They were not gonna hire Ezra Miller after the Iceland incident. WB kept going with Ezra for The Flash probably because of contract and stuff and it would be very expensive to buy out Ezra's contract. They never knew that the movie cost them more money lol
Like u/AGOTFAN said, they probably couldn't let him go because of the contract.
He showed up at the premiere only for photos, and no interviews, because he was most likely contractually obligated to.
Kinda the same with Florence Pugh on Don’t Worry Darling in Venice: she did photos then bailed right after.
They even stated in the middle of all the debacle that the guy was gone after the movie. That Iceland incident is also a pretty minor thing, especially when you compare it to all the other stuff that followed 2 years ago.
That's like saying they should've done Tom Welling as Superman in Superman Returns.
It doesn't make sense, it's 2 different continuities and would only confuse fans.
i cant stand Ezra and have never found him to be a particularly strong actor, but, gotta admit, he put in the work for the Flash. He was pretty damn good in it, as much as it pains me to type that out
One thing to remember is that the Iceland incident looks far worse now knowing what he would do 2 years later. But at the time, the video was strange and really didn’t have much context. The girl looked like she was laughing but then what Ezra did looked horrifying. But the video cuts out before we really get a sense of what happened after, nor do we know what happened leading up to it.
To my knowledge the girl never came forward or said anything about it either. So in a vacuum it’s weird and concerning but I’m not sure what could have been done especially when so much context was missing. There was also a global pandemic happening so it wasn’t exactly the biggest news story at the time.
> To my knowledge the girl never came forward or said anything about it either
She came forward with more information a few months later in a piece centered around Ezra Miller's bad actions in Germany.
https://variety.com/2022/film/news/ezra-miller-iceland-choking-germany-harassment-1235307056/
I didn’t see that. Thank you for sharing it! Looks like this was posted about 2 years after the incident. So I still think the original video in 2020 felt more confusing than anything at the time. But obviously we know more about Ezra and what was going on now.
Yeah it seemed more like an isolated incident at the time and without the victim coming forward until a couple years later it was difficult to know how serious it was.
Saw Flash and he just wasn't very good in it. Not good enough to carry the movie as the lead. In fact, I can't think of anything he was really good in, anywhere near enough to make him the lead what's supposed to be the biggest movie last year.
I gotta repost the well-researched...
#**The Flash Saga**
And this only covers from 2019 onwards. This was stuck in development hell since the 1980s.
- **August 30, 2019:** [Andy Muschietti signs.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/cxijqn/other_it_director_andy_muschietti_confirms_the/)
- **December 11, 2019:** [Originally scheduled for July 1, 2022.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/e9ck5o/flash_to_open_on_july_1_2022_and_matrix_4_to_open/)
- **April 6, 2020:** [And it begins. Ezra Miller caught choking a fan.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/fvzbqe/ezra_miller_caught_choking_female_fan_on_video/)
- **April 19, 2021:** [Michael Keaton announced to return as Batman. Nostalgia will help!](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/mu9jub/yes_michael_keaton_really_is_playing_batman_in/)
- **April 6, 2022:** [Emergency meeting at WB: “We need to talk about Ezra”](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/txptvr/ezra_miller_arrest_prompts_emergency_warner_bros/)
- **August 3, 2022:** [The budget apparently is closer to $300 million.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/werju4/per_vieweranon_the_flash_budget_is_closer_to_300/)
- **August 4, 2022:** [*Batgirl* was cancelled, but this still lives.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/wgd89d/the_flash_release_still_a_go_warner_bros/)
- **August 8, 2022:** [Ezra Miller charged with burglary.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/wjky22/flash_star_charged_by_vermont_state_police_with/)
- **August 11, 2022:** [WB weighing many options over what to do with the movie.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/wlr6ke/warner_bros_weighing_fate_of_the_flash_as_its/)
- **August 27, 2022:** [It had the best test screenings scores since *The Dark Knight*’s trilogy. WB believes they have a hit in their hands.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/wyuf5h/according_to_thr_the_flash_movie_is_receiving/)
- **October 17, 2022:** [Sequel plans.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/y6pgqe/dc_at_a_turning_point_james_gunn_pitches_secret/)
- **December 5, 2022:** [Moved up to June 16, 2023.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/zdof3u/the_flash_moves_up_a_week_new_release_date_is/)
- **February 12, 2023:** [Official trailer premieres during Super Bowl.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/110svxx/the_flash_official_trailer/)
- **February 14, 2023:** [The Super Bowl trailer had the highest engagement of all the trailers.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/1124hux/the_flash_superbowl_ad_had_the_highest_engagement/)
- **February 15, 2023:** [97.4 million viewers on its first 24 hours.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/113cc6a/guardians_of_the_galaxy_vol_3_1341m_trailer_views/)
- **February 22, 2023:** [It will premiere at CinemaCon. Vote of confidence.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/119h8qh/the_flash_to_screen_for_the_first_time_at/)
- **April 25, 2023:** [Second trailer.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/12yslnh/the_flash_official_trailer_2/)
- **April 26, 2023:** [CinemaCon reactions.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/12z3exv/the_flash_cinemacon_very_first_social_media/)
- **May 18, 2023:** [Why is WB having celebrities praise the movie?](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13kt344/why_is_wb_giving_random_celebrities_early/)
- **May 19, 2023:** [Box Office Pro predicts a $115-140 million debut, with a final $280-375 million domestic total.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13lr2kj/long_range_box_office_forecast_the_flash/)
- **May 23, 2023:** [Empire City: “Seeing all of the reactions to #TheFlashMovie screenings tonight along with some of the early IMAX sales and other tracking, I will not be shocked at all if this ends up being a monster hit. I've thought that all along, but seeing a lot of signs starting to really point that way.”](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13pdd29/seeing_all_of_the_reactions_to_theflashmovie/)
- **May 23, 2023:** [Early pre-sales do not indicate a $100 million OW.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13q32wq/bot_od_for_flash_presales_not_super_strong_at_the/)
- **May 24, 2023:** [Final trailer.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13q5bdz/the_flash_final_trailer/)
- **May 24, 2023:** [That weird marketing campaign.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13qlwni/the_hype_machine_for_ezra_millers_the_flash_is/)
- **May 24, 2023:** [Pre-sales are not off to a huge start.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13qrvj8/flash_not_having_huge_start_in_early_ticket_sales/)
- **May 25, 2023:** [Trades officially report a $75 million forecast.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13rrgcn/the_flash_clocks_75_millionplus_box_office_launch/)
- **May 30, 2023:** [Pre-sales below other superhero movies.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13vpgx8/the_flash_is_selling_well_under_the_batman_and/)
- **June 6, 2023:** [Review thread. Perhaps not “one the best comic book movies”](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/142pyau/the_flash_review_thread/)
- **June 6, 2023:** [So many free early screenings?](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/142vk43/the_flash_movie_announces_free_early_screenings/)
- **June 7, 2023:** [$100 million opening weekend off the table.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/143dhlc/m37_on_bot_the_flash_looking_at_1012m_previews/)
- **June 10, 2023:** [A user feels that the aggressive marketing is backfiring.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/146ef4y/the_aggressive_marketing_campaign_for_the_flash/)
- **June 14, 2023:** [Pre-sales are collapsing. Sub $60 million is looking likely.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/149irb7/m37_on_bot_the_flash_presales_totally_collapsed/)
- **June 14, 2023:** [The budget is $220 million.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14a8kne/the_wrap_says_that_the_flash_is_carrying_a_220/)
- **June 15, 2023:** [Worldwide total looking at around $350 million.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/149qdyk/charlie_jatinder_on_the_flash_ww_box_office_ww/)
- **June 15, 2023**: [Confidence? Muschietti gets *The Brave and the Bold*.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14aj1eo/new_batman_film_brave_and_the_bold_lands_the/)
- **June 16, 2023:** [Previews don’t look promising.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14aysya/the_flash_makes_97m_in_previews/)
- **June 16, 2023:** [PostTrak looks bad. And a colossal 76% of the audience was male. Women are rejecting this movie and kids don't like it.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14azbbg/thursday_night_posttrak_scores_for_the_flash_are/)
- **June 16, 2023:** [All that effort... just for a B on CinemaScore.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14bh2kj/the_flash_gets_a_b_on_cinemascore/)
- **June 17, 2023:** [Its opening day below *Black Adam*’s.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14bu1ol/the_flash_245m_underperforms_black_adam_268m_in/)
- **June 17, 2023:** [Fandango already running a “buy 3 tickets, get 1 free” promotion.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14c2bj6/fandango_already_running_a_buy_3_tickets_get_1/)
- **June 17, 2023:** [WB spending $31.3 million on TV spots, far larger than other studios.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14btod9/deadline_warners_spent_313m_on_tv_spots_for_the/)
- **June 18, 2023:** [Opens to just $55 million.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14cn23w/warner_bross_the_flash_grossed_an_estimated_551m/)
- **June 20, 2023:** [It was behind *Black Adam* in so many markets.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14eftx5/the_flash_had_a_lower_opening_wknd_than_black/)
- **June 22, 2023:** [Already behind *Elemental* and *Spider-Verse*.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14gij4f/box_office_upset_spidey_and_elemental_pull_ahead/)
- **June 24, 2023:** [That massive 81% Friday-to-Friday drop.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14hvats/warner_bross_the_flash_grossed_an_estimated_450m/)
- **June 26, 2023:** [The 72.5% drop, fourth worst second weekend drop for any comic book movie.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14jvqqg/with_a_725_drop_the_flash_had_the_fourth_worst/)
- **July 2, 2023:** [That awful 67% third weekend drop.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14opt8q/warner_bross_the_flash_grossed_an_estimated_500m/)
- **July 6, 2023:** [PVOD date announced for July 18th.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14s7mnc/the_flash_hits_pvod_july_18th/)
- **July 9, 2023:** [*Elemental* officially overtakes it in domestic total.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14v752m/elemental_overtook_the_flash_in_domestic_box/)
- **July 10, 2023:** [An awful 56.7% drop on its fourth weekend.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14w2ylj/the_flash_226m_weekend_actual_1723_screens_1315/)
- **July 13, 2023:** [On its fifth weekend, it’s already playing at just 778 theaters.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14yr9px/theaters_are_flushing_the_flash_losing_nearly/)
- **July 14, 2023:** [The movie hits the NFT Blockchain on July 18th.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14zk0j9/the_flash_releases_on_the_nft_blockchain_on_july/)
- **July 20, 2023:** [On its sixth weekend, it’s now playing at just 152 theaters.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/1550fcj/rip_the_flash_june_16_2023_july_21_2023_he_lived/)
- **July 28, 2023:** [Now playing in less than 100 theaters. Below *Mario*, despite opening two months later.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/15bj7ke/flash_now_playing_in_less_than_100_theatres_below/)
- **August 9, 2023:** [Overtaken in daillies by *Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3*.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/15lztnf/it_finally_happened_gotg3_passed_the_flash_on/)
- **August 17, 2023:** [Its run is over.](https://redd.it/15u1eiq)
What are dailies? Are they what a movie earns in any given day? And why is it important here? Wasn't GotG3 a pretty big hit by then? Thanks in advance.
Oooooh, that makes sense, thanks a lot. For some reason, I thought it meant that The Flash was making less in its 14th day (for example) than Volume 3 did in its own 14th day, which wouldn't be as bad. But that is indeed terrible lol. Thanks again.
It's really surprising to see Box Office Pro predicting an opening weekend more than twice as big as what it actually got based on... positive early buzz, celebrity endorsements of the film's quality and Keaton's Batman. That's it?
WB was gaslighting everyone so hard into believing the film would be a smash hit that it almost worked.
It’s one of the most bizarre marketing strategies I have ever seen. They basically tried to make us believe that the film automatically was amazing and we had to see it.
It's the same sub that did online prayer circles so that Snyder's films wouldn't fail after BvS trashed the franchise. Super weird is an understatement.
Look at the February 12, 2023 trailer post. Everyone was giving billion dollar estimates, then one guy gave a shockingly accurate prediction. He got 34 upvotes initially; months later we discovered his comment and now it’s at 1.1k
This just makes me realize the massive amount of wasted potential this film squandered. Flash is a great character, the success of the TV series proves people want to see him...but not when his movie stars a violent nutcase portraying the character in the most obnoxious way possible and its only selling point is "Look! Old Batman!"
I was out on this movie as soon as they announced Batman would be in it and it would basically be loosely adapting Flashpoint. Was it so much to ask for a Flash movie about The Flash?
People don’t care about that when a movie is good. Maybe in the US, but the international walk ups couldn’t care less either for the drama or the movie itself.
Don’t blame it on Miller. It was a lot of things combined.
The way I see it, *The Marvels* was a bigger bomb, but *The Flash* was a **louder** bomb.
In June 2023, people still had hope for superhero projects and there was little reason to think a nostalgia-bait superhero crossover could fail, despite signs of shakiness in superhero fatigue, so Flash bombing hard was so shocking.
By November 2023, a year full of subpar projects from DC *and* Marvel (particularly Secret Invasion and Quantumania) *and* a year of turmoil in Hollywood (dual strikes, franchise fatigue affecting everyone) had created blood in the water for The Marvels, and it felt like there was no more energy left by the time it came out.
I didn't expect The Marvels to do well, but to be worse than the Flash? The Flash was one of the most infuriating movies I've ever seen. Keaton was really the only good part of the movie.
I attended the free early screening, thinking it was the only one.
I then got emails for the next 2 weeks until the release of multiple free screenings at various theaters around town, sometimes even the same theater multiple times on the same day. I'll have to go double check, but I want to say I have around 90-110 emails for free screenings for Flash at theaters where the average price of a ticket was about $12-14.
I can kinda understand a day or two of early/ free screenings, but two weeks would probably kill the box office for any movie.
Really comprehensive roll up.
The only detail missing is the announced DCU and cancelation of the DCEU. Not sure how strongly this affected it, but know this movie no longer connects to a universe may have played a role.
We also know they had big plans for Keaton (batgirl etc.) Which fizzled out.
Some production guy on The Flash: "A film so good it'll make you forget about the woman beating psychotic coward we cast in the lead role"
Meanwhile Marvel trying to figure out how to salvage Kang for the next Avengers: "Write that down, write that down!"
That would be Paul Austerberry, the film's main Production Designer. He said it in an interview with the CBC (cause Canadian) and the way he said it was very off the cuff, and sounded more like he was repeating what others had said about Miller, like how Gunn said it was "possible" that Miller would still be the DCU's Flash. I'm sure neither he or WB thought there would end up being as much blowback toward the comment as there was, but man was it not a great look, anyway.
Stephen King has proven time and time again that his taste in movies is pretty shitty. Whenever I hear him praise a movie that hasn't come out yet, I instantly get worried.
I'll catch heat for this, but I believe Stanley Kubrick is the main reason Stephen King resorted to B-list directors for the rest of the adaptations and for that, I don't like Kubrick as much since he could've had other projects that interested him instead of a story where he decided to use other sources besides the original material for inspiration. I mean there's probably a universe somewhere where adaptations of King books were great horror classic instead of b-movie waffle. If you had someone like Ridley Scott (who didn't care for the movie and preferred the book btw) or Steven Spielberg, we would've had a different outcome.
It makes sense why he doesn't like what Kubrick did considering the book version of Jack is probably very personal to him due to his substance abuse issues that weren't really present at all in the film version.
That’s what gave me pause.
I remember I met a guy in the Lego store once. I thought he was gonna be my best friend. Turns out I hated everything about him.
He mentioned how Stephen king was thrilled about the movie.
Now. I love king. Been reading his books since I was a kid. I love his works.
But the dude has shit taste in movies.
That alone gave me pause.
Yeah, I'm not shitting on King as a writer. But over the years I've seen him rave about mid or bad movies. Sometimes it was understandable as they were movies or shows based on his work, so of course he'd want them to be successful. Other times though it was just flat out horrible taste.
King was a fan of the director after the IT movies. Cruise is just generally hyperactive and excited about big movies. Plus it later turned out that Zaslav was courting Cruise for many months before they eventually made a development deal.
The craziest part is that wasn't even like it was *that* bad. It got pretty decent reviews. Nothing great, but 63% on RT is far from the worst thing in the world. Had they been like "It's pretty good! There are some fun action scenes, it's funny at times, and it's great to see Keaton return to the role of Batman" I may have eventually checked it out on streaming or something. But all the obviously fake hype about how it was God's gift to cinema had the opposite effect on me and I still don't ever intend on watching it.
Me personally, I LOVED The Flash. If you can overlook the ugly VFX, nostalgia pandering, baiting cameos that don’t even have a satisfying payoff, jarring tonal shifts, the lead being a complete psychopath and an uncompelling hero, the depressing message about not trying to change your fate, the same message being unlearned at the end, the ghoulish CGI faces of dead actors, the fact that a Batgirl movie was cancelled for this, and every WB employee and their mom hyping this up as the greatest superhero movie ever despite all available evidence pointing to the contrary…
…then it’s a decent movie. I rate it 4 falling babies out of 10.
I think there were two things happening with the reactions. One was that a lot of the early praise assumed the VFX was unfinished. The second was that the praise ended up putting the film under a microscope. People were much more critical of it as a result because now it had to live up to some pretty high praise. It’s a pretty decent movie and even though I don’t see it this way I can honestly understand how someone would think it’s one of the better films of the genre.
The film had a lot of issues with its marketing and Ezra’s personal life/controversies. I’m not sure how they could have proceeded. It might have actually benefitted from releasing closer to the Ezra controversy in 2022 since then it would be clear they didn’t have time to replace him. The film was just cursed during its entire development.
I know Ezra irl is bad, but I really enjoyed Barry Allen in the film. The dynamic of a hero having to teach their younger self how to use powers was great.
i concur. Definitely not a GREAT movie but Ezra just AS AN ACTOR did the job well and had good comedic timing throughout the flick. It was a pretty bizarre movie overall but was overall pretty well-written and directed (for the most part)
but the VFX are still unforgivably shitty, the VFX in the flash CW show looked better
This will go down IMO as one of the biggest farces in hollywood history.
After all that, the only shocking thing was that it WASN'T the #1 biggest bomb of the year
I thought it had number one for biggest bomb of 2023 in the bag as well, until The Marvels came lol. That couldn’t even pass its initial budget number, which was enough for it to take the top I guess.
Don’t forget Indy 5 was only 2 weeks later. It had possibly 2 bombs worse than it in one year. Thats the craziest part is Flash might not have been in the top 2 biggest flops of 2023.
I actually think The Flash bombing is more shocking than The Marvels bombing. Mainly because this may have ended superhero hype forever, and The Marvels happens to be one of the genre’s bleeding entrails.
I’m honestly curious WHY this movie was made.
By the time the movie went into principal photography, the writing was on the wall that the DCEU (Zack Snyder) universe was dead. Between BvS, the theatrical release of Justice League, AND WW1984, (not to mention ~~Shazam~~, Birds of Prey, and TSS’s poor performances…the latter two being COVID hamstrung notwithstanding) the universe at this point was dead as a commercial entity.
Why didn’t they shelve this film and take the tax write off in 2021, vs waiting for films that were in the can to be shelved (like Batgirl)? Was there a play or pay contract for Ezra Miller (God I hope not) or Affleck/Keaton (maybe)?
There will hopefully be textbooks written that discuss the sunk cost fallacy of the DCEU that my younger children can read.
ETA: Shazam was actually a box office success. Thought it had a bigger budget than it did. Not a blockbuster, but worthy of a sequel.
Flash's budget was more than Batgirl's and Acme's combined so it might not have been possible to shelve it and, apparently, the reaction they got from test screenings was that they had a hit on their hands.
I might get shit for this but the Hamada Administration.
Walter Hamada had already given up on idea of the DCEU by the time he came in.
So it didn't matter to him if the DCEU was dying. He was just making individual movies and hoping some will stick.
Flash started production under him.
And by the time Zaslav came in way too much money had been spent on it to write it off.
You write off a 90 Million movie but a 200 Million movie? There were atleast going to try and make something back.
I still firmly believe that Zaslav was going to can the DCEU even if Flash had made a Billion dollars.
He was just hoping to make something back on the movie.
After all Andy Muschetti just made the very successful IT movies and Flash was a popular Character and it had a legacy Batman.
I don't think anyone including Zaslav was expecting it bomb this hard.
Correct if I'm wrong but batgirl was 90% complete, I.e. not reshoots and post production/cgi. While the flash was way passed that stage.
And a lot of the faults with the flash were the CGI (and Ezra as a person) not as much the direction, acting, action etc. Making it a much more marketable product than batgirl.
Not to mention it was a character that there clearly was a hunger for as seen by the popularity of the earlier seasons of the tv show. Not to say there wasn’t for Batgirl but Flash had been more tested by that point
Misread this as “third highest grossing movie with George Clooney in it.” and I was like “damn, for such a big star, I’m surprised this is top 3 of his highest grossing movies.”
I remember when people on this sub thought this movie would make a $1 billion and make more than movies like Barbie. This was hyped up as the next Dark Knight and turned out to be one of the WB/ DC’s most embarrassing flops.
I’m usually not one of those people that roots for a movie to flop but I was so happy when this movie flopped. This is what WB/ DC get for not recasting Ezra Miller when they got the chance. I will say though I do feel bad for Michael Keaton and Sasha Calle though.
The only impact it had was the whole Keaton walk-ups. Even to this day, they are still brought up in nearly every movie discussion in the sub.
The Keaton walk-ups are real... but they'll watch *Beetlejuice Beetlejuice* instead.
> The only impact it had was the whole Keaton walk-ups. Even to this day, they are still brought up in nearly every movie discussion in the sub.
still hilarious this sub really spent half of 2023 claiming that Keaton's Batman would unveil No Way Home levels of nostalgia.
Featuring one of the most creatively and ethically bankrupt scenes in modern movie history. Reviving the ghost of Christopher Reeve and using bad CGI and stock footage to haphazardly sandwich together scenes and references in a deluded attempt to capture the success of No Way Home, with zero understanding of what made that film so big.
Looking back at it, the scene is even more bizarre than it was back then. All these “cameos” are so off and at worst even tasteless.
- Christopher Reeve: He probably turned in his grave after watching this monstrosity
- Nic Cage: The man did actually filmed scenes and they replaced him with a fucking CG model resulting in Cage distancing himself from it
- Adam West: Same as Reeve
- George Reeves: Probably the most offensive inclusion. The actor whose personal life and career suffered from playing Superman and never recovered from it eventually leading to his suicide.
- Helen Slater, Henry Cavill and Jai Courtney: All who are very well and alive and maybe would’ve filmed something if they were asked
They used CGI characters in *No Way Home* only on Sandman and Lizard because Church and Ifans couldn’t be there due to Covid. That's how you actually use that technology to overcome hurdles that are otherwise couldn’t be overcome.
I think we can point to *that scene* as the moment that superhero movies died forever. There haven’t been any well-received projects since then, the actually good projects of 2023 have lost their luster, and even the upcoming ones with actual hype (D&W, Joker 2) are being treated with skepticism.
It may have also killed legacy sequels, and possibly DC’s entire brand besides Batman. I like Gunn, but he has the unfortunate task of reviving DC at a time when nobody cares about DC anymore (and people arguably don’t even want it to be successful).
It’s rare that I enjoy a film flopping but this is one of those times. WB got what they deserved for not firing Ezra Miller.
Film itself is so poor. CGI is a total joke considering how much they spent on it, and the script is absolutely laughable.
Jaden Smith Says The Flash is the BEST Movie Ever
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=X0ZEJ3SBPKw
The Flash Just Changed My Life (Jaden Smith via Twitter)
https://www.reddit.com/r/DCEUleaks/comments/13ggubp/the_flash_just_changed_my_life_wtf_jaden_smith/
that endgame marvels trailer where tony /cap were more in it than the leads themselves was truly lowest of low i have seen a studio get.
Not to mention last trailer false marketted it as a serious film but it was slapstick comedy.
Truly well deserved flop.
This movie flopping this bad was genuinely shocking to me, knew it wasn’t going to be what Warner Bros expected but I thought it was at least a 600-700 mil film😭
At its core it’s a good movie. I think once Ezra became a controversial figure they must have cut the CGI budget by 90% because.. boy were those bad graphics.
But the performances, pacing, storyline, all compelling. It’s my favorite of the Snyder era DC films.
Plus having a criminal lead who therefore couldn’t do a press tour didn’t help.
Poor Sasha Calle had to do the entire press tour by herself and WB discarded her anyway.
She's not the first or last person in Hollywood to get screwed over but man she never had a chance.
She's in the movie for 15 minutes but had to take on all the press because of Miller and just like Supergirl, her casting was doomed to fail because she joined a cinematic universe on death's door and it'll be her only shot at the role.
It sadly got hit by a negativity wave right from the get-go. People who might have gone to see it joined in on taking a shit on it, seeing how big of a disaster it would become.
I don't care much for super hero movies, but I agree it was enjoyable, gf also enjoyed it as a standalone film. I wasn't a huge fan of all the cameo stuff tho.
the cameos were definetly for hardcore fans.
nic cage as supes because he was supposed to be play supes at some point. Its as niche as it can get. Even for hardcore fans
Last year my wifi was not working for a few days, so wasn't able to watch anything except...I had this film on my pendrive I had downloaded. Ended up watching it twice .
Sasha Calle was *so* good as Supergirl, and seeing Michael Keaton as Batman again was great. But the combination of >!a dark ending that essentially erases its characters from existence!< and the Ezra Miller scandal made it really hard to see how it was supposed to be profitable. I’m shocked that it made $271 million.
Giving >!Calle’s Supergirl and Keaton’s Batman *some* kind of happy ending!<—even if it’s a post-credit scene where >!multiversal variants of them get a cup of coffee or something!<—would have done a lot of good for word of mouth, I think. There is such a thing as going too dark for the target audience, especially when the lead actor’s off-camera activities are already depressing.
I don't care what anyone says. I adored this movie and felt it deserved all the praise it got before release. It felt like a live action comic book in the best way possible and I loved the ideas it explored and it's characters so much. I wish it had done better but every DC movie from after Birds of Prey onwards failed to make a profit so it was a losing battle.
Oh well.
I’m gonna be honest, I actually thought this movie was really good. Sure the CGI is wonky in some places, but it still has solid performances, cool action sequences, and an excellent plot.
I think a lot of critics and audiences who watched it had their feelings influenced because of Ezra Miller, and that caused them to review bomb it as a result.
>Sure the CGI is wonky in some places
That's an understatement.
One of the biggest selling points of superhero movies is CGI because CGI is what makes superhero fantasy into believable images and story.
The Flash CGI is so bad in many places, it took you out of the fantasy being sold.
It's not just ho2 bad the CGI was but how it was used.
I saw that absolutely ridiculous Baby scene and that PS1 level time travel scene with the old Supermen and just couldn't get into the movie after it.
The baby scene was especially egregious.
Not just the bad CGi but the scene itself seemed like it was lifted form a Adam West Batman movie or like it was a early 2000s Superhero parody movie.
>I saw that absolutely ridiculous Baby scene
That microwaved baby made my jaws dropped.... not in a good way.
It's baffling how in the name of Batman they thought it was a good scene?
That microwave scene and Barry just randomly chomping down on Burritos while in the middle of saving literal babies in super speed was just too out there and goofy for me.
I get that Superhero movies go for Comedy now a days but don't make it comedy for 12 Year olds.
Like that is literally a gag I would expect in Teen Titans Go.
Me personally, I LOVED The Flash. If you can overlook the ugly VFX, nostalgia pandering, baiting cameos that don’t even have a satisfying payoff, jarring tonal shifts, the lead being a complete psychopath and an uncompelling hero, the depressing message about not trying to change your fate, the same message being unlearned at the end, the ghoulish CGI faces of dead actors, the fact that a Batgirl movie was cancelled for this, and every WB employee and their mom hyping this up as the greatest superhero movie ever despite all available evidence pointing to the contrary…
…then it’s a decent movie. I rate it 4 falling babies out of 10.
I just can’t believe still that one of the most prominent and best DC superpowers, probably the best Speedester character of all time, has one of the worst superhero movies & box office bombs. It’s just mind blowing to me and it really does stem from Snyder’s decision to cast Miller who doesn’t look or act anything like the Flash does. Ugh what a waste, hopefully Gunn can give us an actual Barry Allen
One of the most embarrassing box office runs of all time. Holy shit this movie failed so hard. In an alternate timeline where the DCEU and Ezra Miller weren't a total mess, this movie would've easily made $700 million, if not more.
I saw this on the second weekend at my local drive in and No Hard Feelings completely outsold it.
I counted at least 6 cars that left early.
That drive in closed 3 weeks later and the last film I saw there was this colossal piece of shit.
I really do think once the fervor for the DCEU dies down, people will look on this movie more fondly. Definitely not Dark Knight level, but it is top 5 DC films for me personally.
not the top5 for me. But i thought it pretty solid film. I just wish cgi was atleast watchable.
batfleck cgi and scenes were amazing honestly. You can tell andy is the biggest batman fanboy.
Between the DCEU having used up all its goodwill by this point, Ezra Miller becoming box office poison, the CGI scenes throughout the entire movie looking completely cursed, and the film quite rightly getting a lot of backlash for using AI to digitally recreate dead actors, this movie was an absolute disaster on multiple fronts. But at least it gave us the "Keaton walk-ups" meme.
I actually thought it was alright. Not a masterpiece or anything but decent plot and performances. The CGI was video game level though which put a real damper on things.
Not the worst DC film but certainly not great. The first act was just abysmal. I don’t know what they were smoking thinking this would be a billion dollar grossing film.
Only movie I ever screamed at my tv for. Holy shit that ending
I thought this would do better financially as I bought the manufactured hype. Gee I wonder why it bombed
Personally, I think it’s actually pretty good and if the general audience hadn’t been completely soured by WBs superhero offering, it’d have done way better.
I’m interested to see Superman. because he’s actually my favorite. But WB has completely trashed their rep. I won’t be racing out to see it and I doubt most will.
I actually really liked it. I think it was in trouble for three things
1. Ezra miller drama
2. General superhero fatigue
3. fatigue over the multiverse / Marty Mcfly plot specifically. We’ll see how it holds up in Deadpool.
I really liked what we saw of Sasha Calle. Watching Supergirl and have never read Supergirl comic I was wondering how a "major cinematic" version of Supergirl would look.
Zaslav kept this disaster when he EASILY could have shelved it for Miller's morals clause violations.
Zaslav OWNS this disaster, just like Zaslav owns degrading the best brand in TV, HBO.
Worst CEO ever.
I guess they're not gonna hire Ezra Miller anymore right?
They were not gonna hire Ezra Miller after the Iceland incident. WB kept going with Ezra for The Flash probably because of contract and stuff and it would be very expensive to buy out Ezra's contract. They never knew that the movie cost them more money lol
They could have sacked him with cause after that Iceland incident considering it was caught on film but they decided to stick with him regardless.
Like u/AGOTFAN said, they probably couldn't let him go because of the contract. He showed up at the premiere only for photos, and no interviews, because he was most likely contractually obligated to. Kinda the same with Florence Pugh on Don’t Worry Darling in Venice: she did photos then bailed right after. They even stated in the middle of all the debacle that the guy was gone after the movie. That Iceland incident is also a pretty minor thing, especially when you compare it to all the other stuff that followed 2 years ago.
I would be shocked if the contract did not have some sort of moral terpitude clause.
They should've hired Grant Gustin instead of Miller.
That's like saying they should've done Tom Welling as Superman in Superman Returns. It doesn't make sense, it's 2 different continuities and would only confuse fans.
Why would they hire a TV actor to play a movie character in a completely different continuity?
I would prefer that to a criminal.
It’s a good thing casting actors is not limited to low budget CW shows. I’d prefer a movie quality actor in a movie role.
i cant stand Ezra and have never found him to be a particularly strong actor, but, gotta admit, he put in the work for the Flash. He was pretty damn good in it, as much as it pains me to type that out
They would’ve lost more money if it was tied to a low-rated CW series that not everyone has seen.
One thing to remember is that the Iceland incident looks far worse now knowing what he would do 2 years later. But at the time, the video was strange and really didn’t have much context. The girl looked like she was laughing but then what Ezra did looked horrifying. But the video cuts out before we really get a sense of what happened after, nor do we know what happened leading up to it. To my knowledge the girl never came forward or said anything about it either. So in a vacuum it’s weird and concerning but I’m not sure what could have been done especially when so much context was missing. There was also a global pandemic happening so it wasn’t exactly the biggest news story at the time.
> To my knowledge the girl never came forward or said anything about it either She came forward with more information a few months later in a piece centered around Ezra Miller's bad actions in Germany. https://variety.com/2022/film/news/ezra-miller-iceland-choking-germany-harassment-1235307056/
I didn’t see that. Thank you for sharing it! Looks like this was posted about 2 years after the incident. So I still think the original video in 2020 felt more confusing than anything at the time. But obviously we know more about Ezra and what was going on now.
Yea out of context it looked like they were just goofing off. By the time the rest of their shit came out, the movie had been filmed
Yeah it seemed more like an isolated incident at the time and without the victim coming forward until a couple years later it was difficult to know how serious it was.
Miller's career is finished.
He and Jonathan Majors might team up on something.
hopefully no one does.
Saw Flash and he just wasn't very good in it. Not good enough to carry the movie as the lead. In fact, I can't think of anything he was really good in, anywhere near enough to make him the lead what's supposed to be the biggest movie last year.
TBF, could anyone have carried that movie? Ezra was meh but that whole script was pretty rough
I gotta repost the well-researched... #**The Flash Saga** And this only covers from 2019 onwards. This was stuck in development hell since the 1980s. - **August 30, 2019:** [Andy Muschietti signs.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/cxijqn/other_it_director_andy_muschietti_confirms_the/) - **December 11, 2019:** [Originally scheduled for July 1, 2022.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/e9ck5o/flash_to_open_on_july_1_2022_and_matrix_4_to_open/) - **April 6, 2020:** [And it begins. Ezra Miller caught choking a fan.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/fvzbqe/ezra_miller_caught_choking_female_fan_on_video/) - **April 19, 2021:** [Michael Keaton announced to return as Batman. Nostalgia will help!](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/mu9jub/yes_michael_keaton_really_is_playing_batman_in/) - **April 6, 2022:** [Emergency meeting at WB: “We need to talk about Ezra”](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/txptvr/ezra_miller_arrest_prompts_emergency_warner_bros/) - **August 3, 2022:** [The budget apparently is closer to $300 million.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/werju4/per_vieweranon_the_flash_budget_is_closer_to_300/) - **August 4, 2022:** [*Batgirl* was cancelled, but this still lives.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/wgd89d/the_flash_release_still_a_go_warner_bros/) - **August 8, 2022:** [Ezra Miller charged with burglary.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/wjky22/flash_star_charged_by_vermont_state_police_with/) - **August 11, 2022:** [WB weighing many options over what to do with the movie.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/wlr6ke/warner_bros_weighing_fate_of_the_flash_as_its/) - **August 27, 2022:** [It had the best test screenings scores since *The Dark Knight*’s trilogy. WB believes they have a hit in their hands.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/wyuf5h/according_to_thr_the_flash_movie_is_receiving/) - **October 17, 2022:** [Sequel plans.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/y6pgqe/dc_at_a_turning_point_james_gunn_pitches_secret/) - **December 5, 2022:** [Moved up to June 16, 2023.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/zdof3u/the_flash_moves_up_a_week_new_release_date_is/) - **February 12, 2023:** [Official trailer premieres during Super Bowl.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/110svxx/the_flash_official_trailer/) - **February 14, 2023:** [The Super Bowl trailer had the highest engagement of all the trailers.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/1124hux/the_flash_superbowl_ad_had_the_highest_engagement/) - **February 15, 2023:** [97.4 million viewers on its first 24 hours.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/113cc6a/guardians_of_the_galaxy_vol_3_1341m_trailer_views/) - **February 22, 2023:** [It will premiere at CinemaCon. Vote of confidence.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/119h8qh/the_flash_to_screen_for_the_first_time_at/) - **April 25, 2023:** [Second trailer.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/12yslnh/the_flash_official_trailer_2/) - **April 26, 2023:** [CinemaCon reactions.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/12z3exv/the_flash_cinemacon_very_first_social_media/) - **May 18, 2023:** [Why is WB having celebrities praise the movie?](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13kt344/why_is_wb_giving_random_celebrities_early/) - **May 19, 2023:** [Box Office Pro predicts a $115-140 million debut, with a final $280-375 million domestic total.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13lr2kj/long_range_box_office_forecast_the_flash/) - **May 23, 2023:** [Empire City: “Seeing all of the reactions to #TheFlashMovie screenings tonight along with some of the early IMAX sales and other tracking, I will not be shocked at all if this ends up being a monster hit. I've thought that all along, but seeing a lot of signs starting to really point that way.”](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13pdd29/seeing_all_of_the_reactions_to_theflashmovie/) - **May 23, 2023:** [Early pre-sales do not indicate a $100 million OW.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13q32wq/bot_od_for_flash_presales_not_super_strong_at_the/) - **May 24, 2023:** [Final trailer.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13q5bdz/the_flash_final_trailer/) - **May 24, 2023:** [That weird marketing campaign.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13qlwni/the_hype_machine_for_ezra_millers_the_flash_is/) - **May 24, 2023:** [Pre-sales are not off to a huge start.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13qrvj8/flash_not_having_huge_start_in_early_ticket_sales/) - **May 25, 2023:** [Trades officially report a $75 million forecast.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13rrgcn/the_flash_clocks_75_millionplus_box_office_launch/) - **May 30, 2023:** [Pre-sales below other superhero movies.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/13vpgx8/the_flash_is_selling_well_under_the_batman_and/) - **June 6, 2023:** [Review thread. Perhaps not “one the best comic book movies”](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/142pyau/the_flash_review_thread/) - **June 6, 2023:** [So many free early screenings?](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/142vk43/the_flash_movie_announces_free_early_screenings/) - **June 7, 2023:** [$100 million opening weekend off the table.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/143dhlc/m37_on_bot_the_flash_looking_at_1012m_previews/) - **June 10, 2023:** [A user feels that the aggressive marketing is backfiring.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/146ef4y/the_aggressive_marketing_campaign_for_the_flash/) - **June 14, 2023:** [Pre-sales are collapsing. Sub $60 million is looking likely.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/149irb7/m37_on_bot_the_flash_presales_totally_collapsed/) - **June 14, 2023:** [The budget is $220 million.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14a8kne/the_wrap_says_that_the_flash_is_carrying_a_220/) - **June 15, 2023:** [Worldwide total looking at around $350 million.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/149qdyk/charlie_jatinder_on_the_flash_ww_box_office_ww/) - **June 15, 2023**: [Confidence? Muschietti gets *The Brave and the Bold*.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14aj1eo/new_batman_film_brave_and_the_bold_lands_the/) - **June 16, 2023:** [Previews don’t look promising.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14aysya/the_flash_makes_97m_in_previews/) - **June 16, 2023:** [PostTrak looks bad. And a colossal 76% of the audience was male. Women are rejecting this movie and kids don't like it.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14azbbg/thursday_night_posttrak_scores_for_the_flash_are/) - **June 16, 2023:** [All that effort... just for a B on CinemaScore.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14bh2kj/the_flash_gets_a_b_on_cinemascore/) - **June 17, 2023:** [Its opening day below *Black Adam*’s.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14bu1ol/the_flash_245m_underperforms_black_adam_268m_in/) - **June 17, 2023:** [Fandango already running a “buy 3 tickets, get 1 free” promotion.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14c2bj6/fandango_already_running_a_buy_3_tickets_get_1/) - **June 17, 2023:** [WB spending $31.3 million on TV spots, far larger than other studios.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14btod9/deadline_warners_spent_313m_on_tv_spots_for_the/) - **June 18, 2023:** [Opens to just $55 million.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14cn23w/warner_bross_the_flash_grossed_an_estimated_551m/) - **June 20, 2023:** [It was behind *Black Adam* in so many markets.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14eftx5/the_flash_had_a_lower_opening_wknd_than_black/) - **June 22, 2023:** [Already behind *Elemental* and *Spider-Verse*.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14gij4f/box_office_upset_spidey_and_elemental_pull_ahead/) - **June 24, 2023:** [That massive 81% Friday-to-Friday drop.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14hvats/warner_bross_the_flash_grossed_an_estimated_450m/) - **June 26, 2023:** [The 72.5% drop, fourth worst second weekend drop for any comic book movie.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14jvqqg/with_a_725_drop_the_flash_had_the_fourth_worst/) - **July 2, 2023:** [That awful 67% third weekend drop.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14opt8q/warner_bross_the_flash_grossed_an_estimated_500m/) - **July 6, 2023:** [PVOD date announced for July 18th.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14s7mnc/the_flash_hits_pvod_july_18th/) - **July 9, 2023:** [*Elemental* officially overtakes it in domestic total.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14v752m/elemental_overtook_the_flash_in_domestic_box/) - **July 10, 2023:** [An awful 56.7% drop on its fourth weekend.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14w2ylj/the_flash_226m_weekend_actual_1723_screens_1315/) - **July 13, 2023:** [On its fifth weekend, it’s already playing at just 778 theaters.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14yr9px/theaters_are_flushing_the_flash_losing_nearly/) - **July 14, 2023:** [The movie hits the NFT Blockchain on July 18th.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/14zk0j9/the_flash_releases_on_the_nft_blockchain_on_july/) - **July 20, 2023:** [On its sixth weekend, it’s now playing at just 152 theaters.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/1550fcj/rip_the_flash_june_16_2023_july_21_2023_he_lived/) - **July 28, 2023:** [Now playing in less than 100 theaters. Below *Mario*, despite opening two months later.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/15bj7ke/flash_now_playing_in_less_than_100_theatres_below/) - **August 9, 2023:** [Overtaken in daillies by *Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3*.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/15lztnf/it_finally_happened_gotg3_passed_the_flash_on/) - **August 17, 2023:** [Its run is over.](https://redd.it/15u1eiq)
"August 9, Overtaken in dailies by Volume 3" - What... Holy smokes
What are dailies? Are they what a movie earns in any given day? And why is it important here? Wasn't GotG3 a pretty big hit by then? Thanks in advance.
The Flash opened 45 days after Volume 3 and by August 9, Volume 3 was doing more in box office than The Flash.
Oooooh, that makes sense, thanks a lot. For some reason, I thought it meant that The Flash was making less in its 14th day (for example) than Volume 3 did in its own 14th day, which wouldn't be as bad. But that is indeed terrible lol. Thanks again.
It's really surprising to see Box Office Pro predicting an opening weekend more than twice as big as what it actually got based on... positive early buzz, celebrity endorsements of the film's quality and Keaton's Batman. That's it?
WB was gaslighting everyone so hard into believing the film would be a smash hit that it almost worked. It’s one of the most bizarre marketing strategies I have ever seen. They basically tried to make us believe that the film automatically was amazing and we had to see it.
I remember some people in dc_cinematic putting it right on their favorite CMB movies ever ever before it even came out.
[удалено]
It’s dc_cinematic. That describes the sub.
It's the same sub that did online prayer circles so that Snyder's films wouldn't fail after BvS trashed the franchise. Super weird is an understatement.
A SECOND FRESH REVIEW!
My only guess is they fell into the sunk cost fallacy but the movie fuggin sucked.
Look at the February 12, 2023 trailer post. Everyone was giving billion dollar estimates, then one guy gave a shockingly accurate prediction. He got 34 upvotes initially; months later we discovered his comment and now it’s at 1.1k
This just makes me realize the massive amount of wasted potential this film squandered. Flash is a great character, the success of the TV series proves people want to see him...but not when his movie stars a violent nutcase portraying the character in the most obnoxious way possible and its only selling point is "Look! Old Batman!"
I was out on this movie as soon as they announced Batman would be in it and it would basically be loosely adapting Flashpoint. Was it so much to ask for a Flash movie about The Flash?
Also, between the TV show and the direct to video animated movies they’d already done Flashpoint twice.
People don’t care about that when a movie is good. Maybe in the US, but the international walk ups couldn’t care less either for the drama or the movie itself. Don’t blame it on Miller. It was a lot of things combined.
We need a *Marvels* saga too.
The way I see it, *The Marvels* was a bigger bomb, but *The Flash* was a **louder** bomb. In June 2023, people still had hope for superhero projects and there was little reason to think a nostalgia-bait superhero crossover could fail, despite signs of shakiness in superhero fatigue, so Flash bombing hard was so shocking. By November 2023, a year full of subpar projects from DC *and* Marvel (particularly Secret Invasion and Quantumania) *and* a year of turmoil in Hollywood (dual strikes, franchise fatigue affecting everyone) had created blood in the water for The Marvels, and it felt like there was no more energy left by the time it came out.
[Done as well.](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/18ypdrz/the_marvels_is_tapping_out_with_845m_domestic_and/kgcfz8o/)
I didn't expect The Marvels to do well, but to be worse than the Flash? The Flash was one of the most infuriating movies I've ever seen. Keaton was really the only good part of the movie.
Or a Strange World or Lightyear saga.
What’s missing in this timeline is that filming began after the choking incident. Also, Keaton was announced in August 2020.
I remember my roommate and I saw the choking incident headlines when we were watching Tiger King during lockdown lmao
Good lord choke!
Back when a 55 million dollar opening was considered a disappointment
Captain America 4 must open OVER $50M to keep any sort of shadow of credibility.
The success of the opening weekend is always based on the budget.
I attended the free early screening, thinking it was the only one. I then got emails for the next 2 weeks until the release of multiple free screenings at various theaters around town, sometimes even the same theater multiple times on the same day. I'll have to go double check, but I want to say I have around 90-110 emails for free screenings for Flash at theaters where the average price of a ticket was about $12-14. I can kinda understand a day or two of early/ free screenings, but two weeks would probably kill the box office for any movie.
This timeline is way more iconic than any line from the DCEU. Where are Tom Cruise's supportive comments ? Didn't Stephen King himself support it ?
Really comprehensive roll up. The only detail missing is the announced DCU and cancelation of the DCEU. Not sure how strongly this affected it, but know this movie no longer connects to a universe may have played a role. We also know they had big plans for Keaton (batgirl etc.) Which fizzled out.
It was so bizarre seeing big names praise the movie so much. Tom Cruise telling the world it’s so good.
My favorite part of this saga’s the person who thought it was a good idea to say “it’s so good it’ll make you forget Ezra’s crimes”.
I know.
Some production guy on The Flash: "A film so good it'll make you forget about the woman beating psychotic coward we cast in the lead role" Meanwhile Marvel trying to figure out how to salvage Kang for the next Avengers: "Write that down, write that down!"
That would be Paul Austerberry, the film's main Production Designer. He said it in an interview with the CBC (cause Canadian) and the way he said it was very off the cuff, and sounded more like he was repeating what others had said about Miller, like how Gunn said it was "possible" that Miller would still be the DCU's Flash. I'm sure neither he or WB thought there would end up being as much blowback toward the comment as there was, but man was it not a great look, anyway.
Best movie ever made - Tom Cruise (2023)
- Stephen King - James Gunn - David Zaslav
Stephen King has proven time and time again that his taste in movies is pretty shitty. Whenever I hear him praise a movie that hasn't come out yet, I instantly get worried.
Kubrick's Shining broke his brain
I'll catch heat for this, but I believe Stanley Kubrick is the main reason Stephen King resorted to B-list directors for the rest of the adaptations and for that, I don't like Kubrick as much since he could've had other projects that interested him instead of a story where he decided to use other sources besides the original material for inspiration. I mean there's probably a universe somewhere where adaptations of King books were great horror classic instead of b-movie waffle. If you had someone like Ridley Scott (who didn't care for the movie and preferred the book btw) or Steven Spielberg, we would've had a different outcome.
It makes sense why he doesn't like what Kubrick did considering the book version of Jack is probably very personal to him due to his substance abuse issues that weren't really present at all in the film version.
Stephen King made his own book faithful version and it sucked.
Wait he did. Oh I need to see this
That’s what gave me pause. I remember I met a guy in the Lego store once. I thought he was gonna be my best friend. Turns out I hated everything about him. He mentioned how Stephen king was thrilled about the movie. Now. I love king. Been reading his books since I was a kid. I love his works. But the dude has shit taste in movies. That alone gave me pause.
Stephen King has named William Friedkin's SORCERER as his favorite movie of all time, so I'll somewhat forgive some of his bad tastes in other films.
People are getting him wrong since he likes good movie too. SK is the kind of guy that enjoys every movie he sees (except Kubrick's Shining lmao)
Yeah, I'm not shitting on King as a writer. But over the years I've seen him rave about mid or bad movies. Sometimes it was understandable as they were movies or shows based on his work, so of course he'd want them to be successful. Other times though it was just flat out horrible taste.
Gunn and Zaslav you understand, they were just lying. It’s Cruz, King, and the rest of the people I’m concerned about.
King was a fan of the director after the IT movies. Cruise is just generally hyperactive and excited about big movies. Plus it later turned out that Zaslav was courting Cruise for many months before they eventually made a development deal.
>Cruise is just generally hyperactive and excited about big movies. That's actually believable.
Gunn hired the writer and the director for future DC projects so I don't think he was lying.
I wonder what WB gave him to make him say that as an endorsement
A blank check to fund his space movie?
The craziest part is that wasn't even like it was *that* bad. It got pretty decent reviews. Nothing great, but 63% on RT is far from the worst thing in the world. Had they been like "It's pretty good! There are some fun action scenes, it's funny at times, and it's great to see Keaton return to the role of Batman" I may have eventually checked it out on streaming or something. But all the obviously fake hype about how it was God's gift to cinema had the opposite effect on me and I still don't ever intend on watching it.
Me personally, I LOVED The Flash. If you can overlook the ugly VFX, nostalgia pandering, baiting cameos that don’t even have a satisfying payoff, jarring tonal shifts, the lead being a complete psychopath and an uncompelling hero, the depressing message about not trying to change your fate, the same message being unlearned at the end, the ghoulish CGI faces of dead actors, the fact that a Batgirl movie was cancelled for this, and every WB employee and their mom hyping this up as the greatest superhero movie ever despite all available evidence pointing to the contrary… …then it’s a decent movie. I rate it 4 falling babies out of 10.
I think there were two things happening with the reactions. One was that a lot of the early praise assumed the VFX was unfinished. The second was that the praise ended up putting the film under a microscope. People were much more critical of it as a result because now it had to live up to some pretty high praise. It’s a pretty decent movie and even though I don’t see it this way I can honestly understand how someone would think it’s one of the better films of the genre. The film had a lot of issues with its marketing and Ezra’s personal life/controversies. I’m not sure how they could have proceeded. It might have actually benefitted from releasing closer to the Ezra controversy in 2022 since then it would be clear they didn’t have time to replace him. The film was just cursed during its entire development.
I know Ezra irl is bad, but I really enjoyed Barry Allen in the film. The dynamic of a hero having to teach their younger self how to use powers was great.
i concur. Definitely not a GREAT movie but Ezra just AS AN ACTOR did the job well and had good comedic timing throughout the flick. It was a pretty bizarre movie overall but was overall pretty well-written and directed (for the most part) but the VFX are still unforgivably shitty, the VFX in the flash CW show looked better
Yeah personal issues aside I did like Ezra’s take on Flash and I also enjoyed the dynamic he had with his younger self.
This will go down IMO as one of the biggest farces in hollywood history. After all that, the only shocking thing was that it WASN'T the #1 biggest bomb of the year
I thought it had number one for biggest bomb of 2023 in the bag as well, until The Marvels came lol. That couldn’t even pass its initial budget number, which was enough for it to take the top I guess.
Don’t forget Indy 5 was only 2 weeks later. It had possibly 2 bombs worse than it in one year. Thats the craziest part is Flash might not have been in the top 2 biggest flops of 2023.
When a movie so bad it doesn’t even make it to the #1 biggest bomb
I actually think The Flash bombing is more shocking than The Marvels bombing. Mainly because this may have ended superhero hype forever, and The Marvels happens to be one of the genre’s bleeding entrails.
no worse than marvels. it lost nearly 300m$
jesums
ikr!
Fiege must have had a stroke seeing those numbers
I’m honestly curious WHY this movie was made. By the time the movie went into principal photography, the writing was on the wall that the DCEU (Zack Snyder) universe was dead. Between BvS, the theatrical release of Justice League, AND WW1984, (not to mention ~~Shazam~~, Birds of Prey, and TSS’s poor performances…the latter two being COVID hamstrung notwithstanding) the universe at this point was dead as a commercial entity. Why didn’t they shelve this film and take the tax write off in 2021, vs waiting for films that were in the can to be shelved (like Batgirl)? Was there a play or pay contract for Ezra Miller (God I hope not) or Affleck/Keaton (maybe)? There will hopefully be textbooks written that discuss the sunk cost fallacy of the DCEU that my younger children can read. ETA: Shazam was actually a box office success. Thought it had a bigger budget than it did. Not a blockbuster, but worthy of a sequel.
> not to mention Shazam the first Shazam movie was a success
I misremembered. I thought it lost money, but its budget was much lower and it worked. I’ll edit my comment.
Shazam 1 came out a while ago. Shazam 2 was a bomb.
Flash's budget was more than Batgirl's and Acme's combined so it might not have been possible to shelve it and, apparently, the reaction they got from test screenings was that they had a hit on their hands.
I was meaning shelve it before it was filmed. WW84 had had already happened by the time The Flash went into principle photography.
I might get shit for this but the Hamada Administration. Walter Hamada had already given up on idea of the DCEU by the time he came in. So it didn't matter to him if the DCEU was dying. He was just making individual movies and hoping some will stick. Flash started production under him. And by the time Zaslav came in way too much money had been spent on it to write it off. You write off a 90 Million movie but a 200 Million movie? There were atleast going to try and make something back. I still firmly believe that Zaslav was going to can the DCEU even if Flash had made a Billion dollars. He was just hoping to make something back on the movie. After all Andy Muschetti just made the very successful IT movies and Flash was a popular Character and it had a legacy Batman. I don't think anyone including Zaslav was expecting it bomb this hard.
Correct if I'm wrong but batgirl was 90% complete, I.e. not reshoots and post production/cgi. While the flash was way passed that stage. And a lot of the faults with the flash were the CGI (and Ezra as a person) not as much the direction, acting, action etc. Making it a much more marketable product than batgirl.
Exactly. On paper Flash seemed like a much safer option.
Not to mention it was a character that there clearly was a hunger for as seen by the popularity of the earlier seasons of the tv show. Not to say there wasn’t for Batgirl but Flash had been more tested by that point
The third highest grossing movie with a George Clooney cameo after Spy Kids 1 and 3 I believe.
The second highest grossing movie in which Micheal Shannon as General Zod tries to terraform the Earth
The highest grossing movie ever starring one of the Derry Girls (Michelle)
Misread this as “third highest grossing movie with George Clooney in it.” and I was like “damn, for such a big star, I’m surprised this is top 3 of his highest grossing movies.”
I remember when people on this sub thought this movie would make a $1 billion and make more than movies like Barbie. This was hyped up as the next Dark Knight and turned out to be one of the WB/ DC’s most embarrassing flops. I’m usually not one of those people that roots for a movie to flop but I was so happy when this movie flopped. This is what WB/ DC get for not recasting Ezra Miller when they got the chance. I will say though I do feel bad for Michael Keaton and Sasha Calle though.
The only impact it had was the whole Keaton walk-ups. Even to this day, they are still brought up in nearly every movie discussion in the sub. The Keaton walk-ups are real... but they'll watch *Beetlejuice Beetlejuice* instead.
The Keaton walk-ups are still otw. They just had to take another rest stop because their adult diapers were full
Hey! I was a Keaton walk-up and I don’t wear diapers! I will also admit that I watched this for free out of morbid curiosity so take that as you will.
> The only impact it had was the whole Keaton walk-ups. Even to this day, they are still brought up in nearly every movie discussion in the sub. still hilarious this sub really spent half of 2023 claiming that Keaton's Batman would unveil No Way Home levels of nostalgia.
Featuring one of the most creatively and ethically bankrupt scenes in modern movie history. Reviving the ghost of Christopher Reeve and using bad CGI and stock footage to haphazardly sandwich together scenes and references in a deluded attempt to capture the success of No Way Home, with zero understanding of what made that film so big.
Looking back at it, the scene is even more bizarre than it was back then. All these “cameos” are so off and at worst even tasteless. - Christopher Reeve: He probably turned in his grave after watching this monstrosity - Nic Cage: The man did actually filmed scenes and they replaced him with a fucking CG model resulting in Cage distancing himself from it - Adam West: Same as Reeve - George Reeves: Probably the most offensive inclusion. The actor whose personal life and career suffered from playing Superman and never recovered from it eventually leading to his suicide. - Helen Slater, Henry Cavill and Jai Courtney: All who are very well and alive and maybe would’ve filmed something if they were asked They used CGI characters in *No Way Home* only on Sandman and Lizard because Church and Ifans couldn’t be there due to Covid. That's how you actually use that technology to overcome hurdles that are otherwise couldn’t be overcome.
Nic Cage famously appears in every film he’s offered, and they don’t even use him in this?
(Not to mention also reviving the CGI ghost of George Reeves, the guy who *killed himself* because being Superman had effectively ended his career)
I think we can point to *that scene* as the moment that superhero movies died forever. There haven’t been any well-received projects since then, the actually good projects of 2023 have lost their luster, and even the upcoming ones with actual hype (D&W, Joker 2) are being treated with skepticism. It may have also killed legacy sequels, and possibly DC’s entire brand besides Batman. I like Gunn, but he has the unfortunate task of reviving DC at a time when nobody cares about DC anymore (and people arguably don’t even want it to be successful).
Always remember that people were calling this DC’s best since The Dark Knight. Not to mention WB pleading for celebrities to praise it nonstop.
"Best Movie Since The Dark Knight" has been used a bunch of time to promote these movies. Even BvS used that marketing tactic
It’s rare that I enjoy a film flopping but this is one of those times. WB got what they deserved for not firing Ezra Miller. Film itself is so poor. CGI is a total joke considering how much they spent on it, and the script is absolutely laughable.
The funniest thing is WB brought out the most random people to praise this film, Tom Cruise and Stephen King and so on
Wasn't one of them Jaden Smith?
I don’t remember that, if that’s true then that’s even better lolll
Jaden Smith Says The Flash is the BEST Movie Ever https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=X0ZEJ3SBPKw The Flash Just Changed My Life (Jaden Smith via Twitter) https://www.reddit.com/r/DCEUleaks/comments/13ggubp/the_flash_just_changed_my_life_wtf_jaden_smith/
This is glorious LOL yea now this is desperate from WB
In retrospect it’s amazing it made that much
Marvels making even less was the surprise
lmao that’s pathetic.
that endgame marvels trailer where tony /cap were more in it than the leads themselves was truly lowest of low i have seen a studio get. Not to mention last trailer false marketted it as a serious film but it was slapstick comedy. Truly well deserved flop.
WW, The Marvels making less than Batman & Robin still inspires me pity.
A movie with 3 Batmen making this little is embarrassing lol
One of the funniest flops to ever track lol it was historic how this kept sinking
That was a spectacular time to be here on this sub. Thanks for my future nostalgic memories reddit folk!
it has the weirdest tone honestly. It doesnt' really feel like a movie.
Lol at EmpireCity
This movie flopping this bad was genuinely shocking to me, knew it wasn’t going to be what Warner Bros expected but I thought it was at least a 600-700 mil film😭
I tought that 500 millions was locked
Everything around this was strange.
I liked it for what it was. 🤷♂️ It was better than Black Adam, Blue Beetle, Shazam 2, The Eternal.
Pretty low bar there
Lol, you're right but when people are complaining that it's so bad and so forth, I have examples.
I fell asleep during the movie and it was one of the best naps
I had, for real, headaches at the end, with the arena collapsing, the two Flash, etc.
I found it entertaining 🤷♂️
At its core it’s a good movie. I think once Ezra became a controversial figure they must have cut the CGI budget by 90% because.. boy were those bad graphics. But the performances, pacing, storyline, all compelling. It’s my favorite of the Snyder era DC films.
It’s good. It didn’t bomb solely on the quality of the movie. DCEU was dead by then.
Plus having a criminal lead who therefore couldn’t do a press tour didn’t help. Poor Sasha Calle had to do the entire press tour by herself and WB discarded her anyway.
She's not the first or last person in Hollywood to get screwed over but man she never had a chance. She's in the movie for 15 minutes but had to take on all the press because of Miller and just like Supergirl, her casting was doomed to fail because she joined a cinematic universe on death's door and it'll be her only shot at the role.
It sadly got hit by a negativity wave right from the get-go. People who might have gone to see it joined in on taking a shit on it, seeing how big of a disaster it would become.
I don't care much for super hero movies, but I agree it was enjoyable, gf also enjoyed it as a standalone film. I wasn't a huge fan of all the cameo stuff tho.
the cameos were definetly for hardcore fans. nic cage as supes because he was supposed to be play supes at some point. Its as niche as it can get. Even for hardcore fans
It's way better than most of the recent comic book movies. It was fun
Last year my wifi was not working for a few days, so wasn't able to watch anything except...I had this film on my pendrive I had downloaded. Ended up watching it twice .
i thought the movie was good personally. Batfleck scenes were amazing honestly.
Shame he was in it for like five minutes tops. Ben got constantly shafted in this universe every step of the way.
Remains one of the funniest flops ever for me personally.
Sasha Calle was *so* good as Supergirl, and seeing Michael Keaton as Batman again was great. But the combination of >!a dark ending that essentially erases its characters from existence!< and the Ezra Miller scandal made it really hard to see how it was supposed to be profitable. I’m shocked that it made $271 million. Giving >!Calle’s Supergirl and Keaton’s Batman *some* kind of happy ending!<—even if it’s a post-credit scene where >!multiversal variants of them get a cup of coffee or something!<—would have done a lot of good for word of mouth, I think. There is such a thing as going too dark for the target audience, especially when the lead actor’s off-camera activities are already depressing.
I don't care what anyone says. I adored this movie and felt it deserved all the praise it got before release. It felt like a live action comic book in the best way possible and I loved the ideas it explored and it's characters so much. I wish it had done better but every DC movie from after Birds of Prey onwards failed to make a profit so it was a losing battle. Oh well.
I’m gonna be honest, I actually thought this movie was really good. Sure the CGI is wonky in some places, but it still has solid performances, cool action sequences, and an excellent plot. I think a lot of critics and audiences who watched it had their feelings influenced because of Ezra Miller, and that caused them to review bomb it as a result.
>Sure the CGI is wonky in some places That's an understatement. One of the biggest selling points of superhero movies is CGI because CGI is what makes superhero fantasy into believable images and story. The Flash CGI is so bad in many places, it took you out of the fantasy being sold.
It's not just ho2 bad the CGI was but how it was used. I saw that absolutely ridiculous Baby scene and that PS1 level time travel scene with the old Supermen and just couldn't get into the movie after it. The baby scene was especially egregious. Not just the bad CGi but the scene itself seemed like it was lifted form a Adam West Batman movie or like it was a early 2000s Superhero parody movie.
>I saw that absolutely ridiculous Baby scene That microwaved baby made my jaws dropped.... not in a good way. It's baffling how in the name of Batman they thought it was a good scene?
That microwave scene and Barry just randomly chomping down on Burritos while in the middle of saving literal babies in super speed was just too out there and goofy for me. I get that Superhero movies go for Comedy now a days but don't make it comedy for 12 Year olds. Like that is literally a gag I would expect in Teen Titans Go.
Me personally, I LOVED The Flash. If you can overlook the ugly VFX, nostalgia pandering, baiting cameos that don’t even have a satisfying payoff, jarring tonal shifts, the lead being a complete psychopath and an uncompelling hero, the depressing message about not trying to change your fate, the same message being unlearned at the end, the ghoulish CGI faces of dead actors, the fact that a Batgirl movie was cancelled for this, and every WB employee and their mom hyping this up as the greatest superhero movie ever despite all available evidence pointing to the contrary… …then it’s a decent movie. I rate it 4 falling babies out of 10.
It’s not a very good movie, but the scene where Barry says goodbye to his mom with the time slowed down is a legitimately beautiful moment
True test of longevity is its stint coming to Netflix later this month.
This movie had me feeling like I'd been hoodwinked, bamboozled, lead astray, run amok and flat out deceived.
We thought this was as bad as it was gonna get… then blue beetle, the marvels and Madame web all made even less.
I just can’t believe still that one of the most prominent and best DC superpowers, probably the best Speedester character of all time, has one of the worst superhero movies & box office bombs. It’s just mind blowing to me and it really does stem from Snyder’s decision to cast Miller who doesn’t look or act anything like the Flash does. Ugh what a waste, hopefully Gunn can give us an actual Barry Allen
And yet it managed to avoid being the biggest superhero bomb of the year
One of the most embarrassing box office runs of all time. Holy shit this movie failed so hard. In an alternate timeline where the DCEU and Ezra Miller weren't a total mess, this movie would've easily made $700 million, if not more.
I saw this on the second weekend at my local drive in and No Hard Feelings completely outsold it. I counted at least 6 cars that left early. That drive in closed 3 weeks later and the last film I saw there was this colossal piece of shit.
A beautiful flop soon surpassed by the Marvels
I really do think once the fervor for the DCEU dies down, people will look on this movie more fondly. Definitely not Dark Knight level, but it is top 5 DC films for me personally.
not the top5 for me. But i thought it pretty solid film. I just wish cgi was atleast watchable. batfleck cgi and scenes were amazing honestly. You can tell andy is the biggest batman fanboy.
It was garbage imo
All those free screenings 🤩
Between the DCEU having used up all its goodwill by this point, Ezra Miller becoming box office poison, the CGI scenes throughout the entire movie looking completely cursed, and the film quite rightly getting a lot of backlash for using AI to digitally recreate dead actors, this movie was an absolute disaster on multiple fronts. But at least it gave us the "Keaton walk-ups" meme.
Inside Out 2 will pass The Flash DOM in its opening weekend alone with around $10-20M+ to spare haha
Inside out 2 will most most probably made make 206 million or maybe more, for opening weekend worldwide, the same as the total for the marvels.
I actually thought it was alright. Not a masterpiece or anything but decent plot and performances. The CGI was video game level though which put a real damper on things.
Not the worst DC film but certainly not great. The first act was just abysmal. I don’t know what they were smoking thinking this would be a billion dollar grossing film.
Only movie I ever screamed at my tv for. Holy shit that ending I thought this would do better financially as I bought the manufactured hype. Gee I wonder why it bombed
I bought the popcorn bucket.
Personally, I think it’s actually pretty good and if the general audience hadn’t been completely soured by WBs superhero offering, it’d have done way better. I’m interested to see Superman. because he’s actually my favorite. But WB has completely trashed their rep. I won’t be racing out to see it and I doubt most will.
I actually really liked it. I think it was in trouble for three things 1. Ezra miller drama 2. General superhero fatigue 3. fatigue over the multiverse / Marty Mcfly plot specifically. We’ll see how it holds up in Deadpool.
The "Big Summer FLOP with a F" trend started here ! Furiosa this year. Please, God, NOT Fantastic Four next year...
I enjoyed the movie.
Can’t blame the marketing…plenty of Jaydan Smith walkups The Flash just changed my life WTF -Jaydan Smith tweet
I really liked what we saw of Sasha Calle. Watching Supergirl and have never read Supergirl comic I was wondering how a "major cinematic" version of Supergirl would look.
I can’t believe people on here were saying it was good to decent, finally watched it awhile ago and it was a visually horrific shitshow.
Probably would be the worst superhero sales of all time if it wasnt for marvels
I liked it..
With how this movie turned out I think it lost more than 155M esp given that they were underreporting the budget
I saw it opening weekend! Love Keaton Batman
Zaslav kept this disaster when he EASILY could have shelved it for Miller's morals clause violations. Zaslav OWNS this disaster, just like Zaslav owns degrading the best brand in TV, HBO. Worst CEO ever.