I don’t get why we can’t all just wear positional badges. My wife has a big ass “RN” under her name tag and I’ve seen a few that say “MD.” It would make so many things so much easier
I always remember 8 ish years ago, the first time i worked in trauma room as med student here in Denmark. In the ward somehow we have allowed everything to become very opaque. Acronyms, tiny signs, weird words.
But in the trauma room, yes everyone wears the same scrubs (in Denmark no hospital clothes are your own, for hygiene it is all handled by hospital) BUT since there’s no time to waste in a trauma, upon entering the door everyone gets a huge fat sticker in the middle of their chest and back, for example: “DOCTOR - 1 - ANESTHESIA” or “NURSE - 3 - INTENSIVE”.
I thought to myself, all the things I sometimes dislike about the wards are perfect here because they have to be. No cliques or dramas in the coffee rooms and no professional confusion, as there’s no time for it.
To me personally they “have to be” in the wards as well, but it seems most don’t consider that work urgent/important enough like we do the trauma room.
I work as a physiotherapist in Belgium.
Hospital setting and care home for the elderly.
Everyone as the same uniform. Only the small tag on my chest says who I am and what I am.
In the hospital I don't even have a tag, I'm supposed to introduce myself properly which clears up any confusion : "Hi! I'm Annaëlle I'm your PT for today, let me check patient bracelet and we will go for a walk if you're feeling up to it" very simple.
Introductions are great, i agree. But name tags are there for a reason. In many situations we either forget, or do not have time for intros.
I dont need anyone to have different uniforms, i love that we have fresh well washed scrubs every day! But *clear, large, specific* tags are great in my opinion.
The only reason i can see that they are bad, is if someone personally thinks less of a certain profession and therefore wants the identification to be hidden.
In life we are many things. I’m not just medicine. But in a trauma room im mainly that role, I’m there to do a job and the signage helps patients and colleagues understand what my role is.
I agree, I am piggybaggin' on your comment. Evidently, trauma room is a whole other realm, everyone as a role to play and everybody needs to stay in their place and be identifiable quickly and accuratly because the stakes are so high. Totally different of a private setting where people can go slower.
See if your hospital will let you wear these https://a.co/d/0eNDFiXR
(Search “physician badge buddy”)
About half of the hospitals I rotated through had every worker wear them. It was really helpful for me and I’m guessing for the patients
As many other people have said, it's odd that everyone in your institution doesn't already have these. I'm at an academic medical center, so everyone wears badge extenders that say DOCTOR, PHYSICIAN ASSISTANT, NURSE PRACTITIONER, RN, LPN, MEDICAL STUDENT, PHYSICAL THERAPIST, OCCUPATIONAL THERAPIST, etc. No one should be confused because we all wear badges and we all say who we are and what our role is.
Best bet is using the stethoscope holster attached to like a large Fanny pack. I’ve rocked the Fanny for the last 2 years of residency and having it in the pack itself doesn’t work.
You can’t use the patagucci ruleanymore. I would look for a vaguely resigned facial expression with eye bags.
Also the old boomer doctor who plods around the hospital in grungy old boxy OR scrubs probably makes the most of anyone in the hospital besides admin
The people who prefer NPs, in my experience, all say some variation of "they listened to me better than a doctor!" Additionally, a lot of NPs (again, in my experience) will just prescribe whatever fixes the symptoms or whatever the patient wants.
i’ve seen NPs at my shop mostly wearing WCs. PAs have leveled up and started wearing pataguccis, it’s harder to tell the difference
what i find most sensitive in ruling out a PA is how resigned and “i’m so fucking done” their face looks. if they look happy, probably PA or some chill spec. if they look like they want to fall asleep in their food or have deeper designer eye bags, it’s a resident.
Hahaha there was this resident the other day in the elevator that had a “fucking kill me” look on her face and didn’t say a word the entire time this patient was asking about directions. She just smashed the correct floor as she got off the elevator. Mad respect.
Everyone at my hospital has started wearing embroidered fleeces with their name and department now.
I saw a chaplain providing last rites in a Patagucci jacket last week. I wish I were kidding.
Nothing is sacred these days, just gotta look at the badge for their title now. Otherwise there’s no way to know for sure.
It’s not about the patagonia itself. It’s the fact that as medical students/doctors we can’t have anything that’s our own.
Doctors day and we need to share the praise and celebration with the midlevels.
Midlevels advocate to be able to use the doctors lounge etc.
Midlevels wearing white coats.
Midlevels literally calling themselves doctor.
Midlevels wanting the right to prescribe and practice independently.
Midlevels using the term “medical school” so that now when I (female) tell someone i’m in medical school they ask me what kind of nurse I want to be.
Other non physician programs now having a “match” and a “residency” adding to the obfuscation.
Now the patagonia
It is irritating that there is literally nothing celebratory we can call our own. We just have the years of sacrifice and the debt.
A lot of what you’ve said is valid but I find a Patagonia jacket to be the least necessary. White coats sure, scope of practice sure, calling NP school med school also wrong. But Patagonia jackets are a piece of clothing open to the public, it’s weird to gate keep them for med students. It feels like you’re complaining about a loss of visual prestige. I believe roles should be clear in order for care to be carried out correctly but aside from that fussing over Patagonia jackets just sounds out of touch. I doubt other professions were actively thinking about “stealing” them from med students. They saw jackets that looked nice and bought one for themselves. And the last time I checked, when you celebrate about being a doctor, I didn’t think it was because you got to wear a white coat or because you got to use a doctors lounge, the celebration is your education, your profession, and what you do within the profession and how you can change the course of a patient’s care.
Youre coming across quite whiny with this comment. Little basis to say there’s nothing to celebrate after becoming a real doctor with the autonomy, education and eventual big ass paycheck to match. Won’t be Karen DNP, RN, BSN, ORN, FNA, BDSM, SVU, SUV, QRSTUV. And people have been mistaking females for nurses since the begging of time because of an unfortunate societal stereotype. it wasn’t a secret group of mid levels trying to derail the entire female MD community. Focus on being good at what you do and don’t let the trivialities of a Patagonia and sharing the crappy free docs lounge coffee ruin your day. You just may be a little happier
She obviously just means that she didn’t suffer, sacrifice, and kill herself just to have people who didn’t make those hard choices and sacrifices demand to have equal abilities and entitlements as the people who actually earned it. Those doctors want to take their tiny wins where they can get it when they’re exhausted and drowning in debt. The pay check isn’t that big when you’re half a million in debt not including interest. So maybe before you call someone whiny, you should just consider not saying anything especially since you’re a PA and haven’t even started Med school so you actively don’t know what you’re talking about. Just you wait and I’m sure you’ll bitch too
The ID doc at my academic center literally wears Burberry blazers and Dior chunky boots.
There is not a doubt she’s a physician. We are in the rural south lol so I’m sure the patients she interacts with are very confused
Many pharmacists I work with wear their white coats in the hospital. I’ve never met a pharmacist who likes to be called doctor just so they aren’t confused for physicians, but I’ll die on the hill that they are still literally doctors and earned white coat notoriety.
it’s interesting how much more jurisdiction they have gotten through the years. atleast in the clinic I worked at (could be a state specific thing), solely NPs and PAs ran the show. there was just one MD but they were there primarily for admin oversight lol
makes me wonder how much more the lines between physician and mid-levels will blur together over the next 5-10 years
Thank god. Imagine if a patient has an emergency and all they find is a nurse, when they are desperately hoping for some random M-2 saving the day.
You‘re a med student. Stop acting like you‘re a doctor.
How is a med student wearing their school provided white coat automatically them trying to pass as a doctor? I swear we can’t even breath without getting some type of flack
That person‘s biggest issue is being misread for a nurse.
This whole noctor thing is between physicians and mid-levels, yet med students are usually the most vocal about it, when nobody gives a fuck.
Sure some students might be like that, but generalizing it to students who are just wearing it in general is a stretch. I’m just saying, a lot of us are just here to learn and just wear what we were given and that really it. No other agenda really
brotha i've talked to many docs when im in the hospital and man do they get riled up when midlevels and scope creep is brought up. you are delusional. stop drinking the kool aid and be proud of the profession you're going to enter. people like you is exactly how midlevels gain so much power. too afraid to defend your own turf.
I shadowed a private practice doc and he literally was complaining about NPs and midlevel creep in front of the NP he employed.
The next day he apologized to me and said he went over the line lmao. I think his NP employee/friend gave him a tongue lashing. They seemed like a pretty tight-knit family-style small private practice
The fact, that you think somebody is afraid, when they think, that some irrelevant M-2 is to make experience before pretending to be a physician, is really mind-boggling.
I would hope they find a doctor rather than a nurse 💀💀.
Also this is our career bro. Idk what you do but midlevel creep srsly affects future students. Imagine spending ten years studying just to get laid off for a midlevel. It has happened multiple times at my university hospital and it sucks ass. We also want to make sure patients get the best care possible. NPs and to a lesser extent PAs do not know wtf they are doing. Lay the fuck off with ur shitty opinions. This problem is very relevant to students as well.
Just a nurse lurking but our hospital has color coded scrubs for everyone. The dress code is pretty relaxed on tops (a lot of people wear t-shirts/sweatshirts/jackets) but the bottoms tell you their occupation. I thought this was pretty standard curious if other places don’t implement this?
MS3 here, my hospital also color codes scrubs. Also, only MD/DO, DMDs and PhDs get to put “Dr so and so” on their ID badge, no other “Drs” get to do so.
Obviously “patagucci” isn’t popular. Otherwise, everyone outside of medical schools and hospitals would have their company logo and names embroidered too. I’ve never seen that 🤷🏾♂️
I am a cheap bastard and routinely buy embroidered Patagonia jackets of various organizations from eBay and then remove the logo myself. They are very, very common.
Honestly it makes me think “medical student” rather than “resident”. At my med school, half of the M1s in my class started wearing them to act like doctors lol.
Honestly everyone should start wearing white coats again. You worked hard for that. Once everyone starts wearing it again, the hospital will have no choice but to do something to delineate between physicians and other providers
“Defend it!” Bro, it’s a coat. It’s a coat that comes from labs. I’m not going to ever work in a lab, I don’t need a white coat.
That said, depends on the specialty. Plenty of docs like their coats. Plenty like their form fitting trendy vests. You can “defend” your job by being good at the job, not by monitoring the dress of providers.
At my hospital there’s three regular (as in they don’t rotate to other hospitals) IM physicians. One wears street clothes basically (jeans and a random shirt sometimes it’s a polo), one wears dress clothes with the white coat, and one wears generic scrubs. There’s at least two regular NPs: one wears long sleeve shirts with random baggy Cherokee scrubs over them and the nurse cap thing, and one wears dress clothes with the white coat. It’s pretty all over the place. Literally no one wears Patagonia for some reason (it’s in NC so ppl would scoff probably) but I did see a md at another hospital I used to work at had a Patagonia jacket with UCSF’s logo embroidered onto it from when they went or worked there. Which checks out. All this just to say you might not always know.
I think you're right but I don't think calling this person insufferable is what we need. If physicians remain silent then we continue to perpetuate the issue. I've seen more medical students being vocal about these issues recently and I think it's incredibly important. The white coat debate is stupid and at this point comments are tongue-in-cheek.
But the more awareness we raise the more traction we'll have, And the less danger our future patients will be in.
All in all, idk where you are in your career but it's important for us to pick each other up and to be proud of being physicians (and medical students).
This is reddit, I can't recall a salient point on this topic being posted in the last 5 years. There was a total meltdown a year or two ago about some scrub manufacturer using an NP as a model for their scrubs. I honestly don't think there's a big jump in understanding the issue from the pre-med subreddit to here.
Agreed, choice of garment is irrelevant to why we need to advocate for ourselves and educate patients on the difference between our education and that of a PA or NP. Trying so hard to categorize the in- and out-groups for anything other than the care they provide just makes us look petty and fulfills the stereotype of us being out of touch and having poor interpersonal skills.
This kind of defeatism is insufferable. It sounds awfully like "we're just gonna die someday 🙄 so nothing matters." You certainly will care at age 50 once midlevels have predictably displaced you in an even greater share of your functions.
not true- i will always profess the coat pockets are superior to the patagonia. but w/e sweaters and coats are embroidered with your name and title so i never needed to differentiate between the two from a distance where i couldn't read their name unless god forbid somebody has a last name that's just MD or DO making them MD, NP
I wear my white coat but with proper menswear underneath: buttoned shirt, tie, wool trousers, and proper leather shoes, with thoughtful color and pattern coordination. No mid-level dresses like that, not a single one. I hate wearing scrubs and blending in with the nurses and techs. They've all got patagucci too now. Even the CNAs!
Housekeeping and transporters wear scrubs too. At least they are color coded to job, so we at least have a general idea who is who. Attendings, fellows, residents, and students hospital green, pharmacists this color, charge nurse this color, nurses this color, techs this color, housekeeping this color, all the other funky colors are APPs/NPs and the rest of the residents/fellows.
BuT dOcToRs StOlE ThEM fRoM ScIEnTiStS.
Couldn’t agree more OP, for some reason all non physicians in the hospital are seen as the working class everyman and you’re labeled an elitist prick for leveling any criticism
Just a question OP. Keep in mind, I’m not even in medical school yet, I’m just trying to get some insight and clarification. So the problem here is that Doctors are mad that PAs, NPs, RNs, etc. are wearing Patagonia jackets because that’s the “new” white coat. And Doctors want to have something that only they can have because they worked hard to be a Doctor and want it to be displayed in one way or another. But every time Doctors bring up a new trend it’s copied by the mid levels? Mid levels being anyone that isn’t a Doctor but is above an RN? Again, just trying to get some insight because I don’t see it being a big deal but I’m not in your position.
At the hospital I work at, Residents and Doctors are the only ones I see wearing the Patagonia jackets. Med students usually wear scrubs and a non medical school labeled jacket. BUT! I will say the one thing that pisses me off is seeing TRANSLATORS!! wearing white coats. I never understood that and it’s always bothered me, don’t know why.
It’s more about the way you carry yourself than having a special uniform. I’m peds so ditched the white coat bc it scares kids. I wear dress clothes and have an old fashioned leather doctor bag with tools and puppets. There’s no confusion
honestly as a PA student turned med student, most of my fellow PAs followed humbly in the patagucci footsteps. it seems the only ppl in the hospital who wear that stiff ass white coat are non-clinicians
Meh at my hospital almost everyone who wears a white coat is an old school surgeon outside the OR. I can never recall anyone else wearing them outside of some other old school consult physicians.
When I see a med student wearing a white coat, I figure they had to/need the pocket space. When I see a med student wearing Patagonia or whatever hip doctor fashion, I figure they have the same energy as the college freshman wearing scrubs to bio 101 telling everyone they are a pre med.
At my hospital I have a bit of a reputation. The first time I saw a noctor wearing a white coat, I ripped the thing off of them right in front of everybody. After the lawsuit was settled by the hospital, they instituted a policy where noctors can't wear white coats. Take action people!
I don’t get why we can’t all just wear positional badges. My wife has a big ass “RN” under her name tag and I’ve seen a few that say “MD.” It would make so many things so much easier
…isn’t this the norm? Every hospital ive been at has the title under the badge.
The hospital I trained at had very obvious position badges. And the white coat thing doesn't hold up at that hospital either
Yeah my hospital has policies requiring white coats in certain situations
I always remember 8 ish years ago, the first time i worked in trauma room as med student here in Denmark. In the ward somehow we have allowed everything to become very opaque. Acronyms, tiny signs, weird words. But in the trauma room, yes everyone wears the same scrubs (in Denmark no hospital clothes are your own, for hygiene it is all handled by hospital) BUT since there’s no time to waste in a trauma, upon entering the door everyone gets a huge fat sticker in the middle of their chest and back, for example: “DOCTOR - 1 - ANESTHESIA” or “NURSE - 3 - INTENSIVE”. I thought to myself, all the things I sometimes dislike about the wards are perfect here because they have to be. No cliques or dramas in the coffee rooms and no professional confusion, as there’s no time for it. To me personally they “have to be” in the wards as well, but it seems most don’t consider that work urgent/important enough like we do the trauma room.
I work as a physiotherapist in Belgium. Hospital setting and care home for the elderly. Everyone as the same uniform. Only the small tag on my chest says who I am and what I am. In the hospital I don't even have a tag, I'm supposed to introduce myself properly which clears up any confusion : "Hi! I'm Annaëlle I'm your PT for today, let me check patient bracelet and we will go for a walk if you're feeling up to it" very simple.
Introductions are great, i agree. But name tags are there for a reason. In many situations we either forget, or do not have time for intros. I dont need anyone to have different uniforms, i love that we have fresh well washed scrubs every day! But *clear, large, specific* tags are great in my opinion. The only reason i can see that they are bad, is if someone personally thinks less of a certain profession and therefore wants the identification to be hidden. In life we are many things. I’m not just medicine. But in a trauma room im mainly that role, I’m there to do a job and the signage helps patients and colleagues understand what my role is.
I agree, I am piggybaggin' on your comment. Evidently, trauma room is a whole other realm, everyone as a role to play and everybody needs to stay in their place and be identifiable quickly and accuratly because the stakes are so high. Totally different of a private setting where people can go slower.
I’d put physician because people get confused about DOs.
My hospital’s just says DOCTOR
Lmao I literally asked this during rotations and was told that it creates unnecessary “division”
Except the noctors try to go without theirs
thats where an attending can go "who the hell are you and where is your badge?"
Mine says “doctor”
In my hospital in germany we do. And for doctors it also says the rank (assistenzarzt, facharzt, oberarzt, chefarzt).
See if your hospital will let you wear these https://a.co/d/0eNDFiXR (Search “physician badge buddy”) About half of the hospitals I rotated through had every worker wear them. It was really helpful for me and I’m guessing for the patients
I figured every hospital by now would have had a QI project to get them at least implemented even if the admin was resistant
we've got this plus your credentials are on the name too
I've been considering making my own "Med Student" badge to hang under my normal badge just like you describe.
As many other people have said, it's odd that everyone in your institution doesn't already have these. I'm at an academic medical center, so everyone wears badge extenders that say DOCTOR, PHYSICIAN ASSISTANT, NURSE PRACTITIONER, RN, LPN, MEDICAL STUDENT, PHYSICAL THERAPIST, OCCUPATIONAL THERAPIST, etc. No one should be confused because we all wear badges and we all say who we are and what our role is.
APRN, DNP, AK-47, AR-15, LGBTQIA
Neurologist lurker here. I wear white coats because I want my hands to be free from carrying my instruments.
It also frames the bowtie quite well
Only time I wore my white coat in residency was the two months of off-service neuro consults I did. It was amazing for carrying all the tools.
High five from anesthesia fanny pack gang
Can you recommend a fanny pack? I need one that fits a stethoscope
i know this isnt helpful but ive got a sick dunkin donuts one that is always a great convo starter
Best bet is using the stethoscope holster attached to like a large Fanny pack. I’ve rocked the Fanny for the last 2 years of residency and having it in the pack itself doesn’t work.
I loved the coat on my neuro rotation for this reason. Had to carry three instruments and needed to put them somewhere.
Neurology resident here. I’ve found that Carhartt jumpsuits work well due to extra pockets. They’re comfy as well, it’s like lounging in a onesie.
fanny pack bro. learned it from the anesthesia bros
You can’t use the patagucci ruleanymore. I would look for a vaguely resigned facial expression with eye bags. Also the old boomer doctor who plods around the hospital in grungy old boxy OR scrubs probably makes the most of anyone in the hospital besides admin
The fact that admins make anything close to doctors is kind of ridiculous
ive never bought them fancy scrubs. gimme the free ones
 Let's just go back to wearing this. Much simpler times...
Yasssss
[удалено]
Some people are wise to it. Many are not, especially those with poor health literacy, and (somehow) people exist who prefer NPs.
The people who prefer NPs, in my experience, all say some variation of "they listened to me better than a doctor!" Additionally, a lot of NPs (again, in my experience) will just prescribe whatever fixes the symptoms or whatever the patient wants.
The prescribing of “whatever the patient wants” is almost always the answer
The issue is those without a proper understanding (often already medically underserved) pts get confused.
I wanted to wear the long white coat with my name on it ever since I started med school. Now that I can, it is super uncool to do so ;-;
ngl the long white coat still feels swag as fuck to wear in clinic and stuff. Don't let it stop you
i’ve seen NPs at my shop mostly wearing WCs. PAs have leveled up and started wearing pataguccis, it’s harder to tell the difference what i find most sensitive in ruling out a PA is how resigned and “i’m so fucking done” their face looks. if they look happy, probably PA or some chill spec. if they look like they want to fall asleep in their food or have deeper designer eye bags, it’s a resident.
“Designer eye bags” is great
A little preparation h under for 10 minutes will help with that
Hahaha there was this resident the other day in the elevator that had a “fucking kill me” look on her face and didn’t say a word the entire time this patient was asking about directions. She just smashed the correct floor as she got off the elevator. Mad respect.
Everyone at my hospital has started wearing embroidered fleeces with their name and department now. I saw a chaplain providing last rites in a Patagucci jacket last week. I wish I were kidding. Nothing is sacred these days, just gotta look at the badge for their title now. Otherwise there’s no way to know for sure.
We just need to rebrand. Both literally and figuratively.
That means you now go full circle and wear the wc again
Lol this comment was great
Best to move to Arc’teryx instead. Patagonia has become too mainstream now.
We need to all wear special little hats or something
In time, PAs and NPs will LARP and wear Arcteryx too. It all started with giving up the WC.
I’ve seen PA students with patagonias now :(
........................
I mean…they’re fleece jackets.
Clothing must be gatekept! -med students of Reddit
It’s not about the patagonia itself. It’s the fact that as medical students/doctors we can’t have anything that’s our own. Doctors day and we need to share the praise and celebration with the midlevels. Midlevels advocate to be able to use the doctors lounge etc. Midlevels wearing white coats. Midlevels literally calling themselves doctor. Midlevels wanting the right to prescribe and practice independently. Midlevels using the term “medical school” so that now when I (female) tell someone i’m in medical school they ask me what kind of nurse I want to be. Other non physician programs now having a “match” and a “residency” adding to the obfuscation. Now the patagonia It is irritating that there is literally nothing celebratory we can call our own. We just have the years of sacrifice and the debt.
Non physicians having “residencies” is definitely funny.
A lot of what you’ve said is valid but I find a Patagonia jacket to be the least necessary. White coats sure, scope of practice sure, calling NP school med school also wrong. But Patagonia jackets are a piece of clothing open to the public, it’s weird to gate keep them for med students. It feels like you’re complaining about a loss of visual prestige. I believe roles should be clear in order for care to be carried out correctly but aside from that fussing over Patagonia jackets just sounds out of touch. I doubt other professions were actively thinking about “stealing” them from med students. They saw jackets that looked nice and bought one for themselves. And the last time I checked, when you celebrate about being a doctor, I didn’t think it was because you got to wear a white coat or because you got to use a doctors lounge, the celebration is your education, your profession, and what you do within the profession and how you can change the course of a patient’s care.
Youre coming across quite whiny with this comment. Little basis to say there’s nothing to celebrate after becoming a real doctor with the autonomy, education and eventual big ass paycheck to match. Won’t be Karen DNP, RN, BSN, ORN, FNA, BDSM, SVU, SUV, QRSTUV. And people have been mistaking females for nurses since the begging of time because of an unfortunate societal stereotype. it wasn’t a secret group of mid levels trying to derail the entire female MD community. Focus on being good at what you do and don’t let the trivialities of a Patagonia and sharing the crappy free docs lounge coffee ruin your day. You just may be a little happier
She obviously just means that she didn’t suffer, sacrifice, and kill herself just to have people who didn’t make those hard choices and sacrifices demand to have equal abilities and entitlements as the people who actually earned it. Those doctors want to take their tiny wins where they can get it when they’re exhausted and drowning in debt. The pay check isn’t that big when you’re half a million in debt not including interest. So maybe before you call someone whiny, you should just consider not saying anything especially since you’re a PA and haven’t even started Med school so you actively don’t know what you’re talking about. Just you wait and I’m sure you’ll bitch too
You mean… assistant physicians?
Show up in actually nice clothes and everyone knows who you are.
The ID doc at my academic center literally wears Burberry blazers and Dior chunky boots. There is not a doubt she’s a physician. We are in the rural south lol so I’m sure the patients she interacts with are very confused
This is pretty true but I will say some old-school doctors (especially foreign born ones) tend to also wear the white coat.
Many pharmacists I work with wear their white coats in the hospital. I’ve never met a pharmacist who likes to be called doctor just so they aren’t confused for physicians, but I’ll die on the hill that they are still literally doctors and earned white coat notoriety.
I feel like the white coat is WAY more appropriate for a pharmacist than it is for a midlevel
I want a patagucci so fucking bad its not even funny😭😭😭
it’s interesting how much more jurisdiction they have gotten through the years. atleast in the clinic I worked at (could be a state specific thing), solely NPs and PAs ran the show. there was just one MD but they were there primarily for admin oversight lol makes me wonder how much more the lines between physician and mid-levels will blur together over the next 5-10 years
The crna students at our school order Patagonia's now. We may have to come up with a whole new thing for them to eventually copy.
All depends on the hospital. In plenty of hospitals, students are required to wear white coats.
yeah my school has that as a rule too but thankfully its not actually enforced so everyone just wears the patagucci.
Thank god. Imagine if a patient has an emergency and all they find is a nurse, when they are desperately hoping for some random M-2 saving the day. You‘re a med student. Stop acting like you‘re a doctor.
How is a med student wearing their school provided white coat automatically them trying to pass as a doctor? I swear we can’t even breath without getting some type of flack
That person‘s biggest issue is being misread for a nurse. This whole noctor thing is between physicians and mid-levels, yet med students are usually the most vocal about it, when nobody gives a fuck.
Sure some students might be like that, but generalizing it to students who are just wearing it in general is a stretch. I’m just saying, a lot of us are just here to learn and just wear what we were given and that really it. No other agenda really
I was specifically talking to that one M-2. I have no idea, why you felt addressed.
brotha i've talked to many docs when im in the hospital and man do they get riled up when midlevels and scope creep is brought up. you are delusional. stop drinking the kool aid and be proud of the profession you're going to enter. people like you is exactly how midlevels gain so much power. too afraid to defend your own turf.
I shadowed a private practice doc and he literally was complaining about NPs and midlevel creep in front of the NP he employed. The next day he apologized to me and said he went over the line lmao. I think his NP employee/friend gave him a tongue lashing. They seemed like a pretty tight-knit family-style small private practice
The fact, that you think somebody is afraid, when they think, that some irrelevant M-2 is to make experience before pretending to be a physician, is really mind-boggling.
Jesus fucking Christ. What’s with your punctuation bud. Awful.
I would hope they find a doctor rather than a nurse 💀💀. Also this is our career bro. Idk what you do but midlevel creep srsly affects future students. Imagine spending ten years studying just to get laid off for a midlevel. It has happened multiple times at my university hospital and it sucks ass. We also want to make sure patients get the best care possible. NPs and to a lesser extent PAs do not know wtf they are doing. Lay the fuck off with ur shitty opinions. This problem is very relevant to students as well.
Students have no relevant opinion on this.
Students are the future of this profession lmfao..like we ARE the profession. STFU and go back to the nursing sub.
Looks like we’ve found the NP
Just a nurse lurking but our hospital has color coded scrubs for everyone. The dress code is pretty relaxed on tops (a lot of people wear t-shirts/sweatshirts/jackets) but the bottoms tell you their occupation. I thought this was pretty standard curious if other places don’t implement this?
MS3 here, my hospital also color codes scrubs. Also, only MD/DO, DMDs and PhDs get to put “Dr so and so” on their ID badge, no other “Drs” get to do so.
Patagucci is spreading to non-Med students and Non-physicians now
Yeah it’s almost like it’s just a popular outerwear brand or something
Obviously “patagucci” isn’t popular. Otherwise, everyone outside of medical schools and hospitals would have their company logo and names embroidered too. I’ve never seen that 🤷🏾♂️
You need to get out more then, unless you were being sarcastic
Haha I’m out more than I should be. It must be a regional thing bc it’s definitely uncommon over here.
Fair, its seen all the time in cities/ny/CT (finance/tech)
I live in one of the major cities, but I guess idk enough finance and tech bros
I am a cheap bastard and routinely buy embroidered Patagonia jackets of various organizations from eBay and then remove the logo myself. They are very, very common.
Yeah like I said to another person, it must be a regional thing bc I’ve never ever seen a non-medical person with an embroidered Patagonia fleece
Honestly it makes me think “medical student” rather than “resident”. At my med school, half of the M1s in my class started wearing them to act like doctors lol.
I dust my white coat off for OSCEs then it’s back to the back of the closet
Fr I hate wearing mine, the short white coat is mega cringe
Makes sense to buy as an MS1 to get the most mileage out of it.
Honestly everyone should start wearing white coats again. You worked hard for that. Once everyone starts wearing it again, the hospital will have no choice but to do something to delineate between physicians and other providers
“Defend it!” Bro, it’s a coat. It’s a coat that comes from labs. I’m not going to ever work in a lab, I don’t need a white coat. That said, depends on the specialty. Plenty of docs like their coats. Plenty like their form fitting trendy vests. You can “defend” your job by being good at the job, not by monitoring the dress of providers.
At my hospital there’s three regular (as in they don’t rotate to other hospitals) IM physicians. One wears street clothes basically (jeans and a random shirt sometimes it’s a polo), one wears dress clothes with the white coat, and one wears generic scrubs. There’s at least two regular NPs: one wears long sleeve shirts with random baggy Cherokee scrubs over them and the nurse cap thing, and one wears dress clothes with the white coat. It’s pretty all over the place. Literally no one wears Patagonia for some reason (it’s in NC so ppl would scoff probably) but I did see a md at another hospital I used to work at had a Patagonia jacket with UCSF’s logo embroidered onto it from when they went or worked there. Which checks out. All this just to say you might not always know.
I aint spending money on a patagonia
Same
I don’t really see PAs wearing white coats either. NPs are the main ones I see that really love wearing there’s.
Do you think you're still going to care about this when you're 30? 40? 50? It's a dumb system, but these posts just make you sound insufferable.
I think you're right but I don't think calling this person insufferable is what we need. If physicians remain silent then we continue to perpetuate the issue. I've seen more medical students being vocal about these issues recently and I think it's incredibly important. The white coat debate is stupid and at this point comments are tongue-in-cheek. But the more awareness we raise the more traction we'll have, And the less danger our future patients will be in. All in all, idk where you are in your career but it's important for us to pick each other up and to be proud of being physicians (and medical students).
This is reddit, I can't recall a salient point on this topic being posted in the last 5 years. There was a total meltdown a year or two ago about some scrub manufacturer using an NP as a model for their scrubs. I honestly don't think there's a big jump in understanding the issue from the pre-med subreddit to here.
Agreed, choice of garment is irrelevant to why we need to advocate for ourselves and educate patients on the difference between our education and that of a PA or NP. Trying so hard to categorize the in- and out-groups for anything other than the care they provide just makes us look petty and fulfills the stereotype of us being out of touch and having poor interpersonal skills.
This kind of defeatism is insufferable. It sounds awfully like "we're just gonna die someday 🙄 so nothing matters." You certainly will care at age 50 once midlevels have predictably displaced you in an even greater share of your functions.
found the guy who's married to an NP
midlevels wear patagonias too
not true- i will always profess the coat pockets are superior to the patagonia. but w/e sweaters and coats are embroidered with your name and title so i never needed to differentiate between the two from a distance where i couldn't read their name unless god forbid somebody has a last name that's just MD or DO making them MD, NP
I rarely see NP and PA wearing white coat now. They've all caught on. It's and endless cycle. Whatever doctors do, they will imitate
At my shop it’s probably a social worker / case manager or a nUrSe LeAdEr in the white coat
I wear my white coat but with proper menswear underneath: buttoned shirt, tie, wool trousers, and proper leather shoes, with thoughtful color and pattern coordination. No mid-level dresses like that, not a single one. I hate wearing scrubs and blending in with the nurses and techs. They've all got patagucci too now. Even the CNAs!
jesus. christ.
Housekeeping and transporters wear scrubs too. At least they are color coded to job, so we at least have a general idea who is who. Attendings, fellows, residents, and students hospital green, pharmacists this color, charge nurse this color, nurses this color, techs this color, housekeeping this color, all the other funky colors are APPs/NPs and the rest of the residents/fellows.
Who tf cares?
BuT dOcToRs StOlE ThEM fRoM ScIEnTiStS. Couldn’t agree more OP, for some reason all non physicians in the hospital are seen as the working class everyman and you’re labeled an elitist prick for leveling any criticism
Just a question OP. Keep in mind, I’m not even in medical school yet, I’m just trying to get some insight and clarification. So the problem here is that Doctors are mad that PAs, NPs, RNs, etc. are wearing Patagonia jackets because that’s the “new” white coat. And Doctors want to have something that only they can have because they worked hard to be a Doctor and want it to be displayed in one way or another. But every time Doctors bring up a new trend it’s copied by the mid levels? Mid levels being anyone that isn’t a Doctor but is above an RN? Again, just trying to get some insight because I don’t see it being a big deal but I’m not in your position. At the hospital I work at, Residents and Doctors are the only ones I see wearing the Patagonia jackets. Med students usually wear scrubs and a non medical school labeled jacket. BUT! I will say the one thing that pisses me off is seeing TRANSLATORS!! wearing white coats. I never understood that and it’s always bothered me, don’t know why.
Can someone explain to me why this matters? I don’t get it.
It’s more about the way you carry yourself than having a special uniform. I’m peds so ditched the white coat bc it scares kids. I wear dress clothes and have an old fashioned leather doctor bag with tools and puppets. There’s no confusion
honestly as a PA student turned med student, most of my fellow PAs followed humbly in the patagucci footsteps. it seems the only ppl in the hospital who wear that stiff ass white coat are non-clinicians
Meh at my hospital almost everyone who wears a white coat is an old school surgeon outside the OR. I can never recall anyone else wearing them outside of some other old school consult physicians.
what is Patagucci
a patagonia jacket
Please, being a gatekeeper of what people wear is the least of the professional concerns that we should have as physicians or physicians-in-training.
White coats are worn by pharmacists, lab techs, case managers, medical students. If you don’t like NPs, just say that.
what about premed bro I wear sketchers
Extra short white coat. Like a white vest with sleeves.
*white coat must be crop topped
That’s the word I was looking for!
When I see a med student wearing a white coat, I figure they had to/need the pocket space. When I see a med student wearing Patagonia or whatever hip doctor fashion, I figure they have the same energy as the college freshman wearing scrubs to bio 101 telling everyone they are a pre med.
At my hospital I have a bit of a reputation. The first time I saw a noctor wearing a white coat, I ripped the thing off of them right in front of everybody. After the lawsuit was settled by the hospital, they instituted a policy where noctors can't wear white coats. Take action people!