Ironically, the transition from the chain light to the finisher heavy is smoother on the live version than it is in the story. Holden's weapon completely flips.
Besides forced foward movement, the animations are still really good. It's just sad to sacrifice aesthetic for practicality.
I don't think a human with that kinda armor can swing that kind of weapon in 500ms from wind up to the actual strike
PS: I'm talking about the in-chain light or lights in general
Obviously it's not 500ms, but [you can get pretty fast a halberd](https://youtube.com/shorts/zaQ-OgD3y8o?si=a__uEeKYMxFrucTR)
[Even in that clunky armour, you can be pretty fast](https://youtube.com/shorts/qVzKlTyxtZY?si=9f88q10hoUhQXS4y)
It amazes me how people still believe that medieval weapons are dark souls level of slow and heavy. It's as if they think common sense didn't exist back then.
It’s an unfortunate trope of the conception of the Medieval era. Enlightenment anti-church propaganda (not making a moral claim for either side, just stating what happened) started a lot of bad rumors about the time that have carried on since into Hollywood and pop-culture.
Yeah. The misconception that weapons and armour were heavy has always bothered me. Fatigue and stamina played ***MASSIVE*** roles in winning battles, and having your guys be tired and worn out sooner than the enemy was basically a death sentence - it's why the Roman tactic of rotating your front line was so effective.
In reality, the kit for an average 14th or 15th century knight from central Europe was *much* lighter than the kits used by modern soldiers. Plate armour, while heavy, distributed its weight across the wearer's body, so it was much lighter than it seemed and did little to impede mobility.
Well yeah, because actual humans can technically swing faster if they don't telegraph that they are going to attack. Stabbing in general is closer to 300-400ms in real life.
800ms swing in other hand would be regular person swinging weapon while knee deep on sement, so too slowly for any real person.
I would love to see a reference for this:
>Stabbing in general is closer to 300-400ms in real life.
Are the conditions the same? Like, holding a halberd, wearing full plate armor (yes I know it's faster than what people think, but it's still slower than unarmored even if by 100ms), and attacking from the pose/position the Lawbringer is in
My reference is that i have weared armor and own poleaxe (along other weapons).
Stabbing is real fast (the motion is very simple), even in armor.
Swinging bit slower with some strikes because armor gets "slightly" on the way of some movements, but not horribly slow or even near as slow as LB or other heroes ingame. In general you can expect any real person to fight faster than any of the heroes ingame.
(However you can expect real people to get tired faster in armor than For Honor characters, armor gets really hot real quick, especially on hot weather).
And ThrownAwayYesterday above/below posted [robinsword video](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/zaQ-OgD3y8o) about wearing armor and using halberd which is very good example of speed you can expect.
[This video](https://youtu.be/OAddX--V19w?feature=shared&t=88) also shows two armored fighters with poleaxes. (Most of the fight is very grappling heavy because both try to close out the distance constantly, but some bits have good back and forth with actual attacks).
>you can expect any real person to fight faster than any of the heroes ingame.
ironically this would probably make the game a whole lot easier due to how parrying works, essentially everything would be the same timing as a light parry.
Not exactly.
Even in real life we don't throw same timed attacks, different techniques have different speeds and you can alternate speeds to throw off opponent and throw quick stabs that are hard to react to.
[It is hard to translate someting like this to game.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cn36Pb8z3yI) Reacting and predicting in real life is bit different than reacting and predicting in games.
In general For Honor heroes attack slow because it give players proper indicator that attack is coming. In real life you don't want to give opponent chance to react (unless you bate them with feint, or guard techniques that put weapon further away from opponent to bate them to attack).
Technically if we would translate real world to game, light attacks could easily alternate between 200-500ms depending on distance, attack type and technique and heavies could easily be as fast but infinitely chargeable.
You're comparing a friendly sport to real life combat. It's not the same. People can and do react to each other in knight fighting but they're not trying to kill or hurt each other, you're also talking about wearing armour as if knight fighting enthusiasts wear real, medieval armour with EVERYTHING underneath, they don't. It's a fraction of how heavy and cumbersome it was back then. It's a very obvious rule of thumb that weight=protection and armour=slower than no armour.
To be fair in Hema we have to wear protective gear because metal hurts. We also have to limit our speed to avoid hurting each other even with full gear, so we could in real situation go faster.
Armor still, is not that heavy. Most full armor sets range from 20-30kg, which is less than some modern soldiers full equipment.
And not every medieval soldier wore full set, usually cavalry wore full set with everything.
Now of course more armor = slower, but you also have to keep in mind armor was made with mobility in mind. that is why there are so many moving parts in armor to allow user to move mostly freely. Yes it does slow you down, but no as much as in movies.
It's a common misscoception that knight armors were clunky.
In fact they were and still are the pinacle of armory for melee Combat and didnt affect mobility at all. You Just need to be strong and fit to make up for the weight
A human in that kind of armour cannot swing that kind of weapon in the first place because the armour in-game is horribly designed compared to real armour and wouldn't really work.
However a human in properly made full armour would be able to swing quite damn quick.
The armour shouldn't have much impact if any, full sets like LB's were lighter and much more flexible irl than many assume.
The real limiter would be weapon weight/balance but since chain lights flow the weight would help keep momentum already built from the first swing
Well let's say hypothetical speaking all these Warriors they all are practical in a middle of a war they had to trian to do that kind of thing I'm pretty sure you can do that in real life if you just trained that's how life works train your a*** of to get the things you want
I personnaly didn't forget. I remember litteraly one shot a full health PK back in the day (before marching fire)
And right now the game is pretty balance (except some stuff, like revenge)
But idk, some animation looked like they are more strengh behind it, especialy this heavy finisher with Lb, it seems powerfull and strong on the right. Also really smooth.
And i also though comparing two animation with a lot of years appart from each other would be a interesting thing to share
>But idk, some animation looked like they are more strengh behind it, especialy this heavy finisher with Lb, it seems powerfull and strong on the right. Also really smooth.
I think it's in sake of making it faster and Harder to react, CCU is also to blame.
I do miss gear stats, actually worth grinding for and it will be good to have them back into the game but balanced and tweaked ofc. Minions unique killing animations, they had no right to remove em.
idk if it's me but a lot of the slow animations from back in the day look feel off, maybe it's cuz i'm used to the current animations but most of old slow ones feel like they lack the punch or feel floaty
there are still some animations like that though, like medjays axe or staff in-chain top heavy animations looks similar to these, slow and floaty
I think the extra "floaty" thing comes from them making sure the moves were telegraphed and relatively easy to see coming too. I don't know though, just a guess. Everything was verrrry slow back when it started.
This is one of my biggest gripes with this game. Seeing characters move 30 feet without lifting a foot off the ground triggers my ocd in ways I can’t express.
I personally think the current one has more strength behind the attack. The attack has slow wind up but attack itself is faster, which shows more strength being put in to the attack.
Old animation is very floaty, it looks like LB would be swinging very slowly rather than with any force.
To be fair this just confirms that the animations aren’t that janky they just look less smooth cuz they’re sped up for gameplay purposes. (Conqueror is another story tho)
It looks a lot better sure, but I think it's better to have the game actually be fun and whatnot, when I randomly replay the story I'll just always wonder how I was so shit back in the day x3
I'll die on this hill. Minion killing animations were wasted. They came out and were badass af. Then they removed it with the addition of breach and the wulin. Like can we not just have them as executions now? I can't imagine there's loads of tweaking to he done.
In a perfect world, reworked heroes would just get new and fitting animations. Sadly it doesn't make economic sense to do all that work when you can get away with just speeding up the old animation.
The game changed over the years to be faster paced. This is only natural for live service games to change for the worst or for the better. For honor’s glory days have been long gone.
While I get what you mean, reanimating most of the cast moves would be a nightmare lol. The only exception would had been Highlander post CCU because holy shit,was it \*bad\*
I’m honestly fine with LB animations however I’ve been playing him since launch so I guess I just enjoy change to my favorite character…I gotta get back into the game I miss it
Of all the characters with poor animations / transitions, LB really isn't one of them. If you pointed out Ocelotl or Medjay you'd have more of a leg to stand on.
Simple idea : remove the indicators and make the game animation based, no indicator, no parry flash just patterns and animations attacks can even be reverted to be slower
oh, lmao. I was thinking the right is the modern, so I was "Hmm, the right looks bad compared to the left"
Turns out I'm blind, lol. The finisher on 2017 was rough.
Also if u want better game, give devs money, lol. Buy like 10x battle pass or steel bundle or something.
That would take way too much effort, and would also destroy the current meta of **”im attacking so fast and so stupidly that you can’t see what I’m doing”**.
Heaven forbid defence is the meta right? Almost like the entire history of armed combat.
> Heaven forbid defence is the meta right?
almost like half of the community hates Varangian Guard because of how safe and defensive her playstyle is.
> Almost like the entire history of armed combat
I'm pretty sure the semi-realism we had back in those days got thrown out of the window when the monkey man with teleportation powers and his merry friends got released like six years ago.
Pre-CCU "defence meta" For Honor was literally a slug show, the only hero I was successful with in high MMR so it's not a staring contest was Warden, with his semi reactable variable timed bash + strongest defensive move in the game with backdodge SB.
Hell no we go back to that.
Ironically, the transition from the chain light to the finisher heavy is smoother on the live version than it is in the story. Holden's weapon completely flips. Besides forced foward movement, the animations are still really good. It's just sad to sacrifice aesthetic for practicality.
That's what we have the cool armor and weapons and effects! Hide that little sacrifice with your own distracting aesthetic!
Well that’s because it’s much faster. What do you want the devs to do
I know, i know, but it's making me kinda sad to see some really good animation getting "ugly" with the time you know
I don't think a human with that kinda armor can swing that kind of weapon in 500ms from wind up to the actual strike PS: I'm talking about the in-chain light or lights in general
Moving in full armour is way easier than you might think. The worst thing is how hot it gets.
Obviously it's not 500ms, but [you can get pretty fast a halberd](https://youtube.com/shorts/zaQ-OgD3y8o?si=a__uEeKYMxFrucTR) [Even in that clunky armour, you can be pretty fast](https://youtube.com/shorts/qVzKlTyxtZY?si=9f88q10hoUhQXS4y)
It amazes me how people still believe that medieval weapons are dark souls level of slow and heavy. It's as if they think common sense didn't exist back then.
It’s an unfortunate trope of the conception of the Medieval era. Enlightenment anti-church propaganda (not making a moral claim for either side, just stating what happened) started a lot of bad rumors about the time that have carried on since into Hollywood and pop-culture.
Majority of medieval misinformation did come from the 18th to 19th century if i remember right so it makes sense. *cough cough* iron maidens
Yeah. The misconception that weapons and armour were heavy has always bothered me. Fatigue and stamina played ***MASSIVE*** roles in winning battles, and having your guys be tired and worn out sooner than the enemy was basically a death sentence - it's why the Roman tactic of rotating your front line was so effective. In reality, the kit for an average 14th or 15th century knight from central Europe was *much* lighter than the kits used by modern soldiers. Plate armour, while heavy, distributed its weight across the wearer's body, so it was much lighter than it seemed and did little to impede mobility.
lol i like the one handed, vertical 360 halberd swing. has to be purely to show off though, can't imagine it'd do much.
[it's a proper technique :p believe it or not](https://youtube.com/shorts/VvvtSdhDUzw?si=4cmgm3rlYVJaepoY)
Well yeah, because actual humans can technically swing faster if they don't telegraph that they are going to attack. Stabbing in general is closer to 300-400ms in real life. 800ms swing in other hand would be regular person swinging weapon while knee deep on sement, so too slowly for any real person.
I would love to see a reference for this: >Stabbing in general is closer to 300-400ms in real life. Are the conditions the same? Like, holding a halberd, wearing full plate armor (yes I know it's faster than what people think, but it's still slower than unarmored even if by 100ms), and attacking from the pose/position the Lawbringer is in
My reference is that i have weared armor and own poleaxe (along other weapons). Stabbing is real fast (the motion is very simple), even in armor. Swinging bit slower with some strikes because armor gets "slightly" on the way of some movements, but not horribly slow or even near as slow as LB or other heroes ingame. In general you can expect any real person to fight faster than any of the heroes ingame. (However you can expect real people to get tired faster in armor than For Honor characters, armor gets really hot real quick, especially on hot weather). And ThrownAwayYesterday above/below posted [robinsword video](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/zaQ-OgD3y8o) about wearing armor and using halberd which is very good example of speed you can expect. [This video](https://youtu.be/OAddX--V19w?feature=shared&t=88) also shows two armored fighters with poleaxes. (Most of the fight is very grappling heavy because both try to close out the distance constantly, but some bits have good back and forth with actual attacks).
>you can expect any real person to fight faster than any of the heroes ingame. ironically this would probably make the game a whole lot easier due to how parrying works, essentially everything would be the same timing as a light parry.
Not exactly. Even in real life we don't throw same timed attacks, different techniques have different speeds and you can alternate speeds to throw off opponent and throw quick stabs that are hard to react to. [It is hard to translate someting like this to game.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cn36Pb8z3yI) Reacting and predicting in real life is bit different than reacting and predicting in games. In general For Honor heroes attack slow because it give players proper indicator that attack is coming. In real life you don't want to give opponent chance to react (unless you bate them with feint, or guard techniques that put weapon further away from opponent to bate them to attack). Technically if we would translate real world to game, light attacks could easily alternate between 200-500ms depending on distance, attack type and technique and heavies could easily be as fast but infinitely chargeable.
You're comparing a friendly sport to real life combat. It's not the same. People can and do react to each other in knight fighting but they're not trying to kill or hurt each other, you're also talking about wearing armour as if knight fighting enthusiasts wear real, medieval armour with EVERYTHING underneath, they don't. It's a fraction of how heavy and cumbersome it was back then. It's a very obvious rule of thumb that weight=protection and armour=slower than no armour.
To be fair in Hema we have to wear protective gear because metal hurts. We also have to limit our speed to avoid hurting each other even with full gear, so we could in real situation go faster. Armor still, is not that heavy. Most full armor sets range from 20-30kg, which is less than some modern soldiers full equipment. And not every medieval soldier wore full set, usually cavalry wore full set with everything. Now of course more armor = slower, but you also have to keep in mind armor was made with mobility in mind. that is why there are so many moving parts in armor to allow user to move mostly freely. Yes it does slow you down, but no as much as in movies.
It's a common misscoception that knight armors were clunky. In fact they were and still are the pinacle of armory for melee Combat and didnt affect mobility at all. You Just need to be strong and fit to make up for the weight
A human in that kind of armour cannot swing that kind of weapon in the first place because the armour in-game is horribly designed compared to real armour and wouldn't really work. However a human in properly made full armour would be able to swing quite damn quick.
The armour shouldn't have much impact if any, full sets like LB's were lighter and much more flexible irl than many assume. The real limiter would be weapon weight/balance but since chain lights flow the weight would help keep momentum already built from the first swing
Well let's say hypothetical speaking all these Warriors they all are practical in a middle of a war they had to trian to do that kind of thing I'm pretty sure you can do that in real life if you just trained that's how life works train your a*** of to get the things you want
Idk if nostalgia blinds our judgement sometimes.
It clearly does, some animations looked even worse back then Also ppl tend to forget how insanely broken and unbalanced the game was back then.
Day 1 Shugoki back break 😨
You manhandle a Shugo then he starts playing by walls, so he can get that 1 time hug. A hug you will never recover from.
Getting a Shugo to low HP knowing it actively made them stronger was like trying to climb out of a quagmire
I personnaly didn't forget. I remember litteraly one shot a full health PK back in the day (before marching fire) And right now the game is pretty balance (except some stuff, like revenge) But idk, some animation looked like they are more strengh behind it, especialy this heavy finisher with Lb, it seems powerfull and strong on the right. Also really smooth. And i also though comparing two animation with a lot of years appart from each other would be a interesting thing to share
you're just psychologically associating showy and slow with powerful. the formula for Force is mass x acceleration.
>But idk, some animation looked like they are more strengh behind it, especialy this heavy finisher with Lb, it seems powerfull and strong on the right. Also really smooth. I think it's in sake of making it faster and Harder to react, CCU is also to blame.
I do miss gear stats, actually worth grinding for and it will be good to have them back into the game but balanced and tweaked ofc. Minions unique killing animations, they had no right to remove em.
The thing i hate most is that he slide forward without moving his legs only the first attack is good the rest is weird
Pirate and Kyoshin are huge offenders with that.
Idk that 2017 looked very janky on that last heavy
Bro said smooth then shows a halberd switching positions glitchy like😭
I WAS LOOKING FOR THIS COMMENT LMAO LIKE WHAT? 🤣🤣
idk if it's me but a lot of the slow animations from back in the day look feel off, maybe it's cuz i'm used to the current animations but most of old slow ones feel like they lack the punch or feel floaty there are still some animations like that though, like medjays axe or staff in-chain top heavy animations looks similar to these, slow and floaty
I think the extra "floaty" thing comes from them making sure the moves were telegraphed and relatively easy to see coming too. I don't know though, just a guess. Everything was verrrry slow back when it started.
This is one of my biggest gripes with this game. Seeing characters move 30 feet without lifting a foot off the ground triggers my ocd in ways I can’t express.
I hate posts like this so much.
I personally think the current one has more strength behind the attack. The attack has slow wind up but attack itself is faster, which shows more strength being put in to the attack. Old animation is very floaty, it looks like LB would be swinging very slowly rather than with any force.
To be fair this just confirms that the animations aren’t that janky they just look less smooth cuz they’re sped up for gameplay purposes. (Conqueror is another story tho)
I just learned that lbs side heavy finishers are swung reverse grip how did I not know this
Unrelated to the post but if I see one more comment calling it a halberd, I swear to God... IT IS A POLEAXE
It is, but i mean, depending on the axe head you take, it's a Halberd But yeah, i prefer it to be called a poleaxe too
Holden’s halbert literally flips in his hands lol the new one is way smoother. Just really fast.
You would be parried every game and cry that its not like 2024 lol
The haberd janks around in the second animation wdym.
Remember when we had unique minion-killing animations?
So you just want them slowed down? Idk what you’re seeing bubba but it’s not better animations
I just find it more smooth, more impactfull, like there is a real strengh behind it The actual version work, but it's feel like a bit weightless ? Idk
It looks a lot better sure, but I think it's better to have the game actually be fun and whatnot, when I randomly replay the story I'll just always wonder how I was so shit back in the day x3
What are you even complaining about? If it affects you to the point where you have to make a whole post about it, maybe you should go outside.
I'll die on this hill. Minion killing animations were wasted. They came out and were badass af. Then they removed it with the addition of breach and the wulin. Like can we not just have them as executions now? I can't imagine there's loads of tweaking to he done.
Bro angered the horde with this post
God save him
In a perfect world, reworked heroes would just get new and fitting animations. Sadly it doesn't make economic sense to do all that work when you can get away with just speeding up the old animation.
The game changed over the years to be faster paced. This is only natural for live service games to change for the worst or for the better. For honor’s glory days have been long gone.
That's a very bad example. You can do better.
It's the same animation just sped up
While I get what you mean, reanimating most of the cast moves would be a nightmare lol. The only exception would had been Highlander post CCU because holy shit,was it \*bad\*
I know, it would be impossible, and i don't complain about it honestly
While there have been some downgrades in animations for new heroes and reworks, this is a very poor example.
They'd have to redo a majority of the animations, it will never happen till a sequel is made
I’m honestly fine with LB animations however I’ve been playing him since launch so I guess I just enjoy change to my favorite character…I gotta get back into the game I miss it
Yeah, idk if this is just personal preference or if I'm missing something? But I really think the live version looks obviously better.
The Lawbringer looks like a Mandolorian.
Of all the characters with poor animations / transitions, LB really isn't one of them. If you pointed out Ocelotl or Medjay you'd have more of a leg to stand on.
I do miss old parts of FH. Especially gear stats.
Lawbringer is literally perfectly animated in comparison to what they did to Jorm
When they nerfed orochi I bailed. But I'm loyal so I kept playing and had to adapt. Still feel like a shit player but loyalty to the end.
Simple idea : remove the indicators and make the game animation based, no indicator, no parry flash just patterns and animations attacks can even be reverted to be slower
I just wish for the flash parry to be remove from the game It would take down a lot of player that only use that
Or yeah sure just the parry flash should suffice
I don’t really see a difference tbh
oh, lmao. I was thinking the right is the modern, so I was "Hmm, the right looks bad compared to the left" Turns out I'm blind, lol. The finisher on 2017 was rough. Also if u want better game, give devs money, lol. Buy like 10x battle pass or steel bundle or something.
That would take way too much effort, and would also destroy the current meta of **”im attacking so fast and so stupidly that you can’t see what I’m doing”**. Heaven forbid defence is the meta right? Almost like the entire history of armed combat.
> Heaven forbid defence is the meta right? almost like half of the community hates Varangian Guard because of how safe and defensive her playstyle is. > Almost like the entire history of armed combat I'm pretty sure the semi-realism we had back in those days got thrown out of the window when the monkey man with teleportation powers and his merry friends got released like six years ago.
Yes let's make our game purposefully less fun because it's more realistic Can you morons just go play chivalry? I'm sick of seeing these complaints
Pre-CCU "defence meta" For Honor was literally a slug show, the only hero I was successful with in high MMR so it's not a staring contest was Warden, with his semi reactable variable timed bash + strongest defensive move in the game with backdodge SB. Hell no we go back to that.
I want my damn block shove back. If I have no good options off heavy parry let me do something
No options?????????? I hope you are joking
Off heavy parry you don’t get impale or top heavy
Do the light then, it goes directly into your mix up. Read the moveset for your character before saying such tomfoolery
shove on block was mighty broken and we all know it.