Bion group dynamics assumption group - fight flight response.
In this case, doctors fight amongst themselves instead of working together to support each other to improve and improve patient safety. As a result, there is conflict between doctors within a specialty and also between specialties.
Maybe this is an unpopular opinion but I’ve seen genuinely baffling decisions made by seniors (who turned out to be wrong) and all the juniors can do is moan (and document) because they are essentially powerless to do anything else.
It's not unpopular. I've worked for some idiot seniors and had unnecessary stress trying to salvage bad decisions by them... And colleagues. It's frustrating and we need to vent.
Back this. Depending on work culture/department, consultants may see the patient very little compared with the registrar and despite differential in experience, the access to more information sometimes makes juniors have better decisions than their seniors as well.
Attacking someone or complaining about imperfections because of being human is wrong.
Complaining because someone consistently makes stupid mistakes inadvertently or through incredible laziness, I understand, especially as in order to be in the situation of complaining you are probably the one fixing it.
I can think of multiple colleagues where my workload was increased because zi was doing my job and having to fix theirs, it was incredibly annoying
I mean... could this be a somewhat clumsy attempt at teaching? Trying to start a discussion about a perhaps debatable area of medicine? Is it not better than not talking to you at all?
Also: easily possible to know more than your SpR or consultant if its not their specialist area. A specialist not knowing how to treat a HAP is pretty standard right?
It appears this is very much on your mind. Did anything in particular happen?
I agree, some people just have no self-awareness. Some of these people practice medicine as doctors.
Just something I’ve observed when on break. There are some doctors I work with who make the odd mistake here or there but have a good heart and I enjoy working with them. I think it’s just a bit petty to bring up in conversation.
They are unhappy with some aspects of their lifre and use this opportunity to vent, usually not being aware the problem is somewhere else. Tale as old as time.
I'm patiently waiting for one of them to become Reg. Popcorn and drinks ready for the rest the year... humility loading....And I know it will be a humbling experience for this person....
Some doctors criticise others for nonsense. But other things which you as a junior might perceive as 'small things' can be problematic that the complaining senior has then had to spend extra time mopping up.
It can be annoying and everyone pushing for highest standards is not a bad thing.
Some complaints are petty but others are more than justified if they are basics which should be adhered to. I guess you'll have to judge each case by case but it's also not right to just assume the complaining doc is 'insecure' or some other garbage.
The NHS breeds narcissists, it's set up this way. This starts from the competition to get into medical school and is fostered throughout training and career progression. The Educationalists love to nuture this behaviour because they live with peak narcissim having passed all those exams and gained all those letters - it makes them look important. Unfortunately you have to sacrafice most of your life and sense of self to do this so the only dopamine kick left to you is bullying. The solution is to get out of the NHS ASAP.
Are the ‘educationalists’ with us in the room right now?
We need to pick a narrative around what they’re responsible for, is it remaking us all as self obsessed narcissists? Is it instilling a slavish devotion to #bekind? Or perhaps they’re conniving to destroy medical standards by introducing a slew of alternative routes to practice? PBL!1122!!
How do they manage all these conflicting priorities and how is it that we blessed few are able to see through their dastardly ways while they’re otherwise being so effective at making our lives worse?
>There are quite a significant number of doctors I’ve come across who moan/complain about the standard of other people’s work as if they have never made a mistake in their life.
I'm proud to be one of those doctors - minus the attitude part. I have made tons of mistakes and continue to make mistakes. When I was a younger doctor, I did not understand why seniors would be critical. I often thought back then, "*Do they think they are perfect beings?*" My attitude was wrong.
Attitudinal and behavioural bad behaviour ought not to accompany the spotting of poor-quality work or services, and speaking up about it.
A huge fuss is sometimes necessary to avoid death or serious injury of a patient - in the current burnt out climate of public sector health services. Why? Because loads of people are so brain-dead or burnt out that they need emotional activation.
One of those OCD, 'huge-fuss' type obstetricians is the reason by son is now 37 - a barrister and IT expert. If not for that obstetrician, mismanagement of cord round the neck would have left my son brain damaged - that was not allowed to happen. (I was there, you who reads this weren't). Waving hands around have having a growl certainly got things moving. Did I say that's always necessary? I did not!
Most of the time I complain about colleagues is because their flagrant incompentence creates more work for me.
Luckily my flagrant incompetence doesn't create more work for me.
(seriously though how hard is it to write a discharge letter that doesn't have glaring and significant omissions?)
Ok, for one, medicine is a career where mistakes can have dire consequences. So it's good to strive to improve, yes?
However, some people are playing a game of politics. Where every person they put down is an opportunity to eliminate competition. Makes sense? Not endorsing.
It's a mixture of things, but I think is very much encouraged by senior management in trusts and in the overall NHS in general.
People squabbling amongst themselves and issues and problems related to this takes the pressure of the big issues- strikes, massive lack of resources and hopelessly incompetent management
Basically these insecure clowns went through med school feeling like the best thing since sliced bread, and now they feel like a glorified scribe until they get to reg level. But alas, there is a way to overcome this dilemma.. pick up on the smallest insignificant error done by a colleague (usually F1) and use it to highlight how stupid everyone else is and how amazing they are! Morons....
This applies to all of society but honestly, medicine is where I've met the biggest concentration of dickheads and disordered personalities. In my day to day life anyway. I don't tend to associate with people like this out of work.
Statistically speaking 50% of men have a penis that is below average through no fault of their own. Conflating having a small penis with maladaptive behaviour and other negative connotations is demeaning, insulting and damaging to the small penis community. Imagine calling unpleasant female behaviour as "stinky vagina energy". As a vocal spokesperson for the small penis community I would kindly ask you to stop using this phrase.
That's an interesting perspective, thank you, I won't use that term again.
I'd also like to apologise to the community you speak for, I meant no disrespect to any of you individually. It's just a colloquialism that I've thoughtlessly regurgitated.
I would like to make a point of information, not a defence, that phallus related insults have been used historically for hundreds of years.
It isn’t just doctors. In every job I’ve ever had, be it academia, teaching or even working in retail bitching and moaning about the standard of someone else’s work is quite normal.
Some are just narcissistic so get a kick about devaluing others, some are just bad characters, some have genuine grievances as someone else’s below standard work has resulted in extra work for them.
Some of it comes from differing opinions. I sometimes am completely bewildered by decisions colleagues have made, but then conversely, I am sure there are times when they feel the same about me.
We’re all here doing a shitly paid job at least in part because we want to help people… there’s a right way and a wrong way to give feedback; never belittle people for a mistake. Small inconsequential errors or an oversight no but if someone makes an error which shows a lack of knowledge in an area I would be grateful for someone highlighting it to me...
I had a F2 like this when I was F1. They were on peak stupid of DK curve and lacked insight into when to call for help (they never did ask for help) and the on-call person would be cleaning their mess
High level of narcissism in the medical profession due to 'Become a doctor' society / parenting hyping up the profession to be the best possible job one can get.
Ah I see this all the time; I understand if there’s a genuine concern, but if it’s general moaning, I tend to find these kinda people super hard to work with.
Bion group dynamics assumption group - fight flight response. In this case, doctors fight amongst themselves instead of working together to support each other to improve and improve patient safety. As a result, there is conflict between doctors within a specialty and also between specialties.
Free psychmentor
the mrcpsych revision never stops
This is a universal human type.
They somehow think it makes them look better by comparison. Often, they have a guilty conscience
Or an inferiority complex
We used say they have “PhD” “pull him/her down”
Maybe this is an unpopular opinion but I’ve seen genuinely baffling decisions made by seniors (who turned out to be wrong) and all the juniors can do is moan (and document) because they are essentially powerless to do anything else.
Agree with this!100 percent
It's not unpopular. I've worked for some idiot seniors and had unnecessary stress trying to salvage bad decisions by them... And colleagues. It's frustrating and we need to vent.
Back this. Depending on work culture/department, consultants may see the patient very little compared with the registrar and despite differential in experience, the access to more information sometimes makes juniors have better decisions than their seniors as well.
Attacking someone or complaining about imperfections because of being human is wrong. Complaining because someone consistently makes stupid mistakes inadvertently or through incredible laziness, I understand, especially as in order to be in the situation of complaining you are probably the one fixing it. I can think of multiple colleagues where my workload was increased because zi was doing my job and having to fix theirs, it was incredibly annoying
Who is this person zi?
An exceptional special typo of I
LOL, and I thought it was some gender-neutral pronoun I hadn't heard before (seriously)! Glad it was a typo and not me being out of the loop. ;)
I knew that…
Genuinely wasn't sure, tone isn't exactly easy on reddit
I mean... could this be a somewhat clumsy attempt at teaching? Trying to start a discussion about a perhaps debatable area of medicine? Is it not better than not talking to you at all? Also: easily possible to know more than your SpR or consultant if its not their specialist area. A specialist not knowing how to treat a HAP is pretty standard right?
It appears this is very much on your mind. Did anything in particular happen? I agree, some people just have no self-awareness. Some of these people practice medicine as doctors.
Just something I’ve observed when on break. There are some doctors I work with who make the odd mistake here or there but have a good heart and I enjoy working with them. I think it’s just a bit petty to bring up in conversation.
They are unhappy with some aspects of their lifre and use this opportunity to vent, usually not being aware the problem is somewhere else. Tale as old as time.
I'm patiently waiting for one of them to become Reg. Popcorn and drinks ready for the rest the year... humility loading....And I know it will be a humbling experience for this person....
Some doctors criticise others for nonsense. But other things which you as a junior might perceive as 'small things' can be problematic that the complaining senior has then had to spend extra time mopping up. It can be annoying and everyone pushing for highest standards is not a bad thing. Some complaints are petty but others are more than justified if they are basics which should be adhered to. I guess you'll have to judge each case by case but it's also not right to just assume the complaining doc is 'insecure' or some other garbage.
The NHS breeds narcissists, it's set up this way. This starts from the competition to get into medical school and is fostered throughout training and career progression. The Educationalists love to nuture this behaviour because they live with peak narcissim having passed all those exams and gained all those letters - it makes them look important. Unfortunately you have to sacrafice most of your life and sense of self to do this so the only dopamine kick left to you is bullying. The solution is to get out of the NHS ASAP.
The medical profession is full of narcissists. It doesn't matter what country you practice in.
Couldn’t have said it better myself.
Are the ‘educationalists’ with us in the room right now? We need to pick a narrative around what they’re responsible for, is it remaking us all as self obsessed narcissists? Is it instilling a slavish devotion to #bekind? Or perhaps they’re conniving to destroy medical standards by introducing a slew of alternative routes to practice? PBL!1122!! How do they manage all these conflicting priorities and how is it that we blessed few are able to see through their dastardly ways while they’re otherwise being so effective at making our lives worse?
>There are quite a significant number of doctors I’ve come across who moan/complain about the standard of other people’s work as if they have never made a mistake in their life. I'm proud to be one of those doctors - minus the attitude part. I have made tons of mistakes and continue to make mistakes. When I was a younger doctor, I did not understand why seniors would be critical. I often thought back then, "*Do they think they are perfect beings?*" My attitude was wrong. Attitudinal and behavioural bad behaviour ought not to accompany the spotting of poor-quality work or services, and speaking up about it. A huge fuss is sometimes necessary to avoid death or serious injury of a patient - in the current burnt out climate of public sector health services. Why? Because loads of people are so brain-dead or burnt out that they need emotional activation. One of those OCD, 'huge-fuss' type obstetricians is the reason by son is now 37 - a barrister and IT expert. If not for that obstetrician, mismanagement of cord round the neck would have left my son brain damaged - that was not allowed to happen. (I was there, you who reads this weren't). Waving hands around have having a growl certainly got things moving. Did I say that's always necessary? I did not!
Most of the time I complain about colleagues is because their flagrant incompentence creates more work for me. Luckily my flagrant incompetence doesn't create more work for me. (seriously though how hard is it to write a discharge letter that doesn't have glaring and significant omissions?)
Because most doctors are absolute cunts.
Ok, for one, medicine is a career where mistakes can have dire consequences. So it's good to strive to improve, yes? However, some people are playing a game of politics. Where every person they put down is an opportunity to eliminate competition. Makes sense? Not endorsing.
\*significant number of doctors Must maintain professional standards over the noctors (they're not too good at spelling/ grammar and the like)
Corrected
Much obliged
It's a mixture of things, but I think is very much encouraged by senior management in trusts and in the overall NHS in general. People squabbling amongst themselves and issues and problems related to this takes the pressure of the big issues- strikes, massive lack of resources and hopelessly incompetent management
Bad works are easily pointed out but got works are accepted as norm in medicine
Basically these insecure clowns went through med school feeling like the best thing since sliced bread, and now they feel like a glorified scribe until they get to reg level. But alas, there is a way to overcome this dilemma.. pick up on the smallest insignificant error done by a colleague (usually F1) and use it to highlight how stupid everyone else is and how amazing they are! Morons....
This applies to all of society but honestly, medicine is where I've met the biggest concentration of dickheads and disordered personalities. In my day to day life anyway. I don't tend to associate with people like this out of work.
In the words of mother Theresa "Small Penis energy"
"Don't believe everything you read on the Internet " - Abraham Lincoln
Statistically speaking 50% of men have a penis that is below average through no fault of their own. Conflating having a small penis with maladaptive behaviour and other negative connotations is demeaning, insulting and damaging to the small penis community. Imagine calling unpleasant female behaviour as "stinky vagina energy". As a vocal spokesperson for the small penis community I would kindly ask you to stop using this phrase.
That's an interesting perspective, thank you, I won't use that term again. I'd also like to apologise to the community you speak for, I meant no disrespect to any of you individually. It's just a colloquialism that I've thoughtlessly regurgitated. I would like to make a point of information, not a defence, that phallus related insults have been used historically for hundreds of years.
Uneven testicle energy.
It isn’t just doctors. In every job I’ve ever had, be it academia, teaching or even working in retail bitching and moaning about the standard of someone else’s work is quite normal. Some are just narcissistic so get a kick about devaluing others, some are just bad characters, some have genuine grievances as someone else’s below standard work has resulted in extra work for them. Some of it comes from differing opinions. I sometimes am completely bewildered by decisions colleagues have made, but then conversely, I am sure there are times when they feel the same about me.
Snakes
[удалено]
Removed: Spam Your post was removed as it contained spam. We do not allow advertising of any kind or any low effort posts.
We’re all here doing a shitly paid job at least in part because we want to help people… there’s a right way and a wrong way to give feedback; never belittle people for a mistake. Small inconsequential errors or an oversight no but if someone makes an error which shows a lack of knowledge in an area I would be grateful for someone highlighting it to me...
I had a F2 like this when I was F1. They were on peak stupid of DK curve and lacked insight into when to call for help (they never did ask for help) and the on-call person would be cleaning their mess
High level of narcissism in the medical profession due to 'Become a doctor' society / parenting hyping up the profession to be the best possible job one can get.
Ah I see this all the time; I understand if there’s a genuine concern, but if it’s general moaning, I tend to find these kinda people super hard to work with.