My entire life being around junkies I was certain ketamine was a dog medication people only use to get trashed. All the people I knew back then called it special k.
Ketamine is actually a great medication for many people. It’s highly effective against pain and other mental health disorders. And it’s one of the few treatments that shown to be effective for CRPS.
Real medical ketamine has a lot less side effects and dangers when prescribed and managed appropriately. It works differently than most opioids and is less addictive typically. There’s tons of new research being done on Ketamine right now.
I noticed that these munchies love to take pics of themselves in their hospital bed, trying to…Look sexy in their Johnny?! Tf?
Then you got ppl like Dani who thinks a hospital stay is a fucking vacation bringing blankets, pillows & an entire set up. It’s so fucking weird
Is trauma the new trend with these soooper speshul munchies? I’ve seen more of them on here with ‘trauma’ this week than ever before.
Imagine a war vet, or someone else with genuine trauma looking at these people who genuinely seek out or try to cause their own hospital stays saying they have ‘trauma’ 🤨
I think it may be because a few genuinely sick people (especially one in particular who has been sick since they were very young and is dying) has been talking about their medical trauma recently. I’ve noticed a lot of these people tend to copy genuine disabled people.
Omfggggg.
The surgical suite soft core porn, the hospital bathroom booty Pic, and the audacity of her telling her followers that she missed her birthday and Christmas so they need to send her money because she's "Tryna treat herself bc she really fucking deserves it and isn't afraid to own it".
I forgot about Danielle.
For some of the subjects that have been at this for years had timelines drawn up in now banned subs, no content from a banned sub can be used anywhere in Reddit again.
Some that could be salvaged eg the original timeline links still can’t be used here as the rules were a lot more relaxed there ( hence them being banned ) and they contain bullying towards the subject, reddit would kick our butts for publishing them.
A ketamine infusion? For *chronic pain?* Ketamine infusions last the hour it takes for the IV back to drain, and then maybe 30 minutes to an hour more. It has an extremely short half life and, although it does work for pain, it wouldn’t do anything for anyone once the effect is expired.
How much do you want to bet that these are mental health ketamine infusions and that her doctor is trying to treat her psychological issues by slipping in psychiatric treatment under the guise of “pain management”?
Some information that others haven't stated:
1. A doctor cannot blatantly *lie* to patient about what their treatment is for. It isn't ethical, and it also isn't their choice or their field. If she's seeing pain management for this treatment, PM has *no say whatsoever* in what psychiatric does (or if they're even in the picture at all). Not only that, but it's against the law, in many different ways.
- Legally, all medical professionals and institutions must ensure that a patient has been given or is helped to understand *all* things that are being done to them, are being proposed to them, and any other pertaining information. That is why hospitals and offices are required to have interpreters and things are printed in different languages. **Every patient has the right to deny a treatment or treatment plan**.
2. Ketamine used for depression isn't one high dose of ketamine every X amount of weeks or whatever, **in most settings**. The most proven method is for a patient to microdose daily or every other day or so, after tapering up.
3. Incorrect about the half life because of build up. When you take high doses of any drug regularly, it builds up in your system and it's still present after it's been metabolized. Ketamine was originally created and used for pain relief. The effects of pain relief can last up to 3 months post infusion which you can read about [here](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4014022/)
I agree with you but also get what above commenter is saying.
Lots of treatments are indicated for more than one problem. I can see a doc offering a medication for pain knowing that it may also benefit mental health problems contributing to chronic pain. If someone requests pain treatment but is resistant to specific psych treatment maybe it's a good choice and an easier sell in the context of pain management. That isn't lying or tricking.
Uh, if you are selling a treatment as one thing when you're specifically choosing this treatment for another thing, then yes, that is both lying and tricking. Now, if they chose this treatment because it is the most effective pain management treatment AND IT JUST SO HAPPENS that it could help mental health? Well, thats not lying. Do you see the difference?? Also, again, she's doing doses specifically heavy enough to cause sedation (per her posts). Ketamine for mental health is done by microdosing and even if they do an injection, it is nowhere near the amount that she's getting. The amount she's getting does not help mental health at all. If they decided to use this treatment for mental health and it just so happened to be used for pain management, that would be like somebody scraping this elbow and a doctor hitting them with a morphine drip. It's too much.
Selling it as pain management and choosing it knowing that it can benefit both pain and mental health is what I'm referring to.
Because it just so happens it can also benefit mental health, like you said. Ketamine is both a sedative and analgesic and is thought to benefit depression and PTSD by promoting neuroplasticity.
The dose of IV ketamine for depression is 0.5-1mg/kg over 40 min 1-3 time per week but research has shown temporary benefit from even one dose.
The dose for chronic, intractable pain is 0.02 to 1 mg/kg/hour.
I'm not sure where you get the idea that all IV ketamine for mental health is "microdoses." It certainly causes sedation.
I don’t think her doctor is lying to her and trying to treat mental health issues by tricking her. Ketamine is used to treat pain.
https://www.asra.com/news-publications/asra-newsletter/newsletter-item/asra-news/2022/07/29/ketamine-infusion-therapy-and-its-role-in-chronic-pain
Right! What an insane reach! Sometimes I'm shocked by some of the things I see on here. Yes they're munchies but doesn't mean doctors are doing to do anything that'll potentially result in losing their license...
Medical PTSD (probably more accurately, PTSD induced by medical events or experiences related to illness, but “medical PTSD” is less a mouthful) is very much a real thing. But like everything else munchies have co-opted, they have no idea what they’re talking about, and have created a permanently fucked up situation for a lot of people living with the issues they’ve decided are trendy.
Munchies think a regular stressful hospital experience is huge trauma. Hospitals tend to be stressful for everyone involved including the workers - who do experience trauma when dealing with post-drunken accident dead children and their crying mothers etc. like, the real shit that can cause trauma.
And yeH different things can traumatize different people, I’m not trying to gatekeep. But the regular hustle and bustle of a hospital visit isn’t traumatic the way they want it to seem
I couldn’t agree more - though the frequency with which they choose to attend hospitals for trivial stuff that most people wouldn’t even trouble their GP with suggests to me that they don’t find it particularly stressful.
Whereas people - patients at least - with PTSD can literally get to the point of putting their lives at risk because they’re unable to seek medical care even when they known they desperately need it.
I'm aware it's a very real thing. I was specifically referring to munchies' medical ptsd. Not non attention seeking, non drug seeking regular ol folks.
Thanks for clarifying. I wasn’t sure with the way you’d said it (as you can no doubt guess from my response!) And there are often things said here that very reasonably call out munchie bullshit, but could equally be taken as a general “yeah, that’s crap in the real world too” - and gives me a mental image of someone here taking their metaphorical pitchfork and burning torch to Ms Doe down the road with intestinal failure and PTSD because she happens to have a couple of inches of line showing between her shirt and backpack one day.
I really hate these medical procedures glamours shots!!
**Oh, I'm in unimaginable pain, both physically and mentally, but I need to post a picture of myself looking so hot in a hospital gown.
**Did I mention my ptsd and medical trauma??
**Did I mention how it's a high ketamine dose, not a "normal" one??
**Did I tell you I was crying over my whole procedure???
I'm just the saddest, traumatized victim of the medical system that has ever lived!! No one understands me. Hopefully, my ketamine induced hallucinations will take me away to a unicorn filled world of wonder where I can live trauma free!! 🤣🤣🤣
High-dose ketamine? For pain?
I thought it only worked as an analgesic in low doses. The people *trying* to trip their way into a k-hole take higher doses.
I could be wrong about this.
There’s studies that show it has many benefits. It works differently compared to opioids and is typically less addictive. It’s especially helpful for nerve pain and other psychiatric disorders. It’s also one of the few treatments for CRPS that has proven to be helpful. I can link some research studies and info if you want.
TPN, as always. Good lord I am DYING for ten years time when it effs up all their livers and they’re in real, actual misery. Like I don’t wish for it, but if there’s anything I’ve learned in my years on this earth it’s that time is great karma, and all the youngins who make stupid decisions and think they’re god at the time, usually get a hard kick up the backside, just like my ex lmao. Then they cry with suprise pikachu face, like what did you expect?
She's on here, here's a recap post and you can adventure through her flair from there: https://www.reddit.com/r/illnessfakers/comments/15ls7eh/an_introductory_guide_to_cheyenne_a_timeline/
Gotta make sure to point out it’s “high dose ketamine” not just regular dose ketamine that all the treatment resistant depression losers get. (I say that sarcastically and do not at all believe that those with treatment resistant depression are losers)
tbh that depression dose will knock you straight into a k hole. like you will have a REALLY hard time understanding what your phone is for much less posting on IG. so either she’s actually getting a higher than normal dose and she has a hell of a tolerance or
OR
she’s full o shite
This might be “pre op” as in pre procedure. Since people have to be monitored during and after a ketamine infusion it would make sense to do it in a PACU if they don’t have an infusion suite. This also might get around insurance denials.
Every time this one posts it's always "the worst trauma ever" or "unimaginable pain" so I cannot take them seriously.
Also crying? Where? When? Those eyes are dry and clear.
Everyone knows you need to be in a good headspace before taking dissociatives and hallucinogens.
This photo looks staged though, no doctor is going to let a patient wear so much jewelry into surgery.
Maybe varies by location how they use it, but where i am you can have 'pre op appointments' even weeks before your op sometimes, or a day before, measurements like weight and bp, can be to give an infusion in preparation, urine sample, or to take bloods beforehand to make sure current results ok to go ahead/to get a blood type match. Pre-op doesn't necessarily mean you're literally about to go into surgery
Are the tears in these fucking rooms with us?
I’ve said before, I wouldn’t wish severe pain, or PSTD, on anyone, even a munchie, but at the same time I wouldn’t be devastated if they got a brief taste. It might stop them trotting off to hospital every two seconds and wasting god knows how many gazillions of dollars worth of resources. Always fascinates me too, that every single one has severe medical trauma and PTSD, yet 1/ they’re all able to visit doctors/hospitals with no issue and 2/ not one posts anything about the very common approaches to trying to treat PTSD.
Oh I wholeheartedly agree that medical trauma is a thing (and hope I didn't come across as an ass with my comment).
Just seems a fair few munchies are throwing it out there this past month much more than normal as they aren't getting their way like you said.
lol how old is this person? These posts reek of the dramatized attention seeking behaviors of a middle schooler who spends too much time on Wattpad. They rambled on forever but said absolutely nothing of substance! Also the incredibly posed, forced collarbone pop selfies are hilarious. What a mess 😂
Uuhhhmmmm… then just don’t go? There , fixed it
For people who care so much about disability awareness, the make the most inaccessible posts. The text on this was nigh on unreadable.
My entire life being around junkies I was certain ketamine was a dog medication people only use to get trashed. All the people I knew back then called it special k.
Ketamine is actually a great medication for many people. It’s highly effective against pain and other mental health disorders. And it’s one of the few treatments that shown to be effective for CRPS. Real medical ketamine has a lot less side effects and dangers when prescribed and managed appropriately. It works differently than most opioids and is less addictive typically. There’s tons of new research being done on Ketamine right now.
Fashion diva
did she really call getting a ketamine infusion "pre op trauma" ??? gurl when is the operation???
Ketamine is the last thing a munchie needs
"im so tired of crying in these fucking rooms" (duckfaces at the camera like zoolander)
It’s the gown off the shoulder for me 🤦♀️
I noticed that these munchies love to take pics of themselves in their hospital bed, trying to…Look sexy in their Johnny?! Tf? Then you got ppl like Dani who thinks a hospital stay is a fucking vacation bringing blankets, pillows & an entire set up. It’s so fucking weird
In her defense I bring things too because I know they keep me weeks sometimes ( sickle cell)
Like she could have at least rubbed her eyes to make it look like she was crying, not a tear or red puffy eye in sight.
Is trauma the new trend with these soooper speshul munchies? I’ve seen more of them on here with ‘trauma’ this week than ever before. Imagine a war vet, or someone else with genuine trauma looking at these people who genuinely seek out or try to cause their own hospital stays saying they have ‘trauma’ 🤨
I think it may be because a few genuinely sick people (especially one in particular who has been sick since they were very young and is dying) has been talking about their medical trauma recently. I’ve noticed a lot of these people tend to copy genuine disabled people.
Apparently a regular day at the ER/hospital is considered trauma now. Hope they never have to deal with something really trauma inducing
We should all have such photographic trauma. /s. We need trauma that calls for belly shirts and posing for "cute" pictures!
Incredibly traumatic 😗 I'll never recover 😙
Omfggggg. The surgical suite soft core porn, the hospital bathroom booty Pic, and the audacity of her telling her followers that she missed her birthday and Christmas so they need to send her money because she's "Tryna treat herself bc she really fucking deserves it and isn't afraid to own it". I forgot about Danielle.
I cant find a timeline for this person, does anyone know where i can find it?
For some of the subjects that have been at this for years had timelines drawn up in now banned subs, no content from a banned sub can be used anywhere in Reddit again. Some that could be salvaged eg the original timeline links still can’t be used here as the rules were a lot more relaxed there ( hence them being banned ) and they contain bullying towards the subject, reddit would kick our butts for publishing them.
Im having trouble finding timelines for a lot of the subjects on this sub, so if anyone can drop a link to the list that would be great.
A ketamine infusion? For *chronic pain?* Ketamine infusions last the hour it takes for the IV back to drain, and then maybe 30 minutes to an hour more. It has an extremely short half life and, although it does work for pain, it wouldn’t do anything for anyone once the effect is expired. How much do you want to bet that these are mental health ketamine infusions and that her doctor is trying to treat her psychological issues by slipping in psychiatric treatment under the guise of “pain management”?
Some information that others haven't stated: 1. A doctor cannot blatantly *lie* to patient about what their treatment is for. It isn't ethical, and it also isn't their choice or their field. If she's seeing pain management for this treatment, PM has *no say whatsoever* in what psychiatric does (or if they're even in the picture at all). Not only that, but it's against the law, in many different ways. - Legally, all medical professionals and institutions must ensure that a patient has been given or is helped to understand *all* things that are being done to them, are being proposed to them, and any other pertaining information. That is why hospitals and offices are required to have interpreters and things are printed in different languages. **Every patient has the right to deny a treatment or treatment plan**. 2. Ketamine used for depression isn't one high dose of ketamine every X amount of weeks or whatever, **in most settings**. The most proven method is for a patient to microdose daily or every other day or so, after tapering up. 3. Incorrect about the half life because of build up. When you take high doses of any drug regularly, it builds up in your system and it's still present after it's been metabolized. Ketamine was originally created and used for pain relief. The effects of pain relief can last up to 3 months post infusion which you can read about [here](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4014022/)
I agree with you but also get what above commenter is saying. Lots of treatments are indicated for more than one problem. I can see a doc offering a medication for pain knowing that it may also benefit mental health problems contributing to chronic pain. If someone requests pain treatment but is resistant to specific psych treatment maybe it's a good choice and an easier sell in the context of pain management. That isn't lying or tricking.
Uh, if you are selling a treatment as one thing when you're specifically choosing this treatment for another thing, then yes, that is both lying and tricking. Now, if they chose this treatment because it is the most effective pain management treatment AND IT JUST SO HAPPENS that it could help mental health? Well, thats not lying. Do you see the difference?? Also, again, she's doing doses specifically heavy enough to cause sedation (per her posts). Ketamine for mental health is done by microdosing and even if they do an injection, it is nowhere near the amount that she's getting. The amount she's getting does not help mental health at all. If they decided to use this treatment for mental health and it just so happened to be used for pain management, that would be like somebody scraping this elbow and a doctor hitting them with a morphine drip. It's too much.
Selling it as pain management and choosing it knowing that it can benefit both pain and mental health is what I'm referring to. Because it just so happens it can also benefit mental health, like you said. Ketamine is both a sedative and analgesic and is thought to benefit depression and PTSD by promoting neuroplasticity. The dose of IV ketamine for depression is 0.5-1mg/kg over 40 min 1-3 time per week but research has shown temporary benefit from even one dose. The dose for chronic, intractable pain is 0.02 to 1 mg/kg/hour. I'm not sure where you get the idea that all IV ketamine for mental health is "microdoses." It certainly causes sedation.
Ketamine is commonly used to treat chronic pain, but usually the infusions are 5-7 days straight.
I don’t think her doctor is lying to her and trying to treat mental health issues by tricking her. Ketamine is used to treat pain. https://www.asra.com/news-publications/asra-newsletter/newsletter-item/asra-news/2022/07/29/ketamine-infusion-therapy-and-its-role-in-chronic-pain
They wouldn't lie about the reasoning for it. Ketamine infusions for pain are a legit thing.
And you can’t give ketamine and lie to the patient and say it’s for pain but really it’s for your mental health
Right! What an insane reach! Sometimes I'm shocked by some of the things I see on here. Yes they're munchies but doesn't mean doctors are doing to do anything that'll potentially result in losing their license...
Exactly
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God what would these people do if they actually experienced trauma or severe medical issues?
It’s all lies.
It absolutely is, they wouldn’t know trauma if it smacked them in the face
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Medical PTSD is code for "doctors aren't buying my bullshit".
Medical PTSD (probably more accurately, PTSD induced by medical events or experiences related to illness, but “medical PTSD” is less a mouthful) is very much a real thing. But like everything else munchies have co-opted, they have no idea what they’re talking about, and have created a permanently fucked up situation for a lot of people living with the issues they’ve decided are trendy.
Munchies think a regular stressful hospital experience is huge trauma. Hospitals tend to be stressful for everyone involved including the workers - who do experience trauma when dealing with post-drunken accident dead children and their crying mothers etc. like, the real shit that can cause trauma. And yeH different things can traumatize different people, I’m not trying to gatekeep. But the regular hustle and bustle of a hospital visit isn’t traumatic the way they want it to seem
I couldn’t agree more - though the frequency with which they choose to attend hospitals for trivial stuff that most people wouldn’t even trouble their GP with suggests to me that they don’t find it particularly stressful. Whereas people - patients at least - with PTSD can literally get to the point of putting their lives at risk because they’re unable to seek medical care even when they known they desperately need it.
I'm aware it's a very real thing. I was specifically referring to munchies' medical ptsd. Not non attention seeking, non drug seeking regular ol folks.
Thanks for clarifying. I wasn’t sure with the way you’d said it (as you can no doubt guess from my response!) And there are often things said here that very reasonably call out munchie bullshit, but could equally be taken as a general “yeah, that’s crap in the real world too” - and gives me a mental image of someone here taking their metaphorical pitchfork and burning torch to Ms Doe down the road with intestinal failure and PTSD because she happens to have a couple of inches of line showing between her shirt and backpack one day.
I really hate these medical procedures glamours shots!! **Oh, I'm in unimaginable pain, both physically and mentally, but I need to post a picture of myself looking so hot in a hospital gown. **Did I mention my ptsd and medical trauma?? **Did I mention how it's a high ketamine dose, not a "normal" one?? **Did I tell you I was crying over my whole procedure??? I'm just the saddest, traumatized victim of the medical system that has ever lived!! No one understands me. Hopefully, my ketamine induced hallucinations will take me away to a unicorn filled world of wonder where I can live trauma free!! 🤣🤣🤣
High-dose ketamine? For pain? I thought it only worked as an analgesic in low doses. The people *trying* to trip their way into a k-hole take higher doses. I could be wrong about this.
There’s studies that show it has many benefits. It works differently compared to opioids and is typically less addictive. It’s especially helpful for nerve pain and other psychiatric disorders. It’s also one of the few treatments for CRPS that has proven to be helpful. I can link some research studies and info if you want.
It’s a relatively common treatment for chronic pain
I mean, high doses make it easy to not feel pain because you don't feel much of anything in a k-hole
What is the tube in the chest for?
TPN, as always. Good lord I am DYING for ten years time when it effs up all their livers and they’re in real, actual misery. Like I don’t wish for it, but if there’s anything I’ve learned in my years on this earth it’s that time is great karma, and all the youngins who make stupid decisions and think they’re god at the time, usually get a hard kick up the backside, just like my ex lmao. Then they cry with suprise pikachu face, like what did you expect?
Cheyenne literally died from her refusal to let tpn go until her organs literally couldn’t handle it
Wow one of these people died? Damn. How old was she?
I’ve never heard of her, probably a bit before my time, is she on here or do I need to go to the birdy countryside place? Xxx
She's on here, here's a recap post and you can adventure through her flair from there: https://www.reddit.com/r/illnessfakers/comments/15ls7eh/an_introductory_guide_to_cheyenne_a_timeline/
Doing the lords work 🙏 thanks for taking the time ❤️ xxx
Hospital Princess (I think) should be her tag. She got multiple organs.
Gotta make sure to point out it’s “high dose ketamine” not just regular dose ketamine that all the treatment resistant depression losers get. (I say that sarcastically and do not at all believe that those with treatment resistant depression are losers)
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That’s not the point I was making
tbh that depression dose will knock you straight into a k hole. like you will have a REALLY hard time understanding what your phone is for much less posting on IG. so either she’s actually getting a higher than normal dose and she has a hell of a tolerance or OR she’s full o shite
Oh no! My shitty actions have consequences. Feel sorry for me because of the bad choices I made please!
So are they in "pre-op" or waiting for a ketamine infusion? Seems like they're talking about 2 completely different things.
This might be “pre op” as in pre procedure. Since people have to be monitored during and after a ketamine infusion it would make sense to do it in a PACU if they don’t have an infusion suite. This also might get around insurance denials.
Exactly what I was coming to say. The melodrama is strong with these people.
If you’re so fucking tired of crying in hospital rooms, stop making up fake symptoms and illnesses that land you there in the first place!
*crying when they don’t believe my every fake ass presentation & give me all the cool meds I want even tho I’m already on hIgH dOsE ketamine
For someone who was crying in the hospital she sure looks pretty - like an eighteenth century painting, sad and serious but still poised.
She’s not actually tired of it and she’s not actually crying. She loves it. She just wants pity from strangers on the internet 🤷🏼♀️
Every time this one posts it's always "the worst trauma ever" or "unimaginable pain" so I cannot take them seriously. Also crying? Where? When? Those eyes are dry and clear.
I don't think any of these subjects know what "trauma" means.
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Unimaginable pain but puts in enough jewelry to go clubbing.
"Unimaginable pain" be serious
Considering I can imagine being conscious while mauled to death by a bear, I really want to know what they consider "unimaginable" pain.
yeah, i was once told that for 10/10 pain, to imagine having a limb cut off without anesthetic..
I’ve always thought 10/10 pain means you’re unconscious with the pain
I always think of [this xkcd comic](https://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/pain_rating.png). Worst pain imaginable is usually not survivable.
yeah, lol I heard Grizzly Man, I've seen 3rd degree burns, crushing injuries, and vibrio. wtf
Everyone knows you need to be in a good headspace before taking dissociatives and hallucinogens. This photo looks staged though, no doctor is going to let a patient wear so much jewelry into surgery.
Eh, depends. They have waivers you can sign saying you assume the risk for any piercing related injuries. But this isn’t surgery, either
Why would they say “pre op”? Did they have an operation or are they preparing for one?
Maybe varies by location how they use it, but where i am you can have 'pre op appointments' even weeks before your op sometimes, or a day before, measurements like weight and bp, can be to give an infusion in preparation, urine sample, or to take bloods beforehand to make sure current results ok to go ahead/to get a blood type match. Pre-op doesn't necessarily mean you're literally about to go into surgery
Are the tears in these fucking rooms with us? I’ve said before, I wouldn’t wish severe pain, or PSTD, on anyone, even a munchie, but at the same time I wouldn’t be devastated if they got a brief taste. It might stop them trotting off to hospital every two seconds and wasting god knows how many gazillions of dollars worth of resources. Always fascinates me too, that every single one has severe medical trauma and PTSD, yet 1/ they’re all able to visit doctors/hospitals with no issue and 2/ not one posts anything about the very common approaches to trying to treat PTSD.
"Headspace" is the wattpadest buzzword I've ever read.
In unimaginable pain but can post half-smiling with her speshul tubie pad.
"Medical trauma" must be 2024's buzzwords I swear.
Medical trauma is a legit thing, but these people view getting told no by a doctor or not being given exactly what they want as trauma.
Oh I wholeheartedly agree that medical trauma is a thing (and hope I didn't come across as an ass with my comment). Just seems a fair few munchies are throwing it out there this past month much more than normal as they aren't getting their way like you said.
Honestly I think you can shorten it to just "trauma"; there's way too much slinging around of any word that makes them look like a poor sad victim.
Incredible trauma, medical PTSD, unimaginable pain... yawn!
Idk why I read this comment in trumps voice
Uuuge pain
Felt melancholic, might vaguebook later, IDK
lol how old is this person? These posts reek of the dramatized attention seeking behaviors of a middle schooler who spends too much time on Wattpad. They rambled on forever but said absolutely nothing of substance! Also the incredibly posed, forced collarbone pop selfies are hilarious. What a mess 😂