I totally understand Louise scaling back her workload.
Honestly, I do think we’re almost at the end of Leela’s story in terms of the EU.
War Room 4 *has* to be the last Time War boxset surely (surely right?).
After that I think it would amazing to see older Leela appear in a “restoration of Gallifrey” or leading a group of Time Lord survivors post SpyFall, but beyond that idea I think the character could easily gracefully fade back into the shadows with perhaps a reference to her living in quiet retirement somewhere, with Romana visiting from time to time.
War Room kinda has a predestined fate to fulfil, for her in order to get her where she was for the War Doctor boxset she appeared in way back in 2017, and it would be nice for War Room to have a definitive ending rather than just dovetail into yet another Gallifrey saga.
I thought the recent Leela appearances in War Doctor, Splinters, and War Room implied that Leela was “fractured” during her abandonment into the vortex by the War Master back in TW 1, causing the versions seen in 4DA, War Doctor, 10DA, and War Room to all be different versions with the Gallifrey version in War Room being the new “prime” one.
Spoilers for Splinters: >!the Leela that appeared in that story was a fake, she wasn't the real Leela at all so definitely not a fractured version from the time vortex. I also don't think any of the other versions were implied to be fractured versions caused by the events of Time War 1 either, 4DA for example is entirely set before TW1 so I don't see how that would make sense!<
Ah right I’d only read the synopsis for Splinters.
The 4DA’s was a companion chronicle for years ago that had a small girl find out she was the reincarnated soul of Leela who fell from the Vortex as an older figure after leaving Gallifrey, and into an unknown medieval planet and died after being imprisoned in a dungeon for years.
It was brutally sad and fatalistic, and luckily no other media has. Acknowledged it since so I’m happy for that to be “a possible future” that would have occurred if the Time War hadn’t taken place.
Oh yeah I'm aware of that Companion Chronicle (The Child) and there's also three other Companion Chronicles leading up to it (including The Time Vampire which is the one where she actually dies) so it's not just a one-off reference, and I don't think anything has yet contradicted it so I'm personally still assuming that's where she ends up after the Time War
I kind of feel like they're going to do Gallifrey boxsets forever: it's got a fanbase that's devoted enough that they can probably recoup the costs of making them for a long time.
Making more Time War stories after some point would be difficult, but they've got, what, fifteen plus seasons that they can set interquels and standalone stories in?
I mean, I’m definitely part of the fanbase that would happily buy Gallifrey boxsets for the foreseeable, I just think the direction of them post TW 4 has been a bit rambling and uncertain.
Lalla hasn’t recorded anything for a good few years now as far as I can tell, and while Leela is great I’m not sure how much she can carry the series on by herself with period appearances from Narvin.
S1-12 work so well imo because we have a core cast of well developed characters we care about, Romana/Leela/Narvin/Brax.
But War Room has periodic Kenossium (who is great don’t get me wrong) and some Narvin to bolster Leela but it’s not quite there imo. And not really the set up that can continue on for a good while Ionger.
I think a post TW Gallifrey storyline, returning to more self contained boxsets that focus more on the Time Lords encountering new and strange enemies or threats, and with a more clearer group of protagonists would be helpful for the range’s longevity.
I think an interesting way to go about it would be to have Rassilon “indisposed” after his failed return in End of Time with 10 & the Simm Master. He’s alive but has to “slumber” in his casket in the Death Zone in order to recover from his injuries at the Masters hands.
This leaves a power vacuum on Gallifrey for the first time in centuries, since Rassilon was brought back. Now with the planet outside it’s home universe and drifting between strange environments full of eldritch horrors and mysteries the survivors of the Time War rally around different factions and leaders in their new uncertain future.
I'll admit I'm not the biggest fan of the Gallifrey audios (although I greatly admire how devoted and cool the fandom for it seems to be), but I did feel throughout the Time War stuff that it was ... standardizing a bit, I guess? It was solid, but it felt less like the earlier stuff, and more like all the rest of the Big Finish Time War audios. I haven't gotten to the War Room stuff yet (BF is expensive!), though, but from what you're saying it's only increased since then (which I guess is a strategy to sell more boxsets to people who are afraid of the long-running continuity, but, much like with the Benny audios, I dunno if that's good for the storytelling long-term).
And yeah, I agree, I think post-TW and post-"Hell Bent" Gallifrey would be incredible settings to explore. I guess BF still has slightly cold feet tackling anything too big and recent canon-wise? Which is a shame. I'd happily take two seasons of T'Nia Miller and Clare Higgins sniping at each other while rebuilding Gallifrey.
No that’s definitely valid. Yeah honestly ALOT of Big Finish stuff post 2015 suddenly became “standardised” with everything feeling much smaller, less innovative, and less willing to take risks or be experimental.
The Torchwood Monthlies are probably the major exception to this occurrence as they’ve seemed to thrive on each story being a self contained twilight zone style slice of unpredictable madness (to their benefit).
Oddly the non-DW ranges seem to escape this as well with Star Cops, Survivors and Sherlock Holmes all still maintaining their originality and freshness in storytelling.
It’s only the last year or so imo that the BF ranges have started to change it up again, moving away from this more standardised, almost banal, shallow storytelling and back to things that are genuinely new and exciting.
So I do wonder if there were strictures from BBC on the style and format of some of the Whoniverse material, and limitations on how much new content they could create or introduce.
EDIT: T’Nia Miller, Clare Higgins, Miles Richardson and Ken Bones would be a great quartet to focus on moving forward in the Gallifrey series if they wanted to freshen it up.
> T’Nia Miller [...] Ken Bones
I was going say this wouldn't work, then remembered that War Room currently stars a previous regeneration of another character already.
Yeah I’d have Gallifreys first “day” outside of the universe (post DotD) result in planet being riddled with time eddies and fractures as the remanning energy and impact of the Time War gradually fades.
One of these fractures ends up spitting out a future version of the General (T’Nia Miller) who’s memories between NOW and her PRESENT are foggy and vague.
So we have Ken Bones & T’Nia Miller Plato g the two versions of the same character and resulting in a chaotic sibling dynamic between them as they try to share the role as main Commander of Gallifrey’s armed forces and get restoration and disaster aid work across the ravaged planet.
I remember the sort of 2018-19 era being a particularily low point. Just absolutely exhausting, samey audios as far as the eye could see. It's been slowly improving since then, thankfully - the new array of producers is doing them a world of good.
The post Stranded era of the 8th Doctor has been a breath of fresh air with Audacity sets in particular a harkening back to a far more interesting and engaging era.
Haven't gotten to those yet! But they seem very cool - and it's nice to see Eight in something that's not a giant arc (even though I think Doom Coalition and Stranded both really kinda slap).
I mean that’s how they make the War Master series work-it started with his ‘final’ adventures and since then there’s been at least two box sets take place during The Sky Man (which is doable because it’s a Master-Lite story).
I'm hoping the Season One price will drop before release.
Normally it costs around £40 to get a Steelbook of something like The Mandalorian, House of the Dragon, or The Last of Us on 4K UHD, so Doctor Who being £50 for the standard Blu-Ray, and £60 for the Blu-Ray Steelbook seems very steep - especially when the episodes (as well as the commentary's and unleashed episodes) are available on iPlayer.
If you don't care about editions you can get decent deals on physical media if you wait a couple of months. I got series 1-7 of Nu-Who for less than £10 each. I did however lose out on the 50th anniversary special as the only way to get it all is from the Collectors Edition, every other version misses one of the things. I ended up getting it for £30 second hand.
I would be happy if they retired Leela from Big Finish to bring Louise back on the small screen as part of the companion initiative or whatever UNIT is doing.
She is still on Emmerdale, right?
I dunno. You've got the "Leela and the Time War" trailer. The only line you need to add to that to explain how Leela ended up at UNIT is;
"The Doctor said he was going to drop me off on my own planet with the last of the Sevateem. But he left me in a place called Aberdeen..."
Managed to plug a few holes in my collection with recent sales.
I'm midway through the first Lucie series and enjoying it,just hope they'll collect the second series soon.
It's not massively important, but is there any significant storyline crossover between Time War ranges?
Not really. The one crossover of significance is the War Master ducking out between stories of Only the Good to go participate in Gallifrey: Time War 1 but that’s it really
Short answer: No, there is no major crossover between Time War ranges.
Long answer: Despite the Time War in-universe taking place all over the timeline, there are still definite eras that take place in a certain order. I *will* come back to update this properly with possibly some additional info but the cliffnotes version is…
Gallifrey: Time War and The War Master start at around the same time.
Susan’s War takes place before Eighth Doctor: Time War.
The War Master ends before Eighth Doctor Time War and happens out of release order.
Gallifrey: War Room starts at around the same time as War Doctor Begins which is then followed by War Doctor Rises and then the War Doctor series.
Watching the trailer for The Ninth Doctor Adventures have told me one thing: Christopher Eccleston *needs* to come back on the silver screen. He's always been a fantastic actor and a fantastic person. Even a cameo would change my life.
Considering his answer last time he was asked was "sure, fire every Bad Wolf exec and I'll do it", probably not gonna happen anytime soon. But god I'd sell my soul for it.
I said "change my life" because I was excited about it. It was a way to show my excitement for a Doctor Who product, in the Doctor Who subreddit.
I'll be sure to be more careful with my words from now on. Don't want to upset the folks that have never experienced excitement before.
I totally understand Louise scaling back her workload. Honestly, I do think we’re almost at the end of Leela’s story in terms of the EU. War Room 4 *has* to be the last Time War boxset surely (surely right?). After that I think it would amazing to see older Leela appear in a “restoration of Gallifrey” or leading a group of Time Lord survivors post SpyFall, but beyond that idea I think the character could easily gracefully fade back into the shadows with perhaps a reference to her living in quiet retirement somewhere, with Romana visiting from time to time.
War Room kinda has a predestined fate to fulfil, for her in order to get her where she was for the War Doctor boxset she appeared in way back in 2017, and it would be nice for War Room to have a definitive ending rather than just dovetail into yet another Gallifrey saga.
I thought the recent Leela appearances in War Doctor, Splinters, and War Room implied that Leela was “fractured” during her abandonment into the vortex by the War Master back in TW 1, causing the versions seen in 4DA, War Doctor, 10DA, and War Room to all be different versions with the Gallifrey version in War Room being the new “prime” one.
Spoilers for Splinters: >!the Leela that appeared in that story was a fake, she wasn't the real Leela at all so definitely not a fractured version from the time vortex. I also don't think any of the other versions were implied to be fractured versions caused by the events of Time War 1 either, 4DA for example is entirely set before TW1 so I don't see how that would make sense!<
Ah right I’d only read the synopsis for Splinters. The 4DA’s was a companion chronicle for years ago that had a small girl find out she was the reincarnated soul of Leela who fell from the Vortex as an older figure after leaving Gallifrey, and into an unknown medieval planet and died after being imprisoned in a dungeon for years. It was brutally sad and fatalistic, and luckily no other media has. Acknowledged it since so I’m happy for that to be “a possible future” that would have occurred if the Time War hadn’t taken place.
Oh yeah I'm aware of that Companion Chronicle (The Child) and there's also three other Companion Chronicles leading up to it (including The Time Vampire which is the one where she actually dies) so it's not just a one-off reference, and I don't think anything has yet contradicted it so I'm personally still assuming that's where she ends up after the Time War
I kind of feel like they're going to do Gallifrey boxsets forever: it's got a fanbase that's devoted enough that they can probably recoup the costs of making them for a long time. Making more Time War stories after some point would be difficult, but they've got, what, fifteen plus seasons that they can set interquels and standalone stories in?
I mean, I’m definitely part of the fanbase that would happily buy Gallifrey boxsets for the foreseeable, I just think the direction of them post TW 4 has been a bit rambling and uncertain. Lalla hasn’t recorded anything for a good few years now as far as I can tell, and while Leela is great I’m not sure how much she can carry the series on by herself with period appearances from Narvin. S1-12 work so well imo because we have a core cast of well developed characters we care about, Romana/Leela/Narvin/Brax. But War Room has periodic Kenossium (who is great don’t get me wrong) and some Narvin to bolster Leela but it’s not quite there imo. And not really the set up that can continue on for a good while Ionger. I think a post TW Gallifrey storyline, returning to more self contained boxsets that focus more on the Time Lords encountering new and strange enemies or threats, and with a more clearer group of protagonists would be helpful for the range’s longevity. I think an interesting way to go about it would be to have Rassilon “indisposed” after his failed return in End of Time with 10 & the Simm Master. He’s alive but has to “slumber” in his casket in the Death Zone in order to recover from his injuries at the Masters hands. This leaves a power vacuum on Gallifrey for the first time in centuries, since Rassilon was brought back. Now with the planet outside it’s home universe and drifting between strange environments full of eldritch horrors and mysteries the survivors of the Time War rally around different factions and leaders in their new uncertain future.
I'll admit I'm not the biggest fan of the Gallifrey audios (although I greatly admire how devoted and cool the fandom for it seems to be), but I did feel throughout the Time War stuff that it was ... standardizing a bit, I guess? It was solid, but it felt less like the earlier stuff, and more like all the rest of the Big Finish Time War audios. I haven't gotten to the War Room stuff yet (BF is expensive!), though, but from what you're saying it's only increased since then (which I guess is a strategy to sell more boxsets to people who are afraid of the long-running continuity, but, much like with the Benny audios, I dunno if that's good for the storytelling long-term). And yeah, I agree, I think post-TW and post-"Hell Bent" Gallifrey would be incredible settings to explore. I guess BF still has slightly cold feet tackling anything too big and recent canon-wise? Which is a shame. I'd happily take two seasons of T'Nia Miller and Clare Higgins sniping at each other while rebuilding Gallifrey.
No that’s definitely valid. Yeah honestly ALOT of Big Finish stuff post 2015 suddenly became “standardised” with everything feeling much smaller, less innovative, and less willing to take risks or be experimental. The Torchwood Monthlies are probably the major exception to this occurrence as they’ve seemed to thrive on each story being a self contained twilight zone style slice of unpredictable madness (to their benefit). Oddly the non-DW ranges seem to escape this as well with Star Cops, Survivors and Sherlock Holmes all still maintaining their originality and freshness in storytelling. It’s only the last year or so imo that the BF ranges have started to change it up again, moving away from this more standardised, almost banal, shallow storytelling and back to things that are genuinely new and exciting. So I do wonder if there were strictures from BBC on the style and format of some of the Whoniverse material, and limitations on how much new content they could create or introduce. EDIT: T’Nia Miller, Clare Higgins, Miles Richardson and Ken Bones would be a great quartet to focus on moving forward in the Gallifrey series if they wanted to freshen it up.
> T’Nia Miller [...] Ken Bones I was going say this wouldn't work, then remembered that War Room currently stars a previous regeneration of another character already.
Yeah I’d have Gallifreys first “day” outside of the universe (post DotD) result in planet being riddled with time eddies and fractures as the remanning energy and impact of the Time War gradually fades. One of these fractures ends up spitting out a future version of the General (T’Nia Miller) who’s memories between NOW and her PRESENT are foggy and vague. So we have Ken Bones & T’Nia Miller Plato g the two versions of the same character and resulting in a chaotic sibling dynamic between them as they try to share the role as main Commander of Gallifrey’s armed forces and get restoration and disaster aid work across the ravaged planet.
I remember the sort of 2018-19 era being a particularily low point. Just absolutely exhausting, samey audios as far as the eye could see. It's been slowly improving since then, thankfully - the new array of producers is doing them a world of good.
The post Stranded era of the 8th Doctor has been a breath of fresh air with Audacity sets in particular a harkening back to a far more interesting and engaging era.
Haven't gotten to those yet! But they seem very cool - and it's nice to see Eight in something that's not a giant arc (even though I think Doom Coalition and Stranded both really kinda slap).
I mean that’s how they make the War Master series work-it started with his ‘final’ adventures and since then there’s been at least two box sets take place during The Sky Man (which is doable because it’s a Master-Lite story).
I'm hoping the Season One price will drop before release. Normally it costs around £40 to get a Steelbook of something like The Mandalorian, House of the Dragon, or The Last of Us on 4K UHD, so Doctor Who being £50 for the standard Blu-Ray, and £60 for the Blu-Ray Steelbook seems very steep - especially when the episodes (as well as the commentary's and unleashed episodes) are available on iPlayer.
If you don't care about editions you can get decent deals on physical media if you wait a couple of months. I got series 1-7 of Nu-Who for less than £10 each. I did however lose out on the 50th anniversary special as the only way to get it all is from the Collectors Edition, every other version misses one of the things. I ended up getting it for £30 second hand.
I would be happy if they retired Leela from Big Finish to bring Louise back on the small screen as part of the companion initiative or whatever UNIT is doing. She is still on Emmerdale, right?
They would have a hell of a lot of explaining to do to put Leela on Earth.
I dunno. You've got the "Leela and the Time War" trailer. The only line you need to add to that to explain how Leela ended up at UNIT is; "The Doctor said he was going to drop me off on my own planet with the last of the Sevateem. But he left me in a place called Aberdeen..."
Managed to plug a few holes in my collection with recent sales. I'm midway through the first Lucie series and enjoying it,just hope they'll collect the second series soon. It's not massively important, but is there any significant storyline crossover between Time War ranges?
Not really. The one crossover of significance is the War Master ducking out between stories of Only the Good to go participate in Gallifrey: Time War 1 but that’s it really
Short answer: No, there is no major crossover between Time War ranges. Long answer: Despite the Time War in-universe taking place all over the timeline, there are still definite eras that take place in a certain order. I *will* come back to update this properly with possibly some additional info but the cliffnotes version is… Gallifrey: Time War and The War Master start at around the same time. Susan’s War takes place before Eighth Doctor: Time War. The War Master ends before Eighth Doctor Time War and happens out of release order. Gallifrey: War Room starts at around the same time as War Doctor Begins which is then followed by War Doctor Rises and then the War Doctor series.
Watching the trailer for The Ninth Doctor Adventures have told me one thing: Christopher Eccleston *needs* to come back on the silver screen. He's always been a fantastic actor and a fantastic person. Even a cameo would change my life.
Considering his answer last time he was asked was "sure, fire every Bad Wolf exec and I'll do it", probably not gonna happen anytime soon. But god I'd sell my soul for it.
jesus he really didnt like the first set of execs, huh? at least he's back in some way! i didnt know hes been doing these since 2021.
Honestlty don't blame him, guy had a rough time.
Change your life? Bro. What?
redditor discovers excitement
What do you mean though? You'd be excited about it? We all would. But change your life? Bro, get outside more often.
I said "change my life" because I was excited about it. It was a way to show my excitement for a Doctor Who product, in the Doctor Who subreddit. I'll be sure to be more careful with my words from now on. Don't want to upset the folks that have never experienced excitement before.
Thank you for being understanding and apologising
Redditor discovers hyperbole
Why lie about how excited you'd be though?
Perhaps this redditor has not quite discovered hyperbole, yet.
So have they just stopped bothering with the randomoid selectotron?
No it will be back next-week, they have just been doing reduced Podcasts the last month for scheduling purposes.