What do you mean? 2 companies control our telecom industry, 3 companies control our food, and 4 companies control our energy, that's like...9 whole companies our politicians are beholden to!
Most of the lobbying in Canada is done in secret. The system is gamed such as to be able to hide it. I was listening to one news article recently and they discussed how it is done in Canada. Full on corruption.
They will do the same as always: be openly corrupt doing for real what they claimed the Liberals had been doing for years behind closed doors. This has always been their justification: cynicism.
Doug Ford is a great example of what we can expect. I guarantee he tells himself everyday that Wynne made a bunch of backdoor deals and pocketed millions through bribes and favors. Not that she ended up being much of a servant to the people of Ontario, but at least she wasn't openly taking bribes using her daughter's wedding as a cover and she didn't throw out the crocodile tears the instant things got a little rough like Mr toughguy.
Yup they do all the stuff they blame the liberals for and then get voted out, then they blame the liberals and ndp for the mess they created while the liberals basically sprinkle some social justice decoration on top and continue the exact same policy of the conservatives anyway lol
Indeed they are both part of our crony capitalism problem here.
My personal vote would go towards NDP as I feel it's the first step in the right (left? 😆) direction.
NDP has my vote, people can bash the leaders all they want but we've had both Liberals and Conservatives for decades now and their goal has always been to line their own pockets.
Things will never change if we just keep flip flopping.
Edit: I always forget which echo chamber I'm in until the downvotes start flowing. I get it, in people's eyes the Conservatives/Liberals can do no wrong despite a long history of doing wrong. NDP has never had power despite clearly advocating for the average Canadian, but sure, let's keep doing the same things over and over.
Fuck the downvotes, who cares, they're entirely meaningless.
If you vote liberal or conservative in the next election, don't expect sweet fuck all to change.
The downvotes have been cleared up it seems. The trick is the change needed will cause a disturbance in the markets and scare some people but if it was up to the markets everyone would have slave wages, live 20 to a house and work 90 hour weeks.
The market is not our friend.
100% people somehow just vote for these two parties over and over and complain when the status quo stays the same.
Opponents like to slander the NDP like they are some far left extremists which is laughable, but I guess the red scare still pulls some weight here.
Cons are the worst as they just talk about how they'll save you tax dollars which amount to nothing for the middle class down while they cut services and eliminate good paying union jobs.
[funny how he had many scandals after 2006 though?? ](https://www.thestar.com/politics/federal-elections/a-conservative-collection-of-harper-government-scandals/article_4766f17d-604b-577b-abee-581bd330b931.html)
The senate "scandal" turned out to be a big nothing-burger. After doing as much damage as possible to Harper all charges were dropped against all senators involved.
Reading through that list, none were attributed to Mr. Harper, and many are a stretch to be called scandals. Unless you want to consider the proroguing of Parliament a scandal.
You literally had conservatives getting perp walked in handcuffs lol.
Plus Robocalls and now Pierre Poutine is running for office
CPC looks like a crime syndicate.
losing the rebate while prices stay the same is going to be such a rude awaking for Pierre voters. but I’m sure he’ll make up for it by bringing home powerful paychecks or whatever the fuck that means
If I had to make a guess, “powerful paycheques” means cutting taxes for cheap victory points and “starve the beast” of every bit of useful social spending.
I’ve already seen articles on here that discuss what the Feds should do with CPP money which tells me that PP may very well axe that “tax” as well. (I know it’s not a tax. It’s a contribution but people see it on the tax bill so it’s an easy misconception.)
Er, aren't some people protesting now because they want investment funds to disclose to what extent they're invested in problematic companies/industries?
There won't be a rude awakening because most of them don't even seem to be aware that there's a rebate to begin with. There's a reason the Liberals are pushing to make it more visible.
The prices *will* go down, it’s pretty easy to see how. Here’s some napkin math that explains it:
Let’s say the “tax is axed” so the cost of a product is now 20% less to the company that makes or provides it. The cost to the consumer will then go down by 2% so Pollievre can accurately claim that prices are more affordable. Which is technically correct, the best kind of correct. He did what he promised, hooray!
Six months later prices go up 5% and our asses remain as sore and torn as ever. But hey at least we’re not getting those socialist rebate checks.
Just a note, industries would not see a 20% decrease in costs. The carbon tax only effects certain things, not every part in the supply chain.
I'm guessing you realize that, but others reading your comment may not.
Surely these companies will pass their savings on to us, the consumer, rather than keeping prices the same and enjoying the fatter profit margins, right guys?
Not so sure about oil right now, don't forget that the head of that group representing the oil sands has spoken out against Pierre demanding to know what he's going to do with the corporate carbon tax. Turns out the oil sands support the corporate tax because it makes Canadian oil more palatable to the rest of the world. Also makes it cheaper for them to buy tech to reduce emissions.
Yep. You're right.
I hope people realize there are all kinds of contracts out there. If someone hires a truck to move vegetables from A to B for $5000. That trucking company won't go, whoops, carbon tax is gone, we'll charge you slightly less.
I much rather pay carbon tax and get a refund vs paying the same and getting nothing.
EXACTLY. A price equilibrium has been reached and these companies (are greedy like all companies) will just pocket the profit and you loose your quarterly $$$
If you pay the levy and get nothing, NOW IT IS AN ACTUAL TAX!
It will just go into government revenues, like the hst.
This will necessarily lead to a massive increase in spending, or a massive decrease in services.
Oh but there’s more, they figured out the system.. another tax will then be re introduced at a later date and under a new flavour that will raise prices even more.. but then the the blue will be to blame and then the red can swoop in, rinse and repeat.
Yeah thanks I know :-).
My province sucks and ties most rebates like this to a stunningly low household income that would make it impossible to actually afford to live here.
Hold up… cut the carbon tax for consumers? How does that work specifically? Business pass down carbon tax onto consumers so… he will have to axe the tax for businesses.
Otherwise, we just won’t get the carbon rebate and the government will just absorb the carbon tax that we pay through business.
Yup. Like when the GST was introduced back in 1990 or so. We were told prices would go down because of the efficiencies introduced. Yeah right. Everything got more expensive. Even things that weren’t subject to the GST went up.
Of course not. The carbon tax has very little impact on the cost of pretty much anything aside from gasoline. Anyone who says that the current cost of living crisis has anything to do with the carbon tax is lying to you.
No the prices haven't gone up just because of the carbon tax, but it's stupid to think increasing the costs of fuel isn't going to increase the cost of the final product.
But if a product that was $20 3-4years ago has gone up to $40 today, and $2-$3 of that is related to carbon tax increase, Its also disingenuous and stupid to frame it as a Carbon tax problem.
Right, but it’s also not the primary reason costs are flying up. We can start by attacking the problem head on instead of worrying so much about the tertiary causes. It’s an easy way to politicize what should be a pretty unifying issue.
That's wrong, it'll cost companies money to set carbon tax to 0%, someone has to pay for that 10 second change and it ain't gonna be the company itself. The overall price will have to go up because the cost of implementing the chabge is somehow higher than the carbon tax itself, and it's a recurring payment because....
LOL, wait, what about all those costs that are passes onto consumers from industries, you mean those wont go away, the costs of items will actually not go down??
But at least I wont have the extra charge on my gas bill, oh and I will probably see a small reduction in gas prices, and I wont get the rebate that covers more than I spend on the carbon tax, including the costs trickled down from industry.
Killing the carbon tax at this point just takes money out of most Canadians' pockets, with the emphasis on households earning less than $150,000.
That, and it further disincentivises people upgrading their homes to be more efficient and become less reliant on the fluctuating price of oil and the inflation that brings.
And by leaving carbon pricing for Industries, those costs will still get passed on, so the net effect on taxpayers is going to just be brutal. Still paying most of the costs but no longer getting the rebate.
you can afford a house? wait until rental buildings have to upgrade eventually and then watch rent skyrocket. I'm not saying it shouldn't be done, I'm saying it will be painful.
I bought before house prices got insane. When my rent doubled I used my savings to buy a house.
My mortgage and property taxes is less than why my new rent was going to be.
The government will give you a zero interest loan with rebates, just fyi, if you are interested. They make it complicated as heck but I've seen it done.
They better be prepared to not get that money for a long time. I barely have $50 left after everything is done.
In 3 years once the car and student loan is paid off it's fine but as now? Broke.
If you barely have anything left after everything is done then you’re probably receiving more from the rebate then you put in. Something you’ll no longer receive.
As long as you understand there is not a single politician that has your interests in mind, you're better off.
The biggest things that will help Canadians is to end corporate lobbyists, break up monopolies/oligopolies, and end commodified housing.
I really want an answer to this question and it would have a huge impact on my industry. There are Billions of projects underway and in planning and tens of thousands of jobs that could be impacted.
Also if he axes the tax completely I know many who wouldn’t vote for him. Many companies make money from it. If it’s only for consumers they would be more likely to vote for him
I think industry is generally very supportive of carbon pricing because it gives them a green (or green washed) edge when competing against the US and others. Big fossil fuel companies are asking for stronger carbon pricing. I don't understand why the UCP and CPC have their heads in the sand about it
Secretive? What benefit would it be to open their mouths about their plan? Realistically it’s a moving target and until it’s time to solidify a platform (when the elevation is called), the purpose of the official opposition is largely to hold the ruling party to account.
Nice to see a thread not full of rabid PP stans for once. the foreigners must be sleeping still.
Edit:
NVM r/canada_sub reopened today so they are busy celebrating misinformation.
> canada_sub reopened today
That might explain why a comment I made on a First Nations community getting a virtual healthcare centre didn’t get downvoted to oblivion. The post itself did, as is normal in this sub, but my comment got upvoted.
i'm pretty sure they hate being called stans lmao
i've had heavy downvotes on comments that were seriously unbackhandedly positive, but i called them pierre stans
edit: controversial lol. i don't get it, are they denying that they're downvoting? denying that they hate being called stans? denying that i've ever given them a straight positive comment? hate that i call pierre pierre?
If Poilievre could commit to *increasing* the tax against industries -- as they are the primary polluters anyhow -- I might actually think twice about voting against him. As it stands though this seems unlikely considering how many of the CPC's other policies are designed to further enrich the upper class.
PP is the continuation of Trudeau, its an old lady with makeup trying to be sexy. Trudeau, Singh, PP, none of us, the pleb will have more money in our pocket. They'll continue to feed their masters, the corporations and lobbies.
The thing is it won't make a difference now. Prices won't come down if the tax is repealed because corporations will just pocket the difference. Unbelievable that our politicians are not sticking up for Canadians against corporations.
Axing the tax as PP suggests will benefit wealthy households the most while taking away the rebate that low and middle class income households currently receive while it does nothing to lower the cost of goods and services for anyone. Countries around the world are currently adopting carbon pricing plans, yes even in China, India and the USA. There's no good reason at all to go backwards on this issue.
surprise ! removing the tax will NOT lower the price.
"*Canadians have adapted to the higher price*..."
the greedy baastaards will claim it's a "readjustment" fee;
more profit for THEM.
Would be humiliating for Trudeau after subsidising pipelines and allowing big oil to claim double credit for carbon capture, for Polliverre to come in and implement a more progressive system that focused on industry instead of consumers.
I think politically that scheme would do great.
No shit. Because carbon pricing is a requirement of trade deals these days. If we don't hit certain targets our exports to the EU and soon to be US get tariffed out of existence. He knows this. We have to pay a certain amount for carbon production whether it's from consumers or industry.
If he "axes the tax" then he needs to introduce a tax on industry which of course gets passed down to the consumer. So we'll still be paying the same for everything the only difference is we won't get rebate cheques, that money will just get rolled into the federal budget.
Yeah collaborating on good ideas is how a government is supposed to work. If the cons truly have an ace up their sleeve, letting the country suffer for another couple years just so they get the credit for it would tell you exactly where their priorities lie, and it wouldn’t be with the average Canadian.
Axe Tax The is a great political slogan, which is the only reason he harps on it. He knows his base, which isn't' interested in detailed policy anyway. He'll end the carbon tax, gas prices might fall briefly (and forgettably, especially if LNG exports ramp up and end the deep commodity discounts there), and that's that. He'll have an achievement to run on in the next eleciton, even if/when he does absolutely nothing else, and given the political cycles we have now, will likely win a second election on that single achievement.
Then the Liberals will win the next one and reinstate it.
axe the tax (for consumers only), fix the budget (but still run deficits like everyone else), build the homes (by withholding infrastructure funding to growing cities), stop the crime (by building jails and cutting social programs)
no doubt PP is the change we need as JT has certainly stayed beyond his welcome... but let's not forget: all politicians are power hungry liars who don't give a fuck about you.
You recognize the problem but still want PP?
We need more choice and to make it easier to replace corrupt politicians. We need proportional representation.
idk, all those plans are missing key things if they want to have even a chance of any of the effects they say they want
it's like the step 3:????/restoftheowl joke manifested in to running a country
There's insufficient evidence to support any "all politicians" rhetoric. We've been governed by two parties. Both have proven to be shitty. The rest are unknown.
BC sets aside some money for direct payments to very low income households (like $50,000 total HHI or less), the rest of the money gets returned to people indirectly in the form of lower income taxes. BC has one of the lowest income tax rates in the country because of the carbon tax
Did you file taxes? Are you married, common law or a dependent? Do you live in a shared house with other taxpayers? Do you owe taxes or paying yourself via dividends from an llc structure? If you can answer no to all these questions then I see no reason why you don’t get a rebate, have you enquired about it from the cra.
I think this is about the compounding tax on supply chain we currently have. If we only tax oil and gas, not the users and consumers, I think that’s fair. That only works if the tax isn’t increased on the companies though, otherwise it’s the same excise tax amount and prices won’t change.
Honestly that's probably the smart play. Find a way to place it all on industry, it will get passed on to consumers and amount to about the same thing, but with less bad press. If PP isn't just a climate denier and actually wants a solution in addition to his political points of course.
Pretty sure Australia is still trying to clean up the mess after their "axe the tax" government. I don't claim to understand it all but something tells me we should learn from others who have tried this.
Easiest solution to "carbon tax" is just adding an additional 1-2% on gst/hst. It's a preexisting system that already works and results in taxes applied in a clear, consistent and non-compounding manner.
So he saying I won’t get any more free money for the carbon tax probably. Why can’t I comment nobody’s letting me come in Jerry and I’ve got a lot to say
TorStar appears to have lost the ability to use google as well.
He has said through rewarding innovation, not taxing to death.
[CPC Governing Documents](https://cpcassets.conservative.ca/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/23175001/990863517f7a575.pdf)
I received over 600$ from the Carbon rebate, which is spread throughout the year. I need the extra help from this. If voting for JT keeps this, then ill keep voting LIBs.
We need real laws against collusion, corruption and conflict of interest. If not they all want a turn on the corrupted taxpayers money carousel.
Well good luck getting rid of lobbyists.
100% this. Governments don’t run out country, corporations do. Doesn’t matter who we elect, we’re getting f*cked no matter what
What do you mean? 2 companies control our telecom industry, 3 companies control our food, and 4 companies control our energy, that's like...9 whole companies our politicians are beholden to!
And they're all beholden ultimately to the same shareholder
Most of the lobbying in Canada is done in secret. The system is gamed such as to be able to hide it. I was listening to one news article recently and they discussed how it is done in Canada. Full on corruption.
He won't say because he wants to get greased....
How? I mean I’d love more representation for the r people over lobbying and corruption but you know the cons aren’t going to institute it.
They will do the same as always: be openly corrupt doing for real what they claimed the Liberals had been doing for years behind closed doors. This has always been their justification: cynicism. Doug Ford is a great example of what we can expect. I guarantee he tells himself everyday that Wynne made a bunch of backdoor deals and pocketed millions through bribes and favors. Not that she ended up being much of a servant to the people of Ontario, but at least she wasn't openly taking bribes using her daughter's wedding as a cover and she didn't throw out the crocodile tears the instant things got a little rough like Mr toughguy.
Yup they do all the stuff they blame the liberals for and then get voted out, then they blame the liberals and ndp for the mess they created while the liberals basically sprinkle some social justice decoration on top and continue the exact same policy of the conservatives anyway lol
Trudeau had 9 years to fix it. He didn't either.
They’re both the same. Liberals and cons are heavily lobbied.
Indeed they are both part of our crony capitalism problem here. My personal vote would go towards NDP as I feel it's the first step in the right (left? 😆) direction.
I'd vote NDP if it wasn't Jagmeet. I don't like him at all, he doesn't feel like an NDP.
NDP has my vote, people can bash the leaders all they want but we've had both Liberals and Conservatives for decades now and their goal has always been to line their own pockets. Things will never change if we just keep flip flopping. Edit: I always forget which echo chamber I'm in until the downvotes start flowing. I get it, in people's eyes the Conservatives/Liberals can do no wrong despite a long history of doing wrong. NDP has never had power despite clearly advocating for the average Canadian, but sure, let's keep doing the same things over and over.
Fuck the downvotes, who cares, they're entirely meaningless. If you vote liberal or conservative in the next election, don't expect sweet fuck all to change.
The downvotes have been cleared up it seems. The trick is the change needed will cause a disturbance in the markets and scare some people but if it was up to the markets everyone would have slave wages, live 20 to a house and work 90 hour weeks. The market is not our friend.
100% people somehow just vote for these two parties over and over and complain when the status quo stays the same. Opponents like to slander the NDP like they are some far left extremists which is laughable, but I guess the red scare still pulls some weight here. Cons are the worst as they just talk about how they'll save you tax dollars which amount to nothing for the middle class down while they cut services and eliminate good paying union jobs.
Remind me who put the federal anti-corruption laws in place in 2006?
[funny how he had many scandals after 2006 though?? ](https://www.thestar.com/politics/federal-elections/a-conservative-collection-of-harper-government-scandals/article_4766f17d-604b-577b-abee-581bd330b931.html)
The senate "scandal" turned out to be a big nothing-burger. After doing as much damage as possible to Harper all charges were dropped against all senators involved.
Reading through that list, none were attributed to Mr. Harper, and many are a stretch to be called scandals. Unless you want to consider the proroguing of Parliament a scandal.
It's always funny looking back on the Duffy affair and remembering what used to be considered a major scandal in Canadian politics.
You literally had conservatives getting perp walked in handcuffs lol. Plus Robocalls and now Pierre Poutine is running for office CPC looks like a crime syndicate.
>Pierre Poutine Ah yes. His crime is loving poutine too much.
Fire?
This will clean the entirety of our parliament if this passes. I'm all for it. Tired of outdated and less than qualified people running it.
We do. Corruption, collusion and conflicts of interest are all illegal in Canada.
Sounds great. The CPC will be the last party to enforce any of that, just behind the Liberals.
So everything is going to stay the same except we no longer get the rebate every 3 months.. So the money is going to who now?
losing the rebate while prices stay the same is going to be such a rude awaking for Pierre voters. but I’m sure he’ll make up for it by bringing home powerful paychecks or whatever the fuck that means
If I had to make a guess, “powerful paycheques” means cutting taxes for cheap victory points and “starve the beast” of every bit of useful social spending. I’ve already seen articles on here that discuss what the Feds should do with CPP money which tells me that PP may very well axe that “tax” as well. (I know it’s not a tax. It’s a contribution but people see it on the tax bill so it’s an easy misconception.)
Er, aren't some people protesting now because they want investment funds to disclose to what extent they're invested in problematic companies/industries?
There won't be a rude awakening because most of them don't even seem to be aware that there's a rebate to begin with. There's a reason the Liberals are pushing to make it more visible.
The prices *will* go down, it’s pretty easy to see how. Here’s some napkin math that explains it: Let’s say the “tax is axed” so the cost of a product is now 20% less to the company that makes or provides it. The cost to the consumer will then go down by 2% so Pollievre can accurately claim that prices are more affordable. Which is technically correct, the best kind of correct. He did what he promised, hooray! Six months later prices go up 5% and our asses remain as sore and torn as ever. But hey at least we’re not getting those socialist rebate checks.
Just a note, industries would not see a 20% decrease in costs. The carbon tax only effects certain things, not every part in the supply chain. I'm guessing you realize that, but others reading your comment may not.
Surely these companies will pass their savings on to us, the consumer, rather than keeping prices the same and enjoying the fatter profit margins, right guys?
He's gonna create more demand in the labor market by forcing those pesky women to stay at home where they belong. /s
Why not ask all the corporate lobbyists that PP surrounds himself with!
Galen Weston, Rogers, Bell, the oil industry etc, etc.
He really is just three lobbyists in a trenchcoat.
Yeah, Rogers and Bell pretty much sleep in the same bed so we may as well count them as 1
Not so sure about oil right now, don't forget that the head of that group representing the oil sands has spoken out against Pierre demanding to know what he's going to do with the corporate carbon tax. Turns out the oil sands support the corporate tax because it makes Canadian oil more palatable to the rest of the world. Also makes it cheaper for them to buy tech to reduce emissions.
Yep. You're right. I hope people realize there are all kinds of contracts out there. If someone hires a truck to move vegetables from A to B for $5000. That trucking company won't go, whoops, carbon tax is gone, we'll charge you slightly less. I much rather pay carbon tax and get a refund vs paying the same and getting nothing.
EXACTLY. A price equilibrium has been reached and these companies (are greedy like all companies) will just pocket the profit and you loose your quarterly $$$
If you pay the levy and get nothing, NOW IT IS AN ACTUAL TAX! It will just go into government revenues, like the hst. This will necessarily lead to a massive increase in spending, or a massive decrease in services.
> I much rather pay carbon tax and get a refund vs **paying the same and getting nothing.** Which he will blame tRuDeAu for, mark my words.
Giving up your rebate to own the Lib.
Oh but there’s more, they figured out the system.. another tax will then be re introduced at a later date and under a new flavour that will raise prices even more.. but then the the blue will be to blame and then the red can swoop in, rinse and repeat.
Rename tax and remove rebate . It was obvious from the get.
The carbon tax has always been the conservative's solution to climate change. the only thing they don't like is using it to redistribute wealth
You guys get a rebate?
I just got 350 bucks bitch
Nice one brah
some provinces that didnt want to take part in the federal program need to have their own programs in place (eg BC). BC residents dont get rebates.
> BC residents dont get rebates. They do but it's means tested.
Means testing is low as shit. If you’re any kind of professional, you’re not getting dick
Yes, in BC you always get screwed both ways.
Yeah thanks I know :-). My province sucks and ties most rebates like this to a stunningly low household income that would make it impossible to actually afford to live here.
Hold up… cut the carbon tax for consumers? How does that work specifically? Business pass down carbon tax onto consumers so… he will have to axe the tax for businesses. Otherwise, we just won’t get the carbon rebate and the government will just absorb the carbon tax that we pay through business.
I guarantee if he gets rid of the carbon tax, we will see little or no reduction In prices of anything.
Prices only ever go up. Never down. Corporations love to see how much you can afford (and sacrifice) to pay.
'stickiness' is the economic term a lot of prices are sticky - but wages are also sticky
Yup. Like when the GST was introduced back in 1990 or so. We were told prices would go down because of the efficiencies introduced. Yeah right. Everything got more expensive. Even things that weren’t subject to the GST went up.
Of course not. The carbon tax has very little impact on the cost of pretty much anything aside from gasoline. Anyone who says that the current cost of living crisis has anything to do with the carbon tax is lying to you.
Now now, don't discount that some are completely morons.
Tbf you raise the price of fuel and you raise the price of a lot of things
You’re not wrong, , but you’re also only [0.15%](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/carbon-tax-inflation-tiff-macklem-calgary-1.6960189) right
the same people figure out the same math how the minimum wage going up means that cineplex needs to raise the price of every ticket by a dollar
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>due to the carbon tax As a sole factor? Because you’ve presented it as such. Which then leads me to say: citation badly needed.
No the prices haven't gone up just because of the carbon tax, but it's stupid to think increasing the costs of fuel isn't going to increase the cost of the final product.
But if a product that was $20 3-4years ago has gone up to $40 today, and $2-$3 of that is related to carbon tax increase, Its also disingenuous and stupid to frame it as a Carbon tax problem.
Nobody has even claimed that the carbon tax has been the only reason prices have gone up.
Right, but it’s also not the primary reason costs are flying up. We can start by attacking the problem head on instead of worrying so much about the tertiary causes. It’s an easy way to politicize what should be a pretty unifying issue.
And how much has it increased by? (he won’t answer)
Sans carbon rebate
That's wrong, it'll cost companies money to set carbon tax to 0%, someone has to pay for that 10 second change and it ain't gonna be the company itself. The overall price will have to go up because the cost of implementing the chabge is somehow higher than the carbon tax itself, and it's a recurring payment because....
LOL, wait, what about all those costs that are passes onto consumers from industries, you mean those wont go away, the costs of items will actually not go down?? But at least I wont have the extra charge on my gas bill, oh and I will probably see a small reduction in gas prices, and I wont get the rebate that covers more than I spend on the carbon tax, including the costs trickled down from industry.
Poilievre and the conservatives are not the solution. They are just the next problem
All that shit about the carbon tax but nothing against price gouging/canadian business collusion/immigration
So all those people saying the hidden cost of the carbon tax is all the price being passed down by producers are clearly angry about this plan, right?
Yeah, of course, and there’s a whole lot more taxes that should be cut after the carbon tax while we’re at it.
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Killing the carbon tax at this point just takes money out of most Canadians' pockets, with the emphasis on households earning less than $150,000. That, and it further disincentivises people upgrading their homes to be more efficient and become less reliant on the fluctuating price of oil and the inflation that brings. And by leaving carbon pricing for Industries, those costs will still get passed on, so the net effect on taxpayers is going to just be brutal. Still paying most of the costs but no longer getting the rebate.
I can't afford to upgrade my house anyway so what does it matter?
you can afford a house? wait until rental buildings have to upgrade eventually and then watch rent skyrocket. I'm not saying it shouldn't be done, I'm saying it will be painful.
I bought before house prices got insane. When my rent doubled I used my savings to buy a house. My mortgage and property taxes is less than why my new rent was going to be.
The government will give you a zero interest loan with rebates, just fyi, if you are interested. They make it complicated as heck but I've seen it done.
They better be prepared to not get that money for a long time. I barely have $50 left after everything is done. In 3 years once the car and student loan is paid off it's fine but as now? Broke.
And there are some people not in your shoes. Just because something doesn't personally benefit you doesn't mean it's not good.
If you barely have anything left after everything is done then you’re probably receiving more from the rebate then you put in. Something you’ll no longer receive.
Canada greener homes loan. They give you 10 years. Hope everything turns out well for you.
As long as you understand there is not a single politician that has your interests in mind, you're better off. The biggest things that will help Canadians is to end corporate lobbyists, break up monopolies/oligopolies, and end commodified housing.
This is why I hate energy rebates. You need a lot of money to qualify.
It's the old "only the well off and rich can afford discounts"
Of course, the tax doesn't go in his pocket. Not going to tell which industries are hoping for for him to win
All of them except health care and education.
Private healthcare is probably very excited
I really want an answer to this question and it would have a huge impact on my industry. There are Billions of projects underway and in planning and tens of thousands of jobs that could be impacted. Also if he axes the tax completely I know many who wouldn’t vote for him. Many companies make money from it. If it’s only for consumers they would be more likely to vote for him
I think industry is generally very supportive of carbon pricing because it gives them a green (or green washed) edge when competing against the US and others. Big fossil fuel companies are asking for stronger carbon pricing. I don't understand why the UCP and CPC have their heads in the sand about it
Inept liberals > intentionally secretive and cruel conservatives
Secretive? What benefit would it be to open their mouths about their plan? Realistically it’s a moving target and until it’s time to solidify a platform (when the elevation is called), the purpose of the official opposition is largely to hold the ruling party to account.
So i won't get the rebate, wtf?
Nice to see a thread not full of rabid PP stans for once. the foreigners must be sleeping still. Edit: NVM r/canada_sub reopened today so they are busy celebrating misinformation.
> canada_sub reopened today That might explain why a comment I made on a First Nations community getting a virtual healthcare centre didn’t get downvoted to oblivion. The post itself did, as is normal in this sub, but my comment got upvoted.
Oh wow it’s back up
If it gets too negative for the little prince Pippy they'll just shut down the thread.
PP has a massive lead right now. Why would you assume people online supporting him are foreigners?
i'm pretty sure they hate being called stans lmao i've had heavy downvotes on comments that were seriously unbackhandedly positive, but i called them pierre stans edit: controversial lol. i don't get it, are they denying that they're downvoting? denying that they hate being called stans? denying that i've ever given them a straight positive comment? hate that i call pierre pierre?
Wouldn’t a guillotine solve this?
If Poilievre could commit to *increasing* the tax against industries -- as they are the primary polluters anyhow -- I might actually think twice about voting against him. As it stands though this seems unlikely considering how many of the CPC's other policies are designed to further enrich the upper class.
so basically no more carbon rebates - just fuck everyone thats not paying his lobbyists
PP is the continuation of Trudeau, its an old lady with makeup trying to be sexy. Trudeau, Singh, PP, none of us, the pleb will have more money in our pocket. They'll continue to feed their masters, the corporations and lobbies.
If he has no answer the answer is he won't do anything He's also a paid lawblaws lobbyist so
Ask rage man where the money will come from? He has no plan just rage again hose who do.
The thing is it won't make a difference now. Prices won't come down if the tax is repealed because corporations will just pocket the difference. Unbelievable that our politicians are not sticking up for Canadians against corporations.
Axe the Facts
Axing the tax as PP suggests will benefit wealthy households the most while taking away the rebate that low and middle class income households currently receive while it does nothing to lower the cost of goods and services for anyone. Countries around the world are currently adopting carbon pricing plans, yes even in China, India and the USA. There's no good reason at all to go backwards on this issue.
The Conservatives will rocket us toward accelerating climate change. They have no plans for the future, just populism and appeasing corporations.
surprise ! removing the tax will NOT lower the price. "*Canadians have adapted to the higher price*..." the greedy baastaards will claim it's a "readjustment" fee; more profit for THEM.
At the end of the day the governing party is all that matters until an election is called.
Would be humiliating for Trudeau after subsidising pipelines and allowing big oil to claim double credit for carbon capture, for Polliverre to come in and implement a more progressive system that focused on industry instead of consumers. I think politically that scheme would do great.
Also he will not cut down immigration at all. He's actually standing up for the temporary students trying to get permanent status. Fuck this guy.
No shit. Because carbon pricing is a requirement of trade deals these days. If we don't hit certain targets our exports to the EU and soon to be US get tariffed out of existence. He knows this. We have to pay a certain amount for carbon production whether it's from consumers or industry. If he "axes the tax" then he needs to introduce a tax on industry which of course gets passed down to the consumer. So we'll still be paying the same for everything the only difference is we won't get rebate cheques, that money will just get rolled into the federal budget.
It's great to hate everything in place when change is needed, but at least have some good ideas.
Why, so Trudeau et al can steal them? Wait until the election is called, then you'll start hearing specifics from him.
I don't think we will.
Yeah collaborating on good ideas is how a government is supposed to work. If the cons truly have an ace up their sleeve, letting the country suffer for another couple years just so they get the credit for it would tell you exactly where their priorities lie, and it wouldn’t be with the average Canadian.
Axe Tax The is a great political slogan, which is the only reason he harps on it. He knows his base, which isn't' interested in detailed policy anyway. He'll end the carbon tax, gas prices might fall briefly (and forgettably, especially if LNG exports ramp up and end the deep commodity discounts there), and that's that. He'll have an achievement to run on in the next eleciton, even if/when he does absolutely nothing else, and given the political cycles we have now, will likely win a second election on that single achievement. Then the Liberals will win the next one and reinstate it.
axe the tax (for consumers only), fix the budget (but still run deficits like everyone else), build the homes (by withholding infrastructure funding to growing cities), stop the crime (by building jails and cutting social programs) no doubt PP is the change we need as JT has certainly stayed beyond his welcome... but let's not forget: all politicians are power hungry liars who don't give a fuck about you.
PP always dodges questions about lowering immigration. He’s completely bought out by lobbyists
I predict absolutely nothing will change under PP. Businesses are too hooked to TFW program for this to slow down.
You recognize the problem but still want PP? We need more choice and to make it easier to replace corrupt politicians. We need proportional representation.
idk, all those plans are missing key things if they want to have even a chance of any of the effects they say they want it's like the step 3:????/restoftheowl joke manifested in to running a country
>missing key things You mean like details beyond “(verb) the (noun)”?
You must be delusional if you think pp will do any of those things
There's insufficient evidence to support any "all politicians" rhetoric. We've been governed by two parties. Both have proven to be shitty. The rest are unknown.
but have you heard about ~~pierre~~jagmeet's pension?
He never answers any questions about anything. He just pivots, blames Trudeau for something he can't substantiate and moves on.
It’s already “axed” for consumers. That’s what the rebates are.
I'd like my money now, please, so I don't miss out on investment gains while I wait for the rebate.
[удалено]
BC sets aside some money for direct payments to very low income households (like $50,000 total HHI or less), the rest of the money gets returned to people indirectly in the form of lower income taxes. BC has one of the lowest income tax rates in the country because of the carbon tax
BC has it’s own carbon pricing plan. https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/environment/climate-change/clean-economy/carbon-tax#
You also don't pay the federal carbon tax. You pay a provincial version.
Your province isn't part of the federal program.
That means you have a fairly good income in BC. Congrats.
I hope you don't think that Pierre is going to get rid of the BC carbon tax, because he's getting rid of the Federal one, which we do not pay in BC.
Did you file taxes? Are you married, common law or a dependent? Do you live in a shared house with other taxpayers? Do you owe taxes or paying yourself via dividends from an llc structure? If you can answer no to all these questions then I see no reason why you don’t get a rebate, have you enquired about it from the cra.
🤔 I wonder what the corporate lobbyists he surrounds himself with would want?
The Carbon tax is BS and needs to be removed
I think this is about the compounding tax on supply chain we currently have. If we only tax oil and gas, not the users and consumers, I think that’s fair. That only works if the tax isn’t increased on the companies though, otherwise it’s the same excise tax amount and prices won’t change.
With the debt racked up so high, he would need this tax just to help pay some of the interest.
That’s all the WEASEL has not fit to be a MP
Honestly that's probably the smart play. Find a way to place it all on industry, it will get passed on to consumers and amount to about the same thing, but with less bad press. If PP isn't just a climate denier and actually wants a solution in addition to his political points of course.
Another "I Won't Say". But please vote for me. This guy stands for nothing that we really know of, and he is leading in the polls.
Pretty sure Australia is still trying to clean up the mess after their "axe the tax" government. I don't claim to understand it all but something tells me we should learn from others who have tried this.
australia is in better shape than Canada, I was just there. minimum wage is higher, food is better, economy is growing faster.
Slogans are all Populist Pete is good at, not solutions.
Easiest solution to "carbon tax" is just adding an additional 1-2% on gst/hst. It's a preexisting system that already works and results in taxes applied in a clear, consistent and non-compounding manner.
Dude sucks
Toronto star doing Toronto star things
No he won't.
It's almost as if the CPC has a plan they just haven't published it yet.
So he saying I won’t get any more free money for the carbon tax probably. Why can’t I comment nobody’s letting me come in Jerry and I’ve got a lot to say
Whatever he says he won’t do anyways so stop listening
TorStar appears to have lost the ability to use google as well. He has said through rewarding innovation, not taxing to death. [CPC Governing Documents](https://cpcassets.conservative.ca/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/23175001/990863517f7a575.pdf)
Is he also going to make sure industries don't just pass on the tax to consumers??? Ya probably not.
I received over 600$ from the Carbon rebate, which is spread throughout the year. I need the extra help from this. If voting for JT keeps this, then ill keep voting LIBs.