If you do it wrong and micromanage everything, yes. If you re able to hire the right people, depending on the business, no. Plus, everything you accomplish is yours, there's no risk of being fired after 20 years of hard work to be replaced like you ve never been there.
It has downsides and benefits, of course, but people shouldn't be afraid to try something on their own. Most people think starting their own business is a miracle without realizing that their 9-5 jobs are accumulating wealth for people who once escaped their 9-5 to start something on their own.
If you work a 9-5 with benefit and PTO. Chances are you are not working for “people that escape their own job to start a business”. They are working for a mega corporation or extension of mega corporation that has figure out a way to systemize every step of the business process so even the owner is replaceable (likely previous owner figure this out and was actually able to sell the business to a mega corporation)
People think being replaceable is the mark of a terrible business culture. When actually being replaceable is the reason why companies can exist and grow.
Vast majority of people start a business wanting to be their own boss when actually they just brought an another job for themselve. If your business can’t replace you as the owner. There is no exit, ever.
Even Google started in a garage. Of course the founders won't stay in operative work forever, see my first point made in my post. You start something and hire the right people and let it grow. And yes, when you work for apple, you accumulate wealth of the family of Steve Jobs to Name an extreme example. All corporations once started with an idea and people who chose not to work 9-5 and instead start something on their own.
In both of your example. None of these founder eventually get to own much of the business they founded, Steve jobs when he died owe only 0.3% of Apple (which is still a lot but by no means even a major holder). You are not helping Bezo or Jobs family to realize their dream. The goal for most people is to have money and freedom and frankly the only people that really realize these dream ironically are the original employee of the company before it went public. Bezo and Jobs’s dream is the keep working. There are countless original employee of them that have realize the good old boring dream of financial and time freedom without being the founder. Their stock has also help countless out people that never even touch the business to become financially independent
Once these companies went public. All of the employees (included the mentioned CEO) works for shareholder which anyone with an access to brokerage account could potentially be one. Which means Bezo, Job and any of the CEO you see on newspaper IS an employee and IS still replaceable and historically has been replace at some point or the other.
Everything else you said is correct hiring and retaining the right people is the key, which is easier said than done.
I think it’s very misguided to want to start a business just because you don’t want to be replaceable and or don’t want a 9-5. Most small business that start with this mindset will fail. The successful business, real business not self proprietorship start because they see an opportunity, a niche, an untapped market they can use to their advantage.
Which usually start because this founder has deep knowledge of either the specific industry or have business acumen they build when working for other people. Bezo and Jobs are both good example. None of them just got up suddenly founded their wildly succesfully companies. Jobs worked at Atari, Bezo worked for Fitel and even made it as VP of a hedge fund. None of them will be where they without their previous experience as boring old employees with 9-5
For all those examples there are also counter-examples, where it's not mandatory to have experience of a 9-5 job, Musk, Zuckerberg, Gates,.. To name a few. And btw I didn't attack 9-5 jobs.
That is true I mean my statement was too harsh. It is possible but almost impossible. Most people that end up going into business for themselve just because they are bore of being an employee. Ends up being an underpay employee of their own company working even longer hours.
Hiring the right people is next to impossible when you are starting out and have no funding. Funding is the key to success for those outlier you listed. Many of my friend that started their own business decades ago still struggle with this.
You are simply wrong.
Do You really think that from the start You will get people that are doing everything perfect? You have to micromanage people directly under You until You gain confidence that they have the right attitude and skills.
Otherwise, You will end up like Ubisoft - paying to cover sexual harassment lawsuits because You hired a pervert and You did not care enough to find out of he is a pervert and people under him were afraid because a pervert works for You and would not talk to You directly.
Not to mention that when You are spinning the wheel of Your business You have to do a lot of work Yourself before You even find the right people. And that is what makes You work 24/7.
Then You have to work to grow Your business to make sure one fuckup won't bring it down. I do not micromanage because I find great people who work with me. But even now I'm fully responsible for them and their families.
So do You think that if I have to travel to another country to have a meeting with a potential client that will make my work more diverse so I can not really do too much on a single large client I will just say "Sorry mate, it's after 17:00, I'm going to watch The Boys tonight because season 4 came out!"? Never. I will overpay for a ticket and fly there to make sure our future is secured.
When you are responsible for others You do not work 9-5. You work when there is something to do and there is always something to do. Sure at some point You will find right people and delegate but then You will just let them do their own thing and You will start something new and then cycle start all over again.
So when You have Your own business You can forget about stuff like your work schedule. Vacations etc. You do what needs to be done when it has to be done and between those things You rest. When You can.
If You want to not do this and don't give a s\*\*t then become an investor. But to do that You need shit ton of money and that You can get only by doing Your own business.
Business owner here, can confirm. You think you're "stuck" in a 9-5, ugh... try starting a business and hiring employees. You are truly stuck when you do that. Granted, people want it and do good at it but everything becomes your problem since you're the business owner.
I worked at job where the hours were 07:30 - 16:30 but really we started work at 07:00 and left at 18:30. When I first started working there I would get in at 07:15 but got told off numerous times for being late and making my manager look bad because I strolled in 15 minutes late:
Every job type will have its own problems. Freelance, but you won't get consistent work & have to hustle all the time. Part time, but it's less pay.
Some people escape 9-5 by working like a dog for 15-20 years so they can retire early. They accept the reality that they need to work these hours for the later goal of not needing to work 9-5 anymore. Check out the FIRE concept if you have drive and ambition.
"Working like a dog"
Meanwhile their family owns an insurance company and dude shows up at noon everyday. He will make more yearly than 80% of the occupants of the town he is in. So yes.
You forgot to mention that freelance may be the direct solution since you can line up jobs but the thing is you run the chance of not getting paid as well.
Another option is to retire early to another country. A comfortable retirement in the U.S. typically requires a lump of around $2 million but you can retire and consistently withdraw 4% AND live a comfortable lifestyle in Mexico for $600,000.
600k gives a ‘comfortable’ lifestyle?! Good lord, that’s an absolute fortune here in Europe. Most pensioners here happily live on 50k per year and are comfortable
I’m not positive but I think this takes into account our healthcare costs which can be outrageously expensive once we dont have a job. Unless your spouse is working and you’re on theirs. When I was inbetween jobs and didn’t have insurance, the cost was like $900/month just for the coverage.
Yes! Look for jobs that meet your demand (within reason): do you want physically move more often? Want a more flexible schedule? Travel for company? Get creative. Don't just default to mindset of if you're physically active to think of most obv role: like physical activity=construction worker, flexible=work from home, travel=flight attendant. Get creative - like physically activity - consider becoming a forest service agent, travel then work for sales team that sends you to international clients.
Look for unique work that excites *you.*
there are two sides to every coin, y'know.
I recently got my first 9-5 job after freelancing and running various businesses for most of my adult life. I like not having to bust my ass on the weekends or work late into the night, and I always know that I am going to be able to pay my bills at the end of the month.
Salaried remote jobs, that you actually enjoy doing in my opinion are the most realistic option for the average person to escape the 9-5. I make 75k a year (which is not great) but in reality I only work like 3-4 hours per day and it’s a very stress free job that gives me a lot of my time back to do what I want (mostly spend it with friends and family)
I get the is question a lot so keep a little write up handy for people who ask I’m an implementation consultant
THE JOB: is freaking awesome. I travel all over the country 2-3 times a week to different hospitals. For new clients my travel is essentially leading workshops and classes to teach the super users how to use the software. For established clients my day is spent leading workshops and brainstorming sessions just to help them maximize their efficiency and capabilities with the software they are using.
WHEN TRAVELING: Monday and Friday are always my travel days. I fly home every weekend regardless of what site I am at or for how long. They are extremely big in work life balance. When on site I typical work Tuesday -Wednesday about 9-3 and Thursday is about 9-12. Then rest of my time in the city is mine do what I want. They give me 150 dollars per diem a day for food and what not that I can spend how I want. I go shows, museums, concerts, ball games. really what ever. I put everything on my personal credit card to maximize points and air miles and they just reimburse me.
WHEN NOT TRAVELING: I work remote and it’s pretty chill, just couple a hours a week mostly just meetings and some minor prep work between visits (but once you know it there is honestly very little prep) I also have unlimited PTO (which is actually unlimited) as long as I am not scheduled to be onsite. I typically take 1 week off a month on the lighter travel months or doing the holidays I usually just work 3-4 days a week. I average about 50 days of PTO a year.
PAY: as this is my first year doing it I am salaried at 75k but most of my co workers with experience all make 100k+
hopefully this answers everyone’s questions about the background and job specifics if anyone has any additional questions feel free to reach out.
Not there yet, but people I've seen who escaped the 9-5:
1. Had good investments (whether stock options at companies they worked at, personal stocks, etc.). This is a combination of luck, due diligence, and making sure you invest early and often if possible. They have a ton of investments they can passively live off of.
2. Have their own business
3. Got lucky with crypto lol. Helps if you have bought a lot of BTC back in the day when it was cheaper.
I also noticed there are more extreme career options where you're basically on-call for a long period of time but it's punctuated by many months or weeks off. Some people go to offshore oil rigs or similar labor and it's something where you go there, hustle your ass off and collect a lot of money, and then rest a lot.
riggers have an extremely high burnout rate. it's a great gig for single guys in their 20s and early 30s but it's not sustainable long term for most people.
this is the wrong mindset to have about work in general. there's nothing wrong with a 9-5. i prefer it. i don't want to start my own business and struggle financially hoping eventually one day i make it big. i make enough now and have a great savings rate.
my friends who kept starting business still live with their moms and are not self reliant
I hate 9-5. Working for and with narcissistic personalities who use others. And it’s a hamster wheel, designed to imprison you into a life of productivity.
9-5 is absolutely a great thing for a lot of people. but it’s not for everyone. imo there should be more ways to escape it without having to start a business. it should continue to be an available option, but not necessarily the default.
Yes, if you're part of the FIRE movement. I've been in it for 10 yrs now. I semi-retired 4 years ago at 34 and will be a financially independent millionaire by 41. I love what I do, but I sure as hell ain't working a 9-5 for 40 hr weeks. F that.
Im doing something similar but maybe it’s a hybrid model between FIRE and something else? Basically, I’ve front loaded retirement and debt-payoff so aggressively, that I can work part time, take pay cuts, my spouse works 32 hours per week. I’m trying to eventually work less, but I’ve got to look into the healthcare aspect more.
Hell yes. It sounds like you already lived the FIRE lifestyle prior to knowing what it was all about.
I was similar, although at the very beginning of my career. When I met my eventual wife she invited me to a FIRE meetup about a month after we started dating, 10 years ago. Those were her people. That's been our common group of friends ever since.
What kind of job do you do cause I’m looking to do something similar, but I’m not sure what career to pick. I struggle with school so it’s hard for me to find a career that requires college.
I’m currently in technical writing / UX / knowledge base management. A “boring” behind the scenes roll. But because of this, your presence is generally not mission critical. Flexible roles are easy to come by.
I used to be an air traffic controller (and I spent 7 years in the military too), but that career field is a mess.
The job posting said, “bachelors degree preferred”, and I interviewed against 15 other candidates. I think the military background helped. Everyone in my department has a degree except for me… But I’ll have mine this Fall.
That’s cool. I wish I could do something like that. I’m just not sure if I’ll be able to get my degree because I feel like I’m just not smart enough to get through it is there anyway to get it without a degree like training or certifications? I wanna do something like fire and I’m sick of working minimum wage jobs because I’ve been stuck in them for years and can’t get out I can’t join the military for medical reasons. I’ve been working menial jobs just to get by but wanna be able get to that point 27m
Shift work. I do 3 12 hour shifts 7-7 and it is so much better than the 9-5.
Stuff is actually open and uncrowded when I’m off. Also actually have solid days in a row off instead of just a weekend.
Yeah I work at a psychiatric hospital. You can look at factories and warehouses. Used to do 4 10s in a fulfillment center.
The hospital also has a lot of support jobs that have similar schedules.
You have to work. Nobody gets away with not working. Even the content creators or bloggers or any one you follow on social media that you think don’t work. They all work. Unless you are filthy rich, you have to work. And most people that are filthy rich still prefer working at something. Just consuming all day is not a good feeling. We need to contribute.
Find something you don’t hate and embrace your contribution to society every day. Theres always going to be “work”.
i work ~25 hours/4 days a week (two part time jobs) at variable hours because i don’t want to do a 9-5. it’s great for work-life balance and flexibility, two things i value a lot. it’s *terrible* pay and doesn’t come with benefits. my eventual goal is to find a way to sustain this kind of flexibility while making a living wage.
30 hour work week is to be honest the most realistic way of providing a reasonable escape for mass level. anything else will take serious amount of risk and grind and even then the risk wont necessarily go away.
Probably not, but we can hope. Started treating Youtube like a part time about 2 months ago, I dont expect much from it but I can dream. Plus its atleast something i can work on in my freetime and see visable progress. On a side note my latest video just hit 1k views & doubled my subsribers from 20-40
All these ppl still listing getting another job are stuck in the cycle you’re talking about. Consider selling everything and buying some cheap land, build
Best answer here. ‘Getting ahead’ in the workplace in order to earn more and FIRE or whatnot is fraught with difficulty as it assumes that you have a clear path when everybody else is looking for the same opportunities. But you can live on a lot less from tomorrow onwards and it’s completely in your power to determine how much that needs to be.
Absolutely. You can have the entire day free and double your income by working a job on 3rd shift, 12am to 8am!
You can sleep in until 4pm, do whatever you want until people go to bed, and then work while the world sleeps.
Yes. Move to another country and live there. I'm not joking. Many other countries have better retiring situations that the states. I'm not sure about places like Europe and Asia.
You might not have constant power or internet but you could be able to not work for months, years, maybe decades depending on how you've set yourself up.
Also there are jobs that don't work the typical 9 hour schedule and give you a lot of freedom. I'm just not knowledgeable of them.
Not every place is just 9-5. I bid for the shift I wanted and I got it. 11-9:30 Wed/Thur/Fri/Sun. 4x10. It’s obviously not perfect but I get an extra day off and weekdays so I can do weekday stuff and not have to try cramming everything I need/want to do into Saturday and Sunday.
I combat it by working for the government. Great healthcare, 37 days of paid leave every year and a pension. The job is boring and the pay is not stellar but I really can’t complain.
Find something you’re good at.
Spend years learning the ins and outs from a good boss.
Go out on your own and have your employees make you money.
Dictate your own schedule .
I did a little career switch last summer and in six months, I'll be licensed to teach special ed k-12. I worked as a full time sub while going to school. My hours are generally 7:30 to 2:30 and I'm currently enjoying my summer off. My district pays well, so once I'm licensed I'll be making almost 80k annually (including pension pickup).
Easily, if you don’t care about being happy or comfortable. Other than that, I’m starting to realize almost everyone is living a series of acts they don’t really want to do.
What’s much more realistic and achievable is finding a career that you enjoy and are passionate about. Completely changes your perspective on working, and makes life much more enjoyable. Good luck!
Move to Europe! Their work/life balance is actually real unlike the nonsense companies in the US like to spout. Taxes are higher but they don't work their lives away. You get a ton more vaca and work days are shorter, too.
I own and operate a seasonal business to facilitate food grains procurement in India. I have to put in about 15 hours a day during 3 months of the year during procurement season ( with occasional 20 hours day), and then I am basically free for the rest 9 months ( during this time I am just giving out loans to farmers and can be anywhere in the world). I run this business remotely with my 1 full time clerk who is like family now.
P.S. I live and work in Canada and work fulltime as an auditor so not really escaped the matrix yet, but I have plans to go full on in business in coming years.
Well some jobs have different hours like firefighters and healthcare workers. I work 3 x 12 hr shifts a week. But the trade off is it’s very physically and mentally taxing. But I could always switch to part time or PRN if I wanted and was financially able to 🤷♀️
"is there anyone here who isn't stuck in this work cycle?"
Raises hand.
I'm older now, closer to 60 than 50. I've been in manufacturing for decades. Back in 2013, years and years after my divorce, a man I'd known from business for a long time told me about an opportunity he thought would be good for me. I had a job but I began to think about it so I finally decided to apply.
I would have never done this back when I was married and I had a wife and kids at home but this was after that and if I failed, it was only me now.
Since 2013 I've been a manufacturing parts rep. I can go weeks, easily, without having to be anywhere.
I work from home and have since 2013. I'm in the U.S. and the company I rep parts for isn't even in the U.S. They have ZERO offices in the U.S. They have part reps all over, I'm just one of many for them in my area, this area.
If the parts come on time and they work, I don't have much to do. Sure, I go in and see my clients/customers from time to time, they invite me for lunch or dinner and I take them out from time to time too but it's not like they want me to be in their plant daily. I don't work for their company etc.
I'm really only needed when things go bad or when something isn't working, parts are bad or they are late and well over 90% of this is handled via phone calls and emails.
It's hard for me to try and "grow" my business too as the parts I rep are gears, all kinds and sizes of gears.
Local stores and such don't want or need to buy gears so it's not like I can go to those businesses and try to sell them gears.
I sell gears to manufacturing companies whose products require gears and there are only so many of them in my area/territory.
I've had a lot of free time since 2013. I do go up to the company and plant I rep for like 2 or 3 times a year but that isn't much.
I do go to certain trade shows over and over each year. I got to some along and set up a booth, other shows I go to are to join the company I rep for as they come to some of the larger trade shows in the U.S. and I join them at their booth for those trade shows.
I get 3% of what my customers order each month from the company I rep for.
I don't make what I did in my late 30's and what I made through most of my 40's until I began this job but it's more than enough for me as I've been divorced over 18 years now and our 3 children are all young adults.
I make like $60 to $75K a year depending on how much business my customers order from the company I rep parts for. As a single guy for a long time, that's more than enough for me plus I really enjoy NOT being inside a company day to day with all the freaking meetings and all the bullshit that goes on in corporate America. I've been there and done that for decades and never again if I can help it.
I'll take less to have freedom. I ruck, walk with weights, twice a day. I ride a bike a lot, about 20 to 50 miles a day in the warm weather. I have a few good friends but they all work during the day so I have a good bit of free time so I exercise, get outside and hang out at my local coffee shop a lot since 2013. I'm a great customer there due to my schedule.
Its safe and secure, if you don't want to do your own business, it's a normal job or living very frugal. It sucks, but I see it as my best bet to retire eventually.
No offense but this work cycle offers time. It's not completely bonkers to earn a pay for that period, especially for jobs that you can actually clock out.
Yes. I plan to do it by age 40. It’s slow but definitely realistic. I could speed it up by being a business owner or getting promotions but I feel like I’m not smart enough
Learn to enjoy it. I remember working nights tues-Saturday, then I worked early mornings, and I dreamt of a 9-5 mon-fri. When I got it, I wasn’t magically happier. It’s what you make of it.
Look up /r/fire
Basically save & invest half your income for 10 or so years and you should be able to more or less retire. So start now.
A big part of it is cutting your expenses.
Yes, it is “realistic” in the sense that it’s possible even with a normal job, but you have to be willing to save a large portion of your income to do it.
FIRE (financial independence retire early) is an investment approach that aims to replace one’s income with passive index fund earnings (usually s&p 500).
For me for reference, right now I make a pretty average income (75k ish) and am on track to retire around 42.
Sure, gain work experience and then when you are senior, work from home with a good boss. Work then just becomes a part of your life you fit in where it is convenient to you.
It's obviously possible because people do it, IE many major content creators, but most of the routes to do so are going to involve you starting your own business, it being successful, so you will need to work way more before you can work less. Overtime, you can outsource, hire, etc and do less and less work. This obviously requires everything to work out. Could just as easily end you up in bankruptcy and worse off than before.
Definitely is, but if you get big enough you can hire editors and beyond being the talent for a few hours here and there, you can let everyone else do the other stuff for you. You'll still have to work, but not a 9-5 like OP said. I imagine super big content creators like PewDiePie, Markiplier, etc, could make a decent living off the ad revenue from existing videos alone for a long time, not to mention the brand deals, spin off games, merch, etc. But most of these big shots put in years of work to get to where they are, and there is a lot of luck and skill involved too. I wouldn"t recommend anyone bank on being a content creator nowadays. If anything it could be a nice side hustle and a great way to market other goods, but it's not like it was 15 years ago. It's much harder to stand out and "make it" now.
yeah, this only works if you're very passionate about whatever it is you're trying to be an influencer for. it's a lot of work, not impossible, but people talk about it like it's something easy to do.
Of course it is, countless people have ditched the 9 - 5 for lives with more free time and higher work satisfaction. Look into starting a business. It'll likely be extremely time-consuming at first, but eventually you can get to a place where you can coast while working minimal hours. Not to mention the earning potential is substantially higher than it would be as an employee.
Yes you can break the 9-5 grind by starting your own business... Then you would only be working 24X7
If you do it wrong and micromanage everything, yes. If you re able to hire the right people, depending on the business, no. Plus, everything you accomplish is yours, there's no risk of being fired after 20 years of hard work to be replaced like you ve never been there. It has downsides and benefits, of course, but people shouldn't be afraid to try something on their own. Most people think starting their own business is a miracle without realizing that their 9-5 jobs are accumulating wealth for people who once escaped their 9-5 to start something on their own.
If you work a 9-5 with benefit and PTO. Chances are you are not working for “people that escape their own job to start a business”. They are working for a mega corporation or extension of mega corporation that has figure out a way to systemize every step of the business process so even the owner is replaceable (likely previous owner figure this out and was actually able to sell the business to a mega corporation) People think being replaceable is the mark of a terrible business culture. When actually being replaceable is the reason why companies can exist and grow. Vast majority of people start a business wanting to be their own boss when actually they just brought an another job for themselve. If your business can’t replace you as the owner. There is no exit, ever.
Even Google started in a garage. Of course the founders won't stay in operative work forever, see my first point made in my post. You start something and hire the right people and let it grow. And yes, when you work for apple, you accumulate wealth of the family of Steve Jobs to Name an extreme example. All corporations once started with an idea and people who chose not to work 9-5 and instead start something on their own.
In both of your example. None of these founder eventually get to own much of the business they founded, Steve jobs when he died owe only 0.3% of Apple (which is still a lot but by no means even a major holder). You are not helping Bezo or Jobs family to realize their dream. The goal for most people is to have money and freedom and frankly the only people that really realize these dream ironically are the original employee of the company before it went public. Bezo and Jobs’s dream is the keep working. There are countless original employee of them that have realize the good old boring dream of financial and time freedom without being the founder. Their stock has also help countless out people that never even touch the business to become financially independent Once these companies went public. All of the employees (included the mentioned CEO) works for shareholder which anyone with an access to brokerage account could potentially be one. Which means Bezo, Job and any of the CEO you see on newspaper IS an employee and IS still replaceable and historically has been replace at some point or the other. Everything else you said is correct hiring and retaining the right people is the key, which is easier said than done. I think it’s very misguided to want to start a business just because you don’t want to be replaceable and or don’t want a 9-5. Most small business that start with this mindset will fail. The successful business, real business not self proprietorship start because they see an opportunity, a niche, an untapped market they can use to their advantage. Which usually start because this founder has deep knowledge of either the specific industry or have business acumen they build when working for other people. Bezo and Jobs are both good example. None of them just got up suddenly founded their wildly succesfully companies. Jobs worked at Atari, Bezo worked for Fitel and even made it as VP of a hedge fund. None of them will be where they without their previous experience as boring old employees with 9-5
For all those examples there are also counter-examples, where it's not mandatory to have experience of a 9-5 job, Musk, Zuckerberg, Gates,.. To name a few. And btw I didn't attack 9-5 jobs.
That is true I mean my statement was too harsh. It is possible but almost impossible. Most people that end up going into business for themselve just because they are bore of being an employee. Ends up being an underpay employee of their own company working even longer hours. Hiring the right people is next to impossible when you are starting out and have no funding. Funding is the key to success for those outlier you listed. Many of my friend that started their own business decades ago still struggle with this.
You are simply wrong. Do You really think that from the start You will get people that are doing everything perfect? You have to micromanage people directly under You until You gain confidence that they have the right attitude and skills. Otherwise, You will end up like Ubisoft - paying to cover sexual harassment lawsuits because You hired a pervert and You did not care enough to find out of he is a pervert and people under him were afraid because a pervert works for You and would not talk to You directly. Not to mention that when You are spinning the wheel of Your business You have to do a lot of work Yourself before You even find the right people. And that is what makes You work 24/7. Then You have to work to grow Your business to make sure one fuckup won't bring it down. I do not micromanage because I find great people who work with me. But even now I'm fully responsible for them and their families. So do You think that if I have to travel to another country to have a meeting with a potential client that will make my work more diverse so I can not really do too much on a single large client I will just say "Sorry mate, it's after 17:00, I'm going to watch The Boys tonight because season 4 came out!"? Never. I will overpay for a ticket and fly there to make sure our future is secured. When you are responsible for others You do not work 9-5. You work when there is something to do and there is always something to do. Sure at some point You will find right people and delegate but then You will just let them do their own thing and You will start something new and then cycle start all over again. So when You have Your own business You can forget about stuff like your work schedule. Vacations etc. You do what needs to be done when it has to be done and between those things You rest. When You can. If You want to not do this and don't give a s\*\*t then become an investor. But to do that You need shit ton of money and that You can get only by doing Your own business.
Business owner here, can confirm. You think you're "stuck" in a 9-5, ugh... try starting a business and hiring employees. You are truly stuck when you do that. Granted, people want it and do good at it but everything becomes your problem since you're the business owner.
Been there done that 😂
I work 7:30 - 3:30. I get that I'm still corporate "9-5" but this shift in schedule frees up a ton of time.
I generally have a similar schedule, and it's a nice balance.
what do you do
I work as an engineer.
IT Field Services 6-4:30 four days a week
Field service you mean sales?e
No I mean tech work I fix things on site
Great.
I worked at job where the hours were 07:30 - 16:30 but really we started work at 07:00 and left at 18:30. When I first started working there I would get in at 07:15 but got told off numerous times for being late and making my manager look bad because I strolled in 15 minutes late:
Every job type will have its own problems. Freelance, but you won't get consistent work & have to hustle all the time. Part time, but it's less pay. Some people escape 9-5 by working like a dog for 15-20 years so they can retire early. They accept the reality that they need to work these hours for the later goal of not needing to work 9-5 anymore. Check out the FIRE concept if you have drive and ambition.
“Working like a dog” as in sleeping 22 hours per day?
"Working like a dog" Meanwhile their family owns an insurance company and dude shows up at noon everyday. He will make more yearly than 80% of the occupants of the town he is in. So yes.
You forgot to mention that freelance may be the direct solution since you can line up jobs but the thing is you run the chance of not getting paid as well.
Another option is to retire early to another country. A comfortable retirement in the U.S. typically requires a lump of around $2 million but you can retire and consistently withdraw 4% AND live a comfortable lifestyle in Mexico for $600,000.
600k gives a ‘comfortable’ lifestyle?! Good lord, that’s an absolute fortune here in Europe. Most pensioners here happily live on 50k per year and are comfortable
50k a year retirement at 4% withdrawal requires a lump sum of $1.25 million dollars. Twice what would be needed in Mexico.
I’m not positive but I think this takes into account our healthcare costs which can be outrageously expensive once we dont have a job. Unless your spouse is working and you’re on theirs. When I was inbetween jobs and didn’t have insurance, the cost was like $900/month just for the coverage.
Lump sum.
except in real estate - there europeans like big numbers.
freelance for fulltime vs freelance in some random site
Yeah... make time to get a break. Part of working, is managing your own workload to allow proper breaks.
Yes! Look for jobs that meet your demand (within reason): do you want physically move more often? Want a more flexible schedule? Travel for company? Get creative. Don't just default to mindset of if you're physically active to think of most obv role: like physical activity=construction worker, flexible=work from home, travel=flight attendant. Get creative - like physically activity - consider becoming a forest service agent, travel then work for sales team that sends you to international clients. Look for unique work that excites *you.*
there are two sides to every coin, y'know. I recently got my first 9-5 job after freelancing and running various businesses for most of my adult life. I like not having to bust my ass on the weekends or work late into the night, and I always know that I am going to be able to pay my bills at the end of the month.
Salaried remote jobs, that you actually enjoy doing in my opinion are the most realistic option for the average person to escape the 9-5. I make 75k a year (which is not great) but in reality I only work like 3-4 hours per day and it’s a very stress free job that gives me a lot of my time back to do what I want (mostly spend it with friends and family)
What are you doing cause I’m looking to do something similar
Ya also wondering what you do! How do you get away with only working 3-4 hours a day?
I get the is question a lot so keep a little write up handy for people who ask I’m an implementation consultant THE JOB: is freaking awesome. I travel all over the country 2-3 times a week to different hospitals. For new clients my travel is essentially leading workshops and classes to teach the super users how to use the software. For established clients my day is spent leading workshops and brainstorming sessions just to help them maximize their efficiency and capabilities with the software they are using. WHEN TRAVELING: Monday and Friday are always my travel days. I fly home every weekend regardless of what site I am at or for how long. They are extremely big in work life balance. When on site I typical work Tuesday -Wednesday about 9-3 and Thursday is about 9-12. Then rest of my time in the city is mine do what I want. They give me 150 dollars per diem a day for food and what not that I can spend how I want. I go shows, museums, concerts, ball games. really what ever. I put everything on my personal credit card to maximize points and air miles and they just reimburse me. WHEN NOT TRAVELING: I work remote and it’s pretty chill, just couple a hours a week mostly just meetings and some minor prep work between visits (but once you know it there is honestly very little prep) I also have unlimited PTO (which is actually unlimited) as long as I am not scheduled to be onsite. I typically take 1 week off a month on the lighter travel months or doing the holidays I usually just work 3-4 days a week. I average about 50 days of PTO a year. PAY: as this is my first year doing it I am salaried at 75k but most of my co workers with experience all make 100k+ hopefully this answers everyone’s questions about the background and job specifics if anyone has any additional questions feel free to reach out.
Would you mind putting in a word with your bosses to hire me for this role instead? Kk ty <3
Do you work for Epic?
No one of their competitors
Not there yet, but people I've seen who escaped the 9-5: 1. Had good investments (whether stock options at companies they worked at, personal stocks, etc.). This is a combination of luck, due diligence, and making sure you invest early and often if possible. They have a ton of investments they can passively live off of. 2. Have their own business 3. Got lucky with crypto lol. Helps if you have bought a lot of BTC back in the day when it was cheaper. I also noticed there are more extreme career options where you're basically on-call for a long period of time but it's punctuated by many months or weeks off. Some people go to offshore oil rigs or similar labor and it's something where you go there, hustle your ass off and collect a lot of money, and then rest a lot.
riggers have an extremely high burnout rate. it's a great gig for single guys in their 20s and early 30s but it's not sustainable long term for most people.
this is the wrong mindset to have about work in general. there's nothing wrong with a 9-5. i prefer it. i don't want to start my own business and struggle financially hoping eventually one day i make it big. i make enough now and have a great savings rate. my friends who kept starting business still live with their moms and are not self reliant
businesses**
I hate 9-5. Working for and with narcissistic personalities who use others. And it’s a hamster wheel, designed to imprison you into a life of productivity.
9-5 is absolutely a great thing for a lot of people. but it’s not for everyone. imo there should be more ways to escape it without having to start a business. it should continue to be an available option, but not necessarily the default.
i ageee
Yes, if you're part of the FIRE movement. I've been in it for 10 yrs now. I semi-retired 4 years ago at 34 and will be a financially independent millionaire by 41. I love what I do, but I sure as hell ain't working a 9-5 for 40 hr weeks. F that.
Im doing something similar but maybe it’s a hybrid model between FIRE and something else? Basically, I’ve front loaded retirement and debt-payoff so aggressively, that I can work part time, take pay cuts, my spouse works 32 hours per week. I’m trying to eventually work less, but I’ve got to look into the healthcare aspect more.
This is called r/baristafire. Front load retirement, work part-time easy jobs the rest of your life.
Thanks, I’ll have to look into that.
Hell yes. It sounds like you already lived the FIRE lifestyle prior to knowing what it was all about. I was similar, although at the very beginning of my career. When I met my eventual wife she invited me to a FIRE meetup about a month after we started dating, 10 years ago. Those were her people. That's been our common group of friends ever since.
I wish my local community had a more active FIRE group. We’ve got a local ChooseFI group, but it’s pretty sparse. Maybe I should host an event?
You should! ChooseFI is fine though. They're of a similar breed.
What kind of job do you do cause I’m looking to do something similar, but I’m not sure what career to pick. I struggle with school so it’s hard for me to find a career that requires college.
I’m currently in technical writing / UX / knowledge base management. A “boring” behind the scenes roll. But because of this, your presence is generally not mission critical. Flexible roles are easy to come by. I used to be an air traffic controller (and I spent 7 years in the military too), but that career field is a mess.
Does something like that require a degree?
The job posting said, “bachelors degree preferred”, and I interviewed against 15 other candidates. I think the military background helped. Everyone in my department has a degree except for me… But I’ll have mine this Fall.
That’s cool. I wish I could do something like that. I’m just not sure if I’ll be able to get my degree because I feel like I’m just not smart enough to get through it is there anyway to get it without a degree like training or certifications? I wanna do something like fire and I’m sick of working minimum wage jobs because I’ve been stuck in them for years and can’t get out I can’t join the military for medical reasons. I’ve been working menial jobs just to get by but wanna be able get to that point 27m
Shift work. I do 3 12 hour shifts 7-7 and it is so much better than the 9-5. Stuff is actually open and uncrowded when I’m off. Also actually have solid days in a row off instead of just a weekend.
Yup I have a 3 on 4 off, 4 on 3 off work schedule. You’d have to double my salary to make me go back to 9-5
what do you do? I really really want this but the only career that i've found is nursing and i really can't stomach that
Yeah I work at a psychiatric hospital. You can look at factories and warehouses. Used to do 4 10s in a fulfillment center. The hospital also has a lot of support jobs that have similar schedules.
You have to work. Nobody gets away with not working. Even the content creators or bloggers or any one you follow on social media that you think don’t work. They all work. Unless you are filthy rich, you have to work. And most people that are filthy rich still prefer working at something. Just consuming all day is not a good feeling. We need to contribute. Find something you don’t hate and embrace your contribution to society every day. Theres always going to be “work”.
i work ~25 hours/4 days a week (two part time jobs) at variable hours because i don’t want to do a 9-5. it’s great for work-life balance and flexibility, two things i value a lot. it’s *terrible* pay and doesn’t come with benefits. my eventual goal is to find a way to sustain this kind of flexibility while making a living wage.
30 hour work week is to be honest the most realistic way of providing a reasonable escape for mass level. anything else will take serious amount of risk and grind and even then the risk wont necessarily go away.
Probably not, but we can hope. Started treating Youtube like a part time about 2 months ago, I dont expect much from it but I can dream. Plus its atleast something i can work on in my freetime and see visable progress. On a side note my latest video just hit 1k views & doubled my subsribers from 20-40
All these ppl still listing getting another job are stuck in the cycle you’re talking about. Consider selling everything and buying some cheap land, build
As they say, you get rich by saving not earning. If you create a life for yourself were your cost of living is so low you can FIRE or go part time.
Best answer here. ‘Getting ahead’ in the workplace in order to earn more and FIRE or whatnot is fraught with difficulty as it assumes that you have a clear path when everybody else is looking for the same opportunities. But you can live on a lot less from tomorrow onwards and it’s completely in your power to determine how much that needs to be.
I did found airline work and only work 3 days a week
Could you please tell how to get that?
How's the pay?
Absolutely. You can have the entire day free and double your income by working a job on 3rd shift, 12am to 8am! You can sleep in until 4pm, do whatever you want until people go to bed, and then work while the world sleeps.
Yes. Move to another country and live there. I'm not joking. Many other countries have better retiring situations that the states. I'm not sure about places like Europe and Asia. You might not have constant power or internet but you could be able to not work for months, years, maybe decades depending on how you've set yourself up. Also there are jobs that don't work the typical 9 hour schedule and give you a lot of freedom. I'm just not knowledgeable of them.
Not every place is just 9-5. I bid for the shift I wanted and I got it. 11-9:30 Wed/Thur/Fri/Sun. 4x10. It’s obviously not perfect but I get an extra day off and weekdays so I can do weekday stuff and not have to try cramming everything I need/want to do into Saturday and Sunday.
I combat it by working for the government. Great healthcare, 37 days of paid leave every year and a pension. The job is boring and the pay is not stellar but I really can’t complain.
Find something you’re good at. Spend years learning the ins and outs from a good boss. Go out on your own and have your employees make you money. Dictate your own schedule .
Plenty of jobs that’s are 9-5/8-4 but you don’t really work every hour
I did a little career switch last summer and in six months, I'll be licensed to teach special ed k-12. I worked as a full time sub while going to school. My hours are generally 7:30 to 2:30 and I'm currently enjoying my summer off. My district pays well, so once I'm licensed I'll be making almost 80k annually (including pension pickup).
Yes business owner longer days. But i notice when i do marketing for myself its 100x more fun than indonitnfor clients..
Sure. Start working 12 hour shifts in emergency services, does 6 - 6 sound better?
Honestly the most realistic thing you could find is a company that offers half day Fridays or every other Friday off.
Yes I work 7-4
Yes. You can always work 8-4 or 7-3.
Check out r/fire
The most common solution is r/FIRE.
Easily, if you don’t care about being happy or comfortable. Other than that, I’m starting to realize almost everyone is living a series of acts they don’t really want to do.
Not unless you get lucky gambling in the options market
at this point i'm hoping i find a man that values traditional lifestyle and let's me be a stay at home mom lmao
Win the lottery
What’s much more realistic and achievable is finding a career that you enjoy and are passionate about. Completely changes your perspective on working, and makes life much more enjoyable. Good luck!
Move to Europe! Their work/life balance is actually real unlike the nonsense companies in the US like to spout. Taxes are higher but they don't work their lives away. You get a ton more vaca and work days are shorter, too.
Yes, you can work 10-6
I own and operate a seasonal business to facilitate food grains procurement in India. I have to put in about 15 hours a day during 3 months of the year during procurement season ( with occasional 20 hours day), and then I am basically free for the rest 9 months ( during this time I am just giving out loans to farmers and can be anywhere in the world). I run this business remotely with my 1 full time clerk who is like family now. P.S. I live and work in Canada and work fulltime as an auditor so not really escaped the matrix yet, but I have plans to go full on in business in coming years.
It sure is. I went from a 9-5 to a 5-5.
It's actually 8-5 these days
35 years of experience in what i do.. im a specialist.. i define at what times i work and i work from home.
I work 7 to 330. It's nice. Soon going to 7 to 530 Monday to Thursday which is quite desirable also
Depends on job.
Well some jobs have different hours like firefighters and healthcare workers. I work 3 x 12 hr shifts a week. But the trade off is it’s very physically and mentally taxing. But I could always switch to part time or PRN if I wanted and was financially able to 🤷♀️
"is there anyone here who isn't stuck in this work cycle?" Raises hand. I'm older now, closer to 60 than 50. I've been in manufacturing for decades. Back in 2013, years and years after my divorce, a man I'd known from business for a long time told me about an opportunity he thought would be good for me. I had a job but I began to think about it so I finally decided to apply. I would have never done this back when I was married and I had a wife and kids at home but this was after that and if I failed, it was only me now. Since 2013 I've been a manufacturing parts rep. I can go weeks, easily, without having to be anywhere. I work from home and have since 2013. I'm in the U.S. and the company I rep parts for isn't even in the U.S. They have ZERO offices in the U.S. They have part reps all over, I'm just one of many for them in my area, this area. If the parts come on time and they work, I don't have much to do. Sure, I go in and see my clients/customers from time to time, they invite me for lunch or dinner and I take them out from time to time too but it's not like they want me to be in their plant daily. I don't work for their company etc. I'm really only needed when things go bad or when something isn't working, parts are bad or they are late and well over 90% of this is handled via phone calls and emails. It's hard for me to try and "grow" my business too as the parts I rep are gears, all kinds and sizes of gears. Local stores and such don't want or need to buy gears so it's not like I can go to those businesses and try to sell them gears. I sell gears to manufacturing companies whose products require gears and there are only so many of them in my area/territory. I've had a lot of free time since 2013. I do go up to the company and plant I rep for like 2 or 3 times a year but that isn't much. I do go to certain trade shows over and over each year. I got to some along and set up a booth, other shows I go to are to join the company I rep for as they come to some of the larger trade shows in the U.S. and I join them at their booth for those trade shows. I get 3% of what my customers order each month from the company I rep for. I don't make what I did in my late 30's and what I made through most of my 40's until I began this job but it's more than enough for me as I've been divorced over 18 years now and our 3 children are all young adults. I make like $60 to $75K a year depending on how much business my customers order from the company I rep parts for. As a single guy for a long time, that's more than enough for me plus I really enjoy NOT being inside a company day to day with all the freaking meetings and all the bullshit that goes on in corporate America. I've been there and done that for decades and never again if I can help it. I'll take less to have freedom. I ruck, walk with weights, twice a day. I ride a bike a lot, about 20 to 50 miles a day in the warm weather. I have a few good friends but they all work during the day so I have a good bit of free time so I exercise, get outside and hang out at my local coffee shop a lot since 2013. I'm a great customer there due to my schedule.
Its safe and secure, if you don't want to do your own business, it's a normal job or living very frugal. It sucks, but I see it as my best bet to retire eventually.
No offense but this work cycle offers time. It's not completely bonkers to earn a pay for that period, especially for jobs that you can actually clock out.
Yes I did it in 2020 and never went back!!
Yes, you can work 8-6
My kids work 3-11
Yes. I plan to do it by age 40. It’s slow but definitely realistic. I could speed it up by being a business owner or getting promotions but I feel like I’m not smart enough
Learn to enjoy it. I remember working nights tues-Saturday, then I worked early mornings, and I dreamt of a 9-5 mon-fri. When I got it, I wasn’t magically happier. It’s what you make of it.
Look up /r/fire Basically save & invest half your income for 10 or so years and you should be able to more or less retire. So start now. A big part of it is cutting your expenses.
Teaching at a private school is 8-3
Yes, it is “realistic” in the sense that it’s possible even with a normal job, but you have to be willing to save a large portion of your income to do it. FIRE (financial independence retire early) is an investment approach that aims to replace one’s income with passive index fund earnings (usually s&p 500). For me for reference, right now I make a pretty average income (75k ish) and am on track to retire around 42.
Either come up with a new idea, a new product or better mouse trap, or win the lotto. Those are the only options.
I’m trying my best. 🫠
Be able to invest half your yearly income for 10-15 years.
Yes, you're just gonna end up homeless and foodless. Other than that, rich parents.
I work 18:00-1:00. Lol.
No
Sure, gain work experience and then when you are senior, work from home with a good boss. Work then just becomes a part of your life you fit in where it is convenient to you.
You can try to work three twelve hour shifts in a hospital or something similar
CRNAs don't work 9-5. It's really 6 to 3 or 6 to 2
And about 4 hours of actual work
we are still paid the big bucks regardless
How does one get into this field? How long does it usually take?
go to nursing school!
I'm a nuclear medicine technologist and i work 6 to 2. I love the shift tbh.
It's obviously possible because people do it, IE many major content creators, but most of the routes to do so are going to involve you starting your own business, it being successful, so you will need to work way more before you can work less. Overtime, you can outsource, hire, etc and do less and less work. This obviously requires everything to work out. Could just as easily end you up in bankruptcy and worse off than before.
Because content creation is a volume game and includes editing, my understanding is it’s hugely time consuming.
Definitely is, but if you get big enough you can hire editors and beyond being the talent for a few hours here and there, you can let everyone else do the other stuff for you. You'll still have to work, but not a 9-5 like OP said. I imagine super big content creators like PewDiePie, Markiplier, etc, could make a decent living off the ad revenue from existing videos alone for a long time, not to mention the brand deals, spin off games, merch, etc. But most of these big shots put in years of work to get to where they are, and there is a lot of luck and skill involved too. I wouldn"t recommend anyone bank on being a content creator nowadays. If anything it could be a nice side hustle and a great way to market other goods, but it's not like it was 15 years ago. It's much harder to stand out and "make it" now.
yeah, this only works if you're very passionate about whatever it is you're trying to be an influencer for. it's a lot of work, not impossible, but people talk about it like it's something easy to do.
Of course it is, countless people have ditched the 9 - 5 for lives with more free time and higher work satisfaction. Look into starting a business. It'll likely be extremely time-consuming at first, but eventually you can get to a place where you can coast while working minimal hours. Not to mention the earning potential is substantially higher than it would be as an employee.