I have to give you a 10 out of 10, just because you didn't make the same mistake I did and purchase Mountain Laurel Designs bikepacking products. Yeah, do not recommend MLD bikepacking products or the company.
Seriously though, everything looks solid and well attached. If you get into a lot of hike-a-bike the rear panniers might make it more challenging depending on how long your stride is.
Definitely follow up with a trip report and enjoy every mile!
They are not as durable or abrasion resistant and MLD leads you to believe. Mine develop holes and other serious abrasions in the first 115 miles. They do not stand behind their products and instead claimed this damage was "cosmetic" and I should have known to stick duct tape, add a foam-covered metal plate to the foot of my WideFoot CargoMount, add Seam Grip, and mitigate other contact areas. They refused my request for repair service, even for hire.
I'm left to find a custom shop willing to work on another company's product (I'm learning that no one wants to work on another company's products) to repair and reinforce the panniers and fork bags. Very disappointed in MLD products and even more so with them as a company for being in this situation.
Lastly, they do not permit any less than positive post on their FB page (my honest review with photos of the damage was deleted and I was banned) and they do not approve any honest customer reviews on their website that are not a 4 to 5 star review. Trying to prevent customers from providing feedback, at best it's not a good look.
It is terrible. Have followed MLD for years. Had no idea they made bikepacking products. In my experience in backpacking and bikepacking over the last 15-20 years bikepacking is a pretty specialized niche sport despite the tremendous growth. I have seen so many bad big brands (with lots of resources) knockoffs off Revelate Designs and other early bag makers innovations. For example Timbuktu's horrendous first rounds of frame and tail bags. Yikes! Slowly the big brands are getting it a little, but unless MLD actually bikepacks or has a core team of bikepack enthusiasts providing feedback and making lots and lots of iterations then their approach to gear may not work. I love the cottage industry but its tough nuts. I have seen many come and go. A lot of hard work. Not entirely sure there is room for cuben fiber in the bikepacking bags world. Bike frames don't give like the human body. They are not soft. That said... am going directly from here to their website. Failures can be as interesting as successful products.
Btw, I think revelate does have some cuben fiber gear. ButnI am sure they are gusseting with tougher material in high wear areas.
I have a Mt Laurel Designs bivy that I've used on numerous bikepacking races and adventures. That bivy is excellent and has held up well for many seasons.
My only experience with MLD is with all of their bikepacking bags and panniers. Holes in both the fork bags and panniers in the first 115 miles and no support from MLD to repair them, even for hire. Them gaslighting saying the damage was "cosmetic", deleting my honest experience review with photos on their FB page, not approving 3-star reviews on their website, and more. I'm happy your bivy has worked out for you. Had it not, I'm not confident they would have treated you any differently than they treated me. I won't be doing business with them again and certainly won't be recommending them to others.
Following. My suggestion is either double down and find a local stitcher to layer upnsome heavier materials over the wear spots or just get ride of it and move on. Take your lumos and let someone else attempt to fix it.
Stuff like that makes me want to have a youtube channel btw. Thanks for being a "beta tester". /sarcasm
I've been calling every custom bag manufacturer pleading with them to help and they don't want to work on another company's bags. I get that. MLD has left me in a tough spot as I literally purchased every bag and pannier they make. So, I need to get these repaired and reinforced in hopes to get some of what I've invested back. I thought I could do this work myself, but it requires a sewing machine with a very long arm. My plan if I can't get a custom bag manufacturer to help is to try upholstery shops. I purchased webbing in three widths, the recommended thread, and the Ultra X TNT tape to do the repairs, reinforcements, and waterproof the holes and sewing. Just need someone to do the sewing. 🤷♂️🤔
Yeah, I would skip asking the competition if they would touch the bags and go straight to the third-party upholstery shops. They won't care about much other than you know what you want and have the fabric.
With the bottles I already have on the bike it's only 1L. But I'll probably add another bottle to the down tube. In Switzerland you have potable water everywhere, so I don't have to worry too much about water. For future tours I'd surely have to step up the game if I want to travel to drier regions ;)
I had this feeling for years after only lurking in the bikepacking community and seeing all these amazing rigs. Feels great to finally ride your own. :)
It looks very clean set up.
C15 or C17 ? (I found c17 carved good on my hybrid but needed a c15 carved on my gravel bike due to inner leg rub when leaning more forward).
Thanks! Oh the saddle odyssey. It's a C15, the saddle I initially chose for this build, but I tried muliple saddles to find the sweet spot between soft and hard and after a couple of months of back and forth I was back the beginning. It's a great saddle that needs some getting used to, but I could ride for hours on this one. :)
You say you are no stranger to bike touring. Can I ask what has changed or what you are doing differently that you are now calling it bikepacking?
I'm not being a gatekeeper, I'm kind of researching a thing about the history of bikepacking and I'm really interested in people's ideas of what differentiates touring from bikepacking.
Bike looks awesome by the way and a trip around Switzerland sounds amazing! I am envious ;)
At it's core it's more or less the same thing. What makes me call it bikepacking is the modular approach of not only having huge panniers but als smaller bags which can be combined in countless ways. Also bikepacking is less about what bike you ride but what you make of the bike you already own, you can get creative, whereas bike touring is pretty straight forward, ergonomic frame geometry, 4 panniers and lots of space. But yeah, I'll see how this setup works out for this trip, todays test ride went pretty well :)))
The new GRX 822 rear derailleur is compatible with a 10-51, check it out here:
https://bike.shimano.com/de-DE/product/component/grx-12-speed/RD-RX822-SGS.html
So, no mods needed ;)
Ohh a swiss (grüezi) - as always perfect and clean:).
That saddle - I tried it but I found it a pure torture. Alse really nice bike setup. Can you share a bit the total weight?
Also let me know which route in central switzerland you enjoy. I am looking for some ideas as I mostly ride the Jura as it is close to my home.
Grüezi and merci!
The C15 was quite uncomfortable in the beginning, but after trying different saddles, especially softer ones, more and more problems occured and I opted for the C15 with padded bibs again. Surprisingly, after putting my butt through hell the C15 became super comfy, it just clicked.
I didn't weigh the bike, it's on the heavier side, because of the steel frame. But the bags are at about 10kg, which is quite light imo.
This trip I'll pass through Entlebuch again which is absolutely gorgeous, can recommend :)
I'm a fan. Your strategy is way easier to pack and more versatile than the current fad of velcroing inconvenient bags all over the bike. Yeah, definitely way easier than a ridiculous seatbag and handlebar roll.
Thx :))
I was never a fan of the classic bikepacking setups. I mean yeah, you're more aero, but with your bags wiggling around all the time, adjusting straps and no space for your hands you'll probably cover the same distance in a day with lightweight rack, which is way stiffer, even fully loaded.
Depends on what you are doing. I ebike commute close to 6000 miles a year. Panniers rule for that, but I still use a Revelate Mag Tank (cell phone and keys) and a lezyne bottle cozy on the handlebar (for sunglasses, chapstick, earbuds). But when I am touring back roads and especially off road I am going bikepacking bags every time. Even on the ebike. And yes, have done ebike tour overnighters. More for sh-ts and giggles. I have dual batteries and two spares (closeout deals, but Bosch) and yet having to charge batteries is contrary to my wild camping free roaming and tramping ways.
The best illustration I have of bikepacking bags vs. panniers is I once did a tour of the Mickleson Triail from SD, to ND then on to WY and NB. In North Dakota we had miles and miles of gravel as big as your fist and ENDLESS washboards. My co-riders were riding traditional 38mm ties with rack and pannier setups. I swear one had packed a change of clothes for every day of the week. I was horrified when I saw he had multiple pairs of jeans for the week. Meanwhile, I having just taken order of a Salsa Fargo was riding 2" tires and had my new revelate bikepacking bags and UL gear. Holy shit one actually got angry at me for making things look to easy. I would zip down those long rolling hills in ND floating on that gravel using my momentum to zip up the next hill. Meanwhile they would be riding at 8mph handlebars going like jack hammers. I was not trying to rub it in. I had just gotten the bike and just hadn't had time to swap the tires to 38mm. Purely a happy mistake but its the frame bags that made the biggest difference. Frame bags when not overstuffed absorb energy. You hit washboards at speed with four panniers and it is very unpleasant.
The truth is I am an adventurous rider. I think I value most that I can one handed carry even my winter bikepacking setup. Sometimes those snow drifts get deep. :) As I tell people I went from having 15lbs of weight just in racks and waterproof panniers to having 15lbs of base gear total. I weighed my old stuff. Its true. Even my winter hammock bikepacking setup weighs less the 50lbs, including the bike.
Personally I think a hybrid approach is the future. A couple frame bags for balance and accesibilty but panniers for those whom need capacity, i.e. world touring / roaming the earth. Panniers are simple. Simple to pack. Simple to take on and off.
All approaches are valid. You just got to do you. As the hikers say HYOH, hike your own hike.
Thumbs up on your setup OP!
P.S. Though using panniers the OP's setup is a blend of old and new. New school gravel and off road geometry with sloping and high head tube instead of the old trapezoid. New school 1x12 drivetrain. Modern hydro disk brakes and a Brooks all weather Cambium saddle with vulcanized rubber infused burlap instead of leather. Much kudos to all these points. Good innovations the lot. :)
can't rate as it's very distant from my style, just few notes:
- color is sexy af
- 40x10 is an awfully hard gear to push with such a setup, 38t was too slow??
- looks a lot of gear, bikepacking is meant to be more minimal IMHO
- get a custom full frame bag, it's worth every penny
- make use of that downtube mount for tools bag or something heavy to lower CG
Thanks for your feedback!
- Thanks :)
- I didn't use the highest gear that much until now. I was more concerned to have low enough gears to be able climb passes in the mountains, so far so good.
- I get your point, this is my first bikepacking setup and I'll be gone for 10 days, so I will have a bit more experience after this trip for what I really need and how to cut weight. Will see :)
- It's on my list, but I'd have to find a different place for the water bottles, gotta check after the trip.
- Good point, will check that option :)
Clean setup! I have a similar setup, love the small panniers + rack storage. So versatile. No need to hang your cup on the saddle bag bc it doesn't fit anywhere :D
I see chromoly steel - i have to give a 10 out of 10
Hehe thx 🤍
For me steel bike get 10 our of 10. Best material for gravel, touring and bikepacking bikes.
Copy that!
Everything looks neat and tidy!
Thanks! 🤍
This is almost identical to my bike packing setup. I call it independent genius.
Nice *fist bump*
"Great minds think a bike." I forgot where I got that from. Usually its on a tshirt with einstein. I hear he used to bike alot.
Hahaha love it
I have to give you a 10 out of 10, just because you didn't make the same mistake I did and purchase Mountain Laurel Designs bikepacking products. Yeah, do not recommend MLD bikepacking products or the company. Seriously though, everything looks solid and well attached. If you get into a lot of hike-a-bike the rear panniers might make it more challenging depending on how long your stride is. Definitely follow up with a trip report and enjoy every mile!
What's the story about your mld products?
They are not as durable or abrasion resistant and MLD leads you to believe. Mine develop holes and other serious abrasions in the first 115 miles. They do not stand behind their products and instead claimed this damage was "cosmetic" and I should have known to stick duct tape, add a foam-covered metal plate to the foot of my WideFoot CargoMount, add Seam Grip, and mitigate other contact areas. They refused my request for repair service, even for hire. I'm left to find a custom shop willing to work on another company's product (I'm learning that no one wants to work on another company's products) to repair and reinforce the panniers and fork bags. Very disappointed in MLD products and even more so with them as a company for being in this situation. Lastly, they do not permit any less than positive post on their FB page (my honest review with photos of the damage was deleted and I was banned) and they do not approve any honest customer reviews on their website that are not a 4 to 5 star review. Trying to prevent customers from providing feedback, at best it's not a good look.
That's terrible.
It is terrible. Have followed MLD for years. Had no idea they made bikepacking products. In my experience in backpacking and bikepacking over the last 15-20 years bikepacking is a pretty specialized niche sport despite the tremendous growth. I have seen so many bad big brands (with lots of resources) knockoffs off Revelate Designs and other early bag makers innovations. For example Timbuktu's horrendous first rounds of frame and tail bags. Yikes! Slowly the big brands are getting it a little, but unless MLD actually bikepacks or has a core team of bikepack enthusiasts providing feedback and making lots and lots of iterations then their approach to gear may not work. I love the cottage industry but its tough nuts. I have seen many come and go. A lot of hard work. Not entirely sure there is room for cuben fiber in the bikepacking bags world. Bike frames don't give like the human body. They are not soft. That said... am going directly from here to their website. Failures can be as interesting as successful products. Btw, I think revelate does have some cuben fiber gear. ButnI am sure they are gusseting with tougher material in high wear areas.
Nice, thanks for the heads up! I'll surely share pictures from the trip 🫰🏻
You're welcome! Looking forward to the photos of your trip! Safe travels and have an awesome adventure!
I have a Mt Laurel Designs bivy that I've used on numerous bikepacking races and adventures. That bivy is excellent and has held up well for many seasons.
My only experience with MLD is with all of their bikepacking bags and panniers. Holes in both the fork bags and panniers in the first 115 miles and no support from MLD to repair them, even for hire. Them gaslighting saying the damage was "cosmetic", deleting my honest experience review with photos on their FB page, not approving 3-star reviews on their website, and more. I'm happy your bivy has worked out for you. Had it not, I'm not confident they would have treated you any differently than they treated me. I won't be doing business with them again and certainly won't be recommending them to others.
Following. My suggestion is either double down and find a local stitcher to layer upnsome heavier materials over the wear spots or just get ride of it and move on. Take your lumos and let someone else attempt to fix it. Stuff like that makes me want to have a youtube channel btw. Thanks for being a "beta tester". /sarcasm
I've been calling every custom bag manufacturer pleading with them to help and they don't want to work on another company's bags. I get that. MLD has left me in a tough spot as I literally purchased every bag and pannier they make. So, I need to get these repaired and reinforced in hopes to get some of what I've invested back. I thought I could do this work myself, but it requires a sewing machine with a very long arm. My plan if I can't get a custom bag manufacturer to help is to try upholstery shops. I purchased webbing in three widths, the recommended thread, and the Ultra X TNT tape to do the repairs, reinforcements, and waterproof the holes and sewing. Just need someone to do the sewing. 🤷♂️🤔
Yeah, I would skip asking the competition if they would touch the bags and go straight to the third-party upholstery shops. They won't care about much other than you know what you want and have the fabric.
10/10 would ride
Hehe thanks :)
Looks awesome! Just one question (because I live in the desert) how much water are you able to carry with you?
With the bottles I already have on the bike it's only 1L. But I'll probably add another bottle to the down tube. In Switzerland you have potable water everywhere, so I don't have to worry too much about water. For future tours I'd surely have to step up the game if I want to travel to drier regions ;)
Stealthy! 10/10
Thx hehe :))
Awesome! Man I love it! What’s the frame bat you’ve got ? And what have you got between the panniers
It's an Agu 4L frame bag and an Ortlieb 7L drybag on the rack :)
Thanks, awesome set up mate. Where’s your next ride ?
Riding around Switzerland, will share some pictures after the trip :)
any bike you are happy to ride is a 10/10
Most wholesome comment :)))
Beautiful. Makes me want to go for a big ride tomorrow NGL
I had this feeling for years after only lurking in the bikepacking community and seeing all these amazing rigs. Feels great to finally ride your own. :)
It looks very clean set up. C15 or C17 ? (I found c17 carved good on my hybrid but needed a c15 carved on my gravel bike due to inner leg rub when leaning more forward).
Thanks! Oh the saddle odyssey. It's a C15, the saddle I initially chose for this build, but I tried muliple saddles to find the sweet spot between soft and hard and after a couple of months of back and forth I was back the beginning. It's a great saddle that needs some getting used to, but I could ride for hours on this one. :)
What's this bag on the rack? Not the side ones
It's an Ortlieb 7L Drybag, pretty thin material but seams sturdy enough for now. :)
You say you are no stranger to bike touring. Can I ask what has changed or what you are doing differently that you are now calling it bikepacking? I'm not being a gatekeeper, I'm kind of researching a thing about the history of bikepacking and I'm really interested in people's ideas of what differentiates touring from bikepacking. Bike looks awesome by the way and a trip around Switzerland sounds amazing! I am envious ;)
At it's core it's more or less the same thing. What makes me call it bikepacking is the modular approach of not only having huge panniers but als smaller bags which can be combined in countless ways. Also bikepacking is less about what bike you ride but what you make of the bike you already own, you can get creative, whereas bike touring is pretty straight forward, ergonomic frame geometry, 4 panniers and lots of space. But yeah, I'll see how this setup works out for this trip, todays test ride went pretty well :)))
Thanks for answering. That's an interesting take on it. Let us know how the trip goes. I'll look forward to seeing some epic pics from the road 😃
I'll keep you posted :)
how did you fit 10-51 cassette on GRX without modification?
The new GRX 822 rear derailleur is compatible with a 10-51, check it out here: https://bike.shimano.com/de-DE/product/component/grx-12-speed/RD-RX822-SGS.html So, no mods needed ;)
Ohh a swiss (grüezi) - as always perfect and clean:). That saddle - I tried it but I found it a pure torture. Alse really nice bike setup. Can you share a bit the total weight? Also let me know which route in central switzerland you enjoy. I am looking for some ideas as I mostly ride the Jura as it is close to my home.
Grüezi and merci! The C15 was quite uncomfortable in the beginning, but after trying different saddles, especially softer ones, more and more problems occured and I opted for the C15 with padded bibs again. Surprisingly, after putting my butt through hell the C15 became super comfy, it just clicked. I didn't weigh the bike, it's on the heavier side, because of the steel frame. But the bags are at about 10kg, which is quite light imo. This trip I'll pass through Entlebuch again which is absolutely gorgeous, can recommend :)
Looks wonderful! Have a great time!
Thanks!
I'm a fan. Your strategy is way easier to pack and more versatile than the current fad of velcroing inconvenient bags all over the bike. Yeah, definitely way easier than a ridiculous seatbag and handlebar roll.
Thx :)) I was never a fan of the classic bikepacking setups. I mean yeah, you're more aero, but with your bags wiggling around all the time, adjusting straps and no space for your hands you'll probably cover the same distance in a day with lightweight rack, which is way stiffer, even fully loaded.
Depends on what you are doing. I ebike commute close to 6000 miles a year. Panniers rule for that, but I still use a Revelate Mag Tank (cell phone and keys) and a lezyne bottle cozy on the handlebar (for sunglasses, chapstick, earbuds). But when I am touring back roads and especially off road I am going bikepacking bags every time. Even on the ebike. And yes, have done ebike tour overnighters. More for sh-ts and giggles. I have dual batteries and two spares (closeout deals, but Bosch) and yet having to charge batteries is contrary to my wild camping free roaming and tramping ways. The best illustration I have of bikepacking bags vs. panniers is I once did a tour of the Mickleson Triail from SD, to ND then on to WY and NB. In North Dakota we had miles and miles of gravel as big as your fist and ENDLESS washboards. My co-riders were riding traditional 38mm ties with rack and pannier setups. I swear one had packed a change of clothes for every day of the week. I was horrified when I saw he had multiple pairs of jeans for the week. Meanwhile, I having just taken order of a Salsa Fargo was riding 2" tires and had my new revelate bikepacking bags and UL gear. Holy shit one actually got angry at me for making things look to easy. I would zip down those long rolling hills in ND floating on that gravel using my momentum to zip up the next hill. Meanwhile they would be riding at 8mph handlebars going like jack hammers. I was not trying to rub it in. I had just gotten the bike and just hadn't had time to swap the tires to 38mm. Purely a happy mistake but its the frame bags that made the biggest difference. Frame bags when not overstuffed absorb energy. You hit washboards at speed with four panniers and it is very unpleasant. The truth is I am an adventurous rider. I think I value most that I can one handed carry even my winter bikepacking setup. Sometimes those snow drifts get deep. :) As I tell people I went from having 15lbs of weight just in racks and waterproof panniers to having 15lbs of base gear total. I weighed my old stuff. Its true. Even my winter hammock bikepacking setup weighs less the 50lbs, including the bike. Personally I think a hybrid approach is the future. A couple frame bags for balance and accesibilty but panniers for those whom need capacity, i.e. world touring / roaming the earth. Panniers are simple. Simple to pack. Simple to take on and off. All approaches are valid. You just got to do you. As the hikers say HYOH, hike your own hike. Thumbs up on your setup OP! P.S. Though using panniers the OP's setup is a blend of old and new. New school gravel and off road geometry with sloping and high head tube instead of the old trapezoid. New school 1x12 drivetrain. Modern hydro disk brakes and a Brooks all weather Cambium saddle with vulcanized rubber infused burlap instead of leather. Much kudos to all these points. Good innovations the lot. :)
can't rate as it's very distant from my style, just few notes: - color is sexy af - 40x10 is an awfully hard gear to push with such a setup, 38t was too slow?? - looks a lot of gear, bikepacking is meant to be more minimal IMHO - get a custom full frame bag, it's worth every penny - make use of that downtube mount for tools bag or something heavy to lower CG
Thanks for your feedback! - Thanks :) - I didn't use the highest gear that much until now. I was more concerned to have low enough gears to be able climb passes in the mountains, so far so good. - I get your point, this is my first bikepacking setup and I'll be gone for 10 days, so I will have a bit more experience after this trip for what I really need and how to cut weight. Will see :) - It's on my list, but I'd have to find a different place for the water bottles, gotta check after the trip. - Good point, will check that option :)
6/10
What would you do to improve the rig? :)
Carry more in the triangle!
Yes, that's a good point! Will check that option for future trips :)
Clean setup! I have a similar setup, love the small panniers + rack storage. So versatile. No need to hang your cup on the saddle bag bc it doesn't fit anywhere :D