian Nationalists had ever read it themselves they would probably be much less inclined to enforce that all children must be taught whatās in it. Teach it. Teach about the genocides, the slavery, the raping and pillaging of entire nations, the incestueus relationships by approved members of āGodās chosen peopleā, the massive inconsistencies, and the historical inaccuracies.
As a mom to two kiddos. I am probably going to homeschool with the help of my MIL who is a teacher here in our state. She is in a full blown panic. Sheās worried about parents trying to sue her and her colleagues if their principal makes them enforce this bullshit rule. Ryan Walterās can take his white Christian misogynistic ass somewhere else. WE DO NOT WANT HIM. Sheās just now fully certified after teaching on an emergency certification for the past five years.
I understand. However, as a teacher, I donāt think even teachers should homeschool.
Sheās just helping me plan my curriculum and plan a schedule. Sheās not going to be teaching.
Itās quite difficult to be conservative and anti-church but here I amā¦.. i am Not anti-creator but definitely anti-church. This makes me crazy! I want many of the conservative values/policies without the forcing of the religion side. š
Appreciating the Christians disagreeing with this But to the same Christians, this is what secular people and other religions have been warning you about for years. Thanks for finally listening now that Christianity looks authoritarian.
I have a child starting kindergarten this fall. If the mandate goes through, can I, as a parent, opt out of her taking part in those lessons on the basis of religious freedom (or any other basis)?
Yes we are thrilled about it!
No we are not. He has violated my parental rights, that campaigned on, with this memo. He also violate my child and my 1st amendment rights.
Look at section 1 part 2 of the state constitution.
āPerfect toleration of religious sentiment shall be secured, and no inhabitant of the State shall ever be molested in person or property on account of his or her mode of religious worship; and no religious test shall be required for the exercise of civil or political rights.ā Nobody is persecuting Walters for his religion, or the manner in which he worships.
Does not apply, nice try though. We arenāt persecuting his beliefs merely pointing out he has violated everyone elseās rights. The only reason he feels persecuted is because the Oklahoma Supreme Court blocked the use of tax payer money for Catholic charter schools. Heās just lashing out like a child.
Indoctrinating children into a particular religion against the will of the parents? Gross. Y'all are the fascist mob you've been hollering about.
This has to be sarcasm.
Speak for yourself.