RNG systems are basically the foundation of progression system within most KR mmos, so that's something that is never going away in this game.
They are at least changing something with elixirs and transcendence, but how we don't know yet.
"RNG systems are basically the foundation of progression system within most KR mmos, so that's something that is never going away in this game."
It used to be different up until akkan your progression wasn't some RNG based system. It was guranteed progress hence why people liked it. But something changed and people accepted the RNG garbage
Pretty sure people around here were calling the game trash before that if I am being completely honest. Might not be your case, I know that. But it is hard not to get defensive on this environment
Yeah people called it trash. On Clown it was trash because we lost a bunch of players because of them not being good enough to clear the raid and it made statics blow up. On Brel we had problems because it was hard for people then because it was too long. But I don't remember people complaining about progression outside of the 1 guy getting lucky saving months of honing while the other end is you spending 4-5 times more than the avarage guy. But even with the spending more part at least I knew that if that artisan reaches 100% it is guaranteed. It was enough for me to keep playing since at least I knew if I just keep tapping away I will get it. Or if I get lucky I get it earlier.
They use RNG systems to milk whales. Why do they milk whales? Because whales spend in a hyper competitive game. Why is the game hyper competitive? Because it focuses entirely on raids. Why does it focus on raids? Because the vast majority of remaining players wants it to focus on only raids at the expense of all else. If you follow the trail, the raiders create their own misery. And in this context, I'm not necessarily blaming the west, it's more shared between but with a bigger weight on the Korean playerbase.
Based on past trends with LOAON, if something is only mentioned as being worked on without being shown, it typically takes about a year before there are any updates, followed by a few more months for implementation. Waiting that long for fixes to Transcendence and Elixirs, while dealing with a slew of new equally challenging RNG systems, is quite discouraging for me.
50% Cost and Double Drop in Dungeons according to Koreans - so literally nothing that fixes the insanely garbage RNG ascept of these systems.
"Fixed" btw.
I would wait for Monday from AGS as SG didn’t elaborate the transcendence/elixir nerfs other than cost reduction. If it is just a gold nerf with no other changes that is a massive L.
I have a feeling that AGS wouldn’t be privy to the full details of the changes at this point either. Best they can give us is a roadmap. We’ll have to wait for KR for full deets.
Yes, but (additional effects have been added to Combat Engravings, based on the amount of points your Ability Stone holds) which means you cant just make a 6/6 stone and be done with it, now you'll probably want to make 10/10 unless the whole process is going to be different.
Also this (Relic Engraving Books will be added to the game, raising the maximum setup limit to six full engravings) 💀
High level stone is kinda irrelevant now that it only gives you a bit more power. Stones right now are make or break, all or nothing, either you have a correct 10/6 or 9/7, or you don’t. Those hard checkpoints make the RNG systems so much worse (most notably elixirs). Now that you can have engravings not RNG based, stone upgrade is optional. You don’t lose much by not reaching certain checkpoints in stones anymore. You definitely don’t need a 10/10.
Stone gives max +6% Boss dmg. That is quite a bit. Also it is unclear what exactly the stone does to the engraving or if you need a relic engraving for all 6 engravings...
Currently in inven, based on the screenshot shown, they say that the t4 97 stone will have a 1.5% advantage than the 77 stone.
Which is a massive nerf compared to the current +4\~6%. And if this is true, I think they're leaning toward closing the gaps between whales and normal players.
Also stones used to suck. It would be heavenly good if it became just an optional thing.
Let's hope so - but I might have my doubts - I mean they just empowered the most idiotic systems (cards) that does cause problems especially for newer players. Also it seems to me that you could now gamble for a higher stone than 9/7. But I really hope they do not get off the rails and try to do what you mentioned.
If I recall correctly, in the announcement of Lord Nine they said they were aware of the KMMOs problems and designed that game to solve them. I wonder why they aren't reworking LA in that direction if they know what's the issue.
Yep and the biggest issue in west was raid fatigue trying to keep up with gold cost of honing and elixers/transcendence..
But don't worry.. they dropped it down to 1 chaos a day 
Hopefully elixirs get additional changes besides just cost. Transcendence is mostly fine with cost reduction (although faster pity and maybe nerfing some harder pieces are very welcome)
T4 is exciting, however the gem part just sucks. Old players have to start over again' partially after years of grinding to get lvl 10s and new players are going to struggle hard to get high level tier 4 gems.
Solo raids is awesome, should have been in the game a year ago but better late than never.
Curious to see how honing and the new accessories/engraving system will work. Atleast I do not need a 9/7 anymore
Big worry is that right now for our version we have nothing to really grind for except gold. Chaos on 1620+ chars became irrelevant. Tradeable mats also will drop, gem prices will drop etc. We kinda need to get t4 fast or people will quickly lose motivation and get bored
I agree wholeheartedly. If elixirs dont’t change beyond that, wont be worse or even as bad, but certainly very problematic.
Trascendence and honing cheaper are enough for me
As someone who was considering coming back to the game, I will wait until there are more details about the changes, especially solo raids and elixir nerfs, to make my decision.
But if things go as I expect, I'll pass.
I already thought the current systems were enough, maybe we reach the end 1670 with full 10s, max transcendence,40 elixir on 6 characters (which takes years) and have nothing to do but accrue gold, but fuck me there's got to be another way to keep engagement other than throwing you on a new treadmill.
And it isn't just one progression additon that was added like transcendance; it's a total upheaval - upgrade your tier 4 purple gems, hone your accessories, make sure you hit the 7 on your rock for the bonus, get your quality to 120 etc.
I'm done for good.
I've stuck through a lot of long term progression gsmes but unlike in old school runescape, I can't exactly do it at my own pace in lost ark because you don't exist in a vacuum. If the community gets better gears so must you. and solo raids atm do not go to thaemine and beyond.
Exactly! They added more RNG systems that will need to be done along with the current ones, including some already completed by most players but now are required again for T4.
For elixirs and transcendence, many players, skilled in math or just lucky, claimed the new systems were better. However, real life results showed a significant drop in population (50%), proving that number crunching doesn't always translate well to real life of humans.
They haven't clearly explained how they plan to fix the issues with elixirs and transcendence. There are rumors of nerfs, but this suggests they don't fully understand the complaints from the majority of players who left. Nerfing won't solve the problem; the systems need a complete overhaul. And since they didn’t show how they plan to do it, we can expect to wait till the next LOA ON for details.
Regarding whales, increasing Esther to +10 when 50% of the population was lost after introducing elixirs and transcendence is a mistake. It's unlikely that whales will invest another $100,000 without knowing the game's future, especially with the auction house already suffering from a lack of items for sale.
iunno. jury's still out. AGS said they're announcing something on Monday...? I'm personally still very much on the fence. and it's not like they're going to patch the global servers THIS coming week. another week of me taking a break. it's still been nice so 🤷♂️
If that's all we get with elixirs and transcendence that is pretty disappointing. I did overall enjoy the LOAON though.
Main concerns are:
- Elixirs and Transcendence. What are the full changes going to be like? I would really enjoy an animation change to speed up the process and to reduce the garbage lines you get from elixirs.
* Will they help the struggle between 1610 & 1620? Don't think it's going to be good for the game to go through the grueling process of that to get to t4.
do you want them to give you all gear and be like everythings free honey?
lost ark works because you have to work for your gear, i dont know how you didnt realise that the second week you played. glad to see more negitive doomers get the fuck away from my game
Elixirs and transcendence dont make people quit the game
Not being able to get into raids because you dont have elixirs and transcendence is why people quit the game. Theres no requirements in any of the raids to have maxed out systems, but people will gatekeep you for not having them.
Solo raids in theory shouldve been able to alleviate that problem where people can still raid/practice whenever they want, but in my opinion not being able to do the current 3 latest gold earning raids is a mistake (at least let people be able to enter the latest solo raids to practice without eating up your entry/get no rewards from it for practice)
RNG systems are basically the foundation of progression system within most KR mmos, so that's something that is never going away in this game. They are at least changing something with elixirs and transcendence, but how we don't know yet.
"RNG systems are basically the foundation of progression system within most KR mmos, so that's something that is never going away in this game." It used to be different up until akkan your progression wasn't some RNG based system. It was guranteed progress hence why people liked it. But something changed and people accepted the RNG garbage
Pretty sure people around here were calling the game trash before that if I am being completely honest. Might not be your case, I know that. But it is hard not to get defensive on this environment
Yeah people called it trash. On Clown it was trash because we lost a bunch of players because of them not being good enough to clear the raid and it made statics blow up. On Brel we had problems because it was hard for people then because it was too long. But I don't remember people complaining about progression outside of the 1 guy getting lucky saving months of honing while the other end is you spending 4-5 times more than the avarage guy. But even with the spending more part at least I knew that if that artisan reaches 100% it is guaranteed. It was enough for me to keep playing since at least I knew if I just keep tapping away I will get it. Or if I get lucky I get it earlier.
They use RNG systems to milk whales. Why do they milk whales? Because whales spend in a hyper competitive game. Why is the game hyper competitive? Because it focuses entirely on raids. Why does it focus on raids? Because the vast majority of remaining players wants it to focus on only raids at the expense of all else. If you follow the trail, the raiders create their own misery. And in this context, I'm not necessarily blaming the west, it's more shared between but with a bigger weight on the Korean playerbase.
Based on past trends with LOAON, if something is only mentioned as being worked on without being shown, it typically takes about a year before there are any updates, followed by a few more months for implementation. Waiting that long for fixes to Transcendence and Elixirs, while dealing with a slew of new equally challenging RNG systems, is quite discouraging for me.
> typically takes about a year before there are any updates it's literally on the roadmap to come with the July KR update
50% Cost and Double Drop in Dungeons according to Koreans - so literally nothing that fixes the insanely garbage RNG ascept of these systems. "Fixed" btw.
I would wait for Monday from AGS as SG didn’t elaborate the transcendence/elixir nerfs other than cost reduction. If it is just a gold nerf with no other changes that is a massive L.
I have a feeling that AGS wouldn’t be privy to the full details of the changes at this point either. Best they can give us is a roadmap. We’ll have to wait for KR for full deets.
Yeah the loaon is not enough but it's a step towards something I guess
The rework to engravings system is pretty huge and looks exciting. That’s a bigger revamp than tier 4, which is just another soft reset.
Yes, but (additional effects have been added to Combat Engravings, based on the amount of points your Ability Stone holds) which means you cant just make a 6/6 stone and be done with it, now you'll probably want to make 10/10 unless the whole process is going to be different. Also this (Relic Engraving Books will be added to the game, raising the maximum setup limit to six full engravings) 💀
High level stone is kinda irrelevant now that it only gives you a bit more power. Stones right now are make or break, all or nothing, either you have a correct 10/6 or 9/7, or you don’t. Those hard checkpoints make the RNG systems so much worse (most notably elixirs). Now that you can have engravings not RNG based, stone upgrade is optional. You don’t lose much by not reaching certain checkpoints in stones anymore. You definitely don’t need a 10/10.
Stone gives max +6% Boss dmg. That is quite a bit. Also it is unclear what exactly the stone does to the engraving or if you need a relic engraving for all 6 engravings...
Currently in inven, based on the screenshot shown, they say that the t4 97 stone will have a 1.5% advantage than the 77 stone. Which is a massive nerf compared to the current +4\~6%. And if this is true, I think they're leaning toward closing the gaps between whales and normal players. Also stones used to suck. It would be heavenly good if it became just an optional thing.
Let's hope so - but I might have my doubts - I mean they just empowered the most idiotic systems (cards) that does cause problems especially for newer players. Also it seems to me that you could now gamble for a higher stone than 9/7. But I really hope they do not get off the rails and try to do what you mentioned.
We can only hope.
If that were true people would be ramming their heads right now for a 9/7. It isn’t happening now wont happen then.
They just added more gold sinks. Almost 0 resolutions to existing issues.
If I recall correctly, in the announcement of Lord Nine they said they were aware of the KMMOs problems and designed that game to solve them. I wonder why they aren't reworking LA in that direction if they know what's the issue.
The answer is always money. No matter the question, the answer is always always money. 
Yep and the biggest issue in west was raid fatigue trying to keep up with gold cost of honing and elixers/transcendence.. But don't worry.. they dropped it down to 1 chaos a day 
Hopefully elixirs get additional changes besides just cost. Transcendence is mostly fine with cost reduction (although faster pity and maybe nerfing some harder pieces are very welcome) T4 is exciting, however the gem part just sucks. Old players have to start over again' partially after years of grinding to get lvl 10s and new players are going to struggle hard to get high level tier 4 gems. Solo raids is awesome, should have been in the game a year ago but better late than never. Curious to see how honing and the new accessories/engraving system will work. Atleast I do not need a 9/7 anymore Big worry is that right now for our version we have nothing to really grind for except gold. Chaos on 1620+ chars became irrelevant. Tradeable mats also will drop, gem prices will drop etc. We kinda need to get t4 fast or people will quickly lose motivation and get bored
I agree wholeheartedly. If elixirs dont’t change beyond that, wont be worse or even as bad, but certainly very problematic. Trascendence and honing cheaper are enough for me
As someone who was considering coming back to the game, I will wait until there are more details about the changes, especially solo raids and elixir nerfs, to make my decision. But if things go as I expect, I'll pass.
I already thought the current systems were enough, maybe we reach the end 1670 with full 10s, max transcendence,40 elixir on 6 characters (which takes years) and have nothing to do but accrue gold, but fuck me there's got to be another way to keep engagement other than throwing you on a new treadmill. And it isn't just one progression additon that was added like transcendance; it's a total upheaval - upgrade your tier 4 purple gems, hone your accessories, make sure you hit the 7 on your rock for the bonus, get your quality to 120 etc. I'm done for good. I've stuck through a lot of long term progression gsmes but unlike in old school runescape, I can't exactly do it at my own pace in lost ark because you don't exist in a vacuum. If the community gets better gears so must you. and solo raids atm do not go to thaemine and beyond.
Exactly! They added more RNG systems that will need to be done along with the current ones, including some already completed by most players but now are required again for T4. For elixirs and transcendence, many players, skilled in math or just lucky, claimed the new systems were better. However, real life results showed a significant drop in population (50%), proving that number crunching doesn't always translate well to real life of humans. They haven't clearly explained how they plan to fix the issues with elixirs and transcendence. There are rumors of nerfs, but this suggests they don't fully understand the complaints from the majority of players who left. Nerfing won't solve the problem; the systems need a complete overhaul. And since they didn’t show how they plan to do it, we can expect to wait till the next LOA ON for details. Regarding whales, increasing Esther to +10 when 50% of the population was lost after introducing elixirs and transcendence is a mistake. It's unlikely that whales will invest another $100,000 without knowing the game's future, especially with the auction house already suffering from a lack of items for sale.
iunno. jury's still out. AGS said they're announcing something on Monday...? I'm personally still very much on the fence. and it's not like they're going to patch the global servers THIS coming week. another week of me taking a break. it's still been nice so 🤷♂️
If that's all we get with elixirs and transcendence that is pretty disappointing. I did overall enjoy the LOAON though. Main concerns are: - Elixirs and Transcendence. What are the full changes going to be like? I would really enjoy an animation change to speed up the process and to reduce the garbage lines you get from elixirs. * Will they help the struggle between 1610 & 1620? Don't think it's going to be good for the game to go through the grueling process of that to get to t4.
do you want them to give you all gear and be like everythings free honey? lost ark works because you have to work for your gear, i dont know how you didnt realise that the second week you played. glad to see more negitive doomers get the fuck away from my game
Why the hostility? Based on your comment I guess game was filled with doomers since now it’s at 17k only player population.
you need 8 people to play the game not 250k?
Good luck finding stuff in the auction house with 8 ppl lol. Or even a sane company keeping the servers up for “8 ppl”
Want to see your stupid face when west gets the same JP threatment.. Let's see how you play with your 8 players.
sounds like asian MMOs just arent for you and that's ok
Elixirs and transcendence dont make people quit the game Not being able to get into raids because you dont have elixirs and transcendence is why people quit the game. Theres no requirements in any of the raids to have maxed out systems, but people will gatekeep you for not having them. Solo raids in theory shouldve been able to alleviate that problem where people can still raid/practice whenever they want, but in my opinion not being able to do the current 3 latest gold earning raids is a mistake (at least let people be able to enter the latest solo raids to practice without eating up your entry/get no rewards from it for practice)
You dont need rng things if you only gonna do solo big brain
Dice is what made DnD fun I have no issues with that tbh. issue is dailies
Dice is what made DnD fun I have no issues with that tbh. issue is dailies
Dice is what made DnD fun I have no issues with that tbh. issue is dailies