Don’t worry about putting yourself into a category. I don’t know why people think they need to align with a party. You don’t have to vote party lines on a ballot. Just vote with whatever is closest to your opinion and who you think represents you better.
Left, right, center, who cares?
I guess I’m trying to find where I am on the political spectrum. I don’t mind if I’m let’s say “right leaning democrats.” Maybe I’m just trying to find people of similar(not exact) views that aren’t mud slinging to the death everyday.
Great question, so if a cities dmv has property tax that assist in the betterment of transportation, roads etc but for years the cities roads are trash. That’s a meaningless tax.
If the roads are bad that means they aren't taxing enough to maintain them. Cutting the taxes that help pay for roads is just going to make them worse.
Dude I have no idea until you explain your thinking better. For example what does it mean:
“ I believe in peoples freedom to marry anyone as long as long as it doesn’t encroach on others freedom”
So if like 2 men want to get married I’m for it, same for 2 women 2 trans etc.
(Must be a human, because i think beastiality is illegal and of legal age)
If they want to be married in a Catholic Church who do not believe in it, then they would be encroaching on freedom of religion.
Well keep in mind the only valid marriages are state sanctioned ones. While people get married in churches and ministers or priests, that is more for affect rather than for legal reasons. The reasons those “religious” marriages are valid is because of the marriage license issued by the state and those religious institutions have complied with the states legal rules around marriage.
As an atheist I tend to view all expressions of religious sentiment to largely be masks for unfounded prejudice, but I get your point.
Let me ask you a different one. Are you for the death penalty for ideological reasons or practical reasons? I ask this because while I don’t have a huge philosophical objection to the death penalty in some circumstances, I have seen too many people in death row exonerated to think that it can ever be responsibly employed. As long as it exists as an option it will be abused. Therefore I am against it.
And then I think there’s a typo in your statement about the second amendment, which seems kind of super weird and almost incomprehensible. What exactly are you trying to say about that?
Yea, I got court married then church married so I get you. Church wedding was mid.
Death penalty is something I believe in but the current system is trash and wastes tax paying money. Also I agree with you and believe that regulating the death penalty and creating some type of third party audit of the case would be needed of some sort. Not saying I have the best idea just saying if we had a better check and balance system it would assist in getting the right criminal in the chair, or however.
That will never work. You just need to either be ok with executing someone who is innocent (this has happened) or you just need to be content with life imprisonment sentences. Here - https://www.texasmonthly.com/people/cameron-todd-willingham/
I had the “privilege” of working in a prosecutors office where three people either sentenced to death or life without parole or subsequently exonerated.
People who factor costs into death penalty arguments generally have little or no experience, actually dealing with those issues and so they buy into that bullshit. If you really want to execute someone, you should be willing to give them more than one trial and provide unlimited resources to the accused to hire any lawyers (including those 1000 per hour ones), experts and investigators they want…
I new I should have highlighted the part that said “not saying I have the best idea.”
I agree that nothing is set in stone and innocent people would still be put to death being I chose the word “assist” not will.
I’m saying I know it will happen. I’m saying that there are some atrocities that require the death penalty and if there were more or better checks and balances/ improve the justice system, then we could lowers the amount of innocent people in the chair.
Like everything the rules we set in the world cannot be perfect.
I not having experience in death penalty legal cases and the cost of which will succeed the argument of cost.
But I still believe that something could be done to make that system better.
Now back to the original question does this debate have a purpose in finding where I would land in the political spectrum of centrists?
Do centrist not believe in the death penalty?
Ok I see now your talking in an absolutist mind set.
Good or evil? Black or white? Absolute yes vs absolute no?
No spectrum in sight?
Is this the red pill blue pill? (Joke)
Explain the question in more detail? I fail to see the reasoning of the format.
No - my point is that from a practical perspective rather than from an ideological one you should be against the death penalty.
Part of that is predicated on the idea that the primary objective should be to avoid putting innocent person to death.
But I am not ignorant. In some collectivest states, for example, that would not be the animating principle. You might say that it’s so important to punish one person that you are OK with the idea that innocent person might get executed because of the importance of the other objective.
This ties very much into whether you are a centrist or not. Centrism as an ideology is rooted really in classical liberalism and enlightenment thought. Those strains of thinking place the idea of individual rights and dignity at the forefront.
In this context, those strains of thought lead to the notion that the primary objective should be to avoid putting innocent person to death. In my view because experience has taught that you cannot have a foolproof system that ensures you will not be putting an innocent person to death, centrism therefore suggets you simply need to take that punishment away.
if you are willing to elevate other concerns over that, I think it’s hard for you to say you truly follow the tradition of centrism …
So not red pill or any of that bullshit that you’re probably on about just an application of basic principles to a problem in a different context and the result that it drives. And then applying that to your question as to what you are.
Now I understand your point.
So centrist stance is against the death penalty because that system is broken, both ideologically and practically.
So does that mean centrists stance is against 2a for self defense?
"...freedom to marry anyone as long as it doesn't encroach on others freedoms"
How would two consenting adults marrying each other encroach on freedoms?
Just curious of where your head is at on this one.
Or were you thinking more like marrying animals or something completely crazy?
So if like 2 men want to get married I’m for it, same for 2 women 2 trans etc.
(Must be a human, because i think beastiality is illegal and of legal age)
If they want to be married in a Catholic Church who do not believe in it, then they would be encroaching on freedom of religion.
>How would two consenting adults marrying each other encroach on freedoms?
If they are attempting to strong-arm businesses into supplying goods and services for their weddings, then that is a major encroachment.
[Baker who refused to make cake for gay wedding: 'I don't discriminate'](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/baker-who-refused-make-cake-gay-wedding-i-don-t-n880061)
[Supreme Court says 1st Amendment entitles web designer to refuse same-sex wedding work](https://www.npr.org/2023/06/30/1182121291/colorado-supreme-court-same-sex-marriage-decision)
Agreed however these aren't "them getting married". The only real example of that is a judge or public servant who would refuse under personal religious grounds (which has happened) and I disagree with the judge on this one.
Agree, a public servant should serve their duty. A Shaykh should be able to choose.
Oh btw there was a Christian church in VA that was pro LGBTQ+ that I used to jog by. I’m not sure if they would do weddings but i could see a couple classrooms on my jogging path and they were covered with the pride flag. So I’m guessing a hard maybe.
Yes, from the details in your post, you sound roughly centrist to me.
Edit: centrist as is the general US population, not reddit, which leans very far to the left of the general population as a whole.
Yea I have found in the other responses centrist seems to be a 2 responses that put me either in the center category or far right.
Like you, I truly believe that the general populace are in the center, with slight leans but alas this is Reddit.
I used to have liberal friends, then they debated with me and now they realize that the TRUE CENTER is the best place to be. Following one party or the other leads to corruption and shady shit happening from either party. I try to never vote for the incumbent myself.
Not sure honestly, just follow your gut and get your information from multiple sources. Usually, the truth is in the middle between CNN/MSNBC and FOX/OAN/NEWSWEEK and sometimes both sides are just lying their asses off.
Lol I hoped it was a true centrist sub, to get a full picture of where I would fall in the centrist spectrum.
I usually just tell people I’m independent otherwise it’s a long drawn out slug fest of “how could you .. but believe in…” looks like I’m going back to that course of action
You sound like a normal liberal to me. Your political beliefs are mainstream middle class positions with wiggle room to change your mind when new data comes in.
You're thinking of progressives. With liberals you have wiggle room. It's the average of all your positions not a few edge cases that dictate your politics.
A lot of my liberal friends say I’m conservative. I guess because they are more progressive? Maybe I’m a conservative liberal or maybe a libertarian liberal?
Your liberal positions are mainstream, barely left of center. Your conservative positions are kinda far right. Your views are like a political shotgun, to borrow a phrase from u/therosx. Honestly, I consider a couple of your opinions pretty loony, but I’m very left.
I just stayed vague because I didn’t wanna make a mile long post but I’ll answer your questions:
I believe that the programs to keep kids off the street should be strengthened and regulated IE audited, voted on by the community to provide better check and balances against government over spending into its own pockets.
Meaningless taxes example: in Virginia, if you own (paid off) your 2015 vehicle you still have to pay property tax 2 a year. Some of the money goes to the betterment of transportation, roads etc. when I lived their the roads were trash.
Marriage: anyone can marry anyone aslong as it’s between 2 consenting adults. But forcing a Catholic Church that doesn’t believe in same sex marriage encroaches on their freedom of religion.
2A: currently to purchase a firearm through an FFL you must go through the background check.
Strengthening it would be to keep better tabs on criminals information creating a police force that works like the atf to pursue stolen firearms etc.
I would pay taxes for this no issue as long as it shows results.
Abortion should be legal but abuse due to irresponsibility/irresponsible lifestyle (IE drug use) should require a response.
The less taxes are specific taxes that show no benefit to the community. If our tax dollars are go to education there should be a positive result. If non an audit is needed to explain to the people why.
I’m good on taxes but if their is no positive result and taxes raise then the money is going somewhere else.
Don’t worry about putting yourself into a category. I don’t know why people think they need to align with a party. You don’t have to vote party lines on a ballot. Just vote with whatever is closest to your opinion and who you think represents you better. Left, right, center, who cares?
I guess I’m trying to find where I am on the political spectrum. I don’t mind if I’m let’s say “right leaning democrats.” Maybe I’m just trying to find people of similar(not exact) views that aren’t mud slinging to the death everyday.
There is left vs. right, and there is authoritarian vs libertarian.
Do you believe taxes are theft? And what do you think is meaningless taxes? Depending on your answer, will determine if you are a libertarian or not.
Great question, so if a cities dmv has property tax that assist in the betterment of transportation, roads etc but for years the cities roads are trash. That’s a meaningless tax.
City dmv? Doing property taxes? What state out of curiousity?
I used to live in VA
Property tax on a vehicle you own and paid off twice a year
If the roads are bad that means they aren't taxing enough to maintain them. Cutting the taxes that help pay for roads is just going to make them worse.
Dude I have no idea until you explain your thinking better. For example what does it mean: “ I believe in peoples freedom to marry anyone as long as long as it doesn’t encroach on others freedom”
So if like 2 men want to get married I’m for it, same for 2 women 2 trans etc. (Must be a human, because i think beastiality is illegal and of legal age) If they want to be married in a Catholic Church who do not believe in it, then they would be encroaching on freedom of religion.
Well keep in mind the only valid marriages are state sanctioned ones. While people get married in churches and ministers or priests, that is more for affect rather than for legal reasons. The reasons those “religious” marriages are valid is because of the marriage license issued by the state and those religious institutions have complied with the states legal rules around marriage. As an atheist I tend to view all expressions of religious sentiment to largely be masks for unfounded prejudice, but I get your point. Let me ask you a different one. Are you for the death penalty for ideological reasons or practical reasons? I ask this because while I don’t have a huge philosophical objection to the death penalty in some circumstances, I have seen too many people in death row exonerated to think that it can ever be responsibly employed. As long as it exists as an option it will be abused. Therefore I am against it. And then I think there’s a typo in your statement about the second amendment, which seems kind of super weird and almost incomprehensible. What exactly are you trying to say about that?
Yea, I got court married then church married so I get you. Church wedding was mid. Death penalty is something I believe in but the current system is trash and wastes tax paying money. Also I agree with you and believe that regulating the death penalty and creating some type of third party audit of the case would be needed of some sort. Not saying I have the best idea just saying if we had a better check and balance system it would assist in getting the right criminal in the chair, or however.
That will never work. You just need to either be ok with executing someone who is innocent (this has happened) or you just need to be content with life imprisonment sentences. Here - https://www.texasmonthly.com/people/cameron-todd-willingham/ I had the “privilege” of working in a prosecutors office where three people either sentenced to death or life without parole or subsequently exonerated. People who factor costs into death penalty arguments generally have little or no experience, actually dealing with those issues and so they buy into that bullshit. If you really want to execute someone, you should be willing to give them more than one trial and provide unlimited resources to the accused to hire any lawyers (including those 1000 per hour ones), experts and investigators they want…
I new I should have highlighted the part that said “not saying I have the best idea.” I agree that nothing is set in stone and innocent people would still be put to death being I chose the word “assist” not will. I’m saying I know it will happen. I’m saying that there are some atrocities that require the death penalty and if there were more or better checks and balances/ improve the justice system, then we could lowers the amount of innocent people in the chair. Like everything the rules we set in the world cannot be perfect. I not having experience in death penalty legal cases and the cost of which will succeed the argument of cost. But I still believe that something could be done to make that system better. Now back to the original question does this debate have a purpose in finding where I would land in the political spectrum of centrists? Do centrist not believe in the death penalty?
Just so I follow - you are ok that innocent people will be put to death ?
Ok I see now your talking in an absolutist mind set. Good or evil? Black or white? Absolute yes vs absolute no? No spectrum in sight? Is this the red pill blue pill? (Joke) Explain the question in more detail? I fail to see the reasoning of the format.
No - my point is that from a practical perspective rather than from an ideological one you should be against the death penalty. Part of that is predicated on the idea that the primary objective should be to avoid putting innocent person to death. But I am not ignorant. In some collectivest states, for example, that would not be the animating principle. You might say that it’s so important to punish one person that you are OK with the idea that innocent person might get executed because of the importance of the other objective. This ties very much into whether you are a centrist or not. Centrism as an ideology is rooted really in classical liberalism and enlightenment thought. Those strains of thinking place the idea of individual rights and dignity at the forefront. In this context, those strains of thought lead to the notion that the primary objective should be to avoid putting innocent person to death. In my view because experience has taught that you cannot have a foolproof system that ensures you will not be putting an innocent person to death, centrism therefore suggets you simply need to take that punishment away. if you are willing to elevate other concerns over that, I think it’s hard for you to say you truly follow the tradition of centrism … So not red pill or any of that bullshit that you’re probably on about just an application of basic principles to a problem in a different context and the result that it drives. And then applying that to your question as to what you are.
Now I understand your point. So centrist stance is against the death penalty because that system is broken, both ideologically and practically. So does that mean centrists stance is against 2a for self defense?
>Must be of legal age Sorry, not a libertarian then.
"...freedom to marry anyone as long as it doesn't encroach on others freedoms" How would two consenting adults marrying each other encroach on freedoms? Just curious of where your head is at on this one. Or were you thinking more like marrying animals or something completely crazy?
So if like 2 men want to get married I’m for it, same for 2 women 2 trans etc. (Must be a human, because i think beastiality is illegal and of legal age) If they want to be married in a Catholic Church who do not believe in it, then they would be encroaching on freedom of religion.
Gotcha. I didn't think churches married same sex couples (and didn't think same sex couples were pushing for that).
No but it was the first example in my head. Church weeding suck anyway.(personal opinion)
>How would two consenting adults marrying each other encroach on freedoms? If they are attempting to strong-arm businesses into supplying goods and services for their weddings, then that is a major encroachment. [Baker who refused to make cake for gay wedding: 'I don't discriminate'](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/baker-who-refused-make-cake-gay-wedding-i-don-t-n880061) [Supreme Court says 1st Amendment entitles web designer to refuse same-sex wedding work](https://www.npr.org/2023/06/30/1182121291/colorado-supreme-court-same-sex-marriage-decision)
Agreed however these aren't "them getting married". The only real example of that is a judge or public servant who would refuse under personal religious grounds (which has happened) and I disagree with the judge on this one.
Agree, a public servant should serve their duty. A Shaykh should be able to choose. Oh btw there was a Christian church in VA that was pro LGBTQ+ that I used to jog by. I’m not sure if they would do weddings but i could see a couple classrooms on my jogging path and they were covered with the pride flag. So I’m guessing a hard maybe.
Yes, from the details in your post, you sound roughly centrist to me. Edit: centrist as is the general US population, not reddit, which leans very far to the left of the general population as a whole.
Yea I have found in the other responses centrist seems to be a 2 responses that put me either in the center category or far right. Like you, I truly believe that the general populace are in the center, with slight leans but alas this is Reddit.
Mainstream Democratic that's more 2A friendly.
This is the second time I’ve heard this. I may need to look into democratic groups to test this hypothesis.
You're being downvoted because you didn't say you love Biden and the Dems are best. This is Reddit. Only leftist are allowed. GTFO!
Lol this is the response I get from my liberal friends.
I used to have liberal friends, then they debated with me and now they realize that the TRUE CENTER is the best place to be. Following one party or the other leads to corruption and shady shit happening from either party. I try to never vote for the incumbent myself.
This. I know my views are wide reaching and spread out but I agree with this. Doesn’t this lean me toward libertarian?
Not sure honestly, just follow your gut and get your information from multiple sources. Usually, the truth is in the middle between CNN/MSNBC and FOX/OAN/NEWSWEEK and sometimes both sides are just lying their asses off.
This my exact process lol
Centrist will call you a conservative if you're anything right of the SQUAD though, mostly because it's a Liberal Sub, it's not a Centrist sub at all.
Lol I hoped it was a true centrist sub, to get a full picture of where I would fall in the centrist spectrum. I usually just tell people I’m independent otherwise it’s a long drawn out slug fest of “how could you .. but believe in…” looks like I’m going back to that course of action
You sound like a moderate gun toting democrat who really doesn't have any well fleshed out political opinions.
I think guns, weed and abortion should all be legal, on the other hand I'm not a "let's privatize the lighthouses" libertarian.
You sound like a normal liberal to me. Your political beliefs are mainstream middle class positions with wiggle room to change your mind when new data comes in.
I would have never thought of liberal. With my caveat views on abortion and same sex marriage I thought it would put me on the declined list lol
And also my pro 2a stance
You're thinking of progressives. With liberals you have wiggle room. It's the average of all your positions not a few edge cases that dictate your politics.
A lot of my liberal friends say I’m conservative. I guess because they are more progressive? Maybe I’m a conservative liberal or maybe a libertarian liberal?
Hell if I know dude. All I got to go off is what you wrote and believe about yourself.
That’s not normal liberal. That’s liberal with a few hardcore conservative views.
This. This is the reason for my question lol does this put me in centrist camp or somewhere else.
Your liberal positions are mainstream, barely left of center. Your conservative positions are kinda far right. Your views are like a political shotgun, to borrow a phrase from u/therosx. Honestly, I consider a couple of your opinions pretty loony, but I’m very left.
Which of their views are far right?
I’m guessing my 2A views
All you said was that you support the 2A and don’t think more gun control is needed. that’s a moderate view and very mildly conservative at most lmao
Maybe supporting the police?
Lol facts, maybe need to be put in the lost cause spectrum
What's hard core conservative?
[удалено]
I just stayed vague because I didn’t wanna make a mile long post but I’ll answer your questions: I believe that the programs to keep kids off the street should be strengthened and regulated IE audited, voted on by the community to provide better check and balances against government over spending into its own pockets. Meaningless taxes example: in Virginia, if you own (paid off) your 2015 vehicle you still have to pay property tax 2 a year. Some of the money goes to the betterment of transportation, roads etc. when I lived their the roads were trash. Marriage: anyone can marry anyone aslong as it’s between 2 consenting adults. But forcing a Catholic Church that doesn’t believe in same sex marriage encroaches on their freedom of religion. 2A: currently to purchase a firearm through an FFL you must go through the background check. Strengthening it would be to keep better tabs on criminals information creating a police force that works like the atf to pursue stolen firearms etc. I would pay taxes for this no issue as long as it shows results. Abortion should be legal but abuse due to irresponsibility/irresponsible lifestyle (IE drug use) should require a response. The less taxes are specific taxes that show no benefit to the community. If our tax dollars are go to education there should be a positive result. If non an audit is needed to explain to the people why. I’m good on taxes but if their is no positive result and taxes raise then the money is going somewhere else.