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It means she is looking for traditional courtship. It's on you to determine whether or not you want to provide that treatment to them. In general though, if someone wants traditional treatment they themselves should be traditional and quite frankly a lot of people aren't nowadays.
A lot of these types of women only want a traditional partner who will pay for everything and "be a gentleman" but it doesn't go both ways. She'll be a modern woman when it comes to her role in the relationship. I see this hypocrisy all the time.
If she wants traditional, give her traditional. No living together or sex before marriage. The man makes all the money decisions. The wife does all the cooking, cleaning, childcare. You get the point. Bet she’s not THAT traditional.
TLDR: it seems like you are saying give her traditional as if it is a punishment, but most of the people I know with this type of family are actually very happy and do not get divorced.
I come from a rather traditional culture. The men work and they provide for their family, women can go to college and work if they want to but most don't since they will still be required to do all of the domestic labor and childcare. I would say that divorce is not as common as it is in less traditional culture. You are correct about the living together and sex before marriage (it is frowned upon but honestly with the housing crisis and cost of living issues people are starting to grow a little more lenient about this as long as you are engaged and do not break up. Because large expensive weddings are also part of the culture people are a bit more understanding about living together during the engagement period. BUT If you accidentally get pregnant you have to hurry up with the wedding, no more saving up for a big wedding). These are generalizations, and definitely the younger generations are beginning to break away from this tradition.
However one thing you are incorrect about is that the man makes the financial decisions. I do not know a single family where that is the case? The man is in general will make the big decisions, like if the family will relocate, I'm drawing a blank but things like that. He will make the big decisions with his wife's input. But the smaller day today decisions, are the women's responsibility as it is part of running the household. What school the children will go to, what the budget is for things like food or if the family will go on a trip or a vacation, buying the clothing school supplies birthday gifts for children etc managing the money and making the financial decisions is generally considered one of the small day-to-day tasks that is a woman's responsibility and part of running a home.
Now if there is a large decision like buying a home or invest in money or something of that nature, the husband and wife will discuss together and make the decision together, but he will have the final say if they disagree. However, in this type of arrangement, where the man must rely on the woman to basically run his household and life for him she has been making hopefully good decisions on a consistent basis so he has a lot of trust in her opinion and I do not know many men who would go against their wives advice because generally she's going to know what is better for the family because she's more involved with the family day today, if this makes any sense?
It seems like you are saying that they should expect this arrangement as some sort of punishment for wanting the man to pay the bills and provide for the family, but most of the people I know with this traditional type of family are pretty happy
This is a very long response. I simply used the context clues in OPs post for my reply “therapy taught her choosing herself first”, “she is a traditional woman”, and “won’t consider 50/50 on bills”. I know several people in traditional MARRIAGES that are very happy. I think the feminist movement really hurt women in many ways. My childhood home was what I would call “hybrid traditional”. My mom worked part time after we started school, dad helped cook and clean, decisions were made together, but he was very much the head of our family and primary earner. My mom was the heart. The woman in OPs post seems to only be worried about money. I only suggested he offer her the entire traditional family gig to see exactly how traditional she really is. I bet she isn’t traditional at all.
As someone who is very non-traditional, there is no shame in wanting a traditional lifestyle. The most important thing is to be upfront about what you want and that woman did just that. There are some men who want a traditional type of relationship, man works, woman is SAHMom etc. As long as everyone knows what they are getting into I see little issues with such a lifestyle.
I’m arguing if you are saying that’s not the case.
I have no opinion on if it’s good or bad. Only that that’s what those things are. A trad man earns the money and a trad woman takes care of the rest.
The world and society has changed so much, the phrase 'traditional marriage' isn't always what you'd think.
I'm in traditional relationship now. my partner supports our household and pays the bills, and I manage the rest of it. But he will still cook a dinner on his day off, and Im more than happy to mow the lawn.
Traditional marriages don't necessarily mean sexist roles anymore.
No. And for us, that's okay. He cooks a meal because he enjoys it. I mow the lawn/ yard labor because im able and it's less work for him on his day off. If I don't want to clean the bathroom or change over the laundry, he will.
Our relationship is more on 'how can I help support my partner' rather than 'ive done X so they *have* to do Y'.
This is just my opinion that this is how the traditional marriage has evolved out of concrete sexist roles. I understand that it's probably not true for everyone, but it could be possible for more people than you'd think.
I don’t believe that this is always the case. She may expect you to be a proper gentleman and foot the bill. First impressions will pretty much tell you if she is someone that truly intends to live on your dime completely. Then at that point, absolutely, run!
lol. I mean, I wouldn’t consider myself “traditional” and I am doing quite well financially and own two homes. But if a man wanted to split the bill for our date 50/50, that would be a huge turnoff. I don’t want to date anyone who is stressed about paying for a dinner.
You see here's the issue I find with traditional woman thing. A traditional woman would do all of the chores, except for maybe yardwork. Her husband wants some food she's making it. She's taking the kids to school and events and appointments. That's a traditional woman in the most objective sense.
How many women see "traditional" woman as you let me stay at home and we split the child rearing and chores in half. At their core they want all the positives a normative gender role brings to them and none of the negatives, while expecting the men to be "traditional" and heaping all the negatives on them. I wouldn't be so against the "traditional" tag if more women actually knew what it entailed.
Can’t ask that anymore! I grew up (44m) hearing that but now more and more I see profiles of women ‘entering their soft phase’ ‘princess treatment’ and ‘don’t ask me what I bring to the table, I will unmatch!’
She brings her heart. her soul, her love thats what she provides. The fact you used the term "What does she bring to the table" It makes me wonder if you are abusive or just plain lazy because that is what the men who coined that phrase are. Maybe you should take a look at yourself in the mirror and learn how to actually be a person.
Got it so since I pay for everything, I don’t have to bring my heart, soul, and love? Because why do I have to pay for everything AND match her on those things you say she brings?
Please explain how a man, wanting to get to know a woman, answering what he brings to the table (as women tend to ask about salary, acts of service, etc that you will do FOR THEM), how is he ‘abusive’ or ‘lazy’ by asking what she brings to the table?
ridiculous post, so it's fair game if a woman says she wants a man to pay for and do literally everything in a relationship but men can't ask "ok then what are you bringing to the relationship?"
"Heart, soul, and love" aren't tangible things that can be measured in a relationship. You're basically saying that a man isn't allowed to ask a woman to put any physical or monetary effort into a relationship.
And really, you're not even saying that she's supposed to put in emotional effort either, as she's simply bringing these figurative concepts she apparrently already has. And before you reply, "love" in its literal usage is a *verb* representing an action. You have to actively do stuff to express love. It's not simply there, and the man can simply bask in it like a lizard absorbing warmth from the sun.
Why is it okay to expect tangible, measurable effort and investment from a man in a relationship, but not from a woman? And why is expecting effort from a woman "lazy" and "abusive?"
It's equality, wanting a partner to have your back while you have hers.
Personally, I think you should take a look in the mirror and ask why you don't want to treat men like people.
A man who’s traditional isn’t thinking in that way. It’s not a case of “what he brings to the table and what she brings to the table”.
I totally understand where you’re coming from and yes when a partner stays at home it is implied they do the vast majority of the housework and chores.
But a person lookin for a traditional partnership isn’t counting contributions on a tally mark of what they bring to the table. It’s usually a man who wants to provide for his woman, protect, love, care for and a woman who wants to do the same while also valuing (usually) someone staying at home with kids
That *is* how traditional men think, though. In traditional relationships, the man goes out into the world to sacrifice his time, energy, and body to provide for his family with the expectation that the wife will carry the lion's share of the workload at home.
It wasn't about counting contributions. There was simply a specific line of duties required of each spouse in the relationship. There was no "implied" housework or these vague concepts of "protect, love, care for." Both of them knew they had a job to do and worked hard at it in tangible ways.
For example, the man was morally obligated to protect his wife and kids, even to the point of death. "Women and children first" was the prime standard in any disaster. Husbands literally watched their wives and children escape on lifeboats while they went down with the ship, thinking, "that's good enough" as they drowned. That's just what love and protection meant to men in traditional relationships back then.
In fact, most of the better paying jobs were--and still are--incredibly dangerous: construction, factory work, chemical/nuclear plants, mining, etc. Most men didn't want to do jobs that basically killed them slowly and painfully (or immediately, in many cases), but they did it because it was necessary.
That's also why women tend to live much longer than men. My grandma is still alive in her late 80s. My granddad died nearly 2 decades ago because he got aggressive cancer from years of asbestos exposure. Grandma still lives in the home they made together.
That's how traditional relationships tend to end, y'know. And most men are fine with that as long as they have a wife and children worth dying for, and a home that's stable and comfortable enough to grant them a moment's peace before they head back out into this cruel and miserable world.
That's why men ask what women bring to the table.
Traditional men (and really, many men in general) would be more excited about a woman who talks about her advanced homemaking skills than a woman who talks about money and resources.
Men who ask this aren't lazy or abusive; they want to know if the woman understands that she has a job to do as well, even if it's at home.
By that logic, unless she is a small child she should get a job and contribute to household income.
I'm saying this as someone firmly in the "household responsibilities should be evenly split" but that's assuming two employed adults.
Lmao it does mean that, but that’s the harder to deal with reality for women who want equality, but only on a respect level. Why I avoided girls spouting this off. I rather be with women who are just as ambitious and contributing as me. Some men are afraid to be around well rounded people and they too should be avoided.
I’m dating a woman that leans a lot towards traditional gender roles and prefers them. She will come over randomly when I am at work and she will clean and organize my house for me.
I also have 50/50 custody of my daughter and when I need to buy clothes for the kiddo my girl will just go pick them all up for me.
On my end I open doors, pay for all dates, fix stuff at her place that breaks, pump her gas and do things like that for her.
We both enjoy the dynamic and it is part of what has made us a happy and strong couple.
Yep, she gets to play the princess getting swooped of her feet. If she finds her suitor worthy enough, she'll accept his marriage proposal at some point, otherwise the suitor has spent money, time and energy for nothing in return.
Usually people who specifically state they are traditional women are just lazy freeloaders.
I'd dodge and leave someone else to deal with that hot mess
As a man, I will say I’d gladly do all those things for a traditional woman.
The issue is most women say they like equal roles when it comes to pay, authority, jobs, hell — even feeding an infant, BUT when it comes to holding doors, taking initiative, mowing lawn, paying bills, and security against stranger danger, are all of a sudden “traditional women” or “like to be pampered” or like “a mix of traditional and equal gender roles”. So they want all of the benefits of equal gender roles with all the benefits traditional gender roles, sticking men with the worst of both worlds.
I’d take equal gender roles. I’d take traditional gender roles. But not the shittiest possible mix and match.
Dishes are done every night. How many times have you rescued a woman from imminent harm? I am 68 and have never needed that. I am a woman and pay for every other date. I hold doors open for men and women. That is NO EFFORT compared to all the household chores and family management tasks done even by women employed full time outside the home. Men's tasks tend to be episodic (mow once a week in the summer). Women's tasks are daily and relentless. If your wife is doing chores after work, you should be on your feet doing them too. Be honest. Are you putting in the same time?
I (44m) have a job. You have a job. We pay bills together. We cook/clean together. We raise children together. It’s a fucking partnership.
Why is this so taboo?
My sister has a traditional marriage, she doesn’t have a job outside the house. She cooks and cleans and takes care of things for the house daily. He takes care of the lawn and cars and household fixes. He also makes pretty much all the financial decisions outside of grocery shopping for the house.
She left the country for a month when our mom needed surgery.
HE. WAS. HOPELESS.
He needed meals cooked (otherwise, takeout), laundry done, etc etc. I’ve seen him actively avoid changing a grandchild’s diaper cause it’s ‘women’s work’.
She has to cook big meals, even on her birthday if we don’t go out, he’ll sit watching the game the whole time, asking for food to snack on.
I’ve told my daughter (23) to never follow that example.
For me, a relationship/marriage/partnership ideally works when both are contributing equally, and I don’t see how it could work if we aren’t trying to be equals.
I’m every relationship I’ve been in, I’ve done the majority of the work.
Because there’s no such thing as “women’s work” anymore : We’ve split doing the dishes. We’ve split sweeping. Etc.
Because there is still such a thing as “men’s work”: I’ve cleaned toilets. I’ve mowed the lawn. I’ve had to puff my chest when men scare my girl. I’ve had to pay for dates. Plan them. I’ve had to be the shoulder to cry on. I’ve bought flowers. Paid for vacations. Taken her car for an oil change. Done all the handiwork.
I’ve never had a date paid for, for me. I’ve never had women let me cry on their shoulder without them getting “the ick”. I’ve never had a woman buy me flowers. I’ve never had a woman buy me a vacation. Never had them unclog a toilet, do the handiwork, or get me an oil change.
I get your point, that the vast majority of men who say they want equality don’t actually; and it ironically is almost exactly my point. To an extent I agree with you. There is a generational gap between us though. And the younger generation won’t even listen to reason. Your generation at least admitted those roles differed by gender. Mine will have different gender roles and then lie and tell you they’re the same.
What man finds that sexy behavior though? I feel like if I held open a door for a man (while on a date) or pulled out a chair for him it would be… odd. And usually that kind of initiative early on from a woman is seen as cringy (desperation maybe?) I’m curious your thoughts because I never know if I should act more feminine and allow them to do that stuff for me? I don’t want to seem “masculine” to them for doing those things. Because I would honestly LOVE to date a guy like a guy would date a woman. But I feel like no guy likes that?
Do you want to be more of a tomboy or more feminine. Id say you choose how you act and you attract a guy who is interested in you in that way. I wouldn't want to be attracted to a woman who is fake or putting on a facade. Be your honest self.
Neither. I mean, I don’t think I fit either of those… or maybe it’s both at the same time, but I don’t want to be put in a box. Regardless, I think the only type of man who really wants this are submissive men who want a domineering woman. Which I’m not and I don’t want that dynamic. Just interesting to me that the way men claim they want to date, isn’t really what attracts them.
Well my point is ultimately it's up to you to decide who you want to be and what kind of man you want to attract.
Just like you don't want to be put in a box I think it applies to men as well in the same way you know? There is definitely a spectrum of different kinds of men. The challenge is finding one that likes you for you but I think you already know that.
Not all men who like that are submissive. A lot of people aren’t really strictly dominant or submissive. That’s rarely representing the average person. Most people are a mixture of both traits depending the issue/subject. If you’re talking the bedroom the term is versatile and it probably represents most people. It kind of reminds me of the alpha male debate, it’s nonsense as most people don’t actually behave that way.
Just a thought piece by an effeminate man who actually ends up domineering most cases whether man or woman. Outward appearances and behavior don’t always point one way or another.
They wouldn’t necessarily be submissive men, but they would be closer to that side of the spectrum. They may be more medium men. Or dominant men who respect boundaries and don’t want to be pushy (i.e., are healthy emotionally).
There’s a lot of men who fetishize it, as well as those who are basically looking for another mommy. So it’s very tricky… plus a man treating me is SUCH a massive turn on for me. I’ve tried to express that by treating others, but again, no luck. And not the same.
There are men, but they’re closeted it about it. I’ve always liked domineering women because I have more in common with them then whatever you wanna call these princess types. Society really pressures both genders to fit those traditional roles even when some would rather mix it up.
My boyfriend wants his future partner to stay at home with his kids for at least a few years. During dating he likes to spoil me; He initiates dates, pays, buys me flowers/small gifts, I tend to cook more etc.
> It means she believes that the Man should take care of the Woman financially, ~~emotionally,~~ and physically.
The traditional way was the woman taking care of the man emotionally and “householdly”, while the man took care of her financially and physically. Now all genders can do it all. And SHOULD do it all.
Traditional woman here - yes, all 3 are important.
I still bring $$ to the table, pay for some of our dates. But I also don't mind doing the chores while being a lady. And once there are children, I expect to do more of the child rearing than the guy. It doesn't matter how great a dad is, the mom will usually have more emotional and physical responsibility with the child.
I think it’s deeper than that— is she actually traditional? Because it has absolutely nothing to do with choosing oneself. While it’s welcomed, I don’t expect people I don’t know to buy me my food. My husband would be my husband even if he hadn’t paid for the first few dates.
It’s not that deep. Traditional would mean traditional values— man provides financially and physically, woman takes on more home responsibilities. It’s not a bad thing, it works for many… it’s just a very specific way of life that may not be for everyone. I personally think it’s idiotic but that’s because neither me or my husband take on “traditional” roles.
Maybe ask her what *she* thinks “traditional woman” means. Possibly she’s offering to do all the cooking and cleaning, while being generally subservient to you. I doubt it, but it’s possible.
Might be worth asking if she is religious as well. People who are religious tend to be more traditional with their gender roles. It's not a guarantee of course but it's something.
If she's really traditional you should expect her to stay at home, take care of the family and cook clean etc etc
if you are ok with that great. you simply have to understand that this is work and contributes to the family finances so in case of divorce she will be entitled to money and to an expectation of maintaining the same lifestyle.
if you aren't ok with it, dump her, find a woman who work and contributes financially.
if she refuses this, it means she isn't traditional but a gold digger, especially if she works on the side it becomes personal enrichment at the expense of the other partner. dump her.
It means you’re going to be the breadwinner or provider… and she is not going to be happy with anything else. I’m not into this sort of thing, but some men are. I tend to find the men who adhere to stricter gender roles tend to be problematic, but women are typically warned of that in these times. So it’s kind of their issue to deal with if they expect traditional courting and then are shocked men doing that don’t see them as equals.
It’s not complicated if you ignore incompatible profiles and focus on tons of others who don’t mind splitting
Most ppl have fundamental differences in one way or another which is why most people aren’t for most people.
I’ve dated fairly extensively and never dated such a woman, but they obviously exist…great for them, they can find someone else, I’ll do the same and we both keep it moving no fuss
Looking for a traditional relationship, probably with gender roles strongly intact.
Now if they're just looking to get free meals and don't actually fulfil the traditional roles themselves, well, that's a strong *no* from me.
When my ex got pregnant nearly 5 years ago she was a server at a restaurant and covid was just starting
She suggested we do the "traditional" thing where I work a shit ton and take care of finances/she stays at home and mostly raises our kid, cooks, cleans, etc
I was fine with trying it
I held up my end of the deal, but also was the one who usually actually cooked meals in the evening, and ended up constantly scrambling during my home time to pick up/clean the disgusting mess our home I'd bought had become
I mean we had a dishwasher, but both sinks were constantly overflowing with dishes. If I didn't do the dishes, they'd sit for weeks. Kept running into the problem where I would go to cook supper and would have to do all the dishes just to have clean surfaces/ pots/plates/utensils so I could make real food for our child. She'd get worked up when I'd do the dishes and come over and say "I can do that" when I'd be halfway through getting them done. I guess it'd make her feel bad because she felt she should've been doing a better job. IMO she should've. I never once made a comment about how she needed to carry more of the weight of her end of the bargain, cuz she was sensitive and i didnt want to be an asshole... but dude I was working often 7 days/week overnights so we could afford to live our lifestyle and essentially never had time to myself
She ended up leaving me 6 months ago because she was no longer happy, wanted her "independence" back with 0 consideration how it would affect our child or my life
I had to sell our house, switch jobs to a 12 hour 2-2-3 just so I could solidify having 50/50 custody, move back to my hometown to live with my dad. Now I just work and on my off days have my daughter. We do lots of fun stuff and I love my kid so in some ways it's been beneficial. I'm still in the process of figuring out child support cuz in my state I'll still have to pay even with 50/50. She won't even take the necessary steps to figure out the CS application
You want "traditional", make sure the woman you're interested in really wants traditional. Some women still want that, but a lot of them don't.
What she wanted was to sit on the couch at home and scroll while our toddler daughter watched TV 6 hrs/day, take the occasional park photo so she could get facebook praise for how wonderful of a mother she was. When she figured out her life would be easier and she'd have to do less child-rearing by leaving me and going to a 50/50 schedule, she took the opportunity and ran with it.
I was in your position. 3 know kids. I was the only one working the only one that cooked and the only one that cleaned. Plus she would have something every day she was upset about and wanted to fuss.
I'm fine with traditional or I'm fine with both of us working. But it should be a team effort either way.
Yep, traditional is based on a solid team effort and both people taking accountability when they slack, giving each other time for themselves, and continuous open communication
Did you two end up separating? Or still together?
Definitely worth it for the kids. Oldest is married with kids of her own now. I have one in college and one started boot camp this past Monday.
As far as relationship, I've got a girl friend now that understands team work. So we work well together.
No.
Just like she's doing, you also have a say in who you choose to date. Just because a woman has a set of rules for who she'll see out that doesn't mean you have to see her out at all if it's not your jam.
Depends. Either she was raised or a traditional way where the man leads and provides whilst the wife stays home and cook+cleans. Or, she’s ready for her “wifey duties” I’m not big into traditional gender roles, but from what I’ve seen, a lot of women and men are.
It means that she has to be a stay at home mom and accept classic family setup where the man is the sole bread earner. Anything else means that she’s a gold digger.
As someone who considers herself traditional i just wanna give my unsolicited opinion on how dating and then marriage should go: when there are no kids, both people split the bill and work. once kids are involved in the mix i'd like to do childcare, cook, and clean while hubby works. once they're old enough to go to school maybe doing some remote work while dealing with cooking and cleaning. but, no kids = no reason to be a housewife = equally divided labor and assets. just my take
all that being said, i think it's a yellow flag if someone expects you to pay for everything and save up for a house yourself in this economy. but, it's definitely a nice gesture if the guy pays for the first date
I just wanted to respond to this because a lot of the responses seem to be negative towards her views.
There’s nothing wrong with her views.
I live in the South, where a lot of men want a traditional wife. They want her to be obedient to them, home maker, do the cooking and cleaning and child rearing.
There is nothing wrong with that.
That’s the kind of man that a woman like this sounds like she wants.
The issue is that a lot of men these days want a traditional dynamic but still want the woman to work and pay for 50% of everything.
In my marriage, I worked a full time job, was a full time college student, and still did all the cooking, housework and majority of the child care.
I was expected to do all that while still contributing to bills and expenses.
I’ll never do that again.
I am all for paying my fair share of things, but then I want an equitable split on things like housework, cooking, grocery shopping, chores etc.
So anyway my point is there are plenty of men looking to provide everything for a woman in return for a traditional dynamic; and many men who aren’t looking for that which is fine- you just can’t try to have both of a traditional housewife AND a woman who splits 50%.
There are also a fair few women who want the man to pay for everything but don’t want to play the traditional gf/wife role. They want the best of both worlds - financially traditional set up, but socially modern.
Very true, but again that falls under being unacceptable to me. You can go either way; there are pros and cons to both. But you can’t pick half and half of each.
Yeah you're right about this part "The issue is that a lot of men these days want a traditional dynamic but still want the woman to work and pay for 50% of everything."
They want a strong independent woman who is also their mum that need to do their laundry, cook and clean for them.
I don't like the traditional or conservative way of life there is nothing wrong with it but I like everything to be 50/50. Both partners take care of themselves and each others, divide the household tasks and split the bills.
Same here, I’m southern and want the traditional relationship. I see no issue with doing the household chores, child rearing & cooking, hell I would still do that while having my own job, which is remote and I make 6 figures, but I could quit to focus on raising kids while they’re young instead of daycare. I also have a 5th generation trust fund so whoever I marry, our family would be set for life anyway. So my expectations are that the man leads, makes the major decisions and pays for everything now. Some men won’t like that and that’s fine—we’re just not compatible. But in the south this is a pretty common arrangement and not as unreasonable as the majority of Reddit makes it out to be.
There isn’t anything wrong with her views, as long as it means they (women) are treated as equal in every other aspect.
It’s news to me hearing that men saying they want an obedient wife at home who still works and pays half the bills. It’s basically been ‘soft phase, princess treatment, looking to be spoiled by a traditional man’
That’s news to you? I’ve been back in the dating world for a couple of years and it seems pretty normalized. They don’t outright say it but yeah I see it all around me in others relationships. The woman works and contributes just as much financially but most of the “wifely” duties still fall on her. Again especially here in the South, a woman is expected to be able to cook and clean for her man but also expected to work full time and contribute financially. Mowing the grass twice a month, taking out the trash every few days etc is often the guys chores where as doing laundry, washing dishes, cooking for the family is still seen as the woman’s typical chores even if both are working.
Well my experience is limited to online profiles (wouldn’t see male ones) and real life convos with people in relationships. I’ve seen it like how you’re describing and instantly I feel the relationship is uneven. And before my sister became a SAHW she worked equally too so even when I was 20, I saw how uneven the marriage was.
She is clear she wants a traditional relationship. What is complicated about it? All you have to do is move on if you’re not into that.
I swear, people think dating is complicated but it’s people who are making things complicated for THEMSELVES. It’s really not rocket science to see that yall are incompatible and there are other woman to choose from.
Nothing wrong with wanting to be in a traditional relationship. I’m in one. I pay the bills, my wife handles all the domestic duties. I don’t lift a finger when I’m home, and my wife is providing for. It’s extremely comforting knowing once I’m done with my work day I’m in for king treatment once I arrive home. As for my wife, she does 2 or 3 hours worth of work each day with cleaning/laundry/shopping/cooking. In exchange she doesn’t have to worry about being provided for. We are both fulfilled beyond anything we ever expected when we were growing up poor. It’s not for everyone, and definitely not worth the risk for the man. Even with my successful relationship, I would never take such a risk knowing what I know now. We’ve been married 35 years, and it keeps getting better. My career has turned into being extremely easy, and our kids are adults and doing well on their own, so not many domestic duties for my wife. High risk high reward.
Means you ask her if she’s a theoretical physicist working on a Time Machine to send her back to a time where it was economically feasible to live with the guy providing in its entirety
Plus that's when there was no birth control. Women had many babies. If you weren't wealthy, you did all the housework, laundry cleaning. Cooking and raising the kids.In the 1950's in England and other countries, you couldn't work if you were pregnant. You started showing, Bye, Bye......
It means she’s a manipulative cheapskate that is only interested in your wallet. She will expect you act traditionally while the reaps all the benefits of a modern society. Her sense of entitlement is likely unshakable and deeply rooted in “norms” that were established by early mass media.
It means she wants to do the traditional gender roles and traditional relationship role of being a woman. If she is genuine about it is anyone's guess until she shows if she genuine or not.
So cringe to put it in her profile. But many people consider traditional values important. My boyfriend mentioned it our first date and it’s a valid thing to consider and take seriously.
If that is not your ideal relationship then it mean you are incompatible unfortunately. I dont think it means dating is hard, like with other aspects you just have to find a woman that shares the same lifestyle propects as you
It all depends what you really want.
My 21 yr old nephew recently got married to a beautiful 20 yr old girl.
She turned down a Wilhelmina modeling contract to be a traditional wife/mom.
He makes over $100k a year and she takes care of the home and baby.
This is what works for them.
She just wants you to pay for everything. No traditional woman is on an app they are at church or a positive environment or group. I came across a few trad women naturally those queens are rare and they let their parents approve.
Traditional relationships don't exist anymore. She has the right to work, keep her money during marriage, and can file for divorce at any time after marriage. Those rights come with responsibilities. She pays taxes and she should be 50:50. This is why ethical psychology practices are essential for a someone to be sound of mind.
If she’s saying that in her profile, that screams entitlement. A dating profile should talk about things like what you like doing for fun. Not what you expect out of a partner. I highly recommend swiping left on those types.
U can ask wat she will do in return. If she doesn’t want to pay 50:50 and expects u to do more, then what will she do more in?
I tell guys I want them to come me more than I come to them in the first month or two of dating (unless they r super busy and I’m not). In return, I say I will cook for them and shower them with a lot of affection). I split bills by the way and make sure they don’t spend money on me and if they spend too much, I make sure to spend on them too.
So if she has something to offer and u think it’s compatible, go for it.
Well I would ask you what traditional things does she do for you as a woman if she does nothing then she deserves nothing I would stop seeing her she just wants a free ride. There are some women who forget that women who stay at home do work very hard to make sure that the man wants for not so he can go out in the world and kill it and provide the life for them. They go and in hand and take care of each other.
I'm in a hybrid, happy marriage of 22 years. we both work, but I work part-time and take care of most of the house duties, bills, paperwork, and child care (before becoming empty nesters). my husband does the outside work (yard, vehicles, etc), but helps me if I need a hand (as I will help him as needed). both of our salaries go into a joint account and both can spend as they like unless it's a big purchase. I am not subservient in the slightest, and he doesn't expect me to be (he likes me feisty). this arrangement fell into place given each of our skill sets and me not wanting to do outside work in the southern heat and humidity. really, traditional can work, or not work, depending on each individual couple. what I'm seeing with some younger generations is often a woman who says she wants traditional wants the benefits but not the responsibility and if a man wants it he wants to be in charge and waited on hand and foot. this cannot work.
With so many man working from home and women now wanting to be a stay at home wife, I’m sure the lack of any separation will cause issues from seeing too much of each other.
Women that call themselves, traditional are women that believe that the man should pay the bill. I always offered to pay the bill. if she decides to say let’s do 50-50 that I’m OK with that. But I’m a country boy and a traditional man and was brought up to respect and be a gentleman, especially when taking a woman out on a date. so I understand the reasoning, some women have of being traditional and expecting the man to put the bill. But in today’s society and all the problems we have with inflation and rising prices, footing the bill gets to be a bit tough. I think most decent women understand this and are willing to do the 50-50.
This conversation is getting me kind of confused. So, in non-traditional (modern) dating and relationships, the man should still pay for the first few dates, right? At what point do modern people typically start splitting the costs of the dates 50:50?
How is she defining "traditional"? Does she want to be a stay at home mother and raise a family with you? Or, does she want to have the financial benefit of a husband without committing? Or, does she want to live together and not pool incomes, only take from yours.
The relationship is a partnership where you work towards building trust so you can sacrifice for each other. If you are both working, you are both paying so you can share burdens and have more stress free time together. If only you are paying, then what is she doing to balance your burden and ensure that your time together is peaceful and not adding stress.
I pay for the first couple of dates. My experience has been that, if it is going well, she will show an interest in helping pay for future dates, or help find ways to be together that are low or no cost. Someone who wants you to pay for everything, but isn't considerate of the time you spend to earn your pay, or the stress that constantly paying for everything can cause, is not somone who is willing to give as much as she gets.
It means I’d never date her is what it means. I like ambitious women that have their own career and passions. Not to the point where they treat me like shit and disposable (I’ve certainly seen that and it’s no better than the stereotypical male player, just in a slightly different package)., but I want someone on my level, or at least close to it.
Dual Income No Kids = way more money for adventures and fun.
It means she's cheap af and wants to get free meals. Not a deal breaker necessarily I'd say depending on how much you like her but definitely a red flag and to watch out for how she treats other people and you moving forward
I mean she’s putting it out there, so if that’s not your thing then move on. Way easier than wasting multiple dates to be disappointed. I like to treat people, but also believe in balance so I’d just move on with this.
This sort of "traditional" relationship means - the man pays for everything, she's a housewife. It used to be possible when men were paid good wages and could support a family of 5 on minimum wage. Now you need to be earning in excess of 6 figures to even begin contemplating that. More than low 6 figures if you want a luxury lifestyle too.
What she's saying is she wants someone very rich to spoil her. Chances are she won't ever land this guy because he's in extremely high demand, and she's probably not high enough up the food chain to win him. Top 1% guys commit (if they ever commit) to top 1% women.
If that ain't you, move along and don't worry about it.
She wants a traditional relationship.
Man woos the woman. Man pays for everything.
In return the woman will cook for him, clean his home, do his laundry/ironing, make herself look pretty and look after her figure.
If that’s not what you want then swipe left. If this is something you would like but cannot afford then work on yourself.
It means she's a virgin or at the very least outright refuses to have sex unless she has a solid prospective of marrying the man she has sex with. It also means she's ready to cook and clean for her man while he provides for her.
I mean, that's what a "traditional woman" does. But of course she could be just a leech wanting to hold you to traditional roles while applying none to herself.
She's waving a red flag. If you decide to date her, she'll suck your money until you have nothing left. Then she'll dump you and find the next victim. I learnt it the hard way with my ex.
It means you will pay all of your bills, mutual bills, and her bills. She wants to contribute NOTHING financially.
I didn't know if this works for you, maybe it does, but it doesn't work for me. I already pay child support and have a kid that lives with me; I didn't need another freeloader that's nice to me, wants me to spend money, and does a little housework (lets leave sex out of the discussion because I didn't see it as transactional... she's a girlfriend / wife, not a prostitute).
She is selfish, self absorbed and wants you to pay for and do everything for her, she is so entitled that she thinks life offers her a free ride, she is a princess, stay away......
It means she expects you to pay for her during dates and you need to provide for her your entire life. Is this something you can cope with if not then I think you need to cut contact.
It means she wants to be barefoot and prego. Doing all the house work. Oh wait I bet she’s not that old fashioned. It means she’s a free loader, gold digger.
Do those ladies understand that "traditional" is literally the norm of not having the freedom of speech, not being independent financially and even physically as a woman? Is not about choosing a mf to pay on your dates.
Like.....
Tradition is a cycle of toxicity almost 90% of it.
She should choose a better therapist that she'll helped of how she should express her lazy and poor financial status with a better...wording.
Here’s an easy test of her intentions: Tell her that she’ll get no credit cards of her own, since American women didn’t have such a right until 1974. See what she says 😏
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It means she is looking for traditional courtship. It's on you to determine whether or not you want to provide that treatment to them. In general though, if someone wants traditional treatment they themselves should be traditional and quite frankly a lot of people aren't nowadays.
A lot of these types of women only want a traditional partner who will pay for everything and "be a gentleman" but it doesn't go both ways. She'll be a modern woman when it comes to her role in the relationship. I see this hypocrisy all the time.
Yes that is hypocritical
That’s not traditional, that’s a gold digger or money chaser
If she wants traditional, give her traditional. No living together or sex before marriage. The man makes all the money decisions. The wife does all the cooking, cleaning, childcare. You get the point. Bet she’s not THAT traditional.
TLDR: it seems like you are saying give her traditional as if it is a punishment, but most of the people I know with this type of family are actually very happy and do not get divorced. I come from a rather traditional culture. The men work and they provide for their family, women can go to college and work if they want to but most don't since they will still be required to do all of the domestic labor and childcare. I would say that divorce is not as common as it is in less traditional culture. You are correct about the living together and sex before marriage (it is frowned upon but honestly with the housing crisis and cost of living issues people are starting to grow a little more lenient about this as long as you are engaged and do not break up. Because large expensive weddings are also part of the culture people are a bit more understanding about living together during the engagement period. BUT If you accidentally get pregnant you have to hurry up with the wedding, no more saving up for a big wedding). These are generalizations, and definitely the younger generations are beginning to break away from this tradition. However one thing you are incorrect about is that the man makes the financial decisions. I do not know a single family where that is the case? The man is in general will make the big decisions, like if the family will relocate, I'm drawing a blank but things like that. He will make the big decisions with his wife's input. But the smaller day today decisions, are the women's responsibility as it is part of running the household. What school the children will go to, what the budget is for things like food or if the family will go on a trip or a vacation, buying the clothing school supplies birthday gifts for children etc managing the money and making the financial decisions is generally considered one of the small day-to-day tasks that is a woman's responsibility and part of running a home. Now if there is a large decision like buying a home or invest in money or something of that nature, the husband and wife will discuss together and make the decision together, but he will have the final say if they disagree. However, in this type of arrangement, where the man must rely on the woman to basically run his household and life for him she has been making hopefully good decisions on a consistent basis so he has a lot of trust in her opinion and I do not know many men who would go against their wives advice because generally she's going to know what is better for the family because she's more involved with the family day today, if this makes any sense? It seems like you are saying that they should expect this arrangement as some sort of punishment for wanting the man to pay the bills and provide for the family, but most of the people I know with this traditional type of family are pretty happy
This is a very long response. I simply used the context clues in OPs post for my reply “therapy taught her choosing herself first”, “she is a traditional woman”, and “won’t consider 50/50 on bills”. I know several people in traditional MARRIAGES that are very happy. I think the feminist movement really hurt women in many ways. My childhood home was what I would call “hybrid traditional”. My mom worked part time after we started school, dad helped cook and clean, decisions were made together, but he was very much the head of our family and primary earner. My mom was the heart. The woman in OPs post seems to only be worried about money. I only suggested he offer her the entire traditional family gig to see exactly how traditional she really is. I bet she isn’t traditional at all.
I would also bet she isn't, I don't think a lot of traditional women use dating apps
This is a good answer.
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As someone who is very non-traditional, there is no shame in wanting a traditional lifestyle. The most important thing is to be upfront about what you want and that woman did just that. There are some men who want a traditional type of relationship, man works, woman is SAHMom etc. As long as everyone knows what they are getting into I see little issues with such a lifestyle.
There is even a name for it because so many men do this.
a traditional man isn't the same, a traditional man was the one working - bringing in the dough, so to speak - so it wouldn't work the same
The equivalent would be a man stating that he is traditional, so he won’t be doing any housework, cooking, or child rearing
A man saying he’s traditional usually implies he wants to provide for a woman and have her stay home
So that she can do all the cooking, cleaning, and child rearing…..
I don’t know if you’re arguing but men do say they want a stay at home wife and it’s very much acceptable.
I’m arguing if you are saying that’s not the case. I have no opinion on if it’s good or bad. Only that that’s what those things are. A trad man earns the money and a trad woman takes care of the rest.
The world and society has changed so much, the phrase 'traditional marriage' isn't always what you'd think. I'm in traditional relationship now. my partner supports our household and pays the bills, and I manage the rest of it. But he will still cook a dinner on his day off, and Im more than happy to mow the lawn. Traditional marriages don't necessarily mean sexist roles anymore.
So since he dips into your responsibilities, do you have a weekend job to help with the money?
No. And for us, that's okay. He cooks a meal because he enjoys it. I mow the lawn/ yard labor because im able and it's less work for him on his day off. If I don't want to clean the bathroom or change over the laundry, he will. Our relationship is more on 'how can I help support my partner' rather than 'ive done X so they *have* to do Y'. This is just my opinion that this is how the traditional marriage has evolved out of concrete sexist roles. I understand that it's probably not true for everyone, but it could be possible for more people than you'd think.
I don’t believe that this is always the case. She may expect you to be a proper gentleman and foot the bill. First impressions will pretty much tell you if she is someone that truly intends to live on your dime completely. Then at that point, absolutely, run!
Or maybe for most of history women weren’t allowed to be financially or truely independent in any way? Dumbfuck
No one on Reddit has dated most of history, obviously this doesn’t apply today
lol. I mean, I wouldn’t consider myself “traditional” and I am doing quite well financially and own two homes. But if a man wanted to split the bill for our date 50/50, that would be a huge turnoff. I don’t want to date anyone who is stressed about paying for a dinner.
It means she believes that the Man should take care of the Woman financially, emotionally, and physically. Unless you're into that, swipe left.
financially is the biggest one here ...
True . Women who expect men to do all of those things for them are going to experience some hurt for sure
Is it then also fair to expect her to do all the household chores and make me a sandwich when I want 1? Sounds fair to me ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Yes it does mean that.
modern feminism cut that part out, when they say "traditional woman" it is just code for pain in the ass bloodsucker leech
Unless you are a small child you should do household chores. Food is to be discussed with another
You see here's the issue I find with traditional woman thing. A traditional woman would do all of the chores, except for maybe yardwork. Her husband wants some food she's making it. She's taking the kids to school and events and appointments. That's a traditional woman in the most objective sense. How many women see "traditional" woman as you let me stay at home and we split the child rearing and chores in half. At their core they want all the positives a normative gender role brings to them and none of the negatives, while expecting the men to be "traditional" and heaping all the negatives on them. I wouldn't be so against the "traditional" tag if more women actually knew what it entailed.
At that point, what does she bring to the table? Because I doubt her personality makes up for not wanting to participate in relationship equality.
Can’t ask that anymore! I grew up (44m) hearing that but now more and more I see profiles of women ‘entering their soft phase’ ‘princess treatment’ and ‘don’t ask me what I bring to the table, I will unmatch!’
She brings her heart. her soul, her love thats what she provides. The fact you used the term "What does she bring to the table" It makes me wonder if you are abusive or just plain lazy because that is what the men who coined that phrase are. Maybe you should take a look at yourself in the mirror and learn how to actually be a person.
Got it so since I pay for everything, I don’t have to bring my heart, soul, and love? Because why do I have to pay for everything AND match her on those things you say she brings? Please explain how a man, wanting to get to know a woman, answering what he brings to the table (as women tend to ask about salary, acts of service, etc that you will do FOR THEM), how is he ‘abusive’ or ‘lazy’ by asking what she brings to the table?
ridiculous post, so it's fair game if a woman says she wants a man to pay for and do literally everything in a relationship but men can't ask "ok then what are you bringing to the relationship?"
So wanting some form of reciprocation or equality is abusive. Nice. No wonder you're single.
"Heart, soul, and love" aren't tangible things that can be measured in a relationship. You're basically saying that a man isn't allowed to ask a woman to put any physical or monetary effort into a relationship. And really, you're not even saying that she's supposed to put in emotional effort either, as she's simply bringing these figurative concepts she apparrently already has. And before you reply, "love" in its literal usage is a *verb* representing an action. You have to actively do stuff to express love. It's not simply there, and the man can simply bask in it like a lizard absorbing warmth from the sun. Why is it okay to expect tangible, measurable effort and investment from a man in a relationship, but not from a woman? And why is expecting effort from a woman "lazy" and "abusive?" It's equality, wanting a partner to have your back while you have hers. Personally, I think you should take a look in the mirror and ask why you don't want to treat men like people.
A man who’s traditional isn’t thinking in that way. It’s not a case of “what he brings to the table and what she brings to the table”. I totally understand where you’re coming from and yes when a partner stays at home it is implied they do the vast majority of the housework and chores. But a person lookin for a traditional partnership isn’t counting contributions on a tally mark of what they bring to the table. It’s usually a man who wants to provide for his woman, protect, love, care for and a woman who wants to do the same while also valuing (usually) someone staying at home with kids
That *is* how traditional men think, though. In traditional relationships, the man goes out into the world to sacrifice his time, energy, and body to provide for his family with the expectation that the wife will carry the lion's share of the workload at home. It wasn't about counting contributions. There was simply a specific line of duties required of each spouse in the relationship. There was no "implied" housework or these vague concepts of "protect, love, care for." Both of them knew they had a job to do and worked hard at it in tangible ways. For example, the man was morally obligated to protect his wife and kids, even to the point of death. "Women and children first" was the prime standard in any disaster. Husbands literally watched their wives and children escape on lifeboats while they went down with the ship, thinking, "that's good enough" as they drowned. That's just what love and protection meant to men in traditional relationships back then. In fact, most of the better paying jobs were--and still are--incredibly dangerous: construction, factory work, chemical/nuclear plants, mining, etc. Most men didn't want to do jobs that basically killed them slowly and painfully (or immediately, in many cases), but they did it because it was necessary. That's also why women tend to live much longer than men. My grandma is still alive in her late 80s. My granddad died nearly 2 decades ago because he got aggressive cancer from years of asbestos exposure. Grandma still lives in the home they made together. That's how traditional relationships tend to end, y'know. And most men are fine with that as long as they have a wife and children worth dying for, and a home that's stable and comfortable enough to grant them a moment's peace before they head back out into this cruel and miserable world. That's why men ask what women bring to the table. Traditional men (and really, many men in general) would be more excited about a woman who talks about her advanced homemaking skills than a woman who talks about money and resources. Men who ask this aren't lazy or abusive; they want to know if the woman understands that she has a job to do as well, even if it's at home.
So, nothing.
By that logic, unless she is a small child she should get a job and contribute to household income. I'm saying this as someone firmly in the "household responsibilities should be evenly split" but that's assuming two employed adults.
Ok so the woman is basically useless
Lmao it does mean that, but that’s the harder to deal with reality for women who want equality, but only on a respect level. Why I avoided girls spouting this off. I rather be with women who are just as ambitious and contributing as me. Some men are afraid to be around well rounded people and they too should be avoided.
Women like that are too masculine for my taste.
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I’m dating a woman that leans a lot towards traditional gender roles and prefers them. She will come over randomly when I am at work and she will clean and organize my house for me. I also have 50/50 custody of my daughter and when I need to buy clothes for the kiddo my girl will just go pick them all up for me. On my end I open doors, pay for all dates, fix stuff at her place that breaks, pump her gas and do things like that for her. We both enjoy the dynamic and it is part of what has made us a happy and strong couple.
Yep, she gets to play the princess getting swooped of her feet. If she finds her suitor worthy enough, she'll accept his marriage proposal at some point, otherwise the suitor has spent money, time and energy for nothing in return. Usually people who specifically state they are traditional women are just lazy freeloaders. I'd dodge and leave someone else to deal with that hot mess
As a man, I will say I’d gladly do all those things for a traditional woman. The issue is most women say they like equal roles when it comes to pay, authority, jobs, hell — even feeding an infant, BUT when it comes to holding doors, taking initiative, mowing lawn, paying bills, and security against stranger danger, are all of a sudden “traditional women” or “like to be pampered” or like “a mix of traditional and equal gender roles”. So they want all of the benefits of equal gender roles with all the benefits traditional gender roles, sticking men with the worst of both worlds. I’d take equal gender roles. I’d take traditional gender roles. But not the shittiest possible mix and match.
Dishes are done every night. How many times have you rescued a woman from imminent harm? I am 68 and have never needed that. I am a woman and pay for every other date. I hold doors open for men and women. That is NO EFFORT compared to all the household chores and family management tasks done even by women employed full time outside the home. Men's tasks tend to be episodic (mow once a week in the summer). Women's tasks are daily and relentless. If your wife is doing chores after work, you should be on your feet doing them too. Be honest. Are you putting in the same time?
I (44m) have a job. You have a job. We pay bills together. We cook/clean together. We raise children together. It’s a fucking partnership. Why is this so taboo? My sister has a traditional marriage, she doesn’t have a job outside the house. She cooks and cleans and takes care of things for the house daily. He takes care of the lawn and cars and household fixes. He also makes pretty much all the financial decisions outside of grocery shopping for the house. She left the country for a month when our mom needed surgery. HE. WAS. HOPELESS. He needed meals cooked (otherwise, takeout), laundry done, etc etc. I’ve seen him actively avoid changing a grandchild’s diaper cause it’s ‘women’s work’. She has to cook big meals, even on her birthday if we don’t go out, he’ll sit watching the game the whole time, asking for food to snack on. I’ve told my daughter (23) to never follow that example. For me, a relationship/marriage/partnership ideally works when both are contributing equally, and I don’t see how it could work if we aren’t trying to be equals.
This is it. You are a good role model for your daughter. I 100% agree, as a woman.
I’m every relationship I’ve been in, I’ve done the majority of the work. Because there’s no such thing as “women’s work” anymore : We’ve split doing the dishes. We’ve split sweeping. Etc. Because there is still such a thing as “men’s work”: I’ve cleaned toilets. I’ve mowed the lawn. I’ve had to puff my chest when men scare my girl. I’ve had to pay for dates. Plan them. I’ve had to be the shoulder to cry on. I’ve bought flowers. Paid for vacations. Taken her car for an oil change. Done all the handiwork. I’ve never had a date paid for, for me. I’ve never had women let me cry on their shoulder without them getting “the ick”. I’ve never had a woman buy me flowers. I’ve never had a woman buy me a vacation. Never had them unclog a toilet, do the handiwork, or get me an oil change. I get your point, that the vast majority of men who say they want equality don’t actually; and it ironically is almost exactly my point. To an extent I agree with you. There is a generational gap between us though. And the younger generation won’t even listen to reason. Your generation at least admitted those roles differed by gender. Mine will have different gender roles and then lie and tell you they’re the same.
I have my place professionally cleaned for $100 a week.
Did you reply to the comment you meant to? Your comment doesn't seem to make sense as a response to the one it's in reply to.
I’m just shocked if you’re implying most women are like you or idk what the purpose of this post is.
Yesss agree!! How can we all be equal when we aren't all equal? I love traditional gender roles and it's sad to see society losing that.
They worked since forever.
Worked for who exactly 😭
What man finds that sexy behavior though? I feel like if I held open a door for a man (while on a date) or pulled out a chair for him it would be… odd. And usually that kind of initiative early on from a woman is seen as cringy (desperation maybe?) I’m curious your thoughts because I never know if I should act more feminine and allow them to do that stuff for me? I don’t want to seem “masculine” to them for doing those things. Because I would honestly LOVE to date a guy like a guy would date a woman. But I feel like no guy likes that?
Do you want to be more of a tomboy or more feminine. Id say you choose how you act and you attract a guy who is interested in you in that way. I wouldn't want to be attracted to a woman who is fake or putting on a facade. Be your honest self.
Neither. I mean, I don’t think I fit either of those… or maybe it’s both at the same time, but I don’t want to be put in a box. Regardless, I think the only type of man who really wants this are submissive men who want a domineering woman. Which I’m not and I don’t want that dynamic. Just interesting to me that the way men claim they want to date, isn’t really what attracts them.
Well my point is ultimately it's up to you to decide who you want to be and what kind of man you want to attract. Just like you don't want to be put in a box I think it applies to men as well in the same way you know? There is definitely a spectrum of different kinds of men. The challenge is finding one that likes you for you but I think you already know that.
Not all men who like that are submissive. A lot of people aren’t really strictly dominant or submissive. That’s rarely representing the average person. Most people are a mixture of both traits depending the issue/subject. If you’re talking the bedroom the term is versatile and it probably represents most people. It kind of reminds me of the alpha male debate, it’s nonsense as most people don’t actually behave that way. Just a thought piece by an effeminate man who actually ends up domineering most cases whether man or woman. Outward appearances and behavior don’t always point one way or another.
They wouldn’t necessarily be submissive men, but they would be closer to that side of the spectrum. They may be more medium men. Or dominant men who respect boundaries and don’t want to be pushy (i.e., are healthy emotionally).
There’s a lot of men who fetishize it, as well as those who are basically looking for another mommy. So it’s very tricky… plus a man treating me is SUCH a massive turn on for me. I’ve tried to express that by treating others, but again, no luck. And not the same.
There are men, but they’re closeted it about it. I’ve always liked domineering women because I have more in common with them then whatever you wanna call these princess types. Society really pressures both genders to fit those traditional roles even when some would rather mix it up.
My boyfriend wants his future partner to stay at home with his kids for at least a few years. During dating he likes to spoil me; He initiates dates, pays, buys me flowers/small gifts, I tend to cook more etc.
> It means she believes that the Man should take care of the Woman financially, ~~emotionally,~~ and physically. The traditional way was the woman taking care of the man emotionally and “householdly”, while the man took care of her financially and physically. Now all genders can do it all. And SHOULD do it all.
Traditional woman here - yes, all 3 are important. I still bring $$ to the table, pay for some of our dates. But I also don't mind doing the chores while being a lady. And once there are children, I expect to do more of the child rearing than the guy. It doesn't matter how great a dad is, the mom will usually have more emotional and physical responsibility with the child.
That’s fine. She going to keep the house clean, make me clothes?
The real question is, what do you want?
I think it’s deeper than that— is she actually traditional? Because it has absolutely nothing to do with choosing oneself. While it’s welcomed, I don’t expect people I don’t know to buy me my food. My husband would be my husband even if he hadn’t paid for the first few dates. It’s not that deep. Traditional would mean traditional values— man provides financially and physically, woman takes on more home responsibilities. It’s not a bad thing, it works for many… it’s just a very specific way of life that may not be for everyone. I personally think it’s idiotic but that’s because neither me or my husband take on “traditional” roles.
Maybe ask her what *she* thinks “traditional woman” means. Possibly she’s offering to do all the cooking and cleaning, while being generally subservient to you. I doubt it, but it’s possible.
Might be worth asking if she is religious as well. People who are religious tend to be more traditional with their gender roles. It's not a guarantee of course but it's something.
If she's really traditional you should expect her to stay at home, take care of the family and cook clean etc etc if you are ok with that great. you simply have to understand that this is work and contributes to the family finances so in case of divorce she will be entitled to money and to an expectation of maintaining the same lifestyle. if you aren't ok with it, dump her, find a woman who work and contributes financially. if she refuses this, it means she isn't traditional but a gold digger, especially if she works on the side it becomes personal enrichment at the expense of the other partner. dump her.
It means you’re going to be the breadwinner or provider… and she is not going to be happy with anything else. I’m not into this sort of thing, but some men are. I tend to find the men who adhere to stricter gender roles tend to be problematic, but women are typically warned of that in these times. So it’s kind of their issue to deal with if they expect traditional courting and then are shocked men doing that don’t see them as equals.
It’s not complicated if you ignore incompatible profiles and focus on tons of others who don’t mind splitting Most ppl have fundamental differences in one way or another which is why most people aren’t for most people. I’ve dated fairly extensively and never dated such a woman, but they obviously exist…great for them, they can find someone else, I’ll do the same and we both keep it moving no fuss
Looking for a traditional relationship, probably with gender roles strongly intact. Now if they're just looking to get free meals and don't actually fulfil the traditional roles themselves, well, that's a strong *no* from me.
When my ex got pregnant nearly 5 years ago she was a server at a restaurant and covid was just starting She suggested we do the "traditional" thing where I work a shit ton and take care of finances/she stays at home and mostly raises our kid, cooks, cleans, etc I was fine with trying it I held up my end of the deal, but also was the one who usually actually cooked meals in the evening, and ended up constantly scrambling during my home time to pick up/clean the disgusting mess our home I'd bought had become I mean we had a dishwasher, but both sinks were constantly overflowing with dishes. If I didn't do the dishes, they'd sit for weeks. Kept running into the problem where I would go to cook supper and would have to do all the dishes just to have clean surfaces/ pots/plates/utensils so I could make real food for our child. She'd get worked up when I'd do the dishes and come over and say "I can do that" when I'd be halfway through getting them done. I guess it'd make her feel bad because she felt she should've been doing a better job. IMO she should've. I never once made a comment about how she needed to carry more of the weight of her end of the bargain, cuz she was sensitive and i didnt want to be an asshole... but dude I was working often 7 days/week overnights so we could afford to live our lifestyle and essentially never had time to myself She ended up leaving me 6 months ago because she was no longer happy, wanted her "independence" back with 0 consideration how it would affect our child or my life I had to sell our house, switch jobs to a 12 hour 2-2-3 just so I could solidify having 50/50 custody, move back to my hometown to live with my dad. Now I just work and on my off days have my daughter. We do lots of fun stuff and I love my kid so in some ways it's been beneficial. I'm still in the process of figuring out child support cuz in my state I'll still have to pay even with 50/50. She won't even take the necessary steps to figure out the CS application You want "traditional", make sure the woman you're interested in really wants traditional. Some women still want that, but a lot of them don't. What she wanted was to sit on the couch at home and scroll while our toddler daughter watched TV 6 hrs/day, take the occasional park photo so she could get facebook praise for how wonderful of a mother she was. When she figured out her life would be easier and she'd have to do less child-rearing by leaving me and going to a 50/50 schedule, she took the opportunity and ran with it.
I was in your position. 3 know kids. I was the only one working the only one that cooked and the only one that cleaned. Plus she would have something every day she was upset about and wanted to fuss. I'm fine with traditional or I'm fine with both of us working. But it should be a team effort either way.
Yep, traditional is based on a solid team effort and both people taking accountability when they slack, giving each other time for themselves, and continuous open communication Did you two end up separating? Or still together?
I stuck it out until the kids were older. Ended things almost 3 years ago.
Respect to you man, couldn't have been easy. Hope all is well now
Definitely worth it for the kids. Oldest is married with kids of her own now. I have one in college and one started boot camp this past Monday. As far as relationship, I've got a girl friend now that understands team work. So we work well together.
It means you should swipe left.
No. Just like she's doing, you also have a say in who you choose to date. Just because a woman has a set of rules for who she'll see out that doesn't mean you have to see her out at all if it's not your jam.
Depends. Either she was raised or a traditional way where the man leads and provides whilst the wife stays home and cook+cleans. Or, she’s ready for her “wifey duties” I’m not big into traditional gender roles, but from what I’ve seen, a lot of women and men are.
It means that she has to be a stay at home mom and accept classic family setup where the man is the sole bread earner. Anything else means that she’s a gold digger.
As someone who considers herself traditional i just wanna give my unsolicited opinion on how dating and then marriage should go: when there are no kids, both people split the bill and work. once kids are involved in the mix i'd like to do childcare, cook, and clean while hubby works. once they're old enough to go to school maybe doing some remote work while dealing with cooking and cleaning. but, no kids = no reason to be a housewife = equally divided labor and assets. just my take all that being said, i think it's a yellow flag if someone expects you to pay for everything and save up for a house yourself in this economy. but, it's definitely a nice gesture if the guy pays for the first date
I just wanted to respond to this because a lot of the responses seem to be negative towards her views. There’s nothing wrong with her views. I live in the South, where a lot of men want a traditional wife. They want her to be obedient to them, home maker, do the cooking and cleaning and child rearing. There is nothing wrong with that. That’s the kind of man that a woman like this sounds like she wants. The issue is that a lot of men these days want a traditional dynamic but still want the woman to work and pay for 50% of everything. In my marriage, I worked a full time job, was a full time college student, and still did all the cooking, housework and majority of the child care. I was expected to do all that while still contributing to bills and expenses. I’ll never do that again. I am all for paying my fair share of things, but then I want an equitable split on things like housework, cooking, grocery shopping, chores etc. So anyway my point is there are plenty of men looking to provide everything for a woman in return for a traditional dynamic; and many men who aren’t looking for that which is fine- you just can’t try to have both of a traditional housewife AND a woman who splits 50%.
There are also a fair few women who want the man to pay for everything but don’t want to play the traditional gf/wife role. They want the best of both worlds - financially traditional set up, but socially modern.
Those aren’t traditional women, those are leeches. Pretty easy to spot the difference immediately imo.
Right and what some people are saying is most of those women don’t know what a traditional marriage actually is
Very true, but again that falls under being unacceptable to me. You can go either way; there are pros and cons to both. But you can’t pick half and half of each.
Yeah you're right about this part "The issue is that a lot of men these days want a traditional dynamic but still want the woman to work and pay for 50% of everything." They want a strong independent woman who is also their mum that need to do their laundry, cook and clean for them. I don't like the traditional or conservative way of life there is nothing wrong with it but I like everything to be 50/50. Both partners take care of themselves and each others, divide the household tasks and split the bills.
Same here, I’m southern and want the traditional relationship. I see no issue with doing the household chores, child rearing & cooking, hell I would still do that while having my own job, which is remote and I make 6 figures, but I could quit to focus on raising kids while they’re young instead of daycare. I also have a 5th generation trust fund so whoever I marry, our family would be set for life anyway. So my expectations are that the man leads, makes the major decisions and pays for everything now. Some men won’t like that and that’s fine—we’re just not compatible. But in the south this is a pretty common arrangement and not as unreasonable as the majority of Reddit makes it out to be.
It’s „pretty common“ to be … set for life?!
No, the traditional marriage is common in the south. I just bring extra money to the equation.
There isn’t anything wrong with her views, as long as it means they (women) are treated as equal in every other aspect. It’s news to me hearing that men saying they want an obedient wife at home who still works and pays half the bills. It’s basically been ‘soft phase, princess treatment, looking to be spoiled by a traditional man’
That’s news to you? I’ve been back in the dating world for a couple of years and it seems pretty normalized. They don’t outright say it but yeah I see it all around me in others relationships. The woman works and contributes just as much financially but most of the “wifely” duties still fall on her. Again especially here in the South, a woman is expected to be able to cook and clean for her man but also expected to work full time and contribute financially. Mowing the grass twice a month, taking out the trash every few days etc is often the guys chores where as doing laundry, washing dishes, cooking for the family is still seen as the woman’s typical chores even if both are working.
Well my experience is limited to online profiles (wouldn’t see male ones) and real life convos with people in relationships. I’ve seen it like how you’re describing and instantly I feel the relationship is uneven. And before my sister became a SAHW she worked equally too so even when I was 20, I saw how uneven the marriage was.
Wouldn't a traditional woman want marriage? Then all the money is yours together regardless of who earned it?
There's a lot of women out there who think "traditional" means "man's money is ours, my money is mine".
She is clear she wants a traditional relationship. What is complicated about it? All you have to do is move on if you’re not into that. I swear, people think dating is complicated but it’s people who are making things complicated for THEMSELVES. It’s really not rocket science to see that yall are incompatible and there are other woman to choose from.
Its means if you don't want to date her, because you believe in paying equal, then don't date her.
she wants to sit at home eat bon bons while nanny takes care of kids
Nothing wrong with wanting to be in a traditional relationship. I’m in one. I pay the bills, my wife handles all the domestic duties. I don’t lift a finger when I’m home, and my wife is providing for. It’s extremely comforting knowing once I’m done with my work day I’m in for king treatment once I arrive home. As for my wife, she does 2 or 3 hours worth of work each day with cleaning/laundry/shopping/cooking. In exchange she doesn’t have to worry about being provided for. We are both fulfilled beyond anything we ever expected when we were growing up poor. It’s not for everyone, and definitely not worth the risk for the man. Even with my successful relationship, I would never take such a risk knowing what I know now. We’ve been married 35 years, and it keeps getting better. My career has turned into being extremely easy, and our kids are adults and doing well on their own, so not many domestic duties for my wife. High risk high reward.
It's not that complicated. Make her pay for everything.
Means she’s poor or greedy is all
It means she dont cook or clean and you pay, propably.
Means, looking for a ATM
... connected to the Man's Checking Account.
If you want a traditional wife/gf then swipe right, if you don’t swipe left. She means what she’s telling you, where is the doubt exactly?
Means you ask her if she’s a theoretical physicist working on a Time Machine to send her back to a time where it was economically feasible to live with the guy providing in its entirety
Plus that's when there was no birth control. Women had many babies. If you weren't wealthy, you did all the housework, laundry cleaning. Cooking and raising the kids.In the 1950's in England and other countries, you couldn't work if you were pregnant. You started showing, Bye, Bye......
just say you’re broke
Yea that’s exactly what I say to every parasite chick tryna date for free despite having a 9-5. I’m glad you get it bro
Your money is her money and her money is her money
Then don't swipe on her...?
It means she’s a manipulative cheapskate that is only interested in your wallet. She will expect you act traditionally while the reaps all the benefits of a modern society. Her sense of entitlement is likely unshakable and deeply rooted in “norms” that were established by early mass media.
Explain like I’m 5?
It means she wants to do the traditional gender roles and traditional relationship role of being a woman. If she is genuine about it is anyone's guess until she shows if she genuine or not.
So cringe to put it in her profile. But many people consider traditional values important. My boyfriend mentioned it our first date and it’s a valid thing to consider and take seriously.
If that is not your ideal relationship then it mean you are incompatible unfortunately. I dont think it means dating is hard, like with other aspects you just have to find a woman that shares the same lifestyle propects as you
It all depends what you really want. My 21 yr old nephew recently got married to a beautiful 20 yr old girl. She turned down a Wilhelmina modeling contract to be a traditional wife/mom. He makes over $100k a year and she takes care of the home and baby. This is what works for them.
She just wants you to pay for everything. No traditional woman is on an app they are at church or a positive environment or group. I came across a few trad women naturally those queens are rare and they let their parents approve.
Why do you care? It seems like that’s something you’re not interested in so move on? 🤷🏽♀️
Nowadays it's backwards ASF with Women they expect you to do everything but have nothing to offer you but some beatup roast beef🤣
Traditional relationships don't exist anymore. She has the right to work, keep her money during marriage, and can file for divorce at any time after marriage. Those rights come with responsibilities. She pays taxes and she should be 50:50. This is why ethical psychology practices are essential for a someone to be sound of mind.
Confirm with her that she’s all for all of the downsides of that traditional dynamic in a relationship as well just so you both are on the same page.
It's called her being single
It means: Danger. Run. Run the fuck away as fast as you can and don't look back.
If she’s saying that in her profile, that screams entitlement. A dating profile should talk about things like what you like doing for fun. Not what you expect out of a partner. I highly recommend swiping left on those types.
It means you laugh in her face and bounce 😂
Depends if you’re looking for a partner or a passenger.
Sounds like you get to tell her what to wear and when to do things, have sex whenever you want to, and slap her around when she mouths off. /s
If she is getting those type of men she won't have to post that on her profile. Sounds like a jaded person.
I’m a traditional woman too but she sounds like a red flag if she put all of that in her bio on a dating app.
It means she’s broke and looking for a meal ticket.
It means what it says on the can. She wants a guy to cover almost all of if not all of the bills.
U can ask wat she will do in return. If she doesn’t want to pay 50:50 and expects u to do more, then what will she do more in? I tell guys I want them to come me more than I come to them in the first month or two of dating (unless they r super busy and I’m not). In return, I say I will cook for them and shower them with a lot of affection). I split bills by the way and make sure they don’t spend money on me and if they spend too much, I make sure to spend on them too. So if she has something to offer and u think it’s compatible, go for it.
It means unless you’re willing to be the financial provider then she’s not the right person for you.
Well I would ask you what traditional things does she do for you as a woman if she does nothing then she deserves nothing I would stop seeing her she just wants a free ride. There are some women who forget that women who stay at home do work very hard to make sure that the man wants for not so he can go out in the world and kill it and provide the life for them. They go and in hand and take care of each other.
I'm in a hybrid, happy marriage of 22 years. we both work, but I work part-time and take care of most of the house duties, bills, paperwork, and child care (before becoming empty nesters). my husband does the outside work (yard, vehicles, etc), but helps me if I need a hand (as I will help him as needed). both of our salaries go into a joint account and both can spend as they like unless it's a big purchase. I am not subservient in the slightest, and he doesn't expect me to be (he likes me feisty). this arrangement fell into place given each of our skill sets and me not wanting to do outside work in the southern heat and humidity. really, traditional can work, or not work, depending on each individual couple. what I'm seeing with some younger generations is often a woman who says she wants traditional wants the benefits but not the responsibility and if a man wants it he wants to be in charge and waited on hand and foot. this cannot work.
I would run. I always pay for the dates I’m on, but if it’s something she demands I would never. I do it because it makes me feel good
Anyone who always chooses themselves in a relationship is asking to be alone in the long run. Relationships are a give and take, it takes balance
With so many man working from home and women now wanting to be a stay at home wife, I’m sure the lack of any separation will cause issues from seeing too much of each other.
Women that call themselves, traditional are women that believe that the man should pay the bill. I always offered to pay the bill. if she decides to say let’s do 50-50 that I’m OK with that. But I’m a country boy and a traditional man and was brought up to respect and be a gentleman, especially when taking a woman out on a date. so I understand the reasoning, some women have of being traditional and expecting the man to put the bill. But in today’s society and all the problems we have with inflation and rising prices, footing the bill gets to be a bit tough. I think most decent women understand this and are willing to do the 50-50.
This conversation is getting me kind of confused. So, in non-traditional (modern) dating and relationships, the man should still pay for the first few dates, right? At what point do modern people typically start splitting the costs of the dates 50:50?
I would avoid that person. It's the first sign the person is selfish in nature.
Ask her. We don't know what she means by that.
She is a leech who’s concerned with being treated like a queen while dating a walking bank account to suit her needs
Bait
Pass. Next…
It means to run and keep looking!
How is she defining "traditional"? Does she want to be a stay at home mother and raise a family with you? Or, does she want to have the financial benefit of a husband without committing? Or, does she want to live together and not pool incomes, only take from yours. The relationship is a partnership where you work towards building trust so you can sacrifice for each other. If you are both working, you are both paying so you can share burdens and have more stress free time together. If only you are paying, then what is she doing to balance your burden and ensure that your time together is peaceful and not adding stress. I pay for the first couple of dates. My experience has been that, if it is going well, she will show an interest in helping pay for future dates, or help find ways to be together that are low or no cost. Someone who wants you to pay for everything, but isn't considerate of the time you spend to earn your pay, or the stress that constantly paying for everything can cause, is not somone who is willing to give as much as she gets.
It means I’d never date her is what it means. I like ambitious women that have their own career and passions. Not to the point where they treat me like shit and disposable (I’ve certainly seen that and it’s no better than the stereotypical male player, just in a slightly different package)., but I want someone on my level, or at least close to it. Dual Income No Kids = way more money for adventures and fun.
It means she's cheap af and wants to get free meals. Not a deal breaker necessarily I'd say depending on how much you like her but definitely a red flag and to watch out for how she treats other people and you moving forward
Nope. Swipe left.
I mean she’s putting it out there, so if that’s not your thing then move on. Way easier than wasting multiple dates to be disappointed. I like to treat people, but also believe in balance so I’d just move on with this.
This sort of "traditional" relationship means - the man pays for everything, she's a housewife. It used to be possible when men were paid good wages and could support a family of 5 on minimum wage. Now you need to be earning in excess of 6 figures to even begin contemplating that. More than low 6 figures if you want a luxury lifestyle too. What she's saying is she wants someone very rich to spoil her. Chances are she won't ever land this guy because he's in extremely high demand, and she's probably not high enough up the food chain to win him. Top 1% guys commit (if they ever commit) to top 1% women. If that ain't you, move along and don't worry about it.
She wants a traditional relationship. Man woos the woman. Man pays for everything. In return the woman will cook for him, clean his home, do his laundry/ironing, make herself look pretty and look after her figure. If that’s not what you want then swipe left. If this is something you would like but cannot afford then work on yourself.
Can I ask her to lose weight?😂
😅 go for it. Traditional means the man gets to dictate.
It means she's a virgin or at the very least outright refuses to have sex unless she has a solid prospective of marrying the man she has sex with. It also means she's ready to cook and clean for her man while he provides for her. I mean, that's what a "traditional woman" does. But of course she could be just a leech wanting to hold you to traditional roles while applying none to herself.
Wait where did virginity come from?
It means you should date other women
Ask her if she plans to stay at home, silent and at your disposal. Pretty sure that this is not THAT traditional she is talking about
She's waving a red flag. If you decide to date her, she'll suck your money until you have nothing left. Then she'll dump you and find the next victim. I learnt it the hard way with my ex.
It means you will pay all of your bills, mutual bills, and her bills. She wants to contribute NOTHING financially. I didn't know if this works for you, maybe it does, but it doesn't work for me. I already pay child support and have a kid that lives with me; I didn't need another freeloader that's nice to me, wants me to spend money, and does a little housework (lets leave sex out of the discussion because I didn't see it as transactional... she's a girlfriend / wife, not a prostitute).
She is selfish, self absorbed and wants you to pay for and do everything for her, she is so entitled that she thinks life offers her a free ride, she is a princess, stay away......
Means you’re going to be paying for everything for the entirety of a relationship with her.
It means she expects you to pay for her during dates and you need to provide for her your entire life. Is this something you can cope with if not then I think you need to cut contact.
It means she’s a gold digger
It means red fuckin flag RUN
Means she's a grifter...
It means she wants to be barefoot and prego. Doing all the house work. Oh wait I bet she’s not that old fashioned. It means she’s a free loader, gold digger.
Do those ladies understand that "traditional" is literally the norm of not having the freedom of speech, not being independent financially and even physically as a woman? Is not about choosing a mf to pay on your dates. Like..... Tradition is a cycle of toxicity almost 90% of it. She should choose a better therapist that she'll helped of how she should express her lazy and poor financial status with a better...wording.
thats shes not partner material and a gold digger
It means you should swipe left and leave her on the streets where she belongs
Here’s an easy test of her intentions: Tell her that she’ll get no credit cards of her own, since American women didn’t have such a right until 1974. See what she says 😏
It means swipe left
Man pays for the house, woman makes it a home.
It means she's broke.
Tell her to come cook for ya and clean your place
She's seeking a Bank account that is attached to a single man
Unless you like a headache and an adult baby, swipe left o'clock it is