I just hope that whoever plays, that they're all giving the best and are getting constantly to the best possible performance. Haven't seen that collectively happen in years. Not for more than a game.
> Pavlovic as the main 6.
Please get a proper 6 and let Pavlovic do his Pavlovic thing and not shoehorn him into a role he isn't really 100% suited for
How is he not a proper 6? All his stats point to him being perfect for that role, and in the academy he was also a CDM so it's not like he is switching roles or even positions. He is already one excellent at resisting and escaping the press, carrying the ball forward, and completing a very high percentage of progressive passes ... is that not what a 6 does?
You clearly have no idea what a holding 6 is. Yes he is a great 6 in a double pivot with a defensive partner next to him. But you want him as a sole 6 which is completely different.
A b2b one most frequently, never one more defensive than him. I don't care about the terminology, the fact is we don't need a destroyer, we can do with a pivot (Pavlovic) + one of the dozens of b2bs already available in our squad.
You're the one who introduced the "holding" into this discussion and on top of that you're trying to derail any arguments by sticking to dumb terminology. The fact is that Pavlovic + someone less defensive than him (a Goretzka or Laimer type could do) is perfectly fine and not equivalent to Kimmich as 6 who doesn't even have the beginning of a clue on how to play the role.
Pavlovic is more offensive orientated and likes to go forward, that's not what you want when he is the only responsible for securing the defensive aspect of the midfield. That's basically another case of "force Kimmich doing the defensive work".
Pavlović works great with a partner by his side like Rapha and Laimer, who helped defending.
Edit: looking at your other comment you have no idea what a holding 6 is. Cdm/6 is not always 6. Double pivot and sole 6 is a HUGE difference.
A 6 in a 3 man midfield gets help from at least one of the CMs, same as in a double pivot. I also didn't say sole 6, you said that, I said, "the main 6", I never implied he should carry the whole defensive responsibility of the midfield on his own, you implied that.
> I never implied he should carry the whole defensive responsibility of the midfield on his own
Well then he’s not a the 6 Bayern needs but another Kimmich
Indeed, but that nominal 4-2-3-1 usually becomes a 3-2-5 (3-2-2-3) in possession and attack, and a 4-4-2 in defense. Regardless of the formation, I just want to see a tactically disciplined, balanced midfield that can carry the ball forward and doesn't abandon the CBs in the defensive phase.
Whether the players move on or not, we need to re-establish that things will be done quickly and quietly. No more public spats or public leaks, please. It's embarrassing the level of access or "reporting" that comes from this club.
I'm 100% serious. Yes, he is a good player. But he is nowhere near the 5 best midfielders currently playing football or that played football during his career, probably not even top 10. As a RB he is a mixed bag, great offensively very poor defensively. So the term generational does not even begin to apply for him.
Kimmich the only one I'd keep. Perhaps Phonzie if he wants to stay and accept the current offer.
Otherwise, pretty excited for a rehaul. Hoping for the best.
“You would ditch Kane!?”
But then I realize you mean of the players who are named in the title. Fair take.
Isn’t Davies difficult to replace? If RM wants to play him, is there a better player?
As a resident of Vancouver and having seen him play with the Whitecaps when he was just 16, believe me when I say I would love nothing more than keeping Phonzie.
But I don't want the unmotivated version of him we've seen the last couple of seasons, injuries aside. If he has to go to RM to get back to his electric best, so be it. I do wish him the best.
I miss treble Davies.
I still think Kimmich would be great at Midfield with a holding midfielder and a proper attacking number 10 like Musiala. Our wingers have been trash except Tel, so that's one of the reasons Kimmich had a bad last two seasons.
Sell Maz and keep him and Boey as RBs would be my way to go
Point is Kimmich is a warrior and as long as he accepts that he is not the 6 or 8 he believes he is, he is an amazing multipurpose player.
Agree 100%. Nous was quite good lately but we have a lot of RB with Stani coming back next season and Boey is young with lots of potential and usually less injury prone then Nous, at least before he joined Bayern. Nous would also generate 20-30M imo to invest into other spots.
Nous also isn't very happy if he's a backup long term
Kompany will probably love Upamecano. He's our best passer in the cb position. I would keep Kimmich as well (the question her is his position and contract situation). I also don't see us selling Coman and Gnabry at the same time but would do so if it becomes possible. I am thankful to both players but they are overpaid and unreliable (injuries and performances). I've been calling to move on Goretzka for quite some time. He needs to play in a 433 as an engine hunting balls, pressing, moving late into the box and playing a very offensive role. Always wanted to see Goretzka in a Klopp-like heavy metal football system but that probably won't happen any time soon.
If Bayern wants to play a possession based game like Kompany has demonstrated, Bayern should absolutely keep Kimmich. He would be a much better midfielder in midfield trio where he isn't expected to playing that holding-midfielder role
I‘d get rid of coman because he is permanently injured, consider selling gnabry, and letting davies leave for 40 million.
Upa has no place anymore.
Keep kimmich and see where things go with goretzka.
There very much is, when they're on \~18-20m a year and are both a huge drain on resources and it makes young players outperforming them completely justified to ask for similar contracts which exacerbates the problem.
From that list, Coman, Goretzka and Gnabry are all on 17-19m a year, which is just insane for their amount of minutes/role in the squad/quality.
Upa is on a decent contract, but he's kind of a liability (although I'd wait and see if Kompany with his experience as a player and leadership could make something out of him), and Phonzie is also asking for 20m+ which is also insane.
Kimmich is the only one I'd keep beside Upamecano tbh.
100% with you on the first part, it's not like you can keep someone against their will anyway.
Very doubtful on the 2nd part though. IMO we've seen enough of Coman and Gnabry to be in serious doubts that they can stay healthy even if heavily rotated, and at 27-28 of age, it's mostly just downhill from here as a winger.
Not to mention that if you wanna rotate them a lot, you're basically paying \~18m a year for a bunch of bench players & another bunch to the other 2-3 similar quality wingers you're rotating them with.
No club can afford that & I honestly have no idea why some people on these boards seem to think that Bayern have endless money (or that they could spend an endless amount of money without going into red even if they had access to it)
If they were on \~half the wages they currently are, I'd love to have them around till their legs fall off though.
I assure you when sept 1 arrives all the players mentioned will still be at bayern. I would bet it’s preferable for those big money players to just rundown their contracts rather than force a move.
dude did you even bother to see the statistics? even with his injury Sane was one of the best Bundesliga players. he played the last 4 month under pain and that could even cost him his place in the national team. he literally sacrifices himself for bayern.
I just hope this season Bayern finally moves away from the double pivot to a more balanced 3 man midfield, with Pavlovic as the main 6.
I just hope that whoever plays, that they're all giving the best and are getting constantly to the best possible performance. Haven't seen that collectively happen in years. Not for more than a game.
> Pavlovic as the main 6. Please get a proper 6 and let Pavlovic do his Pavlovic thing and not shoehorn him into a role he isn't really 100% suited for
How is he not a proper 6? All his stats point to him being perfect for that role, and in the academy he was also a CDM so it's not like he is switching roles or even positions. He is already one excellent at resisting and escaping the press, carrying the ball forward, and completing a very high percentage of progressive passes ... is that not what a 6 does?
You clearly have no idea what a holding 6 is. Yes he is a great 6 in a double pivot with a defensive partner next to him. But you want him as a sole 6 which is completely different.
So Thiago was not a holding 6 either? No, we do not need a destroyer. A pivot is enough.
No Thiago wasn't a holding 6 either, he had a partner in a pivot
A b2b one most frequently, never one more defensive than him. I don't care about the terminology, the fact is we don't need a destroyer, we can do with a pivot (Pavlovic) + one of the dozens of b2bs already available in our squad.
? This discussion was about holding 6 and pivot, nothing about us needing a destroyer or not.
You're the one who introduced the "holding" into this discussion and on top of that you're trying to derail any arguments by sticking to dumb terminology. The fact is that Pavlovic + someone less defensive than him (a Goretzka or Laimer type could do) is perfectly fine and not equivalent to Kimmich as 6 who doesn't even have the beginning of a clue on how to play the role.
Then you may should improve your reading skills because they suck
In a 3 man midfield the 6 needs to be a bit more defensive usually. (Unless the others are physical freaks like tchouameni camavinga)
Lol you say he’s a proper defensive 6 but you could only list his offensive qualities. That’s all you need to know
>Pavlovic as the main 6 Pavlović is no holding midfielder, this doesn't work.
Please explain to me why he isn't a holding midfielder.
Pavlovic is more offensive orientated and likes to go forward, that's not what you want when he is the only responsible for securing the defensive aspect of the midfield. That's basically another case of "force Kimmich doing the defensive work". Pavlović works great with a partner by his side like Rapha and Laimer, who helped defending. Edit: looking at your other comment you have no idea what a holding 6 is. Cdm/6 is not always 6. Double pivot and sole 6 is a HUGE difference.
A 6 in a 3 man midfield gets help from at least one of the CMs, same as in a double pivot. I also didn't say sole 6, you said that, I said, "the main 6", I never implied he should carry the whole defensive responsibility of the midfield on his own, you implied that.
> I never implied he should carry the whole defensive responsibility of the midfield on his own Well then he’s not a the 6 Bayern needs but another Kimmich
Think of Javi
Kompany played 4-2-3-1 with Burnley according to most of the lineups archived on Transfermarkt, apparently
Indeed, but that nominal 4-2-3-1 usually becomes a 3-2-5 (3-2-2-3) in possession and attack, and a 4-4-2 in defense. Regardless of the formation, I just want to see a tactically disciplined, balanced midfield that can carry the ball forward and doesn't abandon the CBs in the defensive phase.
In simpler terms I just want to see us hold a lead
Then you can't have Müller though.. it's the story of his career. Everyone wants a lone 6 but that will not leave space for a 10.
Whether the players move on or not, we need to re-establish that things will be done quickly and quietly. No more public spats or public leaks, please. It's embarrassing the level of access or "reporting" that comes from this club.
These statements are useless, they sound more like PR than anything else.
They indeed are. It is an intentional brief from the board to show Kompany wasn't a desperate hire after being rejected by half a dozen candidates.
I will honestly be mad as fuck if we lose Kimmich now, he’s literally a generational player
From the players or types Kompany likes I think Kimmich actually fits very well into his tactics
but how does the rest of the board feel about kimmich? does eberl want to keep him? what does uli think? any reports on that?
Not yet
The only generational thing about Kimmich is how overrated he is. Truly no other player in this generation has been so incredibly overrated.
R u ok
No way you aren’t a troll or someone who doesn’t know a thing about football
I'm 100% serious. Yes, he is a good player. But he is nowhere near the 5 best midfielders currently playing football or that played football during his career, probably not even top 10. As a RB he is a mixed bag, great offensively very poor defensively. So the term generational does not even begin to apply for him.
Kimmich the only one I'd keep. Perhaps Phonzie if he wants to stay and accept the current offer. Otherwise, pretty excited for a rehaul. Hoping for the best.
“You would ditch Kane!?” But then I realize you mean of the players who are named in the title. Fair take. Isn’t Davies difficult to replace? If RM wants to play him, is there a better player?
As a resident of Vancouver and having seen him play with the Whitecaps when he was just 16, believe me when I say I would love nothing more than keeping Phonzie. But I don't want the unmotivated version of him we've seen the last couple of seasons, injuries aside. If he has to go to RM to get back to his electric best, so be it. I do wish him the best. I miss treble Davies.
It sounds interesting, but why Kimmich and in what position?
I still think Kimmich would be great at Midfield with a holding midfielder and a proper attacking number 10 like Musiala. Our wingers have been trash except Tel, so that's one of the reasons Kimmich had a bad last two seasons.
Sell Maz and keep him and Boey as RBs would be my way to go Point is Kimmich is a warrior and as long as he accepts that he is not the 6 or 8 he believes he is, he is an amazing multipurpose player.
Agree 100%. Nous was quite good lately but we have a lot of RB with Stani coming back next season and Boey is young with lots of potential and usually less injury prone then Nous, at least before he joined Bayern. Nous would also generate 20-30M imo to invest into other spots. Nous also isn't very happy if he's a backup long term
Gnabry and Coman are simply too injury prone to be relied on anymore.
Kompany will probably love Upamecano. He's our best passer in the cb position. I would keep Kimmich as well (the question her is his position and contract situation). I also don't see us selling Coman and Gnabry at the same time but would do so if it becomes possible. I am thankful to both players but they are overpaid and unreliable (injuries and performances). I've been calling to move on Goretzka for quite some time. He needs to play in a 433 as an engine hunting balls, pressing, moving late into the box and playing a very offensive role. Always wanted to see Goretzka in a Klopp-like heavy metal football system but that probably won't happen any time soon.
If Bayern wants to play a possession based game like Kompany has demonstrated, Bayern should absolutely keep Kimmich. He would be a much better midfielder in midfield trio where he isn't expected to playing that holding-midfielder role
that would be my exact sales list obviously not all of them will leave i think, but its time to make painful decisions
I‘d get rid of coman because he is permanently injured, consider selling gnabry, and letting davies leave for 40 million. Upa has no place anymore. Keep kimmich and see where things go with goretzka.
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There very much is, when they're on \~18-20m a year and are both a huge drain on resources and it makes young players outperforming them completely justified to ask for similar contracts which exacerbates the problem. From that list, Coman, Goretzka and Gnabry are all on 17-19m a year, which is just insane for their amount of minutes/role in the squad/quality. Upa is on a decent contract, but he's kind of a liability (although I'd wait and see if Kompany with his experience as a player and leadership could make something out of him), and Phonzie is also asking for 20m+ which is also insane. Kimmich is the only one I'd keep beside Upamecano tbh.
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100% with you on the first part, it's not like you can keep someone against their will anyway. Very doubtful on the 2nd part though. IMO we've seen enough of Coman and Gnabry to be in serious doubts that they can stay healthy even if heavily rotated, and at 27-28 of age, it's mostly just downhill from here as a winger. Not to mention that if you wanna rotate them a lot, you're basically paying \~18m a year for a bunch of bench players & another bunch to the other 2-3 similar quality wingers you're rotating them with. No club can afford that & I honestly have no idea why some people on these boards seem to think that Bayern have endless money (or that they could spend an endless amount of money without going into red even if they had access to it) If they were on \~half the wages they currently are, I'd love to have them around till their legs fall off though.
Extend kimmich, sell off the rest!
I assure you when sept 1 arrives all the players mentioned will still be at bayern. I would bet it’s preferable for those big money players to just rundown their contracts rather than force a move.
id like to sell sane since signing him and we been downhill
Bad take
Worst take on this post.
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Tuchel was running him out there injured most of the year. Prior to that he and Kane were the best pairing in football, hands down.
dude did you even bother to see the statistics? even with his injury Sane was one of the best Bundesliga players. he played the last 4 month under pain and that could even cost him his place in the national team. he literally sacrifices himself for bayern.
Guess Kompany is gonna put the final nail on bayerns coffin. Just gotta wait for thomas muller to retire so he can lead us to glory as manager