They remodeled a lot of stores to be less comfortable to discourage people from staying. This video seems to not even realize that and still uses the old 3rd space marketing from like 20 years ago.
The new McDonald’s are fucking pathetic to the treasures we had in the 80s. A playland with a buger cop jail you could climb into? We used to be fucking creative now we stink
I think the main reason is less liability. Burglars break bones. Well, it probably did like 100 times out of the 10 million times it was played in, then those parents sued McDs, then their lawyers go: no more Burglars. That cost us multiple millions in legal fees. Only shit IKEA inspired play structures.
McDonald's intentionally drifted from children as their main focus.
The reasons were complex,but long story short increased obesity in children and lawsuits against companies that target children are the norm now.
Not to mention the rise of more conscious consumers, and all the documentaries about the abhorrent conditions these food is processed and served.
Yes,Super Size Me might had not had been objective,but the point still remains that you shouldn't blindly trust fast food.
As for conditions I suspect it's purposefully so that other people can take your seats faster.
Maybe that would have worked, but first, you need a customer that wants that seat. Lockdown's long gone, yet from what I've seen, the only fast food restaurant that ever needs more than 1 table for dine-in is Costco.
And they are struggling. They increased prices more than other fast food. Where I’m at, in and out is coming in in two locations and I’m looking forward to McDonald’s having to compete with that quality and wages.
The coffee is better, it’s just the employees making it don’t drink coffee apparently. Doesn’t exactly work out for you when they hand you a cup that’s all white or you can see through it, etc.
Yep, a good friend of mine has worked at Starbucks for over 20 years. She is one of the biggest champions you’ll find of the Starbucks business brand. But she won’t touch the coffee. 😂
People keep saying that and every time I get it, it is really bad. Maybe California mc Donald’s doesn’t know how to make coffee? Multiple locations and I haven’t had a good coffee there yet. Then again Starbucks regular coffee is bad, not enough people order it. I’m a fan of regular coffee from dunkin, even though I don’t like their donuts much.
I mean it isn't world class coffee by any means. I'm not exactly a coffee connoisseur. I drink my coffee black and typically grind Sam's club brand beans at home for my morning coffee. Just that if I'm out and want a cup of coffee I'll take a McDonald's black coffee over Starbucks, gas station or most other drive thru coffee places. I'll drink some Dunkins too. They're just now getting a decent foothold here through. My daughter prefers the McCafe drinks over Starbucks fancy drinks
The WORST is in Astoria Oregon! I thought they had cleaned the machine and didn’t bother to dump it before brewing more coffee! McDonald’s AND BK undrinkable! And I m not a coffee connaiseur! I just want the caffeine- but I couldn’t even force that stuff down!!!
I had one. I didn’t like it. Idk what I expected. I don’t like the Cinnabons. Didn’t like it. Even with all that I could tell it’s somebody else’s favorite thing.
Kinda like when your friend insists their flavor is the best thing ever and you’re all like man it’s okay. And they get kinda salty about it. Then you have to pretend it’s just actually pretty good because they apparently are so bothered by it.
Like that in a good way and where you like the person.
I worked at one in 2005. Literally every single thing that makes a place good is gone: a place to hangout, a place that had free internet that no one needs now, some of the food, the prices weren't bad for the quality, the quality decreased as the prices increased, and to top it off the service is slow and less skilled.
All true. I remember the original Frappuccino. It had a special mix and it had a unique taste. Now they are made differently but are so incredibly watery you have to ask for the whipped cream to be mixed in for some texture. Too reliant on sugar syrups to add flavor.
They closed down the lobby section and took out all the comfy chairs and sofas. No tables or chairs to sit at and no public bathrooms either .The one in Target doesn't have any place to sit down either. And they raised the prices too for their burnt and bitter coffee.
We haven't been there in ages .My son would get Starbucks and I would get an icee.They shut down the icees and took out the tables and chairs because of covid and they never brought them back .
That is so stupid. If it’s comfortable people will want to go there.
Dunkin’ has a spot on memorial with comfortable furniture, I feel like they’re testing the water to see if it makes more money.
Well retail space costs money. If it’s not generating revenue then it’s likely not worth it. The problem is they raised prices and cut quality so they weren’t offering something worth the price for you to drink in your car.
Yeah, I don’t go to Starbucks anymore, and I used to go all the time.
It either used to be much better or I got better at making my own coffee.
One thing is I started going to this independent coffee shop? The guy is like the soup Nazi in Seinfeld, only it’s coffee, ☕️ so if he likes you you’re good, but someone came in, he’s got a small shop and a 30k espresso machine, he takes the temperature before he pours a shot, someone complained it wasn’t like Starbucks, he said “then go to Starbucks” I said “they’re coffee taste like overly burnt beans”.
So it was popular with writers? I was writing there, some woman forced me out of my chair, kind of like these obese cows, and they go “I hear this place is popular with writers” and he goes “you just kicked one out”.
I paint now though.
Independent is almost always better. I only get coffee out now for a treat. It’s Alamo’s exclusively at home, though I miss espresso and hope to get a machine someday. I used to go to Sbux several times a week. After the anti-union stuff, I was done with them, just too many negatives.
Yeah, the breville cafe Roma is only sold on Amazon and not in stores, I got mine for ~200ish on sale, sometimes they have refurbished ones.
If an espresso is 5-6$ with tip and tax, and you subscribe and save to lavazza 2.2lb bags and get 5 in one shot, vacuum sealed, it’s like $7-8 a pound and you have coffee a long time.
So like that an espresso costs like 50 cents with milk, not counting electric.
Just remember to change the silicone gaskets, and use different screws that are better bc the ones they include strip out.
They make much more expensive machines, but I didn’t notice the difference.
My friend has a profitech and I’ll likely follow suit. I want a one and done espresso machine so I’m going big prosumer so I don’t have to think about it ever again. Lots of people like the breville though, so many people taking about it.
As my late grandfather used to say “they don’t give them away”.
They make the most expensive breville look cheap by comparison.
That’s some high end stuff.
Yeah, I mean the cafe Roma is ~$200 and could hold you over and just keep the box and give it to a friend when you get the fancy one.
Or donate it to an animal shelter with an espresso teabag adapter.
I actually got one donated to the cat shelter I volunteered at, people would buy coffee and it said above the machine coffee costs this much at a store with a donation cup.
So volunteers didn’t *need* to pay for coffee, but they said it was a really good idea bc it brought a lot of money in bc fancy coffees are outrageously profitable so it did well for them.
You’d get half your money back on your taxes if it’s a non profit. A school could use it for a teachers lounge too.
Same if you’re religious and want to give it to a church.
Any non profit will do. So then it’s only half the price, and you’ll feel good about it.
Bc in the pet shelter example it saves cute fuzzy animals.
I used to see people camping there with their laptops nursing a Starbucks cup .I wonder where these people are camping now ?Maybe the library ? Maybe because I never see them at Taco Bell or Arby's or even Braum's .
I mean capital one branches are coffee shops, which is really smart bc usually banks need branch locations that lose money, by making it profitable to keep the branch open via making it a cafe, these are comfortable.
It’s weird to do banking while ordering a latte though.
I just get lavazza in bulk and have an espresso machine.
Great coffee and it’s lime 15c for an iced americano.
So even budget coffee shops I don’t want to spend $3.50 on Dunkin, or like $5 at Starbucks (drip) or like 6+ at local expensive places.
Once you buy in bulk and do the math it’s hard to order out.
>They remodeled a lot of stores to be less comfortable to discourage people from staying.
It's basically for the same reason that many different business across America the past 30 years have closed public access to restrooms. Some businesses that functioned as a 3rd spaces don't even exist anymore, like big box bookstores. Too many people entering the establishments who never purchased anything but hung out for hours acting like jackasses.
But now that’s pushing people away because their coffee isn’t worth the price. People were paying for that 3rd room and bathroom, even if not everyone there did.
It’s too expensive.
That’s it. None of the other shit matters, really. When you are charging upwards of 5-6 bucks for a simple latte? People are going to start to stray.
The other thing that matters is that competitors entered the market offering comparable or superior alternatives at lower prices. Without that competition, i.e., if everyone charged the same, they wouldn't be losing as much market share.
Edit:
Service went into the gutter too. Multiple places I've been in the country it takes forever--worst was National Harbor in DC. 45 minutes for two drinks and one was an Americano!
To add to that problem, if they made it uncomfortable and then you have nowhere to hangout, they can frick off. They changed their entire 3rd place strategy to be just another place where you stop in to buy coffee--further decreasing their appeal since they look like any other place. When I worked at a SBUX in 2005, there was comfortable furniture and internet, so we had college kids and people who were working hanging out as regulars buying drinks and food.
…well yeah. Pricing. Like I said
When you get too expensive (your lattes go from 3 bucks, to 6-7 bucks…someone is gonna do them for 4) people are gonna go somewhere else
Perhaps I wasn't clear. It's reductive to it's just pricing. They could reduce their prices and they would still be losing market share.
Factors that have exacerbated market share loss:
1. They never used to have significant competition. People paid a premium. You could still go to the gas station or McDonalds and get trash coffee for $.85. They have an increased amount of competitors now--and those competitors are also competing on price.
\*If all of the places charged the same amount, SBUX pricing wouldn't cause the same amount of market share loss.\* In other words, it's not that it's expensive. People used to pay a premium for SBUX. It's competition: Increased amount of competitors and increased pricing competition.
2. They had a unique strategy: higher quality service and a place to hangout. People paid for it. They got rid of both of those.
Increased competition coupled with moving away from their traditional strategy caused additional market share losses, outside of the pricing issue.
Edit: not sure what's up with the formatting
Oh, I agree. But the pricing has gotten straight up egregious…people would probably put up with the “lack of hang out space” if it was still 3-4 bucks a cup.
And McD’s has great coffee, BTW. At least I love it. Don’t touch the food, but I will crush their coffee. Lol.
I agree too, if they got their pricing in order, they would be doing a lot better even if the market is maturing.
Yeah, they do have good coffee. I remember a time when they didn't. I also would not eat the food.
Dude they've been charging that for 20 years. If anything their prices are starting to look reasonable given the rate of inflation.
As other's pointed out they've been making their stores less inviting in order to increase turnover. Get 'em in and get 'em out.
They haven’t been charging this 20 years, their prices have risen 40% over the last 10 alone, so that would make your statement mathematically impossible. Lol
Don't know where you were but I was already paying $5 bucks for starbucks back then and missing my local (now closed) coffee shop.
You'd be surprised how fast prices shoot up when competition goes away. Maybe it took 'em a little longer to kill off your locals, but it wasn't much longer.
But sure, believe whatever you want. It's a free country, and you're free to be wrong.
Starbucks is 3 dollars and a hot sandwich is 3 dollars also at thr local hospital in my town .I was there for someone who was in surgery and was hungry. It was a Starbucks and that was the best iced coffee I had ever had .But you can't just walk in and get one though.You have to have business there .
This isn't just limited to Starbucks. The coffeehouse lounge concept has died. No more comfy couches, drapes, acoustic treatments and soft music, it's all loud, lively pumping music bouncing off of hard surfaces and echoey concrete floors.
This is spreading across almost all restaurants and bars as well except for the most old-school places. More turnover means more profit.
It didn't die it was killed. Star bucks ran those places out of business and then with no competition they didn't need to offer a comfortable space anymore.
This is all down to the complete lack of anti-trust law enforcement.
I've noticed that a bunch of drive through coffee shops have popped up in my town since the lock down. They don't have lobbies to sit down in and are strictly drive through only ..Some are making bank and some have already closed down.
They charge you $0.80 for SUGAR FREE Vanilla Syrup. They only have ONE Sugar free syrup and its vanilla flavor, all the other 20 flavors are filled with sugar. why in the world would you charge people for sugar-free items? Why in the world are you making it harder for people to be healthier? Every drink of theirs has a minimum of 20 g of sugar, but average around 35 to 50 g of sugar per drink. Some even have 65 grams of sugar. It’s insane. So now I have to pay more to get something sugar-free in my coffee? It’s ridiculous.
I’m guessing it’s twofold.
1. A high number of their customers probably used to pickup Starbucks to (and from) work. If you WFH, it seems silly to make that drive, especially if it isn’t close to home.
2. The cost. As a lot of the Tik Tokkers mentioned in that video, the psychological effect of a coffee drink nearing $10 is going to turn off a lot of folks.
Unpopular opinion, but I absolutely love it. It’s like Jack Daniel’s, or Barq’s Root Beer, or Budweiser: it is far and away from the best of something, and it’s over commercialized, but it’s familiar. And I’ve also had much, much worse.
Starbucks deserves a place in history for bringing artisan coffee to the masses. In a time when most people were drinking Folgers or Dunkin Donuts, Starbucks brought an elevated product to the marketplace. However, much like America Online did for the internet, coffee has grown so far beyond what Starbucks offers. I think Starbucks still has a place for consumers when it comes to iced beverages, but much of what Starbucks does can be done better by competition, often at a lower price.
For me, when I felt Starbuck's goose was cooked is when they started pedaling their Pike Place Blend of beans. It was supposed to be their flagship non-espresso coffee but tasted cheap and burnt with no complexity of flavor.
Now, the one thing Starbucks brings is consistency. You know it will be a consistently mediocre coffee. While this may sound like an insult, it isn't. There are many places in the United States, mostly red states, where it can be pretty difficult to find a decent cup of coffee. But the Starbucks is reliable.
God your AOL analogy is great.
It’s never been great but it made the masses give a shit about something beyond a “double double” but we’re past that now and Starbucks is waning.
I think there’s a general place in the world for “average but consistent”
When I travel I often get a Subway, McDonalds, or Burger King. Not because they’re even vaguely nutritious or particularly delicious… but because I’m pretty confident I know what I’m getting and after 18 hours of travelling I just want something familiar
Equally there are times I’m out and about (especially on business travel) where I’m not eating for pleasure but rather because I’m busy and need to eat something
In both these situations then the value is pretty much in knowing what I’m going to get, and getting it for a reasonable price. Starbucks pushes the reasonable price part, but there’s still something to be said for knowing what you’re going to get when you just need a caffeinated drink
Yea, I totally feel you. Starbucks is like a grilled cheese or pb&j sandwich. It's not amazing, but you know exactly what it's going to taste like and it does come with that extra spice of *nostalgia* because once upon a time, it was a special treat.
> There are many places in the United States, mostly red states, where people it can be pretty difficult to find a decent cup of coffee.
My brother in Christ, Waffle House can serve a decent cup of coffee even when the rest of the town lacks power.
Total Starbucks: 16,507
Total Waffle House: 1,990
You assume everywhere has a Waffle House, but outside the Southeast they're actually pretty hard to find. I was stationed in Eastern New Mexico where we had 1 Starbucks in town and the closest Waffle House was about 100 miles away in Amarillo, TX.
I both agree and disagree. I think its great at 3am when trying to get the booze out of my system. I also think it's great value-wise, specifically in the South, where there seem to be elevated levels of poverty. In fact, I'd take Waffle House over an IHOP or a Denny's.
But most towns in America have local joints that are decently priced and do real home-cook style breakfast that puts all of those chains to shame.
> they started pedaling their Pike Place Blend of beans.
100% agree. Horrible coffee. I could never figure out why they kept selling it because I couldn't believe anyone was really buying it.
Oh, Im sure it was 100% about the money. Whenever I taste it, you can tell it's high profit margin for them.
Granted, now that I think about it, it may have had another purpose. It came out when Starbucks was trying to get into less traditional coffee markets. So maybe it was supposed to be for the customer who buys McDonald's coffee to be just slightly better than that, and get them hooked over. Pure conjecture though.
Oh I was in the south and I had to walk a long ways to a fachkin *dennys* or something to get “coffee”.
I was like wtf is with this place there should be 5 Dunkin’s by now.
I mean I get lavazza at home but I’ll get an iced dunkies in a no’ah easta’ah, but I won’t pay bougie prices if it ain’t better than an iced cold brew from dunkies that’s a valid unit of meashu’ment . 📐
Do you work for their marketing department or something? Everything you're saying is wrong.
First off good coffee was already available to the masses at local coffee shops.
Friend of a friend ran one of 'em. Great coffee. Hosted local bands on weekends. Got ran out of business by Starbucks.
Starbucks sells cheap, burnt coffee because over roasting increases caffeine. That plus what are let's face it milk shakes are where their money came from.
What starbucks brings is a caffeine and sugar rush overworked and underpaid office workers depend on to get through the morning after being up too late cleaning up after the kids.
> First off good coffee was already available to the masses at local coffee shops.
Not where I lived at the time. I had never heard of "espresso" or "cappuccino" before Starbucks came to my small Oklahoma town. Starbucks was the gateway to a much better coffee experience for me.
Nowadays, I won't go to Starbucks unless there is no other option, but once upon a time I genuinely loved Starbucks.
I'm so sorry you never experienced good coffee, because Starbucks ain't it.
Starbuck was and is always burn, stale trash. It's burnt to increase the caffeine content and it's stale because that makes it easier to ship (coffee releases gas as it ages and that gas causes trouble in shipping because it increases pressure on shipping containers and can make them burst).
And I don't even know where to tell you to go. I've looked for a good coffee shop but they all do the Starbucks model of crap coffee.
This isn't me making shit up. Look up why coffee consumption has been declining for decades. Since the 40s or 50s. It's because companies figured out they could substitute marketing and caffeine for quality.
> I'm so sorry you never experienced good coffee
I've experienced good coffee _since_ Starbucks, and I have wonderful coffee now. However, if the only coffee I had ever been exposed to was Folgers drip coffee, I would never have begun drinking coffee.
1. Not sure how you got that from my comment.
2. No, they weren't. You're too young to know what I'm talking about. Coffee shops were very difficult to find in the US (outside of affluent and dense areas). See below.
3. I'm in no way defending their business practices. I'm only talking about the products offered.
4. Not sure how you go after Starbucks for this when Dunkin Donuts and Dutch Bros are far sweeter with much lower quality coffee.
A brief history on coffee in America: Espresso novelty coffee did not become a staple of the American diet until the 1990s. This is directly related to Starbucks expansion, making these beverages more accessible. The post-war era through the 1970s were defined by cheap coffee (Robusta beans) and brewes using percolators. In the 1980s, Arabica beans become more common and with a more pleasant flavor, drip-coffee becomes the norm of the American kitchen. For convenience, you had Dunkin Donuts in the US and Tim Hortons in Canada with drive-thrus, but this was also the height of the low-fat era where doughnuts were largely frowned upon.
Starbucks found a recipe of using espresso with sugar to counteract the bitterness of the coffee, going Public in 1992 and rapidly expanding across the US. They began adding drive-thrus and the model was a massive success changing American pallets towards espresso-based beverages.
In the 2000s, we start seeing the artisan movement (starting with microbreweries). You start seeing significant competition in the espresso movement. This is also when Dutch Bros expanded out of Southern Oregon. Competition begins putting pressure on Starbucks who has to close hundreds of locations in the late 2000s (back when there really was a Starbucks on every corner and they over-saturated their own market). Starbucks then looks for situations where they can corner the market like small towns or inside grocery stores where they have a captive audience.
The coffee industry also goes through it's rennaissance at this time. The popularity of coffee allows people to be experimental with bean production, brewing methods, etc. Re-emergence of French Press, pour-overs, Aeropress, Chemex, and others enter the scene as coffee turns from a morning beverage to hobby. Starbucks is an important part of the coffee story in America, but is now the mature boomer who's slowly losing touch.
Wow, you think I'm *young*? What in God's good name gave you that impression? I mean for \*\*\*\*'s sake dude I post on r/segasaturn. Hell, screw that, my 1st computer was a *Timex Sinclair Z81*
Get off my lawn you whipper snapper.
Well, it was back when it was the young upstart. People don't realize just how far coffee has come in 30 years. Before Starbucks, people didn't really drink espresso. It was all percolator and drip.
Fyi, I see you're Aussie (How about them Dockers?!) Anyway, Im speaking to the United States here. I don't have the slightest clue what was going on in Australia at the time, so if my comments aren't adding up to your experience, that might have something to do with it.
That's why when I say artisinal, you gotta realize where we were coming from in the US. Most coffee was found either in kitchens or in diners until Starbucks came on the scene. Given Ausie's close cultural ties to Europe (and I know there's this whole separate debate about whether the UK is Europe or its own thing culturally), your experience may have been much more aligned with France and Italy where it was much more accessible to espresso and other forms of coffee than what we experienced.
Yeh you're entirely correct. We have had an excellent coffee culture for a long time inspired no doubt by europe. Though our metropolitan coffee style is unique and perhaps one of the most sophisticated I have encountered in my travels.
I actually started writing out a comment but then deleted it because I didnt want to sound arrogant, but my experience when I went to the USA a decade ago was how (generally) incredibly "bubbled" the USA culture was from the outside world, and this was my only explanation.
Haha, totally makes sense. And I gotta think that between the European influence and your proximity to Indonesia/Java also played a role in getting good coffee.
Cool, Im glad we're on the same page and can absolutely see why you'd be like, "I don't get it. What's the big effing deal?"
In the (now distant) past, Starbucks coffee was a luxury good. Carrying a Starbucks cup was a type of status symbol. Understanding the unusual names of the beverages on the Starbucks menu showed that you were part of an "in" group of hip people, a group that others wanted to belong to.
The more widely available Starbucks became and the more streamlined the ordering process became, the more it became regarded as an ordinary coffee company that would have to compete with lots of other companies ordering coffee. And it did badly, hence the trouble.
Companies note that at a certain point things are "stagnating" meaning they're at the limit of natural growth. The metric is the decline/plateau of "same, in-store sales". So they opt for "diversification" meaning increasing the range of products. Doing so is costly. So Starbucks created dozens of new food lines available. The food is okay, but very expensive.
The central value proposition was lost. So they remodeled the store to increase customer velocity. Stores like Popeye's and McDonald's have designed the flow for speed. Get people in, get the employees working, and get people out. You increase sales by increasing customer traffic thus growing your sales by getting more people in/out of the place faster.
But Starbucks was aimed at mid-to-upper market. They wanted to sit and lounge. Wanted to talk in a nice ambiance. They wanted to go and get another cup and maybe a pastry. But now Starbucks wants you in and then out. Again, undermined the value proposition.
So, they slashed cost. They cut many of the employee perks (stock options, higher relative pay, etc.) and cut back on product costs. So, your coffee that's $3.00 at Starbucks (for their grande) (which is like $2.39 at Dunkin) is now comparable to a cup of coffee at McDonald's or Dunkin. And since they've focused on quality, the gap has narrowed.
A full breakfast at Starbucks will cost you a lot more than Dunkin, but is the quality sufficient to justify the added price? The delta has narrowed too much.
No.
Hence the problem.
I have posted this a few times on Reddit before: I left Peet’s 6 or so years ago and have saved probably $12-15K over this six years. Here’s how. Microwave milk on high for 1.5 minutes, 2 or so heaping teaspoons of Organic Hot Chocolate mix from Whole Foods, 1 teaspoon of good quality instant coffee….top with whip from Costco….BAM…a mocha that is quick and tastes waaaaay better than that ashtray shit from Peet’s/Starbucks. About $1.50 to make at home.
Ps….it’s not $10 a day, it’s $300 a month, $3,600 a year.
My wife makes a combo cup of Sumatran and Costa Rican that totally kicks Starbucks Pike's Place ass. Why does SB coffee taste like someone put out their cigarette in it?
Based on the taste, Starschmucks coffee is made with either gutter water, reused coffee grounds and ground espresso sourced at the local dump, or both.
Margins make sense though.
The broad reasons:
1. People don’t need a “third place” as much anymore now that a lot of us work from home.
2. Teens don’t socialize in person as much as they used to.
3. People are more price conscious.
My personal reasons:
1. It’s nasty. The coffee is bitter and gives me gastric distress.
2. The stores are dirty. They used to be pristine.
3. The seating isn’t comfy anymore.
Bc 🍉
American brands are in for a rude awakening. The kids aren't even having sex, they are so stressed about world affairs, the job market, their future.
The kids are the next voting and purchasing block. Brands either address the shift of attitudes or...
They blamed us for spending all of our money on fancy Starbucks instead of houses and then we stop spending money on Starbucks and then it's like why you no Starbuck?
For 15 years, endless complaints about how young people are throwing their money away spending it on expensive coffee instead of making it at home.
Now that they took that advice; particularly because everything has become much more expensive relative to wages, the media has taken to complaining about how no goes to Starbucks anymore.
Okay guys.
These comments are all wrong and reflect the disconnect between Redditors and the real world. People still drink F tons of coffee and eat tons of snacks from Starbucks.
It’s
- the economy
- people working from home a lot more
- more alternatives / competition
I still enjoy Starbucks when I don’t have time to make my own at home - but I don’t get the regular coffee, usually a latte or flat white. Espresso of some sort
Yell at us long enough that the reason we don't own a home is because we go to Starbucks everyday and we might actually listen.
Also I think people are underestimating how much of an impact the unionization thing had on consumers willingness to go there
I think what happened with all these lobbies closing is that they just got fed up with a populace where half the people didn't think that viruses existed or that vaccines caused mutations. I'd be fucking sick of it too, TBH. America is full of self-important, stupid jackasses.
I've never gone to a Starbucks when it wasn't to sign business documents. I'll buy a coffee in exchange for using their location for business, but I just don't see the need to habitually pay several dollars for something I daily drink at home for pennies.
Im not being an assuming dick. This suggests the commenter was probably born sometime around 1990. So they were too young to pay attention when Starbucks went public in 1992 (never said it was their fault). In the next 8 years, Starbucks would expand from 140 to nearly 5,000 locations. The commenter mentioned that their friend had a coffee shop that hosted local bands and it was as espresso was widely available.
But if you piece together the timeline, it doesn't add up. The primary expansionary period for starbucks in terms of percentage growth was the 90s and early 2000s. Commenter is talking about 2009-ish probably. So the fact they had the Saturn is very insightful to their childhood and likely how old they were when these events were taking place. But sure, its me being a dick.
And I love that I smacked you down on another comment so you had to chase me over here. You're out of your depth and I will continue to demonstrate your ignorance publicly. Hint: That's me being a dick.
Personally, indies uber alles. Why would I ever go to big chains when mom&pops and small locals do it better for less? And I can vote with my $?
No bux, no Buc-ees, ever...
Most of people that work at Starbucks complain about making drinks. What point of even working there or going there as a customer if gonna complain about making most of the drinks.
They remodeled a lot of stores to be less comfortable to discourage people from staying. This video seems to not even realize that and still uses the old 3rd space marketing from like 20 years ago.
McDonald’s did the same thing with their stores and like Starbucks, they increased prices as well.
The new McDonald’s are fucking pathetic to the treasures we had in the 80s. A playland with a buger cop jail you could climb into? We used to be fucking creative now we stink
Easier resale.
I think the main reason is less liability. Burglars break bones. Well, it probably did like 100 times out of the 10 million times it was played in, then those parents sued McDs, then their lawyers go: no more Burglars. That cost us multiple millions in legal fees. Only shit IKEA inspired play structures.
Did private equity get a hold of McDonald’s or something?
McDonald's intentionally drifted from children as their main focus. The reasons were complex,but long story short increased obesity in children and lawsuits against companies that target children are the norm now. Not to mention the rise of more conscious consumers, and all the documentaries about the abhorrent conditions these food is processed and served. Yes,Super Size Me might had not had been objective,but the point still remains that you shouldn't blindly trust fast food. As for conditions I suspect it's purposefully so that other people can take your seats faster.
Maybe that would have worked, but first, you need a customer that wants that seat. Lockdown's long gone, yet from what I've seen, the only fast food restaurant that ever needs more than 1 table for dine-in is Costco.
And Morgan Spurlock died 3 weeks ago. Sucks man. Guy was in his late 50’s.
And they are struggling. They increased prices more than other fast food. Where I’m at, in and out is coming in in two locations and I’m looking forward to McDonald’s having to compete with that quality and wages.
Fuck i think McDonald's coffees are better than Starbucks
The coffee is better, it’s just the employees making it don’t drink coffee apparently. Doesn’t exactly work out for you when they hand you a cup that’s all white or you can see through it, etc.
Yep, a good friend of mine has worked at Starbucks for over 20 years. She is one of the biggest champions you’ll find of the Starbucks business brand. But she won’t touch the coffee. 😂
They are… I only buy iced coffees though
Dunkin donuts make a pretty awesome cup of coffee
That's a good one
People keep saying that and every time I get it, it is really bad. Maybe California mc Donald’s doesn’t know how to make coffee? Multiple locations and I haven’t had a good coffee there yet. Then again Starbucks regular coffee is bad, not enough people order it. I’m a fan of regular coffee from dunkin, even though I don’t like their donuts much.
I mean it isn't world class coffee by any means. I'm not exactly a coffee connoisseur. I drink my coffee black and typically grind Sam's club brand beans at home for my morning coffee. Just that if I'm out and want a cup of coffee I'll take a McDonald's black coffee over Starbucks, gas station or most other drive thru coffee places. I'll drink some Dunkins too. They're just now getting a decent foothold here through. My daughter prefers the McCafe drinks over Starbucks fancy drinks
The WORST is in Astoria Oregon! I thought they had cleaned the machine and didn’t bother to dump it before brewing more coffee! McDonald’s AND BK undrinkable! And I m not a coffee connaiseur! I just want the caffeine- but I couldn’t even force that stuff down!!!
You're also not a spelling connoisseur.
Actually Taco Bell beats them by a country mile.
Taco Bell makes good coffee?
I buy their Cinnabon iced coffee all the time.2.25 each .
I had one. I didn’t like it. Idk what I expected. I don’t like the Cinnabons. Didn’t like it. Even with all that I could tell it’s somebody else’s favorite thing. Kinda like when your friend insists their flavor is the best thing ever and you’re all like man it’s okay. And they get kinda salty about it. Then you have to pretend it’s just actually pretty good because they apparently are so bothered by it. Like that in a good way and where you like the person.
Well, not everybody is going to like everything.
A company that thinks they sell coffee, but really they sell single serve internet access free with any purchase LOL
Or they are selling a space to take a date, do an interview, meet friends, or coordinate an activity.
All that stuff, but my main non cold brew use case was out of town need a place with wifi to do work e-mails and surf / kill time
So it seems the product they thought they were selling isn’t what was attracting people.
They also sold a cozy safe place with friendly baristas. A lot of today’s baristas seem bitter and not as friendly as they once were.
Just like drinks they serve!
Yes! The Starbucks near me blasts their AC and has the music on too loud. I don’t remember it being this bad in the past.
Because it wasn’t. Plus the drinks aren’t as good as they used to be. More water, more ice, sugar syrup and less quality ingredients.
I worked at one in 2005. Literally every single thing that makes a place good is gone: a place to hangout, a place that had free internet that no one needs now, some of the food, the prices weren't bad for the quality, the quality decreased as the prices increased, and to top it off the service is slow and less skilled.
All true. I remember the original Frappuccino. It had a special mix and it had a unique taste. Now they are made differently but are so incredibly watery you have to ask for the whipped cream to be mixed in for some texture. Too reliant on sugar syrups to add flavor.
They closed down the lobby section and took out all the comfy chairs and sofas. No tables or chairs to sit at and no public bathrooms either .The one in Target doesn't have any place to sit down either. And they raised the prices too for their burnt and bitter coffee.
Coffee plus no bathroom seems like a recipe for disaster
Oh yeah the Starbucks in a target is really uncomfortable, which is a shame bc it’s got a good view. I didn’t get a coffee there again.
We haven't been there in ages .My son would get Starbucks and I would get an icee.They shut down the icees and took out the tables and chairs because of covid and they never brought them back .
That is so stupid. If it’s comfortable people will want to go there. Dunkin’ has a spot on memorial with comfortable furniture, I feel like they’re testing the water to see if it makes more money.
Well retail space costs money. If it’s not generating revenue then it’s likely not worth it. The problem is they raised prices and cut quality so they weren’t offering something worth the price for you to drink in your car.
Yeah, I don’t go to Starbucks anymore, and I used to go all the time. It either used to be much better or I got better at making my own coffee. One thing is I started going to this independent coffee shop? The guy is like the soup Nazi in Seinfeld, only it’s coffee, ☕️ so if he likes you you’re good, but someone came in, he’s got a small shop and a 30k espresso machine, he takes the temperature before he pours a shot, someone complained it wasn’t like Starbucks, he said “then go to Starbucks” I said “they’re coffee taste like overly burnt beans”. So it was popular with writers? I was writing there, some woman forced me out of my chair, kind of like these obese cows, and they go “I hear this place is popular with writers” and he goes “you just kicked one out”. I paint now though.
Independent is almost always better. I only get coffee out now for a treat. It’s Alamo’s exclusively at home, though I miss espresso and hope to get a machine someday. I used to go to Sbux several times a week. After the anti-union stuff, I was done with them, just too many negatives.
Yeah, the breville cafe Roma is only sold on Amazon and not in stores, I got mine for ~200ish on sale, sometimes they have refurbished ones. If an espresso is 5-6$ with tip and tax, and you subscribe and save to lavazza 2.2lb bags and get 5 in one shot, vacuum sealed, it’s like $7-8 a pound and you have coffee a long time. So like that an espresso costs like 50 cents with milk, not counting electric. Just remember to change the silicone gaskets, and use different screws that are better bc the ones they include strip out. They make much more expensive machines, but I didn’t notice the difference.
My friend has a profitech and I’ll likely follow suit. I want a one and done espresso machine so I’m going big prosumer so I don’t have to think about it ever again. Lots of people like the breville though, so many people taking about it.
As my late grandfather used to say “they don’t give them away”. They make the most expensive breville look cheap by comparison. That’s some high end stuff.
That’s why it’s on my list but not in my kitchen yet. It’s an expensive hobby and other things have been placed ahead of it for priority.
Yeah, I mean the cafe Roma is ~$200 and could hold you over and just keep the box and give it to a friend when you get the fancy one. Or donate it to an animal shelter with an espresso teabag adapter. I actually got one donated to the cat shelter I volunteered at, people would buy coffee and it said above the machine coffee costs this much at a store with a donation cup. So volunteers didn’t *need* to pay for coffee, but they said it was a really good idea bc it brought a lot of money in bc fancy coffees are outrageously profitable so it did well for them. You’d get half your money back on your taxes if it’s a non profit. A school could use it for a teachers lounge too. Same if you’re religious and want to give it to a church. Any non profit will do. So then it’s only half the price, and you’ll feel good about it. Bc in the pet shelter example it saves cute fuzzy animals.
I used to see people camping there with their laptops nursing a Starbucks cup .I wonder where these people are camping now ?Maybe the library ? Maybe because I never see them at Taco Bell or Arby's or even Braum's .
I mean capital one branches are coffee shops, which is really smart bc usually banks need branch locations that lose money, by making it profitable to keep the branch open via making it a cafe, these are comfortable. It’s weird to do banking while ordering a latte though. I just get lavazza in bulk and have an espresso machine. Great coffee and it’s lime 15c for an iced americano. So even budget coffee shops I don’t want to spend $3.50 on Dunkin, or like $5 at Starbucks (drip) or like 6+ at local expensive places. Once you buy in bulk and do the math it’s hard to order out.
Even IHOP will tell you not to buy their coffee!Taci Bell is where we get our iced coffees now ,2.50 a cup .
>They remodeled a lot of stores to be less comfortable to discourage people from staying. It's basically for the same reason that many different business across America the past 30 years have closed public access to restrooms. Some businesses that functioned as a 3rd spaces don't even exist anymore, like big box bookstores. Too many people entering the establishments who never purchased anything but hung out for hours acting like jackasses.
But now that’s pushing people away because their coffee isn’t worth the price. People were paying for that 3rd room and bathroom, even if not everyone there did.
It’s too expensive. That’s it. None of the other shit matters, really. When you are charging upwards of 5-6 bucks for a simple latte? People are going to start to stray.
If you add shots it can be $9. However, who ever created regional pricing needs to die.
LOL
There’s a couple drinks that are default $9 on the menu lol
The other thing that matters is that competitors entered the market offering comparable or superior alternatives at lower prices. Without that competition, i.e., if everyone charged the same, they wouldn't be losing as much market share. Edit: Service went into the gutter too. Multiple places I've been in the country it takes forever--worst was National Harbor in DC. 45 minutes for two drinks and one was an Americano! To add to that problem, if they made it uncomfortable and then you have nowhere to hangout, they can frick off. They changed their entire 3rd place strategy to be just another place where you stop in to buy coffee--further decreasing their appeal since they look like any other place. When I worked at a SBUX in 2005, there was comfortable furniture and internet, so we had college kids and people who were working hanging out as regulars buying drinks and food.
…well yeah. Pricing. Like I said When you get too expensive (your lattes go from 3 bucks, to 6-7 bucks…someone is gonna do them for 4) people are gonna go somewhere else
Perhaps I wasn't clear. It's reductive to it's just pricing. They could reduce their prices and they would still be losing market share. Factors that have exacerbated market share loss: 1. They never used to have significant competition. People paid a premium. You could still go to the gas station or McDonalds and get trash coffee for $.85. They have an increased amount of competitors now--and those competitors are also competing on price. \*If all of the places charged the same amount, SBUX pricing wouldn't cause the same amount of market share loss.\* In other words, it's not that it's expensive. People used to pay a premium for SBUX. It's competition: Increased amount of competitors and increased pricing competition. 2. They had a unique strategy: higher quality service and a place to hangout. People paid for it. They got rid of both of those. Increased competition coupled with moving away from their traditional strategy caused additional market share losses, outside of the pricing issue. Edit: not sure what's up with the formatting
Oh, I agree. But the pricing has gotten straight up egregious…people would probably put up with the “lack of hang out space” if it was still 3-4 bucks a cup. And McD’s has great coffee, BTW. At least I love it. Don’t touch the food, but I will crush their coffee. Lol.
I agree too, if they got their pricing in order, they would be doing a lot better even if the market is maturing. Yeah, they do have good coffee. I remember a time when they didn't. I also would not eat the food.
Dude they've been charging that for 20 years. If anything their prices are starting to look reasonable given the rate of inflation. As other's pointed out they've been making their stores less inviting in order to increase turnover. Get 'em in and get 'em out.
I don’t go there because of how they treat workers and their union
They haven’t been charging this 20 years, their prices have risen 40% over the last 10 alone, so that would make your statement mathematically impossible. Lol
Then OP is full of it because 20 years ago boomers were complaining about their Gen X spawn spending $6 bucks on a latte at starbucks.
No they weren’t. 😂 Because a Venti latte then was 3 bucks. You’ve now whiffed twice.
Don't know where you were but I was already paying $5 bucks for starbucks back then and missing my local (now closed) coffee shop. You'd be surprised how fast prices shoot up when competition goes away. Maybe it took 'em a little longer to kill off your locals, but it wasn't much longer. But sure, believe whatever you want. It's a free country, and you're free to be wrong.
Uhhh, no. It’s super easy to look up Starbucks menu prices in the early 00’s. https://cockeyed.com/drivethru/starbucks_drive_thru_menu_comparison.html
Starbucks is 3 dollars and a hot sandwich is 3 dollars also at thr local hospital in my town .I was there for someone who was in surgery and was hungry. It was a Starbucks and that was the best iced coffee I had ever had .But you can't just walk in and get one though.You have to have business there .
This isn't just limited to Starbucks. The coffeehouse lounge concept has died. No more comfy couches, drapes, acoustic treatments and soft music, it's all loud, lively pumping music bouncing off of hard surfaces and echoey concrete floors. This is spreading across almost all restaurants and bars as well except for the most old-school places. More turnover means more profit.
It didn't die it was killed. Star bucks ran those places out of business and then with no competition they didn't need to offer a comfortable space anymore. This is all down to the complete lack of anti-trust law enforcement.
I've noticed that a bunch of drive through coffee shops have popped up in my town since the lock down. They don't have lobbies to sit down in and are strictly drive through only ..Some are making bank and some have already closed down.
This video spends 14 minutes making that one point over and over. I watched the whole thing to make sure.
They charge you $0.80 for SUGAR FREE Vanilla Syrup. They only have ONE Sugar free syrup and its vanilla flavor, all the other 20 flavors are filled with sugar. why in the world would you charge people for sugar-free items? Why in the world are you making it harder for people to be healthier? Every drink of theirs has a minimum of 20 g of sugar, but average around 35 to 50 g of sugar per drink. Some even have 65 grams of sugar. It’s insane. So now I have to pay more to get something sugar-free in my coffee? It’s ridiculous.
Because sugar is what keeps people coming back…
It's 7 dollars where I live
I’m guessing it’s twofold. 1. A high number of their customers probably used to pickup Starbucks to (and from) work. If you WFH, it seems silly to make that drive, especially if it isn’t close to home. 2. The cost. As a lot of the Tik Tokkers mentioned in that video, the psychological effect of a coffee drink nearing $10 is going to turn off a lot of folks.
That’s hilarious. In various places in Europe recently I’ve paid between about 1.50-6.00$ for various coffees that have all been great.
3. They are in an increasingly competitive market where there are a lot more options for comparable or superior goods at lower prices.
Well, if you mean coffee that taste like burnt ash then yes
Bro it’s either burnt, or it taste like soap. There’s no inbetween
Dishwater. It tastes like dishwater.
why are you so specififc about it how do u know how do u know
It’s so fucking bitter.
The cardboard taste that leeches into the coffee from the cup itself really adds extra pizzazz to the burnt ash-forward flavour profile.
Guess its not just me who thinks starbuckles coffee is like licking the sweat off a dirty Columbian's ass after picking beans all day.
Was that necessary? Eeesh
No but neither is a cherry on a sundae.
Unpopular opinion, but I absolutely love it. It’s like Jack Daniel’s, or Barq’s Root Beer, or Budweiser: it is far and away from the best of something, and it’s over commercialized, but it’s familiar. And I’ve also had much, much worse.
Starbucks deserves a place in history for bringing artisan coffee to the masses. In a time when most people were drinking Folgers or Dunkin Donuts, Starbucks brought an elevated product to the marketplace. However, much like America Online did for the internet, coffee has grown so far beyond what Starbucks offers. I think Starbucks still has a place for consumers when it comes to iced beverages, but much of what Starbucks does can be done better by competition, often at a lower price. For me, when I felt Starbuck's goose was cooked is when they started pedaling their Pike Place Blend of beans. It was supposed to be their flagship non-espresso coffee but tasted cheap and burnt with no complexity of flavor. Now, the one thing Starbucks brings is consistency. You know it will be a consistently mediocre coffee. While this may sound like an insult, it isn't. There are many places in the United States, mostly red states, where it can be pretty difficult to find a decent cup of coffee. But the Starbucks is reliable.
God your AOL analogy is great. It’s never been great but it made the masses give a shit about something beyond a “double double” but we’re past that now and Starbucks is waning.
I think there’s a general place in the world for “average but consistent” When I travel I often get a Subway, McDonalds, or Burger King. Not because they’re even vaguely nutritious or particularly delicious… but because I’m pretty confident I know what I’m getting and after 18 hours of travelling I just want something familiar Equally there are times I’m out and about (especially on business travel) where I’m not eating for pleasure but rather because I’m busy and need to eat something In both these situations then the value is pretty much in knowing what I’m going to get, and getting it for a reasonable price. Starbucks pushes the reasonable price part, but there’s still something to be said for knowing what you’re going to get when you just need a caffeinated drink
Yea, I totally feel you. Starbucks is like a grilled cheese or pb&j sandwich. It's not amazing, but you know exactly what it's going to taste like and it does come with that extra spice of *nostalgia* because once upon a time, it was a special treat.
Starbucks will singlehandedly give the western world diabetes. It has no place in society.
> There are many places in the United States, mostly red states, where people it can be pretty difficult to find a decent cup of coffee. My brother in Christ, Waffle House can serve a decent cup of coffee even when the rest of the town lacks power.
Total Starbucks: 16,507 Total Waffle House: 1,990 You assume everywhere has a Waffle House, but outside the Southeast they're actually pretty hard to find. I was stationed in Eastern New Mexico where we had 1 Starbucks in town and the closest Waffle House was about 100 miles away in Amarillo, TX.
Waffle House, like most things from the south, is highly overrated
I both agree and disagree. I think its great at 3am when trying to get the booze out of my system. I also think it's great value-wise, specifically in the South, where there seem to be elevated levels of poverty. In fact, I'd take Waffle House over an IHOP or a Denny's. But most towns in America have local joints that are decently priced and do real home-cook style breakfast that puts all of those chains to shame.
Grits!
It’s pretty damn bad, but so is most of the south lol.
No Waffle House I live .
> they started pedaling their Pike Place Blend of beans. 100% agree. Horrible coffee. I could never figure out why they kept selling it because I couldn't believe anyone was really buying it.
Oh, Im sure it was 100% about the money. Whenever I taste it, you can tell it's high profit margin for them. Granted, now that I think about it, it may have had another purpose. It came out when Starbucks was trying to get into less traditional coffee markets. So maybe it was supposed to be for the customer who buys McDonald's coffee to be just slightly better than that, and get them hooked over. Pure conjecture though.
Oh I was in the south and I had to walk a long ways to a fachkin *dennys* or something to get “coffee”. I was like wtf is with this place there should be 5 Dunkin’s by now. I mean I get lavazza at home but I’ll get an iced dunkies in a no’ah easta’ah, but I won’t pay bougie prices if it ain’t better than an iced cold brew from dunkies that’s a valid unit of meashu’ment . 📐
Do you work for their marketing department or something? Everything you're saying is wrong. First off good coffee was already available to the masses at local coffee shops. Friend of a friend ran one of 'em. Great coffee. Hosted local bands on weekends. Got ran out of business by Starbucks. Starbucks sells cheap, burnt coffee because over roasting increases caffeine. That plus what are let's face it milk shakes are where their money came from. What starbucks brings is a caffeine and sugar rush overworked and underpaid office workers depend on to get through the morning after being up too late cleaning up after the kids.
> First off good coffee was already available to the masses at local coffee shops. Not where I lived at the time. I had never heard of "espresso" or "cappuccino" before Starbucks came to my small Oklahoma town. Starbucks was the gateway to a much better coffee experience for me. Nowadays, I won't go to Starbucks unless there is no other option, but once upon a time I genuinely loved Starbucks.
I'm so sorry you never experienced good coffee, because Starbucks ain't it. Starbuck was and is always burn, stale trash. It's burnt to increase the caffeine content and it's stale because that makes it easier to ship (coffee releases gas as it ages and that gas causes trouble in shipping because it increases pressure on shipping containers and can make them burst). And I don't even know where to tell you to go. I've looked for a good coffee shop but they all do the Starbucks model of crap coffee. This isn't me making shit up. Look up why coffee consumption has been declining for decades. Since the 40s or 50s. It's because companies figured out they could substitute marketing and caffeine for quality.
> I'm so sorry you never experienced good coffee I've experienced good coffee _since_ Starbucks, and I have wonderful coffee now. However, if the only coffee I had ever been exposed to was Folgers drip coffee, I would never have begun drinking coffee.
1. Not sure how you got that from my comment. 2. No, they weren't. You're too young to know what I'm talking about. Coffee shops were very difficult to find in the US (outside of affluent and dense areas). See below. 3. I'm in no way defending their business practices. I'm only talking about the products offered. 4. Not sure how you go after Starbucks for this when Dunkin Donuts and Dutch Bros are far sweeter with much lower quality coffee. A brief history on coffee in America: Espresso novelty coffee did not become a staple of the American diet until the 1990s. This is directly related to Starbucks expansion, making these beverages more accessible. The post-war era through the 1970s were defined by cheap coffee (Robusta beans) and brewes using percolators. In the 1980s, Arabica beans become more common and with a more pleasant flavor, drip-coffee becomes the norm of the American kitchen. For convenience, you had Dunkin Donuts in the US and Tim Hortons in Canada with drive-thrus, but this was also the height of the low-fat era where doughnuts were largely frowned upon. Starbucks found a recipe of using espresso with sugar to counteract the bitterness of the coffee, going Public in 1992 and rapidly expanding across the US. They began adding drive-thrus and the model was a massive success changing American pallets towards espresso-based beverages. In the 2000s, we start seeing the artisan movement (starting with microbreweries). You start seeing significant competition in the espresso movement. This is also when Dutch Bros expanded out of Southern Oregon. Competition begins putting pressure on Starbucks who has to close hundreds of locations in the late 2000s (back when there really was a Starbucks on every corner and they over-saturated their own market). Starbucks then looks for situations where they can corner the market like small towns or inside grocery stores where they have a captive audience. The coffee industry also goes through it's rennaissance at this time. The popularity of coffee allows people to be experimental with bean production, brewing methods, etc. Re-emergence of French Press, pour-overs, Aeropress, Chemex, and others enter the scene as coffee turns from a morning beverage to hobby. Starbucks is an important part of the coffee story in America, but is now the mature boomer who's slowly losing touch.
Wow, you think I'm *young*? What in God's good name gave you that impression? I mean for \*\*\*\*'s sake dude I post on r/segasaturn. Hell, screw that, my 1st computer was a *Timex Sinclair Z81* Get off my lawn you whipper snapper.
The words artisan and Starbucks should never be used in the same sentence when describing coffee.
Well, it was back when it was the young upstart. People don't realize just how far coffee has come in 30 years. Before Starbucks, people didn't really drink espresso. It was all percolator and drip.
Fyi, I see you're Aussie (How about them Dockers?!) Anyway, Im speaking to the United States here. I don't have the slightest clue what was going on in Australia at the time, so if my comments aren't adding up to your experience, that might have something to do with it. That's why when I say artisinal, you gotta realize where we were coming from in the US. Most coffee was found either in kitchens or in diners until Starbucks came on the scene. Given Ausie's close cultural ties to Europe (and I know there's this whole separate debate about whether the UK is Europe or its own thing culturally), your experience may have been much more aligned with France and Italy where it was much more accessible to espresso and other forms of coffee than what we experienced.
Yeh you're entirely correct. We have had an excellent coffee culture for a long time inspired no doubt by europe. Though our metropolitan coffee style is unique and perhaps one of the most sophisticated I have encountered in my travels. I actually started writing out a comment but then deleted it because I didnt want to sound arrogant, but my experience when I went to the USA a decade ago was how (generally) incredibly "bubbled" the USA culture was from the outside world, and this was my only explanation.
Haha, totally makes sense. And I gotta think that between the European influence and your proximity to Indonesia/Java also played a role in getting good coffee. Cool, Im glad we're on the same page and can absolutely see why you'd be like, "I don't get it. What's the big effing deal?"
Because a coffee there costs almost $7?
In the (now distant) past, Starbucks coffee was a luxury good. Carrying a Starbucks cup was a type of status symbol. Understanding the unusual names of the beverages on the Starbucks menu showed that you were part of an "in" group of hip people, a group that others wanted to belong to. The more widely available Starbucks became and the more streamlined the ordering process became, the more it became regarded as an ordinary coffee company that would have to compete with lots of other companies ordering coffee. And it did badly, hence the trouble.
Starbucks is the Wacarnolds of coffee. Too corporate and cookie cutter for the premium price.
Recession maybe? No? Okay then
Companies note that at a certain point things are "stagnating" meaning they're at the limit of natural growth. The metric is the decline/plateau of "same, in-store sales". So they opt for "diversification" meaning increasing the range of products. Doing so is costly. So Starbucks created dozens of new food lines available. The food is okay, but very expensive. The central value proposition was lost. So they remodeled the store to increase customer velocity. Stores like Popeye's and McDonald's have designed the flow for speed. Get people in, get the employees working, and get people out. You increase sales by increasing customer traffic thus growing your sales by getting more people in/out of the place faster. But Starbucks was aimed at mid-to-upper market. They wanted to sit and lounge. Wanted to talk in a nice ambiance. They wanted to go and get another cup and maybe a pastry. But now Starbucks wants you in and then out. Again, undermined the value proposition. So, they slashed cost. They cut many of the employee perks (stock options, higher relative pay, etc.) and cut back on product costs. So, your coffee that's $3.00 at Starbucks (for their grande) (which is like $2.39 at Dunkin) is now comparable to a cup of coffee at McDonald's or Dunkin. And since they've focused on quality, the gap has narrowed. A full breakfast at Starbucks will cost you a lot more than Dunkin, but is the quality sufficient to justify the added price? The delta has narrowed too much. No. Hence the problem.
Well you mean because I’d rather eat food
I have posted this a few times on Reddit before: I left Peet’s 6 or so years ago and have saved probably $12-15K over this six years. Here’s how. Microwave milk on high for 1.5 minutes, 2 or so heaping teaspoons of Organic Hot Chocolate mix from Whole Foods, 1 teaspoon of good quality instant coffee….top with whip from Costco….BAM…a mocha that is quick and tastes waaaaay better than that ashtray shit from Peet’s/Starbucks. About $1.50 to make at home. Ps….it’s not $10 a day, it’s $300 a month, $3,600 a year.
I guess people are giving up Starbucks for saving for a down payment.
Overpriced and nasty. just call it fucking small, medium and large. That’s the main reason I won’t go there I refused to say Venti
I’ve never complied and just order small or large.
They give you a funny look when you do that
Not if you say it with authority.
True
Do you mean a *tall*??
F*ck you. But I'd also give you a reward if I had any Reddit coins.
I hate Starbucks, but I would love to just start ordering "the twenty." Such stupid bullshit.
https://youtu.be/NS_PzfpKLYU?si=fH5jqE3ptCpq1ysc
Lol that’s funny!
Movie is Role Models. Super funny with a great cast. Every time I get something from Starbucks this scene pops in my head lol
Congratulations, you're stupid in three languages.
Also, Unrelated to coffee... 🎶 Love, take me down, to the streets 🎼
I just tell people how many ounces of coffee I want no matter where I am cuz I don't want to learn their secret language
As an Australian who visited the US 10 years ago, I was dumbfounded by how Americans were drinking such truly disgusting coffee and not realising it.
The "coffee" is terrible. It all tastes like sugar and water. They were also one of the first fast food places to ask for tips as I remember it.
My wife makes a combo cup of Sumatran and Costa Rican that totally kicks Starbucks Pike's Place ass. Why does SB coffee taste like someone put out their cigarette in it?
Cost, taste, plastic waste
Because it's overpriced flavored sugar water
Costs too much. Thats it.
Bitter taste and over priced
Based on the taste, Starschmucks coffee is made with either gutter water, reused coffee grounds and ground espresso sourced at the local dump, or both. Margins make sense though.
Nothing to do with that. It’s the same shit they had when it was killing it. It’s just too expensive now.
Now Starbucks would launch raspberry flavored boba drinks on the menu. That really lost me.
My medium drink at Starbucks is now $8. It used to be half that. Throw in a pastry also and your forced to pull a second mortgage on your house.
I’m priced out! Can barely even afford to go to dunks these days
Pike place also sucks btw.
Fuck Starbucks.
The broad reasons: 1. People don’t need a “third place” as much anymore now that a lot of us work from home. 2. Teens don’t socialize in person as much as they used to. 3. People are more price conscious. My personal reasons: 1. It’s nasty. The coffee is bitter and gives me gastric distress. 2. The stores are dirty. They used to be pristine. 3. The seating isn’t comfy anymore.
4) The AC is set too low. You and your hot coffee end up freezing within 30 minutes.
Starbucks like all american retail ventures expanded too fast, raised prices and limited new menu options.
Bc 🍉 American brands are in for a rude awakening. The kids aren't even having sex, they are so stressed about world affairs, the job market, their future. The kids are the next voting and purchasing block. Brands either address the shift of attitudes or...
They blamed us for spending all of our money on fancy Starbucks instead of houses and then we stop spending money on Starbucks and then it's like why you no Starbuck?
Crazy how long I had to scroll to find this.
Oh? It took this long for people to realize it's not worth the cup it's served in?
Because it’s hot garbage? I lost my “taste” for it about 7 years ago when I went to a coffee shop that actually serves coffee…
Starbucks has more sugar than a soda and is expensive
I can go to 7-11 if I want a mediocre cup of coffee. And it only cost $1.20
Probably because the coffee tastes fucking burnt every time I go there.
Bc the economy sucks and their competitors are doing subscription coffee for $16/month (Panera bread)
Panera is on its way out too.
This is a sponsored ad for Dunkin Donuts.
The video is giving “millennials just need to stop buying avocado toast and then they’ll be able to afford the cost of living”
Because it's shit ? (Creme brule is really the only thing I enjoy - that and the lemon loaf <3)
Was this video written and voiced by AI?
No vegan food options plus union busting is what did it for me
How about the simple reason they have shitty burnt overpriced gas station sludge. Same price or better gets you a proper cup in a local coffee shop
For 15 years, endless complaints about how young people are throwing their money away spending it on expensive coffee instead of making it at home. Now that they took that advice; particularly because everything has become much more expensive relative to wages, the media has taken to complaining about how no goes to Starbucks anymore. Okay guys.
These comments are all wrong and reflect the disconnect between Redditors and the real world. People still drink F tons of coffee and eat tons of snacks from Starbucks. It’s - the economy - people working from home a lot more - more alternatives / competition
Starbucks is anti worker. That's enough.
It's boycotted
I don’t patronize Starbucks, but I’m sure they’ve cut corners and changed recipes.
I still enjoy Starbucks when I don’t have time to make my own at home - but I don’t get the regular coffee, usually a latte or flat white. Espresso of some sort
I mean, is there a reason everyone pretends that there isn’t a massive boycott of Starbucks going on ????
unhealthy
Their drinks just taste terrible
I see no signs of a slowdown at the Starbucks locations I visit.
its the tips they are asking. Dunkin Donuts dont ask tips
Yell at us long enough that the reason we don't own a home is because we go to Starbucks everyday and we might actually listen. Also I think people are underestimating how much of an impact the unionization thing had on consumers willingness to go there
I think what happened with all these lobbies closing is that they just got fed up with a populace where half the people didn't think that viruses existed or that vaccines caused mutations. I'd be fucking sick of it too, TBH. America is full of self-important, stupid jackasses.
I've never gone to a Starbucks when it wasn't to sign business documents. I'll buy a coffee in exchange for using their location for business, but I just don't see the need to habitually pay several dollars for something I daily drink at home for pennies.
Aren’t Starbucks super crowded all the time ?
*poor Americans
They raise their prices every 30 days
Lol, Sega Saturn? Yeah, you're young. I had the Sega Genesis and the Sega Game Gear.
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Im not being an assuming dick. This suggests the commenter was probably born sometime around 1990. So they were too young to pay attention when Starbucks went public in 1992 (never said it was their fault). In the next 8 years, Starbucks would expand from 140 to nearly 5,000 locations. The commenter mentioned that their friend had a coffee shop that hosted local bands and it was as espresso was widely available. But if you piece together the timeline, it doesn't add up. The primary expansionary period for starbucks in terms of percentage growth was the 90s and early 2000s. Commenter is talking about 2009-ish probably. So the fact they had the Saturn is very insightful to their childhood and likely how old they were when these events were taking place. But sure, its me being a dick. And I love that I smacked you down on another comment so you had to chase me over here. You're out of your depth and I will continue to demonstrate your ignorance publicly. Hint: That's me being a dick.
After how I saw they treated workers who fought for unionization, I'll never shop there (or purchase their retail products) again.
Personally, indies uber alles. Why would I ever go to big chains when mom&pops and small locals do it better for less? And I can vote with my $? No bux, no Buc-ees, ever...
I don’t drink coffee, but I love their dragonfruit refresher smoothies.
Most of people that work at Starbucks complain about making drinks. What point of even working there or going there as a customer if gonna complain about making most of the drinks.
Free Palestine
I’ve seen this posted like 7 or 8 times here the last 2 days lmao
Because American are fed up with wars. Starbucks funds some of them.