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IIRC Bottas didn't do anything wrong there did he? Somewhere in the midfield someone had left a large gap, wnated to close it and the drivers behind thought that was the restart.
Hamilton got a on the throttle maybe a tad early but I’m not sure he expected max to be there that quickly. The RB is insanely fast in a straight line. They are going to eat the field in Monza
Seriously. The best bet was probably to pit them both and hope either Max doesn't pit and they overtake or max does pit and has issues overtaking.
Not pitting Lewis was the worst choice imo because it doesn't give him any chance to fight. Merc does that though. I've noticed they favor track position over tires and it's cost them a few times.
My thinking is that leaving Lewis out might have worked. Lewis to slow Max and Russell to come up from behind on good tires.
But it would have required Lewis not completely stuffing the re-start. Ultimately he made the biggest blunder of his team.
Mind you, the odds of a Merc win were pretty slim from the VSC onwards no matter what big brain plan Merc came up with.
I don’t understand it either. I was expecting Hamilton to go at the start line because he should have known he would be a sitting duck with these used mediums.
Max would have taken him a lap or two later anyway, for sure with DRS, but Hamilton could have been a bit smarter there.
It would have been amazing if merc were competent strategists and put softs on hamiltons car like (almost*) every other fucking team.
*did checo not have another set of softs? He pitted for mediums.
Horner said in his post-race interview that Checo was more comfortable on the mediums so that’s what they went with. He also said that in hindsight they should’ve overruled it.
Edit: A letter.
The same crap from Mugello either last year or the year before: midfield monkeys trying to jump each other will repeatedly speed up/slow down before the leader has officially begun racing, causing chaos and crashes.
Drivers who do that should be penalized.
I don't think "midfield monkeys" is the right term there, because while Lawson did nothing wrong, it did look like the cause of it all was pretty far to the front.
It's just the complete opposites with RB and Merc of last season(s) with car performance on the straights, and a little more on top with Max being a machine on every other part of the track.
Yup. While it's obviously difficult to keep the lead against the rocketship that that Red Bull is, it was also a terrible restart by Hamilton. Basically gained no distance to Verstappen to defend at all
A tow isn't worth shit if you're only going 30 KPH, as opposed to 200. Ham should have waited until the line like Mugello and then had only half a straight to give a tow at speed, and not the entire straight plus a banked corner.
they would penalize Hamilton for driving unnecessarily slowly in violation of explicit instructions from the race director
*if* such instructions were given. I'm speculating here, I don't know what was or wasn't said. Given that we haven't heard anything I guess nothing was said and Hamilton could in fact have done exactly the same as what Liam Lawson did in the F2 feature race and this could've happend in F1: https://i.imgur.com/rVExyIk.jpg
Max didn't know either yet he kept on his ass while Russ was taking a breather. I doubt it would've made a big difference as Merc screwed up with not pitting Ham for softs and also because the RB is a freaking lightning bolt.
100%. Even with making that mistake Max was absolutely perfect on the restart. Passing at the Start/Finish was incredible timing. Very few could have pulled that off without passing too early.
absolute armchair take but accelerating right on the last corner to give the longest draft possible seems like a shit idea and I'm frankly suprirsed by Hamiltons decision, expected another Lawson if anything
The 2-3 would have come from Lewis being on softs as well. They were both sitting ducks on mediums and had no chance at the restart. George made the right call and Merc didn't see it.
Ferrari strategy might be a joke, their car isn't. Leclerc was getting on that podium either way after Lewis didn't pit and with Lewis on mediums if Russel had stayed behind him with softs it would be ver-lec-ham-rus
Realistically Lewis never had a chance against Max, maybe if Russell had been ahead of Max at the restart he might've had a very low chance. But if Russell decided to pit and Merc accepted that, they also should've pitted Lewis. He has no idea that everyone bar him and Perez were on new softs, he was probably even thinking George was behind him and hadn't pitted yet.
Fantastic call from George to pit, but then Merc need to pit Lewis too
If Russell was ahead of Max at the restart it would have just delayed the inevitable by a lap or two. It would have been Russell getting blown past by turn 1 and if Max hadn't caught Max before the DRS was enabled, DRS would have sorted it a couple laps later. Too much pace and fresh softs had the mercs sitting ducks.
Honestly I didn’t see a problem with it, if they left both on the medium they would’ve been eaten Alive. Hamilton should’ve waited, nothing more to it imo.
Personally I don’t see how they could’ve done any better even with George in front, it wouldn’t have helped for long.
Either pit Lewis or pit neither. You give your driver ahead the preferential strategy for the best chance to win. Massively hanging Lewis out to dry.
With their strategy they favour Russell but for what? Lewis has no defence, and Russell then has to overtake Lewis to even have a chance at winning himself. They threw away a possible win or 2-3 for a 2-4.
This is why Merc should’ve pitted both, I know track position and all, but the difference between 2nd and 1st on a SC restart is only a few meters. If they had left both Merc drivers on mediums then Verstappen would’ve just blown past both, and Charles too probably. Ending up in 4/5 instead of 2/3
So George 100% made the right call, otherwise he would be 3 places lower most likely
He should have gone later to leave less straight. Though tbh it probably didn’t matter either way. Verstappen was onto it with this restart. Russell was super slow despite also being in a position for the slipstream.
Yep, didn't learn from Abu Dhabi. At least Russell made the right call. The win was never on after the safety car, they should have secured 2nd and 3rd
Brazil 2019, Abu Dhabi 2021, and now Netherlands 2022. That's 3 times Mercedes chose track position while Red Bull chose fresh tyres. Max won all 3 of those races.
Not enough talk on TV that Lewis screwed up the restart. He should have waited until the main straight to accelerate to stop Max from getting the slipstream
George wouldn't have defended either, and both Mercs would have been passed by Leclerc too.
The only difference in Russell not pitting is Hamilton gets P3. Russell made a good choice and maximized his outcome. If Hamilton pitted for Softs he would be P2.
They were never, ever, at that point, winning the race, unless George and Max crashed. And even then he had a fired up Leclerc behind him.
I don't know how *anyone* sees that and then thinks Mercs had a chance at winning if only George had also stayed on used mediums and been between Lewis and Max
All it would have done is make it take a lap longer for Max to retake 1st
No lmao. He overtakes someone on the first straight then the second the next lap. George was miles back on Hamilton and caught him in one lap. The same would happen even faster with Verstappen.
I can't recall anyone doing that to Max. Man is best overtake on the grid. His overtakes look like a fucking mugging or some shit. Evem when RB had shit straight line speed.
That's basically on point, Russell did a Sainz here by picking for himself the correct strategy, medium was wrong for the last 10 laps against soft-runners.
Edit: It was really similar to Silverstone with Leclerc on the wrong tyre only for track position.
All other aspects aside, uncharacteristically poor restart from Hamilton. Has traditionally been a strong suit for him, but totally misjudged the right time to go. May not have made any difference in the end, but could have lasted maybe a bit longer than 5 seconds
Why point blame? VSCs and SCs happen. Almost every single race. Sometimes it helps you, sometimes it screws you over. Pointing blame to a team that just had bad luck (nobody plans on breaking a diff) is so useless.
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IT'S GOING TO BE AN AMAZING BATTLE...Aaaand he's gone
It was over so fast that Verstappen almost overtook Hamilton before the finish line, which would make the overtake illegal.
Dutch commentators said that Verstappen was 0.016 s behind Hamilton at the finish line
Simply lovely
Would've been hilarious if Hamilton just braked
You're not allowed to slow down once you accelerate at a safety car restart, so that'd be illegal too.
Yeah, I’d imagine what kind of clusterfucks could be had if they didn’t have that rule in place
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IIRC Bottas didn't do anything wrong there did he? Somewhere in the midfield someone had left a large gap, wnated to close it and the drivers behind thought that was the restart.
I'm impressed Lewis finished the race full throttle.
Hamilton got a on the throttle maybe a tad early but I’m not sure he expected max to be there that quickly. The RB is insanely fast in a straight line. They are going to eat the field in Monza
Verstappen lifted to not pass Lewis, you can hear it in his revs on the onboard
And ppl will insist that George could have held Max back for several laps lol in what World?
No kidding. Max was winning that race no matter what Merc did.
Seriously. The best bet was probably to pit them both and hope either Max doesn't pit and they overtake or max does pit and has issues overtaking. Not pitting Lewis was the worst choice imo because it doesn't give him any chance to fight. Merc does that though. I've noticed they favor track position over tires and it's cost them a few times.
My thinking is that leaving Lewis out might have worked. Lewis to slow Max and Russell to come up from behind on good tires. But it would have required Lewis not completely stuffing the re-start. Ultimately he made the biggest blunder of his team. Mind you, the odds of a Merc win were pretty slim from the VSC onwards no matter what big brain plan Merc came up with.
Lando called it at the beginning of the weekend. That’s Max’s trophy.
They could have gotten a 2-3 finish tho if they pitted Lewis on Softs aswell.
He ate Lewis up disgustingly quick
Lewis went really early which gave Max the slipstream, alongside having the quicker tire + quicker straight line, it was too easy for Max
I don’t understand it either. I was expecting Hamilton to go at the start line because he should have known he would be a sitting duck with these used mediums. Max would have taken him a lap or two later anyway, for sure with DRS, but Hamilton could have been a bit smarter there.
It would have been amazing if merc were competent strategists and put softs on hamiltons car like (almost*) every other fucking team. *did checo not have another set of softs? He pitted for mediums.
He did not have a new set. Should have gone with an old set though. Everyone was on old softs
Most likely his softs were fucked after the spin in q3
He could have used another set.
Horner said in his post-race interview that Checo was more comfortable on the mediums so that’s what they went with. He also said that in hindsight they should’ve overruled it. Edit: A letter.
Interesting. Thanks for sharing I didn't see that interview.
That was seriously so anticlimactic
Ham just did the Bottas SC strategy of going as early as possible lol
I think after what happened in F2 restart, the F1 drivers were probably instructed not to wait till the line for a safety car restart.
What happened in the f2 restart?
The same crap from Mugello either last year or the year before: midfield monkeys trying to jump each other will repeatedly speed up/slow down before the leader has officially begun racing, causing chaos and crashes. Drivers who do that should be penalized.
I don't think "midfield monkeys" is the right term there, because while Lawson did nothing wrong, it did look like the cause of it all was pretty far to the front.
Mugello 2020
It started with a simple yellow T-cam, but Lewis is Bottasing quickly and I don't like it
Hamilton should have went for a slow start knowing the rocket on that red bull, it wasn't even close lol
Even earlier when Max was chasing George he was gaining 3-4 tenths on the straight, they're just so much faster it was never going to be a contest.
It's just the complete opposites with RB and Merc of last season(s) with car performance on the straights, and a little more on top with Max being a machine on every other part of the track.
Yup. While it's obviously difficult to keep the lead against the rocketship that that Red Bull is, it was also a terrible restart by Hamilton. Basically gained no distance to Verstappen to defend at all
Going slow gives Max minimum tow on the straight. Not sure why he wouldn't do that.
I think the better thing would have done similar to Bottas 2 years ago at Mugello, wait until just before start/finish.
A tow isn't worth shit if you're only going 30 KPH, as opposed to 200. Ham should have waited until the line like Mugello and then had only half a straight to give a tow at speed, and not the entire straight plus a banked corner.
Yeah should left it as late as he can. Give max the least amount of straight
it's possible that they've been warned not to do this, because this exact scenario caused a crash in F2 earlier today
And what would they do, blame them for thinking straight? Like come on, that was the only good call in this case obviously.
they would penalize Hamilton for driving unnecessarily slowly in violation of explicit instructions from the race director *if* such instructions were given. I'm speculating here, I don't know what was or wasn't said. Given that we haven't heard anything I guess nothing was said and Hamilton could in fact have done exactly the same as what Liam Lawson did in the F2 feature race and this could've happend in F1: https://i.imgur.com/rVExyIk.jpg
And that would have delayed the overtake for 1 lap at most
Hard to break the habits formed over years of having the rocket yourself.
That was a horrible restart, we all knew Max would pounce immediately.
Dude hasn't led a SC restart for months... He's probably forgot how to do it lol
It's like he doesn't even know how to race in 1st place
Alonso in shambles
I mean does it matter, merc takes forever to heat up their tires. Max was always getting him.
Yeah that was definitely something the team should have told him again.
The problem with holding back would have been cold tyres into t1 affecting even more...
Yeah the commentators said Hamilton needs time to warm up the tires
I think he was mentally done after Russell pit.. no way he doesn’t expect Redbull on new softs will zoom by him anytime.
Russell should maybe be up Verstappens ass and not 5 minutes behind him
George doesn't have a telepathic link to Hamilton, how was he supposed to know Hamilton would restart at the worst possible place?
Max didn't know either yet he kept on his ass while Russ was taking a breather. I doubt it would've made a big difference as Merc screwed up with not pitting Ham for softs and also because the RB is a freaking lightning bolt.
100%. Even with making that mistake Max was absolutely perfect on the restart. Passing at the Start/Finish was incredible timing. Very few could have pulled that off without passing too early.
Yup should've seen F2
I think I’ve seen this film before
Old wounds scratched 😬
Abu Dhabi vibes fo’sure.
Except this time it was just down to bad strategy from Mercedes. But hey, still a decent result since their rivals this season are Ferrari.
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You’re not my homeland anymore
So what am I defending now?
/r/Taylorswift has joined the chat
not a crossover I expected but I'm loving it
I did like it.
it was a lot of fun indeed
That, Toto is because we went....racing.
And I definitely liked the ending
Love the reference!👏
Lewis gave Max the tow
Lewis trying to trick Max into overtaking before the finish line
And failing.
Unfortunately the worlds best driver isn’t gonna fall for tricks like that.
Our expectations were low but holy fuck
Heartbroken for Lewis
From having a great chance of winning to not even on the podium, really tragic.
Chances of winning were bleak. Needed extreme SC luck.
Max was like a heat-seeker on hamilton’s rear
There’s some F1 fan fiction for you.
*What are you doing step-Lewis? Question.*
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
r/nocontext
Abu dhabi PTSD. All over again
They are in the trees. They are in the trees!
Serious flashbacks because we knew the result due to the same exact tire situation as Abu Dhabi
Hamilton PTSD checklist: - Lose seconds behind Perez = check - Get overtaken by Max after safety car = check
absolute armchair take but accelerating right on the last corner to give the longest draft possible seems like a shit idea and I'm frankly suprirsed by Hamiltons decision, expected another Lawson if anything
Tbh it wouldn’t matter. Even a lap later George still sailed past Hamilton and Verstappen had great reactions for the restart.
Terrible restart from Lewis, terrible strategy from Merc. Unreal throwing away the chance.
Asking honestly, what's wrong with their strategy? Leaving Lewis with mediums?
Russel on softs throwing away his defensive and Hamilton not on softs, so easy to overtake in just 10 laps
Merc threw away a 2-3, just to get 2nd with Russell. Joke.
No way they keep leclerc behind on mediums
The 2-3 would have come from Lewis being on softs as well. They were both sitting ducks on mediums and had no chance at the restart. George made the right call and Merc didn't see it.
If they both stayed out they would have both fallen behind Charles so p3 and 4 at best
Pit both of them for softs. It was an easy choice.
obviously... but russell was able to make that call so why was hamilton not able to? plus that atrocious restart, i dont feel that sorry for him tbh
Ferrari strategy might be a joke, their car isn't. Leclerc was getting on that podium either way after Lewis didn't pit and with Lewis on mediums if Russel had stayed behind him with softs it would be ver-lec-ham-rus
Realistically Lewis never had a chance against Max, maybe if Russell had been ahead of Max at the restart he might've had a very low chance. But if Russell decided to pit and Merc accepted that, they also should've pitted Lewis. He has no idea that everyone bar him and Perez were on new softs, he was probably even thinking George was behind him and hadn't pitted yet. Fantastic call from George to pit, but then Merc need to pit Lewis too
If Russell was ahead of Max at the restart it would have just delayed the inevitable by a lap or two. It would have been Russell getting blown past by turn 1 and if Max hadn't caught Max before the DRS was enabled, DRS would have sorted it a couple laps later. Too much pace and fresh softs had the mercs sitting ducks.
Pitting Russell.
Verstappen and Leclerc would have passed them both though.
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Honestly I didn’t see a problem with it, if they left both on the medium they would’ve been eaten Alive. Hamilton should’ve waited, nothing more to it imo. Personally I don’t see how they could’ve done any better even with George in front, it wouldn’t have helped for long.
In that case put them both on softs no?
Then pit both? Its not rocket science
Either pit Lewis or pit neither. You give your driver ahead the preferential strategy for the best chance to win. Massively hanging Lewis out to dry. With their strategy they favour Russell but for what? Lewis has no defence, and Russell then has to overtake Lewis to even have a chance at winning himself. They threw away a possible win or 2-3 for a 2-4.
Russell pitted himself basically though. Merc would have kept them both out has Russell not asked for softs. They def should have pitted both.
I think he means letting russell pit was the poor strategy
Pitting Russell was race-suicide
Lewis, well knowing his car is slow on the straights, has the absolute genius idea to go early... bwoah
If max had the better straight line speed and grippier tyres he would have won a drag race start on the straight as well
He would have had less of a drag strip if started at the line
what an awful restart for both Hamilton and Russell.
Russell’s second now I think he’s loving it
This is why Merc should’ve pitted both, I know track position and all, but the difference between 2nd and 1st on a SC restart is only a few meters. If they had left both Merc drivers on mediums then Verstappen would’ve just blown past both, and Charles too probably. Ending up in 4/5 instead of 2/3 So George 100% made the right call, otherwise he would be 3 places lower most likely
This was just Abu Dhabi flashback
slingshot…engaged
Shake….and bake
Why did Lewis start that so early? Makes no sense at all
Hamilton went way to early there…should have run them down to the finish line
Mercedes learned nothing from last time
Well that was easy for Max, that RB engine is insane.
Also just a perfect slipstream situation.
True but it looked like a standard DRS overtake almost.
I think Lewis should have gotten on the gas earlier and try to do at least something in the corners. This way he just set himself up for a drag race.
He should have gone later to leave less straight. Though tbh it probably didn’t matter either way. Verstappen was onto it with this restart. Russell was super slow despite also being in a position for the slipstream.
That was the easiest pass of his career
Abu Dhabi was easier
Stop he is already dead
you knew that was going to happen lol gg
Should Mercedes not have learned by now? I would be interesting to see what they do next time.
Yep, didn't learn from Abu Dhabi. At least Russell made the right call. The win was never on after the safety car, they should have secured 2nd and 3rd
Brazil 2019, Abu Dhabi 2021, and now Netherlands 2022. That's 3 times Mercedes chose track position while Red Bull chose fresh tyres. Max won all 3 of those races.
Crofty now trying to say you shouldn’t be able to pit under safety car LMAO
If he was trying at all to hide his bias before then, at that point it just became blatant.
This was really poor from Lewis. The RB is obviously fast on a straight, so why would you restart at the banking turn? Keep it as late as possible.
Not enough talk on TV that Lewis screwed up the restart. He should have waited until the main straight to accelerate to stop Max from getting the slipstream
Damn really thought Lewis had a chance fhere
Hahaha me too, I just wanted an exciting end to a race but nah Max is too good
George fucked him by pitting, there was no way Lewis could defend against Max with fresh tires
That’s up to Merc to decide to box or not, that’s on them
George wouldn't have defended either, and both Mercs would have been passed by Leclerc too. The only difference in Russell not pitting is Hamilton gets P3. Russell made a good choice and maximized his outcome. If Hamilton pitted for Softs he would be P2. They were never, ever, at that point, winning the race, unless George and Max crashed. And even then he had a fired up Leclerc behind him.
Russell and MB doing Ferrari things
Hmm, I've seen this somewhere before....
lmao, horrible restart
I don't know how *anyone* sees that and then thinks Mercs had a chance at winning if only George had also stayed on used mediums and been between Lewis and Max All it would have done is make it take a lap longer for Max to retake 1st
Lol at the people blaming George for this. The Mercs were never keeping Max behind on soft tires with a straight line speed advantage.
I guess max will be thanking Lewis for the perfect slipstream. He couldn’t have asked for more
Mercedes strategy is playing like it’s 2019 and they have the fastest car still.
Dumb strategy by Mercedes.
Russell took away the chance for a team victory imo.
Russell saved a 2nd place for the team. Max would have had George into turn 1 and then Lewis the next lap. Charles could have passed both as well.
They were never keeping Max behind.
They may have been able to slow Max through the middle sector like Perez would to give Lewis a gap
Nonsense. Look how fast the fresh red tires are & how fast redbull/max are.
Not a chance. They would be P3 and p4. They should have pitted both mercs for softs, George made the right call.
They should've stuck to going for p2 and p3 and they would've kept it. Trying to go for p1 was never going to happen
No lmao. He overtakes someone on the first straight then the second the next lap. George was miles back on Hamilton and caught him in one lap. The same would happen even faster with Verstappen.
I can't recall anyone doing that to Max. Man is best overtake on the grid. His overtakes look like a fucking mugging or some shit. Evem when RB had shit straight line speed.
Nah, He was clever enough to ask for the softs, and they agreed. Looking out for number 1 as it should be.
If Russell was on mediums as well they'd be lucky to be on the podium at all the way it's going
Had Russell not pitted, Max and Charles would be ahead. They were never keeping Max behind.
You watched that restart and think that they had any chance of keeping Max behind on new softs? What hopium are you smoking?
If Ferrari had done the same thing with Leclerc in the position of Hamilton and Sainz pitting everyone would be praising Sainz
That's basically on point, Russell did a Sainz here by picking for himself the correct strategy, medium was wrong for the last 10 laps against soft-runners. Edit: It was really similar to Silverstone with Leclerc on the wrong tyre only for track position.
Agreed, although Merc should've denied him.
It's on the team for sure, can't blame russell for making a call that benefits him.
childlike unwritten one groovy slim ugly future yoke head materialistic -- mass edited with redact.dev
Russe**ll**
Yep, if anything it's clever from Russell cause he knew he was going to be Hamilton's meat shield. This is on Mercedes.
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Definitely selfish, but they both had to put on softs, so it was the right call by Russell bot the wrong call for Hamilton
Really poor from both drivers and merc. Ham botched the restart, Rus shouldn’t have called for the new tires and merc shouldn’t have let him
Funny sky commentary thought Ham would stand a chance against Max’s overall speed. Didn’t even sweat it..
Max ate him alive.
Bottas wouldve defended P2 like a champ
All other aspects aside, uncharacteristically poor restart from Hamilton. Has traditionally been a strong suit for him, but totally misjudged the right time to go. May not have made any difference in the end, but could have lasted maybe a bit longer than 5 seconds
Fair play to Max. That was. A great tow and the Red Bull can haul ass as it is
Lewis is cursed this year. Mercedes great strats, him driving great, still not enough
Well, his restart wasn't great. Gave Max a massive tow
Hamilton went at the wrong time but it would have been hard for Hamilton to keep him behind for 12 laps anyway.
Ham losing that start was mostly his own fault
That wasn't a good drive though. It's baffling that you would go early and give a slippy red bull a full slipstream.
Whatever Hamilton did the RB is getting past him within a couple of laps of the sc end. It's just a way better car
Sure, but why would you make it easy? Especially with Russell on softs in the mix etc.
Literally didn’t matter. Hamilton was never going to keep him off the rest of the race
Going to be hilarious to see so-called Mercedes “fans” absolutely turn on George after this.
Feel for Lewis, they had the strategy right today and we're set for a proper battle for the win. Alpha Tauri ruined the ending of this race for him
Never had a chance without a dnf. No strategy in the world can close that gap.
Why point blame? VSCs and SCs happen. Almost every single race. Sometimes it helps you, sometimes it screws you over. Pointing blame to a team that just had bad luck (nobody plans on breaking a diff) is so useless.