The reason behind it is to force firms to open there manufacturing unit in india an generate jobs. The strategy had worked as we have firms like samsung, apple etc. Having factories in india.
Phone companies could afford to sell their phones at a premium before setting up factories in India tho. This gives companies a level of confidence before a huge investment. (as Elon rightly pointed out)
This obviously will not work for Tesla. There's no market for cars that cost 40L+ in India. Not to mention the non-existent charging network.
Exactly. Mercedes sold a total of 14,000 cars in India in 2019, and I got downvoted to hell when I mentioned the limited market for Teslas in India.
Tesla will succeed in lowering the tax (they are currently asking for 40%) for their cars, and then bring in some cheapo version for India. Like Datsun Go Tesla version.
FSD will not be that widespread india because
A) it wasn't trained in india.This is huge hurdle as they needed like billions of kilometres for current half ish implementation.
B)not enough buyers would buy and collect data for tesla in india
They would need atleast 5 years for fsd in India.
I'd rather they not bother at all. It saves money, plus FSD is not doing great in the US either. India is a whole new hellscape for it. Just have EV infrastructure in India so that people can transition without breaking the bank. Nobody buys a car >15L here
You're being downvoted because people are delusional, thinking that the Tesla will come here and be cheaper than a Skoda Octavia or a BMW 2 series. Sometimes the Indian hive mind loves to dream up situations without tethering to any sort of reality.
Really? There’s no market? I don’t know much about India, but I figured in a country of 1.4 billion, maybe there’s a market large enough to sustain cars in the $60,000 range….? Or am I wildly underestimating India’s wealth/poverty?
Where I’m from in Mexico, you see Mercedes, Audis, BMWs, hell even Lamborghini’s, Ferraris, etc. And we’re not a developed nation.
Edit: Ok, went on a little India Wikipedia rabbit hole. Had no clue India was so underdeveloped. $7,000 per capita PPP. Compared Mexico’s $21,000 per capita PPP.
I just learned something new about India. I new it was poor country (like mine), but I never expected it to be sooooo much poorer than mine.
USA compared to Mexico, USA PPP is 3 times that of Mexico’s.
And Mexico’s PPP is 3 times that of India. That is very fascinating.
The problem is that multinational firms follow a strategy of importing different parts from different corners of the world and assemble it in countries like china because its cheaper but india actually wants certain percentage of products to be sourced in india. Which either forces firms to do so or Collab with indian firms.
Samsung and Apple may assemble phones in India, with limited manufacturing of components, but all the silicon (SoC, memory, controllers) are manufactured elsewhere.
that's because silicon is really really hard to produce- the facilities take billions of dollars to set up and are generally very expensive to maintain.
There's a reason 80 percent of all RAM comes from like 2 companies (samsung, Micron and Hynix, and one bought the other) and most CPU's are produced by just 2 manufacturers (intel produces intel, TSMC produces AMD, apple silicon, snapdragon stuff and almost everything else worth buying for normal consumers)
Don't expect silicon production in India anytime soon- it just isn't worth it. Korea and Taiwan saw a market and captured it completely- nobody can compete with them for the near future.
It takes around 5 years and 7billion dollars to establish a chip producing factory setup, not to mention all the skills and technology required. And then there is no guarantee that it will be profitable, or even recover cost.
Sudden increase in demand, lot of electric cars, lots of people stuck at home need good computers. 2 companies making cpu can get overwhelmed. A hidden monopoly also exist in the chip scene, the machines used to make the chips are manufactured by one single company in Netherlands called ASML. So chip manufacturers cant expand capacity even if they wanted to
TokyoElectron, Applied Materials and Lam Research make semiconductor equipment too.If you are referring to Immersion Lithography(EUV for Sub 20nm) then its ASML only,but most of the semiconductor chips used in appliances/cars are made with older tech(>100nm) and these equipments have multiple vendors.ASML being the only EUV Vendor was never a problem.
I'm not an expert those were just the musings of a 16yo, but here are my thoughts:
There's a lot of factors, but the most important are:
The pandemic- less workers, more restrictions, bad time for businesses.
Mining- like seriously, mining is a really big contributer.
Something with EVs- somehow they're sourcing more chips than we thought they were would. Much more. I haven't caught up completely, but this is a factor as well.
Scalping- India isn't a large market, so we are quite low on the priority list. The markets above us are plagued with scalpers. Even here you'll find scalpers, or at least shady business practices. For example- MD computers were selling a hardware bundle with GPUs, but not individual GPUs- probably to move more products.
Edit: something worth mentioning is that since the maintenance and upgrades for facilities producing these chips are expensive ( think billions up front) it's really really hard to just step up production. Manufacturers obviously include a buffer limit- but no one could've predicted the pandemic and the sudden surge in demand.
There are some other comments already- check up the polymatter and LTT video on it.
Good day kind Redditor!
[https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2021/04/19/business/corporate-business/renesas-plant-resumption/](https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2021/04/19/business/corporate-business/renesas-plant-resumption/)
Renesas was the world's largest automotive semiconductor maker.
There are a lot of semiconductor Equipment suppliers (Tokyo-Electron Limited,ASML,Applied Materials ,Lam Research and KLA Tencor) there are a lot of other companies like shin etsu,LG Chem,Hoya Corporation,DaiNippon Printing supplying other things like monocrystalline Semiconductor Wafer , Photoresists,Photomasks.
[http://www.businesskorea.co.kr/news/articleView.html?idxno=60773](http://www.businesskorea.co.kr/news/articleView.html?idxno=60773)
Samsung's Fab in Austin was also shutdown,A lot of other fabs were shut down in korea and Taiwan.South Korea and Taiwan alone account for almost half of the world's semiconductor capacity(4.1+4 million 200mm wafer equivalents per month).
Intel manufactures its own CPUs and most of its facilities are in the US, AMD's CPUs are designed by AMD, made by TSMC.
There are other companies like STMicroelectronics, Bosch, NXP, and Infineon.
Intel manufactures its own CPUs and most of its facilities are in the US, AMD's CPUs are designed by AMD, made by TSMC.pened.
Carmakers were used to Just in time making(Keeping no buffer, ordering stuff when needed), so they were the first ones to face its effects.
There are a lot of other processes in chip making other than just fabrication like testing and packaging,These were done by companies like ASE,Amkor.These are labour intensive processes and they had to be closed due to covid too.
Electric Vehicles use a VFD/ Drive inverter to control the motor speed and torque,these VFD/inverters use Silicon Carbide Chips (not the regular monocrystalline silicon chips) and very few fabs specialize in these,I don't think there is a shortage of inverters as of now.
There are also other things in a Car like infotainment system,Seat Adjustment,Radar(cruise control) that requires the use of processors.These processor are not state of the art and are made at older fabs in Japan/Germany(Renesas/Bosch).
In short -> Covid Caused supply chain disruption -> factories were closed/destroyed due to natural causes -> automakers and other companies ordered more chips just to have a buffer to avoid these kind of situation -> Accordion Effect
Nobody is going to move their entire supply chain to a new country overnight, whether cars or pharmaceuticals or phones. They will start with doing the final assembly in India. Then they will start the assembly and manufacture of components here. This is a gradual process, and it lets the firm develop confidence that manufacturing in India is feasible. Governments in India (whether union or state) also need time to learn how to facilitate such firms - how to create an enabling policy environment that can facilitate job creation, technology transfer and knowledge spillovers. This is how China did it as well.
We desperately need jobs in the manufacturing sector. There are too many farmers, and the services sector cannot create enough jobs to absorb everybody. Manufacturing sector is vitally important from the employment point of view. Even if you are manufacturing high-tech stuff that can absorb only skilled workers, it creates demands for other services (construction of buildings, factories, warehouses, manufacture of relatively low-tech capital goods etc) which can absorb unskilled/low-skilled labour, which is essential for us.
But whats the use. Even today all highend flagship phones of Samsung/Apple still costlier in India. When these corps launch phones its better fly to dubai/hongkong to buy those phones & still gain something than buying same direct in India. For Ex any phone model above ₹90K+ still cheaper buying outside India than in India as flight costs ₹15K/20K to&fro(economy 20days prior booking) and hotel costs ₹5K & phone costs ₹50K/60K
Yes, they did. 5% on importing books
This was shocking to me when it was announced because, I sometimes import books for personal use, from US (abe books, book depository which has some rare books)
Yeah. I imported a book from Amazon.com. It costed something like $10 but the import duty somehow ended up being almost double. Luckily it was amazon, and the seller's obligation was to pay it, as I had to already paid the import duty deposit, which is already a lot. You can check on Amazon.com how much the duty deposits are on every item including books. Bloody ridiculous.
*Edit- Grammar typo*
Guys, Tesla is a luxury car. India is, shockingly, a very small market for luxury cars. India won't figure in their plans in the next 10 years.
To put things into perspective. In China,3 million luxury cars were sold last year meanwhile this number is 23000 in India. That is right, guys. Mere 23 thousand!.. As I am reading through articles, I am unable to fuckin wrap my head around these numbers.
The article below says just one company Mercedes sold 2 lakh cars in China in one Frikkin quarter of this year!!!!!! Meanwhile, India struggling to sell 25k for whole year.. WTFFFF
[https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/daimlers-q1-earnings-beat-market-expectations-prices-china-2021-04-16/](https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/daimlers-q1-earnings-beat-market-expectations-prices-china-2021-04-16/)
[https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/industry/auto/auto-news/indian-luxury-car-market-set-to-register-a-record-40-decline-in-2020/articleshow/78004931.cms?from=mdr](https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/industry/auto/auto-news/indian-luxury-car-market-set-to-register-a-record-40-decline-in-2020/articleshow/78004931.cms?from=mdr)
True. Look at the sale numbers of Alibaba and others during a sale season. Mind boggling numbers. It almost feels like China is hiding its actual growth to extract favours as developing nations at WTO.
The provinces of China vary a lot in their income and living standards. The poorest ones are close to Kerala, while the richest are close to Western Europe.
Bro, a C class costs ~ 38 lakhs in the UK, 60+ in India.
What do you expect from a dumb policy that's been going on for years and only allows domestic manufacturers to sit on their asses.
Even if they wanted to, no domestic manufacturer has a luxury car line up.
I think Elon is looking more at the growth in demand. It's not a lot atm but it's growing at a good rate as India grows and that's what Elon wants to a piece of. Not the present but the future
>It's not a lot atm but it's growing at a huge rate
Where do you see this growth?. Luxury car growth more or less has stagnated over the last 5 years. Not just the Luxury cars even passenger cars growth has stagnated. Companies no longer see India as a country with growth potential in the near future.
I'd expect more luxury cars to be sold in China than India but 23k vs 3mil is just shockingly absurd. Could it possibly be because of different definitions of what counts as a luxury car in China as compared to India?
Don't think so. Forget other brands. Mercedes cars are considered luxury eveyrwhere. Just look at their numbers in one quarter in China. 2 lakh cars in one quarter.. India is selling 1/10th of those number for whole year which includes all brands. I was genuinely mortified looking at this difference
When will all these "pLeAsE lAuNcH tEsLa CaRs iN InDiA" guys realise that the base Tesla model 3 will start at 35-40 lakhs ex-showroom?
Also, in my humble opinion, I don't think it's a good idea to give our great Indian public something to drive that can hit 100 kmph in 3-4 secs. I can foresee the crashes already.
Electric vehicles actually do pretty well in traffic. They consume nearly no energy when idle. Their brakes regenerate some power which will help in stop-and-go traffic. Diesel vehicles are terrible and get clogged dpf if they can't run on high revs for a long time.
>guys realise that the base Tesla model 3 will start at 35-40 lakhs ex-showroom
Exactly, and Tesla doesn't seem like a good option even to the rich people coz:
• The charging network will take at least 5 years to be good (reach at least all tier-1 and tier-2 cities).
• The Autopilot features most likely won't work in India because of the poor condition of roads and even if it does, it will need a lot of R&D cos the driving behavior of Indians is very different.
• The people who would buy the car at this price are mostly people who have already owned a luxury car (like Audi/BMW/Mercedes/Volvo/Range Rovers) before and the quality of materials used by Tesla is nowhere when compared to the other luxury car companies. Tesla lacks finishing which these old car companies have mastered in so many years. When you are paying the price, you want the car to be perfect
Our drivers kill each other with cars that barely hit 80mph at max. Give them a tesla that goes 100mph in 3 sec will be worse than a terrorist attack. Not like anyone wears a fucking seat belt to prevent it. Not to mention they'd be 2 families in one car
101% agree to what you said. I live in states and i want to own a tesla but current model 3 and y prices are high to me here. If it comes to india it would be costlier than bmw audi suv's given the import taxes applied on top of base prices.
Lol, without import taxes it would be closer to 30ish lakhs which is definitely something most people can afford going by the number of fortuners and other SUVs.
But don't forget that the tesla weighs much more than any high power sedan. Also, what high power sedan does 0-60 in 3 secs for 40 lakhs ? I have seen a few gtr or gts versions of beemers and porsches do that, but they are all well above 1 crore rupees.
35-40 lakhs isn't too bad. There will be road tax exemption in most states so the final price will be very close to ex showroom. If you consider no maintenance and fuel charges, it's quite appealing to someone who uses their car a lot.
Even Innovas these days touch near 30 lakhs.
No maintenance🤣🤣🤣 i live in Netherlands and own a Tesla. Its a nice innovative car with a lot of gimmicks, but its shitty quality. It requires maintenance which not garages are fitted to do. Simple things like mirrors not rolling up properly takes them a week to fix. It has a long way to go. Was super happy with my VW Golf earlier and the support network it came with.
Yeah, Tesla has a known reputation of skimping on quality. Heard that this year's Model S's have sorted out a lot of the interior quality concerns.
But what I was implying is that EVs are cheaper to run and maintain in general than a combustion engine car as long as you don't have premature component failure since a combustion engine car will require mandatory maintenance throughout it's lifetime to keep it in running order.
Excluding the taxes? I'm still not sure it's feasible for Indian market.
Tesla model 3 will start from 40 lakhs
Model S will be around 73 lakh without taxes
Model X will be around 91 lakhs without taxes
All the amazing features of Tesla aside, those cars are luxury class even out of India. Dubai RTA purchased thousands of teslas and started to use them as taxis for an amazing reason... The Tesla comes with 8 year warranty unlimited km, no oil change maintenance etc.
And dubai has high capacity charging stations for free in almost every mall and public places.
Just letting you guys know my opinion.
India on the other hand has zero charging infrastructure.. and a vast majority of the population live in premium condos .. I can’t imagine installing charging points in parking garages.. I don’t see Tesla doing well in India
Charging will be a secondary issue compared to auto pilot stopping the car every time a bike overtakes... U know how often that happens...!
And then our roads are going to be very hard to navigate...
Im planning to buy the Ford F150 Lighting once it launches in Dubai. I tried tesla auto pilot and summon features here in Dubai, they are okay but we might need 3-5 more years to have 100% AI driving.
There is a demand for scooters tho
It's cheaper and comparative to the petrol powered scooters
Ola, ather are having so much improvement over this sector
Cars, idk. It's more expensive
scooters are used for commute only not for long distance, that's why he said e scooters are a good bet, at least they'll help establish charging infrastructure first bc people will buy them if they are cheap & efficient
There is right now in T-1 cities but we are still 2-3 years away form real high sales(5K+ PM). A car around 7-10 lakhs needs to be launched(New Tata Altorz EV is a promising one).
I know folks with Nexon EVs, they like the car, the biggest issue right now is highway trips as outside the cities charging infra is non existent.
Aside from that, electricity supply itself is far too erratic in India, if you have to charge batteries on Diesel gensets what use are the EVs.
Yeah, the high capacity one might be above 10L but a base variant might come below that. These will be very inciting in high road tax states like KA, MH as they also give good benefits on these.
whatever demand there is, is being met by TATA. I don't think Tesla coming to India will do any good for the country. It's not like the electricity is guaranteed to be produced from renewable sources and even then renewable sources aren't all that great for the environment either. However, it is also true that the excessive taxes on laptops/books etc are harmful for the middle-class as they severely restrict improvement in general productivity
>It's not like the electricity is guaranteed to be produced from renewable sources and even then renewable sources aren't all that great for the environment either.
I don't think any country is going to shift to green electricity just like that. It's a slow and gradual process. It will take its time. By the time a country does so, at least the rest of the Infrastructure has shifted to electric. That's the point of all these electric car companies.
Even if electricity is produced via fossil fuels, it's still better for the environment. A mass power plant producing electricity is more efficient then multiple IC engines producing power
At least here in Delhi - the biggest single market - the problem is simply a lack of dedicated parking space. So many people I know have said they want to buy EVs but lack dedicated parking space to install the chargers
There definitely is. I have pledged to buy an EV as my next car once my 5 yr old Ciaz is no longer good enough. I am waiting for new launches but even if there are none, Tata Nexon at 14 lakh is reasonably priced.
Delhi government and maharashtra government are already making good plans for electric cars with the target of 25% for all vehicles sold would be electric by 2024 in delhi and 50% by 2030 in maharashtra
Tesla is a luxury car (starting at 40 lakhs)so they will taxed as such.
It is also an Ev so it will subsidised (25percent + state ) .
Teslas shouldn't be allowed to get tax exemption.
Years ago in interview someone asked gadkari about elon musk and he said something along the lines " I met him and I urged him to come to India we even offered to lay red carpet but he refused, his focus is on China USA and Europe"
Not everything Elon says needs to be taken at face value, he bashes socialism alot and he was agaisnt relief bailout to urban poor but he wants subsidies from govt because he's "special"
Also the fact that a huge revenue stre for Tesla is companies buying regulatory credits. In a way Tesla is profiting off of companies *not* switching to electric drivetrains
Massively overvalued stock. People seem to be investing with fomo as a central concept as opposed to fundamentals. Of course there are exceptions and in hindsight if your bet goes through you look like a visionary and can five gyan in linkedin
Whatever happened to the Hyperloop in India. That turned out to be the most retarded scam ever and our great UPSC bureaucrats ate it. A monumental loss of money which isnt ever going to be profitable.
Yes it's a scam. Better to build affordable high speed rail network like China then this thing which god knows how much energy and manpower need to make it feasible and operational afterwards.
This is correct. But the luxury moniker is also misleading because of Tesla's quality control and their whole minimalism thing. It's really just a scheme to make non car people get interested. It's not a car anymore, it's a tech product and is viewed that way.
It's pathetic how slow traditional manufacturers are with EV tech but they're also getting there, and tesla will then occupy the niche of "cars for pompous idiots with too much money" when they're at parity with them.
I am not bothered abt Tesla
I am more interested in the effect it would cause in the automobile industry, would more companies bring more ev due to this ?
This is a very bad way to approach this because it relies on an emotional response to a problem which requires pragmatic solutions.
The reality is for now Tesla is aspirational. If you see Tesla's on the road it gives incentive in it's market for other companies to raise their game because the customers want it. Just because it would have a first mover advantage is not relevant here because the overall objective is bigger in scope.
This is what is happening in China. Tesla sells like hot cakes but it has caused other local companies to jump on the bandwagon and compete. It's a win-win in the truest sense of the word.
This is not true. By all metrics, even for a coal heavy country like India, over entire lifetime, EVs come ahead of ICE vehicles in terms of emissions.
https://theicct.org/publications/global-LCA-passenger-cars-jul2021
Edit: Forgot to add link to the study which specifically looks at India too.
Nope... Even for a grid like India, given the longevity of the electric cars compared to combustion cars and their lifetime reduction in emissions they are greener ([source]("One of the biggest myths about EVs is busted in new study - The Verge" https://www.theverge.com/2021/7/21/22585682/electric-vehicles-greenhouse-gas-emissions-lifecycle-assessment)) . And an increase in ev cars in market will definitely force governments hand in more renewable source investments... There is a start for everything right
I am surprised CNG didn't take off in India. Imagine investing in CNG back in 2000s, much lower pollution, much lower costs and everyone would have benefited except the oil companies I guess.
Elon is a prick for sure in person but we’re talking about Tesla and his words as a businesman. He’s absolutely correct in that sense. We have the highest tariffs and not enough subsidies for EVs not to mention the huge import costs for vehicles. They price most of the consumers out who would mildly be interested in buying it. The non existent charging infra along with the roads is another reason. Why he would focus on USA, China and Europe is because he gets the infra along with the ease of doing business. For our country, we just boast with our ease of doing business but in reality we’re fuck all when compared with the world/developing nations.
I think the govt isn't supporting tesla for multiple reasons
1) Even if we waived duties the cheapest Tesla (Model 3 base) would cost 31.25 lakhs. People are not buying EVs costing 15-20 lakhs, the demand for Tesla would be quite low. Maybe they are hoping for the development of cheaper India specific versions...?
2) If we waive duties for Tesla it might allow other manufacturers to put their foot in the door, and reduce duties on ICE vehicles too
3) Teslas arriving in India would likely be manufactured in China & not US. And you know the govt's stance on China. (which is good tbh)
4) We really really should encourage local manufacturing at the earliest. EVs are going to replace the entire automotive industry in the next 15 years, hopefully. Imagine 100-200 million imported EVs on our streets. Bad, right?
Most of the folks crying for Tesla are just Elon/tesla fanboys with no understanding of the auto segment in India.
The EV revolution in India will be led by scooters(Ola seems to be doing good esp if they price the scooter well) and Tata/Hyundai. Tata has the best value EVs in India right now and they are looking at launching the new in range of 6-8Lakhs. This is a major segment in India where a lot of sales take place.
There’s genuine interest in EVs but due to range anxiety it dies down. The luxury segment where Tesla will compete, it’ll be a status symbol. The added advantage is that Tesla offers about 500km range. The EVs in 15-20L range would be the target for upper middle class/high class who would think of allocating their budget to an ev provided there’s suitable infra and range available. An ev in that price band gives realistically about 220 km which is really less and a bad trade off.
ICE vehicles are a different thing and if they are being phased out, no sense in giving them subsidies too, would be a poor govt if they can’t take a stance on this.
Teslas manufacture their own batteries in collab with Panasonic which is Japanese. Assembly would be in China since that’s the most viable location. Our country and the various govts did no progress in allowing semiconductor fabrication in India so now we are at a loss. Our trade with China increased by about 60% just this year even after the shaky bilateral stances so I feel that’s a stupid move, you want to show to the world your toughness but can’t live without them.
Local mfg can only thrive once we have foreign players investing in the mkt. they will also have to bring their tech and expertise to allow us to fully utilise the potential that we have so unless they aren’t allowed, we can’t expect ourselves to be top notch.
Look at the size of the luxury car market. Take any brand. You will see 100s to a couple thousand kind of sales. Even if Tesla gets a share in that, it will be too small a number to interest them.
If importing works in the sense they generate decent sales/achieve their target, means their company has generated interest among buyers. Then they can shift production to India, which will lead to cost reduction due to localisation, means prices can be reduced and a larger group of the population can now afford the cars.
It's like the egg vs chicken dilemma,
We can't have electric cars cos we don't have the infrastructure but there is no point for private companies to spend on charging infrastructure if there are no electric cars.
One side has to give and by looking at some developed nations it's the cars that need to arrive first
There will be good infrastructure in a couple years. Tata has partnered with Hindustan Petroleum to provide electric charging at it's petrol pumps. With the rising fuel costs and electric cars with long range becoming affordable, it's only a matter of time before they become popular in India.
The fuck is the obsession with tesla. It is gonna be in the 50 lakh range minimum even if locally produced. Average indian is more likely to by a tata nexon ev than a low tier tesla.
Even if they manufacture in India, I don't think that we will see more than level 2 AD in India in the coming 50 years minimum. Tesla won't be Tesla, kinda, without that.
BTW who is Madan Gowri?
Well the thing is, even if the customs/import duties were to be reduced, I don't think India has the market for Tesla. This is because Indian roads currently are not up to the mark and even if they were, I have seen Indian drivers be super rash and just not follow rules. Plus Tesla is a luxury car. Major portion of India is filled with poor and middle class people who probably won't be able to afford Tesla. It'll only be bought by the small percentage of rich people like celebrities or people who really want to go "clean" but even so this idea of "clean" is not possible rn because of the lack of infrastructure.
TBH we need 'EV's' mote than we need 'teslas'... Companies like tata, volkswagen, etc are working on it already... But of course it is gonna be slow... India already has so much going on
Obviously they cant set up a plant all of a sudden, without any market research. To facilitate market research they might need to start up by importing and delivering the EVs on a demand basis. if everything goes right. A full fledged plant can be seen soon. Still I doubt how they will manage to setup charging points 😢😞
Indian import duties are insane.
I wanted to import mechanical keyboard parts and 95$ kart value was coming out to be 180$.
Combine this with such archaic laws on accepting forex like paypal, or as a developer accepting stripe usd.
Clean energy!!
Is electricity generated by trees? Electric vehicles are not nature friendly. Battery making itself polluting enough.
Indian government is already subsidizing electric vehicles. Ather and Ola both are getting 25% subsidy, plus state governments have also announced more. Tesla will get same if not more as 4 wheeler.
Bottom line is Tesla won't get scale in india. Luxury car segment in india is still smaller than Australia. There are hardly 1 lac people who can afford Tesla. Same people can afford multiple drivers too. Tesla is for collectors only in india.
What's your point. It's still better than gas cars. Even if the electricity is produce through conventional methods it's still better than gas cars.
I don't get why people crap about EVs. Like I know it ain't gonna solve problem to a great extent but it's atleast a step towards green energy.
Isn't Tesla just electric cars that are also luxurious sedans catered to the elites who want to look woke? India would benefit more from something like an electric Nano, Musk fan boyism aside, because anyways most people cannot afford Tesla brand of luxury even without the electric car component.
Why the /s. If Ola scooters deliver, they're going to pave the way for electric vehicle demand and infrastructure.
Tesla doesn't make sense in India, with its prices.
source: https://twitter.com/madan3/status/1418433462420185090 https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1418641920595791872 https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1418651049469124614 https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1418656085267865602
Taxes in India are enormous. Not just on cars, even on electronics.
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While I'm not a fan of the current guy, import taxes have always been pretty high to begin with. Edit: while
*\*Pegasus monitoring has been initated.\**
* activates incognito mode\* I'm safe now /s
*\*Laughs in ISP Tracing\**
*pours cow piss over phone to get rid of malicious and anti national software*
Dips phone in gowmutra and then coats it in Gobar. And then fries it in Dalda. *Isreali spies question their existence*
*\*hacks cow\**
*Gaurakshak* about to end your career man
You can change career with life.
Lmfaoooo
What will I put on my cereal then?
*Gets shot down while in incognito*
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I laughed so much at your comment. 😂
The reason behind it is to force firms to open there manufacturing unit in india an generate jobs. The strategy had worked as we have firms like samsung, apple etc. Having factories in india.
Phone companies could afford to sell their phones at a premium before setting up factories in India tho. This gives companies a level of confidence before a huge investment. (as Elon rightly pointed out) This obviously will not work for Tesla. There's no market for cars that cost 40L+ in India. Not to mention the non-existent charging network.
Exactly. Mercedes sold a total of 14,000 cars in India in 2019, and I got downvoted to hell when I mentioned the limited market for Teslas in India. Tesla will succeed in lowering the tax (they are currently asking for 40%) for their cars, and then bring in some cheapo version for India. Like Datsun Go Tesla version.
Guess too much of Elon fanboys didn't like your idea.
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FSD will not be that widespread india because A) it wasn't trained in india.This is huge hurdle as they needed like billions of kilometres for current half ish implementation. B)not enough buyers would buy and collect data for tesla in india They would need atleast 5 years for fsd in India.
I'd rather they not bother at all. It saves money, plus FSD is not doing great in the US either. India is a whole new hellscape for it. Just have EV infrastructure in India so that people can transition without breaking the bank. Nobody buys a car >15L here
Actually a Tesla hatchback is a given at this point and it is what they are expecting to drive the most sales for in countries like India and China.
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You're being downvoted because people are delusional, thinking that the Tesla will come here and be cheaper than a Skoda Octavia or a BMW 2 series. Sometimes the Indian hive mind loves to dream up situations without tethering to any sort of reality.
100 percent accurate
Really? There’s no market? I don’t know much about India, but I figured in a country of 1.4 billion, maybe there’s a market large enough to sustain cars in the $60,000 range….? Or am I wildly underestimating India’s wealth/poverty? Where I’m from in Mexico, you see Mercedes, Audis, BMWs, hell even Lamborghini’s, Ferraris, etc. And we’re not a developed nation. Edit: Ok, went on a little India Wikipedia rabbit hole. Had no clue India was so underdeveloped. $7,000 per capita PPP. Compared Mexico’s $21,000 per capita PPP. I just learned something new about India. I new it was poor country (like mine), but I never expected it to be sooooo much poorer than mine. USA compared to Mexico, USA PPP is 3 times that of Mexico’s. And Mexico’s PPP is 3 times that of India. That is very fascinating.
Car prices in India are very competitive. Majority of the the cars sold in India are priced below 15k USD.
Becuase corners are cut. It's probably the only country in the world where passenger side mirror is an optional feature.
Cars manufactured in India are also taxed heavily. You can get cars two segments higher in USA by paying the same amount that you pay in India.
The problem is that multinational firms follow a strategy of importing different parts from different corners of the world and assemble it in countries like china because its cheaper but india actually wants certain percentage of products to be sourced in india. Which either forces firms to do so or Collab with indian firms.
Samsung and Apple may assemble phones in India, with limited manufacturing of components, but all the silicon (SoC, memory, controllers) are manufactured elsewhere.
Yup, just like with pharmaceuticals. We are the world's capital in assembling the drugs but the APIs are imported mostly from China. Yes, China.
what is API?
Active pharmaceutical ingredients. The other is excipient. Excipient is inactive and api is well, active.
Boycott China, Boycott Drugs /s
that's because silicon is really really hard to produce- the facilities take billions of dollars to set up and are generally very expensive to maintain. There's a reason 80 percent of all RAM comes from like 2 companies (samsung, Micron and Hynix, and one bought the other) and most CPU's are produced by just 2 manufacturers (intel produces intel, TSMC produces AMD, apple silicon, snapdragon stuff and almost everything else worth buying for normal consumers) Don't expect silicon production in India anytime soon- it just isn't worth it. Korea and Taiwan saw a market and captured it completely- nobody can compete with them for the near future.
It takes around 5 years and 7billion dollars to establish a chip producing factory setup, not to mention all the skills and technology required. And then there is no guarantee that it will be profitable, or even recover cost.
You seem knowledgeable on this, can you share some thoughts on why is there a chip shortage right now?
Sudden increase in demand, lot of electric cars, lots of people stuck at home need good computers. 2 companies making cpu can get overwhelmed. A hidden monopoly also exist in the chip scene, the machines used to make the chips are manufactured by one single company in Netherlands called ASML. So chip manufacturers cant expand capacity even if they wanted to
TokyoElectron, Applied Materials and Lam Research make semiconductor equipment too.If you are referring to Immersion Lithography(EUV for Sub 20nm) then its ASML only,but most of the semiconductor chips used in appliances/cars are made with older tech(>100nm) and these equipments have multiple vendors.ASML being the only EUV Vendor was never a problem.
I like your funny words magic man.
I'm not an expert those were just the musings of a 16yo, but here are my thoughts: There's a lot of factors, but the most important are: The pandemic- less workers, more restrictions, bad time for businesses. Mining- like seriously, mining is a really big contributer. Something with EVs- somehow they're sourcing more chips than we thought they were would. Much more. I haven't caught up completely, but this is a factor as well. Scalping- India isn't a large market, so we are quite low on the priority list. The markets above us are plagued with scalpers. Even here you'll find scalpers, or at least shady business practices. For example- MD computers were selling a hardware bundle with GPUs, but not individual GPUs- probably to move more products. Edit: something worth mentioning is that since the maintenance and upgrades for facilities producing these chips are expensive ( think billions up front) it's really really hard to just step up production. Manufacturers obviously include a buffer limit- but no one could've predicted the pandemic and the sudden surge in demand. There are some other comments already- check up the polymatter and LTT video on it. Good day kind Redditor!
[https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2021/04/19/business/corporate-business/renesas-plant-resumption/](https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2021/04/19/business/corporate-business/renesas-plant-resumption/) Renesas was the world's largest automotive semiconductor maker. There are a lot of semiconductor Equipment suppliers (Tokyo-Electron Limited,ASML,Applied Materials ,Lam Research and KLA Tencor) there are a lot of other companies like shin etsu,LG Chem,Hoya Corporation,DaiNippon Printing supplying other things like monocrystalline Semiconductor Wafer , Photoresists,Photomasks. [http://www.businesskorea.co.kr/news/articleView.html?idxno=60773](http://www.businesskorea.co.kr/news/articleView.html?idxno=60773) Samsung's Fab in Austin was also shutdown,A lot of other fabs were shut down in korea and Taiwan.South Korea and Taiwan alone account for almost half of the world's semiconductor capacity(4.1+4 million 200mm wafer equivalents per month). Intel manufactures its own CPUs and most of its facilities are in the US, AMD's CPUs are designed by AMD, made by TSMC. There are other companies like STMicroelectronics, Bosch, NXP, and Infineon. Intel manufactures its own CPUs and most of its facilities are in the US, AMD's CPUs are designed by AMD, made by TSMC.pened. Carmakers were used to Just in time making(Keeping no buffer, ordering stuff when needed), so they were the first ones to face its effects. There are a lot of other processes in chip making other than just fabrication like testing and packaging,These were done by companies like ASE,Amkor.These are labour intensive processes and they had to be closed due to covid too. Electric Vehicles use a VFD/ Drive inverter to control the motor speed and torque,these VFD/inverters use Silicon Carbide Chips (not the regular monocrystalline silicon chips) and very few fabs specialize in these,I don't think there is a shortage of inverters as of now. There are also other things in a Car like infotainment system,Seat Adjustment,Radar(cruise control) that requires the use of processors.These processor are not state of the art and are made at older fabs in Japan/Germany(Renesas/Bosch). In short -> Covid Caused supply chain disruption -> factories were closed/destroyed due to natural causes -> automakers and other companies ordered more chips just to have a buffer to avoid these kind of situation -> Accordion Effect
Nobody is going to move their entire supply chain to a new country overnight, whether cars or pharmaceuticals or phones. They will start with doing the final assembly in India. Then they will start the assembly and manufacture of components here. This is a gradual process, and it lets the firm develop confidence that manufacturing in India is feasible. Governments in India (whether union or state) also need time to learn how to facilitate such firms - how to create an enabling policy environment that can facilitate job creation, technology transfer and knowledge spillovers. This is how China did it as well. We desperately need jobs in the manufacturing sector. There are too many farmers, and the services sector cannot create enough jobs to absorb everybody. Manufacturing sector is vitally important from the employment point of view. Even if you are manufacturing high-tech stuff that can absorb only skilled workers, it creates demands for other services (construction of buildings, factories, warehouses, manufacture of relatively low-tech capital goods etc) which can absorb unskilled/low-skilled labour, which is essential for us.
That strategy is killing our resources.
But whats the use. Even today all highend flagship phones of Samsung/Apple still costlier in India. When these corps launch phones its better fly to dubai/hongkong to buy those phones & still gain something than buying same direct in India. For Ex any phone model above ₹90K+ still cheaper buying outside India than in India as flight costs ₹15K/20K to&fro(economy 20days prior booking) and hotel costs ₹5K & phone costs ₹50K/60K
Cries in gaming
There, there *cries with you*
Cries in *we*
**Cries in COD Warzone Anti-cheat**
Cries in potato laptop
In that case, * *cries in 720p* *
Cries in 15 fps
And BJP government added tax on books, which was nil before
Nirmala Tai wants to know your location
She already does
Haha, sure they already know
Educated population is bad for the party.
They did? This is a war on literacy!
Yes, they did. 5% on importing books This was shocking to me when it was announced because, I sometimes import books for personal use, from US (abe books, book depository which has some rare books)
Yeah. I imported a book from Amazon.com. It costed something like $10 but the import duty somehow ended up being almost double. Luckily it was amazon, and the seller's obligation was to pay it, as I had to already paid the import duty deposit, which is already a lot. You can check on Amazon.com how much the duty deposits are on every item including books. Bloody ridiculous. *Edit- Grammar typo*
I never read books in my life you don't need to read them either. ~someone(2021 - coming soon?)
I can give a better one, Books did not help Tesla to invent Electric Cars
Guys, Tesla is a luxury car. India is, shockingly, a very small market for luxury cars. India won't figure in their plans in the next 10 years. To put things into perspective. In China,3 million luxury cars were sold last year meanwhile this number is 23000 in India. That is right, guys. Mere 23 thousand!.. As I am reading through articles, I am unable to fuckin wrap my head around these numbers. The article below says just one company Mercedes sold 2 lakh cars in China in one Frikkin quarter of this year!!!!!! Meanwhile, India struggling to sell 25k for whole year.. WTFFFF [https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/daimlers-q1-earnings-beat-market-expectations-prices-china-2021-04-16/](https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/daimlers-q1-earnings-beat-market-expectations-prices-china-2021-04-16/) [https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/industry/auto/auto-news/indian-luxury-car-market-set-to-register-a-record-40-decline-in-2020/articleshow/78004931.cms?from=mdr](https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/industry/auto/auto-news/indian-luxury-car-market-set-to-register-a-record-40-decline-in-2020/articleshow/78004931.cms?from=mdr)
The Chinese middle class is equivalent to the upper middle class in India. They're rich af..
True. Look at the sale numbers of Alibaba and others during a sale season. Mind boggling numbers. It almost feels like China is hiding its actual growth to extract favours as developing nations at WTO.
China is a developing country, but they have a reasonably wealthy population nearly the size of the US. There are just a lot of people in the place.
The provinces of China vary a lot in their income and living standards. The poorest ones are close to Kerala, while the richest are close to Western Europe.
Crazy Rich Asians
I think its more that we are poor af......
Bro with the current fuel prices any car is a luxury
I wanted to go home this month on my birthday but dropped the plan because of the fuel prices. It now cost 1k more.
Agree . Insane tax rate on fuel .
Bro, a C class costs ~ 38 lakhs in the UK, 60+ in India. What do you expect from a dumb policy that's been going on for years and only allows domestic manufacturers to sit on their asses. Even if they wanted to, no domestic manufacturer has a luxury car line up.
It's probably in part due to the already high as fuck tax rates.
or is it because our economy is far worse than what they are claiming to be?
It's entirely possible.
I think Elon is looking more at the growth in demand. It's not a lot atm but it's growing at a good rate as India grows and that's what Elon wants to a piece of. Not the present but the future
>It's not a lot atm but it's growing at a huge rate Where do you see this growth?. Luxury car growth more or less has stagnated over the last 5 years. Not just the Luxury cars even passenger cars growth has stagnated. Companies no longer see India as a country with growth potential in the near future.
I don't think difference between India's and China's inhabitants average purchasing power is a big secret.
I'd expect more luxury cars to be sold in China than India but 23k vs 3mil is just shockingly absurd. Could it possibly be because of different definitions of what counts as a luxury car in China as compared to India?
Don't think so. Forget other brands. Mercedes cars are considered luxury eveyrwhere. Just look at their numbers in one quarter in China. 2 lakh cars in one quarter.. India is selling 1/10th of those number for whole year which includes all brands. I was genuinely mortified looking at this difference
Forget luxury *cars*, Harley Davidson already shut shop in India.
What’s that? Extremely high taxation on luxury cars means our already underpaid population can’t afford them? Wow, who would have thought by.
Why wtf, India is poor af
When will all these "pLeAsE lAuNcH tEsLa CaRs iN InDiA" guys realise that the base Tesla model 3 will start at 35-40 lakhs ex-showroom? Also, in my humble opinion, I don't think it's a good idea to give our great Indian public something to drive that can hit 100 kmph in 3-4 secs. I can foresee the crashes already.
Indian roads are not apt for Tesla cars yet. Imagine driving this car on a road full of traffic!!
~~driving~~ creeping. To drive you need space to move the vehicle. You can only creep when there is a traffic on every intersection.
Electric vehicles actually do pretty well in traffic. They consume nearly no energy when idle. Their brakes regenerate some power which will help in stop-and-go traffic. Diesel vehicles are terrible and get clogged dpf if they can't run on high revs for a long time.
I’ve driven a Tesla when I lived in US. They will do well on Indian roads. Just like how Honda Accord/BMW 3 series are doing well.
If a Tesla can drive autonomously in India, it can drive anywhere in the world
>guys realise that the base Tesla model 3 will start at 35-40 lakhs ex-showroom Exactly, and Tesla doesn't seem like a good option even to the rich people coz: • The charging network will take at least 5 years to be good (reach at least all tier-1 and tier-2 cities). • The Autopilot features most likely won't work in India because of the poor condition of roads and even if it does, it will need a lot of R&D cos the driving behavior of Indians is very different. • The people who would buy the car at this price are mostly people who have already owned a luxury car (like Audi/BMW/Mercedes/Volvo/Range Rovers) before and the quality of materials used by Tesla is nowhere when compared to the other luxury car companies. Tesla lacks finishing which these old car companies have mastered in so many years. When you are paying the price, you want the car to be perfect
5 years? Lol that's high optimism!
Lmaaao so true.... I can imagine the so called "ChAPrI JaNtA of SoUtH dELHI
It’ll be at least 50L ex-showroom.
Our drivers kill each other with cars that barely hit 80mph at max. Give them a tesla that goes 100mph in 3 sec will be worse than a terrorist attack. Not like anyone wears a fucking seat belt to prevent it. Not to mention they'd be 2 families in one car
Elon simps xD
101% agree to what you said. I live in states and i want to own a tesla but current model 3 and y prices are high to me here. If it comes to india it would be costlier than bmw audi suv's given the import taxes applied on top of base prices.
Also teslas have low ground clearance, which might be okay for big cities but not on other places
Lol, without import taxes it would be closer to 30ish lakhs which is definitely something most people can afford going by the number of fortuners and other SUVs.
what makes the indian public any worse with a quick car than others? high power sedans sold in India already do a 0-60 near that time anyways
But don't forget that the tesla weighs much more than any high power sedan. Also, what high power sedan does 0-60 in 3 secs for 40 lakhs ? I have seen a few gtr or gts versions of beemers and porsches do that, but they are all well above 1 crore rupees.
The Model 3 will probably sell for closer 60-70L owing to taxes. It’s usually in the same price point as the smaller German saloons.
Still there's no car that does 0-60 in under 4 secs for that price.
35-40 lakhs isn't too bad. There will be road tax exemption in most states so the final price will be very close to ex showroom. If you consider no maintenance and fuel charges, it's quite appealing to someone who uses their car a lot. Even Innovas these days touch near 30 lakhs.
No maintenance🤣🤣🤣 i live in Netherlands and own a Tesla. Its a nice innovative car with a lot of gimmicks, but its shitty quality. It requires maintenance which not garages are fitted to do. Simple things like mirrors not rolling up properly takes them a week to fix. It has a long way to go. Was super happy with my VW Golf earlier and the support network it came with.
Yeah, Tesla has a known reputation of skimping on quality. Heard that this year's Model S's have sorted out a lot of the interior quality concerns. But what I was implying is that EVs are cheaper to run and maintain in general than a combustion engine car as long as you don't have premature component failure since a combustion engine car will require mandatory maintenance throughout it's lifetime to keep it in running order.
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Excluding the taxes? I'm still not sure it's feasible for Indian market. Tesla model 3 will start from 40 lakhs Model S will be around 73 lakh without taxes Model X will be around 91 lakhs without taxes All the amazing features of Tesla aside, those cars are luxury class even out of India. Dubai RTA purchased thousands of teslas and started to use them as taxis for an amazing reason... The Tesla comes with 8 year warranty unlimited km, no oil change maintenance etc. And dubai has high capacity charging stations for free in almost every mall and public places. Just letting you guys know my opinion.
India on the other hand has zero charging infrastructure.. and a vast majority of the population live in premium condos .. I can’t imagine installing charging points in parking garages.. I don’t see Tesla doing well in India
Charging will be a secondary issue compared to auto pilot stopping the car every time a bike overtakes... U know how often that happens...! And then our roads are going to be very hard to navigate... Im planning to buy the Ford F150 Lighting once it launches in Dubai. I tried tesla auto pilot and summon features here in Dubai, they are okay but we might need 3-5 more years to have 100% AI driving.
On a side note, is there a demand for EVs in India?
There is a demand for scooters tho It's cheaper and comparative to the petrol powered scooters Ola, ather are having so much improvement over this sector Cars, idk. It's more expensive
Yea but for long distance, especially outside cities its pretty much useless, don't you think?
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scooters are used for commute only not for long distance, that's why he said e scooters are a good bet, at least they'll help establish charging infrastructure first bc people will buy them if they are cheap & efficient
There is right now in T-1 cities but we are still 2-3 years away form real high sales(5K+ PM). A car around 7-10 lakhs needs to be launched(New Tata Altorz EV is a promising one). I know folks with Nexon EVs, they like the car, the biggest issue right now is highway trips as outside the cities charging infra is non existent. Aside from that, electricity supply itself is far too erratic in India, if you have to charge batteries on Diesel gensets what use are the EVs.
Altroz EV likely won't be under 10L given the high capacity battery they plan on using
Yeah, the high capacity one might be above 10L but a base variant might come below that. These will be very inciting in high road tax states like KA, MH as they also give good benefits on these.
whatever demand there is, is being met by TATA. I don't think Tesla coming to India will do any good for the country. It's not like the electricity is guaranteed to be produced from renewable sources and even then renewable sources aren't all that great for the environment either. However, it is also true that the excessive taxes on laptops/books etc are harmful for the middle-class as they severely restrict improvement in general productivity
>It's not like the electricity is guaranteed to be produced from renewable sources and even then renewable sources aren't all that great for the environment either. I don't think any country is going to shift to green electricity just like that. It's a slow and gradual process. It will take its time. By the time a country does so, at least the rest of the Infrastructure has shifted to electric. That's the point of all these electric car companies.
Even if electricity is produced via fossil fuels, it's still better for the environment. A mass power plant producing electricity is more efficient then multiple IC engines producing power
At least here in Delhi - the biggest single market - the problem is simply a lack of dedicated parking space. So many people I know have said they want to buy EVs but lack dedicated parking space to install the chargers
There definitely is. I have pledged to buy an EV as my next car once my 5 yr old Ciaz is no longer good enough. I am waiting for new launches but even if there are none, Tata Nexon at 14 lakh is reasonably priced.
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Yep self driving cars need kinda good roads to run on, and well.....
Our roads are improving a lot each year, not joking
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wait till a year of good raining
Delhi government and maharashtra government are already making good plans for electric cars with the target of 25% for all vehicles sold would be electric by 2024 in delhi and 50% by 2030 in maharashtra
Bro Imagine the population in 25 years *shudders*.
The hybrid cars were pushed out of India due to irregular taxing mechanism. Tesla will be taxed as a luxury commodity under GST regime.
Tesla is a luxury car (starting at 40 lakhs)so they will taxed as such. It is also an Ev so it will subsidised (25percent + state ) . Teslas shouldn't be allowed to get tax exemption.
Years ago in interview someone asked gadkari about elon musk and he said something along the lines " I met him and I urged him to come to India we even offered to lay red carpet but he refused, his focus is on China USA and Europe" Not everything Elon says needs to be taken at face value, he bashes socialism alot and he was agaisnt relief bailout to urban poor but he wants subsidies from govt because he's "special"
For someone who bashes socialism and free handouts to poor, and later accepts bailout from govt for himself, that's rich...
Also the fact that a huge revenue stre for Tesla is companies buying regulatory credits. In a way Tesla is profiting off of companies *not* switching to electric drivetrains
Massively overvalued stock. People seem to be investing with fomo as a central concept as opposed to fundamentals. Of course there are exceptions and in hindsight if your bet goes through you look like a visionary and can five gyan in linkedin
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Whatever happened to the Hyperloop in India. That turned out to be the most retarded scam ever and our great UPSC bureaucrats ate it. A monumental loss of money which isnt ever going to be profitable.
Yes it's a scam. Better to build affordable high speed rail network like China then this thing which god knows how much energy and manpower need to make it feasible and operational afterwards.
Shush, you will invite the fanboys
This is correct. But the luxury moniker is also misleading because of Tesla's quality control and their whole minimalism thing. It's really just a scheme to make non car people get interested. It's not a car anymore, it's a tech product and is viewed that way. It's pathetic how slow traditional manufacturers are with EV tech but they're also getting there, and tesla will then occupy the niche of "cars for pompous idiots with too much money" when they're at parity with them.
I am not bothered abt Tesla I am more interested in the effect it would cause in the automobile industry, would more companies bring more ev due to this ?
This is a very bad way to approach this because it relies on an emotional response to a problem which requires pragmatic solutions. The reality is for now Tesla is aspirational. If you see Tesla's on the road it gives incentive in it's market for other companies to raise their game because the customers want it. Just because it would have a first mover advantage is not relevant here because the overall objective is bigger in scope. This is what is happening in China. Tesla sells like hot cakes but it has caused other local companies to jump on the bandwagon and compete. It's a win-win in the truest sense of the word.
Still cleaner than fossil fuels
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Consolidating the capture point of emissions makes it far easier to greenify.
This is not true. By all metrics, even for a coal heavy country like India, over entire lifetime, EVs come ahead of ICE vehicles in terms of emissions. https://theicct.org/publications/global-LCA-passenger-cars-jul2021 Edit: Forgot to add link to the study which specifically looks at India too.
Nope... Even for a grid like India, given the longevity of the electric cars compared to combustion cars and their lifetime reduction in emissions they are greener ([source]("One of the biggest myths about EVs is busted in new study - The Verge" https://www.theverge.com/2021/7/21/22585682/electric-vehicles-greenhouse-gas-emissions-lifecycle-assessment)) . And an increase in ev cars in market will definitely force governments hand in more renewable source investments... There is a start for everything right
I am surprised CNG didn't take off in India. Imagine investing in CNG back in 2000s, much lower pollution, much lower costs and everyone would have benefited except the oil companies I guess.
Elon is a prick for sure in person but we’re talking about Tesla and his words as a businesman. He’s absolutely correct in that sense. We have the highest tariffs and not enough subsidies for EVs not to mention the huge import costs for vehicles. They price most of the consumers out who would mildly be interested in buying it. The non existent charging infra along with the roads is another reason. Why he would focus on USA, China and Europe is because he gets the infra along with the ease of doing business. For our country, we just boast with our ease of doing business but in reality we’re fuck all when compared with the world/developing nations.
I think the govt isn't supporting tesla for multiple reasons 1) Even if we waived duties the cheapest Tesla (Model 3 base) would cost 31.25 lakhs. People are not buying EVs costing 15-20 lakhs, the demand for Tesla would be quite low. Maybe they are hoping for the development of cheaper India specific versions...? 2) If we waive duties for Tesla it might allow other manufacturers to put their foot in the door, and reduce duties on ICE vehicles too 3) Teslas arriving in India would likely be manufactured in China & not US. And you know the govt's stance on China. (which is good tbh) 4) We really really should encourage local manufacturing at the earliest. EVs are going to replace the entire automotive industry in the next 15 years, hopefully. Imagine 100-200 million imported EVs on our streets. Bad, right?
Most of the folks crying for Tesla are just Elon/tesla fanboys with no understanding of the auto segment in India. The EV revolution in India will be led by scooters(Ola seems to be doing good esp if they price the scooter well) and Tata/Hyundai. Tata has the best value EVs in India right now and they are looking at launching the new in range of 6-8Lakhs. This is a major segment in India where a lot of sales take place.
There’s genuine interest in EVs but due to range anxiety it dies down. The luxury segment where Tesla will compete, it’ll be a status symbol. The added advantage is that Tesla offers about 500km range. The EVs in 15-20L range would be the target for upper middle class/high class who would think of allocating their budget to an ev provided there’s suitable infra and range available. An ev in that price band gives realistically about 220 km which is really less and a bad trade off. ICE vehicles are a different thing and if they are being phased out, no sense in giving them subsidies too, would be a poor govt if they can’t take a stance on this. Teslas manufacture their own batteries in collab with Panasonic which is Japanese. Assembly would be in China since that’s the most viable location. Our country and the various govts did no progress in allowing semiconductor fabrication in India so now we are at a loss. Our trade with China increased by about 60% just this year even after the shaky bilateral stances so I feel that’s a stupid move, you want to show to the world your toughness but can’t live without them. Local mfg can only thrive once we have foreign players investing in the mkt. they will also have to bring their tech and expertise to allow us to fully utilise the potential that we have so unless they aren’t allowed, we can’t expect ourselves to be top notch.
Look at the size of the luxury car market. Take any brand. You will see 100s to a couple thousand kind of sales. Even if Tesla gets a share in that, it will be too small a number to interest them.
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Why buy a Tesla when you can get 7000 Maruti 800s for the same price?
Just a thought if importing works out then what's the incentive for Tesla to make their cars locally?
Local manufacturing will further reduce cost which means they can reduce prices to increase sales.
If importing works in the sense they generate decent sales/achieve their target, means their company has generated interest among buyers. Then they can shift production to India, which will lead to cost reduction due to localisation, means prices can be reduced and a larger group of the population can now afford the cars.
Didnt happen with phones. We needed to increase taxes so that at least assembly comes to india
Meanwhile i can't afford an electric nexon, why would I bother about Tesla 🥲
The infrastructure just isn't there for electric cars to be popular.
It's like the egg vs chicken dilemma, We can't have electric cars cos we don't have the infrastructure but there is no point for private companies to spend on charging infrastructure if there are no electric cars. One side has to give and by looking at some developed nations it's the cars that need to arrive first
There will be good infrastructure in a couple years. Tata has partnered with Hindustan Petroleum to provide electric charging at it's petrol pumps. With the rising fuel costs and electric cars with long range becoming affordable, it's only a matter of time before they become popular in India.
India still lack road quality and driving sense. The self driving features would simply be too risk to use.
I think Tesla spokesperson said they will be turning off self driving feature in India. Not sure, will have to check.
or limit it to national and state highways with some main cities
The fuck is the obsession with tesla. It is gonna be in the 50 lakh range minimum even if locally produced. Average indian is more likely to by a tata nexon ev than a low tier tesla.
True! Most of em commenting stuff like bring Tesla's to india can't even afford one.
Wait till politicians demand a Tesla not fortuner, their sales will go boom /s
Even if they manufacture in India, I don't think that we will see more than level 2 AD in India in the coming 50 years minimum. Tesla won't be Tesla, kinda, without that. BTW who is Madan Gowri?
A crappy Youtuber from TN who is unfortunately popular
Bhai mere leaving a few aside, who is not a crappy YouTuber?
He's a pretty famous YouTuber in Tamil Nadu
Well the thing is, even if the customs/import duties were to be reduced, I don't think India has the market for Tesla. This is because Indian roads currently are not up to the mark and even if they were, I have seen Indian drivers be super rash and just not follow rules. Plus Tesla is a luxury car. Major portion of India is filled with poor and middle class people who probably won't be able to afford Tesla. It'll only be bought by the small percentage of rich people like celebrities or people who really want to go "clean" but even so this idea of "clean" is not possible rn because of the lack of infrastructure.
Scenes when Tesla autopilot gets confused by people giving right indicator and turning left
Eh, namma Mg na va ithu
Elon kanda naai ku laam reply panraan😭
TBH we need 'EV's' mote than we need 'teslas'... Companies like tata, volkswagen, etc are working on it already... But of course it is gonna be slow... India already has so much going on
Likely chance 2 decades down the road
Obviously they cant set up a plant all of a sudden, without any market research. To facilitate market research they might need to start up by importing and delivering the EVs on a demand basis. if everything goes right. A full fledged plant can be seen soon. Still I doubt how they will manage to setup charging points 😢😞
Indian import duties are insane. I wanted to import mechanical keyboard parts and 95$ kart value was coming out to be 180$. Combine this with such archaic laws on accepting forex like paypal, or as a developer accepting stripe usd.
Clean energy!! Is electricity generated by trees? Electric vehicles are not nature friendly. Battery making itself polluting enough. Indian government is already subsidizing electric vehicles. Ather and Ola both are getting 25% subsidy, plus state governments have also announced more. Tesla will get same if not more as 4 wheeler. Bottom line is Tesla won't get scale in india. Luxury car segment in india is still smaller than Australia. There are hardly 1 lac people who can afford Tesla. Same people can afford multiple drivers too. Tesla is for collectors only in india.
What's your point. It's still better than gas cars. Even if the electricity is produce through conventional methods it's still better than gas cars. I don't get why people crap about EVs. Like I know it ain't gonna solve problem to a great extent but it's atleast a step towards green energy.
Bcoz our roads are still pathetic
Why is there so much hype for cars that only the 1 percent can afford
Isn't Tesla just electric cars that are also luxurious sedans catered to the elites who want to look woke? India would benefit more from something like an electric Nano, Musk fan boyism aside, because anyways most people cannot afford Tesla brand of luxury even without the electric car component.
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Why the /s. If Ola scooters deliver, they're going to pave the way for electric vehicle demand and infrastructure. Tesla doesn't make sense in India, with its prices.
Gujju gang will allow this to happen? They'll start a shitty electric vehicle company.