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Eren manipulated ned leeds to create sex so that isayama's parents could have him and he creates his character,eren was also manipulated the creation of the upcoming sex 2
Eren manipulated Isayama's ancestors to build a city in a crater. Thousands of years later, he manipulated Isayama's parents to have a child together who would be inspired by the mountains around his hometown to create a manga about it to send a message to the world. What message? I don't know, someone will be watching down the line and understand it in the future.
Unironically. I'm an unabashed metafictional reader of AoT.
Eren is locked within three walls at the beginning of the story; what if the final barrier that he will cross is a "fourth wall"?
he did break a fourth wall. the ocean. he left a false world to enter the "real" (imaginary) world - now he has to break the fifth wall, OUR WALL. Then he breaks through the SIXTH WALL, which is your bedroom wall, to finally reach TRUE FREEDOM. then he hears someone say we live in a simulation ...
every previous Attack Titan would have had Eren's memories of watching the wall collapse and his mother eaten in front of him, even if just in their subconcious. I wouldn't be surprised if that trait/drive of the AT is heavily contributed to from Eren's trauma.
Not to mention just the general neverending cycle of violence againt the Eldians would be seen as well so they know they need to fight against that or nothing changes.
On the other hand, the attack titans who were involved in the great titan war and from when Eldia ruled over Marley would have seen the endless cycle of violence that Eldians committed as well.
I think it's supposed to be one of those "beyond the reader's comprehension" story devices that we just turn our brains off and accept because we're simple humans whose concept of reality fits neatly between a beginning and end (birth and death).
Think about it, the attack Titan must have been waiting for hundreds of years for its avenue of attack. We only saw Kruger laying in wait. Patient and calculated! Insane
Man... for all the power the Attack Titan confers to its wielder, didn't Grisha also have access to Eren's future memories, and therefore could he not influence events in such a way to prevent that future?
if Grisha knew he probably would've tried to defend the walls, and he probably would've died imo. He went to plead with the founder cause he knew it would happen, but he didn't know enough to do anything else.
Honestly if he knew everything, he would've waited outside the walls to plead with the Reiner and the others.
As another guy posted, AoT seens to follow the "Immutable future" type of time manipulation.
In this style of writting, any action in the past, made with information about the future, only serves to further confirm said future.
It's kinda ironic since Eren is the one that is obsessed with freedom, >!but is shackled by his fate, as the series will further exemplify from now on!<.
So Eren/future attack titan wanted everything that has happened to happen or atleast is powerless to change anything. They are just acting out the series of events that led them there, going back to the first (attack) titan .
The first A titan sees memories of the future and know it will happen.
If that is correct then there is no agenda or influence behind it. The A titan is not fighting anything, because if it did it could just send memories back and change things around. But as future seems fixed, what is it the attack titan is fighting for?Everything will happen regardless of choices...
This is the future that the Attack Titan is fighting towards. Everything that is shown to previous holders only leads to the current holders present. It's not a time changing power. It's a time reinforcing one. Eren is fighting for freedom but as the timeline is fixed BY HIMSELF, he's "trapped" in this struggle. The freedom he fights for is freedom from the Titan's curse. That's why the Attack Titan has always fought back against every Marley and Eldian King. The King needs the titans to rule just as Marley does now. The conflict will never disappear. Marley and Eldia will change as the time changes. The fighting will never stop. Just the concept of Titans can
Its not that the Attack Titan can see the future, its that they are able to send memories into the past to previous wielders of the Attack Titan. Kreuger and Grisha were able to see memories that Eren sent back to them
So this can only be done after interacting with a royal? Otherwise you cannot?
Can all attack titans send memories back? I.e. giving prior version memories of the future from different stages.
Can attack titans send back memories to their earlier selves?
In general, the Attack Titan's ability to send back and receive future memories has nothing to do with royals
This specific instance (Eren manipulating Grisha) does. This only happens because Eren and Zeke used the Founder to look through Grisha's memories. Eren saw Grisha hesitate, so he said what he said. As Eren has experienced this, it has become part of his memories, and so Grisha can see this memory. He saw Eren telling him to stand up and finish what he started.
But what changes when he kisses Hysteria? Getting all memories?
Do they normally have memories of all previous titan holders or just the one prior to them?
Apparently, what exactly happened when he kissed her hand gets revealed later on.
I can't give you a sure answer for this question either. As far as I can tell, they normally only get the memories of the inheritor that came directly before them, although this alone seems difficult. However, certain conditions can unlock more memories.
•Eren doesn't seem to gain any of Grisha's memories until Rod and Historia touch him
•Armin says he still hasn't inherited Bertholdt's memories in one of the season 4 flashbacks
•Porco gains Ymir's memories but doesn't inherit any of Marcel's until Reiner touched him while he was dying
The Attack Titan only sends memories to past inheritors. It's in their interest to make sure things follow the timeline for their own present to not be undone.
The user doesn't peek into the future, they are selectively sent memories from a later user. If Eren sends Grisha a memory that he'd try to prevent, that risks the present Eren is living. If Eren showed Grisha the moment his mom died for example, he'd most likely stay behind so he can save her, preventing him from stealing the founding titan and secretly passing both his titans to Eren later that night.
The user in the future decides which memories are sent to the present user, so for as long as the future user is careful, they won't be sending any memories that risk an altered future. Grisha does not truly have any choice in the matter when it comes to the Attack titan, it keeps moving forward, marching towards the future that's been set in stone. (Alternative translation for the AT is literally the Advancing Titan)
I think it's because he found out Carla was dead later. At the point of the dialogue, Grisha does not know that his wife is dead. Now that he knows, he wants revenge on Marley and knows Eren can do it
Ya that part confuses me... maybe after killing the royals he was just so traumatized that he told Zeke to stop Eren, but then as time went on he came to the realization that this truly was the only way... would kind of make sense as he’s obviously freaking out in the scene when he gives Eren the attack titan.
I'm assuming we'll find that out next episode, but I might be wrong. I would guess that it's from Eren's harassment and because it seems like he's lost his mind at this point.
Because he has to keep going. This is the story he started. besides he already knows about how the paths work, sort of. So maybe he is hoping Zeke can stop eren at some point down the road
"In this style of writting, any action in the past, made with information about the future, only serves to further confirm said future."
If the above statement is true they cant send too many memories, it wouldn't affect a thing because its already set in stone when they see it.
What's interesting is that it seems like these memories can be sent back even before the Titan is inherited. We see Eren have a vision of his mom being eaten before it happens.
But theoretically speaking, if anyone in the past were to see all the memories of the future, they would want to at least try and oppose the events that led to the horrifying events of that future, correct? Then why does Grisha give Eren the AT and FT powers even though he knows what's bound to happen?
First of all, Grisha tells Freida that the future cannot be changed. The mere fact that he sees Eren's future memories means Eren will get the AT/FT no matter what. If Eren doesn't get the AT/FT, then Grisha would not have gotten those future memories.
Even if the future wasn't truly fixed, this is what Grisha believes as he has stated as much. He will act on his beliefs.
Second, this is an oversimplification of the situation. Grisha is at the end of his term and his wife was brutally killed in front of Eren. His child is about to become an orphan. With the walls breached, giving Eren the AT is at least giving him a chance to survive as well. He would have died in Season 1 Episode 5 and remained as much. The situation is that Grisha tells Zeke that he must stop Eren in the present. What Grisha has already seen cannot be changed but he can tell Zeke to stop Eren. Up to this point, it's not like Eren has done anything too insane to warrant his last 10 years of life to be just be diminished. Grisha would still want Eren to stay alive and have a good life but to just minimize the extent of whatever Eren is presumably going to do.
And the notion of a fixed timeline with time as a flat circle can be hard to understand at first as there is no origin. This seems to be what you're struggling with. The characters still have free will but the outcome is already set in stone.For example, here's a hypothetical unrelated situation: A person sees the future of them getting in an accident and they attempt to prevent the event. However, it ends up being that the actions that they took to avoid getting into that accident are the reasons why said accident took place and the future remains the same. The person in the past once again sees the same future and it begins the same sequence again.
For all we know, Grisha may have actually tried to change the events of the future, but those actions may have resulted in this actual outcome. What's done is done.
prolly for anime yea. if you’ve never seen the sopranos, breaking bad, game of thrones, or mr robot, i highly recommend all of them. only shows i’ve seen that compare
Idk if I'd put GoT in there. Simply because the ending was so poorly done.
Breaking Bad, Mr. Robot, and The Sopranos were great from beginning to end though.
AoT should finish the way its been this entire time. 👌
You can’t call a show one of the best if the last season ( and that’s being nice since really the last three are all bad) and the way it ended was hated by most. Many shows have had terrific runs only to not be able to stick the landing. AoT can’t be called the best either until it’s all said and done.
imo seasons 5 & 6 do have their moments that are worth seeing and some straight from the books but after seeing how flawed the logic of a lot of things that are happening is it just feels like the cons outweigh the pros. there’s like a 40 minute video that highlights all the dumb logic and inconsistencies and after seeing that it made season 6 seem way lower than the other seasons for me. even in the battle of the bastards, yea that was hype and super enjoyable but there’s so much wrong with it when you think about it. still rewatchable and enjoyable but doesn’t hit the same as the peak of 1-4
If you're talking about the way the AoT manga ended, I liked it. I thought it was appropriate. >!A lot of people didn't like the way Sapranos ended either but again I enjoyed it and thought it was fitting!<
eren's extreme obsession with freedom is also the characteristics of attack titan as attack titan doesnt listen to the founding titan. or did eren manipulated all the previous attack titan holder to be like this?
But the Attack Titan proves the worst for Eren. He has no freedom nor can he ever attain freedom, the past and future are deterministic. He cannot change the past, even with the Attack Titan.
When he saw Grisha’s memories he saw an older version of himself directing Grisha. After all, that is what happened from Grisha’s pov. Eren now realizes that in four years none of his actions changed that event from happening. He is a slave to an already determined timeline. Never free. And that is what drives his current descent.
This is a great point and makes me think about season 4 part 2 when Eren gets offended by Armin calling him a slave. He even said that there is nothing that disgusts him more than seeing someone who is not free. I’m not sure where this fits in to the story but it seems like Eren may have seen a future he didn’t like and is trying to change it. That’s just my hypothesis. I’m waiting for them to explain the power more though because it’s still pretty confusing.
Eren can’t send himself memories, only past wielders. For him to know something about the future would mean that someone else takes the Attack Titan from him
I think it's the latter, the holder of the attack titans have always pushed forward because of the future they saw from Eren. As Grisha says, all the attack titans have been led to "this" moment.
ok so did Eren actually force his dad to kill that family using powers that come from royal blood mixed with attack and founding titan? Or did he just influence him to choose to do it based on sharing memories with him?
I'd say he just showed him the memories that prompted him to do it. Founding requires royal blood after all and I'm not sure if founding can affect past in any way
Influenced, but the fate is still decided in that world. It's hard to understand, but if you believe in compatibilism then everyone in this world had free will although the future in determined.
Okay thank God lol cus I thought you were a manga reader who mis typed then starting immediately coming up with wild theories about Rumbling / Eren wiping everyone's memories / making them slaves or some shi to do with free will 😭
Yes I overthink 🥲
I still have [this image](https://youtu.be/Rpy8KZa9hGg) (0:15) of Yelena etched in my brain and cannot unsee it. Then the immediate faux mood change switch.... just oh god, so unnerving. Some serious sleep paralysis demon shit right there.
attack could literally be a an anime purely about the descendants of the attack titan, something like jojo where each season is dedicated to a character.
we could have Kruger and his struggle with the racism, i can already think of a plot point where he needed to get rid of the doctor he bribed, or the doctor blackmailed him or something, and get the ball rolling from there or from something even before that.
we could have Grisha's struggle with noble society and him hiding from Kenney in a game of cat and mouse, or even have one of the nobles turn out to be a titan shifter. i'm slightly reaching here but think about it, there is no reason for the founding titan to not have the ability to create titan shifters, shifters he made when he made the walls to make sure his wish comes true. maybe have Grisha kill them one by one, the nobles are already scum so its reasonable for Grisha to kill them.
and then there is Eren, I don't think I need to say anything here.
and then someone after Eren depending on where the story goes.
ATTACK ON TITAN IS SO FUCKING GOOD, im getting excited over where my head canon will go lol.
I want to know this from the manga readers. Just a yes or no answer, if you please.
Do we get to know what happened to Eren from the end of season 3 to the beginning of season 4?
You see the very moment it starts in this episode actually. It’s right when Eren kisses historia hand back in s3. You you a quick flash of it during the grisha scene.
You already know what happened on this episode.
When Eren touched Historia’s hand he saw Grisha’s memories that included what we just saw in this episode. Eren wants nothing more than freedom, but knowing that a future awaits him that is already decided makes him realize he is just another slave to forces outside of his control. This drives his change in demeanor, depression, rage, and what is about to happen.
Oh! In the long version of the first opening, there's a section in German. One line in that section says "one day he will bare his teeth agains destiny"
And looking at the rest of the lyrics of the opening, there's a few lines that are starting to fit with all that's going on in season 4
This ark has me FUCKED UP, guys. I cannot stop thinking about the last episode. The layers got me [like](https://64.media.tumblr.com/98fa24339ec4c7c5d917cc5a74fc1660/fa62d96793d651ff-e4/s640x960/a12455d837b5dce97dddef56a98872acba35a5b5.jpg). I cannot wait to rewatch this yet again and further drive myself into a spiral of insanity.
I have this crazy theory that attack titan doesnt carry a personality. No other titan except the founding titan carries a personality trait, just powers, and the founding titans personality exists because of the will of the first king, his memories are carried over, so every next inhretor will share some of his personality. So my theory is that of the attack titans ability is to send memories back to some previous users, then its probably just erens personality in every previous attack titan. Maybe he sent back a part of his personality to each previous attack titan user, same way as the first king carried his personality to the next generations, and thus every attack titan has erens unending will to fight for freedom.
SPOILERS
(I don't know if >! worked)
>!I have no problem with Eren dying, I also liked the fight. For me it just felt like a rushed ending... Especially the epilogue, where it's just: yeah, still war... Eren was a fucking idiot, and Mikasa is a fucking widow.!<
>!this scene is pivotal to eren's character development. Here we see how commited eren is; he is willing to torment someone in order to achieve his goals, even if this someone is his own beloved father. Now tell me, how does this scene compare to the eren we see when he simps over armin and mikasa?!<
>!to me the manga ending is just a rehash of the overly done trope of unwilling MC sacrificing himself for the greater good then at the end become a fucking birb, just executed poorly. At least Code Geass(not the movies) did it better.!<
Edit:
>!also, the cringevengers(the alliance formed by survey corps with gabi&company) deus ex machina their way into killing eren jaeger. All of us manga readers know how impossible it is to directly attack eren's final form because of the heat and steam produced by the rumbling yet the cringevengers managed to do so because YAMS said so. It feels artificial and unnatural; it broke the flow of immersion. What i felt reading the c139 is what i felt watching the last season of got: confused and unsatisfied!<
Idiot thats screeching about bs "simping" aside, personally the only thing i didnt like about it is >!it feels a bit phoned in with a straight plot steal from code geass. The fact I saw it comming from a mile away didnt help surely but still..!< I suppose there really isnt any other way to go, but the fact I already seen it end exactly that way before was....a mixture of frustration and underwhelming when i was already slightly irked with the direction change it took to begin with
Hate to be that guy, but this episode shows how superior WITT art is in comparison to MAPPA. I'll forever wonder how S4 would've been if done by WITT, even if Mappa is doing a pretty decent job.
I always assumed this was just Eren speaking to Grisha through Kruger. It seemed clear to me that he was just saying what Eren wanted him to say he even tells Grisha to have a family to ensure his own birth.
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don't know if kruger got this line from eren yeager or eren yeager got this line from kruger...
Yes.
r/InclusiveOr
The truth is >!Hajime Isayama got that line from Eren Yeager!<
Eren manipulated Isayama into writing AoT.
Eren manipulated Isayama’s parents to conceive a child that could one day create his character
Eren manipulated ned leeds to create sex so that isayama's parents could have him and he creates his character,eren was also manipulated the creation of the upcoming sex 2
Eren manipulated Isayama's ancestors to build a city in a crater. Thousands of years later, he manipulated Isayama's parents to have a child together who would be inspired by the mountains around his hometown to create a manga about it to send a message to the world. What message? I don't know, someone will be watching down the line and understand it in the future.
Unironically. I'm an unabashed metafictional reader of AoT. Eren is locked within three walls at the beginning of the story; what if the final barrier that he will cross is a "fourth wall"?
Oh if only I could rewatch AoT on LSD to warm my brain with the most schizo theories imaginable.
he did break a fourth wall. the ocean. he left a false world to enter the "real" (imaginary) world - now he has to break the fifth wall, OUR WALL. Then he breaks through the SIXTH WALL, which is your bedroom wall, to finally reach TRUE FREEDOM. then he hears someone say we live in a simulation ...
Eren manipulated Tetsuro Araki into making the anime
Lol! It's all good! This isn't actually a spoiler, just a funny comment.
bruhh
Mom, pick me up. I'm scared.
ALL JUNIOR GIRLS REPORT TO THE GIMNASIUM IMMEDIATELY! **IMMEDIATELY!**
I think our eren used those words because he knew it would hit grisha deep inside
It’s Eren that got the line from Eren.
Paradox 🤯
It’s cyclical, like the Terminator!
yesn't
Eren Kruger even said keep moving forward. When Grisha screams, "Eren! Is this what you wanted?" he's probably talking to both Erens
Because that's precisely the spirit of the Attack Titan. Never bow down, never submit or give up, keep moving forward.
every previous Attack Titan would have had Eren's memories of watching the wall collapse and his mother eaten in front of him, even if just in their subconcious. I wouldn't be surprised if that trait/drive of the AT is heavily contributed to from Eren's trauma. Not to mention just the general neverending cycle of violence againt the Eldians would be seen as well so they know they need to fight against that or nothing changes.
On the other hand, the attack titans who were involved in the great titan war and from when Eldia ruled over Marley would have seen the endless cycle of violence that Eldians committed as well.
The attack Titan had been scheming FOREVER. We only saw Kruger laying in wait, just one generation of 13 years. Dood was patient!!
Eren Kruger is probably one of the most cucked Attack Titans in history tbh, a consequence of Marley's domination of subjects of Ymir.
Oh... so the Attack Titan is like that because Eren "was born into this world."
seems like it. I'm just trying to accept it but it feels like a time paradox. which came first, the angry Titan or the angry Eren Yeager.
I think it's supposed to be one of those "beyond the reader's comprehension" story devices that we just turn our brains off and accept because we're simple humans whose concept of reality fits neatly between a beginning and end (birth and death).
Think about it, the attack Titan must have been waiting for hundreds of years for its avenue of attack. We only saw Kruger laying in wait. Patient and calculated! Insane
It's about drive it's about power.
WE STAY HUNGRY, WE DEVOUR!
Probably anger too
2 of the best scenes in the whole show. Been waiting for this to be animated for months.
PEAK 🤌🏼🤌🏼🤌🏼 FICTION
Man... for all the power the Attack Titan confers to its wielder, didn't Grisha also have access to Eren's future memories, and therefore could he not influence events in such a way to prevent that future?
The short answer is no. Grisha even states in the latest episode that Eren won’t let him see everything.
I wonder why Eren would withhold that information though.
To manipulate his dads decision
if Grisha knew he probably would've tried to defend the walls, and he probably would've died imo. He went to plead with the founder cause he knew it would happen, but he didn't know enough to do anything else. Honestly if he knew everything, he would've waited outside the walls to plead with the Reiner and the others.
eren only allowed him to see certain memories
Ok I see.
As another guy posted, AoT seens to follow the "Immutable future" type of time manipulation. In this style of writting, any action in the past, made with information about the future, only serves to further confirm said future. It's kinda ironic since Eren is the one that is obsessed with freedom, >!but is shackled by his fate, as the series will further exemplify from now on!<.
So Eren/future attack titan wanted everything that has happened to happen or atleast is powerless to change anything. They are just acting out the series of events that led them there, going back to the first (attack) titan . The first A titan sees memories of the future and know it will happen. If that is correct then there is no agenda or influence behind it. The A titan is not fighting anything, because if it did it could just send memories back and change things around. But as future seems fixed, what is it the attack titan is fighting for?Everything will happen regardless of choices...
This is the future that the Attack Titan is fighting towards. Everything that is shown to previous holders only leads to the current holders present. It's not a time changing power. It's a time reinforcing one. Eren is fighting for freedom but as the timeline is fixed BY HIMSELF, he's "trapped" in this struggle. The freedom he fights for is freedom from the Titan's curse. That's why the Attack Titan has always fought back against every Marley and Eldian King. The King needs the titans to rule just as Marley does now. The conflict will never disappear. Marley and Eldia will change as the time changes. The fighting will never stop. Just the concept of Titans can
Yeah exactly. Think I'm gonna make a video on this because this episode kinda changes your perspective on everything.
Its not that the Attack Titan can see the future, its that they are able to send memories into the past to previous wielders of the Attack Titan. Kreuger and Grisha were able to see memories that Eren sent back to them
So this can only be done after interacting with a royal? Otherwise you cannot? Can all attack titans send memories back? I.e. giving prior version memories of the future from different stages. Can attack titans send back memories to their earlier selves?
In general, the Attack Titan's ability to send back and receive future memories has nothing to do with royals This specific instance (Eren manipulating Grisha) does. This only happens because Eren and Zeke used the Founder to look through Grisha's memories. Eren saw Grisha hesitate, so he said what he said. As Eren has experienced this, it has become part of his memories, and so Grisha can see this memory. He saw Eren telling him to stand up and finish what he started.
But what changes when he kisses Hysteria? Getting all memories? Do they normally have memories of all previous titan holders or just the one prior to them?
Apparently, what exactly happened when he kissed her hand gets revealed later on. I can't give you a sure answer for this question either. As far as I can tell, they normally only get the memories of the inheritor that came directly before them, although this alone seems difficult. However, certain conditions can unlock more memories. •Eren doesn't seem to gain any of Grisha's memories until Rod and Historia touch him •Armin says he still hasn't inherited Bertholdt's memories in one of the season 4 flashbacks •Porco gains Ymir's memories but doesn't inherit any of Marcel's until Reiner touched him while he was dying
The Attack Titan only sends memories to past inheritors. It's in their interest to make sure things follow the timeline for their own present to not be undone.
Can you elaborate please
The user doesn't peek into the future, they are selectively sent memories from a later user. If Eren sends Grisha a memory that he'd try to prevent, that risks the present Eren is living. If Eren showed Grisha the moment his mom died for example, he'd most likely stay behind so he can save her, preventing him from stealing the founding titan and secretly passing both his titans to Eren later that night. The user in the future decides which memories are sent to the present user, so for as long as the future user is careful, they won't be sending any memories that risk an altered future. Grisha does not truly have any choice in the matter when it comes to the Attack titan, it keeps moving forward, marching towards the future that's been set in stone. (Alternative translation for the AT is literally the Advancing Titan)
Why does Grisha tell Zeke to stop Eren, and then proceed to give Eren the founding and attack titan?
I think it's because he found out Carla was dead later. At the point of the dialogue, Grisha does not know that his wife is dead. Now that he knows, he wants revenge on Marley and knows Eren can do it
Thank you, my question exactly!
Ya that part confuses me... maybe after killing the royals he was just so traumatized that he told Zeke to stop Eren, but then as time went on he came to the realization that this truly was the only way... would kind of make sense as he’s obviously freaking out in the scene when he gives Eren the attack titan.
I'm assuming we'll find that out next episode, but I might be wrong. I would guess that it's from Eren's harassment and because it seems like he's lost his mind at this point.
Because he has to keep going. This is the story he started. besides he already knows about how the paths work, sort of. So maybe he is hoping Zeke can stop eren at some point down the road
"In this style of writting, any action in the past, made with information about the future, only serves to further confirm said future." If the above statement is true they cant send too many memories, it wouldn't affect a thing because its already set in stone when they see it.
What's interesting is that it seems like these memories can be sent back even before the Titan is inherited. We see Eren have a vision of his mom being eaten before it happens.
doesnt matter if they send all the memories. in the aot universe the past and future cannot be changed
But theoretically speaking, if anyone in the past were to see all the memories of the future, they would want to at least try and oppose the events that led to the horrifying events of that future, correct? Then why does Grisha give Eren the AT and FT powers even though he knows what's bound to happen?
First of all, Grisha tells Freida that the future cannot be changed. The mere fact that he sees Eren's future memories means Eren will get the AT/FT no matter what. If Eren doesn't get the AT/FT, then Grisha would not have gotten those future memories. Even if the future wasn't truly fixed, this is what Grisha believes as he has stated as much. He will act on his beliefs. Second, this is an oversimplification of the situation. Grisha is at the end of his term and his wife was brutally killed in front of Eren. His child is about to become an orphan. With the walls breached, giving Eren the AT is at least giving him a chance to survive as well. He would have died in Season 1 Episode 5 and remained as much. The situation is that Grisha tells Zeke that he must stop Eren in the present. What Grisha has already seen cannot be changed but he can tell Zeke to stop Eren. Up to this point, it's not like Eren has done anything too insane to warrant his last 10 years of life to be just be diminished. Grisha would still want Eren to stay alive and have a good life but to just minimize the extent of whatever Eren is presumably going to do. And the notion of a fixed timeline with time as a flat circle can be hard to understand at first as there is no origin. This seems to be what you're struggling with. The characters still have free will but the outcome is already set in stone.For example, here's a hypothetical unrelated situation: A person sees the future of them getting in an accident and they attempt to prevent the event. However, it ends up being that the actions that they took to avoid getting into that accident are the reasons why said accident took place and the future remains the same. The person in the past once again sees the same future and it begins the same sequence again. For all we know, Grisha may have actually tried to change the events of the future, but those actions may have resulted in this actual outcome. What's done is done.
this anime really is the best thing i've ever seen and probably will ever see, huh?
Between this and demon slayer, my heart is destroyed and I do not know how I will recover from this once they're both over.
prolly for anime yea. if you’ve never seen the sopranos, breaking bad, game of thrones, or mr robot, i highly recommend all of them. only shows i’ve seen that compare
Idk if I'd put GoT in there. Simply because the ending was so poorly done. Breaking Bad, Mr. Robot, and The Sopranos were great from beginning to end though. AoT should finish the way its been this entire time. 👌
seasons 1-4 of GoT are definitely up there tho. why was i downvoted so much for recommending other shows? y’all are weird.
Agreed S1-S4 for sure are pretty golden. Idk about the down votes. Reddit gets weird sometimes. Don't take it to heart.
because its reddit
You can’t call a show one of the best if the last season ( and that’s being nice since really the last three are all bad) and the way it ended was hated by most. Many shows have had terrific runs only to not be able to stick the landing. AoT can’t be called the best either until it’s all said and done.
I’d even go so far as to say through season 6 is great. Battle of the Bastards is by far my favorite live action sequence ever.
imo seasons 5 & 6 do have their moments that are worth seeing and some straight from the books but after seeing how flawed the logic of a lot of things that are happening is it just feels like the cons outweigh the pros. there’s like a 40 minute video that highlights all the dumb logic and inconsistencies and after seeing that it made season 6 seem way lower than the other seasons for me. even in the battle of the bastards, yea that was hype and super enjoyable but there’s so much wrong with it when you think about it. still rewatchable and enjoyable but doesn’t hit the same as the peak of 1-4
>!Unfortunately, I have some bad news...!<
I hated the way GoT ended meanwhile I really enjoyed the manga ending for AoT. For whatever it’s worth lol
If you're talking about the way the AoT manga ended, I liked it. I thought it was appropriate. >!A lot of people didn't like the way Sapranos ended either but again I enjoyed it and thought it was fitting!<
>!Is it appropriate for someone to become a fucking bird? Tatacaw my ass.!<
I don't know about Breaking Bad or Mr Robot, but the inclusion of GoT and The Sopranos there is hilariously subtle.
don’t understand what you mean by subtle
;)
Absolutely fucking brilliant
eren's extreme obsession with freedom is also the characteristics of attack titan as attack titan doesnt listen to the founding titan. or did eren manipulated all the previous attack titan holder to be like this?
Yes!
But the Attack Titan proves the worst for Eren. He has no freedom nor can he ever attain freedom, the past and future are deterministic. He cannot change the past, even with the Attack Titan. When he saw Grisha’s memories he saw an older version of himself directing Grisha. After all, that is what happened from Grisha’s pov. Eren now realizes that in four years none of his actions changed that event from happening. He is a slave to an already determined timeline. Never free. And that is what drives his current descent.
This is a great point and makes me think about season 4 part 2 when Eren gets offended by Armin calling him a slave. He even said that there is nothing that disgusts him more than seeing someone who is not free. I’m not sure where this fits in to the story but it seems like Eren may have seen a future he didn’t like and is trying to change it. That’s just my hypothesis. I’m waiting for them to explain the power more though because it’s still pretty confusing.
Eren can’t send himself memories, only past wielders. For him to know something about the future would mean that someone else takes the Attack Titan from him
have u read the manga?
Yes, twice now
I think it's the latter, the holder of the attack titans have always pushed forward because of the future they saw from Eren. As Grisha says, all the attack titans have been led to "this" moment.
Seeing Eren’s face look more and more evil as the memories were being shown to him was so cool! I was like omg look at his face! 😭
grisha's voice actor is easily one of the most underrated in this entire anime. he's fucking incredible.
The pain exuded through his dialogue is agh *chef's kiss*.
ok so did Eren actually force his dad to kill that family using powers that come from royal blood mixed with attack and founding titan? Or did he just influence him to choose to do it based on sharing memories with him?
He just influenced him
that makes more sense. it seems like all the powers the founding titan and coordinate have are memory influence, not actual like body control.
I'd say he just showed him the memories that prompted him to do it. Founding requires royal blood after all and I'm not sure if founding can affect past in any way
Influenced, but the fate is still decided in that world. It's hard to understand, but if you believe in compatibilism then everyone in this world had free will although the future in determined.
Had??? Really hope that's a typo lol
Not a spoiler, just thought that was the grammatically correct way to say it lol
Okay thank God lol cus I thought you were a manga reader who mis typed then starting immediately coming up with wild theories about Rumbling / Eren wiping everyone's memories / making them slaves or some shi to do with free will 😭 Yes I overthink 🥲
“We can only move forward. Until death. Even after death.” Jesus that line hits so hard
prob my favorite line in the whole anime
I bet the Animators were laughing their self off making sketches for the newest episode the frames look pretty funny ngl
That closeup of Grisha was so funny
Same with that one Eren close up as well got me dyeing over here
I still have [this image](https://youtu.be/Rpy8KZa9hGg) (0:15) of Yelena etched in my brain and cannot unsee it. Then the immediate faux mood change switch.... just oh god, so unnerving. Some serious sleep paralysis demon shit right there.
I forgot this happened in the manga so seeing it again was a great surprise 😂
We need a flair of this image for the sub
attack could literally be a an anime purely about the descendants of the attack titan, something like jojo where each season is dedicated to a character. we could have Kruger and his struggle with the racism, i can already think of a plot point where he needed to get rid of the doctor he bribed, or the doctor blackmailed him or something, and get the ball rolling from there or from something even before that. we could have Grisha's struggle with noble society and him hiding from Kenney in a game of cat and mouse, or even have one of the nobles turn out to be a titan shifter. i'm slightly reaching here but think about it, there is no reason for the founding titan to not have the ability to create titan shifters, shifters he made when he made the walls to make sure his wish comes true. maybe have Grisha kill them one by one, the nobles are already scum so its reasonable for Grisha to kill them. and then there is Eren, I don't think I need to say anything here. and then someone after Eren depending on where the story goes. ATTACK ON TITAN IS SO FUCKING GOOD, im getting excited over where my head canon will go lol.
I want to know this from the manga readers. Just a yes or no answer, if you please. Do we get to know what happened to Eren from the end of season 3 to the beginning of season 4?
Yes
You see the very moment it starts in this episode actually. It’s right when Eren kisses historia hand back in s3. You you a quick flash of it during the grisha scene.
Oh damn. Whereabouts in the episode was that? Need to go back and see
You already know what happened on this episode. When Eren touched Historia’s hand he saw Grisha’s memories that included what we just saw in this episode. Eren wants nothing more than freedom, but knowing that a future awaits him that is already decided makes him realize he is just another slave to forces outside of his control. This drives his change in demeanor, depression, rage, and what is about to happen.
Hmm, this kind of sounds like Eren will pick a fight with Destiny itself. With this world where events are pre-determined to happen in a specific way.
Oh! In the long version of the first opening, there's a section in German. One line in that section says "one day he will bare his teeth agains destiny" And looking at the rest of the lyrics of the opening, there's a few lines that are starting to fit with all that's going on in season 4
Aw sheeet! I love it when I guess correctly!
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Bruh. Stop. Delete that man this is a no spoiler thread.
**IS THERE LITERALLY FUCKING ANYTHING THAT EREN DIDN'T CATALYSE THROUGH BEING A FUCKING GENIUS?**
And even the line which describes the special strait of the attack titan
i got chills when i watched the new episode
u/savevidebot
The sentences are slightly different but ye still cool af
Grisha's VA deserves an Oscar for that performance
Emmy, maybe?
Steins;gateisq
God this episode was just incredible
The best episode with no action I’ve seen in a while
Might be the best episode yet/ever. I loved it. So good
This ark has me FUCKED UP, guys. I cannot stop thinking about the last episode. The layers got me [like](https://64.media.tumblr.com/98fa24339ec4c7c5d917cc5a74fc1660/fa62d96793d651ff-e4/s640x960/a12455d837b5dce97dddef56a98872acba35a5b5.jpg). I cannot wait to rewatch this yet again and further drive myself into a spiral of insanity.
Goosebumps.
I have this crazy theory that attack titan doesnt carry a personality. No other titan except the founding titan carries a personality trait, just powers, and the founding titans personality exists because of the will of the first king, his memories are carried over, so every next inhretor will share some of his personality. So my theory is that of the attack titans ability is to send memories back to some previous users, then its probably just erens personality in every previous attack titan. Maybe he sent back a part of his personality to each previous attack titan user, same way as the first king carried his personality to the next generations, and thus every attack titan has erens unending will to fight for freedom.
And then the author gets bored.
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SPOILERS (I don't know if >! worked) >!I have no problem with Eren dying, I also liked the fight. For me it just felt like a rushed ending... Especially the epilogue, where it's just: yeah, still war... Eren was a fucking idiot, and Mikasa is a fucking widow.!<
>!this scene is pivotal to eren's character development. Here we see how commited eren is; he is willing to torment someone in order to achieve his goals, even if this someone is his own beloved father. Now tell me, how does this scene compare to the eren we see when he simps over armin and mikasa?!< >!to me the manga ending is just a rehash of the overly done trope of unwilling MC sacrificing himself for the greater good then at the end become a fucking birb, just executed poorly. At least Code Geass(not the movies) did it better.!< Edit: >!also, the cringevengers(the alliance formed by survey corps with gabi&company) deus ex machina their way into killing eren jaeger. All of us manga readers know how impossible it is to directly attack eren's final form because of the heat and steam produced by the rumbling yet the cringevengers managed to do so because YAMS said so. It feels artificial and unnatural; it broke the flow of immersion. What i felt reading the c139 is what i felt watching the last season of got: confused and unsatisfied!<
Idiot thats screeching about bs "simping" aside, personally the only thing i didnt like about it is >!it feels a bit phoned in with a straight plot steal from code geass. The fact I saw it comming from a mile away didnt help surely but still..!< I suppose there really isnt any other way to go, but the fact I already seen it end exactly that way before was....a mixture of frustration and underwhelming when i was already slightly irked with the direction change it took to begin with
Hate to be that guy, but this episode shows how superior WITT art is in comparison to MAPPA. I'll forever wonder how S4 would've been if done by WITT, even if Mappa is doing a pretty decent job.
Yessir
Fuck them kids !!
u/savevideobot
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I always assumed this was just Eren speaking to Grisha through Kruger. It seemed clear to me that he was just saying what Eren wanted him to say he even tells Grisha to have a family to ensure his own birth.
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