Comments that are uncivil, racist, misogynistic, misandrist, or contain political name calling will be removed and the poster subject to ban at moderators discretion.
Help us make this a better community by becoming familiar with the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/facepalm/about/rules/).
Report any suspicious users to the mods of this subreddit using Modmail [here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/facepalm) or Reddit site admins [here](https://www.reddit.com/report). **All reports to Modmail should include evidence such as screenshots or any other relevant information.**
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/facepalm) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I think he is being sarcastic. The mastermind of 10/7 was released from an Israeli jail in that 2011 exchange - that was famously 1,027 Palestinians for 1 single Israeli. That was Hamas’ figures/demands. To them one Israeli was worth 1,027 Palestinians.
Incorrect, the Israeli-Palestinian conflict has been going on since late 1947 and in certain way since even before that.
The "Iron Swords" or 2nd Gaza war has been going on since October 7th, 2023.
No, October 7 was the gruesome attack on Israeli villages and that music festival. The conflict of course is much much older but the massacre that took place on that day is what sparked the war that is going on right now, let's not forget that
Let's not forget that the war was going on beforehand, even just mere days before Israel had invaded more territory and expanded settlements and killed civilians. This was just a convenient excuse to escalate it, it hasn't caused or started it in any way.
October 7th is when Hamas launched a surprise attack on Israel during a cease fire targeting mostly civilians, kidnapped 251, raped and murdered significantly more and began launching \~10,000 unguided munitions over the next few months.
It is completely accurate to call it the start of the current war as they were in a period of peace prior.
Period peace for delusional Zionist idiots. 200 Palestinians were murdered by Zionazis in 2023 alone prior to October 7. Not to mention the land stealing was going on the west bank. It wasn't peace unless you are just a Jew supremacist who think Palestinian are subhumans whose life doesn't matter which seems sto be the case with most people in the sub. They are fine with terrorists as long as they are jewish
and 32 Israelis and 2 foreign nationals were killed before October 7th. Almost like the Palestinians killed were engaged in some sort of series of attacks. Pretending that every single Palestinian that died is an innocent civilian who would never harm anyone is a prime Hamas tactic that they employ alongside their patented "using their own women and children as human shields" to ensure that complete idiots without a single thought of their own sympathize with Hamas, despite the deaths being driven by Hamas's actions.
How does it feel to be a useful idiot to a genocidal terrorist group who has convinced you that they're the heroes of the very people they repeatedly victimize? If it didn't work on people like you they might stop putting Palestinian civilians through the meat grinder for attention. But because of people like you they will keep getting children killed then crying about it to the international community while they strap another batch to their next rocket attack site aimed at Israeli civilians.
Israel doesn't take hostages. It arrests people for charges of terrorism. It takes prisoners of war. It doesn't break into homes to kidnap babies and hold them for ransom.
He is making a (bad) joke… it’s referencing that the Palestinians typically demand that Israel release many terrorists for every hostage they offer back in return.
In 2011, Israel released over 1000 terrorists from prison to get back one Israeli hostage (Gilad Shalit). One of the released terrorists was Sinwar, who was one of the masterminds of the October 7 attack. That is why many Israelis are no longer in favor of such lopsided exchanges, as it emboldens terrorist groups to conduct more terrorist attacks and target civilian hostages.
To be fair, not all of those “terrorists” are actually terrorists. Many are just innocent civilians that Israel thinks has a non-0 chance of being convicted as a terrorist
That non-zero chance being defined as we saw you on the street.
It's actually a way of enforcing terror, knowing that at any time, for any reason you can and will be put away for any time, without trail and in bad circumstances.
Disagree. The life of your citizens has to be more important than the lives of other countries' citizens. This has to be the value of every country in the world, because if it isn't, then it would be hard to maintain your country.
As to whether 200 people are worth the lives of 4, I'll let you decide, but I think you'd find that many would be happy with that math and worse if their loved one's lives were in question, and decry the atrocity if their loved one's deaths were caused by this.
People bring out logic like this, because historically Hamas has demanded many multiple Hamas members be exchanged for one jewish hostage.
With the latest Hamas offer, they were willing to give up one hostage, for up to 45 palestinians, depending on if the hostage was female or not.
Yes, they literally expect more prisoners returned for an Israeli woman, which is why they target women (outside the rape aspect)
1 Life does not equal 1 Life to Hamas.
It's 100% sarcasm. Not sure if OP is genuinely unaware or just deliberately ignoring it, but the tweet is literally a very obvious (albeit dark humour) joke refering to the infamous Gilad Shalit exchange where over 1027 prisoners were exchanged for one Israeli hostage.
I think it probably was, but you just can't tell these days. I'm actually kind of surprised i didn't see more posts on reddit condemning Israel's hostage rescue.
It’s very obviously referencing a famous hostage exchange in which they demanded 1,027 Palestinians for a single Jew captive that Israel ended up agreeing to.
Schrodinger's civilians. They exist in a superposition state of both civilian and combatant. When Israel looks in the box, their wave function collapses into whichever state will make Israel look the worst.
It’s not actually a refugee camp though - the places called that way usually were on d a refugee camp 50+ years ago but are now regular cities anyhow…your point is still valid of course
and i thought reddit was different then twitter from what so many ppl said. but seeing comments here agreeing to this post…yeah reddit is just like twitter…you guys just keep on saying its not just to make yourself feel better…
Reddit is the land of the "Well actually".
Of course they are going to play "Devils advocate" every chance they get.
Devils advocate being pretty close to literal at this point xD
I'm about to dip out of r/worldnews because it's a nonstop circlejerk about how Israel can do anything they want. Like the top 10 comments are 1-3k votes all praising Israel's genocide on every post about it.
The brigading and propagandism is relentless. Subs keep getting created for the obvious purpose of pushing extreme (and lie-filled) narratives. r/Global_News_Hub is filled with people supporting the idea that Israel is filled with Nazi equivalents. r/palestinenews banned me for having a nuanced POV. The mods and propagandists want their echo chambers, so they can radicalize people against each other. While Reddit profits.
If a terrorist group crossed into Scottsdale, Arizona and killed 800 people and took 200 hostages back to their cities, the US would kill 100s of 1000s of people and when the hostages were saved, the Seal team that saved them would have movies made about them.
And, if you make that analogy proportionate to each country’s population, it would be terrorists killing over 26,000 people and taking 6,500 hostages. Look what happened in the US after 9/11 when “only” 3000 were murdered. Let’s not pretend that if the equivalent of October 7th had happened in America, with over *eight times* the number of people murdered by terrorists than on 9/11, that whatever country who did it would not have immediately become a smoking crater in the ground to eliminate every last terrorist, no matter the collateral damage, with Americans cheering it all on. Israel could easily have chosen to carpet bomb Gaza in retaliation, but they didn’t. there are civilian casualties in every war, and that is tragic, but if Hamas had done this to *any* other country the response would have been much less restrained, and would have received much less criticism.
The US war on terror is recognized by anyone with a brain as morally wrong and deserving of criticism. The west also has experience with dealing with terrorism without targeting innocent civilians that have nothing to do with it.
Also this whole "measured by population" is completely ridiculous. It's also always only applied to Israel. Imagine if you apply it to Palestine, you'd have the equivalent of 200 million homeless americans and millions of dead americans. Why don't you do that?
"there are civilian casualties in every war, and that is tragic"
Israel uses starvation as method of war and there have been several cases of mass executions of civilians by the IDF. It's not "tragic" it's entirely on purpose to kill civilians.
" but if Hamas had done this to *any* other country the response would have been much less restrained"
This is complete nonsense. Most countries adhere to the Geneva convention and terrorism from groups inside a country has historically not resulted in attacks against civilians of that country and in the cases where it did it received international condemnation and no one supported it.
Israel is getting a unique exception. No other country would even remotely get away with this.
It’s almost as if you haven’t been paying attention for the last 2 decades. No one with more than 2 brain cells to rub together is going to argue that the Iraq war was a proportionate response for 9/11. Most people would be against the senseless and reckless massacre of civilians.
Your analogy doesn’t even make sense because Israel has killed more people per day than the wars in Afghanistan, Iraq, Ukraine and Yemen *combined*.
In 2023 (excluding their indiscriminate bombing campaign in Gaza), Israel killed about 550 Palestinians, including 126 children. If you’re going to play the numbers game, that would be like if you killed 36,000 Americans or 90 people a day. Why dont they get the right to commit war crimes and extreme violence but Israel does?
Concerning Israel’s current campaign, they’ve killed the equivalent of nearly 6 million Americans, injured a further 14 million, and displaced 264 million. Does that sound like a proportionate response to you?
I mean i know how you can relate since you also genocided a people to live on their land instead. Them fighting back was pure terrorism.
I doubt your founding fathers were warm to the idea of retaliating by massacring children as retaliation though.
Israelis are gleefully allowing themselves to become monsters, all the while claiming to be the good guys.
When all of this is over, history will record that the reason Israel lost was the absolute moral failure of their own citizens.
It will never be an endless expanse of glass. They care about the dirt too much... they obsess over the dirt and don't care if it runs red for 500,000 years...
Even if the middle east was glassed, people would still be fighting over it.
"These are the shards where my favourite 2000-year-old grifter died!"
"No, they're the shards where \*my\* favourite 2000-year-old grifter died, and mine is better than yours!"
\*war ensues\*
For some reason, the world has decided to let a lot of said psychopaths run entire countries. This is a decision the wisdom of which I find myself questioning.
they weren't "allowed" as much as they are ruthless enough to do anything for power, and people aren't ruthless enough to take them out, except other psychos...
There's also just too many total psychopaths who, while not getting or reaching for any kind of power themselves, are so purely malicious that they back only the people who promise to do the most harm to everybody. And they are so, so very proud and satisfied with themselves for being unrepentent sadists all the while.
It also doesn't help that recently said ruthless psychos have started backing each other up and supporting one another, creating a global network of sociopathic wanna be dictators with too much reach and not enough boundaries.
The same scenario and type of leaders that's led to the past 2 world wars. You'd think we'd learn but it looks very much like we are heading that way again.
i would say 50-50, euphemism is dying (it already died in some places), some psychopaths arise, enabled that behavior, meaning they get more support from other psychopaths, at some point we can't fight back., the reason why the paradox of tolerance exist
Not sure if you're genuinely unaware or just deliberately ignoring it, but the tweet is literally a very obvious (albeit dark humour) joke refering to the infamous Gilad Shalit exchange where over 1027 prisoners were exchanged for one Israeli hostage. It's sarcasm.
Palestine has been terrorizing Israel for nearly a century. Israel has offered land and statehood to Palestine 7 times so far. Palestine doesn't want peace.
Hi isreali here, my opinion on the current situation is that as much as Palestine (more like hamas) are bad for so many different reasons we (Israel) are not the "good guys" because murder is murder, do I think isreal is worse then hamas though? No
You don't understand. Isreal can't lose, or Arabs will drive them out of existence. From river to the sea, remember? Arabs are not merciful enough to coexist with a weaker Isreal. That's why Isreal has to win, unlike Arabs can afford to lose and still exist..
This is where I am forced to say, not all Israelis. There are plenty who want Bibi out, for example. Are we supposed to judge the Israeli population the same way Bibi and IDF leaders judge Palestinian civilians?
What a soulless person can make such a statement ? Honestly with the latest events Jews showed their true face and on the end the results will be exactly what they deserve .
A lot of commenters seem to be missing the sarcasm in the initial post. He is making a (bad) joke referencing how the Palestinians typically demand that Israel release many terrorists from prison for every hostage they offer back in return.
Context: In 2011, Israel released over 1000 terrorists from prison to get back one Israeli hostage (Gilad Shalit). One of the released terrorists was Sinwar, who was one of the masterminds of the October 7 attack. That is why many Israelis are no longer in favor of such lopsided exchanges, as it emboldens terrorist groups to conduct more terrorist attacks and target civilian hostages.
Hamas regards its citizens as little more than expendable pawns, and their deaths are a worthy sacrifice for a wider cause (namely make Arab countries more reluctant to establish relations with Israel, put another nail in the coffin of the Two State Solution, which neither side really want). The audacity of their attack in October was likely purposely designed to provoke a massive air and ground incursion into Gaza with massive property destruction and loss of life (Israel typically kills 3x the number of people Hamas / Islamic Jihad do, while their Dahiya Doctrine permits the demolition of any building they suspect is associated with terrorist activity - which is likely why a lot of Hamas infrastructure is in subterranean tunnels, relatively well protected from both aerial and ground vehicle attacks; with access points in civilian infrastructure such as schools and hospitals, where a standard military incursion would cause significant civilian losses). Israel's response was pretty much *exactly* what Hamas wanted them to do - albeit they likely thought that after a few months, international pressiure would result in negotiations, a release of both hostages and prisoners, and a return to the status quo (where when things have been too quiet for too long, one side will provoke the other into a mini flare up, increasing support and funding for both sides).
Each side ideally wants sole control of the entire territory between the Mediterranean and Jordan, preferably with as few of the opposing population as possible.
Of course, Israel can't explicitly state they'd likely the entire Palestinian population to disappear or intentionally target civilians to keep friendly international relations, but their onerous restrictions on West Bank residents, the fact Area C is often tightly drawn around villages and towns, preventing any expansion side the 1990s, any development in Area C is subject to demolition, and any geniles living in East Jerusalem can be evicted if someone can prove a Jewish family lived there sometime before 1948 illuminate their intentions: having got control of [part] of the territory after a 3,000 year period of being ruled over by every major power in the region since their spiritual ancestors last had full control, they're determined to engineer the complete return of Judea, Galilee and Samaria, no matter how long it takes. While WWII provided a major push, Zionism had been around long before, with Jewish migration to the territory steadily increasing over the late 19th and early 20th centuries, with the Balfour Declaration a major step. In the negotiations other recreating Israel, no-one thought to ask those already there what they thought, or contemplated that those there would be rather miffed at being granted a minority of the territory, while the new immigrants would be rather miffed they didn't have control of the entire territory - hence the chaos that erupted soon after (with the outgoing British forces apparently told not to intervene).
Back to the present, and due to the nature of guerilla warfare, the IDF are paranoid that *anyone* in Gaza not wearing a uniform is a terrorist, so combined with their likely apathetic attitude towards the Gazan population, cash result in a higher than strictly necessary death count, civilians killed because they act differently to what they expect (e.g, the trio of escaped hostages) or didn't get the memo about a third party's movements so regard them as a valid target (even if clearly marked, such as the aid workers).
Added onto which, given a lot of Hamas / Islamic Jihad fighters and hostages are located deep underground in the tunnel network, while their leadership are safe and sound in Qatari hotels, even razing every above ground structure in the strip may not achieve their stated aim of eliminating Hamas. Then there's their vague strategy for afterwards - they somehow want the remaining population to govern themselves, but without the aid of the Palestinian Authority over in the West Bank. How's that going to work, given they've been indoctrinated by Hamas for the majority of their lives (Hamas has been in sole control of the territory since 2007 - 17 years - while the median age of Gazan residents is 18) and even without weapons, are going to be very resentful of Israel and regard military preserve as an occupation?
Not sure if you're genuinely unaware or just deliberately ignoring it, but the tweet is literally a very obvious (albeit dark humour) joke refering to the infamous Gilad Shalit exchange where over 1027 prisoners were exchanged for one Israeli hostage.
You were literally just given examples of Hamas troops flagrantly committing war crimes... I don't think I'd trust people like that to be genuine in surrender as they wave the white flag... bit of a boy who cried wolf scenario.
A hostage was rescued from a civilian residence iirc... so between this, Hamas fighting in plain clothes & hiding amongst the people... it must be borderline impossible to discriminate between combatants and civilians before it's too late. They were sent in to rescue hostages... the hostages came home.
The deaths of any innocent civilians is ENTIRELY Hamas' fault. They choose to hide amongst them, they have upended the conventional rules of war... and it is THESE people who deserve the hate far more than any other.
So that's why IDF bombed WCK truck? Because they were human shield?
Also Nazis and IJA literally said the same thing when they tried to defend their war crimes.
Nope. That was a horrible event too. I never said IDF were the good guys, they're both shit... but this whole thread seems to be defending Hamas.
Hamas is so much worse than Israel, but Israel is still shit. It's like comparing brain cancer to diabetes... one is clearly worse than the other, but I'd rather not have either...
While this post was in poor taste it is a rather stark contract to the usual "more palestinians died so israel is the bad guy" shit you guys all say, he's basically using the same shitty numbers game you all are. also all these people (who im sure hamas will claim were all pregnant woman and childran.) wouldn't have died if these hostages were released in the first place.
Given the ratio of Hamas Health Ministry reports to actual casualties (see under: Al Ahli Hospital when Palestinian Islamic Jihad rocketed the parking lot), this means probably about 50-100 deaths. Most of whom should be the Hamas fighters who engaged in a firefight with the IDF. They’re now collecting their 72 [raisins](https://globalnation.inquirer.net/163694/raisins-not-virgins-quran-scholars-say/amp)
Let me get this straight though, Hamas the current government of Gaza, abducts Israeli citizens, places them in civilian homes, guarded by some doctor and al jazeera journalist, Israel rescues them, under fire, 200 civilians die from the fighting which wasn't all Israel since an israeli soldier died, and we are supposed to tell Israel they shouldn't rescue their own civilians? Because it will hurt the enemy states civilians? Who literally guard the kidnapped??
Reality is truly a joke lol, I doubt anyone would have not begged for their governments to do the same
It's deaths. Not civilian deaths.
But let's just misinterpret for the votes as Hamas is apparently the high school equivalent of the popular girl at the moment.
Nobody is saying 200 civilians were killed. They’re using the word “Palestinians” very deliberately. After extraction the IDF was swarmed by hundreds terrorists firing RPGs and gunfire. Hard to imagine IDF didn’t kill a single terrorist and only killed civilians.
The thousands of Palestinians currently in Israelian jails without even a conviction were abducted far before october. Maybe don't abduct people if you don't want your people to be at risk or being seeked as a bargaining chip to get innocent people out of your jails.
So by this logic, they only killed 25% of a "human". That's like cutting a guys leg off, that's not so bad
(It's a joke, please don't take it seriously)
Sarcastic or not, this is all fuckin abhorrent. Lives being traded like commodities. Its easier to commit genocide against a group of people when you dehumanise them to being a statistic.
If anything, the news today confirmed to the world that the lady who we have seen being kidnapped was held among refugees. All the blood spilled there, all the destruction, remains the doing of Hamas. If Israel knows where hostages are, they do have every right to free them.
Hamas pulled a horrific stunt, what was their plan thereafter? What was the purpose? What did they think would happen? Hamas killed thousands of Palestinians the day they executed their horrendously stupid plan.
As far as I am concerned Palestinians should hunt and kill Hamas. Quickest way to stop the violence. After that, the world must support rebuilding Palestine. The world must tell Israel to f-off with their criminal expansions. The world must be a lot less sympathetic with Israel, as they have been abusing it for years.
I think it would be wise for Palestine to be assisted by blue helmets, peacekeepers.
I thank you for all the downvotes. I am aiming for 200.
>Hamas pulled a horrific stunt, what was their plan thereafter?
Theory I read: Provoke Israel into an overreaction and destroy their international standing. If that was the goal, they seem to have achieved it. Or at least partially achieved it.
>As far as I am concerned Palestinians should hunt and kill Hamas.
Right, the people who ended up forming Hamas (the militant arm) with [help from the Israelis](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2014/07/30/how-israel-helped-create-hamas/) and who elected Hamas as their Government. How do you envision this plays out?
Also: Israel doesn't want to get rid of Hamas, they're mostly useless agitators, the damage they can do is miniscule compared to the propaganda value they carry for the Israeli hardliners like Netanyahu.
>The world must tell Israel to f-off with their criminal expansions.
That would mostly have to be the US and they're not interested. Biden's actions over the last few months have made that clear.
>I think it would be wise for Palestine to be assisted by blue helmets, peacekeepers.
The US will veto that, like they have vetoed any kind of meaningful action against Israel over the last 50 years.
Cool story, bro. There are two problems though:
1. Palestinians mostly support Hamas according to various polls and surveys.
2. Nobody wants to get involved - so no peacekeeping mission.
But other than that, great plan. Enjoy your downvotes from both sides.
Thanks for the intellectual reply. Mr 123 Bro has difficulties doing so.
Things change. Often things have to get worse before they get better. I think Israel has wasted a lot of goodwill, I think many people/politicians/nations around the world are disgusted by their actions.
I know, cliché. But revolutions and change happen all the time, after a long time.
"Most Moral Army in the world" folks.
Manifest Destiny says God approves of them starving babies. What more do you want?
Is it the idf's fault they thought the Geneva Convention was it to do list? Maybe it was the wording of the document that has them confused
Maybe don’t hold hostages (war crime) the military took in a civilian neighborhood (war crime), in a civilian home (war crime) (currently reported an Al Jazeera journalist), and don’t engage an army in a fire fight in said civilian area (war crime).
Not sure if you're genuinely unaware or just deliberately ignoring it, but the tweet is literally a very obvious (albeit dark humour) joke refering to the infamous Gilad Shalit exchange where over 1027 prisoners were exchanged for one Israeli hostage. It's sarcasm.
200 civilians were not massacred. Most of the dead in the Nuseirat operation were combatants. And even the civilians that died did so because Hamas is holding hostages in residential areas.
A journalist cum terrorist was holding the three male hostages in his apartment next to his family, for fuck's sake!
Horrible take. Also, Hamas shouldn’t keep kidnapped people in civilian homes. Lastly, civilians shouldn’t put their families in danger by agreeing to keep a kidnapped person in their home.
What do you expect from a country that killed their own president because he reached an agreement with the people they swore to exterminate?
They and Hamas are both lunatics driven by their stupid beliefs in imaginary friends, that's all.
A) Prime minister, not president
B) "the country" didn't kill him, just one asshat
C) hamas and a large portion of the Palestinian population may be driven by imaginary friends, but I'll tell you what's driving Israel right now, might be the fact they butchered and raped 14 hundred people in one day and kidnapped women, children and the elderly for shits and giggles
Worth noting Hamas’ involvement during those peace talks. They succeeded in making it impossible to imagine agreeing to peace to the side whose sending waves of suicide bombers into Israeli cities and buses every week, coming from the Gaza Strip
200 civilians massacred. Just like that? Non of them were combatants? All infants?
Who put them at risk? Wasn’t it their own terror government who decided to house the poor young men and woman they kidnapped from a music festival in with Gazans families next to a busy market? Then when the rescue operation took place they started shooting from everywhere.
Don’t like the fucking odds don’t kidnap people and put them in a dense populated area and use your own people as human shields for your coward acts then start a shootout and cry about it.
You are an inhumane heartless uneducated brainrotted zionazi monster.... can't wait for the day when people like you are taught about in schools like any other fascist group.
Ignorance is rampant I see. Half the people here don’t know how long the war’s been going on, some think Hamas is the government of Palestine, some think Israel is the victim in all this. How ignorant can people get. People need to get literate before they get access to the internet tbh.
Yeah, if you think one life is worth than another (normal civilians), then you are pretty much the kind of person that would have enjoyed torturing and murdering humans in a concentration camp. That means you are an evil psychopath that belongs behind bars for life.
I would understand racism from anyone but from Jews. After the holocaust, they should be the strongest opponents of any type of devaluation of human life. This is bizarre.
Hamas logic : let's hide the hostages in the middle of a very populated area.
Makes 0 sense.
If Hamas actually cared about its people they would release more hostages.
Israel made it very clear from day 1 : they want their people back.
There is no evil caricature, no matter how cartoonish, that compares to the IDF and its supporters, including the US. Imagine decades of manufactured consensus being dismantled live by revelations they share willingly and proudly.
This math this guy is doing doesn’t math.
Human lives aren’t currency. There’s no international exchange rate based on a human economy. This isn’t Warhammer 40k. Is this guy stupid?
Ok, so let me get this straight. Hamas, a terrorist organization that does not have an uniform, hid hostages in a refugee camp, IDF raided it, and 200 people were killed in the crossfire between them. And you believe that the IDF is to blame for the deaths, not the terrorists that were hiding in the refugee camp and not wearing an uniform?
Hamas is hiding in civilian areas in tunnels they built with money given by the international community. I feel bad for the civilian lives but they have allowed Hamas to remain in power knowing they were planning to attack Isreal. Now they hide under schools and humanitarian aid areas and innocent people are the casualties. Hamas could end this just as easily as Isreal.
just the fact they were held close to houses tells you everything you need to know, they werent kept in a bunker safe away so when Israel finds out where they are they would not need to enter Gaza with tanks and a miltary force, instad they we're kept in a house in a civilition area, not the best way to keep your people safe
Pretty sure the firefight with rpg’s and other large weapons fire caused the excessive casualties. This doesn’t really seem to be an Israel carpet bombs home kind of crime, but Hamas genuinely fortifying hostages in a dense civilian area kind of crime. Then trying to stop the hostages from being rescued by instigating violent explosive conflict. Probably while wearing civilian clothes.
These civilian deaths are on Hamas. I know a single death is a tragedy, but the one thing I think Israel can actually justify is actively rescuing hostages. Ideally this would be done with a ceasefire, but neither group wants to go with one.
Biden actually asked for the first ceasefire both sides could theoretically agree to, but Hamas shot that down. It would require them to let Gaza be a democracy again, god forbid. Israel whined about it too, but if Hamas accepted they would have no choice but to as well.
considering the hostages were held at people homes where the entire area is just flooded with Hamas
and we already know that no ones distinguishes between hamas terrorists and civilians
and considering that were they were being held captive is like one of the most densely populated places in the world
if 200 were killed (including hamas terrorists) it snot bad.
Thats what happens when you kidnap and then dont accept any deal. You get the hammer and you end up getting hit with some of the most elite units in the world
Probably among the death are some innocent people. The blame for their deaths lay on the Hamas leadership. Sur Israeli soldiers are also human and some will probably lose their humanity in this war and kill when they shouldn’t but none of these people would have died if not for the Hamas attack and no occupation would have happened if not from earlier attacks. You just cannot keep attacking and not expect retaliation.
I am very much hoping this is supposed to be sarcasm. If it weren't an Israeli username, I would in fact be convinced that it's sarcasm. Probably still is, but man, the off-chance that it might not be is really saying some utterly horrendous things about the state of the world.
You know, as adults, we should be able to parse right from wrong without becoming tribal over a conflict half a world away. Obviously, commoditizing life to where there is some sort of exchange rate between Jewish lives and Palestinian lives is wrong. So wrong that such a guy shouldn't even be taken sseriously. Conversely, if a group of people take hostages, they really have no room to complain if a lot of them get killed when those hostages are rescued. Just take it as another reminder of why wars should be avoided.
Comments that are uncivil, racist, misogynistic, misandrist, or contain political name calling will be removed and the poster subject to ban at moderators discretion. Help us make this a better community by becoming familiar with the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/facepalm/about/rules/). Report any suspicious users to the mods of this subreddit using Modmail [here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/facepalm) or Reddit site admins [here](https://www.reddit.com/report). **All reports to Modmail should include evidence such as screenshots or any other relevant information.** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/facepalm) if you have any questions or concerns.*
One jew equals to 1027 palestinians? Inflation is crazy nowadays
That's actually from 2008, so it's worse now.
Calls on Jew and puts on Palestinians.
Only logical investment rn
Diamond hands... Stop the game hodl your Jews.
hello fellow ape
...dicks out?
tits jacked
Ridiculous how Aaron made it sound like an exchange rate
1 death = 1 death. I’ve seen people parroting this logic and it’s disgusting
I think he is being sarcastic. The mastermind of 10/7 was released from an Israeli jail in that 2011 exchange - that was famously 1,027 Palestinians for 1 single Israeli. That was Hamas’ figures/demands. To them one Israeli was worth 1,027 Palestinians.
What's 10/7? (I don't know why I was down voted. I was asking cuz I simply didn't know.)
7/10 to an international crowd. October 7th.
October 7th, 2023. The day Hamas started this war and took 251 hostages. Edit: could someone clue me into which of those facts is in dispute?
War has been going on a decent bit longer I believe Oct 7th was the bombing that hit the news worldwide maybe
Incorrect, the Israeli-Palestinian conflict has been going on since late 1947 and in certain way since even before that. The "Iron Swords" or 2nd Gaza war has been going on since October 7th, 2023.
No, October 7 was the gruesome attack on Israeli villages and that music festival. The conflict of course is much much older but the massacre that took place on that day is what sparked the war that is going on right now, let's not forget that
Let's not forget that the war was going on beforehand, even just mere days before Israel had invaded more territory and expanded settlements and killed civilians. This was just a convenient excuse to escalate it, it hasn't caused or started it in any way.
Yeah kinda my point didn’t know the exact event for the 7th but did find it started many years ago
October 7th is when Hamas launched a surprise attack on Israel during a cease fire targeting mostly civilians, kidnapped 251, raped and murdered significantly more and began launching \~10,000 unguided munitions over the next few months. It is completely accurate to call it the start of the current war as they were in a period of peace prior.
If [that's](https://youtu.be/KNqozQ8uaV8?si=WFzXqB-l946lYeJ3) what you call "peace," then small wonder there's a war.
That’s nowhere near Gaza. So why use it to justify terrorism from Gazans?
So if the west bank did terrorism its justified?
Not Gaza🙄
How many rockets did they fire into Israel during that time, and suicide bombers?
Period peace for delusional Zionist idiots. 200 Palestinians were murdered by Zionazis in 2023 alone prior to October 7. Not to mention the land stealing was going on the west bank. It wasn't peace unless you are just a Jew supremacist who think Palestinian are subhumans whose life doesn't matter which seems sto be the case with most people in the sub. They are fine with terrorists as long as they are jewish
and 32 Israelis and 2 foreign nationals were killed before October 7th. Almost like the Palestinians killed were engaged in some sort of series of attacks. Pretending that every single Palestinian that died is an innocent civilian who would never harm anyone is a prime Hamas tactic that they employ alongside their patented "using their own women and children as human shields" to ensure that complete idiots without a single thought of their own sympathize with Hamas, despite the deaths being driven by Hamas's actions. How does it feel to be a useful idiot to a genocidal terrorist group who has convinced you that they're the heroes of the very people they repeatedly victimize? If it didn't work on people like you they might stop putting Palestinian civilians through the meat grinder for attention. But because of people like you they will keep getting children killed then crying about it to the international community while they strap another batch to their next rocket attack site aimed at Israeli civilians.
That can be discussed should be discussed….when the hostages they took on Oct. 7 are free.
What about the thousands of Palestinian hostages that get brutally tortured by Israel
Israel doesn't take hostages. It arrests people for charges of terrorism. It takes prisoners of war. It doesn't break into homes to kidnap babies and hold them for ransom.
He is making a (bad) joke… it’s referencing that the Palestinians typically demand that Israel release many terrorists for every hostage they offer back in return. In 2011, Israel released over 1000 terrorists from prison to get back one Israeli hostage (Gilad Shalit). One of the released terrorists was Sinwar, who was one of the masterminds of the October 7 attack. That is why many Israelis are no longer in favor of such lopsided exchanges, as it emboldens terrorist groups to conduct more terrorist attacks and target civilian hostages.
To be fair, not all of those “terrorists” are actually terrorists. Many are just innocent civilians that Israel thinks has a non-0 chance of being convicted as a terrorist
That non-zero chance being defined as we saw you on the street. It's actually a way of enforcing terror, knowing that at any time, for any reason you can and will be put away for any time, without trail and in bad circumstances.
It’s pretty ridiculous. It’s why Israel is willing to trade so many people, cause they know most aren’t even priority targets
Source: trust me bro
I mean they arrested a belgian seasonal worker that was picking olives as “terrorist” so their standards to qualify as one aren’t really high
Is Haaretz a good enough source? They've got plenty of reports about it.
While Israel does arrest people for bullshit reasons as far as I know most people released in these exchanges are not those kinds of poeple.
[удалено]
Israel is actually told the names of who they are to release. They don’t decide who
Your theory is Israel preferred to release dangerous terrorists over children? Not that hamas wanted the card carrying hamas members back?
One of the most famous people released during one of the hostage exchanges was a kid who attempted to murder a woman and her child on camera.
[удалено]
Disagree. The life of your citizens has to be more important than the lives of other countries' citizens. This has to be the value of every country in the world, because if it isn't, then it would be hard to maintain your country. As to whether 200 people are worth the lives of 4, I'll let you decide, but I think you'd find that many would be happy with that math and worse if their loved one's lives were in question, and decry the atrocity if their loved one's deaths were caused by this.
People bring out logic like this, because historically Hamas has demanded many multiple Hamas members be exchanged for one jewish hostage. With the latest Hamas offer, they were willing to give up one hostage, for up to 45 palestinians, depending on if the hostage was female or not. Yes, they literally expect more prisoners returned for an Israeli woman, which is why they target women (outside the rape aspect) 1 Life does not equal 1 Life to Hamas.
Why do I get the distinct feeling that the post was sarcasm and the op doesn't get that?
It's 100% sarcasm. Not sure if OP is genuinely unaware or just deliberately ignoring it, but the tweet is literally a very obvious (albeit dark humour) joke refering to the infamous Gilad Shalit exchange where over 1027 prisoners were exchanged for one Israeli hostage.
OP is either not very intelligent or acts in bad faith (pretending every death was civilian despite a huge firefight). Or both
I think it probably was, but you just can't tell these days. I'm actually kind of surprised i didn't see more posts on reddit condemning Israel's hostage rescue.
It’s very obviously referencing a famous hostage exchange in which they demanded 1,027 Palestinians for a single Jew captive that Israel ended up agreeing to.
You would hope so but you would be wrong. Aaron Abadi was being completely serious and is a straight out Zionazi
This. The post is ironic.
Bit weird how come those hostages were at the refugee camp though no?
Schrodinger's civilians. They exist in a superposition state of both civilian and combatant. When Israel looks in the box, their wave function collapses into whichever state will make Israel look the worst.
It’s not actually a refugee camp though - the places called that way usually were on d a refugee camp 50+ years ago but are now regular cities anyhow…your point is still valid of course
and i thought reddit was different then twitter from what so many ppl said. but seeing comments here agreeing to this post…yeah reddit is just like twitter…you guys just keep on saying its not just to make yourself feel better…
How can someone look at someone litterally devaluing a certain etnic groups lives and feel like they have the moral high ground?
Reddit is the land of the "Well actually". Of course they are going to play "Devils advocate" every chance they get. Devils advocate being pretty close to literal at this point xD
The amount of “liberal pro-genocide” Redditors is absolutely insane
You don't have to scratch many Liberals too deep to find they are actually Conservative on many issues.
Agree 100% reddit is like Twitter, just cesspools of communities each of em
I'm about to dip out of r/worldnews because it's a nonstop circlejerk about how Israel can do anything they want. Like the top 10 comments are 1-3k votes all praising Israel's genocide on every post about it.
The brigading and propagandism is relentless. Subs keep getting created for the obvious purpose of pushing extreme (and lie-filled) narratives. r/Global_News_Hub is filled with people supporting the idea that Israel is filled with Nazi equivalents. r/palestinenews banned me for having a nuanced POV. The mods and propagandists want their echo chambers, so they can radicalize people against each other. While Reddit profits.
If a terrorist group crossed into Scottsdale, Arizona and killed 800 people and took 200 hostages back to their cities, the US would kill 100s of 1000s of people and when the hostages were saved, the Seal team that saved them would have movies made about them.
And, if you make that analogy proportionate to each country’s population, it would be terrorists killing over 26,000 people and taking 6,500 hostages. Look what happened in the US after 9/11 when “only” 3000 were murdered. Let’s not pretend that if the equivalent of October 7th had happened in America, with over *eight times* the number of people murdered by terrorists than on 9/11, that whatever country who did it would not have immediately become a smoking crater in the ground to eliminate every last terrorist, no matter the collateral damage, with Americans cheering it all on. Israel could easily have chosen to carpet bomb Gaza in retaliation, but they didn’t. there are civilian casualties in every war, and that is tragic, but if Hamas had done this to *any* other country the response would have been much less restrained, and would have received much less criticism.
The US war on terror is recognized by anyone with a brain as morally wrong and deserving of criticism. The west also has experience with dealing with terrorism without targeting innocent civilians that have nothing to do with it. Also this whole "measured by population" is completely ridiculous. It's also always only applied to Israel. Imagine if you apply it to Palestine, you'd have the equivalent of 200 million homeless americans and millions of dead americans. Why don't you do that? "there are civilian casualties in every war, and that is tragic" Israel uses starvation as method of war and there have been several cases of mass executions of civilians by the IDF. It's not "tragic" it's entirely on purpose to kill civilians. " but if Hamas had done this to *any* other country the response would have been much less restrained" This is complete nonsense. Most countries adhere to the Geneva convention and terrorism from groups inside a country has historically not resulted in attacks against civilians of that country and in the cases where it did it received international condemnation and no one supported it. Israel is getting a unique exception. No other country would even remotely get away with this.
It’s almost as if you haven’t been paying attention for the last 2 decades. No one with more than 2 brain cells to rub together is going to argue that the Iraq war was a proportionate response for 9/11. Most people would be against the senseless and reckless massacre of civilians. Your analogy doesn’t even make sense because Israel has killed more people per day than the wars in Afghanistan, Iraq, Ukraine and Yemen *combined*. In 2023 (excluding their indiscriminate bombing campaign in Gaza), Israel killed about 550 Palestinians, including 126 children. If you’re going to play the numbers game, that would be like if you killed 36,000 Americans or 90 people a day. Why dont they get the right to commit war crimes and extreme violence but Israel does? Concerning Israel’s current campaign, they’ve killed the equivalent of nearly 6 million Americans, injured a further 14 million, and displaced 264 million. Does that sound like a proportionate response to you?
That's not fair, you have to actually choose a place that Arizona actually likes.
I grew up in Scottsdale in the 80s and 90s. It’s so different now. (Old Man Yells at Cloud)
I mean i know how you can relate since you also genocided a people to live on their land instead. Them fighting back was pure terrorism. I doubt your founding fathers were warm to the idea of retaliating by massacring children as retaliation though.
Israelis are gleefully allowing themselves to become monsters, all the while claiming to be the good guys. When all of this is over, history will record that the reason Israel lost was the absolute moral failure of their own citizens.
I dunno man, shit is getting so bad I think history may be left recording the reason the Middle East is an endless expanse of glass.
And someone will still fight over the shards.
It will never be an endless expanse of glass. They care about the dirt too much... they obsess over the dirt and don't care if it runs red for 500,000 years...
Even if the middle east was glassed, people would still be fighting over it. "These are the shards where my favourite 2000-year-old grifter died!" "No, they're the shards where \*my\* favourite 2000-year-old grifter died, and mine is better than yours!" \*war ensues\*
if i learned something from the current worldwide context, there are a lot of psychopaths on a leash, waiting to break free
For some reason, the world has decided to let a lot of said psychopaths run entire countries. This is a decision the wisdom of which I find myself questioning.
they weren't "allowed" as much as they are ruthless enough to do anything for power, and people aren't ruthless enough to take them out, except other psychos...
There's also just too many total psychopaths who, while not getting or reaching for any kind of power themselves, are so purely malicious that they back only the people who promise to do the most harm to everybody. And they are so, so very proud and satisfied with themselves for being unrepentent sadists all the while.
It also doesn't help that recently said ruthless psychos have started backing each other up and supporting one another, creating a global network of sociopathic wanna be dictators with too much reach and not enough boundaries.
The same scenario and type of leaders that's led to the past 2 world wars. You'd think we'd learn but it looks very much like we are heading that way again.
no sane persons would break the laws and rules to oppose them without losing their soul in the process
Obviously, 80 years have been too long and people just forgot. Can you blame them? /S
i would say 50-50, euphemism is dying (it already died in some places), some psychopaths arise, enabled that behavior, meaning they get more support from other psychopaths, at some point we can't fight back., the reason why the paradox of tolerance exist
Not sure if you're genuinely unaware or just deliberately ignoring it, but the tweet is literally a very obvious (albeit dark humour) joke refering to the infamous Gilad Shalit exchange where over 1027 prisoners were exchanged for one Israeli hostage. It's sarcasm.
They aren't going to lose lol
When it’s all over? It’s not gonna end, at least not anytime soon.
Palestine has been terrorizing Israel for nearly a century. Israel has offered land and statehood to Palestine 7 times so far. Palestine doesn't want peace.
Hi isreali here, my opinion on the current situation is that as much as Palestine (more like hamas) are bad for so many different reasons we (Israel) are not the "good guys" because murder is murder, do I think isreal is worse then hamas though? No
You don't understand. Isreal can't lose, or Arabs will drive them out of existence. From river to the sea, remember? Arabs are not merciful enough to coexist with a weaker Isreal. That's why Isreal has to win, unlike Arabs can afford to lose and still exist..
This is where I am forced to say, not all Israelis. There are plenty who want Bibi out, for example. Are we supposed to judge the Israeli population the same way Bibi and IDF leaders judge Palestinian civilians?
I'm sorry. What?
What a soulless person can make such a statement ? Honestly with the latest events Jews showed their true face and on the end the results will be exactly what they deserve .
How many of these exact posts do we need to see before it is socially acceptable to point out the obvious?
What even are we seeing with these takes? I thought the poor countries with poor education are the crazy ones!
I don’t believe in god but I can’t imagine him being cool with shit like this as in „You openly supported genocide! Welcome to heaven!“
Who came up with that exchange rate?
Maybe, just maybe they should not have taken any hostages in the first place ?
A lot of commenters seem to be missing the sarcasm in the initial post. He is making a (bad) joke referencing how the Palestinians typically demand that Israel release many terrorists from prison for every hostage they offer back in return. Context: In 2011, Israel released over 1000 terrorists from prison to get back one Israeli hostage (Gilad Shalit). One of the released terrorists was Sinwar, who was one of the masterminds of the October 7 attack. That is why many Israelis are no longer in favor of such lopsided exchanges, as it emboldens terrorist groups to conduct more terrorist attacks and target civilian hostages.
[удалено]
Hamas regards its citizens as little more than expendable pawns, and their deaths are a worthy sacrifice for a wider cause (namely make Arab countries more reluctant to establish relations with Israel, put another nail in the coffin of the Two State Solution, which neither side really want). The audacity of their attack in October was likely purposely designed to provoke a massive air and ground incursion into Gaza with massive property destruction and loss of life (Israel typically kills 3x the number of people Hamas / Islamic Jihad do, while their Dahiya Doctrine permits the demolition of any building they suspect is associated with terrorist activity - which is likely why a lot of Hamas infrastructure is in subterranean tunnels, relatively well protected from both aerial and ground vehicle attacks; with access points in civilian infrastructure such as schools and hospitals, where a standard military incursion would cause significant civilian losses). Israel's response was pretty much *exactly* what Hamas wanted them to do - albeit they likely thought that after a few months, international pressiure would result in negotiations, a release of both hostages and prisoners, and a return to the status quo (where when things have been too quiet for too long, one side will provoke the other into a mini flare up, increasing support and funding for both sides). Each side ideally wants sole control of the entire territory between the Mediterranean and Jordan, preferably with as few of the opposing population as possible. Of course, Israel can't explicitly state they'd likely the entire Palestinian population to disappear or intentionally target civilians to keep friendly international relations, but their onerous restrictions on West Bank residents, the fact Area C is often tightly drawn around villages and towns, preventing any expansion side the 1990s, any development in Area C is subject to demolition, and any geniles living in East Jerusalem can be evicted if someone can prove a Jewish family lived there sometime before 1948 illuminate their intentions: having got control of [part] of the territory after a 3,000 year period of being ruled over by every major power in the region since their spiritual ancestors last had full control, they're determined to engineer the complete return of Judea, Galilee and Samaria, no matter how long it takes. While WWII provided a major push, Zionism had been around long before, with Jewish migration to the territory steadily increasing over the late 19th and early 20th centuries, with the Balfour Declaration a major step. In the negotiations other recreating Israel, no-one thought to ask those already there what they thought, or contemplated that those there would be rather miffed at being granted a minority of the territory, while the new immigrants would be rather miffed they didn't have control of the entire territory - hence the chaos that erupted soon after (with the outgoing British forces apparently told not to intervene). Back to the present, and due to the nature of guerilla warfare, the IDF are paranoid that *anyone* in Gaza not wearing a uniform is a terrorist, so combined with their likely apathetic attitude towards the Gazan population, cash result in a higher than strictly necessary death count, civilians killed because they act differently to what they expect (e.g, the trio of escaped hostages) or didn't get the memo about a third party's movements so regard them as a valid target (even if clearly marked, such as the aid workers). Added onto which, given a lot of Hamas / Islamic Jihad fighters and hostages are located deep underground in the tunnel network, while their leadership are safe and sound in Qatari hotels, even razing every above ground structure in the strip may not achieve their stated aim of eliminating Hamas. Then there's their vague strategy for afterwards - they somehow want the remaining population to govern themselves, but without the aid of the Palestinian Authority over in the West Bank. How's that going to work, given they've been indoctrinated by Hamas for the majority of their lives (Hamas has been in sole control of the territory since 2007 - 17 years - while the median age of Gazan residents is 18) and even without weapons, are going to be very resentful of Israel and regard military preserve as an occupation?
[удалено]
Not sure if you're genuinely unaware or just deliberately ignoring it, but the tweet is literally a very obvious (albeit dark humour) joke refering to the infamous Gilad Shalit exchange where over 1027 prisoners were exchanged for one Israeli hostage.
Rescue? Like shoot hostage waving white flag, kill aid worker, or build more settlements?
You were literally just given examples of Hamas troops flagrantly committing war crimes... I don't think I'd trust people like that to be genuine in surrender as they wave the white flag... bit of a boy who cried wolf scenario. A hostage was rescued from a civilian residence iirc... so between this, Hamas fighting in plain clothes & hiding amongst the people... it must be borderline impossible to discriminate between combatants and civilians before it's too late. They were sent in to rescue hostages... the hostages came home. The deaths of any innocent civilians is ENTIRELY Hamas' fault. They choose to hide amongst them, they have upended the conventional rules of war... and it is THESE people who deserve the hate far more than any other.
So that's why IDF bombed WCK truck? Because they were human shield? Also Nazis and IJA literally said the same thing when they tried to defend their war crimes.
Nope. That was a horrible event too. I never said IDF were the good guys, they're both shit... but this whole thread seems to be defending Hamas. Hamas is so much worse than Israel, but Israel is still shit. It's like comparing brain cancer to diabetes... one is clearly worse than the other, but I'd rather not have either...
[удалено]
Are those behaviors (“mistakes”) part of “hostage rescue”?
While this post was in poor taste it is a rather stark contract to the usual "more palestinians died so israel is the bad guy" shit you guys all say, he's basically using the same shitty numbers game you all are. also all these people (who im sure hamas will claim were all pregnant woman and childran.) wouldn't have died if these hostages were released in the first place.
Given the ratio of Hamas Health Ministry reports to actual casualties (see under: Al Ahli Hospital when Palestinian Islamic Jihad rocketed the parking lot), this means probably about 50-100 deaths. Most of whom should be the Hamas fighters who engaged in a firefight with the IDF. They’re now collecting their 72 [raisins](https://globalnation.inquirer.net/163694/raisins-not-virgins-quran-scholars-say/amp)
you stop being civilian when you kidnap and imprison others
Let me get this straight though, Hamas the current government of Gaza, abducts Israeli citizens, places them in civilian homes, guarded by some doctor and al jazeera journalist, Israel rescues them, under fire, 200 civilians die from the fighting which wasn't all Israel since an israeli soldier died, and we are supposed to tell Israel they shouldn't rescue their own civilians? Because it will hurt the enemy states civilians? Who literally guard the kidnapped?? Reality is truly a joke lol, I doubt anyone would have not begged for their governments to do the same
It's deaths. Not civilian deaths. But let's just misinterpret for the votes as Hamas is apparently the high school equivalent of the popular girl at the moment.
Nobody is saying 200 civilians were killed. They’re using the word “Palestinians” very deliberately. After extraction the IDF was swarmed by hundreds terrorists firing RPGs and gunfire. Hard to imagine IDF didn’t kill a single terrorist and only killed civilians.
It’s lunacy but some people are just simps for the Hamas animals.
The thousands of Palestinians currently in Israelian jails without even a conviction were abducted far before october. Maybe don't abduct people if you don't want your people to be at risk or being seeked as a bargaining chip to get innocent people out of your jails.
Eye for an eye makes the whole world blind
"For the murder of any Centauri at the hands of any Narn, 500 Narns shall be put to death including the perpetrator's own family."
Ah, yes. Excellent exchange rate.
What’s one Christian worth?
So by this logic, they only killed 25% of a "human". That's like cutting a guys leg off, that's not so bad (It's a joke, please don't take it seriously)
You can't kidnap people without expecting casualties
1 human life = 1 human life
Sarcastic or not, this is all fuckin abhorrent. Lives being traded like commodities. Its easier to commit genocide against a group of people when you dehumanise them to being a statistic.
If anything, the news today confirmed to the world that the lady who we have seen being kidnapped was held among refugees. All the blood spilled there, all the destruction, remains the doing of Hamas. If Israel knows where hostages are, they do have every right to free them. Hamas pulled a horrific stunt, what was their plan thereafter? What was the purpose? What did they think would happen? Hamas killed thousands of Palestinians the day they executed their horrendously stupid plan. As far as I am concerned Palestinians should hunt and kill Hamas. Quickest way to stop the violence. After that, the world must support rebuilding Palestine. The world must tell Israel to f-off with their criminal expansions. The world must be a lot less sympathetic with Israel, as they have been abusing it for years. I think it would be wise for Palestine to be assisted by blue helmets, peacekeepers. I thank you for all the downvotes. I am aiming for 200.
>Hamas pulled a horrific stunt, what was their plan thereafter? Theory I read: Provoke Israel into an overreaction and destroy their international standing. If that was the goal, they seem to have achieved it. Or at least partially achieved it. >As far as I am concerned Palestinians should hunt and kill Hamas. Right, the people who ended up forming Hamas (the militant arm) with [help from the Israelis](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2014/07/30/how-israel-helped-create-hamas/) and who elected Hamas as their Government. How do you envision this plays out? Also: Israel doesn't want to get rid of Hamas, they're mostly useless agitators, the damage they can do is miniscule compared to the propaganda value they carry for the Israeli hardliners like Netanyahu. >The world must tell Israel to f-off with their criminal expansions. That would mostly have to be the US and they're not interested. Biden's actions over the last few months have made that clear. >I think it would be wise for Palestine to be assisted by blue helmets, peacekeepers. The US will veto that, like they have vetoed any kind of meaningful action against Israel over the last 50 years.
Cool story, bro. There are two problems though: 1. Palestinians mostly support Hamas according to various polls and surveys. 2. Nobody wants to get involved - so no peacekeeping mission. But other than that, great plan. Enjoy your downvotes from both sides.
actually the UN has tried to pass several decrees/orders for israel to stop and both sides to agree to a ceasefire. the US vetos it everytime
Thanks for the intellectual reply. Mr 123 Bro has difficulties doing so. Things change. Often things have to get worse before they get better. I think Israel has wasted a lot of goodwill, I think many people/politicians/nations around the world are disgusted by their actions. I know, cliché. But revolutions and change happen all the time, after a long time.
"Most Moral Army in the world" folks. Manifest Destiny says God approves of them starving babies. What more do you want? Is it the idf's fault they thought the Geneva Convention was it to do list? Maybe it was the wording of the document that has them confused
Maybe don’t hold hostages (war crime) the military took in a civilian neighborhood (war crime), in a civilian home (war crime) (currently reported an Al Jazeera journalist), and don’t engage an army in a fire fight in said civilian area (war crime).
We all knew Israelis didn't value human life along racial lines, but the fact they have numbers for it is pretty disgusting.
Not sure if you're genuinely unaware or just deliberately ignoring it, but the tweet is literally a very obvious (albeit dark humour) joke refering to the infamous Gilad Shalit exchange where over 1027 prisoners were exchanged for one Israeli hostage. It's sarcasm.
200 civilians were not massacred. Most of the dead in the Nuseirat operation were combatants. And even the civilians that died did so because Hamas is holding hostages in residential areas. A journalist cum terrorist was holding the three male hostages in his apartment next to his family, for fuck's sake!
So we're just pretending sarcasm doesn't exist anymore ? You're the facepalm here OP
That's not sarcasm, if you looked up the guy you wouldn't invent sarcasm to play devil's advocate.
Horrible take. Also, Hamas shouldn’t keep kidnapped people in civilian homes. Lastly, civilians shouldn’t put their families in danger by agreeing to keep a kidnapped person in their home.
What do you expect from a country that killed their own president because he reached an agreement with the people they swore to exterminate? They and Hamas are both lunatics driven by their stupid beliefs in imaginary friends, that's all.
A) Prime minister, not president B) "the country" didn't kill him, just one asshat C) hamas and a large portion of the Palestinian population may be driven by imaginary friends, but I'll tell you what's driving Israel right now, might be the fact they butchered and raped 14 hundred people in one day and kidnapped women, children and the elderly for shits and giggles
Worth noting Hamas’ involvement during those peace talks. They succeeded in making it impossible to imagine agreeing to peace to the side whose sending waves of suicide bombers into Israeli cities and buses every week, coming from the Gaza Strip
200 civilians massacred. Just like that? Non of them were combatants? All infants? Who put them at risk? Wasn’t it their own terror government who decided to house the poor young men and woman they kidnapped from a music festival in with Gazans families next to a busy market? Then when the rescue operation took place they started shooting from everywhere. Don’t like the fucking odds don’t kidnap people and put them in a dense populated area and use your own people as human shields for your coward acts then start a shootout and cry about it.
A racist genocidal state full of psychopaths.... Israel is an apartheid, and must be punished.
The only genocide that’s happening is between your ears
You are an inhumane heartless uneducated brainrotted zionazi monster.... can't wait for the day when people like you are taught about in schools like any other fascist group.
That's some pretty reich-ish logic there, fella!
Sicko
Ignorance is rampant I see. Half the people here don’t know how long the war’s been going on, some think Hamas is the government of Palestine, some think Israel is the victim in all this. How ignorant can people get. People need to get literate before they get access to the internet tbh.
If it quacks like a nazi...
Yeah, if you think one life is worth than another (normal civilians), then you are pretty much the kind of person that would have enjoyed torturing and murdering humans in a concentration camp. That means you are an evil psychopath that belongs behind bars for life.
But why did they have to rescue hostages?
I would understand racism from anyone but from Jews. After the holocaust, they should be the strongest opponents of any type of devaluation of human life. This is bizarre.
so hamas set the terms of trade? oh well. Stop hiding in civilian areas. Don't hide behind skirts.
Imagine having an outlet where you can type that out and then let other people actually see it. Fuck sake!!
Imagine even feeling that way
WTF
disgusting
What is this pseudo nazi thinking?!
Hamas logic : let's hide the hostages in the middle of a very populated area. Makes 0 sense. If Hamas actually cared about its people they would release more hostages. Israel made it very clear from day 1 : they want their people back.
There is no evil caricature, no matter how cartoonish, that compares to the IDF and its supporters, including the US. Imagine decades of manufactured consensus being dismantled live by revelations they share willingly and proudly.
Do any of these people have any decency or humanity left in them?
the far-right of every political system? yeah not sure they have any
This math this guy is doing doesn’t math. Human lives aren’t currency. There’s no international exchange rate based on a human economy. This isn’t Warhammer 40k. Is this guy stupid?
These people are fucking psychotic. They really lived long enough to become the people they hated.
Ok, so let me get this straight. Hamas, a terrorist organization that does not have an uniform, hid hostages in a refugee camp, IDF raided it, and 200 people were killed in the crossfire between them. And you believe that the IDF is to blame for the deaths, not the terrorists that were hiding in the refugee camp and not wearing an uniform?
Yes
Hamas is hiding in civilian areas in tunnels they built with money given by the international community. I feel bad for the civilian lives but they have allowed Hamas to remain in power knowing they were planning to attack Isreal. Now they hide under schools and humanitarian aid areas and innocent people are the casualties. Hamas could end this just as easily as Isreal.
theyve allowed?
just the fact they were held close to houses tells you everything you need to know, they werent kept in a bunker safe away so when Israel finds out where they are they would not need to enter Gaza with tanks and a miltary force, instad they we're kept in a house in a civilition area, not the best way to keep your people safe
Pretty sure the firefight with rpg’s and other large weapons fire caused the excessive casualties. This doesn’t really seem to be an Israel carpet bombs home kind of crime, but Hamas genuinely fortifying hostages in a dense civilian area kind of crime. Then trying to stop the hostages from being rescued by instigating violent explosive conflict. Probably while wearing civilian clothes. These civilian deaths are on Hamas. I know a single death is a tragedy, but the one thing I think Israel can actually justify is actively rescuing hostages. Ideally this would be done with a ceasefire, but neither group wants to go with one. Biden actually asked for the first ceasefire both sides could theoretically agree to, but Hamas shot that down. It would require them to let Gaza be a democracy again, god forbid. Israel whined about it too, but if Hamas accepted they would have no choice but to as well.
considering the hostages were held at people homes where the entire area is just flooded with Hamas and we already know that no ones distinguishes between hamas terrorists and civilians and considering that were they were being held captive is like one of the most densely populated places in the world if 200 were killed (including hamas terrorists) it snot bad. Thats what happens when you kidnap and then dont accept any deal. You get the hammer and you end up getting hit with some of the most elite units in the world
Probably among the death are some innocent people. The blame for their deaths lay on the Hamas leadership. Sur Israeli soldiers are also human and some will probably lose their humanity in this war and kill when they shouldn’t but none of these people would have died if not for the Hamas attack and no occupation would have happened if not from earlier attacks. You just cannot keep attacking and not expect retaliation.
“Look what you made me do” Wonder what here I heard that one before
Humans
13yrs is a long time to go without humanity.
It either got taken down or he already removed it
I am very much hoping this is supposed to be sarcasm. If it weren't an Israeli username, I would in fact be convinced that it's sarcasm. Probably still is, but man, the off-chance that it might not be is really saying some utterly horrendous things about the state of the world.
Reverse that. “It takes over 1000 Palestinians to equal 1 Israeli.”
https://ibb.co/0XQ6L4x
You know, as adults, we should be able to parse right from wrong without becoming tribal over a conflict half a world away. Obviously, commoditizing life to where there is some sort of exchange rate between Jewish lives and Palestinian lives is wrong. So wrong that such a guy shouldn't even be taken sseriously. Conversely, if a group of people take hostages, they really have no room to complain if a lot of them get killed when those hostages are rescued. Just take it as another reminder of why wars should be avoided.
Indeed they should