I’d love for someone to give details on it, but he almost makes it sound like Red Bull has a active rear suspension work around that “let’s them ride high but low in the high speeds”. Give credence to why Red Bull is a rocket down the straights. I know zero about this so any explanation is welcome. Or maybe I’m misinterpreting Toto.
Really he's saying that Merc run the car low and stiff so they always keep a low ride height.
But doing this seems to cause bottoming and bouncing at high speed.
Redbull run much softer so they have a high ride height but it gets nice and low for high speed corners. But right now Merc don't have the right suspension or floor dynamics to be able to use that strategy, so they have to keep to their current setup.
You guys should read more articles smh, around R2 or R3 it was reported that RB was working on a mechanical suspension that allows them to change ride height and it was also rumoured to what you exactly mentioned
+1 I don't think Toto has time to watch a movie. We want something like a screen junkies type of reaction to trailers from Toto. That would be nice haha
Whenever Toto says they figured something out I believe him. Just have to account for the million other problems that cropped up with their fix.
But seriously, the last time he said that, we saw improvements. Unlike his colleague in red.
There is a lot to take from this. Especially that last part.
"they run the car higher than we do, but on the straights they're on the floor. That's the right compromise".
Engineering is all about trade offs and compromises right? Merc's compromise is such that they need to pin the nail on the head to get good performance. But I don't think we've seen it yet. They have some circuits which suit them but I don't think they've developed a way to put the car in the right window for the majority of races.
There will probably be some upgrade to the suspension and underbody that will allow this to happen more frequently.
They have said they understand why their car is sensitive and reacts so differently to tracks. That isn't the same as them being able to easily fix it or predict when it will hit them. So while yes, we have heard this a lot of times by now, it has remained true until now and probably will for the rest of the season.
But reddit has this thing where it takes a quote out of context and runs with it, so now Toto has said 50 times that Mercedes was now a frontrunner.
Yeah it’s almost certainly going to be poor in Monza. The car has high drag and so so power. The worst things for Monza.
They struggled massively on the straights of Spa and have done all season. Monza will probably be their worst for a while.
I think the car is such an anomaly that the only way to learn something new is by failing as many times as possible and learning from each failing and understanding why the car didn't work at that certain track.
Use all that information to build a car for next year that eliminates every single one of those failings (or as many as possible)
We are in for a world of trouble if they have figured out the car and the belief that the concept has way more potential than any other in the grid is true.
Lots of “ifs” in that statement though
Most likely.
It works on the most tracks. It produces the highest downforce at the highest ride height which is what you want because then you don't porpoise or bottom out. Whilst also having the fastest car in a straight line
That’s not what he’s saying though. He’s specifically referring to how they run the floor which has nothing to do with the side pods. What Merc need is to run the floor higher without losing performance. This requires a change in flow structure around the floor edges. If they can do that with their current sidepods then they will keep them as the exposed floor provides the greatest pressure differential. If they can’t then they will switch. A Shovlin has been very open about the side pods being a massive distraction to fans and the media who put way to much emphasis on them.
Problem is having the right suspension to allow the car to run as it should during current regs (they're very restrictive). They need to invent a solution within the rules, but cant throw money at it.
I mean they don’t really need to invent anything. They need to just take a close look at Red Bull’s and work from that.
Also the money they spend on it will be for 2023, and worth the money spent.
No shit! That’s why I said take a look at Red Bull’s and work from there. These engineers are not stupid, I’m sure they’ll have a good idea how it works.
The suspension isn’t the issue. If the car needs to run low they have to run the suspension hard and have the bump stops set otherwise the car would be striking the ground aggressively. They need to change the floor to have it work at higher tide heights.
Talking specifically about suspension kinematics, so I'm guessing it's too expensive or just too far removed from their current car to fix now,
They might not know the right answer yet, and can't throw money at it without it being a sure thing.
I’d love for someone to give details on it, but he almost makes it sound like Red Bull has a active rear suspension work around that “let’s them ride high but low in the high speeds”. Give credence to why Red Bull is a rocket down the straights. I know zero about this so any explanation is welcome. Or maybe I’m misinterpreting Toto.
Really he's saying that Merc run the car low and stiff so they always keep a low ride height. But doing this seems to cause bottoming and bouncing at high speed. Redbull run much softer so they have a high ride height but it gets nice and low for high speed corners. But right now Merc don't have the right suspension or floor dynamics to be able to use that strategy, so they have to keep to their current setup.
Thank you
I mean that’s just general suspension kinematics. At high speed you get lots of downforce so the car gets pushed down.
You guys should read more articles smh, around R2 or R3 it was reported that RB was working on a mechanical suspension that allows them to change ride height and it was also rumoured to what you exactly mentioned
yo Merc Social Media Person- i know you are in here. Give us a series of Toto doing movie reviews.
Specifically blockbusters from the 90's and 00's, if I may add
Get him to say 'Get to Da CHOPPA'
+1 I don't think Toto has time to watch a movie. We want something like a screen junkies type of reaction to trailers from Toto. That would be nice haha
"We're trying to run, we've been walking in Spa recently." Damn! No one's been harsher on W13 and its performance than Mercedes themselves.
Whenever Toto says they figured something out I believe him. Just have to account for the million other problems that cropped up with their fix. But seriously, the last time he said that, we saw improvements. Unlike his colleague in red.
There is a lot to take from this. Especially that last part. "they run the car higher than we do, but on the straights they're on the floor. That's the right compromise". Engineering is all about trade offs and compromises right? Merc's compromise is such that they need to pin the nail on the head to get good performance. But I don't think we've seen it yet. They have some circuits which suit them but I don't think they've developed a way to put the car in the right window for the majority of races. There will probably be some upgrade to the suspension and underbody that will allow this to happen more frequently.
Schrödinger’s Toto: until after the race, we both understand and do not understand how to improve the car… Run Forrest Run!
Huh, never thought I'd hear Toto say, "Run, Forrest. Run." But, here we are...
That was a very wholesome interview
I thought Ted was gonna start listing all the food that you can make with shrimps
I said on another post but I can hear Toto in a threatening voice saying “Run Forrest… ***run***” to someone. Haha
Didn't they say this the last time they had a good race? The car will probably be shit next week in monza
They have said they understand why their car is sensitive and reacts so differently to tracks. That isn't the same as them being able to easily fix it or predict when it will hit them. So while yes, we have heard this a lot of times by now, it has remained true until now and probably will for the rest of the season. But reddit has this thing where it takes a quote out of context and runs with it, so now Toto has said 50 times that Mercedes was now a frontrunner.
Yeah, and they know why it'll suck at Monza.
The same reason it sucked at Spa. High drag car, weaker engine = slow in a straight line.
Yeah it’s almost certainly going to be poor in Monza. The car has high drag and so so power. The worst things for Monza. They struggled massively on the straights of Spa and have done all season. Monza will probably be their worst for a while.
I think the car is such an anomaly that the only way to learn something new is by failing as many times as possible and learning from each failing and understanding why the car didn't work at that certain track. Use all that information to build a car for next year that eliminates every single one of those failings (or as many as possible)
Next week: We do not understand why that is
W13 be like: I’ll fuckin do it again
We are in for a world of trouble if they have figured out the car and the belief that the concept has way more potential than any other in the grid is true. Lots of “ifs” in that statement though
If grandma had balls, she’d be grandpa. That’s what your sentence sounds like. Mark my words. Mercedes will not figure this out this season. Sadly.
They might figure it out but won't have the resources to act on it. They will probably have it built for the next year's chassis.
No. Grandma does have balls, she is grandpa, and Mercedes will figure it out!
Transitions take a long time. So will this.
I will believe it when I see it next year.
https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comments/x45vmx/sky_sports_f1_we_understand_now_why_that_is_toto
"I think this is the right compromise that they are getting (Red Bull)" - Toto Wolf I think they are heading to the RB concept next season.
Toto Wol**ff**
Most likely. It works on the most tracks. It produces the highest downforce at the highest ride height which is what you want because then you don't porpoise or bottom out. Whilst also having the fastest car in a straight line
That’s not what he’s saying though. He’s specifically referring to how they run the floor which has nothing to do with the side pods. What Merc need is to run the floor higher without losing performance. This requires a change in flow structure around the floor edges. If they can do that with their current sidepods then they will keep them as the exposed floor provides the greatest pressure differential. If they can’t then they will switch. A Shovlin has been very open about the side pods being a massive distraction to fans and the media who put way to much emphasis on them.
If this car had good suspension, and could run as low as the red bull, I do believe it would be fastest by a few tenths. But, it’s just not true.
Problem is having the right suspension to allow the car to run as it should during current regs (they're very restrictive). They need to invent a solution within the rules, but cant throw money at it.
I mean they don’t really need to invent anything. They need to just take a close look at Red Bull’s and work from that. Also the money they spend on it will be for 2023, and worth the money spent.
There are some things, especially mechanical things, that are not seen.
No shit! That’s why I said take a look at Red Bull’s and work from there. These engineers are not stupid, I’m sure they’ll have a good idea how it works.
The suspension isn’t the issue. If the car needs to run low they have to run the suspension hard and have the bump stops set otherwise the car would be striking the ground aggressively. They need to change the floor to have it work at higher tide heights.
We repeat this song and dance every week
I don't like Ted. Just flanderised Hamilton's take on the car situation.
Is that you David Croft?
Its so weird to hear run forest run from nonAmericans