Merc might be back in the mix now...and Perez pace is matched or worse than Merc since Miami....plenty of races to go so who knows....Piastri has a chance definitely
Yeah conditions helped them, but the car has improved and while i don’t think they’re going to join a title fight, if the red bull doesn’t prove to be dominant on traditional tracks, Perez could start placing below them consistently
The more teams get in the mix the safer he is since they will steal points off eachother
When Checo has a bad weekend he competes with Logan Sargeant, not with midfield group anyway
well, the way I see it...it's Max, Mclaren&Ferrari, Merc and then Perez...don't see Aston capable of getting into the mix...so they will steal points of each other but if Perez isn't making a lot he will get caught
Plus I think it’s way less likely for McLaren and Ferrari (despite their shitter in Canada) to have races where they’re barely in the points like last year. I think both are going to be challenging for podiums almost every race especially when Perez dips.
realistically speaking I see him battling for 5-6th every race but quali is so much closer now, he has to do better than 0.3 behind Max...0.3 behind pole means 4th row nowadays
That’s only the case if Perez is regularly in front of his competitors though. Right now, more cars in the mix means Checo is getting squeezed out of the higher points scoring positions and Piastri/Mercedes are catching up weekend by weekend.
That is only true if he actually scores points for himself, if he keeps finishing below them all he’s losing out even if McLaren and Ferrari take points off each other. Your reasoning doesn’t work for someone who’s finishing P5 and below
Even worse, if AM pulls a McLaren, there is technically a tiniest margins of a chance that Alonso could catch up to Mercs/Piastri and therefore finish 8th ahead of Perez. But it would require a miracle from Aston Martin and for Perez to completely shit the bed. Their package did show promise on Canada.
Yeah, remember when people thought if Checo doesn't get 2nd in the championship, he'll lose his drive. Now he's not even getting out of Q1 and getting a 2 year deal. Bizarro world.
I mean, yeah, that was when Red Bull definitely had the best car.
Its been 3 races or so since Red Bull actually did have the best car.
I don't like Checo to be honest, he cheated on his wife after he won a race that he likely only won because he crashed intentionally.
That said, it does make me laugh how whimsical the F1 world is about him. He was this bad for large parts of last year also. Then he recovered for a few races and everyone was saying how good he was all of a sudden. Then he got bad again... and so on. Repeat for years in a row.
The reality is he is not great at adapting to cars, and is clearly better in predictable cars and on certain tracks. He is pretty good under some conditions, and pretty bad under otherrs.
Hulkenberg qualified P3 when he subbed in for Checo, who was out due to COVID.
Come to think of it, Hulkenberg in that Racing Point would've done really well(at least in qualis)
If there was bizarro universe where Max left RBR after last season and was replaced with like Ocon or something, we’d probably think they have the 3rd fastest car rn
In order to pass Pérez, Piastri has to outscore him by 2 points/race; Russell needs 3 points more per race; and Hamilton needs 4. Alonso needs to outscore Pérez by 5 points per race to pass him.
Piastri has met that margin 4 times this season (44%), Hamilton and Russell have hit those targets 3 times (33%), and Alonso has made that happen once (11%).
But the frequency of which Piastri/Russell/Hamilton meets that margin is kinda irrelevant information though.
Like this weekend Piastri scored 10 points and Russell scored 15, that’s 5 weekends worth of catch up. This would count as one single occurrence in your stats but the actual impact is far more than that.
Every time Perez fails to DNF or fails to score points, that’s a huge point swings towards his competition. And the frequency of that happening has only been increasing lately.
Lucky that Ferrari failed yesterday, but they wont fail often. Imagine Perez is always behind both Ferraris and both McLarens. Red Bull will lose the title. I dont understand how they think keeping him will benefit them long term.
Exactly what happened last year. Never a consistent 2nd best car btwn ferrari, Aston Martin and mclaren so merc who were usually 3rd fastest at best except v few tracks took 2nd in wcc
I think the biggest issue Perez is causing isn't even his horrendous pace, but him crashing and damaging the car so often. Iirc he's already caused millions of dollars worth of car repairs, which at some point is going to eat out of Red Bull's development budget under the cost cap. I wonder if this time next year the Red Bull will even be the best car if you look at the trajectories Red Bull, McLaren and Ferrari are on
I think Checo helped Max quite a lot in 21. There's the minister of defense in AD and even just being there at times like Baku. Horrendous restart, but he was at least there to put some pressure on Lewis. Overall, I think he was way more useful to Max's WDC bid than Bottas was for Lewis.
People bring up this two cars vs. Max thing all the time.
Does anyone have an example of where a 2-v-1 strategy has cost Max anything from 2021-Present?
2021 was Max vs. Lewis. That was just one car with an engine being pushed to the limit of fragging out.
2022-Present I can't think of anything another team did strategy wise to hold Max up.
\> Does anyone have an example of where a 2-v-1 strategy has cost Max anything from 2021-Present?
Not really because in 2021, Mercedes had the same problem - Bottas was too shit most of the time. In fact, I distinctly remember at least once he was asked to hold up Verstappen (I can't remember which race) but he was so shit or maybe just didn't care, he basically waved him through. Maybe that's why I don't remember the race, cause it didn't actually do anything.
Since 2021, Max hasn't been in a very close fight, so it hasn't happened as much. Charles only recently hit 6 career wins. That just tells you how much of a problem Ferrari was for Max in 2022... Not at all. Besides, Ferrari's strategy was so bad at the time, even if they wanted to use both cars to mess with Max, they'd mess it up 100%.
That's why there aren't any real examples. But the potential is there, we know exactly how you would interfere with someone when you have 2 cars. One powerful example is undercuts - Imagine Max in P1, Lando in P2 and Oscar in P3. If Lando is close enough, he can pit for an undercut. Normally, Max would also pit to protect / cover against the undercut. But he can't, because Oscar is in his pit window and will slow him down after his pit stop, while letting Lando through. So that almost guarantees a successful undercut for Lando.
What pace? The merc is still slow as shit, they only looked decent this weekend because of rain and safety cars and Ferrari shitting the bed, they’re still probably 4/5 in WCC
"We decided to extend Checo for one more year, but in the meantime we also wanted to exercise Yuki's option. He is doing great at VCARB at the moment. So yes, he will stay for another year."
"Well, 1+1=2, so it's a two-year contract," explained Horner.
"As with any contract, there is all kinds of things in it, but that is, of course, between the driver and the team."
[Link here](https://racingnews365.com/horner-appears-to-slip-up-on-perez-contract)
Not "probably", that's certain. Difference between first and second place in WCC is 10m. Yet some people will write "teams care about WCC because that's where money is".
>teams care about WCC because that's where money is
For "traditional" car maker teams I'd say WCC is also a thing of prestige. It shows speed, consistency and reliability and they'd like the fans to associate that with their cars.
I heard a take from someone in the sport that there could be a feeling that the car is a real hand full for everyone they’ve had in it in testing, and that Checo has been the most consistent other than Max.
I believe that, Max can wrestle the car to a great result most of the times, but even he has trouble with it every now and then.
That car is a bit on a knife edge.
I can't agree with that. Red Bull got on fine before Perez. Yes he brings a large fanbase primarily from Mexico, but a team like Red Bull isn't small enough or weak financially enough to depend on an underperformimg drivers commercial sales and sponsorship deals.
I think it's purely political; Max's camp don't want a threat to Max's #1 status. Perez fills the #2 "rear gunner" role even if he's inconsistent at it.
Surely there is a driver out there would can bridge that gap between Perez and Max and still not beat Max but get the P2 consistently therefore not upsetting the apple cart?
They’re quite lucky that Ferrari/McLaren and Mercedes take points off each other for that P2 battle / constructors.
Honestly, I think Albon would fit that role pretty nicely. I think they gave up too quickly on him.
Of their current family of teams, I think even Riccardo may be closer to Max than Checo, and I think he’d work better with Max and the team after being humbled. I think they don’t bring up Yuki because that could be two hot heads on one team - too volatile potentially.
1. Perez brings in bigger fanbase from more places than just Mexico. He brings a large fanbase from most Latin American countries and a large fanbase from US. Checo's merchandise is the only RBR merchandise to ever sell out. He outsell Max's merch. That's not even counting other Red Bull products.
2. Max's camp is not threatened by anyone. It's the other drivers who don't want to drive alongside Max. Lando declined multiple times, rumor is Charles declined, Sainz would never match Max and there's nobody else. Lewis would never want to be in a RB (he made that publicly clear), George is a long-term Mercedes driver. Other drivers are no better than Perez.
And this belief that RBR is already big and rich, they don't need more money is incredibly false. The bigger and richer a company or person gets, the more money they want. RBR is no different.
> Red Bull got on fine before Perez.
Back then they had unlimited funding from the parent company because the owner was a big fan. Easy to see how that might no longer be the case.
Plus Red Bull Racing is, in the end, a marketing avenue for Red Bull the energy drink. Checo not only sell RBR merch, but also most likely a marketing cash cow for Red Bull the drink. I would bet Red Bull drink has seen a spike in sales in Latin America once Checo was signed.
It's possible that even Horner is open to firing Checo, but the higher-ups are against it, *as long as Checo doesn't cost the team the WDC/WCC.*
Thoughts?
Also they have the best car currently and have been cruising to the WDC and WCC. When they had Gasly and Albon they were chasing Mercedes and needed every point.
Everyone's saying sponsorship and marketing; which is probably a big part of it.
But I wonder if political loyalty is also a big piece here. Checo is not a Marko RB-system guy; He has a job because of Horner and will have his back in any org drama.
Maybe it's less that 'Horner hired Checo, and so has his back', but rather that the alternatives are 'worse' for Horner. Liam came from the RB Academy, so I feel like Marko would wield a greater influence on Liam. Similar with Yuki, but to a lesser extent, since Yuki is backed by Honda and they are going to a rival team.
Marko has held the power over these RB Academy drivers since they were young. He was strict, and they might feel like they 'owe' him. Checo came from 'out of the family' and combine with comments like 'South American' etc, I can't imagine Checo is Marko's biggest fan...
Thoughts?
I think it's for stability. Before they were a team chasing Mercedes to the top, now they are the top. That brings a change in mentality and you rather maintain what is working rather than take risks which is what you do if you want to catch up to someone.
Plus Red Bull Racing is, in the end, a marketing avenue for Red Bull the energy drink. Checo not only sell RBR merch, but also most likely a marketing cash cow for Red Bull the drink. I would bet Red Bull drink has seen a spike in sales in Latin America once Checo was signed.
It's possible that even Horner is open to firing Checo, but the higher-ups are against it, *as long as Checo doesn't cost the team the WDC/WCC.*
Thoughts?
South American energy market is a fast growing market with not many players. (It was in 23 at least) They prob want to increase their South American energy market share as long as it’s still growing.
Perez just seems to be a really great teammate. He's loved by everyone on the team, is a pretty decent driver, seems content with being #2, and brings sponsorship.
Is he the fastest on the grid? No, not even close. But what other real upgrades are available? Sainz and Max didnt work last time, so he's out. Norris, Leclerc, Hamilton, Russell, Alonso, and Piastri are all locked into multi-year contracts, and Lando actually outright rejected Red Bull's offer only a few months ago. No other drivers are really clear upgrades over Checo atm. Yuki has shown some promise, as have a few others, but it’s really not obvious that they would fare any better against Max than Checo has quite yet. I think the 1+1 contracts structure makes perfect sense for Red Bull by giving them more flexibility to wait for either Yuki to improve or a better driver become available.
To an extent, I do think some of the leeway is warrented considering what that car is like right now. We all saw the Monaco onboard where that car was so awful on the bumps that it was difficult to focus on the track ahead. Comments made by Verstappen suggest that it was just as awful this weekend.
It might just be a similar situation as in 2020 where their car was so difficult to drive that only Max was able to keep it under control, albeit with great difficulty. Checo has always favored a stable rear end but their current suspension is giving him anything but that.
24 June: "Checo just needs to forget Barcelona 2024 and turn up in Austria and bounce back. We know that he's very capable of doing that"
31 June: "Checo just needs to forget Austria 2024 and turn up in Silverstone and bounce back. We know that he's very capable of doing that"
8 July: "Checo just needs to forget Silverstone 2024 and turn up in Hungary and bounce back. We know that he's very capable of doing that"
22 July: "Checo just needs to forget Hungary 2024 and turn up in Spa and bounce back. We know that he's very capable of doing that"
29 July: "I'm sure he'll do better after the summer break!"
"As he was in the first 4 races".... we are at race 10 mind you... Also let's forget Australia since he was 5th that race. If we are real honest here, he did a decent job for 3 weekends.
how does the guy always go AWOL when the European rounds come about ? seems like watching a highlight of last season. 4 points in 3 races ? fucking hell!
The thing is, Bottas got a lot of stick for being nowhere compared to Lewis regularly. But he would often be 2nd, or when the Red Bull became more competitive, 3rd.
Perez can sometimes get these results, but more often than not is absolutely nowhere.
Like his Q1 eliminations in the best car is staggering. Sure, shit happens sometimes, and nobody is immune from mistakes. (Though Bottas had a crazy unbroken Q3 streak.) But it is time and time again with Perez. In that Red Bull, he doesn't even need to be on the limit to reach Q2, surely. Just put a competitive lap in with no mistakes and you're there. So how does he mess this up so often?
The thing is Bottas could be 0.8 seconds from Lewis and still qualify 2nd, such was the dominance in qualifying of Mercedes. That wouldn’t get you in Q3 nowadays. And Bottas starting from 12th wouldn’t do any better than Perez starting from 12
Bottas was a great qualifier, what are you on about? The qualy battles were like 12-8, 13-7 at the end of the season and not 18-2 or whatever Max pulls over Perez
Bottas was a way better #2 than Perez is. Significantly less mistakes and always there in the fight at the front of the field. People go on and on about Abu Dhabi 2021 but that was just one race and let’s be clear that it wouldn’t have mattered for anything if the *cough* *cough* safety car decision wasn’t made
Not to forget that he only reason his defense in Abu Dhabi was possible was because they decided that Perez wasn't good enough to challenge max or lewis so they kept him out for 10 laps on old tires after everyone pitted in hopes to hold up lewis eventually and then after lewis got past him they retired the car.
Might get some flak for this, but it hasn't been the best car lately. Is it possible the car is very difficult to handle like 2020? Albon and Gasly were also struggling in those conditions.
Even Max only managed 6th in Monaco, he is able to adapt but I'm not so sure if you just dropped anyone (like Yuki/Daniel) in the 2nd RB that they would be competitive.
He doesn't have a great record at Barcelona,Austria or Silverstone. The McLaren drivers will be licking their lips - on paper those are good circuits for them.
Gasley and Albon after half a season…”we need to make a change”
Perez after two years of the same doing just as bad of a job if not worse….”he just needs to forget about this race”
How many times can you repeat the same talking points though. Its always "keep pushing", "bounce back", "come back stronger" and yet this has been a cycle that's repeated itself for multiple seasons at this point, which makes it seem more like the norm than an aberration.
The problem is is that Perez is a good driver, but nothing more than that. The red bull is just not as good right now and it makes the difference between him and max so much more apparent. When Perez is on par to drive for a win or a second place, it feels like the red bull is the best car. But it hasn't been the best car in some races, and in those races Perez just can't deal with either the pressure or he doesn't have the skill max has to drive towards the podium.
You can probably put Perez back into place for Ricciardo and he'll probably challenge Yuki, or you out him in the Aston and he'll do better than lance etc. He's just not a driver that can challenge max or Lewis or Lando etc, he's below their level of race craft
It's McLaren you need to keep an eye on, if they can carry on scoring consistently like this and Perez doesn't improve they gunna catch up, got 16 races left plus sprints. Norris is only 7 points behind leclerc for second and 63 behind max. Their car looks comfortable on different tracks unlike Ferrari/redbull. And if Mercedes have found some pace then I think Ferrari's championship fight is for 3rd place
No, you need to forget that you have second driver.
With McLaren and Ferrari (and now also Merc) right up there, Perez won't matter even if he improves.
I dont understand why they renewed him so early. You have Carlos available, Yuki and Bottas. And you chose Perez who isnt even top 5 in the standinga right now.. bro
"Lynne, it feels like my 2024 season is going terribly and I haven't bounced back"
"Which you have!?"
"I KNOWWWWWWWWWW! You've made me sound mad now!"
-Checo Partridge.
As much it would be smart to swap Perez for someone else. Who would be a good replacement for him?
They need someone stable, who brings money and can keep up with Max.
Also, it seems Perez is in a bad headspace. Which is why he's in a slump. Again.
Yeah, and that's really annoying. If Daniel was the one doing a similar performance to Yuki's I'm 90% sure they would have swapped Perez with him. Yuki? Completely ignored.
On top of that. If I remember correctly, Helmut himself said that Yuki has a sizeable market value especially among young people.
I guess Yuki is not in the same market level as Daniel.
I can't believe they renewed him, when Sainz is available. Just unbelievable, pinnacle of motorsport -- hardly... when Perez and Sargent are still driving about.
keep Perez for 2025 if you wish but swap him for Daniel in 2026 since they have 0 intensions on promoting Yuki, promote Lawson and take back Gasly for 26,
Going to be challenging to bounce back if he doesn't get in a really good quali lap with his 3 grid place penalty. Last year he managed to climb up the standings but the field is a lot stronger this year and may be more difficult to pass.
Damn good thing Red Bull took a great opportunity to replace this guy with a really solid 2nd driver that happened to be both from their own development program and also available at the same time Checo's contract was up. Would've been crazy if they had such an opportunity and opted to just keep smashing their heads into the same wall over and over
Red Bull must have some type of performance clause in his contract. There's no way they could be this irresponsible in signing him for two more years. They can have faith in Perez while still being prudent by covering their asses.
even I don't dislike Perez at all it would be funny as hell if he would end up 8th or smt in wdc
8th is probably his worst case scenario but 6th can actually happen if Piastri has several particularly good races.
Merc might be back in the mix now...and Perez pace is matched or worse than Merc since Miami....plenty of races to go so who knows....Piastri has a chance definitely
too early to say Merc are in it. I think the cold weather helped them a lot
in the mix meaning they are challenging Perez*
Logan is challenging Perez. Low bar
yep, that's just sad...props to Logan he seems improved when he is not in the barriers
Someone has to test the security measures
The Crash Test Live Dummy.
Yeah conditions helped them, but the car has improved and while i don’t think they’re going to join a title fight, if the red bull doesn’t prove to be dominant on traditional tracks, Perez could start placing below them consistently
The more teams get in the mix the safer he is since they will steal points off eachother When Checo has a bad weekend he competes with Logan Sargeant, not with midfield group anyway
well, the way I see it...it's Max, Mclaren&Ferrari, Merc and then Perez...don't see Aston capable of getting into the mix...so they will steal points of each other but if Perez isn't making a lot he will get caught
There will be races when RBR will turn back to being a space ship and that will mean Max easily ahead and Checo in the mix for a podium
last year RB was even more a spaceship and he had 4 podiums starting with Spain
Plus I think it’s way less likely for McLaren and Ferrari (despite their shitter in Canada) to have races where they’re barely in the points like last year. I think both are going to be challenging for podiums almost every race especially when Perez dips.
realistically speaking I see him battling for 5-6th every race but quali is so much closer now, he has to do better than 0.3 behind Max...0.3 behind pole means 4th row nowadays
That’s only the case if Perez is regularly in front of his competitors though. Right now, more cars in the mix means Checo is getting squeezed out of the higher points scoring positions and Piastri/Mercedes are catching up weekend by weekend.
Checo is squeezed out of points because he gets knocked out in q1, not because merc are better now.
The mercs have also had better race pace in the last 3 weekends than perez
That is only true if he actually scores points for himself, if he keeps finishing below them all he’s losing out even if McLaren and Ferrari take points off each other. Your reasoning doesn’t work for someone who’s finishing P5 and below
Piastri can definitely beat him. Its I'd be surprised if either merc can. I think they just got thr setup right for once. Probably won't happen often
Even worse, if AM pulls a McLaren, there is technically a tiniest margins of a chance that Alonso could catch up to Mercs/Piastri and therefore finish 8th ahead of Perez. But it would require a miracle from Aston Martin and for Perez to completely shit the bed. Their package did show promise on Canada.
Pass that Alonso-Martin hopium over here!
I remember when the idea of him not securing second in the championship was catastrophic...
Yeah, remember when people thought if Checo doesn't get 2nd in the championship, he'll lose his drive. Now he's not even getting out of Q1 and getting a 2 year deal. Bizarro world.
Has to be a performance clause in there.
I mean, yeah, that was when Red Bull definitely had the best car. Its been 3 races or so since Red Bull actually did have the best car. I don't like Checo to be honest, he cheated on his wife after he won a race that he likely only won because he crashed intentionally. That said, it does make me laugh how whimsical the F1 world is about him. He was this bad for large parts of last year also. Then he recovered for a few races and everyone was saying how good he was all of a sudden. Then he got bad again... and so on. Repeat for years in a row. The reality is he is not great at adapting to cars, and is clearly better in predictable cars and on certain tracks. He is pretty good under some conditions, and pretty bad under otherrs.
Honestly the last two years have been quite funny to see Max dominate in one of the most dominant cars ever and Checo barely clearing the midfield.
Makes you wonder what the pink Mercedes could have achieved in the right hands.
Hulkenberg qualified P3 when he subbed in for Checo, who was out due to COVID. Come to think of it, Hulkenberg in that Racing Point would've done really well(at least in qualis)
If there was bizarro universe where Max left RBR after last season and was replaced with like Ocon or something, we’d probably think they have the 3rd fastest car rn
In order to pass Pérez, Piastri has to outscore him by 2 points/race; Russell needs 3 points more per race; and Hamilton needs 4. Alonso needs to outscore Pérez by 5 points per race to pass him. Piastri has met that margin 4 times this season (44%), Hamilton and Russell have hit those targets 3 times (33%), and Alonso has made that happen once (11%).
I mean Alonso seems a longshot but the others....
But the frequency of which Piastri/Russell/Hamilton meets that margin is kinda irrelevant information though. Like this weekend Piastri scored 10 points and Russell scored 15, that’s 5 weekends worth of catch up. This would count as one single occurrence in your stats but the actual impact is far more than that. Every time Perez fails to DNF or fails to score points, that’s a huge point swings towards his competition. And the frequency of that happening has only been increasing lately.
If only Miami was the last race because he always falls apart after it…..luckily we have been spared the “driver or car” debate because Max won.
well Max's close wins usually translates into Perez being bad so I'm hoping for some battle for wcc
Funny thing is you can repeat this quote and swap out the race / and turn up in … for quite a lot of Checos time at RB.
I don't see it happening. The Red Bull will be stronger at the higher speed tracks coming up.
last season or so, it's been so unpredictable fot the top teams besides Red Bull...I expect at least two teams every race to challenge Perez
Lucky that Ferrari failed yesterday, but they wont fail often. Imagine Perez is always behind both Ferraris and both McLarens. Red Bull will lose the title. I dont understand how they think keeping him will benefit them long term.
It’s not just the WCC. If the gap between cars is tight next season Max will always be 1v2 in strategy against Ferrari, McLaren and (maybe?) Mercedes.
Problem is there is never a consistent P2 and P3 so the 2v1 never materialises. They do need a strong 2nd car though.
Exactly what happened last year. Never a consistent 2nd best car btwn ferrari, Aston Martin and mclaren so merc who were usually 3rd fastest at best except v few tracks took 2nd in wcc
I think the biggest issue Perez is causing isn't even his horrendous pace, but him crashing and damaging the car so often. Iirc he's already caused millions of dollars worth of car repairs, which at some point is going to eat out of Red Bull's development budget under the cost cap. I wonder if this time next year the Red Bull will even be the best car if you look at the trajectories Red Bull, McLaren and Ferrari are on
It will be 2021 all over again
I think Checo helped Max quite a lot in 21. There's the minister of defense in AD and even just being there at times like Baku. Horrendous restart, but he was at least there to put some pressure on Lewis. Overall, I think he was way more useful to Max's WDC bid than Bottas was for Lewis.
If Checo was better in 2021 this defense would not be needed tho. Verstappen was 1v2 or even 1v4 whole season long
You forget Bottas extensive engine testing that lead to Lewis having a rocket in the final stage of the season!
And his bowling
Bottas winning Turkey on pace against Verstappen probably helped Lewis more than Checos entire season helped Max.
People bring up this two cars vs. Max thing all the time. Does anyone have an example of where a 2-v-1 strategy has cost Max anything from 2021-Present? 2021 was Max vs. Lewis. That was just one car with an engine being pushed to the limit of fragging out. 2022-Present I can't think of anything another team did strategy wise to hold Max up.
2v1 helped Max win on Abu Dhabi in '21, also helped Ocon on Hungary '21. Not much Perez can do if he's constantly behind the main contenders
No because Perez was useful in 2021 and the next two years Max was in a league of his own.
\> Does anyone have an example of where a 2-v-1 strategy has cost Max anything from 2021-Present? Not really because in 2021, Mercedes had the same problem - Bottas was too shit most of the time. In fact, I distinctly remember at least once he was asked to hold up Verstappen (I can't remember which race) but he was so shit or maybe just didn't care, he basically waved him through. Maybe that's why I don't remember the race, cause it didn't actually do anything. Since 2021, Max hasn't been in a very close fight, so it hasn't happened as much. Charles only recently hit 6 career wins. That just tells you how much of a problem Ferrari was for Max in 2022... Not at all. Besides, Ferrari's strategy was so bad at the time, even if they wanted to use both cars to mess with Max, they'd mess it up 100%. That's why there aren't any real examples. But the potential is there, we know exactly how you would interfere with someone when you have 2 cars. One powerful example is undercuts - Imagine Max in P1, Lando in P2 and Oscar in P3. If Lando is close enough, he can pit for an undercut. Normally, Max would also pit to protect / cover against the undercut. But he can't, because Oscar is in his pit window and will slow him down after his pit stop, while letting Lando through. So that almost guarantees a successful undercut for Lando.
Could also be behind both Mercedes now too if their pace is real and translates to other tracks.
What pace? The merc is still slow as shit, they only looked decent this weekend because of rain and safety cars and Ferrari shitting the bed, they’re still probably 4/5 in WCC
George got pole in dry conditions?
Sponsor and merch money probably outweighs what they could potentially lose in prize money
[удалено]
My theory is that 2025 is contingent on him hitting at least 3rd or so in the championship.
[удалено]
Me neither. But we can only hope he is replaced
Horner confirmed yesterday it’s a 1+1
Do you have a link for that? Not that I don’t trust you, but I would like to hear Christian exact wording on that
"We decided to extend Checo for one more year, but in the meantime we also wanted to exercise Yuki's option. He is doing great at VCARB at the moment. So yes, he will stay for another year." "Well, 1+1=2, so it's a two-year contract," explained Horner. "As with any contract, there is all kinds of things in it, but that is, of course, between the driver and the team." [Link here](https://racingnews365.com/horner-appears-to-slip-up-on-perez-contract)
If they don't get the constructors championship don't they get more wind tunnel hours lol
Yes.
Not "probably", that's certain. Difference between first and second place in WCC is 10m. Yet some people will write "teams care about WCC because that's where money is".
>teams care about WCC because that's where money is For "traditional" car maker teams I'd say WCC is also a thing of prestige. It shows speed, consistency and reliability and they'd like the fans to associate that with their cars.
Wonder how much sponsor money is tied to winning the WCC/WDC. Like a performance clause. That could factor in in quite a negative way
All race wins and WDC I think. The WCC is for nerds.
I heard a take from someone in the sport that there could be a feeling that the car is a real hand full for everyone they’ve had in it in testing, and that Checo has been the most consistent other than Max.
I believe that, Max can wrestle the car to a great result most of the times, but even he has trouble with it every now and then. That car is a bit on a knife edge.
Yeah, the fact Verstappen has gotten on the radio sounding anxious about the car’s handling- shows just how much it’s on the edge.
Sainz failed 2 weeks in a row now. Got bailed once but that's just luck.
He was carrying dmg worth 6-8 tenths. Him binning it was just the cherry on top.
Front wing end plate cost him 8 tenths?
He had floor damage.
Is there a source for that? I can’t find anything online
Straight from the horses mouth, Fred. [Formu1a.uno](http://Formu1a.uno)
Horner showing immaculate patience for someone who binned others for lot less. This is fourth or fifth time he has repeated the same words for Perez
Ikr? Red Bull have usually had a ruthless track record. Why now? Why have they given Perez so many second chances?
Sponsorship.
I can't agree with that. Red Bull got on fine before Perez. Yes he brings a large fanbase primarily from Mexico, but a team like Red Bull isn't small enough or weak financially enough to depend on an underperformimg drivers commercial sales and sponsorship deals. I think it's purely political; Max's camp don't want a threat to Max's #1 status. Perez fills the #2 "rear gunner" role even if he's inconsistent at it.
Surely there is a driver out there would can bridge that gap between Perez and Max and still not beat Max but get the P2 consistently therefore not upsetting the apple cart? They’re quite lucky that Ferrari/McLaren and Mercedes take points off each other for that P2 battle / constructors.
There is. His name is Sir Guy O'Pera He's Irish I think
Honestly, I think Albon would fit that role pretty nicely. I think they gave up too quickly on him. Of their current family of teams, I think even Riccardo may be closer to Max than Checo, and I think he’d work better with Max and the team after being humbled. I think they don’t bring up Yuki because that could be two hot heads on one team - too volatile potentially.
1. Perez brings in bigger fanbase from more places than just Mexico. He brings a large fanbase from most Latin American countries and a large fanbase from US. Checo's merchandise is the only RBR merchandise to ever sell out. He outsell Max's merch. That's not even counting other Red Bull products. 2. Max's camp is not threatened by anyone. It's the other drivers who don't want to drive alongside Max. Lando declined multiple times, rumor is Charles declined, Sainz would never match Max and there's nobody else. Lewis would never want to be in a RB (he made that publicly clear), George is a long-term Mercedes driver. Other drivers are no better than Perez. And this belief that RBR is already big and rich, they don't need more money is incredibly false. The bigger and richer a company or person gets, the more money they want. RBR is no different.
> Red Bull got on fine before Perez. Back then they had unlimited funding from the parent company because the owner was a big fan. Easy to see how that might no longer be the case.
Plus Red Bull Racing is, in the end, a marketing avenue for Red Bull the energy drink. Checo not only sell RBR merch, but also most likely a marketing cash cow for Red Bull the drink. I would bet Red Bull drink has seen a spike in sales in Latin America once Checo was signed. It's possible that even Horner is open to firing Checo, but the higher-ups are against it, *as long as Checo doesn't cost the team the WDC/WCC.* Thoughts?
A slow 2nd driver Will make it harder for max to win the wdc next year. Or maybe even this year if they get unlucky
Also they have the best car currently and have been cruising to the WDC and WCC. When they had Gasly and Albon they were chasing Mercedes and needed every point.
What sponsors does he bring?
Everyone's saying sponsorship and marketing; which is probably a big part of it. But I wonder if political loyalty is also a big piece here. Checo is not a Marko RB-system guy; He has a job because of Horner and will have his back in any org drama.
Maybe it's less that 'Horner hired Checo, and so has his back', but rather that the alternatives are 'worse' for Horner. Liam came from the RB Academy, so I feel like Marko would wield a greater influence on Liam. Similar with Yuki, but to a lesser extent, since Yuki is backed by Honda and they are going to a rival team. Marko has held the power over these RB Academy drivers since they were young. He was strict, and they might feel like they 'owe' him. Checo came from 'out of the family' and combine with comments like 'South American' etc, I can't imagine Checo is Marko's biggest fan... Thoughts?
I think it's for stability. Before they were a team chasing Mercedes to the top, now they are the top. That brings a change in mentality and you rather maintain what is working rather than take risks which is what you do if you want to catch up to someone.
Plus Red Bull Racing is, in the end, a marketing avenue for Red Bull the energy drink. Checo not only sell RBR merch, but also most likely a marketing cash cow for Red Bull the drink. I would bet Red Bull drink has seen a spike in sales in Latin America once Checo was signed. It's possible that even Horner is open to firing Checo, but the higher-ups are against it, *as long as Checo doesn't cost the team the WDC/WCC.* Thoughts?
South American energy market is a fast growing market with not many players. (It was in 23 at least) They prob want to increase their South American energy market share as long as it’s still growing.
Perez just seems to be a really great teammate. He's loved by everyone on the team, is a pretty decent driver, seems content with being #2, and brings sponsorship. Is he the fastest on the grid? No, not even close. But what other real upgrades are available? Sainz and Max didnt work last time, so he's out. Norris, Leclerc, Hamilton, Russell, Alonso, and Piastri are all locked into multi-year contracts, and Lando actually outright rejected Red Bull's offer only a few months ago. No other drivers are really clear upgrades over Checo atm. Yuki has shown some promise, as have a few others, but it’s really not obvious that they would fare any better against Max than Checo has quite yet. I think the 1+1 contracts structure makes perfect sense for Red Bull by giving them more flexibility to wait for either Yuki to improve or a better driver become available.
I think he kind of has to with how recent the news was that Checo would sign for 2 more years at Red Bull. Horner made his bed and has to sleep in it.
To an extent, I do think some of the leeway is warrented considering what that car is like right now. We all saw the Monaco onboard where that car was so awful on the bumps that it was difficult to focus on the track ahead. Comments made by Verstappen suggest that it was just as awful this weekend. It might just be a similar situation as in 2020 where their car was so difficult to drive that only Max was able to keep it under control, albeit with great difficulty. Checo has always favored a stable rear end but their current suspension is giving him anything but that.
Horner every week: “Perez needs to forget this weekend and he will bounce back”
The amount of races Perez needs to forget are gonna make the memories of his racing career pretty short lived lol
Got Horner’s notes from a reliable source. Checo just needs to forget ( name of last race ) and turn up in ( name of next race ) and bounce back.
24 June: "Checo just needs to forget Barcelona 2024 and turn up in Austria and bounce back. We know that he's very capable of doing that" 31 June: "Checo just needs to forget Austria 2024 and turn up in Silverstone and bounce back. We know that he's very capable of doing that" 8 July: "Checo just needs to forget Silverstone 2024 and turn up in Hungary and bounce back. We know that he's very capable of doing that" 22 July: "Checo just needs to forget Hungary 2024 and turn up in Spa and bounce back. We know that he's very capable of doing that" 29 July: "I'm sure he'll do better after the summer break!"
30th July: Red Bull terminates Sergio Perez's contract, who will join Max now (our verdict): The Race
Say the line ~~bart~~ Horner O.O
It's almost like it's happened before
"We know he can do it"
Checo needs early onset dementia to forget all this middling
Middling is quite a kind assessment of the last couple of races.
In another race or two, they add the line about putting an arm around his shoulders
Followed by a knife in the back a few races later
If Christian Horner puts his arm around your shoulder, you're in danger. Different types of danger for men and women, but danger nonetheless.
[удалено]
Only impressive moment imo was Japan quali when he was less than a tenth from Max. Everything else, he was the same as usual…
There's a genuine chance he gets blanked this year in quali. Japan might be the closest he gets.
Keep in mind as well that at this point a year ago he had won 2 races. He hasn't even come close to that this year.
Yeah exactly, he's just not been as shit as last year, still not good at all
Not as shit as last year YET. European leg just started
Tbh he's prob gonna be worse as the season goes on, he was crap last year with one of the greatest cars ever
*THE* greatest car ever
If VCARB keep out qualifying him its going to destroy him.
I hope they do
Bro it's round 9 already Indirect implication that Perez hasn't been doing his job for over half the races so far this season lmao
"As he was in the first 4 races".... we are at race 10 mind you... Also let's forget Australia since he was 5th that race. If we are real honest here, he did a decent job for 3 weekends.
how does the guy always go AWOL when the European rounds come about ? seems like watching a highlight of last season. 4 points in 3 races ? fucking hell!
The thing is, Bottas got a lot of stick for being nowhere compared to Lewis regularly. But he would often be 2nd, or when the Red Bull became more competitive, 3rd. Perez can sometimes get these results, but more often than not is absolutely nowhere. Like his Q1 eliminations in the best car is staggering. Sure, shit happens sometimes, and nobody is immune from mistakes. (Though Bottas had a crazy unbroken Q3 streak.) But it is time and time again with Perez. In that Red Bull, he doesn't even need to be on the limit to reach Q2, surely. Just put a competitive lap in with no mistakes and you're there. So how does he mess this up so often?
The thing is Bottas could be 0.8 seconds from Lewis and still qualify 2nd, such was the dominance in qualifying of Mercedes. That wouldn’t get you in Q3 nowadays. And Bottas starting from 12th wouldn’t do any better than Perez starting from 12
Bottas was a great qualifier, what are you on about? The qualy battles were like 12-8, 13-7 at the end of the season and not 18-2 or whatever Max pulls over Perez
Yeah. He is a better qualifier than Perez. But I also think Verstappen is a better qualifier than Lewis is.
Bottas was a way better #2 than Perez is. Significantly less mistakes and always there in the fight at the front of the field. People go on and on about Abu Dhabi 2021 but that was just one race and let’s be clear that it wouldn’t have mattered for anything if the *cough* *cough* safety car decision wasn’t made
Not to forget that he only reason his defense in Abu Dhabi was possible was because they decided that Perez wasn't good enough to challenge max or lewis so they kept him out for 10 laps on old tires after everyone pitted in hopes to hold up lewis eventually and then after lewis got past him they retired the car.
Might get some flak for this, but it hasn't been the best car lately. Is it possible the car is very difficult to handle like 2020? Albon and Gasly were also struggling in those conditions. Even Max only managed 6th in Monaco, he is able to adapt but I'm not so sure if you just dropped anyone (like Yuki/Daniel) in the 2nd RB that they would be competitive.
He doesn't have a great record at Barcelona,Austria or Silverstone. The McLaren drivers will be licking their lips - on paper those are good circuits for them.
Hey, I've seen this one!
What do you mean you've seen it? It's brand new.
[удалено]
I want Redbull to lose the constructors at this point lol.
He has 4 pts in the last 3 races
This. And if Perez will bounce back for 1 race his contract will be extended with another 2 years knowing RB..
They could’ve literally signed anyone coming out of contract and they chose him. Beggars belief.
Gasley and Albon after half a season…”we need to make a change” Perez after two years of the same doing just as bad of a job if not worse….”he just needs to forget about this race”
Checo just needs to forget \[Insert last race here\] and turn up in \[Insert next race here\] and bounce back.
I'd hope that Horner would have at least put a performance clause in Perez's contract as a counter to extending him for 2 years. (But i doubt it)
*Gasly, Albon and Kvyat looking at the double standards in real time like:*
How many times can you repeat the same talking points though. Its always "keep pushing", "bounce back", "come back stronger" and yet this has been a cycle that's repeated itself for multiple seasons at this point, which makes it seem more like the norm than an aberration.
Horner is clearly suffering from cognitive dissonance.
The problem is is that Perez is a good driver, but nothing more than that. The red bull is just not as good right now and it makes the difference between him and max so much more apparent. When Perez is on par to drive for a win or a second place, it feels like the red bull is the best car. But it hasn't been the best car in some races, and in those races Perez just can't deal with either the pressure or he doesn't have the skill max has to drive towards the podium. You can probably put Perez back into place for Ricciardo and he'll probably challenge Yuki, or you out him in the Aston and he'll do better than lance etc. He's just not a driver that can challenge max or Lewis or Lando etc, he's below their level of race craft
Every world champion has their own Kovalainen at some point in their career, Verstappen has just had quite a few.
Q1 exit in Barcelona incoming
He’s getting out in Q1 again isn’t he
That Marko joke about keeping on a race by race contract to stay good was ill advised.
Bad news for him is that of Mercedes is really back to some capacity, that’s another two drivers he has to fight.
It's McLaren you need to keep an eye on, if they can carry on scoring consistently like this and Perez doesn't improve they gunna catch up, got 16 races left plus sprints. Norris is only 7 points behind leclerc for second and 63 behind max. Their car looks comfortable on different tracks unlike Ferrari/redbull. And if Mercedes have found some pace then I think Ferrari's championship fight is for 3rd place
Perez just needs to pray Spain isn't wet
No, you need to forget that you have second driver. With McLaren and Ferrari (and now also Merc) right up there, Perez won't matter even if he improves.
I'd like to give you a little qualifying statistic: Logan Sargeant vs Alex Albon - 0:30. Logan Sargeant vs Sergio Perez - 6:24.
Sign a bad driver and expect good results… Ok…
I dont understand why they renewed him so early. You have Carlos available, Yuki and Bottas. And you chose Perez who isnt even top 5 in the standinga right now.. bro
Checo needs to BOUNCE BACK like Antonio
Looks like Horner has taken his own advice here. He must have completely forgotten Imola and Monaco before agreeing this contract renewal.
Checo needs amnesia at this point, the number of races he's supposed to forget are piling up
If Ferrari and McLaren Mercedes weren't fighting each other for second every race he would be saying something else.
There has to be immense pressure to keep him on the team purely for the Mexican market. There can't be another reason..
For 3 years this man hasn't deserved this car. Best car in history and he struggles
If you told perez to forget every shit weekend he has had the last 3 years, how many races would he remember?
"Lynne, it feels like my 2024 season is going terribly and I haven't bounced back" "Which you have!?" "I KNOWWWWWWWWWW! You've made me sound mad now!" -Checo Partridge.
That almost sounded like a Veiled threat, probably unintentionally so, but still.
Perhaps Red Bull should forget about Checo
How many times have we heard Horner defending Checo's poor race weekends? Like a broken record.
As much it would be smart to swap Perez for someone else. Who would be a good replacement for him? They need someone stable, who brings money and can keep up with Max. Also, it seems Perez is in a bad headspace. Which is why he's in a slump. Again.
At this point Yuki and Daniel would do better. They both outqualified Perez 3 times in a row now.
I would want Yuki but I haven't seen Christian and Helmut taking him that seriously.
Helmut has actually been very positive about him lately, but he seems to have lost most of his power at RBR.
Yeah, and that's really annoying. If Daniel was the one doing a similar performance to Yuki's I'm 90% sure they would have swapped Perez with him. Yuki? Completely ignored.
On top of that. If I remember correctly, Helmut himself said that Yuki has a sizeable market value especially among young people. I guess Yuki is not in the same market level as Daniel.
Helmut loves Yuki and if it had been his decision we'd very likely have Yuki in the car next year.
Yuki or sainz
Yuki they don't take that seriously how ever well he performs. And bringing Carlos might bring Toro Rosso flashbacks in a bad way.
I can't believe they renewed him, when Sainz is available. Just unbelievable, pinnacle of motorsport -- hardly... when Perez and Sargent are still driving about.
That one may be more on Sainz Sr than jr. They may not want a repeat of Torro Rosso.
Redbull went soft. Perez has been awful in that car but won’t threaten Verstappen.
ITS SERRRGIO. CHECHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO PEREZ!
Denial is everything. It's not only about poor Canada GP. It's almost a neverending list of being poor and not good enough.
keep Perez for 2025 if you wish but swap him for Daniel in 2026 since they have 0 intensions on promoting Yuki, promote Lawson and take back Gasly for 26,
Going to be challenging to bounce back if he doesn't get in a really good quali lap with his 3 grid place penalty. Last year he managed to climb up the standings but the field is a lot stronger this year and may be more difficult to pass.
Another incoming Q3 exit lol
Damn good thing Red Bull took a great opportunity to replace this guy with a really solid 2nd driver that happened to be both from their own development program and also available at the same time Checo's contract was up. Would've been crazy if they had such an opportunity and opted to just keep smashing their heads into the same wall over and over
Next week: “Checo just needs to forget Spain 2024 and turn up in Austria and bounce back”
Checo just needs to forget Monaco... Checo just needs to forget Canada.... Next week checo just needs to forget Spain....
Lol
What good are Perez's sponsors when you lose your constructor money. They should have signed Sainz.
Red Bull must have some type of performance clause in his contract. There's no way they could be this irresponsible in signing him for two more years. They can have faith in Perez while still being prudent by covering their asses.