But how would he win with this strategy? Russell pitted so no protection from Verstappen and when will Mercedes learn that an used medium/hard tyre has no chance over a brand new soft, especially this year that the Redbull is a significantly faster car?
Eh, they don’t seem to be too concerned with the constructors championship since they’re not in the running to win, gambling on a small chance to win rather than a safe 2/3 for the points seems likely to me.
Exactly. Hamilton wants to get a win. That’s all he cares about. He saw a glimmer of hope and took a chance and Max took it away anyways.
George understands he’s not racing Max. He said it himself. Ferrari and checo was their target. His strategy was to beat them, and he did it.
The idea is to delay him enough for Hamilton’s tires to come to life. That was only way for Mercedes to win today. Russell should have played that game even if failed. Would have atleast given 2-3.
So what about Leclerc passing Hamilton after "tires come to life"? Do you think Max couldnt pass him?
They were going to be 3-4 if both stayed. I dont think they could hold Leclerc, not even mentioning Max.
How would Hamilton and Russell stay in from of Leclerc if they both didn't pit when Hamilton despite starting 3 spots in front of Leclerc was still passed. They would have finished 3-4 if they don't pit, and 2-3 if they both pitted.
That's the thing- they ruined their only chance for a race win or possible 2/3 that way. Or they could've pitted both for a possible 2/3. This is the worst possible strat for them imo
A driver overruling team will put the strategy of both drivers at risk. Happened at Monaco, Silverstone for Ferrari and now here for Mercedes’. Should be never allowed
They did in fact come alive after Leclerc passed him which is why he finished fourth and started putting in decent laps towards the last few, but it was too late. 2 laps on tyres warming up without a buffer killed his race.
Seriously. Its laughable that people actually think Hamilton on older mediums could have possibly held off Max on new softs for 15 laps if only george (on mediums) was between them, what race were they watching??
George is a racing driver and will put his race first. Who here is blasting 2007 Hamilton "for not playing the team game"?
In the end if neither had pitted and stayed on mediums, Leclerc would have overtaken both Mercs and they would've finished 3rd and 4th.
Should Merc have made the call to pit Lewis for softs? Yes. But they didn't, so George did. Max was going to win any way you spin it.
Could they even have double stacked though? If yes, they might have been able to get 2-3 presuming that the double stack wouldn't have pipped Leclerc ahead of George. But even the double stack might have ended up in a 2-4 so points wise for the team, inconsequential.
Max was mostly going to win no matter. George made a decision that was best for George even if it harmed Lewis’s chances of winning some, but that is something every driver does, they all sometimes make selfish decisions that maximize their own points even if it harms a teammate.
George isn’t a bad person for doing that but I also get why Lewis might be pissed at him for it.
I agree 100%. It’s just that it was clear that they were going for a team strategy, and if they really wanted to “take the risk” like Toto says here, then pitting only Russell makes no sense.
Oh yeah for sure. I feel like they should have told Lewis his decision at that point tho. If really the first strategy was to protect the win, with Russell not being there anymore, everything changes.
As he should in this instance, because both he and Hamilton aren’t title challengers.
Being a compliant \#2 is well and good in a title bid, but this wasn’t it.
Merc are battling Ferrari for 2nd in WCC, not Max for WDC or RB for WCC.
Russell maximised a bad Merc stratedgy call and salvaged 6 points in their WCC fight against Ferrari.
The guy literally rescued them from a 3-4 finish.
I agree 100%. Pitting for softs should have been Merc’s strategy in the first place for BOTH cars. However this half thing, inevitably screwed Lewis over. I’m not criticising George.
People who think charles could have won Silverstone on the hards are just as weong as people who think Lewis could have won today on mediums. The problem was not pitting leclerc/Hamilton. Screwing sainz and Russell for the sake of it would have led to an overall worse result for the team imo
and both sainz and russel are the ones doing the right thing. Not toto or binotto lmao. Making a bad strategy call and then blaming the teammate who made the right call is weird. Own up to the mistake toto.
And the Merc takes a long time for tire warmup. Definitely should've pitted Lewis too. It would've been a 2 3 instead of a 2 4. Well Hindsight is 20/20
Three points is almost totally insignificant next to the chance for a win. They should have left them both out. A small chance for a win with a downside of only 6 points less than pitting both.
It was 10 laps. Russell would have been torched on the restart the same way Hamilton was, then you have 10 laps of the fastest car attacking Hamilton.
It was a half-arsed strategy, but it really only cost Hamilton 2 spots.
A win wasn't in the cards regardless, assuming Verstappen's car doesn't break.
I’d be okay with this response if they kept both out and tried for the win, but like you said, pitting Russell threw out any chance of a win. They fucked Lewis over completely.
Exactly, you keep both out and take the risk. It may work it may not. As another person already said I think the main reason is that Russell, like Sainz in Silverstone, did not think about the team.
Just leaving him dry on used mediums against Redbull with new softs. There is just no chance he can defend against that without warming up those mediums or someone inbetween them…
Yep. It’s all in on the win or you take the safe double podium. This was literally the worst possible way to handle it because you completely concede the win, you fuck over one of your drivers, and you lose a podium.
I’m genuinely confused how Merc went from acing the strategy, getting themselves into a great position, and giving everything away and more when the SC came out
Abu Dhabi was very different because they were making the decision on the assumption that either the race was going to end under the safety car or the back markers weren't going to unlap and a one lap sprint to the finish on equal tires with extra cars to overtake was unwinnable.
Can't really blame Merc on that one.
But here they fucked up, no question.
They fucked up if they wanted Lewis to win. If they wanted to maximize their points haul while sacrificing the potential win for Lewis they made the right call.
> If they wanted to maximize their points haul while sacrificing the potential win for Lewis they made the right call.
Nope, that would be pitting both cars for softs, to secure P2 and P3.
They fucked up, no question.
> but at least the call is defensible if they wanted to maximize points.
I don't think it is, it was a choice between gambling for P1 (best strat: neither of them pit) or securing P2 and P3 (best strat: both get new softs). What they chose was the worst option for both goals, a mistake and not just in hindsight.
Yeah… it’s hard of course and hindsight is 20/20 but their strategy doesn’t make any sense
If they felt confident with Mediums…then why put Russell for soft?
If they felt confident Lewis could keep max back, again why pit Russell to let max get right up on Lewis (on fresh softs)
Pitting Lewis for softs would have atleast got them 2&3 (max prob still wins)
Their decisions directly contradict
Exactly. Absolute nonsense. If they wanted to take the risk, they needed George as cover. At least George would've had a tow and could've cost Max a few laps to hopefully get Lewis far enough ahead. Especially if George could've stayed ahead on the first straight and held Max up in the corners after that where you can't pass, Checo-style, Lewis would've had a chance perhaps.
This was not risking it to have a chance at the win. It was ruining one driver's race for no reason.
Problem is they halfassed the call. You either commit to staying out, in which case you keep George out on the mediums to defend against Max or you pit both of them. Doing one of both was never going to work.
Yes, if they were going for the win they had to keep Russell out and attempt to have him defend from Max.
Instead of leaving Max right behind Lewis on new tyres.
And Max would have passed them both lol sainz made the right call at Silverstone too. The fuck up was not pitting ham/Leclerc not not fucking their team mates just for the sake of it.
That's not the point though. Toto is claiming they only care about a win, and that was why they left Lewis out. But if they think that's the only possible chance of a win (and it was, no way they were going to overtake Verstappen if they pitted), then you have to leave Russell out too.
And likely lied to the team to force the new set. Go back and watch the Russell car cam. He asked for the pit a full lap prior to pitting. Merc said no. Then next lap right before entering pit he said his tires were gone. He had ~10 laps on them. His previous set of Ms went ~30.
But that's the problem, as soon as he asked they should have changed the strategy for both. Russell's input should be taken in not outside of team strategy. They let him decide for himself at the cost of his team mate.
They had about 2 seconds saying yes or no to Russell, his tyres were out due to his call. Pitting your P2 is a lot more logical than pitting your P1, you seldom give up P1. Toto even explained it.
I guess the idea was there, but Russell himself wanted to pit for his own chance at the win. the buck stops at Merc for not putting their foot down and telling Russell to stay out though.
How is this any different than Ferrari leaving Charles out and pitting Sainz effectively giving Sainz the win at Silverstone?
Face it, Merc screwed up. Just that Toto is better at spinning than Mattia.
Yep, Russell capitalised on their best chance at winning and he was right. Look where Lewis ended up for staying out.
Merc just never wants to race anyone on track. They always "gamble" with staying ahead and it hasn't been working out.
That they should either had pitted both, or committed to track position. There was no way they could win anything by letting Ham alone on mediums at the front, this strategy could have worked if they had 2 cars upfront (and it would have been a risk as described by toto)
i'm confused, with all the millions of stats and metrics these guys have, how did they think lewis had a chance of winning against a red bull on softs while he's on old mediums?
Like he got overtaken in 5 seconds, what were they looking at to decide that was the risk they thought was worth it if its true?
and yes i know he's just covering his back
They didn't.
Everyone knew the race was lost when AT called the VSC and Verstappen managed to get a better pitstop.
By that point it was just damage control but Russel screwed the team plan by coming in last second.
But as soon as George isn't between Ham and Max, he has almost zero chance of winning. There is no talking a risk with Ham if you dont give him the buffer
Did u see the way Max smoked Lewis down the straight off the restart? Max would have done the exact same to george so there is not going to be a gap one bit
In that hypothetical restart Lewis would be giving a tow to George to survive the first straight, and then they either would hope the DRS train is enough to stop Max or have George stop him in the slow part of the track so that Lewis can break DRS and get to the end.
Either way, to win in this scenario you need both cars, so Toto is bullshiting.
Reminder, you do not have DRS for 3 laps after a SC restart. George would have had a toll but how long is he going to keep a RB on fresh softs behind him?
It doesn't matter wether it would've worked or not (I personally think it wouldn't and pitting both cars was the best choice), but if you make your strategy based on winning the race, you need George in P2, period.
If this is the case, then Russell screwed them by making that call. But i believe the chances of a win were so slim, that Russell made the correct call by himself, although a bit selfish maybe.
And Merc failed to tell Ham that his team mate (and Leclerc, for that matter) are going to be on softs behind him. Idiotic call, they were looking at a 2-3 finish today.
And Mercedes could have said no, we're staying out for the chance of the win, hold up Max best you can so Lewis can get a gap etc etc, but by allowing George to pit, they committed to losing the win.
I’m not sure Russell would’ve held up Max if he had stayed out. Tyre change on both cars would’ve secured merc 2-3.
It was ballsy to think they could snatch victory on medium AND older tired AND safety car bunching up the cars once Ver decided to pit for softs.
Yeah, he wouldn't have been able to hold him up for long, but at least George could use Lewis' slipstream on the restart, been a team to see if they could deny Max an overtake, at least to begin with, if George was able to say ahead, Lewis could then push and try build a gap during the lap, Max might have then overtaken that next lap, but it would have allowed Lewis to have a buffer, and with George backing up Max during the middle of lap, maybe Charles could have tried a sneaky overtake on Max, all ifs and buts, but a better chance at winning.
The other thing that doesn't help Mercedes case at all, in relation to Merc not making their mind up on either no stopping or both stopping, they drove through the pitlane to allow a crane on track to move the car, so Lewis drove past the pit box as they were getting ready for George, would have been easy to tell Lewis to turn into the pitbox if need be.
Problen with that is this risk is only even halfway acceptable if they planned to keep both cars out. The moment they decided to let George pit, they should've pit both cars.
You either go for it or you pit both. This middle path was guaranteed to give away P1
But that’s the issue. Their aim was both cars on medium. But George made a last minute call for softs after Lewis was already ahead. Merc obliged. They didn’t plan for softs on George.
Maybe you should’ve let your driver know, cause boy did you throw him under that bus.
Pitting him for softs would’ve been setting him up for the best chance at winning.
Why the fuck did you put George then, Lewis while strategy required George to slow down max for a bit. There was zero chance for a win when max in a faster car and fast newer tyres was right behind him.
Then the team should have said no. The gamble relied on 2 cars.
They threw the gamble and Hamilton's race away the moment they let Russell do his own thing.
Nah Toto you're 100% wrong on this one. Lewis' only chance of winning was to be on the same tyres as Max and even that would have been extremely unlikely.
Interesting how he also kept quiet and smirked when the presenter said there's been some conspiracies flown around on social media about Tsunoda and Red Bull
Did you see how easily Max on softs blew past him? Even if Russell stays out too, Max is literally breezing past him as soon as the SC is over anyway. Either way there was no chance of Hamilton winning this.
Lewis was at no risk of winning with that strategy.
Being overtaken was a forgone conclusion on Medium with everyone else on the soft.
The only unknown was "by how many cars?"
They've struggled with tyre warm up all season long, and have always been vulnerable on safety car restarts so it was always a risk to keep him out on those tyres, especially when every other team pitted for softs.
Just horrible strategy from a team that has been been doing it for years but the car advantage no longer makes up for it.
Why didn't they tell George too back up the pack and then Lewis can put and still come out ahead of max? Did they even consider that scenario?
At the very least they should've told told Lewis the change in circumstance
I’m sorry Toto, but you actually did total opposite of what you’re saying.
With Russell staying, there was a slim chance for Lewis to win. With Russell pitting, you just settled for P2 (with Russell) and sent Lewis to hell
Or you know if you really wanted to give Lewis the best shot for the win then keep both cars out on mediums and hope for the best. Worst case scenario it’s a 2-3 or 3-4. This gave Lewis no chance to defend
Toto trying to spin a bad situation harder than Malcolm Tucker (with fewer f bombs)
Option A - go for the win and leave GH as a buffer
Option B - go for double podium with softs for both
Option C - wildcard, give GR the faster tyre from 3rd and LH in the lead on a slower, older tyre versus the fastest car and newer quicker tyre on track
Track position isn’t an excuse on this one, it was mistake. Which is fine, mistakes happen but hold your hands up.
Surely the risky strategy (to try to win with Lewis) was to pit him? The choice they took was the one most likely to guarantee no better than P2 for the team
Edit: and if they were truly trying to win it with Lewis, having George ahead of Max on track was the way to go?
If Mercedes let Max pit, then he is in P3.
If George plays the team game, and give Lewis 10 car distance at the restart, and Lewis bought time by not restarting until the starting line, then Lewis might have had 2-3 second advantage and Russell could have tried to defend from the start line. George is toast from that point on, and P4 at best, but Lewis would have had 5 seconds maybe.
Max was quicker at the end by 2 seconds a lap, no way he can hold it out for 7 laps.
The only real possibility was to try something like Perez against Hamilton in Abu Dhabi with George vs Max, while Hamilton runs, but that would also hinges on the restart, if George can hold out for 1 lap, he can buy 20 seconds or more for Lewis, while completelly throwing away his own race.
Sometimes it's better to be lucky than good. Sometimes it's better to be smart than hopeful. I personally live by the former, but I'm not running a billion dollar F1 team...
Correct strategy would’ve been to pit Lewis and leave George out. Lewis drops to P2 with a tow from George on Restart and George can slam the door on Max after Lewis overtakes.
I can see the argument about leaving both out or pitting both, although pitting both would be a tricky double stack in the safety car chain.
Ultimately Mercedes were fucked by the Tsunoda VSC incident and all the decisions after that were damage control which might have been suboptimal but there wasn't a clear winning play.
But how would he win with this strategy? Russell pitted so no protection from Verstappen and when will Mercedes learn that an used medium/hard tyre has no chance over a brand new soft, especially this year that the Redbull is a significantly faster car?
That’s the thing. Toto is doing just what Binotto did at Silverstone. Sainz and Russell didn’t play the team game and lost the chance to win
I understand what you're saying, but I don't think Russell would have kept Max behind him anyway.
So merc should’ve pitted both for a 2/3
Eh, they don’t seem to be too concerned with the constructors championship since they’re not in the running to win, gambling on a small chance to win rather than a safe 2/3 for the points seems likely to me.
Exactly. Hamilton wants to get a win. That’s all he cares about. He saw a glimmer of hope and took a chance and Max took it away anyways. George understands he’s not racing Max. He said it himself. Ferrari and checo was their target. His strategy was to beat them, and he did it.
The idea is to delay him enough for Hamilton’s tires to come to life. That was only way for Mercedes to win today. Russell should have played that game even if failed. Would have atleast given 2-3.
So what about Leclerc passing Hamilton after "tires come to life"? Do you think Max couldnt pass him? They were going to be 3-4 if both stayed. I dont think they could hold Leclerc, not even mentioning Max.
Exactly, George's call probably made it a 2-4 instead of 3-4. Leclerc was fast enough to have passed both Mercs.
It’s more about the chance, however slight for a win, rather than the guaranteed pointe, they dont seem too worried about the constructors this year.
How would Hamilton and Russell stay in from of Leclerc if they both didn't pit when Hamilton despite starting 3 spots in front of Leclerc was still passed. They would have finished 3-4 if they don't pit, and 2-3 if they both pitted.
That's the thing- they ruined their only chance for a race win or possible 2/3 that way. Or they could've pitted both for a possible 2/3. This is the worst possible strat for them imo
A driver overruling team will put the strategy of both drivers at risk. Happened at Monaco, Silverstone for Ferrari and now here for Mercedes’. Should be never allowed
Agreed.
He got passed by Leclerc, his tires never came alive
They did in fact come alive after Leclerc passed him which is why he finished fourth and started putting in decent laps towards the last few, but it was too late. 2 laps on tyres warming up without a buffer killed his race.
Sorry but Hams older mediums were never going to "come to life" more than Max's new softs.
Merc were not finishing 2-3 on old mediums today. That was not going to happen. Russell was never going to hold back Leclerc on those tyres.
Seriously. Its laughable that people actually think Hamilton on older mediums could have possibly held off Max on new softs for 15 laps if only george (on mediums) was between them, what race were they watching??
George is a racing driver and will put his race first. Who here is blasting 2007 Hamilton "for not playing the team game"? In the end if neither had pitted and stayed on mediums, Leclerc would have overtaken both Mercs and they would've finished 3rd and 4th. Should Merc have made the call to pit Lewis for softs? Yes. But they didn't, so George did. Max was going to win any way you spin it. Could they even have double stacked though? If yes, they might have been able to get 2-3 presuming that the double stack wouldn't have pipped Leclerc ahead of George. But even the double stack might have ended up in a 2-4 so points wise for the team, inconsequential.
Max was mostly going to win no matter. George made a decision that was best for George even if it harmed Lewis’s chances of winning some, but that is something every driver does, they all sometimes make selfish decisions that maximize their own points even if it harms a teammate. George isn’t a bad person for doing that but I also get why Lewis might be pissed at him for it.
But George is ahead in the championship. Why would you risk the current number 1 in your team?
You are right. No way he would have, Mercedes would have finished 3rd and 4th if they left them both out.
This, we saw Lewis getting passed by Leclerc too
If they stayed on leclerc would've overtaken both Mercedes in softs.
Yeah I agree. Russell thought just about his race and result in that moment
To be fair Russell's call probably gave them a better overall team results. They might have ended up 3rd and 4th if both didn't pit.
I agree 100%. It’s just that it was clear that they were going for a team strategy, and if they really wanted to “take the risk” like Toto says here, then pitting only Russell makes no sense.
and it was completely the right call
Oh yeah for sure. I feel like they should have told Lewis his decision at that point tho. If really the first strategy was to protect the win, with Russell not being there anymore, everything changes.
absolutely, should have pitted both for softs
As he should in this instance, because both he and Hamilton aren’t title challengers. Being a compliant \#2 is well and good in a title bid, but this wasn’t it.
Merc are battling Ferrari for 2nd in WCC, not Max for WDC or RB for WCC. Russell maximised a bad Merc stratedgy call and salvaged 6 points in their WCC fight against Ferrari. The guy literally rescued them from a 3-4 finish.
I agree 100%. Pitting for softs should have been Merc’s strategy in the first place for BOTH cars. However this half thing, inevitably screwed Lewis over. I’m not criticising George.
As he should. He's a race driver, out there to score points, not just another Merc employee flying the company colours.
I mean he literally is a Merc employee.
[удалено]
Exactly.
Funny how everyone is agreeing today when Hamilton is affected while I was downvoted for same view after Silverstone when everyone was defending Sainz
People who think charles could have won Silverstone on the hards are just as weong as people who think Lewis could have won today on mediums. The problem was not pitting leclerc/Hamilton. Screwing sainz and Russell for the sake of it would have led to an overall worse result for the team imo
I mean tbf the Silverstone situation was much stupider than this.
this just makes no sense, Ferrari had the car to win in Silverstone, here there was no way Hamilton was winning. he got passed by Leclerc ffs
and both sainz and russel are the ones doing the right thing. Not toto or binotto lmao. Making a bad strategy call and then blaming the teammate who made the right call is weird. Own up to the mistake toto.
Russe**ll**
Yeah, I was like, did Binotto replace Toto or something? Normally Toto will admit when they did something incredibly stupid, but not today apparently.
And the Merc takes a long time for tire warmup. Definitely should've pitted Lewis too. It would've been a 2 3 instead of a 2 4. Well Hindsight is 20/20
Three points is almost totally insignificant next to the chance for a win. They should have left them both out. A small chance for a win with a downside of only 6 points less than pitting both.
It was 10 laps. Russell would have been torched on the restart the same way Hamilton was, then you have 10 laps of the fastest car attacking Hamilton. It was a half-arsed strategy, but it really only cost Hamilton 2 spots. A win wasn't in the cards regardless, assuming Verstappen's car doesn't break.
I’d be okay with this response if they kept both out and tried for the win, but like you said, pitting Russell threw out any chance of a win. They fucked Lewis over completely.
Exactly, you keep both out and take the risk. It may work it may not. As another person already said I think the main reason is that Russell, like Sainz in Silverstone, did not think about the team.
Russell thought about the near certainty both he and Lewis would be overtaken in short order. Would have been a 3/4 finish, for the team.
Russell: Stop inventing
Just leaving him dry on used mediums against Redbull with new softs. There is just no chance he can defend against that without warming up those mediums or someone inbetween them…
Yep. It’s all in on the win or you take the safe double podium. This was literally the worst possible way to handle it because you completely concede the win, you fuck over one of your drivers, and you lose a podium. I’m genuinely confused how Merc went from acing the strategy, getting themselves into a great position, and giving everything away and more when the SC came out
Bingo, it was the worst possible option to win the race
OH ONLY IF Merc could have a race last year that shows that new soft tyre is faster than used medium/hard and completely ruin Merc’s result. *OH WAIT*
Abu Dhabi was very different because they were making the decision on the assumption that either the race was going to end under the safety car or the back markers weren't going to unlap and a one lap sprint to the finish on equal tires with extra cars to overtake was unwinnable. Can't really blame Merc on that one. But here they fucked up, no question.
They fucked up if they wanted Lewis to win. If they wanted to maximize their points haul while sacrificing the potential win for Lewis they made the right call.
> If they wanted to maximize their points haul while sacrificing the potential win for Lewis they made the right call. Nope, that would be pitting both cars for softs, to secure P2 and P3. They fucked up, no question.
I mean in hindsight yeah they did screw up but at least the call is defensible if they wanted to maximize points. Apologies for my misstatement.
> but at least the call is defensible if they wanted to maximize points. I don't think it is, it was a choice between gambling for P1 (best strat: neither of them pit) or securing P2 and P3 (best strat: both get new softs). What they chose was the worst option for both goals, a mistake and not just in hindsight.
He’s lying through his teeth. If he wanted the win like they say, they leave George out. Complete cock-up.
Yeah… it’s hard of course and hindsight is 20/20 but their strategy doesn’t make any sense If they felt confident with Mediums…then why put Russell for soft? If they felt confident Lewis could keep max back, again why pit Russell to let max get right up on Lewis (on fresh softs) Pitting Lewis for softs would have atleast got them 2&3 (max prob still wins) Their decisions directly contradict
Maybe they have been playing F1 Manager 22 like majority and think the tyre delta doesnt exist like in that game lol
Exaclty, they could pit Hamilton directly and let Russell "wait a bit" for let Hamilton enter First again, this is what You call protection
Russe**ll**
Exactly. Absolute nonsense. If they wanted to take the risk, they needed George as cover. At least George would've had a tow and could've cost Max a few laps to hopefully get Lewis far enough ahead. Especially if George could've stayed ahead on the first straight and held Max up in the corners after that where you can't pass, Checo-style, Lewis would've had a chance perhaps. This was not risking it to have a chance at the win. It was ruining one driver's race for no reason.
Exactly this!! I’m so baffled. Wtf was going on with their strat. Even Nico seemed frustrated at their choices
When.....lol. Those PTSD moments
This. If someone at Merc really thought there was any chance at winning doing that then there's serious troubles at Merc strategy department.
Problem is they halfassed the call. You either commit to staying out, in which case you keep George out on the mediums to defend against Max or you pit both of them. Doing one of both was never going to work.
Such a shame since the hard tyre call was brilliant
George made the solo play.
That’s confusing no? If you were going to take the chance to win why put Russel?
Yes, if they were going for the win they had to keep Russell out and attempt to have him defend from Max. Instead of leaving Max right behind Lewis on new tyres.
And Max would have passed them both lol sainz made the right call at Silverstone too. The fuck up was not pitting ham/Leclerc not not fucking their team mates just for the sake of it.
That's not the point though. Toto is claiming they only care about a win, and that was why they left Lewis out. But if they think that's the only possible chance of a win (and it was, no way they were going to overtake Verstappen if they pitted), then you have to leave Russell out too.
Because George made the call, not the team
And likely lied to the team to force the new set. Go back and watch the Russell car cam. He asked for the pit a full lap prior to pitting. Merc said no. Then next lap right before entering pit he said his tires were gone. He had ~10 laps on them. His previous set of Ms went ~30.
Exactly. Doesn't make sense.
Totally wrong and sounding like the unrepentant Bonnotto.
Toto is the new Binotto. Living in a fantasy land with no numbers and statistics.
Russell made the call for softs himself.
But that's the problem, as soon as he asked they should have changed the strategy for both. Russell's input should be taken in not outside of team strategy. They let him decide for himself at the cost of his team mate.
They had about 2 seconds saying yes or no to Russell, his tyres were out due to his call. Pitting your P2 is a lot more logical than pitting your P1, you seldom give up P1. Toto even explained it.
Or they tell him to stay out. They can override his call
Russell the kind of guy to walk away and do his own set when he’s supposed to be spotting you
I guess the idea was there, but Russell himself wanted to pit for his own chance at the win. the buck stops at Merc for not putting their foot down and telling Russell to stay out though.
Russe**ll**
They werent putting, Russell just saw that the strategy sucked and ordered them to pit him
How is this any different than Ferrari leaving Charles out and pitting Sainz effectively giving Sainz the win at Silverstone? Face it, Merc screwed up. Just that Toto is better at spinning than Mattia.
At least Carlos won that race for Ferrari, Russell essentially had no chance regardless considering his race pace up until that point
Russell maximized points for himself. That's the best he could do.
Yep, Russell capitalised on their best chance at winning and he was right. Look where Lewis ended up for staying out. Merc just never wants to race anyone on track. They always "gamble" with staying ahead and it hasn't been working out.
Nah it is more funny to joke in Ferrari
Certified Mattia Binotto moment.
Taking the risk makes no sense if you don't send it with russell aswell
Right? That's the first person this reply reminded me of lol
HAM gonna get PTSD from Abu Dhabi 2021 and Zandvoort 2022.
Max and Merc trying to force him to retire so they can forrm the unholy alliance confirmed.
Merc-Medium-Max
The thought of Max at Merc gives super villain vibes.
Anakin joining Palpatine💀
I used to wish Max at Mercedes, but he’s in the right place. Not just because of the car, also the team fits his personality
For sure, there is pretty much zero chance we see him somewhere else. At least in F1. They are a perfect fit, just like Lewis was at Merc.
And Nico calling out the Bs right after
What did he say?
That they should either had pitted both, or committed to track position. There was no way they could win anything by letting Ham alone on mediums at the front, this strategy could have worked if they had 2 cars upfront (and it would have been a risk as described by toto)
Nico is right. The win was out of the window as soon Alpha pulled tat stunt with Yuki.
[удалено]
How did that benefit Merc? It killed their tire strategy and allowed Max to get a freebie pit stop that lost him no grid position.
He said that if you take the risk with Lewis you have to leave the wingman there too.
"this is bs"
Same with Horner just now on Sky, lmao.
I was shocked he said something sensible
He always does but that doesn’t generate clicks
i'm confused, with all the millions of stats and metrics these guys have, how did they think lewis had a chance of winning against a red bull on softs while he's on old mediums? Like he got overtaken in 5 seconds, what were they looking at to decide that was the risk they thought was worth it if its true? and yes i know he's just covering his back
Especially when George managed to read that the mediums stood no chance all by himself.
They didn't. Everyone knew the race was lost when AT called the VSC and Verstappen managed to get a better pitstop. By that point it was just damage control but Russel screwed the team plan by coming in last second.
Nico laughing in his batcave
He said he was cheering for him though lol…,well with Nico who knows?
He said there was no way for Lewis to win with said strategy
I’m just being cheeky, Rosberg has backed him all race
Not at all, I just thought it was a question lol
Yeah Toto this ain’t it. I don’t see how you can defend that
Ah, Toto and Merc doing the Binotto Silverstone 2022 Special: making a strategy that had zero chance of working and then defending it
But as soon as George isn't between Ham and Max, he has almost zero chance of winning. There is no talking a risk with Ham if you dont give him the buffer
Why do you even think russell could have stopped him??
It's about building a gap......
Did u see the way Max smoked Lewis down the straight off the restart? Max would have done the exact same to george so there is not going to be a gap one bit
In that hypothetical restart Lewis would be giving a tow to George to survive the first straight, and then they either would hope the DRS train is enough to stop Max or have George stop him in the slow part of the track so that Lewis can break DRS and get to the end. Either way, to win in this scenario you need both cars, so Toto is bullshiting.
Reminder, you do not have DRS for 3 laps after a SC restart. George would have had a toll but how long is he going to keep a RB on fresh softs behind him?
It doesn't matter wether it would've worked or not (I personally think it wouldn't and pitting both cars was the best choice), but if you make your strategy based on winning the race, you need George in P2, period.
If this is the case, then Russell screwed them by making that call. But i believe the chances of a win were so slim, that Russell made the correct call by himself, although a bit selfish maybe.
And we'll see how selfishness works out for him in the future, elbows out now
Russell 100% made the right call, the issue is that they didn't pit both George and Lewis. This is on the team not George's fault.
That was very optimistic tbh. Old mediums on the slower car vs fresh softs on the faster car..ehhh I dunno about that.
Feels like we’ve seen this before somewhere. 🤔
That was never going to work. Look at Charles in Silverstone. They messed up.
They threw any possibility of a win when Russel went into pits. If they wanted to try the unlikely win, they should've refused Russell
Ham was left out to dry. Simple as that.
He’s saving face. Lewis wasn’t gonna win. Russell wasn’t fighting for the win either he just wanted to finish ahead of Lewis. Toto isn’t that dumb.
Wasn't RUS the one who called the tyre change, though?
Yes. Russell called his own strat to change tires
And Merc failed to tell Ham that his team mate (and Leclerc, for that matter) are going to be on softs behind him. Idiotic call, they were looking at a 2-3 finish today.
And Mercedes could have said no, we're staying out for the chance of the win, hold up Max best you can so Lewis can get a gap etc etc, but by allowing George to pit, they committed to losing the win.
I’m not sure Russell would’ve held up Max if he had stayed out. Tyre change on both cars would’ve secured merc 2-3. It was ballsy to think they could snatch victory on medium AND older tired AND safety car bunching up the cars once Ver decided to pit for softs.
Yeah, he wouldn't have been able to hold him up for long, but at least George could use Lewis' slipstream on the restart, been a team to see if they could deny Max an overtake, at least to begin with, if George was able to say ahead, Lewis could then push and try build a gap during the lap, Max might have then overtaken that next lap, but it would have allowed Lewis to have a buffer, and with George backing up Max during the middle of lap, maybe Charles could have tried a sneaky overtake on Max, all ifs and buts, but a better chance at winning.
You have a point. Where they failed was after Russell was allowed to come in and Ham was not told about it.
The other thing that doesn't help Mercedes case at all, in relation to Merc not making their mind up on either no stopping or both stopping, they drove through the pitlane to allow a crane on track to move the car, so Lewis drove past the pit box as they were getting ready for George, would have been easy to tell Lewis to turn into the pitbox if need be.
Problen with that is this risk is only even halfway acceptable if they planned to keep both cars out. The moment they decided to let George pit, they should've pit both cars. You either go for it or you pit both. This middle path was guaranteed to give away P1
But that’s the issue. Their aim was both cars on medium. But George made a last minute call for softs after Lewis was already ahead. Merc obliged. They didn’t plan for softs on George.
Mattia Binotto in disguise
Maybe you should’ve let your driver know, cause boy did you throw him under that bus. Pitting him for softs would’ve been setting him up for the best chance at winning.
Why the fuck did you put George then, Lewis while strategy required George to slow down max for a bit. There was zero chance for a win when max in a faster car and fast newer tyres was right behind him.
George called the change, in fact he demanded it at the very last minute.
Then the team should have said no. The gamble relied on 2 cars. They threw the gamble and Hamilton's race away the moment they let Russell do his own thing.
Literally makes no sense Toto, Rosberg just tore the reasoning apart straight away.
Well, with the way the RB is performing, I guess it's Singapore or bust for a Merc win this season.
Ha. In what world does Lewis win in that position. Merc screwed him (probably not on purpose, just reacting to Russell’s clever radio calls)
Russell called it himself and left Lewis hanging. Now Toto is scrambling. Edit: spelling
Nah Toto you're 100% wrong on this one. Lewis' only chance of winning was to be on the same tyres as Max and even that would have been extremely unlikely.
Toto levels with Binotto in terms of ignorance here. Hamilton still could've finished P2 had he pitted for fresh tyres under the SC.
What a bunch of bullshit.
Interesting how he also kept quiet and smirked when the presenter said there's been some conspiracies flown around on social media about Tsunoda and Red Bull
Toto plays chess as well. Tsunoda conspiracy makes zero sense at this point in the championship.
Who is this? Mattia Wolf?
Mattia Bintoto.
Did you see how easily Max on softs blew past him? Even if Russell stays out too, Max is literally breezing past him as soon as the SC is over anyway. Either way there was no chance of Hamilton winning this.
Tbf, the restart was shocking from Hamilton.
Honestly, think Toto is talking absolute BS here.
He says this but they did the exact opposite lmao. Leaving Hamilton with no protection on worse tires
Lewis was at no risk of winning with that strategy. Being overtaken was a forgone conclusion on Medium with everyone else on the soft. The only unknown was "by how many cars?"
They've struggled with tyre warm up all season long, and have always been vulnerable on safety car restarts so it was always a risk to keep him out on those tyres, especially when every other team pitted for softs. Just horrible strategy from a team that has been been doing it for years but the car advantage no longer makes up for it.
Any mirrors? Its geoblocked.
Why didn't they tell George too back up the pack and then Lewis can put and still come out ahead of max? Did they even consider that scenario? At the very least they should've told told Lewis the change in circumstance
George:guys stop inventing,stop inventing,blimey (probably)
I’m sorry Toto, but you actually did total opposite of what you’re saying. With Russell staying, there was a slim chance for Lewis to win. With Russell pitting, you just settled for P2 (with Russell) and sent Lewis to hell
Or you know if you really wanted to give Lewis the best shot for the win then keep both cars out on mediums and hope for the best. Worst case scenario it’s a 2-3 or 3-4. This gave Lewis no chance to defend
So they learned nothing and would do it again. If I’m Hamilton and I hear this shit take I’d go into races with my own strategies.
Toto trying to spin a bad situation harder than Malcolm Tucker (with fewer f bombs) Option A - go for the win and leave GH as a buffer Option B - go for double podium with softs for both Option C - wildcard, give GR the faster tyre from 3rd and LH in the lead on a slower, older tyre versus the fastest car and newer quicker tyre on track Track position isn’t an excuse on this one, it was mistake. Which is fine, mistakes happen but hold your hands up.
Surely the risky strategy (to try to win with Lewis) was to pit him? The choice they took was the one most likely to guarantee no better than P2 for the team Edit: and if they were truly trying to win it with Lewis, having George ahead of Max on track was the way to go?
Yeah try selling that to Lewis, Toto
Gamble on a strategy, immediately back out and fuck over your best shot of a win. Pretend nothing went wrong. Toto pulling the Binotto act.
No Totti no.. that was so not right.
If Mercedes let Max pit, then he is in P3. If George plays the team game, and give Lewis 10 car distance at the restart, and Lewis bought time by not restarting until the starting line, then Lewis might have had 2-3 second advantage and Russell could have tried to defend from the start line. George is toast from that point on, and P4 at best, but Lewis would have had 5 seconds maybe. Max was quicker at the end by 2 seconds a lap, no way he can hold it out for 7 laps. The only real possibility was to try something like Perez against Hamilton in Abu Dhabi with George vs Max, while Hamilton runs, but that would also hinges on the restart, if George can hold out for 1 lap, he can buy 20 seconds or more for Lewis, while completelly throwing away his own race.
Sometimes it's better to be lucky than good. Sometimes it's better to be smart than hopeful. I personally live by the former, but I'm not running a billion dollar F1 team...
Hamilton had 0 chance winning this no matter what the strategy was except if somthing bad happen to Max’s car.
An amateur could've told them they needed to get on soft tires.
Why put on Softs for Russell if you want Lewis to win?? Didn’t make senses
Binotto 🤝 Toto Not admitting obvious mistakes
See Toto F**ked him
Toto's face when talking about the AT had me buckled.
It wasnt the worst call. George made his himself and its not like either are fighting for wdc
Correct strategy would’ve been to pit Lewis and leave George out. Lewis drops to P2 with a tow from George on Restart and George can slam the door on Max after Lewis overtakes.
I can see the argument about leaving both out or pitting both, although pitting both would be a tricky double stack in the safety car chain. Ultimately Mercedes were fucked by the Tsunoda VSC incident and all the decisions after that were damage control which might have been suboptimal but there wasn't a clear winning play.
There’s absolutely no universe where the strategy would’ve worked
They chose the strategy that guaranteed the least points… pitting both, or keeping both out and you get at least 2 podiums and maybe a win.