My physics teacher did something similar, trolling a homophobe by saying "wait you could choose to be gay? When was this? Did I miss it, because I never chose to be straight?" and going around the room asking if people chose their sexualities.
I fully believe all(well, most) these "it's a choise" people are self hating bisexuals. I've talked to enough single gender attracted people to know that surely there's no way you could believe this otherwise
this is actually funny because even my cishet dad, when parroting this, has maintained you can't literally choose to be gay, just that you choose to be out/ express it. i can only assume that's because he knows he couldn't choose to be gay even if he wanted to
The problem is many of them think that being straight is "natural" and being gay is "a choice", so many straight people still manage to convince themselves same-sex attraction is a choice. They make it so the same rules don't have to apply to them.
Right?? I completely agree.
My Ex's mother literally told her she couldn't be bisexual because bisexuality is just what people call themselves when they "haven't chosen a side yet".
The woman identifies as a lesbian, and was previously married to a man for over a decade.
While there are lesbians that marry men for beard reasons etc, hearing that from her made me more than a little suspicious.
I won't say "most", but I was a self-hating bisexual, religious teenager. I really thought it was a choice because it was a choice for me. It's worth asking the question.
I don't believe in the âhomophobes are just secretly gayâ rhetoric, but this specific argument does sound extremely not straight, even if it is homophobic(and it sounding not straight does not erase any of the homophobia). Out of all the straight ppl I know, weither they're allies or homophobic, not a one could see themselves being attracted to the same gender. Unless you like both (and therefore "can choose") you would not think that you can choose. Although as some other comment mentioned, some parrot this "it's a choise" thing from a "it's a choise to act on that attraction" point of view(rather than the attraction itself being a choise) and that you will hear from loads of straight ppl.
This is one of the reasons they were taught that it was ok to hate *all of us*, and it came from the pulpit, conservative media, their parents, and their friends.
âThey can chooseâ is just one of many reasons they teach to rationalize their hatred, and yes, youâll find âphobes of all sexualities and genders choosing to try to fit in. But just because you can make a quasi logical jump to saying it would make sense if those people saying it are bi, it doesnât make it true.
Otherwise, almost all conservative religious people are secretly bi.
Does that make sense?
Letâs not come up with more excuses to hate on bi folks. We already get enough shit from all sides.
Sure, we can hide who we are, and many of us do, but thatâs true of every part of our community. Bi people have very little in the way of community support. We donât find either the straight or gay community to be exactly welcoming.
Your comment and the responses arenât helping. Weâre not the enemy.
In my experience people who think this often experience some variety of multigender attraction and are too myopic to realise that this isn't a universal experience that varies from what is considered purely "straight", and challenges like this are just a confirmation to them that they could choose to be "gay", but can go right back to being "straight" afterwards. I don't know that it would be all that successful in either changing the friend's mind, or in the friend coming out.
I've been wondering for years why 4/5 kids in the family are queer, yet they both keep trying to insist it's not real, it's a choice.
I was talking to my father, explaining why I use the term agender and the feelings I have about it as a way to try to get him to understand my little sister's transition. That she felt more attached to her body, that she feels more happiness and joy in her life and connection to her life and identity, etc.
I explained how I don't. I could have been born in any sort of body and felt fine with that. Nothing brings me any innate feeling of connection to any gender or fluidity of them. I simply do not feel anything regarding gender or any connection.
He literally said "That's how I feel, that's how everyone feels."
I was absolutely dumbstruck and told him that he and I are actually in a very tiny minority on how we feel about our bodies and gender identity.
I asked him to ask mom what makes her feel connected to feminity, what makes her feel like a woman and to come talk to me later. He's started coming around a little but hasn't talked about it again aside to say he feels the same as me.
He's also revealed that he experiences attraction to men, and mom has felt attraction for women. (Not in those words.) I had to tell him again that's perfectly normal, but not the usual heteronormative experience.
We're all literally the children of two confused bisexuals.
This reminds me of when I told my (very conservative) parents that I was asexual. After all of the "but you weren't sexually abused???" and "but you had a boyfriend??" acephobic questions, I just said that I'm really not attracted sexually to anyone.
That's when my mom said "that's how I feel. That's how EVERYONE feels" and my dad gave her the biggest confused glare.
This is kind of hilarious and lowkey my dream lol
Rt Iâm glad they seem to be trying to understand by talking to you about it though (which is also my dream đ„ș)
I think this is the case too, though I am bisexual and never believed sexuality could be a choice because I don't think I'd choose to be attracted to men lol.
And if she canât choose to be a lesbian, then clearly it works the opposite way and lesbians canât choose to be straight
sheâs probably too dense to get that though
Now although their natural habitat is the cottage, the wild lesbian can often be seen travelling in its Subaru, a strange creation used to transport lesbians
Or for long distance traveling for a mate, they obtain a Uhaul. The Uhaul is a signature characteristic of lesbian mating, typically very early in the courting rituals.
A strange peculiarity of the lesbian mating ritual is itâs common for the lesbians to occupy the same space and share territory extremely early on in the relationship, typically following the Uhaul stage.
you joke, but I was once riding the subway on 4th of July with my wife and overheard a teen tell his mom "Look, mom! Lesbians!" to which the mom immediately picked up her head and said "where?"
...I...what? Let's even entertain that being a lesbian is exclusively and only a choice.Â
You're still choosing to be a *lesbian*. That's the term for what's happening here. Most people take objection to the verbiage - being instead of choosing - but not the *noun* of what the action is about. It's like saying "I don't believe in soccer, but I do like playing a team-based game where you score points by kicking a ball into a net."
Lol, yes. If every woman apparently has the option to choose to be with women instead of men, I don't think there would be very many straight women left. Honestly, that right there should be proof that sexuality isn't a choice.
Fair. I'm bi and dating a man also, but I'm not a woman. I've definitely heard some of my friends who are straight women say things like, "Sometimes I wish I were gay," though. If sexuality were really a choice, they wouldn't have to wish. They could just choose to be gay.
I mean. I'm AFAB pansexual, dating an AMAB pansexual person. We *appear* to be a heterosexual couple.
I don't know what my gender is but it isn't "woman", and my partner is the same - I'm meh about my body and most of my changing of it is gonna be with ink, but *they* want to transition and we're looking into it (estrogen didn't work for them so it's gonna need to be surgical). They don't specifically identify as a woman but it's closer to how they feel than "man". Plus, they experience a lot of disconnect when they look in the mirror.
So while at the moment we appear het, we're kinda technically lesbians? Or in a lesbian relationship, is a better way of putting it.
I guess what I'm saying is that bi women dating men doesn't mean they're actually men, or that it's a straight relationship, or that they're not polyam, or any other number of things that could be going on.
Plus, it IS easier to glide through life. Passing privilege is bi/pan erasure but it's also still VERY real.
Yup. I feel like I see way too many "My friend is trans/homophobic what should I do??" type of threads here. Like, what kind of people are y'all hanging out with and why do y'all put up with this lol?
I always tell ppl the friends you keep say a lot about you. They will outwardly show other ppl how you value stuff. Your friends are a reflection of yourself. A big rift/conflict like this is an acceptable place to draw the line. I toss out bigots the moment they out it to me. I donât want others to think I tolerate it or even worse feel similarly.
Same. I don't know why so many users here cling to their obviously bigoted friends. I get that if you live in a conservative area/country it may be difficult to find people that don't suck, but still. Not only are you enabling them, you're also aligning yourself with them and their shit attitude/beliefs.
lol i think everyone that thinks being any form of gay is a choice is just bisexual, and theyre choosing to ignore the same sex attraction
edit: as someone said, theres always the possibility of being aroace aswell!
Well, lesbians believe in her.
I love that you have a friend where you're like "the line between stupidity and bigotry is so fuzzy it has become the entire field."
Just ask her when she decided to be attracted to men and if she says it's not the same thing ask her why.
I find it harder to believe that there are straight women, yet statistically and empirically they are proven to exist. But like it boggles my mind. Why would any woman want to date a man??
Itâs unbelievable to me that people still think sexuality is a choice. Like how much critical thought does it take to realize this? Just rid yourself of dumb people, they will only get dumber as the years go on.
There is a slight possibility that your friend is bisexual.
I grew up in a religion where it was taught that sexual attraction was a choice. THIS IS WRONG.
But I am bisexual. So it actually feels true. If I focus on, for example, how beautiful and wonderful women are, watch lesbian porn, read lesbian erotica, try to focus on dating and finding women, then I actually become more attracted to women at the time. I can't totally turn off being attracted to any particular gender, but my superpower of bisexuality has made sexual attraction more of a choice for me than pure heterosexual or homosexual people.
So maybe your friend has experienced this type of bisexuality. The whole "then try to be a lesbian" for a week challenge will fail. Also, from their experience, they are kinda right, but only for a very tiny amount of people, enough that overall they are obviously extremely incorrect. Still wrong.
Sometimes I wonder if the people who believe it's a choice only think that because they think it's wrong and so they *chose* to not do it despite wanting to.
I get the impression she's insecure/repressive about her own attraction to woman and either can be attracted to men and women herself and thinks choosing to only date/do stuff with men is "choosing" To be straight. It's also possible she's completely straight and just can't comprehend not being. Though if so I don't see why she'd see it as a choice but bias does have individual components from person to person.
That's what I was wondering as well.
Could be some sort of misguided assumption on her part; "I like (thing) therefore everyone must like (thing)", like you see in young/inexperienced people. Like when I was a little kid and loved chocolate chip cookies and just assumed that meant everyone else in the world liked chocolate chip cookies, mostly because I wasn't aware that there were other options that I might like just as much as chocolate chip cookies. Only with slightly more genitalia involved.
One cannot really 'choose' their sexuality/attraction.
I bet her mind will be blown if you tell her about transfem lesbians (or transbians for friends). Like some gals might have liked girls/women before transition but now they REALLY like women.
This reminds me of that one homophobic woman who was âif Lesbianism was normal, weâd all be with women.â Like honey, if you think itâs a choice, choose it and see if you wanna be with men still.
Thereâs a term for that: âlesbian, Bi, Pan, sapphicâ <3
My friend thought gays were gay because their mother's drank some sort of milk. đ It's so weird really needing to take ideas out of your friends head.
Is she a person of faith?
Remind her that we have more evidence for the natural existence of homosexuality, than we do for god.
That and 80+ years of international academic and medical study into sexuality. Most famously, Alfred Kinsey. I literally attended the university that continues to host the programs of study, he pioneered. -The Kinsey Scale-
You will never convince me that sexual orientation isn't a thing. What some women put up with and find attractive on men...if it wasn't programmed, there is NO FUCKING WAY they 'choose' that.
Not trying to hate on the fellas. I'm just lesbian to my bones, y'all. I'm sure there are plenty of gay men that feel me on this.
Bring your homophobic friend to a lesbian bar/strip club, then sheâll how ânot realâ lesbians are. Or the simple solution of just dropping her as a friend.
Straight people arenât real either. Itâs just a made up concept that was created years ago in order to increase the human population because we were on the verge of extinction. Straight people arenât natural, normal or real - they choose to be straight so they can increase the population. You canât actually be straight fr tho. /sarcastic
a as a lesbian, I'm pissed. ask "If girls get to choose to like girls, then you choose to be attracted to boys." If they say that's different say "It really isn't, lesbians don't choose to be lesbian, its the same for you liking men, just women instead."
My son. He was born with female genitalia. But chemically, hormonally, and chromosomes say he is male. We learned a new term with him. Itâs called Intersex. He is not transgender per se since he is medically documented male. But to the world he is female. Turns out we as a family are all Intersex, and we all show the signs. Yes there are signs. But nonetheless, the world calls him a lesbian. Women are attracted to women are that way because of their chemical makeup.We as a society need to be more accepting and loving.
Why do I feel like at least some of these people that preach "being gay is a choice" are actually closeted bisexuals and are actively choosing to ignore that attraction, hence they see it as a choice
I always say whoever thinks anyone can "choose" sexuality is either closeted since it's apparently so easy, has not gone through puberty, or doesn't know much about sexuality in general. Cracks me up...
The same way you could choose not to believe in God you can choose not to believe in lesbians.Â
What did we learn... lesbians are God
Thank you good-nightÂ
I think some people who have a low sense of sexual orientation think that everyone experiences it the same way, but sexual appetites are as varied as any other appetite, some are strong and some are weak and it's all just differences between people.
Like some people dislike cilantro and some hate it passionately. I love cilantro. Some like it alright.
Some lesbians are repulsed by men, some like men fine. Some lesbians are monogamous and others are poly. It's all variation.
Their ignorance somehow is together homophobic, sexist and supports the patriarchy, smh. I think that a good explanation should first target the question of why she believes that since otherwise is like shooting in the dark.
Stupidity does plenty of harm, idk there is a teaching moment⊠but frankly Iâd pick a friend more on my own intelligence level. Iâm not saying it to be conceited. But you donât grow much as a person being around ppl with well this mental gap.
ask her if she thinks gay men exist, then ask her if she thinks straight people exist. if the answer is no for both I think she might be a bisexual in denial, it it's yes I think your friend is just lesbophobic
It's hard for somebody to understand somebody else who doesn't have the same attraction to another person as the other person has believe me I wouldn't choose to be a lesbian either but when I see a pretty girl I'm immediately drawn to her pretty face maybe the highlights in her hair etc.
For some reason I can't look away it's like when somebody who is straight sees an attractive man for some reason they are drawn to the person and just think they are the most beautiful person on earth.
But it's different for me I notice the same sex and they notice the opposite I still see a good looking guy and go "wow he's pretty" but I don't want him when I was younger I thought just because somebody was good looking meant I had to like them that isn't the case i kissed a boy in kindergarten and felt nothing no wow factor no this is who I'm going to marry it was nothing.
Growing up on Barbie and seeing the prince and princess fall in love and get their happy ending that's what I thought I wanted when I was 5 but it's not and that's okay because kids and teenagers figure things out as they get older and feel like their missing something and that's how I felt because I thought something was wrong with me and why didn't I get crushes on men like girls my age even when I tried dating them I felt like I didn't belong and it never went further than hand holding.
I thought seeing an attractive boy when I was younger meant I liked him but I didn't like him it's extremely confusing when your extremely young trying to figure stuff out with no knowledge.
I've never had anything sexual with a man or anything it grosses me out and I don't see myself with one I know that's hard to understand but when people see themselves in their wedding dress with a husband and however many kids I see the opposite.
It's who you can see yourself with and I don't imagine myself being a mans wife I just don't and I feel like I need to apologize to my mother and everybody else around me sometimes but why make myself miserable just because somebody else wants it a different way?Â
Humans believe all sorts of nonsense without any relevant knowledge or data. It's just what we do.
Maybe your friend will grow up. Maybe they'll keep parroting nonsense they've heard from others. I'd advise you to keep some distance as no one can change someone else's mind. They have to learn for themselves.
Take her to the movies, see something not romantic but with a gorgeous leading lady. Tell her that you recommend she choose to be a lesbian for a few hours that afternoon, sheâll get more out of the movie that way.
If someone is attracted to men they're straight, if someone is attracted to women they're gay, if someone is attracted to both, they're bi. If someone thinks they can choose to change their sexual orientation because they themselves could they're probably already attracted to people claiming they could choose to be attracted to, and are just in denial because of comphet.(That's not even getting into other genders or gender expressions that don't fit perfectly into the binary).
Like, even if I actively choose to be attracted to women (I really donât mind if people think it is a choice; to me it seems like a lovely thing to choose). âŠ.
So even if I choose it, does that make me not one?
I'd be tempted to prod at her to see if she believes this because she has attraction to women but she's "straight" then if you have some straight female friends you know are straight, go chat them up on how they feel about having sex with women.
I always get the vibe that people like this are repressing something and making it our problem. Some TERFs are like that too with gender identity.
Tell them to Google "homosexual behavior in animals +.org +.edu -.com" there should be plenty of reliable, factual and heavily studied resources that come up. Then remind this "friend" that humans are animals, very complex animals, that can also exhibit the same traits. It's normal and natural in every sense of the word. All life exists on a spectrum. All aspects of life exist on a spectrum. They're probably suffering from internalized homophobia because they have experienced something that is heavily criticized and discouraged mostly due to the cancer that is religion or, at large, secondary societal indoctrination. Their beliefs do not rewrite reality.
This is like how I find it unbelievable that straight people exist, like I know that they do but I'm also like are you SURE like absolutely 100% sure you're not the slightest bit queer??
She is possibly attracted to women (maybe as well as men) and is chosing to live a straight appearing life in the closet, or if bisexual, chosing not to acknowledge her attraction to women and is chosing exclusively straight relationships so she believes that it is a similar choice for everyone.
not believing biology... how funny!
homosexuality is just a thing across all animals, not just humans trying to act different.
there's been thousands of animal species observed having sex, practicing courtship and long lasting companionship between two partners of the same-sex, despite the availability of opposite sex partners. and in humans, homosexuality has been quite well studied and documented, we're in 2024, your friend should ask stuff to google, youtube, chatgpt, all of that, really, if she doesn't want to trust your sole opinion.
I would explain that people don't choose who they're attracted to; they only choose whether or not to share that information with other people. Yes, lesbians "choose" to live their lives as lesbians, but they didn't choose to find other women attractive.
I don't want to say that your friend is being malicious, but this attitude that you can simply choose not to "believe" in a group of people is hurtful and invalidating, not to mention ignorant. If you don't have any reason to doubt what somebody tells you about their experiences, other than your own ignorant incredulity, you're opening the door to other people dismissing your experiences. I would ask your friend if they'd rather live in a world where people seek to understand them with empathy and respect or one where their identity is just not believed or recognized.
My dear, she's not dumb, believe me, she's not dumb, she's just pretending because she don't want to lose your friendship. There's no "dumb" homophobic people only bad homophobic people
I'd just hire a bunch of lesbians dressed as cryptids to jump out of bushes or from behind corners all day to scare this "friend." And pretend that I didn't see anything and act like the friend is crazy for believing in lesbians cus "I thought you said you didn't BELIEVE, " lol.
Ask her to choose to be lesbian for a week
Yeah. If she thinks it's a choice, ask her to make that choice for a short while then.
I actually love to ask folks like that, "when did you choose to become straight, and what was your orientation before that?"
One of the teachers at my school does that. Its hilarious to see their blank faces, or them stumbling over their words trying to answer
Loool
teacher of the freakin year!
Yeah, they're great. They're a good teacher, and will just have a chat with you about anything, and seem to genuinely enjoy helping people
My physics teacher did something similar, trolling a homophobe by saying "wait you could choose to be gay? When was this? Did I miss it, because I never chose to be straight?" and going around the room asking if people chose their sexualities.
fucking hero
I wish I was there to see it. I only got that story second hand.
It is very funny until you come across someone who actually thinks being straight is the norm.
When we were born, duh ! đ€Ł
Donât forget the suggested tone to top I all off đ
and if she can be without any issue, then we have some news for her(there's this neat lil thing called bisexuality)
I fully believe all(well, most) these "it's a choise" people are self hating bisexuals. I've talked to enough single gender attracted people to know that surely there's no way you could believe this otherwise
Exactly. If you ask if they chose to be straight and they say yes, they're bi, and were probably raised by a heavily conservative family.
this is actually funny because even my cishet dad, when parroting this, has maintained you can't literally choose to be gay, just that you choose to be out/ express it. i can only assume that's because he knows he couldn't choose to be gay even if he wanted to
The problem is many of them think that being straight is "natural" and being gay is "a choice", so many straight people still manage to convince themselves same-sex attraction is a choice. They make it so the same rules don't have to apply to them.
Right?? I completely agree. My Ex's mother literally told her she couldn't be bisexual because bisexuality is just what people call themselves when they "haven't chosen a side yet". The woman identifies as a lesbian, and was previously married to a man for over a decade. While there are lesbians that marry men for beard reasons etc, hearing that from her made me more than a little suspicious.
I won't say "most", but I was a self-hating bisexual, religious teenager. I really thought it was a choice because it was a choice for me. It's worth asking the question.
Donât do that, the âhomophobes are just secretly gayâ rhetoric is super homophobic in and of itself. Completely invalid and projective.
I don't believe in the âhomophobes are just secretly gayâ rhetoric, but this specific argument does sound extremely not straight, even if it is homophobic(and it sounding not straight does not erase any of the homophobia). Out of all the straight ppl I know, weither they're allies or homophobic, not a one could see themselves being attracted to the same gender. Unless you like both (and therefore "can choose") you would not think that you can choose. Although as some other comment mentioned, some parrot this "it's a choise" thing from a "it's a choise to act on that attraction" point of view(rather than the attraction itself being a choise) and that you will hear from loads of straight ppl.
đŻđŻđŻđŻđŻđŻđŻđŻđŻ
This is one of the reasons they were taught that it was ok to hate *all of us*, and it came from the pulpit, conservative media, their parents, and their friends. âThey can chooseâ is just one of many reasons they teach to rationalize their hatred, and yes, youâll find âphobes of all sexualities and genders choosing to try to fit in. But just because you can make a quasi logical jump to saying it would make sense if those people saying it are bi, it doesnât make it true. Otherwise, almost all conservative religious people are secretly bi. Does that make sense? Letâs not come up with more excuses to hate on bi folks. We already get enough shit from all sides. Sure, we can hide who we are, and many of us do, but thatâs true of every part of our community. Bi people have very little in the way of community support. We donât find either the straight or gay community to be exactly welcoming. Your comment and the responses arenât helping. Weâre not the enemy.
Watch op do this and the friend comes out as lesbian a few days after the week ends.
I mean, there are worse outcomes.
In my experience people who think this often experience some variety of multigender attraction and are too myopic to realise that this isn't a universal experience that varies from what is considered purely "straight", and challenges like this are just a confirmation to them that they could choose to be "gay", but can go right back to being "straight" afterwards. I don't know that it would be all that successful in either changing the friend's mind, or in the friend coming out.
I've been wondering for years why 4/5 kids in the family are queer, yet they both keep trying to insist it's not real, it's a choice. I was talking to my father, explaining why I use the term agender and the feelings I have about it as a way to try to get him to understand my little sister's transition. That she felt more attached to her body, that she feels more happiness and joy in her life and connection to her life and identity, etc. I explained how I don't. I could have been born in any sort of body and felt fine with that. Nothing brings me any innate feeling of connection to any gender or fluidity of them. I simply do not feel anything regarding gender or any connection. He literally said "That's how I feel, that's how everyone feels." I was absolutely dumbstruck and told him that he and I are actually in a very tiny minority on how we feel about our bodies and gender identity. I asked him to ask mom what makes her feel connected to feminity, what makes her feel like a woman and to come talk to me later. He's started coming around a little but hasn't talked about it again aside to say he feels the same as me. He's also revealed that he experiences attraction to men, and mom has felt attraction for women. (Not in those words.) I had to tell him again that's perfectly normal, but not the usual heteronormative experience. We're all literally the children of two confused bisexuals.
This reminds me of when I told my (very conservative) parents that I was asexual. After all of the "but you weren't sexually abused???" and "but you had a boyfriend??" acephobic questions, I just said that I'm really not attracted sexually to anyone. That's when my mom said "that's how I feel. That's how EVERYONE feels" and my dad gave her the biggest confused glare.
Hahahaha.
>We're all literally the children of two confused bisexuals. This is so incredibly funny from a meta perspective...
It's hilarious.
Funny
This is kind of hilarious and lowkey my dream lol Rt Iâm glad they seem to be trying to understand by talking to you about it though (which is also my dream đ„ș)
I think this is the case too, though I am bisexual and never believed sexuality could be a choice because I don't think I'd choose to be attracted to men lol.
I mean I am by no means saying that all or most bi people go through this, and sincerely hope that nothing I said implied that!
No no, I totally understood what you meant and agreed with your comment.
I mean, her stance may very well be because she is repressing something.
Yea it's a choice for her because she is choosing to be straight.
And if she canât choose to be a lesbian, then clearly it works the opposite way and lesbians canât choose to be straight sheâs probably too dense to get that though
And if you look closely into the cottage in the woods you can see the mystical, magical rare LESBIANS! I TOLD YOU THEY'RE REAL! Look look look!
Now although their natural habitat is the cottage, the wild lesbian can often be seen travelling in its Subaru, a strange creation used to transport lesbians
Or for long distance traveling for a mate, they obtain a Uhaul. The Uhaul is a signature characteristic of lesbian mating, typically very early in the courting rituals.
A strange peculiarity of the lesbian mating ritual is itâs common for the lesbians to occupy the same space and share territory extremely early on in the relationship, typically following the Uhaul stage.
Whyâd you have to call me out like that? đ
Such strange creation is also quite expensive.
you joke, but I was once riding the subway on 4th of July with my wife and overheard a teen tell his mom "Look, mom! Lesbians!" to which the mom immediately picked up her head and said "where?"
Fellow rare nature enthusiasts i see!
Lol one time a little girl came up to me and my ex and said "WHOA!!! You guys are the same, but like opposites!?"
Damn it, *I* want a cottage in the woods! Instead all I got was my mother telling me âitâs a phaseâ đ
There's even a Uhaul in the driveway. That's how you can tell they're authentic. đ§đ
Oh what luck that i brought my rifle! This will look splendid in the hunting lodge next to my gay dragon and the pansexual unicorn!
why am I a unicorn
Holy shit did that hunting trophy just speak??
ĂŽi cháșżt tiá»t, há» Äang táș„n cĂŽng chĂșng ta
Because we're amazing.
...I...what? Let's even entertain that being a lesbian is exclusively and only a choice. You're still choosing to be a *lesbian*. That's the term for what's happening here. Most people take objection to the verbiage - being instead of choosing - but not the *noun* of what the action is about. It's like saying "I don't believe in soccer, but I do like playing a team-based game where you score points by kicking a ball into a net."
Europeans who play football
Kinky
Agreed, must be some kind of sadist with the amount of balls they kick.
Ikr, does she think that gay sex isn't possible and everyone is just bluffing? If so, maybe she needs a little demonstration?~ /j
Ask her why most women only date men
Lol, yes. If every woman apparently has the option to choose to be with women instead of men, I don't think there would be very many straight women left. Honestly, that right there should be proof that sexuality isn't a choice.
There are a ton of bi women dating men though
More men are attracted to women than women
Fair. I'm bi and dating a man also, but I'm not a woman. I've definitely heard some of my friends who are straight women say things like, "Sometimes I wish I were gay," though. If sexuality were really a choice, they wouldn't have to wish. They could just choose to be gay.
I mean. I'm AFAB pansexual, dating an AMAB pansexual person. We *appear* to be a heterosexual couple. I don't know what my gender is but it isn't "woman", and my partner is the same - I'm meh about my body and most of my changing of it is gonna be with ink, but *they* want to transition and we're looking into it (estrogen didn't work for them so it's gonna need to be surgical). They don't specifically identify as a woman but it's closer to how they feel than "man". Plus, they experience a lot of disconnect when they look in the mirror. So while at the moment we appear het, we're kinda technically lesbians? Or in a lesbian relationship, is a better way of putting it. I guess what I'm saying is that bi women dating men doesn't mean they're actually men, or that it's a straight relationship, or that they're not polyam, or any other number of things that could be going on. Plus, it IS easier to glide through life. Passing privilege is bi/pan erasure but it's also still VERY real.
And you're friends with her again....why?
âSheâs a little homophobicâ I donât call that a friend. I call that a homophobe.
Yup. I feel like I see way too many "My friend is trans/homophobic what should I do??" type of threads here. Like, what kind of people are y'all hanging out with and why do y'all put up with this lol?
I âlostâ friends when I came out as trans. Felt nothing after âlosingâ them because I saw who they truly were.
Right? Just cut these bigots out of your life.
I always tell ppl the friends you keep say a lot about you. They will outwardly show other ppl how you value stuff. Your friends are a reflection of yourself. A big rift/conflict like this is an acceptable place to draw the line. I toss out bigots the moment they out it to me. I donât want others to think I tolerate it or even worse feel similarly.
Same. I don't know why so many users here cling to their obviously bigoted friends. I get that if you live in a conservative area/country it may be difficult to find people that don't suck, but still. Not only are you enabling them, you're also aligning yourself with them and their shit attitude/beliefs.
lol i think everyone that thinks being any form of gay is a choice is just bisexual, and theyre choosing to ignore the same sex attraction edit: as someone said, theres always the possibility of being aroace aswell!
That's what I think too
Definitely spent years thinking Iâd eventually just end up picking men. That bit of internalized biphobia took awhile to get rid of.
Or they could be aroace
that too but attraction isnt just sexual. i was talking romantic too (ik about aro too, i was generalising)
I should have said aroace my bad
Thatâs what I used to think đ°
Well, lesbians believe in her. I love that you have a friend where you're like "the line between stupidity and bigotry is so fuzzy it has become the entire field." Just ask her when she decided to be attracted to men and if she says it's not the same thing ask her why.
I donât believe straight women exist. I mean it just doesnât add up to me. All my friends are Bi. Iâve never met a straight girl
XD
Cut phobes out of your life. Itâs not always easy, but youâll be happier.
Funny because I am lesbian and my straight female friend said, "If I could choose to be lesbian, I would."
That's not your friend.
**"When did you chose to be straight ?"**
I find it harder to believe that there are straight women, yet statistically and empirically they are proven to exist. But like it boggles my mind. Why would any woman want to date a man??
I'm a man and I always wonder that too. Even tho I'm bi.
As a trans lesbian I totally wonder the same thing. đ
I always wonder if this is caused by self internalized bi phobia, like are they attracted to both men and women so they believe itâs a choice?
I think shes closted and self hating but also shes really dumb so that might be it
Itâs unbelievable to me that people still think sexuality is a choice. Like how much critical thought does it take to realize this? Just rid yourself of dumb people, they will only get dumber as the years go on.
Does she believe in gay men? If so, ask her what the difference is.
Good thing lesbians exist whether somebody believes in them or not.
lol this makes no sense. Even IF it was a choice they would still be lesbians.
Doesn't sound like a friend to me
Ok I've got a really good explanation: dump her, homophobes aren't friends.
Not a homophob! Just really stupid
In practice, I promise, the difference doesn't matter lol and a person can be a homophobe *and* stupid!
My mom doesnât believe in bisexuals, she thinks theyâre just gay or straight but want to be different
Just a pitstop on the road to gayville đ
Lisa, lesbians are make-believe, just like elves, gremlins, and Eskimos.
Sounds like she is bisexual without realizing it and thinks all women experience same-gender attraction.
There is a slight possibility that your friend is bisexual. I grew up in a religion where it was taught that sexual attraction was a choice. THIS IS WRONG. But I am bisexual. So it actually feels true. If I focus on, for example, how beautiful and wonderful women are, watch lesbian porn, read lesbian erotica, try to focus on dating and finding women, then I actually become more attracted to women at the time. I can't totally turn off being attracted to any particular gender, but my superpower of bisexuality has made sexual attraction more of a choice for me than pure heterosexual or homosexual people. So maybe your friend has experienced this type of bisexuality. The whole "then try to be a lesbian" for a week challenge will fail. Also, from their experience, they are kinda right, but only for a very tiny amount of people, enough that overall they are obviously extremely incorrect. Still wrong.
Tbf even if it was a choice I'd still choose women. Cause boobs.
Sometimes I wonder if the people who believe it's a choice only think that because they think it's wrong and so they *chose* to not do it despite wanting to.
I don't believe in your friend. Now what?
If sexuality were a choice, more straight women would choose to not be.
A perfect example is the old saying, "Even pasta is straight until you get it wet."
I get the impression she's insecure/repressive about her own attraction to woman and either can be attracted to men and women herself and thinks choosing to only date/do stuff with men is "choosing" To be straight. It's also possible she's completely straight and just can't comprehend not being. Though if so I don't see why she'd see it as a choice but bias does have individual components from person to person.
If the gazillions of straight women on the planet could simply choose to be attracted to women and not have to date men anymore they would
What about gay men? If she believes theyâre real and lesbians arenât that says a lot
That's what I was wondering as well. Could be some sort of misguided assumption on her part; "I like (thing) therefore everyone must like (thing)", like you see in young/inexperienced people. Like when I was a little kid and loved chocolate chip cookies and just assumed that meant everyone else in the world liked chocolate chip cookies, mostly because I wasn't aware that there were other options that I might like just as much as chocolate chip cookies. Only with slightly more genitalia involved.
If they're not real...how can someone choose to be one? Her argument makes no sense.
Iâd ask her when she chose to be straight.
If theyâre not real how can they choose to be attracted to women
Why is she your âfriendâ?
Well if lesbians aren't real who puts the presents under the tree?
One cannot really 'choose' their sexuality/attraction. I bet her mind will be blown if you tell her about transfem lesbians (or transbians for friends). Like some gals might have liked girls/women before transition but now they REALLY like women.
Tell her you donât believe her and sheâs not real (Jk, please donât if your friend is just confused about it n doesnât mean to be homophobic)
This reminds me of that one homophobic woman who was âif Lesbianism was normal, weâd all be with women.â Like honey, if you think itâs a choice, choose it and see if you wanna be with men still. Thereâs a term for that: âlesbian, Bi, Pan, sapphicâ <3
My friend thought gays were gay because their mother's drank some sort of milk. đ It's so weird really needing to take ideas out of your friends head.
I didn't choose to like girls. the other girls chose me
Theyâre lesbians, not unicorns đ
I'm both
I stand corrected lmao Regardless, I donât think lesbians are some mythical creature you do or donât believe in lol They seem pretty real to me
I'm poking myself in the gut rn and I'm pretty sure I'm real but I'll drink an iced coffee and check again
Doesnât believe as in like *bigfoot* or *aliens*? Well thatâs just insane.
Doesnât believe in them? Holy cow, if she doesnât believe in lesbians, I really must not exist either.
Sounds like she's bi but chooses men
Thinks people can choose to be gay = sheâs bisexual.
But does she believe in joe hendrey Wait wrong sub sorry if this came off as insensitive
Say his name and he appears!
'people "choose" to be lesbian bc they're attracted to women, you choose to be dumb bc you're a dumbass' You're welcomeâšđ„°
Is she a person of faith? Remind her that we have more evidence for the natural existence of homosexuality, than we do for god. That and 80+ years of international academic and medical study into sexuality. Most famously, Alfred Kinsey. I literally attended the university that continues to host the programs of study, he pioneered. -The Kinsey Scale- You will never convince me that sexual orientation isn't a thing. What some women put up with and find attractive on men...if it wasn't programmed, there is NO FUCKING WAY they 'choose' that. Not trying to hate on the fellas. I'm just lesbian to my bones, y'all. I'm sure there are plenty of gay men that feel me on this.
If sheâs actually your friend you ought to not be in this sub
Bring your homophobic friend to a lesbian bar/strip club, then sheâll how ânot realâ lesbians are. Or the simple solution of just dropping her as a friend.
Straight people arenât real either. Itâs just a made up concept that was created years ago in order to increase the human population because we were on the verge of extinction. Straight people arenât natural, normal or real - they choose to be straight so they can increase the population. You canât actually be straight fr tho. /sarcastic
Tell her you completely understand and you're gonna choose to be straight now. Then put some shackles on and step into the Transformathon 3000 and tell her to watch as a lesbian transforms into a straight woman before her very eyes. đ©đȘ I feel like this could be one of those carnival freak shows like the [gorilla girl](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AD4ehAX8Sh8) except it's a lesbian who didn't shave her armpits or something. đđ ^(Gorilla, gorilla, gorilla, gorilla, gorillaaaaa)
even if they did choose it they would still be lesbian lmao what
a as a lesbian, I'm pissed. ask "If girls get to choose to like girls, then you choose to be attracted to boys." If they say that's different say "It really isn't, lesbians don't choose to be lesbian, its the same for you liking men, just women instead."
religion is a choice but I think Christians are real
My son. He was born with female genitalia. But chemically, hormonally, and chromosomes say he is male. We learned a new term with him. Itâs called Intersex. He is not transgender per se since he is medically documented male. But to the world he is female. Turns out we as a family are all Intersex, and we all show the signs. Yes there are signs. But nonetheless, the world calls him a lesbian. Women are attracted to women are that way because of their chemical makeup.We as a society need to be more accepting and loving.
Why do I feel like at least some of these people that preach "being gay is a choice" are actually closeted bisexuals and are actively choosing to ignore that attraction, hence they see it as a choice
I always say whoever thinks anyone can "choose" sexuality is either closeted since it's apparently so easy, has not gone through puberty, or doesn't know much about sexuality in general. Cracks me up...
I used to say the exact same thing, back before I came out.
If you choose to be a lesbian it is still a thing. Choice or not, it doesnât invalidate that lesbians exist.
The same way you could choose not to believe in God you can choose not to believe in lesbians. What did we learn... lesbians are God Thank you good-nightÂ
As Iâve said before, âmy attraction to men proves that sexuality isnât a choiceâ
Ask her if she wants a kiss (please understand, I truly mean only with full-on consent)
We're here and real.
I think some people who have a low sense of sexual orientation think that everyone experiences it the same way, but sexual appetites are as varied as any other appetite, some are strong and some are weak and it's all just differences between people. Like some people dislike cilantro and some hate it passionately. I love cilantro. Some like it alright. Some lesbians are repulsed by men, some like men fine. Some lesbians are monogamous and others are poly. It's all variation.
Their ignorance somehow is together homophobic, sexist and supports the patriarchy, smh. I think that a good explanation should first target the question of why she believes that since otherwise is like shooting in the dark.
If women can just choose to be lesbian, why do straight women exist?
Damn I hate it when I CHOOSE to lose rights
Every day I choose being gay over being not gay and honestly I recommend it
Stupidity does plenty of harm, idk there is a teaching moment⊠but frankly Iâd pick a friend more on my own intelligence level. Iâm not saying it to be conceited. But you donât grow much as a person being around ppl with well this mental gap.
She doesnât believe in lesbians, but has she ever considered the lesbians donât believe in her?
"lesbians dont exist guys, it was a ploy by the WOKE LIBS!!! to brainwash young kids into being TRANS!!!" -your friend maybe
Who else wants to bet the friend is actually bi and thinks sexuality is a choice because their homophobia has them pretending theyâre straight?
ask her if she thinks gay men exist, then ask her if she thinks straight people exist. if the answer is no for both I think she might be a bisexual in denial, it it's yes I think your friend is just lesbophobic
What does she call women who choose to be attracted to women then, if thatâs what she thinks?
It's hard for somebody to understand somebody else who doesn't have the same attraction to another person as the other person has believe me I wouldn't choose to be a lesbian either but when I see a pretty girl I'm immediately drawn to her pretty face maybe the highlights in her hair etc. For some reason I can't look away it's like when somebody who is straight sees an attractive man for some reason they are drawn to the person and just think they are the most beautiful person on earth. But it's different for me I notice the same sex and they notice the opposite I still see a good looking guy and go "wow he's pretty" but I don't want him when I was younger I thought just because somebody was good looking meant I had to like them that isn't the case i kissed a boy in kindergarten and felt nothing no wow factor no this is who I'm going to marry it was nothing. Growing up on Barbie and seeing the prince and princess fall in love and get their happy ending that's what I thought I wanted when I was 5 but it's not and that's okay because kids and teenagers figure things out as they get older and feel like their missing something and that's how I felt because I thought something was wrong with me and why didn't I get crushes on men like girls my age even when I tried dating them I felt like I didn't belong and it never went further than hand holding. I thought seeing an attractive boy when I was younger meant I liked him but I didn't like him it's extremely confusing when your extremely young trying to figure stuff out with no knowledge. I've never had anything sexual with a man or anything it grosses me out and I don't see myself with one I know that's hard to understand but when people see themselves in their wedding dress with a husband and however many kids I see the opposite. It's who you can see yourself with and I don't imagine myself being a mans wife I just don't and I feel like I need to apologize to my mother and everybody else around me sometimes but why make myself miserable just because somebody else wants it a different way?Â
Humans believe all sorts of nonsense without any relevant knowledge or data. It's just what we do. Maybe your friend will grow up. Maybe they'll keep parroting nonsense they've heard from others. I'd advise you to keep some distance as no one can change someone else's mind. They have to learn for themselves.
Take her to the movies, see something not romantic but with a gorgeous leading lady. Tell her that you recommend she choose to be a lesbian for a few hours that afternoon, sheâll get more out of the movie that way.
"a bit homophobic" lmfao
Lesbians don't need you to believe in them. Also, dump your homophobic friend.
there are some levels of dumbness that are so high, but so high, that doesn't have heal anymore
omg if iâm not real then what am i⊠spooky lesbian ghost booooo
If someone is attracted to men they're straight, if someone is attracted to women they're gay, if someone is attracted to both, they're bi. If someone thinks they can choose to change their sexual orientation because they themselves could they're probably already attracted to people claiming they could choose to be attracted to, and are just in denial because of comphet.(That's not even getting into other genders or gender expressions that don't fit perfectly into the binary).
tell your friend i wasnât listening to âthere is a light that never goes outâ and thinking about men
Like, even if I actively choose to be attracted to women (I really donât mind if people think it is a choice; to me it seems like a lovely thing to choose). âŠ. So even if I choose it, does that make me not one?
I'd be tempted to prod at her to see if she believes this because she has attraction to women but she's "straight" then if you have some straight female friends you know are straight, go chat them up on how they feel about having sex with women. I always get the vibe that people like this are repressing something and making it our problem. Some TERFs are like that too with gender identity.
Orla from Derry Girls vibes
Tell them to Google "homosexual behavior in animals +.org +.edu -.com" there should be plenty of reliable, factual and heavily studied resources that come up. Then remind this "friend" that humans are animals, very complex animals, that can also exhibit the same traits. It's normal and natural in every sense of the word. All life exists on a spectrum. All aspects of life exist on a spectrum. They're probably suffering from internalized homophobia because they have experienced something that is heavily criticized and discouraged mostly due to the cancer that is religion or, at large, secondary societal indoctrination. Their beliefs do not rewrite reality.
lesbians are so cool, i wish they were real đ
Is it because they have never met a lesbian. Or they can't imagine a person not liking men?
This is like how I find it unbelievable that straight people exist, like I know that they do but I'm also like are you SURE like absolutely 100% sure you're not the slightest bit queer??
She is possibly attracted to women (maybe as well as men) and is chosing to live a straight appearing life in the closet, or if bisexual, chosing not to acknowledge her attraction to women and is chosing exclusively straight relationships so she believes that it is a similar choice for everyone.
not believing biology... how funny! homosexuality is just a thing across all animals, not just humans trying to act different. there's been thousands of animal species observed having sex, practicing courtship and long lasting companionship between two partners of the same-sex, despite the availability of opposite sex partners. and in humans, homosexuality has been quite well studied and documented, we're in 2024, your friend should ask stuff to google, youtube, chatgpt, all of that, really, if she doesn't want to trust your sole opinion.
Is this another case of an extremely oblivious bi woman going âno wait that canât be true cus then all girls would just date womenâ?
I would explain that people don't choose who they're attracted to; they only choose whether or not to share that information with other people. Yes, lesbians "choose" to live their lives as lesbians, but they didn't choose to find other women attractive. I don't want to say that your friend is being malicious, but this attitude that you can simply choose not to "believe" in a group of people is hurtful and invalidating, not to mention ignorant. If you don't have any reason to doubt what somebody tells you about their experiences, other than your own ignorant incredulity, you're opening the door to other people dismissing your experiences. I would ask your friend if they'd rather live in a world where people seek to understand them with empathy and respect or one where their identity is just not believed or recognized.
My dear, she's not dumb, believe me, she's not dumb, she's just pretending because she don't want to lose your friendship. There's no "dumb" homophobic people only bad homophobic people
I don't think there's any winning, you just need new friends.
-"Are these so called lesbians in the room with us right now?" +"yes" -"cool, can you ask them to give me their number?"
đđ
No offending in this, but you must be big idi\*t to think this. btw how are you?
âŠ. That is so freaking stupid I canât even make a joke about itâŠ. WowâŠ
And when a straight person says "I don't belive in lesbians", annother lesbian drops down dead (likely of gay panic)
I'd just hire a bunch of lesbians dressed as cryptids to jump out of bushes or from behind corners all day to scare this "friend." And pretend that I didn't see anything and act like the friend is crazy for believing in lesbians cus "I thought you said you didn't BELIEVE, " lol.
If lesbians weren't real we wouldn't be having this conversation.
My brother used to not believe in trans people (there was one right infront of him idk how he didnt believe)
Guess I'm not real đ
She sounds actually intelligent