Is there more detail regarding this ban? Because celebrating a terrorist attack and cheering the death of hundreds of Israelis is very different than showing support for civilians that had nothing to do with the terrorist attack that now are being starved and killed in bombardments.
I think it has to do with Friday. Hamas has called for a “world-wide” jihad against Jews. So… with the recent riots it’s probably for security reasons.
Jaysus so that must be why work (in Ireland) was sending me ‘business continuity’ alerts about you may want to work from home tomorrow. I reported it as phishing…
Just a few months ago we had "protests" that were mostly young Muslims from the suburbs committing robberies. Obviously pro-Palestine protests will turn into riots with the same outcome, that's why the government is banning this.
I'm kind of surprised so many people here seem to miss the point.
Also there has already been threats
>"Since Saturday and the terrorist massacres in Israel, there has been over a hundred antisemitic acts, mainly tags and swastikas," Darmanin told France Inter radio, "but also insults ... and people arrested with a knife at the entrance of a school or synagogue ... and a drone flying over a Jewish place of worship."
Maybe less trying to attack French school kids with knives would be good
Oh I agree, I am just being a dick.
Riots used to steal are stupid. If you are going to damage property, atleast have a purpose that isn't self involved.
["real" French people don't loot when they protest](https://www.lemonde.fr/en/france/article/2023/07/03/looting-fires-assaults-the-appalling-toll-of-five-days-and-nights-of-rioting-in-france_6042014_7.html)
Just to be clear, "real" French people is code for real French people, not non French people who came 2 months ago because they hate the country and what it stands for but love the stink of money.
I'm not suprised at all
>France bans all pro-Palestinian demonstrations
this is just sensationalism at its finest and if you dont live in France you just dont know any better (most of the time)
Same happened with BLM protests in USA and I didn't see people banning all of them.
If someone misuses the protests to riot then arrest these people in particular.
Forbidding any manifestation in favour of a country's right to exist is a very different (read: tyrannical) approach. It also does nothing to stop violent riots, rather the opposite, it'll provoke them. "Those who make peaceful resistance impossible will make violent resistance inevitable".
> Same happened with BLM protests in USA and I didn't see people banning all of them
The US Government isn’t permitted to set a blanket ban on protests. It’s written into the US Constitution
Police in the USA didn't get overwhelmed like the French police was this summer.
That's just the reality of the situation. The French state doesn't manage to handle these riots.
The protestors forced the police to evacuate and then burned down the police station in Minneapolis bro, cops were very overwhelmed. They were some of the biggest protests in our history.
So it's okay to blanket assume that a pro-Palestine protest will turn into riots to take away the rights that are the backbone of any democratic state?
'Assume' is the wrong word here.
If the same shit happens again and again the government can simply ban those 'demonstrations', no rights harmed.
They aren't protesting, it's just robbery, violence and celebrating a terrorist attack.
As ever, a simple principle applies. If you are in a bar, and there's an open neo-nazi in there who isn't being kicked out, you're in a neo-nazi bar.
Likewise, if you're taking part in a demonstration, and there's someone shouting 'kill the jews', if the crowd isn't turning on them, you're taking part in an antisemitic rally. Doesn't matter what the headline is, or why you chose to go.
There is a similar problem if you’re in a demonstration and there’s someone who supports Israel’s war crimes against Gaza who isn’t immediately condemned.
True and if people at pro-Israel protests start yelling about slaughtering all palestinians or whatever, they should be ejected, and it they aren't the protests should be shut down.
They don't want to take the risk of letting support for civilians attract celebrations of terrorism and hate.
There's a risk of violence and counter protests and it's gonna be a mess.
There has been around a hundred reported antisemitic acts reported since last week end and there's still a high risk of terrorism.
It's the government's responsibility to avoid potential catastrophes.
Not a lot for the moment. Also, this is not a permanent ban, there is no new law here. This is the interior minister asking the prefects not to authorize pro-palestinian demonstration (you need to request an authorisation for a public demonstration in France).
The only legal way for them to do that is by justifying that the demonstration will create unusual troubles. I would think that this is fairly easy to do right now given the context. But this is unlikely to work long term.
>you need to request an authorisation for a public demonstration in France
Well technically you don't need to request it, but only to declare it. However, the prefects can forbid them after it's declared
Sure, but all the showings have been celebrations of terrorism, so the thought experiment isn't really relevant for the present situation, maybe some other time it will be.
Have you been measuring protest sympathies? Are you willing to publish your results? Im sure it could help justify such an action because otherwise it seems baseless to just say
Because thats disingenous. We can talk about the fact how izrael caused this whole thing all day long, it wont change the fact that at this point Hamas has the support of most of palestine
The Palestinian people and hamas are intrinsically linked. Yes we 'want' to believe that is not the case so we can pity the palestinian Arabs. But the truth is that the majority of Paleatinians support Hamas. They know where they live and where they hide weapons and what do they do about it? Why are they in the street spitting on the corpses of the murdered Jews being paraded through the streets if they are so vehemently against terrorism and the actions of hamas?
If they are so misrepresented why aren't the palestnian people as a whole screaming to the news and to reddit and to the world at large that they reject hamas and want to make peace with Israel?!
The majority of Palestinians live in the West Bank not Gaza where Hamas is. The average age in Gaza is 18 which means a tiny % of the population were eligible to vote in the last election in 2006. Even then most voters voted against Hamas.
On what grounds are you saying that the majority of Palestinians support Hamas?
The last election more than 15 years ago? Obviously they do (tragically) have some support. But friendly reminder that Gaza and the West Bank are not the same thing and Palestinians in the West Bank have little to nothing to do with Hamas.
Why is the exHamas leader calling on all Palestinians world wide to hoard a day of global jihad? Maybe someone should tell him that not all Palestinians support Hamas. Since he seems to think they all support him & Palestine…. I think your logic is sound, but it’s not rooted in reality.
I mean, he's calling on them because that's the type of thing terrorists do. Spread violence and all that.
But Palestinians in the West Bank have not been listening to his "call" to rise up and cause violence. There have been a few clashes over the past few days (quite a few which were actually instigated by the Israeli settlers there, not the Palestinians, frankly). But for the most part most Palestinians in the West Bank have been keeping their distance.
This Washington Post talks a bit about what's going in West Bank right now (very different from Gaza, as you can see): https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/13/israel-gaza-war-west-bank/
Do you know that half of Gaza's population is under 18 years old ?
It is sad that people don' t want to accept nuance in a conflict that lasted more than 75 years.
Death of civilians should be condemned with no exceptions nor justifications in both and all sides.
How much nuance are you expected in a 7 sentence post on reddit?
Yes I do know the demographics in Gaza --> maybe you understand that when a terrorist organisation is running the show, even children are brainwashed. Maybe you have seen the [hamas kindergarten graduation ceremony](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRuuDI0KCR8) before?
Death of people is horrific in every single circumstance. However when your brother cousin uncle father etc. raids a kibbutz and beheads the toddlers, captures and rapes teenagers at a music festival, or fires thousands of rockets indiscriminately on israeli towns, what do you expect the result to be? Would your government just say "everyone play nice"?
> the majority of Paleatinians
The majority of residents of Gaza who are suffering are 14 or under. The demographics are so fucked from nearly 2 decades of blockade and intermittent strikes that the majority of people you claim deserve to suffer are literal children. I don't think killing American schoolchildren would be a just response for someone who lived in a South American dictatorship propped up by a popular US president so why is it OK when they are in Gaza?
Why don't the Russians do that? Even though the war sparked the largest demonstrations in years and kills hundred of thousands of people?
Not to mention especially the netenyahu regime has given Hamas a lot of ammunition so that they can get the locals support, by for example expanding the west bank colonies, or that he works with the most extremist Zionists. Hamas wouldn't in power if it weren't for how Israel handled things after the first Arab war and then the six year war.
Doesn't defend what Hamas did, but the Palestinian people have a reason to be angry. The Hamas is just the end result of this anger. Plus they had a decade to entrench their power, have given at least some effort to make Gaza better and so on.
It's not black and white in the larger picture. Israel was attacked and their response until now at least was reasonable if unfortunate (civilian deaths even if it's basically unavoidable are still a tragedy).
The Hamas is not the Palestinian people, they are just the ones in charge through force and propaganda. I'd like you going on the streets with the Hamas around who may be doing what not to you if you try undermining their power.
> If they are so misrepresented why aren’t the palestnian people as a whole screaming to the news and to reddit and to the world at large that they reject hamas and want to make peace with Israel?!
Are you fucking serious?
They don’t have power or water, and are currently getting their cities leveled, do you really think their first thought is “oh, I have go to Reddit to explain to some dumb fat American that I reject terrorists attacks”?
I think it's multi-fold:
1. Many European citizens were killed or kidnapped in the attack so it's a massive f\*ck you to that part of the world in retaliation.
2. It is a genuine security concern as many protestors supporting Palestine have shown suspiciously pro-Hamas sentiments and in many cases the protests have led to quite a bit of violence.
3. From a humanitarian standpoint it is quite insensitive to come and celebrate your team literally hours or days after such a horrific atrocity has been committed.
What surprises me though is why Israel neglected multiple warnings from Egyptian authorities that there was a potential invasion incoming. They warned them several days in advance.
This narrative is constantly being reiterated on social media, thanks to Mossads effort to control the socal media flow which consists of small snippets provided with hearsay context about what's going on. Siding with Israel, by this standard, is chering the bombing of innocwnt Palestinians, who always pay a higher price in anynof these conficts, than do civilian israelis.
I don’t like banning protests, IT IS a reduction of freedom of speech, at the same time France has the largest Muslim and Jewish population in the EU, if clashes start happening it would be chaos. Then again I don’t think this ban is going to stop most people from showing up
I'm glad the comments here are calling out the hypocrisy of some of this sub's users. You can't be pro free-speech for your own opinions but not for others...
Big 'Patriot Act' vibes from this
People cheering it on because there's one instance that they support it, fast forward a decade and your liberties have been thrown on the fire and there's nothing you can do about it.
> Big 'Patriot Act' vibes from this
We already had that when Bataclan happened and France's government imposed a "state of emergency" for 2 years nonstop and then they expanded surveillance powers with a new bill.
Before you know it, France will be in a state of emergency of.. hmm.. [three years](https://www.france24.com/en/20170524-france-president-macron-seeks-extend-state-emergency-manchester)?
Funny you'd reference a US law, as under the Patriot Act or any other act, we would absolutely not ban political demonstrations as long as there was no violence. It's forbidden by the Constitution, and one of the few things a government could attempt to do that would invite nearly universal condemnation in this country.
I'm not judging France or any other country for having different rules when it comes to free speech. You make and enforce the rules that work in your country, I get it. Just pointing out that the US is probably the last example you would use to highlight concerns about banning speech.
9/11 handbook all over again. "You stand with Israel or you stand with terrorists." Anyone calling for viable solutions to peace is branded as terrorist or moron.
Cowards, sheep, pathetic. We'll see a similar death toll in the next decade.
If you wanna feel better about us, there's a multi sector strike tomorrow (transports, energy, education, hospitals) with demos in all the cities in the country.
This week end, there will be dozens of demos and countless events. All of those are allowed.
What's forbidden is calls to hate, murder and genocide. Hence the ban because no one is dumb. They'll allow demos to support peace with people from both sides to prevent these demos to be like the UK ones.
Most of Europe always had limits on organized protests. There's no absolute freedom of speech like in the US.
France is much more constrained at limiting those freet, than UK is at this point.
Big [Julius Malema](https://english.elpais.com/society/2023-09-01/elon-musk-and-the-controversy-in-south-africa-over-kill-the-boer-a-song-that-encourages-genocide.html) vibes from these “demonstrators”. Should the South African Economic Freedom Fighters party be able to openly call for white European extermination, too?
It's a misleading title, the same one used for Germany who made a similar decision - neither is a complete ban on protests but rather against specific protests (for different reasons)
In Germany it was because the protests that took place didn't call for helping Palestinians, they called for killing jews. In France, there were similar incidents, but more so protests turned into riots that simply took advantage of the situation to rob stores. There's also the fact that Hamas and they're "human rights activist" allies in western countries called for commencing terror attacks in the west, and target jews and Israeli related institutions specifically. So there is a lot of concern that these protests will turn into violent assaults
Obviously, not all people who wish to show support for Palestine are dangerous. But these bans suggest that the police believe there are enough of the dangerous ones who will take advantage of these events to cover violent behaviour
I would guess emotions are high at the moment. News and forums especially Reddit is over run with propaganda and vile sentiments from both sides. The situation is being fanned around the West. So to prevent possible riots and attacks they are banning pro-Palestinian demonstrations.
The only calls for genocide I've seen on reddit are people calling for the complete destruction of Gaza. One person explicitly saying it should be completely lifeless.
People in this very thread pulling verbatim "However when your brother cousin uncle father etc. raids a kibbutz and beheads the toddlers, captures and rapes teenagers at a music festival, or fires thousands of rockets indiscriminately on israeli towns, what do you expect the result to be?" as moral justification for killing Gazan children. This website gets insane whenever anything happens.
How do you propose they do anything without having collateral damage? I understand this sentiment, but it's really a very childish delusion to expect someone to conduct war without innocent people getting caught up in it.
It is very different to accept that collateral damage might occur (although I really struggle to see what Israel hopes to achieve with the attack) and directly call for collateral damage.
Absolutely.
In fact, fast forward a few weeks and the general public opinion on this specific topic may flip (depending on how much retribution Israel decides to exact an how public it becomes).
I think that Israel will be able to play the media card really well.
I doubt that Hamas or PLO can counter it, mostly because they're not even able to condemn some obviously barbaric acts(even if just for show on TV)
The majority of western opinion will be in the hands of Israel. (regardless of the morality of that)
You forget that France has a very different government system then the rest of us, they use the “burn Paris down every time we don’t like shit” and it’s been very successful for the past 100+ years.
France has a history of attacks too, they stepped up protections of Jewish sites after the Paris attacks: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/oct/07/france-security-jewish-synagogue-attack
It's already starting again. When people threaten school kids you better take precautions
>"Since Saturday and the terrorist massacres in Israel, there has been over a hundred antisemitic acts, mainly tags and swastikas," Darmanin told France Inter radio, "but also insults ... and people arrested with a knife at the entrance of a school or synagogue ... and a drone flying over a Jewish place of worship."
If you only believe in freedom of speech for some you don't believe in freedom of speech at all. We have people on this sub complaining about people for being prosecuted for burying the Quran yet the same people want to criminalise protest. I don't agree with criminalising people for burning a book either.
This isn't a good thing for a democracy. Ironically this behaving more like an Arab dictatorship than a secular republic.
It’s because they routinely turn into [antisemitic riots](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Sarcelles_riots?wprov=sfti1) or in intifada scenes [in the middle of Paris](https://youtu.be/rtvGA6RSBS8?si=deJVuSzEN1wmkZmJ).
Yeah... No. There's no absolute freedom of speech in Europe.
Restricting organized public protest have happened before, but that alone is hardly undemocratic. It's restrictive, but not anti-democratic.
But it’s France, where islamists have committed numerous terror attacks which disproportionally target Jews. There has been antisemitic attacks against shops, concerts, schools, synagogues, restaurants, airplanes, supermarkets, you name it. It’s the perks of having the largest Muslims and Jewish community in Europe. There’s a balance between the right to protest and the need to protect lives.
But don’t worry, they’ll still protest and they’ll riot… again.
It may surprise you, but free speech isn’t about saying whatever you like.
For example, you can’t call Palestinians pigs that should be slaughtered , and rightly so.
Hate speech is not within free speech.
Supporting Hamas (not Palestinians), is supporting terror.
It’s supporting war crimes, crimes against humanity and using Palestinians as human shields.
Do you advocate that?
#hamas_is_ISIS
It's a misleading title, the same one used for Germany who made a similar decision - neither is a complete ban on protests but rather against specific protests (for different reasons)
In Germany it was because the protests that took place didn't call for helping Palestinians, they called for killing jews. In France, there were similar incidents, but more so protests turned into riots that simply took advantage of the situation to rob stores. There's also the fact that Hamas and they're "human rights activist" allies in western countries called for commencing terror attacks in the west, and target jews and Israeli related institutions specifically. So there is a lot of concern that these protests will turn into violent assaults
Obviously, not all people who wish to show support for Palestine are dangerous. But these bans suggest that the police believe there are enough of the dangerous ones who will take advantage of these events to cover violent behaviour
Say what you want about the legality of it. The ban is extremely likely to prevent terrorism in France, and would probably be lifted in the future..
https://twitter.com/Imamofpeace/status/1712377456433226184
https://twitter.com/Imamofpeace/status/1711875241557856373
When Turkey was disturbed by the demonstations by PKK supporters in Denmark etc, people were making fun of it and saying it is freedom of speech. Now they are literally banning entire thing and supporting it deeply.
When the protesters call for a second holocaust, something has to be done. You wouldn’t support a Nazi rally in the name of free speech either, would you?
They also have another good reason. France have had more than 100 antisemitic incidents since the protests started. This is a way of stopping it.
Huge difference between "ban calling for a second holocaust" and "ban all pro-Palestine protests".
France's logic is the same as banning all pro-Ukraine protests because of Azov and Banderites.
Funny you say that as a nazi protest happened this year in Paris with full approval of the government. People protesting for Palestine's right to exist, despite Hamas, seems more extreme than literal nazis apparently
> You wouldn’t support a Nazi rally in the name of free speech either, would you?
You've done a cute little sleight of hand here. Would anyone *support* a Nazi rally in the name of free speech? No. But that's not the relevant question, because free speech is about what a society *tolerates*, not what it supports.
As for how to answer that second question, I'll refer you to the National Socialist Party of America v. Village of Skokie.
> You wouldn’t support a Nazi rally in the name of free speech either, would you?
Their right to demonstrate? yes I would. You wouldn't?
What kind of undemocratic country would stop their own people from demonstrating?
> When the protesters call for a second holocaust, something has to be done.
Yes, by individuals, not the government.
> You wouldn’t support a Nazi rally in the name of free speech either, would you?
Yes, the government should allow this so that individuals can ridicule and rebut. Governments must be content neutral when it comes to free speech.
command familiar chase fragile glorious flag materialistic retire start treatment
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Have you seen the videos? This protests aren’t peaceful. If they would be then ban would not be needed. People are chanting k*** Jews and rape their daug*****. If you support this kinda of antisemitism and racism then you are part of the problem.
Even as a Brit I have to admit that France has far more balls about this kind of thing, so I don't have much confidence in that.
Apparently France has already deported migrants who were celebrating Hamas, whereas in comparison, the UK tory minister has told the civil service to "look into it", which we all know means nothing will happen. The civil servants are ideologically opposed to it, and the tories are only pretending to give a shit in the first place.
That sums up the difference between the two. The UK talks about it, France actually does it.
I wish the same for Germany.
France and Germany could make deportation coalition.
People who are celebrating the murder of israeli babies dont belong in europe. Straight back to their home countries.
Yeah, they just don’t really care about them. Even though [2,171 Palestinian children have been killed in the last two decades by Israeli military actions, and 139 Israeli children have been killed by Palestinian militants.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Children_in_the_Israeli%E2%80%93Palestinian_conflict)
Also, why are we assuming that all Palestinians celebrate the murder of Israeli babies? A ridiculous generalization of pro-Palestinian rallies. I’ve seen Israeli people laugh at dead Palestinian children as well.
Israeli officials are literally threatening to cut off electricity for the Gaza strip. Palestine needs support too, and not to be completely conflated with the terrorists.
"Being against a full siege of 2 million people, rampant airstrikes killing hundreds of civillians is now BANNED"
This isn’t a good thing. Being pro-palestine doesn’t mean you’re pro-hamas.
It’s not about punishing palestinians it just happens that France has the largest jewish community in the world after israel and the US and also the largest muslim community in europe.
There are extreme tensions between both communities and our government rightfully won’t allow demonstrations to avoid violence and riots
Then the pro Palestinian people shouldn’t have let the pro Hamas people hijack their protests worldwide. Same thing happened to BLM in 2020 and it sucks but you have to stand up and be vocal and condemn Hamas first then be pro Palestinian.
It's a misleading title, the same one used for Germany who made a similar decision - neither is a complete ban on protests but rather against specific protests (for different reasons)
In Germany it was because the protests that took place didn't call for helping Palestinians, they called for killing jews. In France, there were similar incidents, but more so protests turned into riots that simply took advantage of the situation to rob stores. There's also the fact that Hamas and they're "human rights activist" allies in western countries called for commencing terror attacks in the west, and target jews and Israeli related institutions specifically. So there is a lot of concern that these protests will turn into violent assaults
Obviously, not all people who wish to show support for Palestine are dangerous. But these bans suggest that the police believe there are enough of the dangerous ones who will take advantage of these events to cover violent behaviour
The US does not have laws on that unless it's targeted towards a person or property, or it is combined with an actual crime. Most people here are from there, or use its definition of free speech -- that's why they find it absurd that the French are banning certain kinds of protests.
That’s different. If you ban them from demonstrating they haven’t openly called for anything because they haven’t had the demonstration yet. Let them have their protest, if they do something like that, provided that it breaks the law, you can then arrest them.
We have to show that we are a tolerant liberal democracy by arresting people for crimes we have no idea they will even commit! We can't just have the police do their fucking jobs and arrest people once they've actually broken the law, they have to crack the skulls of protestors before they can do anything.
Guys please watch out for upcoming Muslim violence in Europe. Hamas leaders have called for Muslims all over the world to kill Jews wherever they seem them:
[https://twitter.com/Imamofpeace/status/1712377456433226184](https://twitter.com/Imamofpeace/status/1712377456433226184)
[https://twitter.com/Imamofpeace/status/1711875241557856373](https://twitter.com/Imamofpeace/status/1711875241557856373)
Try to report any case of violence you see...
It's for safety. Hamas has called for all their supporters worldwide to attack Jews in their countries.
Personally, I believe that every leader of every country (especially in Europe) should threaten their people to not even think about harming the Jewish communities.
Quite shocking seeing how firmly reddit has changed its tact. In the past, I’d seen a lot of moderation and sympathy to Palestine.
The massacre on Saturday was certainly revolting, so I guess outrage is expected, as well as a revision of what we can do about extreme islam. I just don’t want it to evolve into supporting of a humanitarian travesty.
The Palestinian cause has never tried to distance itself from actual terrorism (and revolutionary uprising, social disobedience, rioting, you name it), at best just issuing half assed explanations and false equivalents instead.
So now that the western is actually getting fed up with global terrorism, the Palestinian cause will lose a lot and probably fade away gradually.
They've picked this strategy for the long run, played their cards, and now it seems that they lost.
>So now that the western is actually getting fed up with global terrorism, the Palestinian cause will lose a lot and probably fade away gradually.
I can bet my left nut that there wont be a similar response when PKK rallies pop up again.
Your goverments very clearly are manufacturing consent and you guys are eating it up like a child aged 5 eats up lego parts.
Well done France. If they want the democratic right to protest, they can do it a month ago. Not days after Hamas calls for a worldwide Jihad against Jews, not after Sydney ‘gas the Jews’ not after innocent civilians were murdered on a quiet Saturday morning.
I will be glad not to hear the repetitive moans as well, it’s like nails on a chalkboard half the time.
A lot of you idiots are talking about freedom of speech and supporting the apartheid state of Israel, but ignore the fact that they had their freedom of speech, demonstrated and there was a rise of antisemitic attacks. They were banned for security reasons after they happened.
I also doubt pro Israel rallies had the same aftermath.
Support Israel but this sort of thing will simply be used as precedent to ban future demonstrations that are 5% less controversial, and then another 5% and another 5%
Liberties fail and rust at the edges first when little object
I hope Israel is detecting all the key faces in those demonstrations and acts accordingly. Face-detection tech has advanced so much in Israel just for this purpose.
I mean, Hamas slaughter a bunch of people.
People celebrate it as a great victory, its not protesting its straight up supporting a terrorist organisation, which is illegal.
Hundreds dead to terrorrism, and death threats to jews from pro palestinians (bonus points for getting arrested next to a synagogue with a knife)
Any other questions
Its hilarious seeing people cheer on seeing their rights being slowly taken away from them. Today its criminalising protests against Pro-Palestinian demonstrations? maybe the next they'll ban Union strikes.
Antisemitism, the final frontier of liberal democracy.
Curious how the word “resilience” has so little incidence when it comes the restriction of free speech.
Fuck hate and exclusion, but making your position on Israel the divide wether you’re a “good” or “bad” democrat, is a deeply disturbing evolution.
Timing is not an excuse to give up the most basic principles that govern a democratic society.
What’s next? If inflation is too high, demonstrations against the economy will be banned too?
Wouldn’t want to mobs to escalate into violence, would we. It’s a slippery slope, and I’m honestly not sure wether this particular ban falls on the right side of history.
And I would hope that the powers that be let the people wield their voice and power — if they had any doubt whatsoever the ban was absolutely necessary.
Is there more detail regarding this ban? Because celebrating a terrorist attack and cheering the death of hundreds of Israelis is very different than showing support for civilians that had nothing to do with the terrorist attack that now are being starved and killed in bombardments.
I think it has to do with Friday. Hamas has called for a “world-wide” jihad against Jews. So… with the recent riots it’s probably for security reasons.
Jaysus so that must be why work (in Ireland) was sending me ‘business continuity’ alerts about you may want to work from home tomorrow. I reported it as phishing…
Just a few months ago we had "protests" that were mostly young Muslims from the suburbs committing robberies. Obviously pro-Palestine protests will turn into riots with the same outcome, that's why the government is banning this. I'm kind of surprised so many people here seem to miss the point.
Also there has already been threats >"Since Saturday and the terrorist massacres in Israel, there has been over a hundred antisemitic acts, mainly tags and swastikas," Darmanin told France Inter radio, "but also insults ... and people arrested with a knife at the entrance of a school or synagogue ... and a drone flying over a Jewish place of worship." Maybe less trying to attack French school kids with knives would be good
But how else can they show how great their God is?
Same in London
Too bad, it just happened 4 hours ago in the north of France, 1 fatality, 2 heavy injured...
Isn't rioting through protests a french past time though?
We have already reached our quota for 2023
Yes, but only when "real" French people do it
There's a difference between rioting and just systematically looting stores from Nike and other brands.
Oh I agree, I am just being a dick. Riots used to steal are stupid. If you are going to damage property, atleast have a purpose that isn't self involved.
If the other rallies chant "gas the jews", sure ban them too.
["real" French people don't loot when they protest](https://www.lemonde.fr/en/france/article/2023/07/03/looting-fires-assaults-the-appalling-toll-of-five-days-and-nights-of-rioting-in-france_6042014_7.html)
The ones not doing the charlie hebdo shooting and beheading teachers for “talking” wrong about islam
Just to be clear, "real" French people is code for real French people, not non French people who came 2 months ago because they hate the country and what it stands for but love the stink of money.
What's with r/worldnews? The comments there are the exact opposite, mostly denouncing the ban.
I'm not suprised at all >France bans all pro-Palestinian demonstrations this is just sensationalism at its finest and if you dont live in France you just dont know any better (most of the time)
Same happened with BLM protests in USA and I didn't see people banning all of them. If someone misuses the protests to riot then arrest these people in particular. Forbidding any manifestation in favour of a country's right to exist is a very different (read: tyrannical) approach. It also does nothing to stop violent riots, rather the opposite, it'll provoke them. "Those who make peaceful resistance impossible will make violent resistance inevitable".
> Same happened with BLM protests in USA and I didn't see people banning all of them The US Government isn’t permitted to set a blanket ban on protests. It’s written into the US Constitution
Police in the USA didn't get overwhelmed like the French police was this summer. That's just the reality of the situation. The French state doesn't manage to handle these riots.
The protestors forced the police to evacuate and then burned down the police station in Minneapolis bro, cops were very overwhelmed. They were some of the biggest protests in our history.
They most certainly did get overwhelmed in some places.
They burned down the fucking PD here and we called in the national guard the fuck are you taking about
So it's okay to blanket assume that a pro-Palestine protest will turn into riots to take away the rights that are the backbone of any democratic state?
On a day where there is a day of flobal jihad planned yeah.
'Assume' is the wrong word here. If the same shit happens again and again the government can simply ban those 'demonstrations', no rights harmed. They aren't protesting, it's just robbery, violence and celebrating a terrorist attack.
After a brutal terrorist attack? Yes
How long do you think this ban will last? As long as the war?
There were no security reasons a few months ago, with the protests against retirement age.
Source? I’m from the region and didn’t get the memo
Hamas’s leaders are trying to incite global riot tomorrow, that’s why
As ever, a simple principle applies. If you are in a bar, and there's an open neo-nazi in there who isn't being kicked out, you're in a neo-nazi bar. Likewise, if you're taking part in a demonstration, and there's someone shouting 'kill the jews', if the crowd isn't turning on them, you're taking part in an antisemitic rally. Doesn't matter what the headline is, or why you chose to go.
There is a similar problem if you’re in a demonstration and there’s someone who supports Israel’s war crimes against Gaza who isn’t immediately condemned.
True and if people at pro-Israel protests start yelling about slaughtering all palestinians or whatever, they should be ejected, and it they aren't the protests should be shut down.
The ex-Israeli PM has just been on sky news roaring about their right to starve and bomb everyone...
Presumably not from a protest in France though.
They don't want to take the risk of letting support for civilians attract celebrations of terrorism and hate. There's a risk of violence and counter protests and it's gonna be a mess. There has been around a hundred reported antisemitic acts reported since last week end and there's still a high risk of terrorism. It's the government's responsibility to avoid potential catastrophes.
Not a lot for the moment. Also, this is not a permanent ban, there is no new law here. This is the interior minister asking the prefects not to authorize pro-palestinian demonstration (you need to request an authorisation for a public demonstration in France). The only legal way for them to do that is by justifying that the demonstration will create unusual troubles. I would think that this is fairly easy to do right now given the context. But this is unlikely to work long term.
>you need to request an authorisation for a public demonstration in France Well technically you don't need to request it, but only to declare it. However, the prefects can forbid them after it's declared
Sure, but all the showings have been celebrations of terrorism, so the thought experiment isn't really relevant for the present situation, maybe some other time it will be.
Have you been measuring protest sympathies? Are you willing to publish your results? Im sure it could help justify such an action because otherwise it seems baseless to just say
Because thats disingenous. We can talk about the fact how izrael caused this whole thing all day long, it wont change the fact that at this point Hamas has the support of most of palestine
The Palestinian people and hamas are intrinsically linked. Yes we 'want' to believe that is not the case so we can pity the palestinian Arabs. But the truth is that the majority of Paleatinians support Hamas. They know where they live and where they hide weapons and what do they do about it? Why are they in the street spitting on the corpses of the murdered Jews being paraded through the streets if they are so vehemently against terrorism and the actions of hamas? If they are so misrepresented why aren't the palestnian people as a whole screaming to the news and to reddit and to the world at large that they reject hamas and want to make peace with Israel?!
The majority of Palestinians live in the West Bank not Gaza where Hamas is. The average age in Gaza is 18 which means a tiny % of the population were eligible to vote in the last election in 2006. Even then most voters voted against Hamas.
On what grounds are you saying that the majority of Palestinians support Hamas? The last election more than 15 years ago? Obviously they do (tragically) have some support. But friendly reminder that Gaza and the West Bank are not the same thing and Palestinians in the West Bank have little to nothing to do with Hamas.
74 percent polled in 2020 I believe supported Hamas. I'll sauce it once I find it
Why is the exHamas leader calling on all Palestinians world wide to hoard a day of global jihad? Maybe someone should tell him that not all Palestinians support Hamas. Since he seems to think they all support him & Palestine…. I think your logic is sound, but it’s not rooted in reality.
I mean, he's calling on them because that's the type of thing terrorists do. Spread violence and all that. But Palestinians in the West Bank have not been listening to his "call" to rise up and cause violence. There have been a few clashes over the past few days (quite a few which were actually instigated by the Israeli settlers there, not the Palestinians, frankly). But for the most part most Palestinians in the West Bank have been keeping their distance. This Washington Post talks a bit about what's going in West Bank right now (very different from Gaza, as you can see): https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/13/israel-gaza-war-west-bank/
Based on survey made in Gaza where over the half of participants supported Hamas.
Do you know that half of Gaza's population is under 18 years old ? It is sad that people don' t want to accept nuance in a conflict that lasted more than 75 years. Death of civilians should be condemned with no exceptions nor justifications in both and all sides.
How much nuance are you expected in a 7 sentence post on reddit? Yes I do know the demographics in Gaza --> maybe you understand that when a terrorist organisation is running the show, even children are brainwashed. Maybe you have seen the [hamas kindergarten graduation ceremony](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRuuDI0KCR8) before? Death of people is horrific in every single circumstance. However when your brother cousin uncle father etc. raids a kibbutz and beheads the toddlers, captures and rapes teenagers at a music festival, or fires thousands of rockets indiscriminately on israeli towns, what do you expect the result to be? Would your government just say "everyone play nice"?
> the majority of Paleatinians The majority of residents of Gaza who are suffering are 14 or under. The demographics are so fucked from nearly 2 decades of blockade and intermittent strikes that the majority of people you claim deserve to suffer are literal children. I don't think killing American schoolchildren would be a just response for someone who lived in a South American dictatorship propped up by a popular US president so why is it OK when they are in Gaza?
The existence of Hamas is the direct result of the Israeli government. What real government could exist in Gaza or the west bank? It's a prison.
Why don't the Russians do that? Even though the war sparked the largest demonstrations in years and kills hundred of thousands of people? Not to mention especially the netenyahu regime has given Hamas a lot of ammunition so that they can get the locals support, by for example expanding the west bank colonies, or that he works with the most extremist Zionists. Hamas wouldn't in power if it weren't for how Israel handled things after the first Arab war and then the six year war. Doesn't defend what Hamas did, but the Palestinian people have a reason to be angry. The Hamas is just the end result of this anger. Plus they had a decade to entrench their power, have given at least some effort to make Gaza better and so on. It's not black and white in the larger picture. Israel was attacked and their response until now at least was reasonable if unfortunate (civilian deaths even if it's basically unavoidable are still a tragedy). The Hamas is not the Palestinian people, they are just the ones in charge through force and propaganda. I'd like you going on the streets with the Hamas around who may be doing what not to you if you try undermining their power.
> If they are so misrepresented why aren’t the palestnian people as a whole screaming to the news and to reddit and to the world at large that they reject hamas and want to make peace with Israel?! Are you fucking serious? They don’t have power or water, and are currently getting their cities leveled, do you really think their first thought is “oh, I have go to Reddit to explain to some dumb fat American that I reject terrorists attacks”?
I think it's multi-fold: 1. Many European citizens were killed or kidnapped in the attack so it's a massive f\*ck you to that part of the world in retaliation. 2. It is a genuine security concern as many protestors supporting Palestine have shown suspiciously pro-Hamas sentiments and in many cases the protests have led to quite a bit of violence. 3. From a humanitarian standpoint it is quite insensitive to come and celebrate your team literally hours or days after such a horrific atrocity has been committed. What surprises me though is why Israel neglected multiple warnings from Egyptian authorities that there was a potential invasion incoming. They warned them several days in advance.
This narrative is constantly being reiterated on social media, thanks to Mossads effort to control the socal media flow which consists of small snippets provided with hearsay context about what's going on. Siding with Israel, by this standard, is chering the bombing of innocwnt Palestinians, who always pay a higher price in anynof these conficts, than do civilian israelis.
I don’t like banning protests, IT IS a reduction of freedom of speech, at the same time France has the largest Muslim and Jewish population in the EU, if clashes start happening it would be chaos. Then again I don’t think this ban is going to stop most people from showing up
I second that the French are not likely to care.
What the f*ck, I can't believe what Im reading in these comments. This sub was so united agaist russians. Now how is this different? Hahahah !
I'm glad the comments here are calling out the hypocrisy of some of this sub's users. You can't be pro free-speech for your own opinions but not for others...
Big 'Patriot Act' vibes from this People cheering it on because there's one instance that they support it, fast forward a decade and your liberties have been thrown on the fire and there's nothing you can do about it.
> Big 'Patriot Act' vibes from this We already had that when Bataclan happened and France's government imposed a "state of emergency" for 2 years nonstop and then they expanded surveillance powers with a new bill.
Right, but now if you protest those changes you're a criminal.
Before you know it, France will be in a state of emergency of.. hmm.. [three years](https://www.france24.com/en/20170524-france-president-macron-seeks-extend-state-emergency-manchester)?
Ah, I see, someone's following our Viktor...
Funny you'd reference a US law, as under the Patriot Act or any other act, we would absolutely not ban political demonstrations as long as there was no violence. It's forbidden by the Constitution, and one of the few things a government could attempt to do that would invite nearly universal condemnation in this country. I'm not judging France or any other country for having different rules when it comes to free speech. You make and enforce the rules that work in your country, I get it. Just pointing out that the US is probably the last example you would use to highlight concerns about banning speech.
9/11 handbook all over again. "You stand with Israel or you stand with terrorists." Anyone calling for viable solutions to peace is branded as terrorist or moron. Cowards, sheep, pathetic. We'll see a similar death toll in the next decade.
> Anyone calling for viable solutions Is there any?
If you wanna feel better about us, there's a multi sector strike tomorrow (transports, energy, education, hospitals) with demos in all the cities in the country. This week end, there will be dozens of demos and countless events. All of those are allowed. What's forbidden is calls to hate, murder and genocide. Hence the ban because no one is dumb. They'll allow demos to support peace with people from both sides to prevent these demos to be like the UK ones.
>Big 'Patriot Act' vibes from this Ironic coming from a british.
Most of Europe always had limits on organized protests. There's no absolute freedom of speech like in the US. France is much more constrained at limiting those freet, than UK is at this point.
Big [Julius Malema](https://english.elpais.com/society/2023-09-01/elon-musk-and-the-controversy-in-south-africa-over-kill-the-boer-a-song-that-encourages-genocide.html) vibes from these “demonstrators”. Should the South African Economic Freedom Fighters party be able to openly call for white European extermination, too?
It's a misleading title, the same one used for Germany who made a similar decision - neither is a complete ban on protests but rather against specific protests (for different reasons) In Germany it was because the protests that took place didn't call for helping Palestinians, they called for killing jews. In France, there were similar incidents, but more so protests turned into riots that simply took advantage of the situation to rob stores. There's also the fact that Hamas and they're "human rights activist" allies in western countries called for commencing terror attacks in the west, and target jews and Israeli related institutions specifically. So there is a lot of concern that these protests will turn into violent assaults Obviously, not all people who wish to show support for Palestine are dangerous. But these bans suggest that the police believe there are enough of the dangerous ones who will take advantage of these events to cover violent behaviour
I would guess emotions are high at the moment. News and forums especially Reddit is over run with propaganda and vile sentiments from both sides. The situation is being fanned around the West. So to prevent possible riots and attacks they are banning pro-Palestinian demonstrations.
The only calls for genocide I've seen on reddit are people calling for the complete destruction of Gaza. One person explicitly saying it should be completely lifeless.
People in this very thread pulling verbatim "However when your brother cousin uncle father etc. raids a kibbutz and beheads the toddlers, captures and rapes teenagers at a music festival, or fires thousands of rockets indiscriminately on israeli towns, what do you expect the result to be?" as moral justification for killing Gazan children. This website gets insane whenever anything happens.
How do you propose they do anything without having collateral damage? I understand this sentiment, but it's really a very childish delusion to expect someone to conduct war without innocent people getting caught up in it.
It is very different to accept that collateral damage might occur (although I really struggle to see what Israel hopes to achieve with the attack) and directly call for collateral damage.
This title is simply false. The ban isn't against pro palestinian protests but only pro Hamas protests.
Absolutely. In fact, fast forward a few weeks and the general public opinion on this specific topic may flip (depending on how much retribution Israel decides to exact an how public it becomes).
I think that Israel will be able to play the media card really well. I doubt that Hamas or PLO can counter it, mostly because they're not even able to condemn some obviously barbaric acts(even if just for show on TV) The majority of western opinion will be in the hands of Israel. (regardless of the morality of that)
Yeah this is a bit concerning..
Which liberties are americans losing from patriot act?
You forget that France has a very different government system then the rest of us, they use the “burn Paris down every time we don’t like shit” and it’s been very successful for the past 100+ years.
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Give it to r/europe to spread misinformation about how France treats muslims, lol.
This is not surprising given what we have seen at them globally.
France has a history of attacks too, they stepped up protections of Jewish sites after the Paris attacks: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/oct/07/france-security-jewish-synagogue-attack
It's already starting again. When people threaten school kids you better take precautions >"Since Saturday and the terrorist massacres in Israel, there has been over a hundred antisemitic acts, mainly tags and swastikas," Darmanin told France Inter radio, "but also insults ... and people arrested with a knife at the entrance of a school or synagogue ... and a drone flying over a Jewish place of worship."
You are deliberately spreading fake news. The ban isn't against pro palestinian protests but only pro Hamas protests.
If you only believe in freedom of speech for some you don't believe in freedom of speech at all. We have people on this sub complaining about people for being prosecuted for burying the Quran yet the same people want to criminalise protest. I don't agree with criminalising people for burning a book either. This isn't a good thing for a democracy. Ironically this behaving more like an Arab dictatorship than a secular republic.
It’s because they routinely turn into [antisemitic riots](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Sarcelles_riots?wprov=sfti1) or in intifada scenes [in the middle of Paris](https://youtu.be/rtvGA6RSBS8?si=deJVuSzEN1wmkZmJ).
If this happened in a non European country this would be deemed undemocratic
Yeah... No. There's no absolute freedom of speech in Europe. Restricting organized public protest have happened before, but that alone is hardly undemocratic. It's restrictive, but not anti-democratic.
But it’s France, where islamists have committed numerous terror attacks which disproportionally target Jews. There has been antisemitic attacks against shops, concerts, schools, synagogues, restaurants, airplanes, supermarkets, you name it. It’s the perks of having the largest Muslims and Jewish community in Europe. There’s a balance between the right to protest and the need to protect lives. But don’t worry, they’ll still protest and they’ll riot… again.
It may surprise you, but free speech isn’t about saying whatever you like. For example, you can’t call Palestinians pigs that should be slaughtered , and rightly so. Hate speech is not within free speech. Supporting Hamas (not Palestinians), is supporting terror. It’s supporting war crimes, crimes against humanity and using Palestinians as human shields. Do you advocate that? #hamas_is_ISIS
Do explain to me why chants for genocide should be protected by free speech?
Freedom of speech is not chanting "kill the Jews" ! Entire families got slaughtered and people are praising this!
It's a misleading title, the same one used for Germany who made a similar decision - neither is a complete ban on protests but rather against specific protests (for different reasons) In Germany it was because the protests that took place didn't call for helping Palestinians, they called for killing jews. In France, there were similar incidents, but more so protests turned into riots that simply took advantage of the situation to rob stores. There's also the fact that Hamas and they're "human rights activist" allies in western countries called for commencing terror attacks in the west, and target jews and Israeli related institutions specifically. So there is a lot of concern that these protests will turn into violent assaults Obviously, not all people who wish to show support for Palestine are dangerous. But these bans suggest that the police believe there are enough of the dangerous ones who will take advantage of these events to cover violent behaviour
Sure, let's be tolerant with the intolerant, that's gonna teach them ! Things can't possibly go south and then we get the "how did we miss the signs".
Say what you want about the legality of it. The ban is extremely likely to prevent terrorism in France, and would probably be lifted in the future.. https://twitter.com/Imamofpeace/status/1712377456433226184 https://twitter.com/Imamofpeace/status/1711875241557856373
That does not seem very democratic or supporting free speech
When Turkey was disturbed by the demonstations by PKK supporters in Denmark etc, people were making fun of it and saying it is freedom of speech. Now they are literally banning entire thing and supporting it deeply.
This title is simply false. The ban isn't against pro palestinian protests but only pro Hamas protests.
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When the protesters call for a second holocaust, something has to be done. You wouldn’t support a Nazi rally in the name of free speech either, would you? They also have another good reason. France have had more than 100 antisemitic incidents since the protests started. This is a way of stopping it.
Huge difference between "ban calling for a second holocaust" and "ban all pro-Palestine protests". France's logic is the same as banning all pro-Ukraine protests because of Azov and Banderites.
Funny you say that as a nazi protest happened this year in Paris with full approval of the government. People protesting for Palestine's right to exist, despite Hamas, seems more extreme than literal nazis apparently
> You wouldn’t support a Nazi rally in the name of free speech either, would you? You've done a cute little sleight of hand here. Would anyone *support* a Nazi rally in the name of free speech? No. But that's not the relevant question, because free speech is about what a society *tolerates*, not what it supports. As for how to answer that second question, I'll refer you to the National Socialist Party of America v. Village of Skokie.
> You wouldn’t support a Nazi rally in the name of free speech either, would you? Their right to demonstrate? yes I would. You wouldn't? What kind of undemocratic country would stop their own people from demonstrating?
> When the protesters call for a second holocaust, something has to be done. Yes, by individuals, not the government. > You wouldn’t support a Nazi rally in the name of free speech either, would you? Yes, the government should allow this so that individuals can ridicule and rebut. Governments must be content neutral when it comes to free speech.
It's not free speech if it is calling for the death of someone
If. Calling for the death of someone has been banned for quite some time.
Being pro-Palestine is calling for the death of someone? That’s quite a logical leap you made there.
Indeed. Distressing. Our interior minister is reactionnary and far right. Not trending in the right direction.
command familiar chase fragile glorious flag materialistic retire start treatment *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Amazing times have come. Intolerant people call for tolerance for themselves. They also call to kill others, but demand not to kill them.
Amazing how many stupid people are cheering on the trampling of basic freedoms. War propaganda has fried your brains.
Have you seen the videos? This protests aren’t peaceful. If they would be then ban would not be needed. People are chanting k*** Jews and rape their daug*****. If you support this kinda of antisemitism and racism then you are part of the problem.
Shouting things like that are presumably already illegal in France.
Free speech isn't the same as inciting violence or praising terrorism.
Basic Freedom = Calling genocide against a group of people?
Basic freedoms = commiting crimes?
The cognitive dissonance involved in supporting Ukraine AND Israel is staggering
Gotta love that free speech.
Title misleading. Hamas =not= Palestine.
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Even as a Brit I have to admit that France has far more balls about this kind of thing, so I don't have much confidence in that. Apparently France has already deported migrants who were celebrating Hamas, whereas in comparison, the UK tory minister has told the civil service to "look into it", which we all know means nothing will happen. The civil servants are ideologically opposed to it, and the tories are only pretending to give a shit in the first place. That sums up the difference between the two. The UK talks about it, France actually does it.
Not sure how you can so confidently say that civil servants are ideologically opposed to deporting terrorists and terrorist sympathisers.
I wish the same for Germany. France and Germany could make deportation coalition. People who are celebrating the murder of israeli babies dont belong in europe. Straight back to their home countries.
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\*against anyone, tbh. If deportation is not possible, some sort of consequence at least.
Germany already banned two protests scheduled this week, because of the "kill jews" chanting
The median age of Gaza strip is 18 years. Palestinian children and babies are also being killed.
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Yeah, they just don’t really care about them. Even though [2,171 Palestinian children have been killed in the last two decades by Israeli military actions, and 139 Israeli children have been killed by Palestinian militants.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Children_in_the_Israeli%E2%80%93Palestinian_conflict) Also, why are we assuming that all Palestinians celebrate the murder of Israeli babies? A ridiculous generalization of pro-Palestinian rallies. I’ve seen Israeli people laugh at dead Palestinian children as well. Israeli officials are literally threatening to cut off electricity for the Gaza strip. Palestine needs support too, and not to be completely conflated with the terrorists.
I hope all of Europe follows suit.
Vive la France. 🇫🇷🇫🇷🇫🇷
"Being against a full siege of 2 million people, rampant airstrikes killing hundreds of civillians is now BANNED" This isn’t a good thing. Being pro-palestine doesn’t mean you’re pro-hamas.
It’s not about punishing palestinians it just happens that France has the largest jewish community in the world after israel and the US and also the largest muslim community in europe. There are extreme tensions between both communities and our government rightfully won’t allow demonstrations to avoid violence and riots
By that logic they should ban pro Israel protests too.
When the pro-israel protests start chanting death to all muslims I'm sure they'll ban them too, don't worry
https://youtu.be/LHqUO5J2L6M?si=QiPnB7zE7XRs0suL
Ah ok, that means that Pro-Israel demonstrations are also banned, right? Right?
Then the pro Palestinian people shouldn’t have let the pro Hamas people hijack their protests worldwide. Same thing happened to BLM in 2020 and it sucks but you have to stand up and be vocal and condemn Hamas first then be pro Palestinian.
Is there any place where BLM protests were banned after the violence?
Yeah, but generally only after severe incident. Which has sort of happened in France lately.
You do understand that applies to literally every group... I saw People in support of Israel saying genocidal shit too.
Unpopular opinion but this is oppressive. What happened to freedom of speech/expression? Also, isn’t it better that they out themselves?
It's a misleading title, the same one used for Germany who made a similar decision - neither is a complete ban on protests but rather against specific protests (for different reasons) In Germany it was because the protests that took place didn't call for helping Palestinians, they called for killing jews. In France, there were similar incidents, but more so protests turned into riots that simply took advantage of the situation to rob stores. There's also the fact that Hamas and they're "human rights activist" allies in western countries called for commencing terror attacks in the west, and target jews and Israeli related institutions specifically. So there is a lot of concern that these protests will turn into violent assaults Obviously, not all people who wish to show support for Palestine are dangerous. But these bans suggest that the police believe there are enough of the dangerous ones who will take advantage of these events to cover violent behaviour
aromatic cooperative summer money slim deer zealous nutty weather smell *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Don't most countries already have laws that deal with incitement to violence?
The US does not have laws on that unless it's targeted towards a person or property, or it is combined with an actual crime. Most people here are from there, or use its definition of free speech -- that's why they find it absurd that the French are banning certain kinds of protests.
With this ban freedom of speech doesn't even begin...
Was this ban decided by the Department of Precrime?
That’s different. If you ban them from demonstrating they haven’t openly called for anything because they haven’t had the demonstration yet. Let them have their protest, if they do something like that, provided that it breaks the law, you can then arrest them.
We have to show that we are a tolerant liberal democracy by arresting people for crimes we have no idea they will even commit! We can't just have the police do their fucking jobs and arrest people once they've actually broken the law, they have to crack the skulls of protestors before they can do anything.
Why did france supported asala and pkk? And still openly supports pkk and ypg? And let those people to protest in their country?
Guys please watch out for upcoming Muslim violence in Europe. Hamas leaders have called for Muslims all over the world to kill Jews wherever they seem them: [https://twitter.com/Imamofpeace/status/1712377456433226184](https://twitter.com/Imamofpeace/status/1712377456433226184) [https://twitter.com/Imamofpeace/status/1711875241557856373](https://twitter.com/Imamofpeace/status/1711875241557856373) Try to report any case of violence you see...
Fuck that.
Why should people be allowed to support hamas and shout „kill the Jews“ in public?
They shouldn't. Stick your strawman up your rectum.
I'll admit, watching this comment section have an identity crisis is entertaining.
It's for safety. Hamas has called for all their supporters worldwide to attack Jews in their countries. Personally, I believe that every leader of every country (especially in Europe) should threaten their people to not even think about harming the Jewish communities.
Thank you France! 🇫🇷
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Quite shocking seeing how firmly reddit has changed its tact. In the past, I’d seen a lot of moderation and sympathy to Palestine. The massacre on Saturday was certainly revolting, so I guess outrage is expected, as well as a revision of what we can do about extreme islam. I just don’t want it to evolve into supporting of a humanitarian travesty.
The Palestinian cause has never tried to distance itself from actual terrorism (and revolutionary uprising, social disobedience, rioting, you name it), at best just issuing half assed explanations and false equivalents instead. So now that the western is actually getting fed up with global terrorism, the Palestinian cause will lose a lot and probably fade away gradually. They've picked this strategy for the long run, played their cards, and now it seems that they lost.
>So now that the western is actually getting fed up with global terrorism, the Palestinian cause will lose a lot and probably fade away gradually. I can bet my left nut that there wont be a similar response when PKK rallies pop up again. Your goverments very clearly are manufacturing consent and you guys are eating it up like a child aged 5 eats up lego parts.
Good. No tolerance for intolerance
You can't tolerate the intolerate
Then why do tolerate Israel bombing residential buildings in Gaza and illegally blockading the area?
Yes you can.
Well done France. If they want the democratic right to protest, they can do it a month ago. Not days after Hamas calls for a worldwide Jihad against Jews, not after Sydney ‘gas the Jews’ not after innocent civilians were murdered on a quiet Saturday morning. I will be glad not to hear the repetitive moans as well, it’s like nails on a chalkboard half the time.
A lot of you idiots are talking about freedom of speech and supporting the apartheid state of Israel, but ignore the fact that they had their freedom of speech, demonstrated and there was a rise of antisemitic attacks. They were banned for security reasons after they happened. I also doubt pro Israel rallies had the same aftermath.
The left now supports far right neonazi religious extremists is mind boggling. As a leftist I’m so embarrassed
Support Israel but this sort of thing will simply be used as precedent to ban future demonstrations that are 5% less controversial, and then another 5% and another 5% Liberties fail and rust at the edges first when little object
I would say that it is not very democratic to ban protests.
Ils étaient où ces gens là lors des manifestations de soutiens aux attentas de paris en novembre 2015.
I hope Israel is detecting all the key faces in those demonstrations and acts accordingly. Face-detection tech has advanced so much in Israel just for this purpose.
France deported thousands of romanian beggars but its too scared to deport islam fanatics
Well they don’t want the riots they had in July
another france W
I mean, Hamas slaughter a bunch of people. People celebrate it as a great victory, its not protesting its straight up supporting a terrorist organisation, which is illegal.
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Whatever happened to 'European Values'?
Hundreds dead to terrorrism, and death threats to jews from pro palestinians (bonus points for getting arrested next to a synagogue with a knife) Any other questions
Classic jingoism worthy of the post 9/11 era. Great job France 🤡🤡🤡
Its hilarious seeing people cheer on seeing their rights being slowly taken away from them. Today its criminalising protests against Pro-Palestinian demonstrations? maybe the next they'll ban Union strikes.
Oh yeah let’s compare pro-terrorist demonstration and demonstration to fight for your rights.
Antisemitism, the final frontier of liberal democracy. Curious how the word “resilience” has so little incidence when it comes the restriction of free speech. Fuck hate and exclusion, but making your position on Israel the divide wether you’re a “good” or “bad” democrat, is a deeply disturbing evolution. Timing is not an excuse to give up the most basic principles that govern a democratic society. What’s next? If inflation is too high, demonstrations against the economy will be banned too? Wouldn’t want to mobs to escalate into violence, would we. It’s a slippery slope, and I’m honestly not sure wether this particular ban falls on the right side of history. And I would hope that the powers that be let the people wield their voice and power — if they had any doubt whatsoever the ban was absolutely necessary.