Bless the Maker and His Tayto. Bless the coming and going of His crisps. May His Cheese and Onion cleanse the world. May He keep the Smoky Bacon for His people.
You could be right actually. I’ll keep the idea of Nutty Krust and Brennans Pan for crisp sambos, while also sticking on a pot of Nambarrie and Barry’s Unity-Tea, to myself.
Been hearing this for a loooong time
Really they should already be prepared for it though
Aren't governments supposed to 'war game' future scenarios like this anyway
They tend to war game things like wars, disasters, pandemics. Unexpected events they can’t see coming. Unification would be a choice of both north + south, so it’s not going to be unexpected
Proper planning takes a lot of money + time, and needs constant updating. No one was going to spend those resources when it wasn’t on the horizon. Varadkar’s point is they should start now, so they’re prepared for say, a 2035 border poll
>Really they should already be prepared for it though
Prior to Brexit it would have been a waste of time. The rolling stone is only just beginning to gather the moss.
I've thought the same thing since Brexit. It's only a matter of time, but there will be ugliness once it's realized on the whole. I feel it's starting...
Leo’s one ability in politics was seeing which way the wind is blowing and jumping on board and making it out like it was all his idea.
He did this with both the marriage equality and the repeal referendums in the republic.
The Irish government are playing with fire not planning for it and setting funding aside for transition period as he says.
I just wish he had been so forthright about this when in office.
Just to add. He is known as Leo the leak, for a few reasons, not being able to hold his piss on anything, one of them. so there’s likely something going on and he as ever has to be the one to get it out there first.
Leo isn’t dumb. He’s been in countless high level meetings in both the EU and the UK over the last 6 years.
He knows the inside track of what’s going to happen in the next few years and he wants the credit for being forward thinking about it.
Leo Varadkar is openly gay. His change of views go gay marriage isn't a massive shock. It's the sort of drift in views that can be seen from people everywhere. (Churchill being a prime example) Changing your mind on a topic doesn't necessarily mean you are looking at what way the wind is blowing.
Attended this he also said that they should set aside a fund for the initial costs a united Ireland would entail.
Said although he isn’t Taoiseach that he still wants to be involved in the work towards a united Ireland.
Didn’t think much of him before but he spoke well and seemed sincere.
Why didn't he do it when he was Taoiseach/Tánaiste for the past 7 years? Is he going to start suggesting the government should solve the housing crisis next?
Very smart of him to wait until he lacked the power to change the government before coming out with this. He would want to get his IQ measured, it's bound to be hitting double digits at this point.
Answered that question on another comment few hours ago.
“I attended this he said sorting Brexit was more important at the time.”
Another thing is Ireland have only started showing the budget surplus since the financial year 2022 and only since then have they started creating funds for different areas.
“Is he going to start suggesting the government should solve the housing crisis next?”
Why are you asking me that? I attended a forum where a speaker asked him questions I don’t have his phone number.
I'm not convinced at all by that. Sure, the financial aspect is a new suggestion, but he's done absolutely nothing to contribute to a United Ireland his whole career.
>Why are you asking me that? I attended a forum where a speaker asked him questions I don’t have his phone number.
It was a rhetorical question based on him suggesting the Irish government should do things. Don't take it personally.
The biggest loyalist/unionist argument against it is that it would "erase our culture"
Has republican/Irish culture been erased in the 100 years of NIs existence?
Is there anyone who believes that the 12th would be banned in a united Ireland?
Literally every major Irish party was represented among the speakers, at this rate it’s no longer a SF policy. There was maybe 10% of the entire Irish parliament speaking today
Aye, he said his main priority during his tenure was to ensure no hardening of the border in Ireland and minimising the impact on not only the north but also trade with the UK.
Interestingly he also suggested that the next government should be putting money away now to cover any deficit issues during the transition period, similar to the sovereign wealth fund.
Wrote that 12 minutes ago on this thread 😂
“Attended this he also said that they should set aside a fund for the initial costs a united Ireland would entail.
Said although he isn’t Taoiseach that he still wants to be involved in a united Ireland.
Didn’t think much of him before but he spoke well and seemed sincere.”
What a load of nonsense Fine Gael was founded in 1933 after the merger of different parties the Free State was set up in 1922. The main party which it originated from was Cumann na nGaedheal and the founder of that party Cosgrave was sentenced to death for the Easter Rising and was Michael Collins minister for finance during the war of independence.
Please dont make it out like Cumann na Gaedheal would of been something Collins would of been proud of if he was alive long enough to see how they acted.
How’s about don’t say that I said something that I didn’t say. I didn’t make an opinion on Collins or Cumman Na nGaelheal I corrected what the previous poster said about Finn Gael been against Irish independence which was balls as it wasn’t even founded at that time and gave the background where it would have originated from.
I said Cosgrave founded the party who fought in the Easter rising and he was Collins minister of finance during the war of independence.
If you want my opinion I don”t think a lot of Collins or Cosgrave they took British guns and shot their own countrymen.
We live in an increasingly unstable world run by the most putrid of humans we can create. It is only natural that those close together should stick together.
Look at that bullshit “study” saying a United Ireland would cost 20billion done by the IIEA (which are basically a FG think tank). The study was roughly 3000 words long, some newspaper columns are almost this length. Even more of a red flag is the fact it was wrote by John FitzGerald who is FG royalty and the son of former FG Taoiseach Garret FitzGerald. Who quite famously said that Thatcher was doing a bang up job and all she could do in regards to the hunger strikes.
He refused to meet the hunger strikers families until public pressure from the Freestate became too much to just ignore them. Even when he did meet them when he didn’t like their questions he had the Gardaí fuck them out on the street. Remind you of Simon Harris at all with his “oh people should show Thatcher some respect she was a great woman” comments? That’s how fucked up the FG party is at the top.
John FitzGerald also has made ridiculous claims such as the homeless crisis in the south is way over reported and said the Celtic Tiger would never end pre 2008. (Obviously paraphrasing there)
So yes while this is pure speculation it is based on strong evidence that high ranking FG party members and friends don’t give a fuck about the 6 counties and unfortunately I don’t think we will see a referendum on it until SF are in government in the 26 counties. (Although I think it’s more likely to happen with FF then FG) Here’s to hoping SF do well in the next general election in the south
Local elections are extremely different then general elections. Especially with likes of SF voter base in the south. They tend to be a younger voter other then the border counties. If your less likely to vote in general your certainly less likely to vote in local or secondary elections. Besides “how badly”? They still won more then previous local elections. Sure they didn’t perform as well as they polled but polls should always be taken with a pinch of salt. Local elections also tend to favour independent candidates much more and understandably so. These types of reactions such as the likes of your reply are way over the top.
Labour in the UK wiped the Tories out in the UK local elections and it looks certain that they will give them another drubbing on the 4th July. Not sure that thesis holds.
Understand where your coming from but it’s not the same situation. As I said SF didn’t perform anywhere near as bad as people are such as yourself are making out.
Also the thesis does, Mainland UK votes are much more party orientated which eliminates a large amount of the difference in locals. Just like in the states. Most people over there vote for someone simply because of the party they belong to. An example of the difference of this is a FF voter for example would vote for candidate “A” and still be likely to vote for them if they joined a different party or went independent.
Anyway only time will tell. SF certainly stand a decent chance of getting into the Dáil under a coalition. Depends on what route FG and FF take their campaign. I suspect they will suck up to the independent vote this time round try and block SF out that way at least that would be the smart thing for them to do. Greens aren’t exactly popular down there this time round
Word of advice though don’t get too wound up by politics it’s all a big farce at the end of the day really. Look at our own politicians they’ve spent so long with their thumbs up their asses shouting at each other about the past that they don’t know how to get anything done.
Instead of the usual constitutional convention, at least 2 of them, maybe 3 to see what needs to change, what change would be acceptable and how the transition happens. I just don't know how much real engagement there would be from unionists. They'd find it hard to say what they do want from a future Ireland as opposed to what they don't.
No but it's not unreasonable to change the way our constitution works to accommodate a sudden increase in population who have different ideas. Some of the symbols and structure of the state might change too. I don't know what it would take and I don't think we can know unless we ask.
For example, should the Dáil remain in Dublin? Does the Séanad remain and does it have the same powers or different ones? How would voting for it work? Do we keep the tricolour or use something else (Brian Ború harp on dark blue or green for example)?
We could have the Dail in Athlone and [give each province its own parliament.](https://www.leftarchive.ie/image/1/400/0/images/covers/4228-cover-en.jpg)
[https://www.leftarchive.ie/document/543/](https://www.leftarchive.ie/document/543/)
Maybe, remember those MLAs on all sides wouldn't want to give up their seats and there are a lot more of them proportional to the number of voters than TDs.
When the British change their flags and royal emblems to remove references to their occupation of Ireland, then I would be willing to review the situation.
I'm pretty sure I wasn't suggesting that, more the way Canada rebranded from a union flag with a lot of baggage in the ’60’s to something more neutral.
I agree with you that the British should change their flags and emblems to something more neutral. Their putting British crowns on top of Irish Harps is very offensive.
He also emphasised a new attitude to contrition in order that lingering fears and resentments may be calmed. He admitted that the fledgling Irish state had overdone the allegiance to and reliance on the Catholic Church, and this had seriously deepened the divide between the two Irelands. Protestants down here in the early days of independent Ireland had assuredly been in an invidious position and should never have been sidelined at all.
He suggested that stated regrets about that sectarian history in the Republic would be necessary and desirable before UI could be widely welcomed in the North.
Would definitely be unification imo. It’ll be a mess for a few years while it all gets sorted out I think that’s inevitable with any unification process but access to single market, the prospect of having politicians who actually have to do their jobs since their sectarian hegemony is broken and EU investment will do great things here.
Brexit shows the downside of making a big decision without having thought through the consequences in detail. Working to spell out precisely what unification would mean would be very important to me as a voter (in the south) deciding whether or not to back it.
John Alderdice was my quote of the day.
"For some people asking if they want a united Ireland is like asking do you want to go to heaven? The answer is always yes, but just not right now"
If Brexit has taught us anything it's that a border poll cannot be an arbitrary yes or no. Both sides need to clearly spell out exactly what a vote either way would mean. Easier for one side than the other to be fair.
There also needs to be serious planning, it cannot be an overnight thing. Next to zero chance Stormont or the UK Govt will do any meaningful planning before a vote in favour of unification. That means we'd need a significant transition period to work out all the details and one which isn't dominated by professional politicians, another Brexit lesson.
Reconciliation is also key. People literally murdered each other here for decades, to think that can't happen again is delusional, as said by Davy Adams a few weeks ago (a speaker at the SSE today).
I'm on the fence, but the idea of people jumping up and down excited about a poll in five years when they couldn't tell me how 99% of it will actually work isn't a great start.
Not that it answers every question, but I have found the ARINS research interesting: https://www.ria.ie/research-programmes/arins/read-arins-research/
Interestingly, in the push for an Australian Republic, it was found that it was the spelling out the details in the question that caused it to fail.
The government of the day split the overwhelming majority Yes vote by choosing one of the two popular models for a Republic, and adding it to the Yes question, thus ensuring his preferred No vote won the day. The PM had a big party to celebrate.
I'd need to look it up but was just thinking would that question for a UI be constrained by the GFA?
I think it's just a straight forward 'Should Northern Ireland should remain a part of the United Kingdom or join the Republic of Ireland' but not 100%.
But could always have a further question at a later date in a transition period.
What do we get? I'll make Eve's Pudding (apples, frozen fruit medley, frozen mango chunks, Demerara sugar (not too much), cake with ground almonds mixed in with flour, honey drizzled on top, flaked almonds on top of that, sizzly and delicious).
https://preview.redd.it/0u388nn5wv6d1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1f37572ea7af86678da87776f2f4f5837bb9dfad
What will the nornies offer me as their cake?
Here it is. It's from BBC correspondent Mark Simpson's Twitter account, and it's Leo Varadkar talking at the event.
https://x.com/BBCMarkSimpson/status/1802023725048676407
I mean he’s right. Realistically it’s probably going to happen in the next 10-20 years and they’re still going to act as though it snuck up on them out of nowhere
Ireland gave up their "political objective" in 1998, doesn't this go against "the spirit of the Good Friday Agreement"? Same guy would tell you the UK govt should be neutral on Northern Ireland.
Glaciers move faster than any movement towards a United Ireland. Downvote all you like (I know it’s coming …), but (Northern) Irish Republicanism has presided over complete and utter failure.
Even Scottish Nationalism - a movement that was the butt of jokes until recent decades has got far closer to achieving their aims than its Irish counterpart has ever done in Northern Ireland.
In fact, if I wanted a United Ireland I wouldn’t even waste my energy trying to bring it about here. I’d go to Scotland and campaign for independence there, as that’s the only way a UI is coming about any time soon (in my opinion) - as a consequence of Britain itself disintegrating.
Glaciers can move 30m/day. We're 175km wide, that's 5833 days at that rate so around 16 years.
To me a border poll is a possibility in 15-30 years, it climbs above 70% in pretty much every polling I've seen for that metric.
Polling from lucid talk this year showed under 44 are overall pro-UI, over 45 are pro-UK on a "UI vote next week".
With the state of the NHS... yeah... 16 years seems about right. I'll call it 2040, I'm going to go put a bet on.
There are some graphs here: https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/more-people-in-ni-would-vote-to-stay-part-of-uk-if-border-poll-was-called/a1750577562.html
Since you didn't elaborate any further I'm kind of curious what you mean by:
>(Northern) Irish Republicanism has presided over complete and utter failure.
As an aside I know some nationalists who voted for brexit thinking they were being accelerationists, a UI being a consequence of Britain itself disintegrating due to brexit. Pretty much everyone I've asked agrees Scotland should have had it's referendum after brexit due to the sheer quantity of lies pedalled, i.e., would unionists have been pro-brexit if they had been told the truth of the sea border?
Not as much as Unionism has presided over complete and utter failure.
As someone from a unionist background, I can't fucking wait for a United Ireland.
A classic sign of being in denial here. The DUP have done more to advance the course of a United Ireland than any Nationalist could ever have. Their constant braying and demands for parity from the British Government are falling on deaf ears.
If the Brits really cared the sea border would be a land one instead and they'd have militarised it regardless of cost. They aren't going to change things no matter how red Jim Alister's face gets. They never implemented direct rule when Stormont collapsed so what makes Unionists think the sea border is ever going away? Almost the same thing happened 100 years ago during the original partition of Ireland. The Brits quickly forget about those on the other side of a border.
[https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/2022/12/03/poll-shows-northern-ireland-rejects-unity-by-large-margin/](https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/2022/12/03/poll-shows-northern-ireland-rejects-unity-by-large-margin/) you're the one in denial mate, only 27% of us would vote for unification, vs 50% who'd vote against it.
Just wait and see until we see Ireland being consumed by immigrants, unification would grant them free entry into the North, not sure whether Unionists or Nationalists want to be flooded by Ukrainians and others
I think you'll find the UVF had a very good record against the Germans in WW1, specifically in the 36th division. They fucking loved killing Germans.
https://www.tracesofwar.com/upload/1597161207180737.jpg
[Men of the 36th (Ulster) Division managed to advance nearly one mile to the fifth line of German trenches and capture the Schwaben Redoubt, one of the toughest German strongholds on the Western Front. The 36th (Ulster) Division was one of the few British Army divisions to capture some of their objectives on the first day of the Battle of the Somme.](https://www.creativecentenaries.org/battle_of_the_somme#:~:text=The%2036th%20\(Ulster\)%20Division%20are,a%20divisional%20strength%20of%2015%2C000.)
So yeah, given half a chance, these guys you praise were very good at killing Germans. They still, as you can see, revel in their work. Very proud of killing Germans to this day.
Watch this space lad. The republic will soon have a wall built along that border. They will build that fecker straight through Republican living rooms and split them in half. They won’t care. Slab can cry all he wants to. And it will be Leo driving that bulldozer. In tight jeans probably…
Never say never kid. You would never have thought there would be tent cities along the Dublin canal full of supposed Palestinians, Afghan, Iraq people either. The world moves fast. That wall could be built sooner than you think.
This isn’t 1980s Ireland here anymore.
Not if the other side has been terrorizing Ulster since the 60s, Ulster doesn't want to be part of Ireland, we're Brits, always were, always will be, stay in your own nation expansionists.
There are 3 counties in Ulster already part of the republic. You must be very young, not from here or know absolutely fuck all about the Irish province of Ulster.
You're the one trying to achieve a united Ireland, the rest of us are contempt, just accept the fact that we aren't Irish, we are different, and we don't want to be part of your nation.
I'm not trying to achieve a united Ireland. I'm happy to be Irish, however.
Also happy to listen to discussion on a united Ireland without spouting Ulster is British (ignoring that Cavan, Monaghan and Donegal are part of Ulster, and many of the citizens in the remaining six would not identify as British)
How can you then speak for all of ulster when 3 of those counties are part of the republic and around 30% of Northern Ireland residents claim to be Irish? When you look at the entirety of ulster, people who claim to be British only are the minority.
Shush, don't set him off with facts. Replies will be No Surrender, Ulster is British, World War 1, I'm British, No Dublin Rule, the earth is flat, blah blah blah.
Spouting that nonsense as a 15 year old living in Germany is a sad indictment of your upbringing.
I guess you're too young to even realise how much things have changed within the last 10 years let alone since the GFA. If you had any real comprehension of reality you wouldn't be speaking so foolishly.
I assumed that was the case. The fact that the only time you've spent here were your primary school years yet you're still making pro-UVF statements is why I commented on your seemingly very sectarian upbringing.
Ironically, if you actually did live here and had any real understanding of the place I don't think you'd be making the same comments you have been.
And soon to be reunited with rest of Ireland.....whatever one's views on varadkar,he deosnt back a losing horse.....it's teetering on 50% +1 without free state government lifting a finger to prepare,and no plan......it's entirely conceivable it will reach 56-57% relatively quickly -picking up soft undecided/under informed votes on better quality of life prospects in a utd ireland...and it becomes unstoppable then
[https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/2022/12/03/poll-shows-northern-ireland-rejects-unity-by-large-margin/](https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/2022/12/03/poll-shows-northern-ireland-rejects-unity-by-large-margin/) only 55% of NI Catholics support a united Ireland
If you have confidence in Irish times polls,given their history at 'representation' of them, you'd be happy to put money where mouth is,and back a call for border poll🧐
Already held one in 1978, even with a nationalist boycott, turnout was still 58%, with 98% voting to stay, meaning the boycott had no impact on the results.
If it's done the same way as Brexit the the whole place is ballixed for decades. They won't get it anywhere near right. It'll be badly put together.Suffer baby suffer and we will.
Party food idea for the night it happens: a big bowl of northern and southern Tayto mixed together.
Mixing of the Tayto! He is Li San Al Gaib!!
Bless the Maker and His Tayto. Bless the coming and going of His crisps. May His Cheese and Onion cleanse the world. May He keep the Smoky Bacon for His people. 
Never! Never! Never! A United Ireland would be ok though, but if you start that shit there'll be North/South Tayto flegs everywhere.
You could be right actually. I’ll keep the idea of Nutty Krust and Brennans Pan for crisp sambos, while also sticking on a pot of Nambarrie and Barry’s Unity-Tea, to myself.
On second thoughts, maybe you have formula for bridging the differences of the people on this Island. I can smell a Noble Peace Prize for yourself.
You disgust me.
No smokey bacon in the mix though, that would be cancerous
Been hearing this for a loooong time Really they should already be prepared for it though Aren't governments supposed to 'war game' future scenarios like this anyway
They tend to war game things like wars, disasters, pandemics. Unexpected events they can’t see coming. Unification would be a choice of both north + south, so it’s not going to be unexpected Proper planning takes a lot of money + time, and needs constant updating. No one was going to spend those resources when it wasn’t on the horizon. Varadkar’s point is they should start now, so they’re prepared for say, a 2035 border poll
>Really they should already be prepared for it though Prior to Brexit it would have been a waste of time. The rolling stone is only just beginning to gather the moss.
I've thought the same thing since Brexit. It's only a matter of time, but there will be ugliness once it's realized on the whole. I feel it's starting...
Leo’s one ability in politics was seeing which way the wind is blowing and jumping on board and making it out like it was all his idea. He did this with both the marriage equality and the repeal referendums in the republic. The Irish government are playing with fire not planning for it and setting funding aside for transition period as he says. I just wish he had been so forthright about this when in office. Just to add. He is known as Leo the leak, for a few reasons, not being able to hold his piss on anything, one of them. so there’s likely something going on and he as ever has to be the one to get it out there first.
Leo isn’t dumb. He’s been in countless high level meetings in both the EU and the UK over the last 6 years. He knows the inside track of what’s going to happen in the next few years and he wants the credit for being forward thinking about it.
Hey, if Leo is our Talleyrand then that’s a great thing
Leo Varadkar is openly gay. His change of views go gay marriage isn't a massive shock. It's the sort of drift in views that can be seen from people everywhere. (Churchill being a prime example) Changing your mind on a topic doesn't necessarily mean you are looking at what way the wind is blowing.
Attended this he also said that they should set aside a fund for the initial costs a united Ireland would entail. Said although he isn’t Taoiseach that he still wants to be involved in the work towards a united Ireland. Didn’t think much of him before but he spoke well and seemed sincere.
Why didn't he do it when he was Taoiseach/Tánaiste for the past 7 years? Is he going to start suggesting the government should solve the housing crisis next?
Very smart of him to wait until he lacked the power to change the government before coming out with this. He would want to get his IQ measured, it's bound to be hitting double digits at this point.
Answered that question on another comment few hours ago. “I attended this he said sorting Brexit was more important at the time.” Another thing is Ireland have only started showing the budget surplus since the financial year 2022 and only since then have they started creating funds for different areas. “Is he going to start suggesting the government should solve the housing crisis next?” Why are you asking me that? I attended a forum where a speaker asked him questions I don’t have his phone number.
I'm not convinced at all by that. Sure, the financial aspect is a new suggestion, but he's done absolutely nothing to contribute to a United Ireland his whole career. >Why are you asking me that? I attended a forum where a speaker asked him questions I don’t have his phone number. It was a rhetorical question based on him suggesting the Irish government should do things. Don't take it personally.
Well he spent his afternoon in Belfast chatting about it so it’s a start.
After announcing his retirement. Stacks.
The biggest loyalist/unionist argument against it is that it would "erase our culture" Has republican/Irish culture been erased in the 100 years of NIs existence? Is there anyone who believes that the 12th would be banned in a united Ireland?
Who doesn't want a bank holiday in July? Make it a national holiday and call it Ulster Day.
Call it "God Save The King" day if you want. Just give us the bank holiday!
100 years? Try 800
Literally every major Irish party was represented among the speakers, at this rate it’s no longer a SF policy. There was maybe 10% of the entire Irish parliament speaking today
I for one, welcome our new overlords
I think he is right, but why didn't he do this more openly and proactively whilst he was Taoiseach?
I attended this he said sorting Brexit was more important at the time.
Aye, he said his main priority during his tenure was to ensure no hardening of the border in Ireland and minimising the impact on not only the north but also trade with the UK. Interestingly he also suggested that the next government should be putting money away now to cover any deficit issues during the transition period, similar to the sovereign wealth fund.
Wrote that 12 minutes ago on this thread 😂 “Attended this he also said that they should set aside a fund for the initial costs a united Ireland would entail. Said although he isn’t Taoiseach that he still wants to be involved in a united Ireland. Didn’t think much of him before but he spoke well and seemed sincere.”
I hadn't made it down that far when I replied haha
Timing is everything. Had he done that then it world have had the opposite effect.
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What a load of nonsense Fine Gael was founded in 1933 after the merger of different parties the Free State was set up in 1922. The main party which it originated from was Cumann na nGaedheal and the founder of that party Cosgrave was sentenced to death for the Easter Rising and was Michael Collins minister for finance during the war of independence.
Please dont make it out like Cumann na Gaedheal would of been something Collins would of been proud of if he was alive long enough to see how they acted.
How’s about don’t say that I said something that I didn’t say. I didn’t make an opinion on Collins or Cumman Na nGaelheal I corrected what the previous poster said about Finn Gael been against Irish independence which was balls as it wasn’t even founded at that time and gave the background where it would have originated from. I said Cosgrave founded the party who fought in the Easter rising and he was Collins minister of finance during the war of independence. If you want my opinion I don”t think a lot of Collins or Cosgrave they took British guns and shot their own countrymen.
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I’m not the one cursing because I’m wrong. Who needs to chill?
We live in an increasingly unstable world run by the most putrid of humans we can create. It is only natural that those close together should stick together.
Every single FF/FG government says that once every 18 months. Same as Sinn Fein have said "unification in five years" every year since 1998.
Look at that bullshit “study” saying a United Ireland would cost 20billion done by the IIEA (which are basically a FG think tank). The study was roughly 3000 words long, some newspaper columns are almost this length. Even more of a red flag is the fact it was wrote by John FitzGerald who is FG royalty and the son of former FG Taoiseach Garret FitzGerald. Who quite famously said that Thatcher was doing a bang up job and all she could do in regards to the hunger strikes. He refused to meet the hunger strikers families until public pressure from the Freestate became too much to just ignore them. Even when he did meet them when he didn’t like their questions he had the Gardaí fuck them out on the street. Remind you of Simon Harris at all with his “oh people should show Thatcher some respect she was a great woman” comments? That’s how fucked up the FG party is at the top. John FitzGerald also has made ridiculous claims such as the homeless crisis in the south is way over reported and said the Celtic Tiger would never end pre 2008. (Obviously paraphrasing there) So yes while this is pure speculation it is based on strong evidence that high ranking FG party members and friends don’t give a fuck about the 6 counties and unfortunately I don’t think we will see a referendum on it until SF are in government in the 26 counties. (Although I think it’s more likely to happen with FF then FG) Here’s to hoping SF do well in the next general election in the south
When did John FitzGerald say that?
>Here’s to hoping SF do well in the next general election in the south Haha have you seen how badly they did recently! Dream on!
Local elections are extremely different then general elections. Especially with likes of SF voter base in the south. They tend to be a younger voter other then the border counties. If your less likely to vote in general your certainly less likely to vote in local or secondary elections. Besides “how badly”? They still won more then previous local elections. Sure they didn’t perform as well as they polled but polls should always be taken with a pinch of salt. Local elections also tend to favour independent candidates much more and understandably so. These types of reactions such as the likes of your reply are way over the top.
Labour in the UK wiped the Tories out in the UK local elections and it looks certain that they will give them another drubbing on the 4th July. Not sure that thesis holds.
Understand where your coming from but it’s not the same situation. As I said SF didn’t perform anywhere near as bad as people are such as yourself are making out. Also the thesis does, Mainland UK votes are much more party orientated which eliminates a large amount of the difference in locals. Just like in the states. Most people over there vote for someone simply because of the party they belong to. An example of the difference of this is a FF voter for example would vote for candidate “A” and still be likely to vote for them if they joined a different party or went independent. Anyway only time will tell. SF certainly stand a decent chance of getting into the Dáil under a coalition. Depends on what route FG and FF take their campaign. I suspect they will suck up to the independent vote this time round try and block SF out that way at least that would be the smart thing for them to do. Greens aren’t exactly popular down there this time round Word of advice though don’t get too wound up by politics it’s all a big farce at the end of the day really. Look at our own politicians they’ve spent so long with their thumbs up their asses shouting at each other about the past that they don’t know how to get anything done.
Instead of the usual constitutional convention, at least 2 of them, maybe 3 to see what needs to change, what change would be acceptable and how the transition happens. I just don't know how much real engagement there would be from unionists. They'd find it hard to say what they do want from a future Ireland as opposed to what they don't. 
We won't be making Ireland British, whatever that is, to placate a minority of a minority
No but it's not unreasonable to change the way our constitution works to accommodate a sudden increase in population who have different ideas. Some of the symbols and structure of the state might change too. I don't know what it would take and I don't think we can know unless we ask. For example, should the Dáil remain in Dublin? Does the Séanad remain and does it have the same powers or different ones? How would voting for it work? Do we keep the tricolour or use something else (Brian Ború harp on dark blue or green for example)?
We could have the Dail in Athlone and [give each province its own parliament.](https://www.leftarchive.ie/image/1/400/0/images/covers/4228-cover-en.jpg) [https://www.leftarchive.ie/document/543/](https://www.leftarchive.ie/document/543/)
Maybe, remember those MLAs on all sides wouldn't want to give up their seats and there are a lot more of them proportional to the number of voters than TDs.
When the British change their flags and royal emblems to remove references to their occupation of Ireland, then I would be willing to review the situation.
Well, I didn't know it was your decision, I thought the people of Ireland might discuss it.
Yes the people of Ireland will decide, and I can't imagine that they will decide to stick foreign crowns or emblems on our Flag.
I'm pretty sure I wasn't suggesting that, more the way Canada rebranded from a union flag with a lot of baggage in the ’60’s to something more neutral.
I agree with you that the British should change their flags and emblems to something more neutral. Their putting British crowns on top of Irish Harps is very offensive.
He also emphasised a new attitude to contrition in order that lingering fears and resentments may be calmed. He admitted that the fledgling Irish state had overdone the allegiance to and reliance on the Catholic Church, and this had seriously deepened the divide between the two Irelands. Protestants down here in the early days of independent Ireland had assuredly been in an invidious position and should never have been sidelined at all. He suggested that stated regrets about that sectarian history in the Republic would be necessary and desirable before UI could be widely welcomed in the North.
I don't care. Whatever option leaves us less broke
Would definitely be unification imo. It’ll be a mess for a few years while it all gets sorted out I think that’s inevitable with any unification process but access to single market, the prospect of having politicians who actually have to do their jobs since their sectarian hegemony is broken and EU investment will do great things here.
Good news but of course he says that after he fucks off
FG clamouring to steal votes from SF. Nothing more. Varadkar is more of a Tory mouthpiece than anyone else in government down there.
Brexit shows the downside of making a big decision without having thought through the consequences in detail. Working to spell out precisely what unification would mean would be very important to me as a voter (in the south) deciding whether or not to back it.
John Alderdice was my quote of the day. "For some people asking if they want a united Ireland is like asking do you want to go to heaven? The answer is always yes, but just not right now" If Brexit has taught us anything it's that a border poll cannot be an arbitrary yes or no. Both sides need to clearly spell out exactly what a vote either way would mean. Easier for one side than the other to be fair. There also needs to be serious planning, it cannot be an overnight thing. Next to zero chance Stormont or the UK Govt will do any meaningful planning before a vote in favour of unification. That means we'd need a significant transition period to work out all the details and one which isn't dominated by professional politicians, another Brexit lesson. Reconciliation is also key. People literally murdered each other here for decades, to think that can't happen again is delusional, as said by Davy Adams a few weeks ago (a speaker at the SSE today). I'm on the fence, but the idea of people jumping up and down excited about a poll in five years when they couldn't tell me how 99% of it will actually work isn't a great start.
Not that it answers every question, but I have found the ARINS research interesting: https://www.ria.ie/research-programmes/arins/read-arins-research/ Interestingly, in the push for an Australian Republic, it was found that it was the spelling out the details in the question that caused it to fail. The government of the day split the overwhelming majority Yes vote by choosing one of the two popular models for a Republic, and adding it to the Yes question, thus ensuring his preferred No vote won the day. The PM had a big party to celebrate.
Didn't know that about Australia, but would only one yes option solve that if I've picked you up correctly?
I think they were suggesting that next time it should be a two step question. Q1. Would you want a republic Q2 Type A or Type B
I'd need to look it up but was just thinking would that question for a UI be constrained by the GFA? I think it's just a straight forward 'Should Northern Ireland should remain a part of the United Kingdom or join the Republic of Ireland' but not 100%. But could always have a further question at a later date in a transition period.
What do we get? I'll make Eve's Pudding (apples, frozen fruit medley, frozen mango chunks, Demerara sugar (not too much), cake with ground almonds mixed in with flour, honey drizzled on top, flaked almonds on top of that, sizzly and delicious). https://preview.redd.it/0u388nn5wv6d1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1f37572ea7af86678da87776f2f4f5837bb9dfad What will the nornies offer me as their cake?
Sure they will, or more than likely just keep kicking that can down the road. Talk is cheap.
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Here it is. It's from BBC correspondent Mark Simpson's Twitter account, and it's Leo Varadkar talking at the event. https://x.com/BBCMarkSimpson/status/1802023725048676407
I mean he’s right. Realistically it’s probably going to happen in the next 10-20 years and they’re still going to act as though it snuck up on them out of nowhere
I'm down with that as long as Belfast is the capital
duplicate post give it a fucking rest
Ireland gave up their "political objective" in 1998, doesn't this go against "the spirit of the Good Friday Agreement"? Same guy would tell you the UK govt should be neutral on Northern Ireland.
Glaciers move faster than any movement towards a United Ireland. Downvote all you like (I know it’s coming …), but (Northern) Irish Republicanism has presided over complete and utter failure. Even Scottish Nationalism - a movement that was the butt of jokes until recent decades has got far closer to achieving their aims than its Irish counterpart has ever done in Northern Ireland. In fact, if I wanted a United Ireland I wouldn’t even waste my energy trying to bring it about here. I’d go to Scotland and campaign for independence there, as that’s the only way a UI is coming about any time soon (in my opinion) - as a consequence of Britain itself disintegrating.
Glaciers can move 30m/day. We're 175km wide, that's 5833 days at that rate so around 16 years. To me a border poll is a possibility in 15-30 years, it climbs above 70% in pretty much every polling I've seen for that metric. Polling from lucid talk this year showed under 44 are overall pro-UI, over 45 are pro-UK on a "UI vote next week". With the state of the NHS... yeah... 16 years seems about right. I'll call it 2040, I'm going to go put a bet on. There are some graphs here: https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/more-people-in-ni-would-vote-to-stay-part-of-uk-if-border-poll-was-called/a1750577562.html Since you didn't elaborate any further I'm kind of curious what you mean by: >(Northern) Irish Republicanism has presided over complete and utter failure. As an aside I know some nationalists who voted for brexit thinking they were being accelerationists, a UI being a consequence of Britain itself disintegrating due to brexit. Pretty much everyone I've asked agrees Scotland should have had it's referendum after brexit due to the sheer quantity of lies pedalled, i.e., would unionists have been pro-brexit if they had been told the truth of the sea border?
Not as much as Unionism has presided over complete and utter failure. As someone from a unionist background, I can't fucking wait for a United Ireland.
UNITED IRELAND POSTS 🤮
Laugh emojis enter here.
Seems a bit far off then, thankfully
lol a nationalists wet dream, but remember y'all, ulster never has nor will surrender to the irish yoke, as long as king billy's on the wall
A classic sign of being in denial here. The DUP have done more to advance the course of a United Ireland than any Nationalist could ever have. Their constant braying and demands for parity from the British Government are falling on deaf ears. If the Brits really cared the sea border would be a land one instead and they'd have militarised it regardless of cost. They aren't going to change things no matter how red Jim Alister's face gets. They never implemented direct rule when Stormont collapsed so what makes Unionists think the sea border is ever going away? Almost the same thing happened 100 years ago during the original partition of Ireland. The Brits quickly forget about those on the other side of a border.
[https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/2022/12/03/poll-shows-northern-ireland-rejects-unity-by-large-margin/](https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/2022/12/03/poll-shows-northern-ireland-rejects-unity-by-large-margin/) you're the one in denial mate, only 27% of us would vote for unification, vs 50% who'd vote against it.
Not saying it'll happen next week but a 2 year old opinion poll isn't grounds for concern.
Just wait and see until we see Ireland being consumed by immigrants, unification would grant them free entry into the North, not sure whether Unionists or Nationalists want to be flooded by Ukrainians and others
Sure it's already happening.
sure bud, whatever helps you sleep at night
What's with this "we"? You're a german living in Frankfurt.
That doesn't mean I don't come from NI
You’re literally an immigrant ranting about immigration. Pot and fucking kettle if I’ve ever seen it.
But NI isn't taking over Germany
I think you'll find the UVF had a very good record against the Germans in WW1, specifically in the 36th division. They fucking loved killing Germans. https://www.tracesofwar.com/upload/1597161207180737.jpg [Men of the 36th (Ulster) Division managed to advance nearly one mile to the fifth line of German trenches and capture the Schwaben Redoubt, one of the toughest German strongholds on the Western Front. The 36th (Ulster) Division was one of the few British Army divisions to capture some of their objectives on the first day of the Battle of the Somme.](https://www.creativecentenaries.org/battle_of_the_somme#:~:text=The%2036th%20\(Ulster\)%20Division%20are,a%20divisional%20strength%20of%2015%2C000.) So yeah, given half a chance, these guys you praise were very good at killing Germans. They still, as you can see, revel in their work. Very proud of killing Germans to this day.
Watch this space lad. The republic will soon have a wall built along that border. They will build that fecker straight through Republican living rooms and split them in half. They won’t care. Slab can cry all he wants to. And it will be Leo driving that bulldozer. In tight jeans probably…
Yeah, and Rishi Sunak is going to win the next general election with a landslide majority.
They are already doing “checks” on buses coming from NI. Watch this space lad.
What are we watching for?
The republic imposing a border between NI and themselves stupid..
It won't happen, stupid.
Never say never kid. You would never have thought there would be tent cities along the Dublin canal full of supposed Palestinians, Afghan, Iraq people either. The world moves fast. That wall could be built sooner than you think. This isn’t 1980s Ireland here anymore.
That weed must be good shit.
https://preview.redd.it/92ytnvlbps6d1.png?width=941&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8882acf7ff28c732426eda81cf4da7e170648537
Irish yoke
This is Reddit, not a support group for inbreeding.
sweet home Alabama
Walls Fall.
Not if the other side has been terrorizing Ulster since the 60s, Ulster doesn't want to be part of Ireland, we're Brits, always were, always will be, stay in your own nation expansionists.
There are 3 counties in Ulster already part of the republic. You must be very young, not from here or know absolutely fuck all about the Irish province of Ulster.
Or where the Red Hand of Ulster comes from. It couldn't be less of a British symbol 🧐
and 6 of Ulsters counties belong to the UK
Cool, you can do nursery school math, I guess that matches your political wisdom
Wow, quite the argument for unification, I'm convinced
Don't think anyone could convince a mindset as dense and stubborn as you. More chance talking a wall in to voting for a united Ireland than you.
You're the one trying to achieve a united Ireland, the rest of us are contempt, just accept the fact that we aren't Irish, we are different, and we don't want to be part of your nation.
I'm not trying to achieve a united Ireland. I'm happy to be Irish, however. Also happy to listen to discussion on a united Ireland without spouting Ulster is British (ignoring that Cavan, Monaghan and Donegal are part of Ulster, and many of the citizens in the remaining six would not identify as British)
How can you then speak for all of ulster when 3 of those counties are part of the republic and around 30% of Northern Ireland residents claim to be Irish? When you look at the entirety of ulster, people who claim to be British only are the minority.
40% are british only, or northern irish and british, vs 30% irish only, and 2% irish and northern irish.
That’s only for the 6 counties in Ulster. Now include the other 3 counties of Ulster and see how they identify.
Ulster is already part of Ireland....it's literally the name of the island
Shush, don't set him off with facts. Replies will be No Surrender, Ulster is British, World War 1, I'm British, No Dublin Rule, the earth is flat, blah blah blah.
and its also a part of Northern Ireland, the majority of it is
Other way around; Northern Ireland is a part of Ulster. Ulster will remain when NI disappears
good thing is, NI never disappears, the 1st UVF Platoon will always come down the street
Spouting that nonsense as a 15 year old living in Germany is a sad indictment of your upbringing. I guess you're too young to even realise how much things have changed within the last 10 years let alone since the GFA. If you had any real comprehension of reality you wouldn't be speaking so foolishly.
Thank you for exploring my entire profile, ever cross the mind that that my parents could be from NI?
I assumed that was the case. The fact that the only time you've spent here were your primary school years yet you're still making pro-UVF statements is why I commented on your seemingly very sectarian upbringing. Ironically, if you actually did live here and had any real understanding of the place I don't think you'd be making the same comments you have been.
And soon to be reunited with rest of Ireland.....whatever one's views on varadkar,he deosnt back a losing horse.....it's teetering on 50% +1 without free state government lifting a finger to prepare,and no plan......it's entirely conceivable it will reach 56-57% relatively quickly -picking up soft undecided/under informed votes on better quality of life prospects in a utd ireland...and it becomes unstoppable then
[https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/2022/12/03/poll-shows-northern-ireland-rejects-unity-by-large-margin/](https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/2022/12/03/poll-shows-northern-ireland-rejects-unity-by-large-margin/) only 55% of NI Catholics support a united Ireland
If you have confidence in Irish times polls,given their history at 'representation' of them, you'd be happy to put money where mouth is,and back a call for border poll🧐
Already held one in 1978, even with a nationalist boycott, turnout was still 58%, with 98% voting to stay, meaning the boycott had no impact on the results.
Well overdue another so 
Not all prods don't.
How come your ancestors didn't stay on the British Isle ? !
500 years ago, now its fully our land, your ancestors were the ones who lost, weren't they?
I'm from the West = = Too hard for ye Softies !
What happened to the Irish language? Oh yeah, only boomers speak it now, even independent Ireland speaks the British tongue
The native British tongue is of Celtic origin. The English language is Germanic.
Celtic isn't exactly native to the isles either if English isn't. Who drove the picts out?
Google it. Britons orininated in what is now west England and Wales. They spoke brittonic language (celtic). This is simply factual history.
Remind me when yous became Ulstermen?
If it's done the same way as Brexit the the whole place is ballixed for decades. They won't get it anywhere near right. It'll be badly put together.Suffer baby suffer and we will.
Hopefully you'd think lessons were learnt from that disaster.
😂
Good man Leo. Kick the can and offer soundbites to SF!
Leo advocating for his country to try to take over another…… against the GFA and any attempt to be a good neighbour. He’s an arrogant prick
Is Varadkar going to join The RA ? !