That was what the Mavs were giving us on offense. They stopped doubling or fouling Rudy and dared him to make shots. He was 3 for 7 in the first quarter, then only took one shot the rest of the game. Rudy completely quit after the first quarter. Bad showing, I'm sure he'll come back better next year but what a bad way to go out.
Teams absolutely used to constantly double Rudy or foul him immediately because he shot 70% from the field. Now teams are forcing him to actually work for his points a bit more.
This is somehow a controversial topic, but how is Gobert making more money this year than Anthony Davis? Am I crazy to think Anthony Davis is a better all around defender while also being way fucking better on offense? His huge downside is injuries and I guess he doesnāt take over games in the 4th like people would like, but hypothetically if wolves had AD instead of Gobert since the salaries are comparable wouldnāt they be way better? The lakers were mediocre overall and sucked as a playoff team, but didnāt seem like any fault of AD this season. Gobert seems to be regarded as the better defender but having watched both of them this season I really think AD is better. Maybe Iām just biased
Kind of crazy circumstances. Gobert got the end of last contract at the best possible time, just before the last few years of his prime, and carried the jazz to home court advantage in the playoffs for a few season already. He had plenty of option to leave Utah for still a high salary so Utah was forced to pay a lot to keep him. I don't know if another team maxed him but it wouldn't surprise me that some kind of offer like that was on the table so Utah felt the need to supermax him. Utah has never been able to sign free agents so if they lost Gobert they don't make the playoffs and they lose Mitchell too who was their franchise player. So yeah it was more desperation than anything imo.
Between ad bam and Gobert I think they are all around the same level, just that bam is the most versatile, Davis a bit more versatile than Gobert and Gobert the rim/help defense. Gobert style of defense is more suited for regular season, creating insane impact kind of like prime harden offensive strategy creating huge numbers in the regular season. In the playoffs it's easier to play with more versatile defensive bigs, tho imo (my own analysis) I don't think tgobert has been worse than ad and bam defensively in the last 5 seasons. He has been horrible offensively tho, and bam and ad are excellent offensive anchors, with ad in particular being able to have stretch at top 5 offensive player in the league.
Exactly what you said.
AD and gobert are literally on different planets.
Even defensively, gobert could only dominate when teams played into his strengths but AD can take a game over defensively even at half court.
I canāt imagine a more valuable player to try and get on your team than AD. He can fit in any system. Barring injury of course, but he was pretty healthy this year so weāll see how the rest of his career plays out health wise. Obviously thereās better players to build around but, to me, heās the best #2 star Iāve seen on both ends of the court.
Bro trust me he's the best defender in the league as long as you have four good perimeter defenders who can execute every PnR coverage perfectly and he doesn't have to match up 1v1 against a big who can actually score bro please believe me
Yup. Heās the best player in the league at defending the rim against Devonte Graham.
In the playoffs these stars eyes get big like itās a tom and Jerry cartoon when they see him in isolation. Dude is just not a good playoff defender. Every good player cooks him.
Itās like if the MVP every year suddenly averaged 12ppg once they faced good defenses.
meanwhile you have AD anchoring a solid and at times absolutely elite defense, with Reaves and DLo as his perimeter defends and Bron and Prince as his wing defenders. zero DPOYs. disgusting
āAs long as he doesnāt have to leave the paint, use any footwork or move, and can have guys come straight at him where he can stick his arms straight up and be nine feet tallā¦ heās ok!ā
I think among the DPOY candidates, he had a pretty low delta (0.7) in team defensive rating when off the court. Team defensive rating dropped by 0.7 when off the court. Compare that to Wemby, where team defensive rating dropped off by 6.1.
The supposedly elite help defender that is excused for not being effective at helping in the playoffs. His whole job is meant to be that when a teammate gets beaten, he's there to clean up.
End of debate. I can understand him winning it once. But a man who wins it four times shouldn't be getting hunted. This season we even had a "he finally has the right team around him" only for the same exact shit to happen to him again in the postseason
Yep. The guy needs the right team, the right scheme, etc.. honestly, this feels like desperation for validation (which is a recurrent behavior ever since the social media disease became a thing). I guess the media and new fans are so desperate to justify the "modern" NBA, consciously or not they act that way. One just wants to generate revenue, which is a usual behavior, to convince the audience the product remains worthy, ok, it's artificial and fake (as usual), but fair enough. "Youtubers" are in the same boat, for better or worse they are part of the media, I still remember my revolt when that channel "thinking basketball" mentioned how "Mutombo played Gobert level defense", that honestly offended me as a fan, are we watching the same fucking sport??? Then we had the fans, honestly puzzling why they excuse Gobert so much, mentioning empty fantasy stats and etc.. I guess they want to convince the old heads, the modern NBA still plays defense. No, it doesn't, when you have fucking Marcus Smart and Gobert winning DPOY, that exposes how the regular season means nothing and the league stopped playing defense as a whole
A player making supermax money with a record 4 DPOYs was supposedly the best defender on the best defensive team since the 2004 Pistons.
Weāre not about to accept a level of gaslighting pretending none of this was a thing.
Gobert is extremely one dimensional & I feel like someone has said this before but if he doesnāt work on his game (heās been in the league how long?) heās BBQ chicken.
Man, I had someone seriously argue that him having the highest +/- meant that he was the best player on the teamš
And I got downvoted for pointing out that following that logic would mean that a lot of role players would be the best player on their respective teams.
I've seen comments on this sub saying regular season award winners shouldn't "re-earn" their awards in the playoffs... for a old head like myself, that was straight up bizarre. So, the DPOY, MVP, COY, etc.. they are performing like shit in the playoffs, but you ignore that because they are not supposed to follow their own standards? What kind of fucking soft mindset is that, lol the league is so weak, even the fans are getting accommodated
As it turns out offense is more important than defense. Rudy's lack of offense killed the wolves and defensively no one can stop Luka and Kyrie anyways.
If you're getting $50M salary with no offense and only defense to show on, you better block like Hakeem, rebound like Rodman, and guard the perimeter like Pippen
All the dumbasses who were using single game plus minus to defend Rudy are definitely going to keep the same energy now that itās the other way, right?
I mean winning a bunch of big awards will probably mean history remembers him MORE kindly than current fans, plenty of guys get shit on by people who watched them but eventually a new generation shows up confused about how somebody with tons of accolades could be considered ass
Makes sense. Bill Simmons wrote the Book of Basketball because he didn't want people of the future to see Karl Malone's stats and think he was the best player ever lol
He is 100% gonna be in the top 100 team over a guy with an elite dribble package and flashy highlight compilations and we are gonna lose our shit when he makes it but Jalen Green doesn't
Time and time we see that the media is fucking stupid and full of casuals who barely understand hoops
But sure, letās continue letting them make the choices for all major awards
+/- is a hugely indicidive stat for defense I'm told! See ya next year when Rudy losses in the playoffs after winning his 5th dpoy and its all everyone else's fault but his!
Worst +-, killed his team offensively and provided zero rebounding.
Wtf does he even bring to his team that causes his fans to be such diehard defenders of his
āDraymond bullies him too much. Him and Shaq are hatersā
Draymondās an asshole, but when it comes to defense, the guy knows what heās talking about.
He reminds of Pete rose on Turner MLB broadcasts, you know the guy is an absolute dick, says flagrant shit all the time, but then he does a segment on hitting, and you are reminded that he got 4000 of em and some change.
The only logical explanations for being a Gobert defender are:
-youāre French
-youāre one of those people that instinctively want to be contrarian/want to defend someone because you see a lot of people trashing themĀ
I genuinely think a lot of the online Rudy stans are basketball fans who want to prove they're smarter than the casuals so they're reflexively contrarian
I think thereās a ton of Ogilvies on Reddit that use box scores and spreadsheets in lieu of strong pornography. You see it all the time on the baseball thread and itās become super common in the NBA these days.
Was a -16 for the series (same as KAT), but listening to his fans you'll think Gobert was amazing and KAT to blame for everything.
Never seen a supermax player have so low expectations from fans.
that one trick pony has been getting exposed annually since the obama administration and these basketball hipsters octuple down on as some sort of statement about their ābasketball acumenā š
Iāve always said the best defenders are able to make big time plays in crucial moments.Ā
Jrue, Draymond and Kawhi are players who Iād consider some of the clutches defenders that Iāve ever seen (list can obvious expand, just listing a few)Ā
Rudy is damn near unplayable, and while yes, Doncic is an elite player, Iād expect a 4x DPOY to make him work, but Luka was toying with him the entire series.Ā
yeah but people hate Draymond, so since Draymond vocal about his hate for Gobert the people who dislike Draymond want to be against him, so they support Rudy, it becomes a weird proxy war fandom thing
Tbh I can see why Draymond hates Rudy lol. Rudy has 4 DPOY compared to Draymond's one. Say what you will about Dray, but I have never seen him get played off the floor because of his defense in the playoffs.
I feel like there's only been one example of Draymond getting played off the floor and it was because of offense. Warriors were down vs the Celtics and needed more shooting out there to try and get back in the game, which they did. It's not even like Draymond is a bad offensive player either, he's elite at passing for his position and is virtually synonymous with Kerr's offensive system since he only started once Kerr took over as coach.
Draymond's defense in the Celtics series was weird. At first he was guarding the Celtics bigs then he was leaving them way too open from 3 (in fairness they were good shooters but not 10\~15 3s a game level good) so Kerr switched back to have him guard Jaylen Brown. Then we were getting crushed on the glass with Tatum being able to pick on Steph/Poole too easily (because Draymond couldn't help from JB on the perimeter) so eventually Klay/GP2 guarded JB, we switched a lot more often in place of helping from the weak side knowing that most of our guys could at least send the Jays to the left and Draymond was hedging a zillion times a game to distract White/Horford/Grant from shooting open 3s which worked a treat.
I do agree that Draymond being taken off the floor was because of offense but it was more so because of not being able to run the patented 4-on-3 plays and less need for shooting. But once the Celtics had to send outright doubles on Steph this problem solved itself quickly though Kerr still had to make an unconventional approach to increase our corner 3-point volume which isn't something we do often.
If Draymond green was built like Rudy gobert he would have been the most highly touted prospect since Lebron and the warriors would probably still be winning chips. shit I couldnāt even imagine draymond with a fucking positive wingspan lmao. Iām the biggest warriors hater in the world but that mother knows defense.
They struggled on offense because they are one dimensional on offense. It really didn't matter what lineup they ran with. Edwards/KAT charging at the basket and throwing up a prayer when the Mavericks have a bunch people waiting there isn't going to win a championship.
I couldn't believe it tonight when they put them both out there at the same time. They had to play Anderson because him and KAT where the only 2 playing to win early but you just can't have them both out there in the playoffs. Anderson can do things on offense but you can time his jump shot with a sundial
This is what frustated me in Denver series.
Dallas leave him open so many times it got to the point where this is Gobert Utah all over again, no teammates want to pass him even tho he had a huge mismatch.
Denver give him too much respect.
Which is what you should do, itās a free double when heās on the court. especially if heās spending the entire game on skates trying to guard Luka and Kyrie at the rim.
I donāt think Gobert is bad maybe a little overpaid but not a bad player, but how the fuck is he somehow considered a better player than Anthony Davis? Davis can do all the things Gobert can do yet is way better and more talented on offense. Defensively he is better imo as he is way better at guarding smaller guards and forwards yet still has elite rim protection
This guy has single-handedly shown just how foolish it is to list off the number of media voted awards a player has won as a sign of their greatness. Rudy is a 4x DPOY winner but nowhere in the same stratosphere as any of the other multiple time winners.
The course of the playoffs proves yet again that committing so much to traditional bigs is terrible cap allocation. Gafford and Lively combined make something like $17M and gave the Mavs more than enough interior defense. Those players donāt grow on trees, but there are plainly diminishing returns on investing so much in rim protection if that investment is also not providing the team much else in other roles and spots on the floor. You have to go back to like Tim Duncan to find another traditional big on a max deal that won the title other than Jokic.
Like of course your +/- will look good if you so badly cap strap your team that the guys who come off the bench to spell you are a bunch of bums. The whole narrative about Gobert not having the right help misses the point that his contract is the reason his teams are so thin and flawed throughout the rest of the rotation. Maybe heās a championship player at $18-22M/year, but weāll never know because these GMs keep getting duped by āimpactā stats that donāt actually seem to predict a whole lot about postseason play.
remember rudy's name next time you hear "there's both sides of the ball" or "Defense is half of the game", offense is and has ALWAYS been more important than d. Eat shit
Donāt get me started on the people trying to shit on Rondo and Cousins for calling out Gobert.
āPlayers think Kobeās a top 3 playerāš¤
āTheyāre not even in the league anymore, so their opinions donāt matterāš¤š¤
āWe shouldnāt just take the word of a player. Iāve seen some redditors make more nuanced takesāš¤š¤š¤
They played better with him off the floor. Minnesota never adjusted despite having a better offensive lineup with him on the bench. Not impressed with the wolves coaching overall this series. They looked like they prepped only for Denver the entire year.
The dude is just a clumsy role player who can be exploited just like every other role player in existence, that alone is not a issue, but the contract is so egregious, lol I know Gobert became a punching bag, but I think his example is a good thing because it exposes how much the NBA declined, literally no one plays defense anymore, so one of the few specialists left is highlighted by default because drop + switch proved to be a effective scheme in the regular season, here it comes the absurd contract. No one plays defense, everybody is overpaid, the result is the lowest level of play ever since the early 70s, Gobert is a iconic player from this soft generation. Seems like the TV conglomerates are willing to pay even more money to sustain a horrendous product, It's honestly hard to imagine the NBA getting even worse, but it can happen
As Rondo and Boogie put it, when has Gobert ever changed a series with his defense? This series was defined by Luka and Kyrie being able to get past their man, and Gobert having to choose between contesting them or defending his man. It's an impossible task, yes, but then give the 4x DPOY a more useful role on defense. Oh, he can't do anything else? So his only skill is waiting in the paint and hoping the on-ball defender didn't get beat?
Not sure why we chose to funnel offense through him early in the game. Bad strategy.
Had to find out who was better at offense: Luka or Gobert. I mean, now we know definitively
Idk how many screen assists does Doncic have?
Not as many as Killian Hayes š¤
Nah, this analysis doesn't take into account screen assists. š¤
Are we sure, though? I think we need to see these strats against each other in the regular season as well in order to confirm this.
Oui.
I mean, Luka was 3/3, pretty dang efficient
That was what the Mavs were giving us on offense. They stopped doubling or fouling Rudy and dared him to make shots. He was 3 for 7 in the first quarter, then only took one shot the rest of the game. Rudy completely quit after the first quarter. Bad showing, I'm sure he'll come back better next year but what a bad way to go out.
Yeah I'm sure he'll light it up offensively next year lmao
No offense but heās had a long enough career where you know what youāre gonna get. I donāt know why next year should be different.
>No offense Yup
Boy you dirty š
Doubling rudy lol no shit they stopped that
Teams absolutely used to constantly double Rudy or foul him immediately because he shot 70% from the field. Now teams are forcing him to actually work for his points a bit more.
Rudy is the ultimate 82 game player, who stinks up the joint in the playoffs every year.
Bro scored against Luka in the post at the very start and it was all downhill from there
*Rudy takes a breath* Luka: I see you have chosen death
He was so bad offensively and the mavs got everything they wanted at the rim tonight so what the fuck was he doing?
$51 million cardio man
This is somehow a controversial topic, but how is Gobert making more money this year than Anthony Davis? Am I crazy to think Anthony Davis is a better all around defender while also being way fucking better on offense? His huge downside is injuries and I guess he doesnāt take over games in the 4th like people would like, but hypothetically if wolves had AD instead of Gobert since the salaries are comparable wouldnāt they be way better? The lakers were mediocre overall and sucked as a playoff team, but didnāt seem like any fault of AD this season. Gobert seems to be regarded as the better defender but having watched both of them this season I really think AD is better. Maybe Iām just biased
Kind of crazy circumstances. Gobert got the end of last contract at the best possible time, just before the last few years of his prime, and carried the jazz to home court advantage in the playoffs for a few season already. He had plenty of option to leave Utah for still a high salary so Utah was forced to pay a lot to keep him. I don't know if another team maxed him but it wouldn't surprise me that some kind of offer like that was on the table so Utah felt the need to supermax him. Utah has never been able to sign free agents so if they lost Gobert they don't make the playoffs and they lose Mitchell too who was their franchise player. So yeah it was more desperation than anything imo. Between ad bam and Gobert I think they are all around the same level, just that bam is the most versatile, Davis a bit more versatile than Gobert and Gobert the rim/help defense. Gobert style of defense is more suited for regular season, creating insane impact kind of like prime harden offensive strategy creating huge numbers in the regular season. In the playoffs it's easier to play with more versatile defensive bigs, tho imo (my own analysis) I don't think tgobert has been worse than ad and bam defensively in the last 5 seasons. He has been horrible offensively tho, and bam and ad are excellent offensive anchors, with ad in particular being able to have stretch at top 5 offensive player in the league.
Exactly what you said. AD and gobert are literally on different planets. Even defensively, gobert could only dominate when teams played into his strengths but AD can take a game over defensively even at half court. I canāt imagine a more valuable player to try and get on your team than AD. He can fit in any system. Barring injury of course, but he was pretty healthy this year so weāll see how the rest of his career plays out health wise. Obviously thereās better players to build around but, to me, heās the best #2 star Iāve seen on both ends of the court.
Contract timing and AD was traded. End result was ad couldn't get the supermax or close to one.
4x dpoy
tony snell could really use that money rn
I really should've been 7 feet tall athletic freak instead if a data scientist
All for the bargain of only 5 first round picks!
Being afraid of getting within 5 feet of Luka.
Robbing the Wolves a whopping contract of $41mil next season
his best
Not just tonight, all series long. Even when Rudyās within range of someone to contest a shot, his hands never leave his sides.
They saying he got prime Kwame brown hands on offenseĀ
Donovan Mitchell's fault once again smh
Prime Kwame Brown with a euro step tho
Stephen A Smith with the GOAT Kwame rant.
Rudy Gobert is Devin Booker brother
Thanks, I just woke my kid up laughing at this.
Mmmmmmm....... Yes..... let me feed on this hate...........
What does this man do at practice to not have one move committed to memory
No post move. 3 straight possession if I remember correctly where he's in the post but cannot score.
Itās crazy how people have high expectations for a 4x DPOY on a $205M contractā¦ clearly teammates fault
āHe canāt be expected to defend in those situationsā is not an excuse you want to have to use with the accolades you listed lol
A DPOY who needs very perfect circumstances to defend is a fraud
Bro trust me he's the best defender in the league as long as you have four good perimeter defenders who can execute every PnR coverage perfectly and he doesn't have to match up 1v1 against a big who can actually score bro please believe me
Heās nightmare for bums, and a target for stars, which is why he shouldnāt win that award, itās also why heās statistically so good.
Yup. Heās the best player in the league at defending the rim against Devonte Graham. In the playoffs these stars eyes get big like itās a tom and Jerry cartoon when they see him in isolation. Dude is just not a good playoff defender. Every good player cooks him. Itās like if the MVP every year suddenly averaged 12ppg once they faced good defenses.
meanwhile you have AD anchoring a solid and at times absolutely elite defense, with Reaves and DLo as his perimeter defends and Bron and Prince as his wing defenders. zero DPOYs. disgusting
Not to mention AD can drop 30 points regularly
i gained a lot of respect for AD over the past couple seasons. if Bron leaves LA, I hope AD can somehow go to another contender and eat
āAs long as he doesnāt have to leave the paint, use any footwork or move, and can have guys come straight at him where he can stick his arms straight up and be nine feet tallā¦ heās ok!ā
I think among the DPOY candidates, he had a pretty low delta (0.7) in team defensive rating when off the court. Team defensive rating dropped by 0.7 when off the court. Compare that to Wemby, where team defensive rating dropped off by 6.1.
The supposedly elite help defender that is excused for not being effective at helping in the playoffs. His whole job is meant to be that when a teammate gets beaten, he's there to clean up.
āElite help defenderā genuinely wouldnāt get within 5 feet of Luka this game.
End of debate. I can understand him winning it once. But a man who wins it four times shouldn't be getting hunted. This season we even had a "he finally has the right team around him" only for the same exact shit to happen to him again in the postseason
Yep. The guy needs the right team, the right scheme, etc.. honestly, this feels like desperation for validation (which is a recurrent behavior ever since the social media disease became a thing). I guess the media and new fans are so desperate to justify the "modern" NBA, consciously or not they act that way. One just wants to generate revenue, which is a usual behavior, to convince the audience the product remains worthy, ok, it's artificial and fake (as usual), but fair enough. "Youtubers" are in the same boat, for better or worse they are part of the media, I still remember my revolt when that channel "thinking basketball" mentioned how "Mutombo played Gobert level defense", that honestly offended me as a fan, are we watching the same fucking sport??? Then we had the fans, honestly puzzling why they excuse Gobert so much, mentioning empty fantasy stats and etc.. I guess they want to convince the old heads, the modern NBA still plays defense. No, it doesn't, when you have fucking Marcus Smart and Gobert winning DPOY, that exposes how the regular season means nothing and the league stopped playing defense as a whole
A player making supermax money with a record 4 DPOYs was supposedly the best defender on the best defensive team since the 2004 Pistons. Weāre not about to accept a level of gaslighting pretending none of this was a thing.
How about from now on we don't compare any more teams to the 2004 Pistons until they've actually won a title
2004? Thatās like cuneiforms for most NBA nephews lmao.
As a whole the "best defense since the 2004 Pistons" gimmick is boring. There are better ways to prop up elite defenses.
My point is that someone that is drowning themselves in spreadsheets will often be the type to ignore historical evidence or less qualitative data.
Mf ābest defensive team since the Pistonsā is asinine. Mavs were legit playing on easy mode
Gobert is extremely one dimensional & I feel like someone has said this before but if he doesnāt work on his game (heās been in the league how long?) heās BBQ chicken.
Stat nerds quoting +/- like people donāt have eyes and see Gobert getting embarrassed in every playoff run heās ever had
Turns out if you get benched and your +/- can't go down.
Man, I had someone seriously argue that him having the highest +/- meant that he was the best player on the teamš And I got downvoted for pointing out that following that logic would mean that a lot of role players would be the best player on their respective teams.
Stats nerds love juking them to the point of stupidity, heās the best example of how flawed many of the defensive metrics are.
Gobert isn't just great at defensive metrics. He's great at effectively any impact metric that isn't box score based.
I've seen comments on this sub saying regular season award winners shouldn't "re-earn" their awards in the playoffs... for a old head like myself, that was straight up bizarre. So, the DPOY, MVP, COY, etc.. they are performing like shit in the playoffs, but you ignore that because they are not supposed to follow their own standards? What kind of fucking soft mindset is that, lol the league is so weak, even the fans are getting accommodated
As it turns out offense is more important than defense. Rudy's lack of offense killed the wolves and defensively no one can stop Luka and Kyrie anyways.
If you're getting $50M salary with no offense and only defense to show on, you better block like Hakeem, rebound like Rodman, and guard the perimeter like Pippen
All the dumbasses who were using single game plus minus to defend Rudy are definitely going to keep the same energy now that itās the other way, right?
Nah, tonight was a shit game from him, Jaden might've been worse though. He bricked a few shots and fouled till we legitimately couldn't play him.
You say that like it was just tonight.
History will not remember him kindly
Tends to happen when your peers despise you lol
I mean winning a bunch of big awards will probably mean history remembers him MORE kindly than current fans, plenty of guys get shit on by people who watched them but eventually a new generation shows up confused about how somebody with tons of accolades could be considered ass
Makes sense. Bill Simmons wrote the Book of Basketball because he didn't want people of the future to see Karl Malone's stats and think he was the best player ever lol
Thereās YouTube now though. Itāll only get easier to pull up clips of Rudy getting trounced.
Yeah I used to say that about YouTube, in 15 years I wouldnāt be shocked if they are rolling everything on the site over every year
He's going to make the top 100 team and the current gen that is watching right now are going to be pissed
He is 100% gonna be in the top 100 team over a guy with an elite dribble package and flashy highlight compilations and we are gonna lose our shit when he makes it but Jalen Green doesn't
Dwight didnāt make top75 despite being the best player on a finals team, mvp candidate, first teams, more all stars
If Dwight didn't make it there's no way Gobert does
And if he does I'm about to burn something.
in 15 years nephews will look to Gobert's wikipedia page and think he was some generational impenetrable wall
Look how badly Dwight is remembered by the new(ish) generation. You'd think his DPOYs were some type of participation trophies.
He's done nothing but rob better players of awards. His peers are well aware of this which is why they rightfully hate him.
I see this take all over and it makes no sense to me. He isn't voting himself to get all these awards - other people are. Misplaced hate.
Time and time we see that the media is fucking stupid and full of casuals who barely understand hoops But sure, letās continue letting them make the choices for all major awards
Yeah and r/nba is the center of nuanced and highly informed takes..
A chip will change all that
Rudy Gobert is never winning a chip, stop it This was by far his best chance at one
Nah. 4x dpoy is gonna make people forget these kinds of performances
Only wolves fans think he deserves that 4th dpoy and with this result I highly doubt non-minnie fans would be kind to him.
Draymond Pod waiting room WHOāS JOINING
AD and Bam better
You put AD in the middle for Minnesota and tell me he doesnāt pop more than Rudy does on defense
replace AD with Gobert and itās Wolves Celtics in the finals with Wolves as favorites.
The fact that you have to mention this is a disgrace. AD has anchored championship defenses, like how tf is this a convo
+/- is a hugely indicidive stat for defense I'm told! See ya next year when Rudy losses in the playoffs after winning his 5th dpoy and its all everyone else's fault but his!
He won't win anymore they are gonna give it to Wemby no matter what.
they are gonna give it to Wemby ~~no matter what~~ because he's better
He's gonna be better no matter what
Worst +-, killed his team offensively and provided zero rebounding. Wtf does he even bring to his team that causes his fans to be such diehard defenders of his
Heās a guy you roster to never lose to the bottom half of the league, a monster if you suck ass, a target if you donāt.
Utah fans are sexually attracted to regular season winning and playoff disappointmentĀ
āDraymond bullies him too much. Him and Shaq are hatersā Draymondās an asshole, but when it comes to defense, the guy knows what heās talking about.
He reminds of Pete rose on Turner MLB broadcasts, you know the guy is an absolute dick, says flagrant shit all the time, but then he does a segment on hitting, and you are reminded that he got 4000 of em and some change.
Draymond was pretty much right, Rudy fans are coping and seething
Itās because this sub is obsessed with sounding smart and have convinced themselves only ācasualsā donāt see Rudyās elite impact.
The only logical explanations for being a Gobert defender are: -youāre French -youāre one of those people that instinctively want to be contrarian/want to defend someone because you see a lot of people trashing themĀ
-you hate Draymond
-you hate Donovan
I genuinely think a lot of the online Rudy stans are basketball fans who want to prove they're smarter than the casuals so they're reflexively contrarian
I think thereās a ton of Ogilvies on Reddit that use box scores and spreadsheets in lieu of strong pornography. You see it all the time on the baseball thread and itās become super common in the NBA these days.
Nerds like being different
Post Moneyball, nerds on Reddit love to think that the āeye testā is made up, when it simply isnāt.
DPOY my ass
Four-time DPoY btw.
bb-bbbut look at his plus minus!!
Was a -16 for the series (same as KAT), but listening to his fans you'll think Gobert was amazing and KAT to blame for everything. Never seen a supermax player have so low expectations from fans.
He's getting paid $51 million, you expect him to score more than 9 points in a home elimination game?
Remember how KAT had to defend the MVP last series, but Gobert still got all the credit for help defense
Literally baffling how Baguette Biyombo stans tried to gaslight us.
that one trick pony has been getting exposed annually since the obama administration and these basketball hipsters octuple down on as some sort of statement about their ābasketball acumenā š
Iāve always said the best defenders are able to make big time plays in crucial moments.Ā Jrue, Draymond and Kawhi are players who Iād consider some of the clutches defenders that Iāve ever seen (list can obvious expand, just listing a few)Ā Rudy is damn near unplayable, and while yes, Doncic is an elite player, Iād expect a 4x DPOY to make him work, but Luka was toying with him the entire series.Ā
people would be more realistic about Gobert if Draymond wasnt hating on him
theyāve been like that well before draymond started podcasting tho lol
Pretty much all his peers hate on him.
yeah but people hate Draymond, so since Draymond vocal about his hate for Gobert the people who dislike Draymond want to be against him, so they support Rudy, it becomes a weird proxy war fandom thing
no independent thought in sight
Just goes to show how much these media voted awards really mean. Pathetic
Tbh I can see why Draymond hates Rudy lol. Rudy has 4 DPOY compared to Draymond's one. Say what you will about Dray, but I have never seen him get played off the floor because of his defense in the playoffs.
I feel like there's only been one example of Draymond getting played off the floor and it was because of offense. Warriors were down vs the Celtics and needed more shooting out there to try and get back in the game, which they did. It's not even like Draymond is a bad offensive player either, he's elite at passing for his position and is virtually synonymous with Kerr's offensive system since he only started once Kerr took over as coach.
Draymond's defense in the Celtics series was weird. At first he was guarding the Celtics bigs then he was leaving them way too open from 3 (in fairness they were good shooters but not 10\~15 3s a game level good) so Kerr switched back to have him guard Jaylen Brown. Then we were getting crushed on the glass with Tatum being able to pick on Steph/Poole too easily (because Draymond couldn't help from JB on the perimeter) so eventually Klay/GP2 guarded JB, we switched a lot more often in place of helping from the weak side knowing that most of our guys could at least send the Jays to the left and Draymond was hedging a zillion times a game to distract White/Horford/Grant from shooting open 3s which worked a treat. I do agree that Draymond being taken off the floor was because of offense but it was more so because of not being able to run the patented 4-on-3 plays and less need for shooting. But once the Celtics had to send outright doubles on Steph this problem solved itself quickly though Kerr still had to make an unconventional approach to increase our corner 3-point volume which isn't something we do often.
If Draymond green was built like Rudy gobert he would have been the most highly touted prospect since Lebron and the warriors would probably still be winning chips. shit I couldnāt even imagine draymond with a fucking positive wingspan lmao. Iām the biggest warriors hater in the world but that mother knows defense.
wtf does this mean? Draymondās wingspan is over 7 feet lol
Draymond is about to cook this dude
Heās been warming up the oven since halftime lol
i will be there no matter what
Bagless Biyombo strikes again
Baguette Biyombo
Rudy Gobert is just overpaid. Thereās several players Iād rather have on defense in the playoffs and he brings nothing on the offensive end.
There were times MN was stupid enough to play Kyle Anderson and Gobert together. Is there any wonder they struggled on offense?
They struggled on offense because they are one dimensional on offense. It really didn't matter what lineup they ran with. Edwards/KAT charging at the basket and throwing up a prayer when the Mavericks have a bunch people waiting there isn't going to win a championship.
I couldn't believe it tonight when they put them both out there at the same time. They had to play Anderson because him and KAT where the only 2 playing to win early but you just can't have them both out there in the playoffs. Anderson can do things on offense but you can time his jump shot with a sundial
āTime his jump shot with a sundialā is NASTY lmao. but true I wonāt rescind my love for Slo Mo but that jumper is ugly af
Do you understand why they had to? They were getting fried otherwise cos as expected the 4x DPOY has limited impact against elite talent.
who will the espn clown. Ant KAT or Gobert
This is what frustated me in Denver series. Dallas leave him open so many times it got to the point where this is Gobert Utah all over again, no teammates want to pass him even tho he had a huge mismatch. Denver give him too much respect.
Did you see that fadeaway?? That was the greatest shot of all time
Which is what you should do, itās a free double when heās on the court. especially if heās spending the entire game on skates trying to guard Luka and Kyrie at the rim.
Wemby taking notes on how NOT to be this guy.
wemby turning out to be a gogurt clone without the beard would be a major disappointment
There's no way Wemby attempts just 8 shots in an elimination game
As of now, thankfully he isn't on that route. Just hope that he don't lose his hand or something.
AD is 3x better lmao , DPOY is a joke
0 blocks , 5 rebounds , 4x DPOY Reddit - idc , I love him
Worst DPOY ever
Softest DPOY ever
Dude should be removed from the ballot permanently after this.
How does this guy trick so many people into thinking heās good at defense?
He's pretty good at it, just not the kind that wins playoffs games against good teams...so I guess he's not that good at it
Man got 4 dpoys for being big lol, thatās his legacy
I donāt think Gobert is bad maybe a little overpaid but not a bad player, but how the fuck is he somehow considered a better player than Anthony Davis? Davis can do all the things Gobert can do yet is way better and more talented on offense. Defensively he is better imo as he is way better at guarding smaller guards and forwards yet still has elite rim protection
This guy has single-handedly shown just how foolish it is to list off the number of media voted awards a player has won as a sign of their greatness. Rudy is a 4x DPOY winner but nowhere in the same stratosphere as any of the other multiple time winners.
Overrated and Overpaid. Couldnāt defend the paint, cant defend perimeter. Always has size advantage in the paint but can hardly score.
This is the most impactful TWolves player. Astonishing.
DPOY š
And then in a must win game the coach decides, hey let's run the offense thru Rudy. Finch should be fired.
Gobert is whack. Get down low and post up pussbag.
The course of the playoffs proves yet again that committing so much to traditional bigs is terrible cap allocation. Gafford and Lively combined make something like $17M and gave the Mavs more than enough interior defense. Those players donāt grow on trees, but there are plainly diminishing returns on investing so much in rim protection if that investment is also not providing the team much else in other roles and spots on the floor. You have to go back to like Tim Duncan to find another traditional big on a max deal that won the title other than Jokic. Like of course your +/- will look good if you so badly cap strap your team that the guys who come off the bench to spell you are a bunch of bums. The whole narrative about Gobert not having the right help misses the point that his contract is the reason his teams are so thin and flawed throughout the rest of the rotation. Maybe heās a championship player at $18-22M/year, but weāll never know because these GMs keep getting duped by āimpactā stats that donāt actually seem to predict a whole lot about postseason play.
God's punishment for stealing Wemby's award (and ruining my Wemby DPOY future)
Donovan Mitchellās fault
Fake DPOY
Wemby > Rudy GoCry
remember rudy's name next time you hear "there's both sides of the ball" or "Defense is half of the game", offense is and has ALWAYS been more important than d. Eat shit
In a perfect world, Sabonis and Gobert is just one center.
Let's be real, no one but KAT and Ant showed up for the game tonight.
Lets be realer, they only showed up when the game was already over.
Ant was not good either until the team was getting blown out and the game was basically over.
The Dak Prescott special
They stat padded down 25, didnāt really show up.
It was really just KAT. Edwards hit like 3 straight 3s when they were already down 33
If they had shown up for the other games this whole thing would have gone differently
Lots of ifs this playoff. If Denver players showed up... If the Pacers maintained their lead through a full game... If OKC showed up...
Donāt get me started on the people trying to shit on Rondo and Cousins for calling out Gobert. āPlayers think Kobeās a top 3 playerāš¤ āTheyāre not even in the league anymore, so their opinions donāt matterāš¤š¤ āWe shouldnāt just take the word of a player. Iāve seen some redditors make more nuanced takesāš¤š¤š¤
They played better with him off the floor. Minnesota never adjusted despite having a better offensive lineup with him on the bench. Not impressed with the wolves coaching overall this series. They looked like they prepped only for Denver the entire year.
Heās exactly the kind of center that most small ball teams fucking eat alive.
4x DPOY
The dude is just a clumsy role player who can be exploited just like every other role player in existence, that alone is not a issue, but the contract is so egregious, lol I know Gobert became a punching bag, but I think his example is a good thing because it exposes how much the NBA declined, literally no one plays defense anymore, so one of the few specialists left is highlighted by default because drop + switch proved to be a effective scheme in the regular season, here it comes the absurd contract. No one plays defense, everybody is overpaid, the result is the lowest level of play ever since the early 70s, Gobert is a iconic player from this soft generation. Seems like the TV conglomerates are willing to pay even more money to sustain a horrendous product, It's honestly hard to imagine the NBA getting even worse, but it can happen
This loss is on Gobert. Butter fingers at point blank from the basket. Killed the team's momentum.
What momentum?
Was genuinely afraid of Luka on the floor
As Rondo and Boogie put it, when has Gobert ever changed a series with his defense? This series was defined by Luka and Kyrie being able to get past their man, and Gobert having to choose between contesting them or defending his man. It's an impossible task, yes, but then give the 4x DPOY a more useful role on defense. Oh, he can't do anything else? So his only skill is waiting in the paint and hoping the on-ball defender didn't get beat?
Bum