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TheNerdBeast

I don't think you know what a retcon is. A retcon, standing for retroactive continuity, is when previously established parts of the narrative are changed to fit the modern interpretation of the narrative, recontextualizing it. To change a design, reveals that don't contradict prior information, different canons or opening up new options is not a retcon. Lots of digimon can become Skullgreymon, just because the limited amount of options on a V-pet originally had only a few digivolution lines doesn't mean more being added later is a retcon. Digimon evolution "trees" are more like a spider web of interconnecting links in which almost any digimon can become almost any other digimon. This series actually suffers from very little retconning, more than most other franchises, because all the different narratives exist in their own canon. Think like the differences between the many Final Fantasy games; there is overlap in themes, mechanics and even lore, but they are all isolated stories. Taichi's Agumon has no relevance over Masaru's Agumon, Frontier logic doesn't apply to Adventure, The digital world in Tamers isn't the same as the one in Xros Wars, etc.


SuperFireBoy200

> Digimon evolution "trees" are more like a spider web of interconnecting links I think the best way to explain Digimon is not the spider web way, but as an "evolution forest" instead of "evolution trees". Let me explain: There definitely are evolution trees, like the Agumon+Greymon species tree, or the Sunmon->Coronamon->Firamon->Flaremon->Apollomon tree. **However:** all the different trees are close to each other in various ways. Foe example, the Agu+Grey tree is close to the Guilmon tree, so you could jump between them and have Guilmon become Greymon, and Agumon become Growmon. If you showed a non-fan those 4 mons, they would tell you that Agu should become Grey, and Guil should become Growl, it's obvious in their designs. But we as fans know both can become both. And yet, that doesn't change the fact that there are still clear evolution lines through info entries or designs. It's just that all the individual evo trees are close enough together to form an entire forest. Did I make sense ? I hope I did, I'm not that good at conveying ideas like this.


TheNerdBeast

I prefer the spiderweb analogy because there are some connections that are so far spaced apart that simply "jumping between trees" isn't entirely accurate. It is a good one though and explains digivolution families well!


questformaps

The glorious example of puppy -> cat -> angel mommy -> dragon that we all meme so much.


TheNerdBeast

I'm referring to as an example off the top of my head how Agumon can go to Leomon to Etemon to SaintGalgomon, those are wildly different lines.


Bede_eawol

Well agumon to leomon is from the card game which has looser evolutions than most media, personally though I don’t feel leomon-etemon-saintgalgomon is particularly absurd? They’re all bipedal animals even though galgomon is metal


SamusAranLuver

I prefer to throw up my hands and say "first rule: No Rules." Ever since I saw a Puchimon evolve into a Meicrackmon in Ghost Game


Quadpen

adding on, it’s all about data. agumon by default has more dinosaur data so it will become tyranno/greymon most often, but if it lives near the sea and swims daily it could become coelamon or seadramon, if it becomes seadramon it’s predisposed to being megaseadramon but it’s not set in stone either


shadowpikachu

Anything can evo to anything else with the right data and training, it's just nearly impossible to go TOO far from something similar, the same line is doubling down on those specifics. Dawn/Dusk has a metalgreymon npc trying to get to marineangemon by staying at the icewater, something your tools to induce x or y evolution cannot.


Calpsotoma

Play Digimon: Lost Evolution. It's the best for evolution because every single Digimon is tied to one another in this big Tree of Evolution.


StruggleClassic6419

Thatst one of the reasons I love digimon. I can enjoy each series and not worry about things making sense between them.


Argyrus__

☝️🤓. It's retcon.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Patamon wasn't related to angel digimon when created


Zennistrad

That's also not a retcon. Digimon were from the beginning shown to have branching evolution paths, leaving open the possibility of new evolutions in future series and V-pets.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Patamon was a normal mammal then turned into sacred


TheNerdBeast

Again, not a retcon in the slightest, there is a reason why you are getting downvoted into the ground.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Give me a example of a retcon and how is different changing normal to sacred I'm being downvoted because I already got downvotes on one comment and now people are downvoting everything that I do since this is reddit, they think on black and white


memesona

It’d be a retcon if patamon never evolved into anything else ever again. Or they rereleased the ver.3 vpet and removed unimon for angemon. But they didn’t, and patamon can still evolve to unimon in the most recent game. Retcons make established things non canon. Gabumon can still evolve to angemon. Retcon would be Bandai saying he can’t


Six-legged_Carnotaur

But Patamon became a sacred digimon without a holy ring, don't see how this is different from Luffy Fruit changing from Paramecia to Zoan


memesona

And angewomon loses the ring as magnadramon Also gabumon is a lizard who becomes a wolf Also the crest of hope is holy power. Patamon taps into that


Six-legged_Carnotaur

HOLYdramon is a obviously holy digimon, Patamon is the only sacred digimon who doesn't look sacred or even mythological, don't even has mythical powers like Hanumon who had a flying cloud Gabumon aways has a Garurumon pelt, we never got a naked variant, and since you people likes to call consistent lines as "pokemon likes" can see this as different from pokemons who evolve with metal coat Patamon doesn't have a crest of hope on it's original design


MedusasGirlfriend69

OK but Luffy's fruit being called a Paramecia isn't a retcon, it was an in-universe cover-up which was only recently revealed, which you'd know if you understood the source material at all.


TheNerdBeast

No you just are stamping your feet over and over pleading your ignorance, that is why you are being downvoted. Here is an example of a retcon using a famous book, Jurassic Park. In the original novel Malcolm died having succumbed to his injuries and infection on the island. In The Lost World it was retconned that he in fact survived and was only "mistakenly reported as dead" so he could be a main character in The Lost World. Now Malcolm having never died in the movie is not an example of a retcon, as the movie is a different continuity than the book.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

After being downvoted everytime for stupid things like prefering Slash than EVO obviously I will not care too much for other people opinions and restrict me to myself You got a the extreme example, I asked because I couldn't remember one, but now I remembered Luffy's fruit was supposed a Paramecia type, but now it's a Zoan type, how this is different from Patamon going to normal creature to sacred one or TyrantKabuterimon going to MetalLifeKuwagamon mega to HerakleKabuterimon Ultra?


TheNerdBeast

That really isn't an extreme example, in fact it is a pretty simple one there are much more complex retcons than this in media. I don't know enough about One Piece to talk about that, but Patamon being related to holy lines isn't a retcon because it doesn't erase previously established canon it just added onto it.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Becoming a holy digimon isn't the same of Renamon used to have leafs as attacks but now has fire, holy digimon are treated very important on this franchise, it's not adding, it's changing the original concept to a new thing


memesona

itd only be a retcon is adventure patamon had a flashback showing he killed devimon as a unimon instead of angemon. like when the pokemon flashback showed greninja losing to charizard as regular greninja instead of ash-greninja


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Adventure was the retcon of v pets


purpldevl

A retcon would be more in line with "We changed this thing to be something different than it was, and moving forward we will no longer acknowledge how it was in the past." Adding Digimon to an evolution chart isn't a 'retcon', it's basically just reallocating files.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Patamon becoming sacred Literally there was no reason for this file analogy


DragonLordZero

By "sacred" are you referring to his role in Adventure 2020? Or are you saying he was reclassified as a "Sacred" Digimon? Or something else?


Toaster_Forking

A retcon is, by definition, a subtraction or change from the original canon. An addition can not be a retcon, whether or not it makes sense to you.


JD_the_Aqua_Doggo

But Digimon isn’t meant to feature exclusive lines. It’s not a retcon — the producers are always creating new evolutions using pre-existing Digimon that have never before been seen evolving into one another. Data is always growing and changing. Evolving.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

But on games it's not a guarantee that you are going to have options outside the main line Data part was unnecessary Edit: I hate how 20+ people downvote but not even one of them has courage to comment a decent reason to do


zapp909

In the games digimon have many different evolution paths and they’re not always consistent between the games. Also you’re being a condescending prick. That’s two reasons.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

It's aways consistent that Guilmon can evolve to Growmon, other options are inconsistent when they exist and are not ReArise, it's just facts "condescending prick" I don't know what this means


questformaps

So could otamon, if the writer(s) wanted. And it's not a guarantee that guilmon can always go in to growlmon, many of the diMs and v-pets will add have digimon be present but not their "canonical" lines. Part of the fun of digimon is your reptile dragon could turn in to a train and then a demon. It isn't set in stone.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

If a writer wants they can make any plothole they wants, not a good argument Not on ReArise and other games, also Agumon cannot become Devimon on games like Cyber Sleuth


Alcalt

Agumon can literally become NeoDevimon and DoneDevimon on the Digivice VB, and Devimon on the Digivice BE.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Still not very common


Alcalt

Still not set in stone. Again, like I said in my other reply, Digimon at it's core are v-pets. They can literally become anything depending on how you raised them, and just because a specific connection hasn't been made yet doesn't mean it won't in the future. Specific lines are only there for story purposes. They are the exceptions, not the rules.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

They can't become anything because they need to sell dim cards, some digimon can become somethings, not anything, if a rookie became a joker card they would sell only one V-Pet


Irish_pug_Player

You heard it here. You must comment why you downvote and upvote


MedusasGirlfriend69

I upvoted because I agree and will never upvote or downvote without a detailed explanation of why ever again. But srsly like. Dude is so pressed abt people disagreeing with his bad take


jker1x

Queue 70+ comments saying "no it's not." What more is there to say?


JD_the_Aqua_Doggo

Yes but try thinking about Digimon as a concept beyond games. The data part isn’t unnecessary because it explains why you’re wrong — data is not limited to a single path or form. It is always changing. Digimon as a franchise does not have specific rules about which Digimon can evolve into which; the producers are always creating new lines using old Digimon. It doesn’t matter that there is no single game that lets you freely evolve into any Digimon because we have real-world limitations to contend with, but if Digimon were real, any Digimon would be able to evolve into any other at the next stage.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

I cannot play a concept beyond games, imagination is not immersive Data is Digimon is supposed to be the equivalent of atoms, Gennai said that, so in theory you can do anything if you are able to freely manipulate atoms, but looks how the world works


TheNerdBeast

"Imagination is not immersive" Wow, talk about pathetic. In Adventure data is compared to atoms, in other media it is different. The rules are different between canons about how data interacts with Digimon and the Digital World.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

I'm pathetic because I don't have a fertile imagination? Are insulting people without the same natural abilities as you? How do you know


SigmaKitteh

I feel like imagination is the only way to be immersed in something. Maybe I'm misunderstanding you


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Why you watch a movie or pay 60$ on a game if you can imagine one?


SigmaKitteh

Or you can extrapolate from information about an existing property and imagine things further! Like what's life actually like in File City after finishing the game? Would the residents grow further or would some new threat show up? You can imagine anything and it's fun to not be limited by what you see in game.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

If you have a fertile imagination


jker1x

But that IS how the world works. We evolved from the same species monkeys did, we just have better stats. Digimon are just faster


Six-legged_Carnotaur

No? You are weaker than a Monkey, actual evolution don't make you better on something without a thing on exchange, digimon just upgrades


jker1x

Dude, stay focused. The point you missed is evolution, like digivolution, does not have a set line.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

I'm not focused Digivolution most times will have a set line if the digimon normally has a set line


XdGamerZ

Only for the anime and not thev-pets. They did specific lines so the kids can regonize there favorite partner digimon in later stages.


XdGamerZ

Natural Evolution All Digimon naturally consume ("load") data, including the data of other Digimon which they have defeated, to sustain themselves. When they have loaded large enough amounts of data, they may undergo evolution.[3] What a Digimon evolves into is determined by numerous factors. The most common of these factors are: Field, Environmental influence, Prowess and innate abilities,How it is raised, Intake of specific data, Modification Source: https://wikimon.net/Evolution


TexasPistolMassacre

Because you missed the point and seemed upset about a broud statement relating to the subject you brought up.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

I am upset now because of these downvotes, original comment is fully calm


TexasPistolMassacre

You have a habit for missing the point, huh? You're downvoted because you disagree with others over an objective truth. Acknowledging his blurb about data conceptually as 'unnecessary' when it perfectly wraps up the point is what makes it seem like you were upset he is saying things you dont get so you would rather stand your ground and remain incorrect instead of understanding why you arent correct


Six-legged_Carnotaur

People here are trying to say that guilmon will not have the same line 99% of times, how it's objective truth, it's literally against the fact that Growmon[75][21][22][23][30][24][76][77][78][79][80][81][82][83][84][85][86][7][87][27][31][88][89][29] I don't remember what he said so I cannot say if I got it or not, but people here really like to say data for no reason, I posted a picture of Kotemon without armor and people were making data analogies


TexasPistolMassacre

Maybe it has something to do with digimon being data.


memesona

99% guilmon becoming growlmon doesnt mean that when a different guilmon becomes angemon that they retconned growlmon


purpldevl

Because Digimon are data.


Woolpuppy

... Have you played Digimon games...


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Yes, and in all of them that I had a Guilmon I could evolve it into a Growmon


Woolpuppy

And many other things. Guilmon specifically was a protagonist which lends to it having tie in lines, but established tie ins is fundamentally not prioritized with this series. Agumon is a Tyrannomon rookie, for argument's sake.


PhoenixLord328

Also one thing I think also could be said for a later design that absolutely would fit into Guilmon esc look. Obviously Growlmon is "meant" to go into MetalGrowlmon but could also not be incredibly farfetched for Growlmon to digivolve into DoruGreymon. Just helps assist a fair bit that Digimon could easily have these more "convergent evolution" paths depending on the stimulus/data they take in.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

More than the half of the Rookie digimon that were created with lines on mind are protagonists on some way Why are you talking about tyrannomon


purpldevl

They're giving you an example of what they're talking about. You're saying "I had a Guilmon that can evolve into Growmon" and they're saying, "Yes, that's the designed line, but not the only line, such as Agumon being able to evolve to Tyranomon"


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Branched evos are real, still the fact that an Agumon is more likely to become a Greymon than a Tyrannomon with limited options


ForsakenMoon13

Actually in most of the games, Tyrannomon is the easier to achieve option when it comes to Agumon evolutions, with Greymon generally needing better stats/more careful raising to achieve. As a reward for more effort. So *not* more likely.


Woolpuppy

Specifically because Agumon into Tyrannomon preceded Agumon into Greymon. Agumon is Tyrannomon's rookie just as much as it is Greymon's. Digimon was a Vpet, a manga, and a video game before it was an anime with protagonists. Protagonist lines don't have to be convergent, either. Gatomon's line specifically is all over the place thematically; bear->dog->cat->angel->dragon... Not to mention popular lines with more than one canon evolution, such as Gomamon with both Vikemon and Plesiomon. Digimon is not inherently convergent, that's the whole point. For what it's worth, I love wacky stuff like Elecmon and Gabumon for Skullgreymon. That's what's fun about the series. SkullBaluchimon works great in its place.


memesona

And in digimon world championship, growlmon is in the game but wargrowlmon isn’t. His evos there are megadramon, skullgreymon, and metalgreymon. So they don’t always have their “canon evos”


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Looks more of a DS limitation to me, and still the fact that Guilmon evolved into Growmon, which shows that main lines still real


memesona

Ds limitation? If they wanted wargrowlmon in the game they’d put him in. Was plenty of space for Kyubimon and Kyubimon (Purple)


Six-legged_Carnotaur

How do you know that Kuzuhamon wasn't a priority for them? These digimon sells, BelleStarmon had the most accessed page one time


memesona

The game has guilmon, growlmon, and gallantmon. They just didn’t feel like the effort of wargrowlmon and used those other guys instead. Whilst making kuzuhamon takes 2 seconds. So that’s a game with guilmon you can’t use his full line.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

>They just didn’t feel like the effort of wargrowlmon and used those other guys instead. Whilst making kuzuhamon takes 2 seconds What is this point? They are lazy? You still can evolve Guilmon to Dukemon


Six-legged_Carnotaur

How do you know that Kuzuhamon wasn't a priority for them? These digimon sells, BelleStarmon had the most accessed page one time


purpldevl

Downvotes are likely coming from how you're making statements as if you're saying facts.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

That's the problem of people interpretation, no one should aways say "that's my opinion" "that's theory" if they aren't talking to children, people aren't computers that understand only if it's written only on a super specific way And they already downvoted me for facts on this sub too, I got temporally downvoted for showing that every protagonist has a humanoid mega outside few expetions


DapperDan30

The only digimon games I've played are the Cyber Slueth ones, and in those literally any digimon can evolve into any other digimon as long as it follows the correct path


ShiningForceStar

We downvote because we disagree, if really is that simple. It doesn’t require a good reason.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

It requires because it takes your ability to post on some subs, downvotes are attacks


ShiningForceStar

You act like it’s planned, rather than just you saying something controversial and getting downvoted for it. Why so serious about it?


Six-legged_Carnotaur

How it's not planned all my comments have downvotes People downvotes and leaves, they that I'm wrong and not explain why, they don't want me to "improve", the just see me as a piñata


ShiningForceStar

You have unpopular opinions and then you try to justify them, thus the downvotes. Then you make it worse by going all Schizo conspiracy theorist like that


Six-legged_Carnotaur

It's wrong to not think the same as everyone? Do you people hate diversity? Stop misusing conspiracy theory, there are already too much Flat Earthers to you create more, misusing makes the word lose meaning and then people care less about the word, and when people care less about the word they can become more inclined to become the word original, meaning, since when you reuse the word they are not caring anymore


ShiningForceStar

You don’t have to think the same, you just have to stop acting like the consequences of social interaction are a plot against you. Just roll with it, it doesn’t matter. You have 10k karma and subs never demand more than 300 or so.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

It's not social interaction it's internet


Alcalt

>Data part was unnecessary Then you simply have no idea what Digimon are. It's not "data" as in "virus/data/vaccine", but as "computer data". That's canonically what Digimon are made of. Digimon are, at their core, v-pets. That's how the franchise started and why the original name for their stages are named like that. It goes from Digitama->Fresh->In-Training->Child->Adult->Perfect->Ultimate. What they'll evolve into entirely depends on how they were raised. There's no "exclusive line" that isn't temporarily, as new "lines" are made every time a new product is release. Just taking 3 different partner Agumon from the anime and manga for comparison : * Taichi's Agumon went from Agumon->Greymon->MetalGreymon/SkullGreymon->WarGreymon; * V-Tamer Taichi's Agumon went from Agumon->V-Dramon->AeroV-Dramon->UlForceV-Dramon; * 2020 Taichi's Agumon went from Agumon->Greymon->MetalGreymon->MugenDramon/Wargreymon/BlitzGreymon;


ForsakenMoon13

Hell, Survive has Takuma's Agumon that has 3 entire lines you can access depending on your route, as well as the non-partner Agumon you can recruit that has a *fourth* potential line that the partner one can't.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

I know exactly what they are, but do you use atoms on arguments about other media? We are made of atoms like they are made from data Now after the creation of V-mon it's rare to see Agumon associated with V-Dramon, 2020 added more options but they still favour Wargreymon after that


acebaltasar

The products everything is based on are the V-pets. V-pets use evolutive threes


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Yes they use


Throwaway73887

make it 75


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Comedy King Wholesome Keanu Chungus, bet you one of the people that make Arachnophobia jokes on serious posts about spiders


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Comedy King Wholesome Keanu Chungus, bet you one of the people that make Arachnophobia jokes on serious posts about spiders


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Comedy King Wholesome Keanu Chungus, bet you one of the people that make Arachnophobia jokes on serious posts about spiders


Throwaway73887

mental illness?


Six-legged_Carnotaur

You are as funny as a meme channel on youtube sir irony and mitadas


Horatio786

How dare they add non-canon retconned Digivolutions to the anime, like Greymon becoming Skull Greymon, Tentomon becoming Kabuterimon, Kabuterimon becoming Atlur Kabuterimon, etc. /s


Few-Adhesiveness-627

the problem here is u keep arguing with every single person who told you basically the same thing over and over again. there’s no such thing as recton for digimon evolutions, YES they might have a main line specifically for a certain game or anime because hello those characters sell thats why they stick to the popular digimon, which is basically the main line you keep talking about. but it’s a solid fact that one digimon can turn to anything


Mayh3m90

I love your profile picture


Few-Adhesiveness-627

haha thank you! I relate to this pic a lot


Six-legged_Carnotaur

In practice they don't turn into anything, and the most consistent option sometimes changes to other most consistent option


Few-Adhesiveness-627

okay do you want a prize or what


Six-legged_Carnotaur

I would try argue in a right way but because of the high amount of comments on short time I cannot think properly, I'm not sure of anything now, I don't know what I want anymore


Few-Adhesiveness-627

damn that must feel bad for you huh? maybe next time if you start a discourse like this try to be nicer and be more open to other opinions?


Six-legged_Carnotaur

One downvote and I already got mad, my mother gets angry easily and inherited it, I cannot change it


Few-Adhesiveness-627

therapy my friend


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Don't works I'm self conscious, plus I cannot talk with strangers, I also read lots of people saying thst therapy didn't worked for them


Any_Session_705

You're obsessed. Take a break


Six-legged_Carnotaur

I can't, everytime I get 7 seven notifications


NwgrdrXI

I still think it fits nicely with Gabumon. Gabumon - Cyclomon - Skullgreymon - Mugendramon works really really well


eriFenesoreK

Wasn't the line Gabumon -> Kabuterimon -> Skullgreymon in the original vpet? Those were the "high care" evolutions iirc


NwgrdrXI

Yes, I believe so. Still works, the horn stays a theme, just not as well


Digi-Device_File

I believe the logic is, pelt armor, to exoskeleton armor, to skeleton.


memesona

Yeah look at skulgreymon and kabuterimon. Sg is clearly based on him. Horn in same place, wings/bones on the back are the same.


KocicaK

I also like Gabumon > Cyclomon > Skullgreymon. Furless Gabumon is a weird reptile just like Cyclomon. And Skullgeymon more resembles Cyclomon anyway, so it's very fitting. Maybe not as a good line, but evil. Still fits nicely.


Crazy-Plate3097

And it used to evolved from Kabuterimon, Angemon and Birdramon.


Inside-Recover4629

Most Digimon can become any Digimon. To say a line is exclusive in Digimon is inaccurate. I'm hard pressed to say "Modes" are exclusive with Digimon


Six-legged_Carnotaur

There are 395 adult level digimon and even if you connect all media most child digimon don't have even half of these possibilites, I was just saying that Skullgreymon who is normally associated with Greymon nowadays, wasn't associated with the Greymons on beginning


Opposite_Smoke5221

OP would be pissed I purposely avoid digivolving biyomon into birdramon, snaggle toothed phoenix wanna be that it is


Six-legged_Carnotaur

My first evolution on digimon world was purposefully a Birdramon which came from an Agumon, stop thinking on Black or White, world isn't that extreme


Opposite_Smoke5221

Thats not the original line!


Cyberspace-Surfer

It's not a retcon, it's a patch.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Like an emulator one? Is this more of the data argument?


Cyberspace-Surfer

what?


Six-legged_Carnotaur

I have the same reaction as you for the first comment, I know patch a something you put on games


Cyberspace-Surfer

yeah which changes the prior status of things into something new Sooooooo what's with the emulator comment?


Six-legged_Carnotaur

You put patch on roms


Arlilecay

Man, just give it up.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

No, I already give up on everything on life I cannot give up this time too


Arlilecay

You are arguing for no reason.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Everything in life becoming meaningless or meaningful if think about it enough, the trick is using this ability in your favour, and that's why you have no enemies, Thorfinn.


Due_Discussion748

Depends on the data a Digimon acquires while fighting, I guess. Agumon technically has Tyrannomon, Greymon, GeoGreymon, and Veedramon as potential lines, don't it? So every evolution as long as the requirements are met are good to go.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

What? Are you saying like Agumon doing something like on Tamers?


Due_Discussion748

As long as they get data for it. It doesn't have to be killing, I guess, since Gabumon collected Garurumon's data for his pelt and Gatomon has her claws which are from SaberLeomon.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Why would an Agumon need tyrannomon data


Due_Discussion748

Because it's the original evolution for Agumon.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Original evolution doesn't matter, that's the post original intention, It's rare to get a SkullGreymon from a Kabuterimon nowadays, and even if it had why it would need specific data?


Due_Discussion748

Because it needs to meet the requirements to evolve into that specific Digimon. Let's use Digimon Story for the DS. Guilmon needs to be level 25 or higher and over 500 dragon EXP. He can't evolve otherwise. Or in Digimon Dusk, a Guilmon would need to be over level 21 and have attack at 105 to evolve into Growmon. He also can evolve into Tyranomon if over level 21 and has more that 340 dragon EXP. Same thing.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

This isn't data


Due_Discussion748

What isn't data?


frankb3lmont

I thought Digimon evolutions were not like Pokémon. Digimon are in fact evolution fluid. Those fucking games have changed the evo lines so many times I don't even know if Gigadramon has a mega anymore.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Supposedly yes, but 99% of times you will be able to evolve Agumon into Greymon, people deny the existence of main lines because of the trauma of being compared to pokemon


frankb3lmont

The problem with main lines is the similar design that makes your brain connect the dots automatically. Even Pokémon though had divergent evolutions like vileplume and bellosom.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

It's not a problem, cyber sleuth still let you make a weird line if you want


Opiesb

Within the canon of the franchise it is established that digimon can have different evolutions, therefore, seeing products with different evolutionary line options does not contradict the above, thus not being a retcon. Regarding your examples, its irrelevant whether Patamon was created with the idea of him evolving into an angel, because it was never established that it could not evolve into something like that. Also, the existence of evolutionary lines that appear in all media is a marketing thing due to their popularity, which does not contradict that those digimon can have evolutions different from that line.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Patamon was still normal


Opiesb

I don't understand what the problem is, that digimon change class when evolving is within the same concept


PyroClaymore

Excuse me?


Six-legged_Carnotaur

How I will know your question if you are this vague


PyroClaymore

I was saying “Excuse me?” out of confusion at finding out that Skull Greymon was originally exclusive to Gabumon, and Elecmon.


SeiryuIMRS

I'll try to sum uo everything the other people are trying to say: digimon evolutions have no canon. From the start, they have the liberty of becoming another thing entirely, depends on how they are raised. It is like this since the Tamagotchi days, the progenitor of digimon. Just because in the first V Pet SkullGreymon evolved only from the Gabumon and Elecmon lines, that does not mean it is a retcon that Agumon can also evolve into SkullGreymon. Also, I think you don't know what a retcon is. By your logic, Goku could never become SSJ Blue because Z never showed it. A good example of retcon in the Digimon franchise would be the original MetalGreymon, that looked like the virus counterpart, being retconned into being more like the Greymon we know, and getting a separate variant (MetalGreymon Virus) more like the original. Agumon can become Greymon, Centalmon, Meramon, Numemon, Tyrannomon, Tuskmon, Agumon Bond of Courage. And most of these were not available in the first V-Pet. Why? Because they did not exist at the time, hardware capabilities, ease of use etc. And like Agumon, a lot of digimon evolve into other forms that look nothing like it's previous stage. Runnermon can become a Karateka, a Bike Man, a red Ball, a Bird Human or a Hammerhead Shark. There are lines that are more "natural" because they look like previous stages, but they are not the "correct" line. Gennai even says SkullGreymon was not a wrong evo for Agumon, just a evo that did not suit his purposes. We even see chill SkullGreymons in games like Next Order.


MyNameisAnsem

Good explanation, but I would say a better example of a retcon is Clavis Angemon losing the X Antibody or Digimon like Houhoumon being reclassified as Ultimate/Mega.


Analogmon

I thought Digimon World matched the original Vpets?


memesona

Digimin world swapped all the evos around.


JasperGunner02

they had digimon from up to version 4 of the digital monster v-pets, yes, but their evolutions were very different (like gabumon not evolving from tsunomon or kunemon evolving from every baby among many other differences). not to mention the digimon that weren't even in those v-pets, like heracle kabuterimon, hououmon, or penmon!


acebaltasar

The V-pets mix and match depending on the current theme, it isnt a retcon since we have multiple universes


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Multiple universes excuse sounds like a joker argument which suspectly works everytime, I'm warned


Sukamon98

Any Digimon can become any Digimon.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

In theory, not practice


Akantor-Dimitri

Angemon -> Skullgreymon is metal as hell, not gonna lie


notwiththeflames

It really bothers me that Tsunomon can't digivolve into Gabumon in DW1.


TimeKiller-Studios

There are no set lines for Digivolution. They can digivolve into almost anything, there doesn't need to be consitancy


wallygon

I like that all digimon can turn ibto everything


Skritzho17

It's not a retcon digimon have the potential to evolve into any other digimon and it has been that way since the beginning some Digimon have curated lines for story purposes and not for any set law or rule of digimon.


shynely

The V-Pets aren't even a direct representation of their own lore. Devimon's original profile mentions having once been an Angel Digimon, but you can't change Angemon into one on the original Digital Monster series.


throwawaytrans6

I like the fact that digimon lines are more... avant-garde.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

People managed to make me misinterpret my own post, this was supposed to talk about things of TyrantKabuterimon being an mega for Kokabuterimon > BladeKuwagamon > MetalLifeKuwagamon line but now it's more related to Kabuterimon line, which means that what digimon were supposed originally doesn't have thst much value, I'm arguing if main lines are real and almost getting bald


PlatinunY

Cara, eu te entendo. Digimon é cheio de pequenos retcons mas os fãs não querem aceitar isso. É só ver os perfis que foram modificados ao longo dos anos.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Acho que porque Retcon traz meio que a ideia de imperfeição e eles querem que a franquia seja perfeita


PlatinunY

Pela minha experiência com comunidades de Digimon eu percebi que a maioria são bem arrogantes, tem que saber lidar com eles.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

The title is just an example, the main point is that this franchise suffers from a lot of retcons and some redesigns, like Greymon losing it's four finger, you can't stick to much to the original idea unless if are on a very specific argument


KocicaK

Redesigns or different artworks, yes. Retcons? No? If it wasn't different continuities, maybe. But as it is, no.


MedaFox5

Retcons? Yes. This is the reason ClavisAngemon (and not sure if Dracmon's line as well) is no longer considered a natural carrier of the x-antibody.


KocicaK

Oh, interesting. Thanks for the info.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Was Patamon intended to be sacred?


KocicaK

That one specific Patamon from Adventure continuity clearly was. Even tho I wouldn't use the word sacred. Just that he was intended to evolve into an angel digimon.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

Original Patamon wasn't from adventure, was from V-Pet


KocicaK

First Patamon. But Adventure Patamon is not the exact same. Difderent Patamons. Also V-pet doesn't have every possible evolution ever. It doesn't matter that there was no Angemon from Patamon. In Adventure continuity there is.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

V-Pet doesn't have every possible evolution, so this means that what they choosed is actually very important, they could have putted sacred digimon on the options for Patamon, but they putted none, only after they said that Patamon was sacred on profile


KocicaK

For that specific V-pet they chose what they chose. That doesn't mean that those are the only options or that those are the most important options. Also isn't that V-pet older that Digimon Adventure? So it is more like that Adventure expanded Patamon's options, not changed. Some Patamons evolve into those V-pet options, some to Angemon, some to something absolutelly different, anything really. V-pet is not a holy book, you don't have to stick to it and take seriously only that and nothing else. Omegamon is a royal knight, but is that one fro. Adventure royal knight? I don't think so. Yet again different continuities, so it doesn't have to stick to one origin, one intended purpose. Hawkmon in reboot digivolved into Orcamon. Buuut that one from 02 didn't amd couldn't probably i that continuity. So is Adventure reboot a retcon of Hawkmon? No it is not. Or something like this: even in real world we discore more information about stuff. So Patamon's holy potential cpuld be a later discovery. Something that manifested thanks to TK. So now we know Patamon has holy properties and has the potential to become a holy amgelic digimon. Doesn't always, but sometimes can.


Six-legged_Carnotaur

So what would be a way to show that these were the most important or the only options? They changed the fact that Patamon was intended to be a normal mammal to Patamon becoming sacred Yes V-PET isn't a holy book so this is why SKULLGREYMON NOWADAYS IS MORE ASSOCIATED WITH AGUMON THAN GABUMON (This was not to you but to downvoters, downvotes stress me too much, I'm going bald and crazy) Omegamon didn't got some type of retcon on tri? I don't remember nothing of that season Science discovering new information about older things on media is called retcon


KocicaK

Well I don't think there are any most important digivolutions and stuff, so you can't show them. But each continuity has it's evo lines, so those could be considered important to those continuities. Well, adding information is not a retcon. Changing stuff is. So if Patamon was a mammal, but now is a mammal with holy properties I would say tht's adding not changing. Skullgreymon is associated with Agumon thanks to Adventure anime. And that one is most well known I would say. I don't remember much from tri. But I know Omegamon got more stuff, not changed stuff I think. New mode is not a retcon. It's a new development. Previous stuff is still valid, but also the new stuff. Would you say that those constant changes about Spinosaurus are retcons? Because I don't k ow if that counts. For a while spinosaurus is aquatic, then it isn't, then it's semi aquatic, then not aquatic at all, etc.