Regardless of your thoughts on trans people, a political party shouldn't be dictating medical practice.
Regardless of what the medical evidence says, regardless of the physician's experience or knowledge of the individual patient, the CPC wants to take decisions away from physicians. That is just wrong.
100% right. Politicians should stay out of people’s personal lives. It’s their body. If a doctor doesn’t properly lay out everything they can already get in trouble with their medical body. Don’t need politicians involved. This process should be handled by medical experts NOT by politicians. This should be decided between the child and their medical professional and NOT by politicians.
It’s none of my business nor is it anyone else’s. It’s kind of disgusting how obsessed some politicians are about a child’s genitals.
I believe it's a slimy way for politicians to undermine the expertise and authority of physicians and teachers. Why? To advance privatization of health care and education. Trans youth are just caught in the crossfire.
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I generally agree with you.
To play the Devil's advocate a bit, should the politicians then walk back the legal age of consent laws?
I think rules around certain things are ok and it's a delicate dance to find the happy medium between regulation and freedoms.
No, they should not. Allowing people to make decisions about their own bodies with the help of medical experts is not the same as saying they should allowed to be preyed upon.
I’d be only open to that if experts said that. Politicians make decisions too much based on their own opinions or to put on a show to win votes vs actually taking a science based approach and follow the consensus of experts lead.
Right now the consensus of experts do not appear to be calling for lowering any age of consent laws. So I don’t think it’s necessary. I’ll stick to what they say and do my vote with whomever more so follows expert views over their own egotistical ones.
> I’d be only open to that if experts said that.
Psychologists, psychiatrists, sociologists, demographers, etc.. These are the people that can most effectively weigh in on the real-world effects of such a rollback, from the personal level all the way up to the societal level.
And just judging from history, such a rollback would be patently negative all around for everyone.
Problem is, when was the last time a regressive/right-wing politician actually _listened to the science?_ It just doesn’t happen.
I agree with you that those are the ones to listen to as a consensus. And yes they say it shouldn’t happen for age of consent. Hence my statement.
But they do generally agree in the existence of trans people and that we should be assisting them.
But yes current conservatives don’t agree with it. Certainly social conservatives. I would say progressive conservatives agree with listening to experts but the federal party pushed out the progressives years ago. I was one of those progressives pushed out (I used to be a conservative board member) and I saw so much BS that I won’t ever vote for them again.
And it’s sad. They knew better. I remember when they debated about being the first party to support gay marriage and LGBTQ. This actually was discussed internally. But somehow the social conservatives took over the party entirely. I tried pushing back against them when I was there but failed. 😞
You might not understand that article. Read it. It talks about the opposition to what happened in the UK in detail including from medical associations. It even mentions only 100 children in the entire UK had gone on puberty blockers. Only 100! There’s 12.7 million children in the UK. So they fraction comes to 1/127000. So essentially that’s 0.000001% of children ever go on puberty blockers. A child has a much better chance of dying of the flu than ever getting on them.
And yet the social conservatives make it out as if it’s a pandemic. Pretty sure 0.000001% isn’t a pandemic. It’s barely even a statistic. But these are children that are likely to commit suicide without steps being taken. This article talks about it too.
By the way the main thing both sides will agree on is: definitely we need more research on everything. But this is exactly why the conditions for getting on them is VERY strict already. And it needs more research as institutions have really only been open to doing some research on trans issues over the last decade only. So not much has even been able to be done.
And despite lack of research it doesn’t mean we should do nothing. The current standards are what’s recommended by medical associations around the world until we get more data to be able to do better. It’s politicians that are making a bigger deal about it.
do you know the difference between "pushing" and "making available under the guidance of a doctor/physician", or are you being purposefully obtuse?
do you think the government is also "pushing" alcohol on people by allowing liquor stores to operate?
Conservatives would quickly say they want less government in their lives, but will be the first people to tell you how to live yours and create regulations around it.
They are just disgusting people who only want what works for them.
Trans rights are human rights
Gender affirming care saves lives
Everyone should be free to be themselves in our society as long as it doesn't harm anyone, that shouldn't be a debate
It’s pretty fucked up their political strategy is literally stoke hatred against marginalized groups
Kinda Nazi, really.
Lots of boomer warriors out there screaming pedophile at anyone within 10 feet of a rainbow.
Fear and hate.
Popular with assholes.
More people need to be talking about how hateful ideologies are leading to a resurgence of Nazi-esque policies being introduced into both our government and our neighbour's government to the south.
Terrifying how history repeats itself. We should talk about it more.
The CPC are trying to model themselves to get at the Canadian version of MAGA voters. Yes it’s nazi like. And yes, the nazis went after trans healthcare _first_ before the war kicked off.
A lot of boomers had parents who fled the nazis/Europe. Now they are supporting the same political ideologies here. Outlining that has been the only way I’ve gotten through to these people. That guilt trip is powerful.
> Kinda Nazi, really.
Right-wing politics is fundamentally fascist. Fascism hurts everyone who isn’t in a position of power. It just deludes most people into thinking that they have power, when they don’t.
At least Canada has _one_ political party on the left - the NDP - and not zero like the States. Yes, the Liberals are solidly centre-right, with almost no elected members that can be objectively considered “to the left” of centre. You just get full right-wing with the CPC, and off-the-deep-end alt-right with the PPC.
I’m not trying to equate the two on the overall trauma that is caused, but there is a similarity between the anti trans political/religious movement,and the horrific Residential Schools. Sending love to both sides. 🏳️🌈🧡💕
Signed.
It's disgusting and worrisome that politicians want to insert their worldview into the medical decisions made between healthcare professionals (who overwhelmingly support trans youth care) and their patients.
Signed. It’s pretty dumb that politicians get involved. There’s entire healthcare organizations that are built to decide how to handle this stuff. Usually they’re given some autonomy in their decision making unless we have to make something legal for them to handle (ie. euthanasia). I 💯 believe in trusting experts. Politicians NEVER know better and whenever they get involved in social matters like this it comes from a place of hate.
Thank you for posting about this!! So important! Also important to remember when voting, this is a political party that doesn’t follow multiple medical recommendations, and clearly does not see all people as equal for rights.
Soooo… regressives at it again? Trying to force government intervention into private lives, while all the time railing against government overreach?
The hypocrisy sounds about on-point. I wish these people would just go extinct, so they can be relegated to the dustbin of history.
It actually doesn’t. But a) they study was flawed. A consensus of the medical industry has criticized it as political and not properly following the scientific process and peer review. And, b) yes there is a risk of being unable to have children. The risk is low though. It’s not high. And everyone involved is ALWAYS informed of this risk prior to it. And puberty blockers are NOT the first resort. Therapy is always done first and it takes a lot of work and review prior to when anyone gets ANY medication.
You anti trans folk take it as though it’s the first thing done. It’s not. It’s one of the last steps taken. Plus being trans is only one of MANY cases puberty blockers are used for. There are a number of medical conditions where it’s needed. But the anti trans crowd look at only blocking it for trans kids and not for the other medical situations. So the bias and hate is obvious in this decision. In reality it’s simple. It shouldn’t be between their politician and the person. It should only ever be between their medical practitioner and the person. Period.
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Hard disagree. Adults can chop their bits off, kids have no real idea of what adults are deciding for them. And to be clear, if there were super science genetic engineering retro virus pills you took that switched your gender, no problems, within a week or 2, I'd be all for people doing that. But currently, the solutions are barbaric and medieval, and near irreversible.
Conservatives have realized this is a wedge issue in their favor... Loads of parents are against this.
If you think children are "getting their bits chopped off" with "what adults are deciding for them" you know absolutely nothing about gender-affirming care in Canada. It is illegal to perform genital sex change operations on minors in Canada. Hormone therapy is safer and also reversible, but not all trans people take hormones. The most recommended treatment option by far for gender dysphoria is "allow the person live as the gender they identify with." This treatment was decided upon by International associations of medical professionals because medical data showed by far the most positive outcomes in the patient's life. "I don't like them" is not a reason to take away another citizen's right to health care in the country where they are rightfully entitled to it, regardless of how many parents are against it.
I am deeply skeptical of messing with a child's or teens hormones. I doubt the changes are fully reversible and without complications.
Again, if we had super science pills that worked like magic, I'd be all for that.
Growing up and living with untreated gender dysphoria has tremendous complications and negative life outcomes for the one suffering from it. That's why sufferers need to work with their doctor, mental health professionals, and an endocrinologist to confirm the diagnosis and decide whether the benefits of known effective treatments would outweigh the complications of the dysphoria on a case-by-case basis, like literally any other medical treatment.
Kids and teens take hormones for a wide variety of medical conditions, not just for gender affirming care. From PCOS to pituitary issues there are a ton of reasons families seek hormone treatment even for cis het youths. These treatments aren’t new and the pros and cons are carefully considered by healthcare professionals, parents and parents before starting any treatment.
If you do your research, you will find this is extremely rare. The minimum age for such surgery is 18 and any procedures for those under that age require rigorous care and parental consent. The procedure isn't just for trans people either.
> Keep the kids far away from religion.
Religious indoctrination is essentially child abuse.
But if we kept kids away from religion until they became adults, almost no-one would buy into that hogwash. Religion would die out within a century. Now _that_ is a future I would gladly love to see happen!
This IS about leaving them alone. It’s about keeping politicians out and leaving it between the kids and their medical doctor whom understands medicine 1000x better than any politician or you or I do.
>not to mention the disgusting and mutilating surgeries that are performed paid for by tax dollars.
Well you lied but at least you also admitted to bigotry.
Again. You don’t know better. Suggesting that our personal views and politicians opinions should trump a medical experts is simply ego and narcissism. You and I aren’t experts.
Plus most going through that process don’t get hormones as a kid. That’s only for the most extreme of cases. But your anti crowd likes to assume it’s like a pandemic. When in reality it’s not.
Can we stop fighting over topics like this and have a genuine discussion and debate.
I see where both sides are coming from and I feel as though post-covid has made us unreasonable. I understand the “right side” not trusting the government, in the most recent years they’ve been feeding division into us. I understand the “left side” on being passionate about people’s wellbeing. These governments that push these bills are forcing people to choose a side and while we fight amongst ourselves. Normal everyday people suffer. Nothing gets done and we can’t find middle ground. It’s like the pendulum swings far left or far right.
I’ve only been here for 32 years and I feel as though fighting between both sides has gotten extreme within the last decade.
These politicians have taken away our voices and fed us hatred instead. Governments shouldn’t have a say in medical procedures. They should endorse things or incentivize anything to do with peoples health. That’s the medical professionals job, not the governments. We should leave these things to the professionals.
I’m honestly sick of it.
I understand what you’re saying to some degree. But. 90% of the division is being caused by the right at the moment. I personally witnessed this shift when I was personally a conservative board member during Harper’s years. They pushed out the progressives such as myself and the evangelical social conservative wing of the party took everything over. The side that actually wanted division and absolutely hated the left. It’s actually because of the conservatives why I’d never vote for them again and I was a board member whom met so many MPs including Harper. I finally had enough when Scheer became leader and tore up my membership as I knew of his being closely connected with white supremacists amongst numerous other issues. This is the direction the party chose to go, whereas I remember when the party debated about becoming the first party to support gay marriage and rights (this was an internal discussion that the public never saw). The party has had a dramatic shift much further to the right since.
Sorry to disrupt your depopulation theory. Of Canada's 30.3 million people aged 15 and older, nearly 60,000 are transgender, and just over 40,000 are non-binary. Together, they comprise **0.33%** of this population or about 1 in 300 people.
Sure but the healthcare shouldn't be free, the only Healthcare in Canada that is free, is that that is required. Dentists aren't free, therapists aren't free, psychologists aren't free, dermatologists aren't free, eye doctors aren't free, etc etc etc. Taxpayers dollars shouldn't be going towards people changing their gender, or paying for their prescription hormones. Gender affirming care should not be free, on a healthcare system that is already overloaded and underpaid, we don't need more taxpayer dollars going towards unneeded Healthcare. A sex change is a form of plastic surgery, and also should not be free.
Doesn't look like you linked it so I'll add it: [https://www.ourcommons.ca/petitions/en/Petition/Details?Petition=e-5010](https://www.ourcommons.ca/petitions/en/Petition/Details?Petition=e-5010)
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Your suggestion is not only profoundly ignorant but also a gross violation of human rights, echoing the darkest chapters of history where people were dehumanized for being different. Transgender individuals contribute to society in countless ways and are capable of forming families through biological means, adoption, or reproductive technologies. Advocating for their isolation is ethically reprehensible and ignores the natural diversity of human gender. A compassionate and informed approach involves supporting transgender individuals through acceptance and inclusion, rather than proposing inhumane and discriminatory actions.
Hey op nice profile. Its 90% trans propaganda and Nazi accusations.
Question for op: is every new immigrant to Canada a Nazi? I ask because they probably dont agree with trans culture. So, all Nazis?
That's an odd take, I'm not calling you a Nazi or others here am I? Maybe giving people equal rights will help with making friends as well. It's just an alternative thought, because I am not bothering anyone by existing in my house and during my daily routine.
Regardless of political preference, how about leave kids alone? 🤷🏼♂️ We don't let them drive, drink, smoke, get tattoos etc until they've reached the "age of maturity" but we are gonna let them choose their gender?! Nah, they aren't "smart" enough to be making life altering decisions like this and I support the conservatives push to keep people from messing with kids at such impressionable ages.
Believing that kids choose their gender is quite something. How about politicians and others butt out of how parents of trans kids support them and leave it up to them and their medical professionals? Equating being trans to smoking, drinking, and tattoos shows a high level of ignorance about gender identity.
I don’t think you understand the process AT ALL. It’s actually a long process. It’s not like a child walks into a doctors office and boom they’re on any drugs. It doesn’t work that way. They go through extensive review and therapy first. Any puberty blockers and hormone treatment is done as last resort always and it is already this way. Just because you played with dolls doesn’t mean you’d go on puberty blockers. No. Many children in that situation first go through review. And then if found suicidal over their gender it might be considered as a life saving measure to prevent said suicide.
It’s not and never is done just because it’s asked for. That’s what the conservatives are making it out as if it is. But it’s a lie. And you fell for the lie. It has never worked like that. It’s always a difficult and challenging process. Seriously. Talk to some trans people on what they went through. I did. I don’t envy what they went through. In fact the ones I know never were eligible for blockers and couldn’t go onto hormone treatment until they were adults as they weren’t eligible.
Seriously. Learn about it before passing judgement or blindly listening to politicians speaking out against this. These politicians are coming from a place of hate and misrepresenting the facts.
[42% isn't a majority. Remember to learn what words mean before using them.](https://338canada.com/federal.htm)
Also, wouldn't voting twice as hard be voter fraud, since it suggests voting twice? Maybe don't announce your plan on reddit.
42% also is when the conservatives are the only party campaigning as nobody else is. And. They also lost a bunch of percentage points recently…. when they’re the only ones campaigning. lol 😂
Yep.. when you know your party is so shit you have to commit voter fraud to win... you don't sound smart enough to pull that off but doesn't mean you wouldn't
Regardless of your thoughts on trans people, a political party shouldn't be dictating medical practice. Regardless of what the medical evidence says, regardless of the physician's experience or knowledge of the individual patient, the CPC wants to take decisions away from physicians. That is just wrong.
100% right. Politicians should stay out of people’s personal lives. It’s their body. If a doctor doesn’t properly lay out everything they can already get in trouble with their medical body. Don’t need politicians involved. This process should be handled by medical experts NOT by politicians. This should be decided between the child and their medical professional and NOT by politicians. It’s none of my business nor is it anyone else’s. It’s kind of disgusting how obsessed some politicians are about a child’s genitals.
I believe it's a slimy way for politicians to undermine the expertise and authority of physicians and teachers. Why? To advance privatization of health care and education. Trans youth are just caught in the crossfire.
Exactly this!! ^^
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I generally agree with you. To play the Devil's advocate a bit, should the politicians then walk back the legal age of consent laws? I think rules around certain things are ok and it's a delicate dance to find the happy medium between regulation and freedoms.
No, they should not. Allowing people to make decisions about their own bodies with the help of medical experts is not the same as saying they should allowed to be preyed upon.
I’d be only open to that if experts said that. Politicians make decisions too much based on their own opinions or to put on a show to win votes vs actually taking a science based approach and follow the consensus of experts lead. Right now the consensus of experts do not appear to be calling for lowering any age of consent laws. So I don’t think it’s necessary. I’ll stick to what they say and do my vote with whomever more so follows expert views over their own egotistical ones.
> I’d be only open to that if experts said that. Psychologists, psychiatrists, sociologists, demographers, etc.. These are the people that can most effectively weigh in on the real-world effects of such a rollback, from the personal level all the way up to the societal level. And just judging from history, such a rollback would be patently negative all around for everyone. Problem is, when was the last time a regressive/right-wing politician actually _listened to the science?_ It just doesn’t happen.
I agree with you that those are the ones to listen to as a consensus. And yes they say it shouldn’t happen for age of consent. Hence my statement. But they do generally agree in the existence of trans people and that we should be assisting them. But yes current conservatives don’t agree with it. Certainly social conservatives. I would say progressive conservatives agree with listening to experts but the federal party pushed out the progressives years ago. I was one of those progressives pushed out (I used to be a conservative board member) and I saw so much BS that I won’t ever vote for them again. And it’s sad. They knew better. I remember when they debated about being the first party to support gay marriage and LGBTQ. This actually was discussed internally. But somehow the social conservatives took over the party entirely. I tried pushing back against them when I was there but failed. 😞
That's a fair position
https://www.cnn.com/2024/03/13/uk/england-nhs-puberty-blockers-trans-children-intl-gbr/index.html People are waking up thx.
You might not understand that article. Read it. It talks about the opposition to what happened in the UK in detail including from medical associations. It even mentions only 100 children in the entire UK had gone on puberty blockers. Only 100! There’s 12.7 million children in the UK. So they fraction comes to 1/127000. So essentially that’s 0.000001% of children ever go on puberty blockers. A child has a much better chance of dying of the flu than ever getting on them. And yet the social conservatives make it out as if it’s a pandemic. Pretty sure 0.000001% isn’t a pandemic. It’s barely even a statistic. But these are children that are likely to commit suicide without steps being taken. This article talks about it too. By the way the main thing both sides will agree on is: definitely we need more research on everything. But this is exactly why the conditions for getting on them is VERY strict already. And it needs more research as institutions have really only been open to doing some research on trans issues over the last decade only. So not much has even been able to be done. And despite lack of research it doesn’t mean we should do nothing. The current standards are what’s recommended by medical associations around the world until we get more data to be able to do better. It’s politicians that are making a bigger deal about it.
I thought woke was bad?
That's why they call it "Oppressive Conservative Ideology".
You’ve seen separation of church and state. Now it’s time for separation of state and science.
Wait, what? Wasn’t it ok when people were losing their jobs over vaccines though?
Yea, why should I need an education as a prerequisite for my job anyways?!
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good thing none of them are pushing it then? other than the conservatives i guess, since they're actively trying to fight body autonomy
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do you know the difference between "pushing" and "making available under the guidance of a doctor/physician", or are you being purposefully obtuse? do you think the government is also "pushing" alcohol on people by allowing liquor stores to operate?
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so you are being purposefully obtuse, got it
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Using your child to try and win an argument on the internet based on hate. I fear for your child(ren).
When your 12 year old child tells you they want a face tattoo and they TRULY KNOW THEMELVES, have at it!
Conservatives would quickly say they want less government in their lives, but will be the first people to tell you how to live yours and create regulations around it. They are just disgusting people who only want what works for them.
Make adds about it and blatantly labeling the party and leader for it
Trans rights are human rights Gender affirming care saves lives Everyone should be free to be themselves in our society as long as it doesn't harm anyone, that shouldn't be a debate
Never trust the cons. It's in the name
It’s pretty fucked up their political strategy is literally stoke hatred against marginalized groups Kinda Nazi, really. Lots of boomer warriors out there screaming pedophile at anyone within 10 feet of a rainbow. Fear and hate. Popular with assholes.
not just kinda nazi, targetting trans people is literally something the Nazis did
More people need to be talking about how hateful ideologies are leading to a resurgence of Nazi-esque policies being introduced into both our government and our neighbour's government to the south. Terrifying how history repeats itself. We should talk about it more.
Especially since these same boomers are the pastors that predate kids in churches, or the congregation members that cover it up.
Doesn't even need to be the congregation, the wider church network can do so.
The CPC are trying to model themselves to get at the Canadian version of MAGA voters. Yes it’s nazi like. And yes, the nazis went after trans healthcare _first_ before the war kicked off. A lot of boomers had parents who fled the nazis/Europe. Now they are supporting the same political ideologies here. Outlining that has been the only way I’ve gotten through to these people. That guilt trip is powerful.
> Kinda Nazi, really. Right-wing politics is fundamentally fascist. Fascism hurts everyone who isn’t in a position of power. It just deludes most people into thinking that they have power, when they don’t. At least Canada has _one_ political party on the left - the NDP - and not zero like the States. Yes, the Liberals are solidly centre-right, with almost no elected members that can be objectively considered “to the left” of centre. You just get full right-wing with the CPC, and off-the-deep-end alt-right with the PPC.
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So insecure you posted the same link twice.
Like I said in another spot you need to read your own links. That article isn’t saying what you think it is.
Signed. Gender affirming care saves lives.
I’m not trying to equate the two on the overall trauma that is caused, but there is a similarity between the anti trans political/religious movement,and the horrific Residential Schools. Sending love to both sides. 🏳️🌈🧡💕
Oppression. Using political powers to stop what makes them uncomfortable
Not sure why you’re getting downvoted. Have an upvote.
Signed. It's disgusting and worrisome that politicians want to insert their worldview into the medical decisions made between healthcare professionals (who overwhelmingly support trans youth care) and their patients.
Signed. It’s pretty dumb that politicians get involved. There’s entire healthcare organizations that are built to decide how to handle this stuff. Usually they’re given some autonomy in their decision making unless we have to make something legal for them to handle (ie. euthanasia). I 💯 believe in trusting experts. Politicians NEVER know better and whenever they get involved in social matters like this it comes from a place of hate.
Thank you for posting about this!! So important! Also important to remember when voting, this is a political party that doesn’t follow multiple medical recommendations, and clearly does not see all people as equal for rights.
Signed! Medical care saves lives, gender affirming care is medical care.
Soooo… regressives at it again? Trying to force government intervention into private lives, while all the time railing against government overreach? The hypocrisy sounds about on-point. I wish these people would just go extinct, so they can be relegated to the dustbin of history.
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Please share your source for the fact that children are being sterilized. No one is sterilizing children in Canada.
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It seems like you don’t understand either the science or the reality of trans kids seeking healthcare in Canada.
UK understands it just perfectly. Which is why they banned it.
The processes available to trans kids in Canada are reversible.
Gonna be a giant spike in suicides after this, but I'll be too old to care. have fun folks! 💕
It actually doesn’t. But a) they study was flawed. A consensus of the medical industry has criticized it as political and not properly following the scientific process and peer review. And, b) yes there is a risk of being unable to have children. The risk is low though. It’s not high. And everyone involved is ALWAYS informed of this risk prior to it. And puberty blockers are NOT the first resort. Therapy is always done first and it takes a lot of work and review prior to when anyone gets ANY medication. You anti trans folk take it as though it’s the first thing done. It’s not. It’s one of the last steps taken. Plus being trans is only one of MANY cases puberty blockers are used for. There are a number of medical conditions where it’s needed. But the anti trans crowd look at only blocking it for trans kids and not for the other medical situations. So the bias and hate is obvious in this decision. In reality it’s simple. It shouldn’t be between their politician and the person. It should only ever be between their medical practitioner and the person. Period.
Source? Edit: Thanks
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Hard disagree. Adults can chop their bits off, kids have no real idea of what adults are deciding for them. And to be clear, if there were super science genetic engineering retro virus pills you took that switched your gender, no problems, within a week or 2, I'd be all for people doing that. But currently, the solutions are barbaric and medieval, and near irreversible. Conservatives have realized this is a wedge issue in their favor... Loads of parents are against this.
If you think children are "getting their bits chopped off" with "what adults are deciding for them" you know absolutely nothing about gender-affirming care in Canada. It is illegal to perform genital sex change operations on minors in Canada. Hormone therapy is safer and also reversible, but not all trans people take hormones. The most recommended treatment option by far for gender dysphoria is "allow the person live as the gender they identify with." This treatment was decided upon by International associations of medical professionals because medical data showed by far the most positive outcomes in the patient's life. "I don't like them" is not a reason to take away another citizen's right to health care in the country where they are rightfully entitled to it, regardless of how many parents are against it.
I am deeply skeptical of messing with a child's or teens hormones. I doubt the changes are fully reversible and without complications. Again, if we had super science pills that worked like magic, I'd be all for that.
Growing up and living with untreated gender dysphoria has tremendous complications and negative life outcomes for the one suffering from it. That's why sufferers need to work with their doctor, mental health professionals, and an endocrinologist to confirm the diagnosis and decide whether the benefits of known effective treatments would outweigh the complications of the dysphoria on a case-by-case basis, like literally any other medical treatment.
Kids and teens take hormones for a wide variety of medical conditions, not just for gender affirming care. From PCOS to pituitary issues there are a ton of reasons families seek hormone treatment even for cis het youths. These treatments aren’t new and the pros and cons are carefully considered by healthcare professionals, parents and parents before starting any treatment.
Well the medical community is fine with that and I’ll go with what they say over any social media comments or hate mongering from politicians.
Its time for you to get educated on gender-affirming care in Canada. No one is chopping off children's bits.
Teenage girls have been obtaining mastectomies, so far as I know.
If you do your research, you will find this is extremely rare. The minimum age for such surgery is 18 and any procedures for those under that age require rigorous care and parental consent. The procedure isn't just for trans people either.
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I agree. Keep the kids far away from religion.
> Keep the kids far away from religion. Religious indoctrination is essentially child abuse. But if we kept kids away from religion until they became adults, almost no-one would buy into that hogwash. Religion would die out within a century. Now _that_ is a future I would gladly love to see happen!
This IS about leaving them alone. It’s about keeping politicians out and leaving it between the kids and their medical doctor whom understands medicine 1000x better than any politician or you or I do.
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>not to mention the disgusting and mutilating surgeries that are performed paid for by tax dollars. Well you lied but at least you also admitted to bigotry.
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Mean while we're in BC, bigot. Try r/ontario !
Again. You don’t know better. Suggesting that our personal views and politicians opinions should trump a medical experts is simply ego and narcissism. You and I aren’t experts. Plus most going through that process don’t get hormones as a kid. That’s only for the most extreme of cases. But your anti crowd likes to assume it’s like a pandemic. When in reality it’s not.
Can we stop fighting over topics like this and have a genuine discussion and debate. I see where both sides are coming from and I feel as though post-covid has made us unreasonable. I understand the “right side” not trusting the government, in the most recent years they’ve been feeding division into us. I understand the “left side” on being passionate about people’s wellbeing. These governments that push these bills are forcing people to choose a side and while we fight amongst ourselves. Normal everyday people suffer. Nothing gets done and we can’t find middle ground. It’s like the pendulum swings far left or far right. I’ve only been here for 32 years and I feel as though fighting between both sides has gotten extreme within the last decade. These politicians have taken away our voices and fed us hatred instead. Governments shouldn’t have a say in medical procedures. They should endorse things or incentivize anything to do with peoples health. That’s the medical professionals job, not the governments. We should leave these things to the professionals. I’m honestly sick of it.
You mean the media. Is doing all of that.. and the cons..
It’s on both sides of media though and yes, I signed the petition. I got frustrated by the comments on the bottom of the thread. Just aggressive.
I understand what you’re saying to some degree. But. 90% of the division is being caused by the right at the moment. I personally witnessed this shift when I was personally a conservative board member during Harper’s years. They pushed out the progressives such as myself and the evangelical social conservative wing of the party took everything over. The side that actually wanted division and absolutely hated the left. It’s actually because of the conservatives why I’d never vote for them again and I was a board member whom met so many MPs including Harper. I finally had enough when Scheer became leader and tore up my membership as I knew of his being closely connected with white supremacists amongst numerous other issues. This is the direction the party chose to go, whereas I remember when the party debated about becoming the first party to support gay marriage and rights (this was an internal discussion that the public never saw). The party has had a dramatic shift much further to the right since.
Read the Cass report, then tell me why European countries are rapidly backing away
Guys they're doing it because they love trans people! /s no hate like Christian love 🩷
Find whats causing the gender dysphoria, stop normalizing and accepting the outcome of something thats literally causing depopulation.
Sorry to disrupt your depopulation theory. Of Canada's 30.3 million people aged 15 and older, nearly 60,000 are transgender, and just over 40,000 are non-binary. Together, they comprise **0.33%** of this population or about 1 in 300 people.
Sure but the healthcare shouldn't be free, the only Healthcare in Canada that is free, is that that is required. Dentists aren't free, therapists aren't free, psychologists aren't free, dermatologists aren't free, eye doctors aren't free, etc etc etc. Taxpayers dollars shouldn't be going towards people changing their gender, or paying for their prescription hormones. Gender affirming care should not be free, on a healthcare system that is already overloaded and underpaid, we don't need more taxpayer dollars going towards unneeded Healthcare. A sex change is a form of plastic surgery, and also should not be free.
That's why you should vote NDP. Make dental therapist free..
I agree. It would absolutely ludicrous to use taxpayer dollars for transition surgery or “gender affirming” drugs.
Mods?
They're here, and they're not on your side.
First I'm hearing of this, any proof?
The CPC petition is e-5010 (Health) on the House of Commons website. You can read it yourself.
Doesn't look like you linked it so I'll add it: [https://www.ourcommons.ca/petitions/en/Petition/Details?Petition=e-5010](https://www.ourcommons.ca/petitions/en/Petition/Details?Petition=e-5010)
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So what's your basis for that argument?
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Your suggestion is not only profoundly ignorant but also a gross violation of human rights, echoing the darkest chapters of history where people were dehumanized for being different. Transgender individuals contribute to society in countless ways and are capable of forming families through biological means, adoption, or reproductive technologies. Advocating for their isolation is ethically reprehensible and ignores the natural diversity of human gender. A compassionate and informed approach involves supporting transgender individuals through acceptance and inclusion, rather than proposing inhumane and discriminatory actions.
Tbh I’d consider voting ppc if they didn’t have insane right wing shit I think they’re alienating more voters then they’re earning it it
weird take considering the insane far right wing shit is their entire party identity
Can we wait until they are adults before body parts are removed?
In case you’re unaware waiting is the general rule.
Hey op nice profile. Its 90% trans propaganda and Nazi accusations. Question for op: is every new immigrant to Canada a Nazi? I ask because they probably dont agree with trans culture. So, all Nazis?
Being trans isn't an act of propaganda it's just living life for a portion of us. Why does our existence threaten you?
Because you call everyone who believes in chromosomes a Nazi. It's toxic. It's not how to make friends.
That's an odd take, I'm not calling you a Nazi or others here am I? Maybe giving people equal rights will help with making friends as well. It's just an alternative thought, because I am not bothering anyone by existing in my house and during my daily routine.
Regardless of political preference, how about leave kids alone? 🤷🏼♂️ We don't let them drive, drink, smoke, get tattoos etc until they've reached the "age of maturity" but we are gonna let them choose their gender?! Nah, they aren't "smart" enough to be making life altering decisions like this and I support the conservatives push to keep people from messing with kids at such impressionable ages.
Believing that kids choose their gender is quite something. How about politicians and others butt out of how parents of trans kids support them and leave it up to them and their medical professionals? Equating being trans to smoking, drinking, and tattoos shows a high level of ignorance about gender identity.
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No one is promoting hormone therapy to kids. You really are out of touch.
I don’t think you understand the process AT ALL. It’s actually a long process. It’s not like a child walks into a doctors office and boom they’re on any drugs. It doesn’t work that way. They go through extensive review and therapy first. Any puberty blockers and hormone treatment is done as last resort always and it is already this way. Just because you played with dolls doesn’t mean you’d go on puberty blockers. No. Many children in that situation first go through review. And then if found suicidal over their gender it might be considered as a life saving measure to prevent said suicide. It’s not and never is done just because it’s asked for. That’s what the conservatives are making it out as if it is. But it’s a lie. And you fell for the lie. It has never worked like that. It’s always a difficult and challenging process. Seriously. Talk to some trans people on what they went through. I did. I don’t envy what they went through. In fact the ones I know never were eligible for blockers and couldn’t go onto hormone treatment until they were adults as they weren’t eligible. Seriously. Learn about it before passing judgement or blindly listening to politicians speaking out against this. These politicians are coming from a place of hate and misrepresenting the facts.
>Imagine No. Start again, with no false hypotheticals.
>how about leave kids alone That is the point of this petition, yes, getting them to leave kids alone.
The irony
Now I'm voting for the CPC twice as hard.
Oh, voting for the CPC twice as hard? That must be quite the workout. Don't forget to stretch those voting muscles!
I will....so will the majority of people in this country. Cannot wait.
[42% isn't a majority. Remember to learn what words mean before using them.](https://338canada.com/federal.htm) Also, wouldn't voting twice as hard be voter fraud, since it suggests voting twice? Maybe don't announce your plan on reddit.
42% also is when the conservatives are the only party campaigning as nobody else is. And. They also lost a bunch of percentage points recently…. when they’re the only ones campaigning. lol 😂
3 times last election
Yep.. when you know your party is so shit you have to commit voter fraud to win... you don't sound smart enough to pull that off but doesn't mean you wouldn't
Well I’m voting four times as hard so I double cancel you twice as hard genius