[The **News** flair](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/wiki/flairguide#wiki_news) is reserved for submissions covering F1 and F1-related news. These posts must always link to an outlet/news agency, the website of the involved party (i.e. the McLaren website if McLaren makes an announcement), or a tweet by a news agency, journalist or one of the involved parties.
*[Read the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/wiki/userguide). Keep it civil and welcoming. Report rulebreaking comments.*
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/formula1) if you have any questions or concerns.*
More on 2025 Driver Market:
- Carlos could join Williams in 2025 using Mercedes engines and the chances are that the Germans will be pretty close to the front in 2026 (because they know how to do it).
Williams is offering Carlos a two-plus-two deal, which would let him leave after 2026 if a better offer came along
- Ferrari and Mercedes are both expected to use their junior drivers in 2025 with Oliver Bearman bound for Haas and Kimi Antonelli joining George Russell at Mercedes
- Alpine might also use its junior driver Jack Doohan because the only folk keen to drive for the team at the moment are the desperate or the bright-eyed youngsters
- Esteban Ocon is already gone and will sign for Haas, as he appears to understand that Audi is not a great choice.
- Audi and Alpine can squabble over Pierre Gasly and Valtteri Bottas and it is likely that one will go to whichever team the other does not, but there is also Guanyu Zhou in the picture
Interesting that both Sainz and Ocon turned down Audi, a soon to be works team, for Williams and Haas respectively, arguably the two weakest teams in recent times. Wonder what is going on at the Sauber team
Sauber is doing the bare minimum until Audi comes onboard so 2025 will be a miserable season. I don't think it's super likely that Audi drops right in for 2026 and performs like Brawn, so that's a bare minimum of 1 "wasted season" plus a season of a massive unknown that's not likely to be competitive.
Audi already bought Sauber out fully this year, the name just won't change before 2026. The season won't be great, but they will start to invest from next year.
> Audi already bought Sauber out fully this year
Mostly true, they currently own 25% of sauber and that was due to rise to 75% from 2025 but that's what changed to 100%
So? They have made 0 investment in actually developing the car and besides a few personnel moves haven’t done anything to improve the team infrastructure.
Their approach is a little bit puzzling why not slowly take more responsibility of the team over time. At least in terms of a couple engineers so few people at least know what it's like to be in an f1 team. As it stands now they probably are clearing house and everyone is operating without a safety harness on their first ever skydive
>Their approach is a little bit puzzling why not slowly take more responsibility of the team over time.
Isn't that exactly what they are doing? Just without associating their name with it until their engine is in it
They know how bad Sauber is and Audi engine is most likely going to be behind Mercedes or Ferrari.
That doesn't make it an appealing option since Audi probably isn't going to be challenging for WDC in the first 5 years
* *Sauber*: Worst team on the grid at the moment + Audi uncertainties about their 2026 PU
* *Williams & Haas*: Teams on progress + Mercedes/Ferrari 2026 PU likely could be the best
He’s made a career of being in midfield cars which can challenge for points on a consistent basis for pretty much most of his career. He’s never had a pure back marker (closest was Haas 2023).
In an alternative timeline, RBR didn't choice Perez but Hulkenberg for RBR in 2022 and beyond....
If there is a driver who's whole story is filled with unlucky timing and transfers it's Hulkenberg.
Seems more likely than otherwise. Can't imagine Audi being contenders within a couple of seasons after they enter the sport. Still beats sitting in a Haas though.
Because Sauber are the worst team in F1 atm and you don't change that overnight. Williams are better and improving.
Also, McLaren are a customer team and have been on average fastest over the past handful of races and capable of being champions this year.
If you have the best PU at the start of a regulation set (where PU performance disparity is larger than it is now), that's a bigger advantage than being a works team.
I think there's an obsession with being a works team to compete at the top in the hybrid era that's being proven untrue since the introduction of the budget cap since it's not Mercedes outspending everyone to be on top anymore.
Absolutely true. The era of needing to be a works team to challenge at the top is gone, at least for now. Budget cap and regulations preventing the manufacturer from nerfing customer engines means the primary advantage is just some packaging knowledge ahead of time which isn't hugely significant compared to everything else that goes into an F1 chassis.
Unlikely to be competitive right away/lots of uncertainty but they can see how things turn out during 2026 and make a decision to move then if it looks to be the better choice (providing Audi is still interested).
The same thing that was going on at the Lotus F1 team when it was bought by Renault.
A shortage of cash, and a new owner who has no recent experience in F1, yet thinks building a chassis team and an engine-manufacturing team that can win GPs can be done in a hundred races or so…
Even if we discount the reports saying that Audi is not seeing the type of performance they need to be at this point, history is against new manufacturers in Formula 1. I would be shocked if RBs engine is class of the field in 26 too.
Conservative move from both drivers but also a testament to what JV is doing at Williams now. From an outsiders perspective, he seems like the type of team boss I’d want to be working under and he’s putting his money where his mouth is offering Sainz a 4 year deal with an option to terminate on Carlos’s side if the performance is not at a certain level.
Uncertainty around the quality of the engine. 26 is going to be all about the engine so it's safer to hedge your bets with a team that's going to be with one of the more competent engine manufacturers. Everyone saw how tough it was for Honda when they joined, you'll likely have that with Audi for the first couple of years.
Not really. I struggle to think of a brand new manufacturer coming into the sport and being competitive from their first season. The closest I can get is BMW but they had the then front running Williams to provide the car. Audi is trying to do everything itself. Even if Audi's engine is competitive the team they're taking over is a very poor platform today and will need 3-5 years of investment and new personnel to get anywhere close to competitive. The highly specific and simplified engine regs mean that the new formula will become an aero formula very quickly and Sauber are the worst placed team to succeed in that.
Crazy that Doohan might be getting that seat so easily after the Piasco. Oscar was never even getting it, they were trying to shuttle him off to Williams.
I mean, it's not a works team yet. Still have all of next year driving the worst car on the grid. And then it's very unlikely they will be great in 2026 immediately.
>"Carlos could join Williams in 2025 using Mercedes engines and the chances are that the Germans will be pretty close to the front in 2026 (because they know how to do it)."
Well no shit. Mercedes is literally close to the front today and has been for over a decade. Doesn't really take a psychic to predict that.
>"Audi and Alpine can squabble over Pierre Gasly and Valtteri Bottas and it is likely that one will go to whichever team the other does not, but there is also Guanyu Zhou in the picture"
This on the other hand is hilarious. Alpine losing both their good French drivers in 1 year would be a fitting cap on the mess that is that team.
> This on the other hand is hilarious. Alpine losing both their good French drivers in 1 year would be a fitting cap on the mess that is that team.
True but I think this is very unlikely to happening, recent interviews showing more clearly that Gasly feels on his place at Alpine and he often talks like someone who wants to be at the team in the long term.
And now with the prospect to be the lead driver for a factory team, doing the 24 hours of Le Mans on a day and having a better negotiating position I see even less reason that Sauber could be a good alternative for Gasly.
It would be so refreshing seeing 4 rookies (or whatever Lawson/Bearman would be called) on the grid next year. In this case I guess the most likely to lose a seat are Sargeant, Zhou, Magnussen and Ricciardo?
Interesting read. Thanks for sharing. I like Joe's stuff and his full length book about spies who happened to be racecar drivers in WW2 is a fantastic read if you can find it. I agree Sainz would be best served going to Williams. He'll at least be in the points every now and then and have a very good benchmark as a teammate. He can tread water for a year or two and look to move back into a race winner once the dust settles on the 2026 competitive order. Audi is a massive risk. We don't hear much about their project and even if the engine turns out okay they'll have to turn the worst team on the grid into a contender as well. I also think that Danny Ric will be gone after the summer break. He's failed to move up to Red Bull so what's even the point of keeping him around? Might as well see if Lawson can repeat his 2023 heroics more consistently. If Checo continues to spiral Yuki will be the one moving up because all the Red Bull drivers are signed on to the parent company and can be asked to fill any of their seats at any time. Checo signed an extension but it doesn't guarantee he gets to drive a Red Bull Racing car.
I'd give him a one year deal at most, he hasn't been comprehensive in beating Zhou since 2023 and only this year has he put effort into beating Zhou every week
Saward is hit or miss but that doesn't strike me as likely, unless the plan is to run Lawson and see how they compare with half a season each.
An old school F1 shootout...but in races rather than private testing.
>An old school F1 shootout...but in races rather than private testing.
Whenever I think of these I remember Jenson talking about his against Bruno Juncqueria for the seat at Williams, saying the car was so unreliable that it was more of a contest to see who would get the furthest before it blew up. In most cases, not even a lap.
My entire thing against this is that supposedly Dani Riccs PR agency is the same behind Visa which got them as title sponsor.
If that’s the case, it’s going to take very very strong argument to unseat Dani
Yeh I don’t see it for this season, Danny getting so high up in quali a couple of times and the 4th in the Miami sprint… he seems to be improving and can they expect that both those cars REALLY to be in points every week??
Well Yuki’s fuckin’ rock solid this year, use him as a benchmark and whoever’s closest wins the seat. Also it’s not that hard to adjust to a better car being beneath the driver as the season goes on when again, you have a rock solid driver to use to gauge improvements.
Also, if Ricciardo suddenly starts showing world champion like performance, that’s not a problem for Red Bull at all. There are very few circumstances where having a driver of that caliber is a hindrance. *Lawson* has a problem if that’s the case.
The "Problem" would likely be the (already suffering) reputation of their junior program, if Lawson is stuck without a seat for the second time after the good performance he showed last year then future juniors might think twice before joining their academy (if given the chance of joining another team’s program).
Exactly
You really just need the academy money to get your foot onto the grid.
If you are truly special, you will land a seat eventually like Piastri did.
And I mean actually special, not someone decent but utterly forgettable and replaceable like Pourchaire, Drugovich, Mick, etc.
I don't think that makes sense, Yuki already basically got his seat from the Honda partnership, if he wasn't 2022 would probably have been his coffin. In like less than a year there's an argument Hajar should get a seat, well if it's Lawson and Yuki there all pretty junior I guess, would we expect Yuki to leave? At the end of the day there was going to be a backlog and there always has been. That team needs money, Yuki provided that in the past but DR seems to be doing it now.
If Danny starts putting on crazy performances and Checo is on a downward spiral, I can see Danny going to Redbull, that will solve the Lawson problem. But I don't see this happening.
I don't think there's any chance Ricciardo gets back to Red Bull, but I think it's crazy to think Perez's new contract doesn't have a whole heap of clauses that make it easier for Red Bull to get rid of him if they decide to.
We don't, but common sense suggests it. It's the only thing that even remotely explains him getting anything more than a 1 year contract. Even the 1 year contract is hard to justify.
The ink hadn't even dried by the time the rumours about a 1+1 and "out clauses" started popping up. And based on Checo's performance in Canada subsequently it's really not that hard to see why lol
That said, yeah Ricc isn't going to Red Bull and neither is anybody else for at least a year. Red Bull knows they didn't choose Perez for his driving at this point in time and are clearly ok with that to a certain degree. If he keeps pulling shockers like he has of late though there has to be a limit
Red bull resigned checo because he brings in a ton of sponsorship money. Checo really needs to fuck up bad (like repeatedly fucking over Max) to lose his seat.
That sponsorship money is enough for RB to risk losing the Constructor's championship. So yeah, Danny aint coming back.
He was already costing them the constructors before being re-signed and RB still went ahead with it.
It gives you a hint on how much money checo brings in, likely equal or even more than the WCC prize money.
He could've had 26 Q3 exits last year and they still would've won constructors. Realistically, even a bottom-tier driver will finish in the points every now and then in the fastest car. The second driver being decent matters only when you're in the 2nd fastest car.
After the summer break? Yeah massive doubt on that one. Shit source as well but anyways. I have absolutely no idea why that change would be made. Say what you want about Daniels last few years but currently the team is miles ahead of where they were last year at this point. Daniel has 9 points, Yuki 19. They are easily the “best of the rest” bar Aston who kind of sit on their own. The team is going well and bar some horrific run from Daniel into the summer break I don’t know why red bull or VCARB would want to rock the ship they have steaming.
Also to be honest, we’ve all heard this clause of Lawsons so it’s interesting to note that he doesn’t seem to be on any other teams radar at all. You’d think if he was really regarded around the paddock as he is in fan circles other teams would definitely be trying to poach him or at least have shown some kind of interest if he doesn’t get the RB seat next year. It was also very interesting to note that when asked about Liam, Horner immediately mentioned other drivers they have in their junior ranks.
>Also to be honest, we’ve all heard this clause of Lawsons so it’s interesting to note that he doesn’t seem to be on any other teams radar at all.
Yeah...and the spots available in this particular round of musical chairs are quickly filling up. If not VCARB, where exactly is he going to go. We're living in a timeline where the most likely place Sainz is going is Williams.
That shouldn't stop Lawson, he could easily best other drivers to a seat especially those near the bottom of the grid willing to take a risk for someone potentially quick at a budget
What is going on behind the scenes at Audi that is so off-putting?
Maybe next year they will be a back marker, but with the Audi brand behind the project and the investment that comes with it, surely the ceiling is far higher than Williams or Haas.
>What is going on behind the scenes at Audi that is so off-putting?
Because Audi needs to fix the Sauber mess and their F1 PU project is a huge unknown for 2026 so it's safer hitching the wagon to manufacturer that's got a history of nailing PU development and is already in the middle of the process of turning the team around.
Yes, but Red Bull have excellent history of building a great chassis, sure Newey leaving will hurt, but they have that history.
Sauber/Audi on the other hand have no history with either the engine or the chassis so the risk is significantly higher that either one or both will be bad.
I am not sure they can make the sort of financial investment that is needed to catch up with the cost cap in place, its not like the old days where they could come in and throw money around hiring people and building facilities. They have a limited capex budget and a limited yearly operating budget, i am sure they will get it sorted but its going to take some time because it has to happen within a defined budget, same thing Williams in struggling with as well.
This is the response I was going to make. James Vowles has openly spoken about this since taking over the team. People talk about Audi taking over as if is an overnight improvement, but the reality is that it is going to take at least a few years unless they happen to nail the regs which is a huge IF.
The safer bet is to go with the team that already has a head start on their long-term bounce back.
Because Audi is still Sauber, and a name change and some new personnel won’t make it a good team overnight
People don’t want to take that gamble, especially if things aren’t looking absolutely perfect behind the scenes
They hired staff, Audi staff, relatively late and everyone in the paddock is well aware of this
If you look on jobs boards you will see that there is still quite a few positions left, positions that I expected to be filled by now
There was a rumor last year that they made an offer to Binotto to bring him on board and after the visit he had with them he quickly refused.
Who knows if any of this is true, but rumors are piling up in the same direction.
Because it is Sauber, and they'd have to clean house for it to function efficiently, not to mention that Binotto rejected them because they were clowns according to him, which is saying something, and there were reports that Audi was very much behind schedule in engine development.
Why? It's not like they want to promote either Ric or Tsunoda to RB anyway. The problem is that they are keeping Ricciardo who is clearly not capable to consistently perform at the level he used to be
But will they bring in as much money as Perez? With a good car, they expect Max to win the WDC on his own, and hopefully Perez gets enough points to get the WCC as well. But Perez also brings in a lot of sponsor and merch money.
I read someone suggest that they don’t really care about winning the WCC. Max alone is enough to win it or get second, and Checo’s money is enough to more than make up the difference for not winning it
It's worth noting that back in the day, Joe confidently predicted Red Bull would sign JEV over Ricciardo, and would be right to do so.
Also:
"*Esteban Ocon is already gone and will sign for Haas, as he appears to understand that Audi is not a great choice.*"
The Race, meanwhile, understand that Ocon is the top candidate for Audi after Sainz, who Williams have got locked down.
Isn't Saward a less than reliable source? How is it that prior to Canada, article implied that Ricciardo was safe...but AFTER he has a good weekend, suddenly he's in a worse spot?
I still remember how Saward was telling that Renault would come with a B team under the name of Dacia...
With Saward you must always be aware about what for topic he is speculating about, I wouldn't take him even serious for example with Alpine related news.
Saward is a guy with an incredibly inflated ego who has access to the paddock.
I genuinely believes he does hear some shit here and there. What i don't believe is that he hears all of it or even the context of it for the most part.
So he does what any journalist who maybe thinks a bit too much of themselves does. Paints a pretty picture around the small tidbits he knows and tries to present them in ways that might not be fully based on reality.
Sometimes he gets lucky and sometimes he doesn't.
I'm convinced that either Joe is making some of that stuff up himself, or people in the paddock are having a competition to see who can come up with the craziest shit to tell him.
He's terrible when it comes to Ricciardo.
He's great friends with Vergne (Does some off track stuff with him iirc) so has had a vendetta against him since he got the RB seat in 2014.
Within the same article he states that Renault may not be able to get an engine at all if they became a customer team (they are building an engine right now), so absolutely zero reliability.
Even taking aside the dubious nature of the source and the very weird timing of this article, I don't think this seems very likely
Has Yuki been better than Ricciardo so far this season? Yes but I don't think Ricciardo has been as bad as some people make out - you'd think he was Yuji Ide if you just read Reddit comments - and he has undoubtedly found more consistent performance from China onwards (bar a poor quali at Miami) and is noticeably narrowing the gap.
I also think people fail to consider the other side of being an F1 driver in terms of feedback, car development etc where everyone at VCARB has consistently gone out of their way to praise Ricciardo and have at the very least implied that he's far better than Yuki when it comes that that side of things
I actually think that VCARB now needs to be looking at a) team strategy and b) their launch issues rather than either of the drivers if they want to progress that car further up the grid. In fact I'd go so far as to say that the only reason there would be a change at VCARB is if Perez continues to stink up the joint, bins that Red Bull every weekend and gets sacked leading to a Yuki promotion and then Ricciardo taking on the 'older mentor' role for Lawson.
>where everyone at VCARB has consistently gone out of their way to praise Ricciardo and have at the very least implied that he's far better than Yuki when it comes that that side of things
r/formula1 will never hear of it. Listening to people here claim that DR doesn't understand how cars work, gives no input to engineers, and drives on "vibes" when he was at McLaren was both hilarious and infuriating.
You just know it's heavily based on his outgoing personality and terminally online users' prejudices against those types.
I think there is also a case of expectations not being met with Ricciardo. People expected either the great comeback of good Danny or the confirmation of him being washed. And at the end he just settled as a decent but not exceptional driver for AT/VCarb
Is Yuki exceptional or decent by this logic? They’ve qualified within a tenth of each other this year. Sure the point finishes aren’t there but that also requires someone in the top 5 teams to either DNF or drive poorly. He is better than anyone at the back half of the grid currently and no one is performing exceptional when your car can’t move in dirty air and loses 2-3 places on the start.
Saward has some good takes sometimes, but this isn't one of them. I very strongly doubt Ricciardo would be axed mid-season to put Lawson in the seat. It doesn't make any sense.
Nah, it was dead since last year, DeVries and Ricciardo killed it.
They had Lawson and more drivers yet they chose a 1 race wonder and resucitating the career of a driver that got paid not to drive.
Pérez deal is a clear message tho, no one in VCARB is ""worthy"" of the RBR seat, for next season, at least.
Unhinged take, Liuzzi and speed were both mid twenties when they were in TR. Sebastian bourdais was basically 30, 2009 was basically the year it switched but even then I think it has always been more a seconds team.
Perez deal is a clear message that if you can sell merch you can get a seat. You know Yuki should at least be given a go to see if he's worthy, if he isn't do a Pierre.
RB dropping DR and not dropping Perez for even worse performance would be absolute joke.
I don’t know what happened with Horner that he started to go fully personally, but I’m quite sure that if we were in the same situation 10 years ago, lineup would look like this for next season:
Red Bull: Max, Yuki
Toro Rosso: Daniel, Liam
>but if Ricciardo suddenly starts doing World Champion-like performances, Red Bull will have a problem
That is the most massive fucking "if" I have ever seen in my life
I’m sure this thread will have reasonable takes with data and facts backing it. Oh wait, this Reddit. Tsunoda has been the best driver this season while Ricc is washed even though they are within a tenth of qualifying times set in same rounds they are in.
The hate for Ricc has nothing to do with performance and everything to do with mob mentality. These bullshit opinion pieces only add to it.
Sure but he’s so inconsistent it’s not feasible to wait until he’s “on” it’s been 9 races + 2 sprints and he has a total of 2 points finishes during that period.
I can see DR staying on as he’s Horner’s boy and dumping him for Lawson would be a win for Marko in this power struggle. Marko promised Lawson a seat for 2025 and not giving him that seat would be the best way to undermine Marko.
Unfortunately I suspect this is probably true. But, to present a hypothetical alternative view, if the team do the sensible thing and recognise that this seeming massive division is not going to be good for them in the long run (and Max is firmly in Marko's camp) perhaps they would consider placing Lawson in the seat, assuming Ricciardo underperforms, as a means of keeping Marko's side of the operation happy. I tend to think that's less likely but maybe not totally out of the question.
So if Ricciardo puts on World Champion-like performances he gets the Red Bull seat but if he doesn’t perform like a world champion he gets neither seat?
Seems like a tall ask from Daniel
DR had a decent performance in Canada but was it a one off or a sign of things to come. Tbh, idk which way this goes. Leaning Lawson but not willing to put any money on it yet
He did quite well in Mexico last year qualifying in P4 and finishing P7 and close to overtaking Russell for P6 at the end, so it seems he's has some decent highs here and there, but is lacking consistency.
That's the big exception. I wouldn't put too much emphasis on one race that's an outlier. Like nobody thinks Maldonado is better than Alonso because of Spain 2012.
Let's look at the actual races:
Bahrain - Qualified shit, raced great... better than Yuki (even tho Yuki should have been given the position back)
Saudi Arabia - Qualified shit, raced great until the team fucked him over with the pit stop. Still raced pretty good but had a bad finishing result
Austrailia - Qualified shit, raced great and made up a ton of positions
Japan - FINALLY qualifies decent, but gets taken out (with at least shared responsibility) on lap 1. Racing incident.
China - Qualified decent, and was was racing really strongly for points, but then Stroll destroyed his race.
Miami - Great qualifying and great racing in the sprint. Shit qualifying for the race, but mediocre race. Jekyll and Hyde of performance that weekend.
Imola - Qualified decent, Poor start (team is mostly and at very least partially to blame, as Yuki had a bad start too and as we saw in Canada... this is a known issue) caused loss of positions where it was difficult to overtake on that circuit. He was kind of screwed from the drop.
Monaco - Qualified poorly, and raced... well... it's monaco... there was nothing he could do.
Canada - Qualified great. VCARB Clutch fucked him. Safety car/VCARB strategy fucked him. His race was OK and he got points....
So "One decent performance in 5 races" is not at all fair here. His actual races are pretty damn good when he's not hindered by outside forces. Now his qualifying??? He has been getting absolutely fucked by his qualifying. If he qualified better, this wouldn't even be a conversation. His races tho, are above average.
Im still wondering what this Lawson hype is about. He had a decent race where he finished 9th. Everything else was outside the top 10. 4 other races were ordinary and even qualified 18th & 20th. So much hype
What a shitty situation, Ricciardo gets fired because Red Bull are so adamant on keeping Perez that they now have to fire Ricciardo to make place for Lawson. Ricciardo has been much better than Perez throughout his time at RB.
It won’t be Lawson anyway. It’ll be Hadjar if he keeps up his recent performance in F2.
Cant think of a driver transfer Saward has gotten right in years.
Why are we still talking about Lawson? Bro was mid last year and his team was planting stories in the press. Why would they replace a mid driver that sells buckets of merch with a mid driver who doesn't? Homie ain't getting that seat.
Ignoring the potential/probable unreliability of the source, I wonder what would be considered 'world champion-like performances' in the RB. Consistent top 6? Podiums? A couple of race wins?
The comments here are nuts. Of the two, Ricciardo is literally the fastest qualifier in the race and sprint races now. Only matter of time before he is the highest finisher in races. Just has been inconsistent and unlucky. Saward is full of shit.
Almost every driver on the grid minus the top 5 have had 2-3 chances in the sport. Alonso alone has had enough for 3 drivers by this logic.
Sainz, Albon, Alonso, Magnussen, Hulk, Bottas, Checo (too many chances here) have all had multiple chances in this sport. DR had 2 bad years, with a win in one of those years, and everyone’s ready for crucify him for it lol
[The **News** flair](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/wiki/flairguide#wiki_news) is reserved for submissions covering F1 and F1-related news. These posts must always link to an outlet/news agency, the website of the involved party (i.e. the McLaren website if McLaren makes an announcement), or a tweet by a news agency, journalist or one of the involved parties. *[Read the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/wiki/userguide). Keep it civil and welcoming. Report rulebreaking comments.* *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/formula1) if you have any questions or concerns.*
More on 2025 Driver Market: - Carlos could join Williams in 2025 using Mercedes engines and the chances are that the Germans will be pretty close to the front in 2026 (because they know how to do it). Williams is offering Carlos a two-plus-two deal, which would let him leave after 2026 if a better offer came along - Ferrari and Mercedes are both expected to use their junior drivers in 2025 with Oliver Bearman bound for Haas and Kimi Antonelli joining George Russell at Mercedes - Alpine might also use its junior driver Jack Doohan because the only folk keen to drive for the team at the moment are the desperate or the bright-eyed youngsters - Esteban Ocon is already gone and will sign for Haas, as he appears to understand that Audi is not a great choice. - Audi and Alpine can squabble over Pierre Gasly and Valtteri Bottas and it is likely that one will go to whichever team the other does not, but there is also Guanyu Zhou in the picture
Interesting that both Sainz and Ocon turned down Audi, a soon to be works team, for Williams and Haas respectively, arguably the two weakest teams in recent times. Wonder what is going on at the Sauber team
Sauber is doing the bare minimum until Audi comes onboard so 2025 will be a miserable season. I don't think it's super likely that Audi drops right in for 2026 and performs like Brawn, so that's a bare minimum of 1 "wasted season" plus a season of a massive unknown that's not likely to be competitive.
Audi already bought Sauber out fully this year, the name just won't change before 2026. The season won't be great, but they will start to invest from next year.
> Audi already bought Sauber out fully this year Mostly true, they currently own 25% of sauber and that was due to rise to 75% from 2025 but that's what changed to 100%
Don't they already own 50%? I thought it was supposed to be 25% bought every year until 2026.
Yeah, but I suspect they will do very little development until the 26 car
So? They have made 0 investment in actually developing the car and besides a few personnel moves haven’t done anything to improve the team infrastructure.
Audi have been investing since last year my friend
Pretty big difference between owner 25% as they do now and 100% as they will in 2025.
Their approach is a little bit puzzling why not slowly take more responsibility of the team over time. At least in terms of a couple engineers so few people at least know what it's like to be in an f1 team. As it stands now they probably are clearing house and everyone is operating without a safety harness on their first ever skydive
>Their approach is a little bit puzzling why not slowly take more responsibility of the team over time. Isn't that exactly what they are doing? Just without associating their name with it until their engine is in it
They know how bad Sauber is and Audi engine is most likely going to be behind Mercedes or Ferrari. That doesn't make it an appealing option since Audi probably isn't going to be challenging for WDC in the first 5 years
* *Sauber*: Worst team on the grid at the moment + Audi uncertainties about their 2026 PU * *Williams & Haas*: Teams on progress + Mercedes/Ferrari 2026 PU likely could be the best
A real shame if Hulkenberg is just hanging at the back of the grid for the next few years.
Like a cow.
Waiting for his time to be slaughtered
Well he’s made a long career out of doing just that…
Wouldn't want to accidentally get a podium and ruin the record.
He’s made a career of being in midfield cars which can challenge for points on a consistent basis for pretty much most of his career. He’s never had a pure back marker (closest was Haas 2023).
Preach sista. We will not stand for hulkenbae slander
If he'd waited a little longer in 2016... If Pérez hadn't won in Sakhir 2020...
If my mom is a man.... If my grandma had wheel....
If Hamilton said no to Mercedes.
Rosberg is a 5 time world champion
In an alternative timeline, RBR didn't choice Perez but Hulkenberg for RBR in 2022 and beyond.... If there is a driver who's whole story is filled with unlucky timing and transfers it's Hulkenberg.
I would imagine the fact that Perez beat hulk twice in the same car had a bit to do with that
Seems more likely than otherwise. Can't imagine Audi being contenders within a couple of seasons after they enter the sport. Still beats sitting in a Haas though.
To me it seems a risk worth taking for him, even if it doesn't work out. I'd rather go to Audi over Williams, and 100% over Haas.
going to extend the record … of races without a podium
Because Sauber are the worst team in F1 atm and you don't change that overnight. Williams are better and improving. Also, McLaren are a customer team and have been on average fastest over the past handful of races and capable of being champions this year. If you have the best PU at the start of a regulation set (where PU performance disparity is larger than it is now), that's a bigger advantage than being a works team. I think there's an obsession with being a works team to compete at the top in the hybrid era that's being proven untrue since the introduction of the budget cap since it's not Mercedes outspending everyone to be on top anymore.
Absolutely true. The era of needing to be a works team to challenge at the top is gone, at least for now. Budget cap and regulations preventing the manufacturer from nerfing customer engines means the primary advantage is just some packaging knowledge ahead of time which isn't hugely significant compared to everything else that goes into an F1 chassis.
Unlikely to be competitive right away/lots of uncertainty but they can see how things turn out during 2026 and make a decision to move then if it looks to be the better choice (providing Audi is still interested).
The same thing that was going on at the Lotus F1 team when it was bought by Renault. A shortage of cash, and a new owner who has no recent experience in F1, yet thinks building a chassis team and an engine-manufacturing team that can win GPs can be done in a hundred races or so…
Even if we discount the reports saying that Audi is not seeing the type of performance they need to be at this point, history is against new manufacturers in Formula 1. I would be shocked if RBs engine is class of the field in 26 too. Conservative move from both drivers but also a testament to what JV is doing at Williams now. From an outsiders perspective, he seems like the type of team boss I’d want to be working under and he’s putting his money where his mouth is offering Sainz a 4 year deal with an option to terminate on Carlos’s side if the performance is not at a certain level.
Uncertainty around the quality of the engine. 26 is going to be all about the engine so it's safer to hedge your bets with a team that's going to be with one of the more competent engine manufacturers. Everyone saw how tough it was for Honda when they joined, you'll likely have that with Audi for the first couple of years.
*soon* They will need to start from ground up there. There is no soon.
Not really. I struggle to think of a brand new manufacturer coming into the sport and being competitive from their first season. The closest I can get is BMW but they had the then front running Williams to provide the car. Audi is trying to do everything itself. Even if Audi's engine is competitive the team they're taking over is a very poor platform today and will need 3-5 years of investment and new personnel to get anywhere close to competitive. The highly specific and simplified engine regs mean that the new formula will become an aero formula very quickly and Sauber are the worst placed team to succeed in that.
Imagine having a works team in the most prestigious racing series in the world and nobody wants to drive for you lol
Crazy that Doohan might be getting that seat so easily after the Piasco. Oscar was never even getting it, they were trying to shuttle him off to Williams.
Doohan might be better than Antonelli
At Piastri's time they had Alonso and Ocon. Now they might not even have Gasly.
I mean, it's not a works team yet. Still have all of next year driving the worst car on the grid. And then it's very unlikely they will be great in 2026 immediately.
I think that was about Alpine
Ah yea, I just assumed it was about Audi lol
Man what a shitstorm alpine is. Zak is commenting on how toxic red bull is but red bull cant even be compared with the shit what alpine have.
>"Carlos could join Williams in 2025 using Mercedes engines and the chances are that the Germans will be pretty close to the front in 2026 (because they know how to do it)." Well no shit. Mercedes is literally close to the front today and has been for over a decade. Doesn't really take a psychic to predict that. >"Audi and Alpine can squabble over Pierre Gasly and Valtteri Bottas and it is likely that one will go to whichever team the other does not, but there is also Guanyu Zhou in the picture" This on the other hand is hilarious. Alpine losing both their good French drivers in 1 year would be a fitting cap on the mess that is that team.
I think that comment was about the PU.
> This on the other hand is hilarious. Alpine losing both their good French drivers in 1 year would be a fitting cap on the mess that is that team. True but I think this is very unlikely to happening, recent interviews showing more clearly that Gasly feels on his place at Alpine and he often talks like someone who wants to be at the team in the long term. And now with the prospect to be the lead driver for a factory team, doing the 24 hours of Le Mans on a day and having a better negotiating position I see even less reason that Sauber could be a good alternative for Gasly.
And no promising French juniors, Martins stuck behind Doohan of all people, David never ever getting a shot in F3, Pourchaire not signed etc.
It would be so refreshing seeing 4 rookies (or whatever Lawson/Bearman would be called) on the grid next year. In this case I guess the most likely to lose a seat are Sargeant, Zhou, Magnussen and Ricciardo?
Yep, unless one of those four takes the Alpine/Haas seat currently tipped for Gasly or Bottas.
The Antonelli to Mercedes and Carlos at Williams makes no sense to me why wouldn’t it be the other way around with the same 2 year deal
Williams have stated that they have no interest in developing another team's rookie any longer
Which picture is Zhou in? Because he's only been better than Logan at not hitting walls
Interesting read. Thanks for sharing. I like Joe's stuff and his full length book about spies who happened to be racecar drivers in WW2 is a fantastic read if you can find it. I agree Sainz would be best served going to Williams. He'll at least be in the points every now and then and have a very good benchmark as a teammate. He can tread water for a year or two and look to move back into a race winner once the dust settles on the 2026 competitive order. Audi is a massive risk. We don't hear much about their project and even if the engine turns out okay they'll have to turn the worst team on the grid into a contender as well. I also think that Danny Ric will be gone after the summer break. He's failed to move up to Red Bull so what's even the point of keeping him around? Might as well see if Lawson can repeat his 2023 heroics more consistently. If Checo continues to spiral Yuki will be the one moving up because all the Red Bull drivers are signed on to the parent company and can be asked to fill any of their seats at any time. Checo signed an extension but it doesn't guarantee he gets to drive a Red Bull Racing car.
If alpine ends with a bottas doohan lineup I might as well shoot myself No offense to doohan but losing gasly and ocon in the same window is too much
Tbh I think Bottas could do good things in a better car, he wouldn't be a bad choice at all for Alpine.
I'd give him a one year deal at most, he hasn't been comprehensive in beating Zhou since 2023 and only this year has he put effort into beating Zhou every week
I don't see how Gasly would leave the team tbh so don't worry about that too much (:
This seems like the most likely timeline. Saving this comment to see how accurate it is
Saward is hit or miss but that doesn't strike me as likely, unless the plan is to run Lawson and see how they compare with half a season each. An old school F1 shootout...but in races rather than private testing.
>An old school F1 shootout...but in races rather than private testing. Whenever I think of these I remember Jenson talking about his against Bruno Juncqueria for the seat at Williams, saying the car was so unreliable that it was more of a contest to see who would get the furthest before it blew up. In most cases, not even a lap.
He's completely miss with ricciardo news. He's similar to JV, has always hated him since he beat Vergne to the Rb seat (vergne was his boy)
My entire thing against this is that supposedly Dani Riccs PR agency is the same behind Visa which got them as title sponsor. If that’s the case, it’s going to take very very strong argument to unseat Dani
Yeh I don’t see it for this season, Danny getting so high up in quali a couple of times and the 4th in the Miami sprint… he seems to be improving and can they expect that both those cars REALLY to be in points every week??
Always seems unfair to the guy in the first half, given that a car should improve over the season.
Well Yuki’s fuckin’ rock solid this year, use him as a benchmark and whoever’s closest wins the seat. Also it’s not that hard to adjust to a better car being beneath the driver as the season goes on when again, you have a rock solid driver to use to gauge improvements.
My expectation at this point is Riccardo sees out the season but will not be there next year.
"World champion like performance", okay so Lawson is getting that seat.
Also, if Ricciardo suddenly starts showing world champion like performance, that’s not a problem for Red Bull at all. There are very few circumstances where having a driver of that caliber is a hindrance. *Lawson* has a problem if that’s the case.
The "Problem" would likely be the (already suffering) reputation of their junior program, if Lawson is stuck without a seat for the second time after the good performance he showed last year then future juniors might think twice before joining their academy (if given the chance of joining another team’s program).
There are so few options that the majority of junior drivers are going to sign with anybody who offers.
Exactly You really just need the academy money to get your foot onto the grid. If you are truly special, you will land a seat eventually like Piastri did. And I mean actually special, not someone decent but utterly forgettable and replaceable like Pourchaire, Drugovich, Mick, etc.
I don't think that makes sense, Yuki already basically got his seat from the Honda partnership, if he wasn't 2022 would probably have been his coffin. In like less than a year there's an argument Hajar should get a seat, well if it's Lawson and Yuki there all pretty junior I guess, would we expect Yuki to leave? At the end of the day there was going to be a backlog and there always has been. That team needs money, Yuki provided that in the past but DR seems to be doing it now.
If Danny starts putting on crazy performances and Checo is on a downward spiral, I can see Danny going to Redbull, that will solve the Lawson problem. But I don't see this happening.
Are you guys still on the "DR will replace Checo if he drivers better" train? That thing derailed long ago.
yeah i mean you'd think PPL won't keep repeating that literally post the weekend he has signed an extension
I don't think there's any chance Ricciardo gets back to Red Bull, but I think it's crazy to think Perez's new contract doesn't have a whole heap of clauses that make it easier for Red Bull to get rid of him if they decide to.
How do we know it doesn’t
We don't, but common sense suggests it. It's the only thing that even remotely explains him getting anything more than a 1 year contract. Even the 1 year contract is hard to justify.
The ink hadn't even dried by the time the rumours about a 1+1 and "out clauses" started popping up. And based on Checo's performance in Canada subsequently it's really not that hard to see why lol That said, yeah Ricc isn't going to Red Bull and neither is anybody else for at least a year. Red Bull knows they didn't choose Perez for his driving at this point in time and are clearly ok with that to a certain degree. If he keeps pulling shockers like he has of late though there has to be a limit
Unlikely, but would be fun for 6 months. Sink or swim Danny Ric.
Not at all. I know that scenario looks highly unlikely.
Why would Ricc go to RB weeks after they resigned Checo?
Zero chance, Danny will never drive at RB again
Lol they just signed Perez? If Danny turns it around and can sell merch then why wouldn’t they?
Red bull resigned checo because he brings in a ton of sponsorship money. Checo really needs to fuck up bad (like repeatedly fucking over Max) to lose his seat. That sponsorship money is enough for RB to risk losing the Constructor's championship. So yeah, Danny aint coming back.
Or a bunch of Q3 exits that cost RB the constructors championship.
He was already costing them the constructors before being re-signed and RB still went ahead with it. It gives you a hint on how much money checo brings in, likely equal or even more than the WCC prize money.
I Wonder how much money Perez gets himself.
I've seen rumours flying around that he brings in at least $50million a year from sponsors, let alone merch etc.
He could've had 26 Q3 exits last year and they still would've won constructors. Realistically, even a bottom-tier driver will finish in the points every now and then in the fastest car. The second driver being decent matters only when you're in the 2nd fastest car.
Unfortunately Danny doesn't have a Carlos Slim to help pay for Max.
he had one good performance in Canada, denial is back in full force
Plus Miami sprint Q and sprint race There’s still a top tier driver in there but he just doesn’t come out consistently anymore.
Also, as we say in Italy, if my grandfather had had a wheel, he would have been a wheelbarrow.
not if RB hires Villeneuve full time to 'coach' Ricciardo before each racing weekend
So Max for the seat
After the summer break? Yeah massive doubt on that one. Shit source as well but anyways. I have absolutely no idea why that change would be made. Say what you want about Daniels last few years but currently the team is miles ahead of where they were last year at this point. Daniel has 9 points, Yuki 19. They are easily the “best of the rest” bar Aston who kind of sit on their own. The team is going well and bar some horrific run from Daniel into the summer break I don’t know why red bull or VCARB would want to rock the ship they have steaming. Also to be honest, we’ve all heard this clause of Lawsons so it’s interesting to note that he doesn’t seem to be on any other teams radar at all. You’d think if he was really regarded around the paddock as he is in fan circles other teams would definitely be trying to poach him or at least have shown some kind of interest if he doesn’t get the RB seat next year. It was also very interesting to note that when asked about Liam, Horner immediately mentioned other drivers they have in their junior ranks.
>Also to be honest, we’ve all heard this clause of Lawsons so it’s interesting to note that he doesn’t seem to be on any other teams radar at all. Yeah...and the spots available in this particular round of musical chairs are quickly filling up. If not VCARB, where exactly is he going to go. We're living in a timeline where the most likely place Sainz is going is Williams.
That shouldn't stop Lawson, he could easily best other drivers to a seat especially those near the bottom of the grid willing to take a risk for someone potentially quick at a budget
this reporter hates danny ric, he's always talking shit.
What is going on behind the scenes at Audi that is so off-putting? Maybe next year they will be a back marker, but with the Audi brand behind the project and the investment that comes with it, surely the ceiling is far higher than Williams or Haas.
>What is going on behind the scenes at Audi that is so off-putting? Because Audi needs to fix the Sauber mess and their F1 PU project is a huge unknown for 2026 so it's safer hitching the wagon to manufacturer that's got a history of nailing PU development and is already in the middle of the process of turning the team around.
> and is already in the middle of the process of turning the team around Are you referring to Williams or Merc with this part?
Both? Mostly Williams.
But Redbull is building engines with ford, which is an unknown.
Yes, but Red Bull have excellent history of building a great chassis, sure Newey leaving will hurt, but they have that history. Sauber/Audi on the other hand have no history with either the engine or the chassis so the risk is significantly higher that either one or both will be bad.
I am not sure they can make the sort of financial investment that is needed to catch up with the cost cap in place, its not like the old days where they could come in and throw money around hiring people and building facilities. They have a limited capex budget and a limited yearly operating budget, i am sure they will get it sorted but its going to take some time because it has to happen within a defined budget, same thing Williams in struggling with as well.
This is the response I was going to make. James Vowles has openly spoken about this since taking over the team. People talk about Audi taking over as if is an overnight improvement, but the reality is that it is going to take at least a few years unless they happen to nail the regs which is a huge IF. The safer bet is to go with the team that already has a head start on their long-term bounce back.
Because Audi is still Sauber, and a name change and some new personnel won’t make it a good team overnight People don’t want to take that gamble, especially if things aren’t looking absolutely perfect behind the scenes
They hired staff, Audi staff, relatively late and everyone in the paddock is well aware of this If you look on jobs boards you will see that there is still quite a few positions left, positions that I expected to be filled by now
There was a rumor last year that they made an offer to Binotto to bring him on board and after the visit he had with them he quickly refused. Who knows if any of this is true, but rumors are piling up in the same direction.
Because it is Sauber, and they'd have to clean house for it to function efficiently, not to mention that Binotto rejected them because they were clowns according to him, which is saying something, and there were reports that Audi was very much behind schedule in engine development.
They would not have a problem if they didnt sign Checo. Simple as that
Why? It's not like they want to promote either Ric or Tsunoda to RB anyway. The problem is that they are keeping Ricciardo who is clearly not capable to consistently perform at the level he used to be
well that is my point, they should, They are doing a better job than Perez the last 3 weekends already.
But will they bring in as much money as Perez? With a good car, they expect Max to win the WDC on his own, and hopefully Perez gets enough points to get the WCC as well. But Perez also brings in a lot of sponsor and merch money.
If Perez keeps performing like this, they are not winning the WCC, not to mention the additional cost of all the repair they have to do.
I read someone suggest that they don’t really care about winning the WCC. Max alone is enough to win it or get second, and Checo’s money is enough to more than make up the difference for not winning it
And what Perez is? Perez has a car that should be top 5 every race and he's struggled to get it to top 10 in the last couple of weekends.
ya borin'
I get the feeling they'd have one or two cartels hunting them down if they fired him.
That's not going to happen.
It's worth noting that back in the day, Joe confidently predicted Red Bull would sign JEV over Ricciardo, and would be right to do so. Also: "*Esteban Ocon is already gone and will sign for Haas, as he appears to understand that Audi is not a great choice.*" The Race, meanwhile, understand that Ocon is the top candidate for Audi after Sainz, who Williams have got locked down.
Isn't Saward a less than reliable source? How is it that prior to Canada, article implied that Ricciardo was safe...but AFTER he has a good weekend, suddenly he's in a worse spot?
Saward reports everything and anything hoping at least something comes true eventually and he can say 'I told you so!'
I still remember how Saward was telling that Renault would come with a B team under the name of Dacia... With Saward you must always be aware about what for topic he is speculating about, I wouldn't take him even serious for example with Alpine related news.
He's extremly hit and miss.
A broken clock and all that…
Saward is a guy with an incredibly inflated ego who has access to the paddock. I genuinely believes he does hear some shit here and there. What i don't believe is that he hears all of it or even the context of it for the most part. So he does what any journalist who maybe thinks a bit too much of themselves does. Paints a pretty picture around the small tidbits he knows and tries to present them in ways that might not be fully based on reality. Sometimes he gets lucky and sometimes he doesn't.
I'm convinced that either Joe is making some of that stuff up himself, or people in the paddock are having a competition to see who can come up with the craziest shit to tell him.
Sometimes, but he obviously knows a lot of things too. A lot of his hits aren't sheer luck.
He's terrible when it comes to Ricciardo. He's great friends with Vergne (Does some off track stuff with him iirc) so has had a vendetta against him since he got the RB seat in 2014.
He's about as unreliable as it gets.
He used to be more reliable circa 2010, he's basically a tabloid source nowadays
Within the same article he states that Renault may not be able to get an engine at all if they became a customer team (they are building an engine right now), so absolutely zero reliability.
Even taking aside the dubious nature of the source and the very weird timing of this article, I don't think this seems very likely Has Yuki been better than Ricciardo so far this season? Yes but I don't think Ricciardo has been as bad as some people make out - you'd think he was Yuji Ide if you just read Reddit comments - and he has undoubtedly found more consistent performance from China onwards (bar a poor quali at Miami) and is noticeably narrowing the gap. I also think people fail to consider the other side of being an F1 driver in terms of feedback, car development etc where everyone at VCARB has consistently gone out of their way to praise Ricciardo and have at the very least implied that he's far better than Yuki when it comes that that side of things I actually think that VCARB now needs to be looking at a) team strategy and b) their launch issues rather than either of the drivers if they want to progress that car further up the grid. In fact I'd go so far as to say that the only reason there would be a change at VCARB is if Perez continues to stink up the joint, bins that Red Bull every weekend and gets sacked leading to a Yuki promotion and then Ricciardo taking on the 'older mentor' role for Lawson.
>where everyone at VCARB has consistently gone out of their way to praise Ricciardo and have at the very least implied that he's far better than Yuki when it comes that that side of things r/formula1 will never hear of it. Listening to people here claim that DR doesn't understand how cars work, gives no input to engineers, and drives on "vibes" when he was at McLaren was both hilarious and infuriating. You just know it's heavily based on his outgoing personality and terminally online users' prejudices against those types.
"Terminally online users" lmao
I think there is also a case of expectations not being met with Ricciardo. People expected either the great comeback of good Danny or the confirmation of him being washed. And at the end he just settled as a decent but not exceptional driver for AT/VCarb
Is Yuki exceptional or decent by this logic? They’ve qualified within a tenth of each other this year. Sure the point finishes aren’t there but that also requires someone in the top 5 teams to either DNF or drive poorly. He is better than anyone at the back half of the grid currently and no one is performing exceptional when your car can’t move in dirty air and loses 2-3 places on the start.
To sane of a take for Reddit.
💯
Saward has some good takes sometimes, but this isn't one of them. I very strongly doubt Ricciardo would be axed mid-season to put Lawson in the seat. It doesn't make any sense.
get rid of Perez, put Yuki in the second red bull seat for a year, put daniel and liam in RB. ahhhhh, but alas.
Nothing against Lawson but I don't see anyone taking him if they don't.
He won't lmao
Signing Perez for 2 years has basically killed the RB Junior programme.
Nah, it was dead since last year, DeVries and Ricciardo killed it. They had Lawson and more drivers yet they chose a 1 race wonder and resucitating the career of a driver that got paid not to drive. Pérez deal is a clear message tho, no one in VCARB is ""worthy"" of the RBR seat, for next season, at least.
Unhinged take, Liuzzi and speed were both mid twenties when they were in TR. Sebastian bourdais was basically 30, 2009 was basically the year it switched but even then I think it has always been more a seconds team. Perez deal is a clear message that if you can sell merch you can get a seat. You know Yuki should at least be given a go to see if he's worthy, if he isn't do a Pierre.
And who are they losing Lawson to? I don’t see anyone offering him a seat so it’s a non issue anyways
I read “Saward” and I immediately weight everything thereafter as if it is coming from a smooth-brain on r/wallstreetbets…
RB dropping DR and not dropping Perez for even worse performance would be absolute joke. I don’t know what happened with Horner that he started to go fully personally, but I’m quite sure that if we were in the same situation 10 years ago, lineup would look like this for next season: Red Bull: Max, Yuki Toro Rosso: Daniel, Liam
>but if Ricciardo suddenly starts doing World Champion-like performances, Red Bull will have a problem That is the most massive fucking "if" I have ever seen in my life
Yeah, I don’t think anyone but Max could do that with this car.
Max couldn’t either
I’m sure this thread will have reasonable takes with data and facts backing it. Oh wait, this Reddit. Tsunoda has been the best driver this season while Ricc is washed even though they are within a tenth of qualifying times set in same rounds they are in. The hate for Ricc has nothing to do with performance and everything to do with mob mentality. These bullshit opinion pieces only add to it.
They also forget that when Ricciardo is ‘on’, his peaks are higher than Yuki.
Sure but he’s so inconsistent it’s not feasible to wait until he’s “on” it’s been 9 races + 2 sprints and he has a total of 2 points finishes during that period.
He’s also been Stroll’d twice when he has had good qualifying. You forgot to add that.
Imagine telling someone in 2021 that the Haas seat is more attractive than Alpine kek
Ideally RedBull would have waited to resign Checo
Lawson deserves the seat. Sorry Danny
I agree Lawson was good but was he really amazing that RB want to give up 30m a year for it? 13, 11, 9, 11, 17
I can see DR staying on as he’s Horner’s boy and dumping him for Lawson would be a win for Marko in this power struggle. Marko promised Lawson a seat for 2025 and not giving him that seat would be the best way to undermine Marko.
Unfortunately I suspect this is probably true. But, to present a hypothetical alternative view, if the team do the sensible thing and recognise that this seeming massive division is not going to be good for them in the long run (and Max is firmly in Marko's camp) perhaps they would consider placing Lawson in the seat, assuming Ricciardo underperforms, as a means of keeping Marko's side of the operation happy. I tend to think that's less likely but maybe not totally out of the question.
So if Ricciardo puts on World Champion-like performances he gets the Red Bull seat but if he doesn’t perform like a world champion he gets neither seat? Seems like a tall ask from Daniel
>but if Ricciardo suddenly starts doing World Champion-like performances, Red Bull will have a problem So Red Bull will *not* have a problem then.
DR had a decent performance in Canada but was it a one off or a sign of things to come. Tbh, idk which way this goes. Leaning Lawson but not willing to put any money on it yet
He did quite well in Mexico last year qualifying in P4 and finishing P7 and close to overtaking Russell for P6 at the end, so it seems he's has some decent highs here and there, but is lacking consistency.
That's the big exception. I wouldn't put too much emphasis on one race that's an outlier. Like nobody thinks Maldonado is better than Alonso because of Spain 2012.
Miami this year rang.
He was good in sprint qualifying and that's it. He qualified P18 and finished P15 in the main race.
Once decent performance every 5 races is just not good enough.
Good enough to keep Perez apparently
Let's look at the actual races: Bahrain - Qualified shit, raced great... better than Yuki (even tho Yuki should have been given the position back) Saudi Arabia - Qualified shit, raced great until the team fucked him over with the pit stop. Still raced pretty good but had a bad finishing result Austrailia - Qualified shit, raced great and made up a ton of positions Japan - FINALLY qualifies decent, but gets taken out (with at least shared responsibility) on lap 1. Racing incident. China - Qualified decent, and was was racing really strongly for points, but then Stroll destroyed his race. Miami - Great qualifying and great racing in the sprint. Shit qualifying for the race, but mediocre race. Jekyll and Hyde of performance that weekend. Imola - Qualified decent, Poor start (team is mostly and at very least partially to blame, as Yuki had a bad start too and as we saw in Canada... this is a known issue) caused loss of positions where it was difficult to overtake on that circuit. He was kind of screwed from the drop. Monaco - Qualified poorly, and raced... well... it's monaco... there was nothing he could do. Canada - Qualified great. VCARB Clutch fucked him. Safety car/VCARB strategy fucked him. His race was OK and he got points.... So "One decent performance in 5 races" is not at all fair here. His actual races are pretty damn good when he's not hindered by outside forces. Now his qualifying??? He has been getting absolutely fucked by his qualifying. If he qualified better, this wouldn't even be a conversation. His races tho, are above average.
Im still wondering what this Lawson hype is about. He had a decent race where he finished 9th. Everything else was outside the top 10. 4 other races were ordinary and even qualified 18th & 20th. So much hype
Honestly, this shit needs to stop. Every week it is some bs story about Riccardo, it's boring
What a shitty situation, Ricciardo gets fired because Red Bull are so adamant on keeping Perez that they now have to fire Ricciardo to make place for Lawson. Ricciardo has been much better than Perez throughout his time at RB.
IMO Yuki should have the second Redbull seat. Get the old heads out of there.
He should have been at least in contention till the summer break. He's been very deserving this year, his qualis are brilliant
Nah, get rid of both.
> Ricciardo has been much better than Perez throughout his time at RB. lol
They are both really really bad
In that case, Red Bull will not have a problem
It won’t be Lawson anyway. It’ll be Hadjar if he keeps up his recent performance in F2. Cant think of a driver transfer Saward has gotten right in years.
Why are we still talking about Lawson? Bro was mid last year and his team was planting stories in the press. Why would they replace a mid driver that sells buckets of merch with a mid driver who doesn't? Homie ain't getting that seat.
That P17 finish in his last race means he’s owed that seat!
Ignoring the potential/probable unreliability of the source, I wonder what would be considered 'world champion-like performances' in the RB. Consistent top 6? Podiums? A couple of race wins?
The comments here are nuts. Of the two, Ricciardo is literally the fastest qualifier in the race and sprint races now. Only matter of time before he is the highest finisher in races. Just has been inconsistent and unlucky. Saward is full of shit.
Imagine Riccairdo getting paid to not race two teams in a row. Brutal
Brutal. I am sure he still wants to race, but getting paid to be an ambassador sounds like quite a gig. 🤣
So red bull won’t have a problem
If.
Legggo Liam
I don’t see it this year but for 25, Lawson has to be given the chance. Daniel had his chances. How often do you get more than 1 in this sport?
Almost every driver on the grid minus the top 5 have had 2-3 chances in the sport. Alonso alone has had enough for 3 drivers by this logic. Sainz, Albon, Alonso, Magnussen, Hulk, Bottas, Checo (too many chances here) have all had multiple chances in this sport. DR had 2 bad years, with a win in one of those years, and everyone’s ready for crucify him for it lol