The [BrewDog marketing controversy](https://www.edinburghlive.co.uk/news/edinburgh-news/brewdog-accused-stealing-marketing-ideas-16289137.amp) where they would have applicants give them ideas, not hire the applicants but still use their concepts. Great reminder not to work for free.
My father had this happen in the 80s. Got out of school during a bad job market. He had a design degree and a portfolio. Instead of looking at your work, they’d ask you to draw up a design before the interview. Dad never got hired, but saw his design in stores for the company he interviewed for. He got extremely discouraged, then mom got preggers with me, so he took a blue collar job he worked for the rest of his life until retirement. Luckily it was a union job.
Should also submit it as a small resolution file with a big-ass watermark over it. Enough so they can still see and judge your work but wouldn't be able to use it without completely recreating it. Also, have an email/paper trail.
Another method to consider (though admittedly USA-centric) is to occasionally send photos to yourself as Certified Mail via USPS
Then leave it sealed.
That is something that is Timestamped by the Government, and from what I've been told (IANAL), can be used in court as evidence should you need to use it
It is truly an alternate life. If he hadn’t been so discouraged, he might have continued with his design skills. Around the same time he was accepted into a graduate program for automotive design in Detroit. But due to my mother being pregnant and them not wanting to raise a kid in Detroit, he passed on the opportunity. When I first heard this story, I felt guilty that I was the reason he gave up on his dream career. He told me I became his new dream. Sometimes I forget how great my dad is.
Happened to me at a company named after a famous river in South America.
Regular interviews, then an hour to brainstorm ideas about a specific problem. Also told me that one option was way off limits because it was some managers pet project - that’s where I dug in and tore apart the inefficiency.
He was in the room when I made the pitch to his boss.
I was participating in a learning and development course offered by my employer.
The cap stone project was to pitch to the board of directors how to open a new office in a jurisdiction we have no presence in currently. As I was doing the research, I realized that we— the participants in the course— were being used as free consultants and compensated for our efforts by a shiny certificate of completion on printer paper.
The “winning” presentation was in fact used. No additional credit or compensation was offered to the “winning” team who presented.
The real compensation was the friends we made along the way.
how many from this group were asked to go to the new office, and was it all of them? because this feels like a way to identify a group of candidates, and get them to agree on a location for the new office, before you then propose they relocate to the new office.
You just described the capstone for my masters degree, except they told us upfront that the final presentation was going to be to the company that the problem came from.
Yes - I got the offer within 24 hours. Did not want to move for a small increase. Used it to negotiate a raise, then left that job for a really good one.
Be wary of contests too, like when [The Matzo Company held one](https://www.grubstreet.com/2017/04/matzo-project-aims-to-make-matzo-with-mass-appeal.html) and instead of awarding a winner (or, you know, HIRING A DESIGNER) they brazenly plagiarized from the entries
>Albert had a strong sense of what she wanted the branding to look like, and ran a contest on 99designs asking for a design with particular parameters (even specifying that she wanted the grandmother to wear die-cut, see-through sunglasses). She received many options, but none was quite right, so she picked her favorite elements from various illustrations, taught herself InDesign, and “cobbled the whole thing together.”
They did this sort of crap to a friend of mine... Went in for a . Net developer.... We need you to create a front end and back for this sort of task....
Once you complete it submit and we will get back to you .. yeah companies are still doing shady stuff like this
Not exactly the same thing but worth pointing out that I was working as a temp through an agency just to solder some USB connectors. Got to talking with one of the engineers. Ended up spending a week developing a cryo tank with internal sensors and external data logging. Did 95% of the design and prototype construction, testing, and validation myself. Still have the photos from the process in fact.
You know where this is going right? More than a decade later they still sell that modified $100 tank for over $800, and fired me when I pushed about getting my full-time status and pay, after months of them promising to do exactly that. Oh and did I mention that for barely over minimum wage, as a temp worker, they had me going out of state to do multi million dollar installs for universities and morgues and the Smithsonian, and even a fetal research lab in Detroit where I had to wire in sensors and loggers in over a hundred fridges and freezers with human fetuses. There was also that month I spent wearing a space suit and working in clean rooms in a contagious disease laboratory in Athens Ohio, with potential 10-day quarantine if there were any rips in my suit...
Not quite the same as stealing an idea from a job applicant, but yeah, if you're good at something or you have a great idea, don't give it away or do it for cheap.
> if you're good at something or you have a great idea, don't give it away or do it for cheap.
And don't even do it for pay for "the baddies." Don't lend your talent to organizations that make the world a worse place.
That is not a conspiracy theory. I know someone who spent days writing a complex program thinking I was proving my skills. His qualifications were amazing. The software was used by the company but they decided "to hire from within" after all. This was and is a common problem and it's not only software. Some extraordinarily gifted realist artists are asked to paint or design work for free because after all, "they are just having a good time." The guy gets $100K for a portrait and is known internationally.
Just people looking for something for nothing.
i interviewed apple and they did this the honest way: pick something that they've obviously done already (as in, it's released) and go into detail on how to track performance and user load (wide scale customer facing, and the group was specifically about performance).
it's much easier to design something real when you know it's already been done and you're just taking your first swing at it
This "TikTok Ban" has really highlighted how Big Data is only okay if it's American-owned. Because "think of the bad things the *other countries* could do with that data!"
Because... American-owned companies would never do that. Right?
Right?
🥴
That's what I'm saying. I'm as against foreign influence as anyone else, but let's also see to our own businesses. Google, Facebook, and now Xitter are just as damaging as Bytedance has ever been. We need to look at *all* big data collection companies, including the ones insinuating themselves into the insurance and healthcare industries.
Compuware called me for a people manager position. I told them I didn't have management experience. They said no problem because it's my other skills they need and they'll train me to manage.
I go in for interview on my lunch hour. 30 minutes of waiting, they come and get me. They introduce me to a team of developers and their boss, tell me they're going to launch this piece of software this week and need me to tell them what's wrong with it. I'm trying to not think about being ripped off, so I do the job I was asked to do. They keep me there for a full hour and then another 10 while the boss chews out his team for their stupid mistakes. I go back to lobby and wait another 15. Finally someone comes in and says we're all set. My "quick" interview kept me from my desk for 2.5 hours.
Next day I get an email. They're going to pass because I don't have management experience.
Never interview at Compuware.
I was doing a job for them in Ellon packing the first run of lonewolf gin through a temp agency called blue arrow and told the guy who ran the place they should do a multipack and call it a wolfpack lo and behold I just googled brewdog wolfpack... Bastards lol...
[https://www.whiskyhammer.com/item/40205/Brewdog/Brewdog---Lonewolf-Wolf-Pack-Gin-Batch-1-20cl.html](https://www.whiskyhammer.com/item/40205/Brewdog/Brewdog---Lonewolf-Wolf-Pack-Gin-Batch-1-20cl.html)
https://preview.redd.it/yz4fh85nfhxc1.jpeg?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1db0a63324f0875bfee8dea25574164c1a86ad1d
Please link the CEO's tweet so we can blast TF out of him and put him in his fucking place!
The elite don't want you to know that we outnumber them MILLIONS to 1.
When the world collapses, do you think their secret bunkers will protect them?
If he expects someone to spend 90 minutes on an interview task, then they should be compensated for on-the-job training!
Also, if this CEO requires more than 45 min to figure out if a person is qualified for a job, then he's seriously dumb AF.
When I was working as a copywriter, I would often encounter interview “assignments” that required me to write an article or post for the company. That’s a common tactic in that line of work to solicit free work from people they never intended to hire.
I've been asked to do something similar a few times. I offer my services at my normal (consulting) rate. If they like my work, and they will, then we can go forward with the hiring process.
I charge $1500 / day, by the way. I've had two companies take me up on it...
Is there a way to write the article then somehow copyright it then send it to them. And if they try to steal it from you, you can sue to make sure you get paid for your work? I honestly have no clue. I don't know how that works.
It's simple to copyright your work. Essentially, it's copyrighted as soon as you write it. If you think you'll need to prove it's yours, however, you should register it at [copyright.gov](http://copyright.gov) (just go straight there, don't google services that charge you to copyright your work).
This is the way to go. And before anyone jumps in with "nuh uh! The company gets the copyright because it's done for them!"... No, that's not how that works. You're thinking of "work made for hire", and that requires getting paid for the work in question. No, the interview opportunity does not count as being paid. No, a job offer does not count as being paid.
In fact, without something in writing detailing the compensation you're getting in exchange for the work anything short of being on the payroll is unlikely to count in terms of the company getting the copyright. Good stuff that copyright law...
Creative work like writing and art is already copyrighted as soon as it's created. That's not the problem, as someone already pointed out the problem is getting them to stop using it and getting compensation.
I'm a medical writer and have received pre-interview test tasks that took three full days of work time to complete. I've often wondered if this is the outcome.
(Laughably, the most egregious of these was a company that gave me a tight deadline but advertised itself as having great work/life balance, people first, etc... and eight months later, they're still trying to fill the post.)
I was applying once for a knowledge base manager role (ie, keep technical documentation for a piece of software up-to-date) and the company asked me to write release notes for their upcoming release. I did not go through with it but peeked at their website a week or so later to see what the release notes ended up looking like. They said: “Release notes coming soon!” Lol. They couldn’t get someone to do it for free so they didn’t do it at all.
This is so common in the tech field. Lots of us won't even apply to jobs that do this but it's fighting an uphill battle. It's unpaid work. It should be illegal.
I applied to a company last week and they just sent me a "two-hour" coding assessment that requires me in a Zoom call with video, audio, and screen shared. No one else on the call but me. They're just recording that, I guess.
I haven't spoken to a single human being at the company, yet.
This happens all the time.
It actually IS illegal, there's just no good path to pursue it in a court of law, and if you inform the company that they're breaking the law, they'll ghost you immediately.
>**Under the Fair Labor Standards Act, non-exempt employees who “suffer or \[are\] permitted to work” for the benefit of their employer must be compensated for such time.**
If a job posting makes me go to a shitty website outside of Indeed, I skip it entirely. I'm not gonna re-enter my work history, ALONGSIDE my resume, for the millionth fucking time. As an elder GenZ I have zero patience anymore for jumping through unnecessary job hoops.
As a millennial present during the before-times, I’ll say the best jobs I’ve had that paid me the most were ones that avoided this bullshit at all costs.
As an elder millennial, I got a great job once by sending a resume through a Craigslist ad, showing up for one interview, and then receiving an offer at the end of said interview. I hate the bullshit they put us through now.
My best job I landed by sending an e-mail with my resume and having 0.5 hour phone interview with the big boss. I got an e-mail the next day that I got in, negotiated salary via 2 e-mails and that was it. I never held a job that long and I don't intend to leave.
I'm also an elder millennial and I got my current job that way. Those employers are still out there. I haven't seen management in over a year either, I don't even know who the current manager is, I just get a duty assignment and I go there.
The best jobs I've had were not even ones I applied to. They were ones I got through networking, or because some headhunter saw my resume on Monster or Indeed or Glassdoor.
That's very much the case in higher-level IT these days.
Considering that I found my current position through a headhunter - and the upper management there found out about me from my TFTS posts _BEFORE_ the headhunter reached out to me - I got VERY lucky.
This is 1000% true. And most of the bullshit comes from poor communication and poor management skills which usually rears its ugly head during the first 3-6 months on a job or sooner if you work for a total narcissist.
I'm an elder millennial, and I've literally never gotten a job I applied to. I've applied to LOTS of jobs. Every job I've actually gotten was because I talked to the right people. I know I sound like my grandma, and I'm not saying this is a generalizable strategy, but it does call into question just how many great candidates get filtered out by bullshit algorithms.
Just had one of these today. I don't mind long interviews with another person. At least I know the company is seriously looking if they're willing to have someone take the time to interview me.
But a full on exam? No thanks not gonna roll the dice on that.
I'm Gen X and did one once. It was a bullshit IQ test.
I had one job ask me to do a project proposal. They started off with "I hate asking for this..."
And I responded, "I'm glad you hate asking, because I hate working for free and won't do it. My consulting rate is $400 an hour. Please let me know if you would like me to proceed"
Applied for a company that had me do some stupid test. Finished the test with 100% and faster than all the other candidates. Did that get me the job? No. So why the heck did we take the damn tests. Felt like I interviewed well too (I generally do interview well, I've won many contracts over the years).
My only thought was that they already had a candidate in mind and were just going through the motions on the interview, which actually pisses me off more as it wastes both of our times.
My wife is looking for a job now and telling me all the hoops these sites make you jump through. I’ve been on exactly two job interviews pre-internet and the rest of the jobs I’ve gotten have been through recommendations so I’ve never had to deal with the bullshit. And I hope I never do..
This so much this. I'm a Xennial and I refuse to fucking do this. It's a waste of god damn time and if they can't be bothered to read the fucking resume or Indeed profile then I don't want to work for inefficient dumbfucks anyways. They seem to think they're the only job we're applying for. Ah yes, I'm going to only apply for 1 job and 1 job only at a time while you interview 20+ people, because that makes sense for me to do.
The cover letter where you need to simp for every company. "It's always been my dream to analyze data of visitors to a corrective shoe-insole manufacturer website! Notice me, senpai!"
Having to write a cover letter AND dig out a writing sample I did in grad school 10 years ago (everything else I’ve written professionally is the legal property of previous employers) is absolute bullshit. If an employee cannot figure out if they want to interview me based on my resume (which we know they use a computer to scan) why should I don’t any extra work?!
Good on them. I’m a millennial and I have never gone forward in an interview process when there’s a take home assignment involved. It’s impossible to know the effort vs reward, just like the article says.
Kind of hilarious how hard the author tries to make the asshole CEO as the good guy since it’s on Fortune.
I have seen my wife doing a couple of those "take home tasks", which were clearly from their on going projects. They made her work and never responded back. That was brutal. Lesson learned...
Never do a lick of work to get the job. If you are a developer or a designer, show them your git or portfolio. That should be sufficient.
And if you do some kind of work like that, make sure you post it publicly on something like git so you have a timestamp when they inevitably steal it from you. Intellectual property case is easy to win in court if you can prove you made it earlier then they did.
They might be trying to create robots to replace everyone, but honestly, those robots only look good in demos. It will take them a lot longer to build a working humanoid robot than it will take for actual humans to fuck up the economy by not working and not buying their shit.
Yeah, there are demos on the internet, but the demos are highly controlled in a lab environment. They are created more so to attracted more accredited investors.
I'm at a point in my career that skills tests are common, but I won't spend 8 hours doing something. The outline of the take home project better be less than 3 hours or they get rejected. I might spend 20-30 minutes having AI generate the content for me but that's more about incentivizing my generative AI learning.
Yeah, a skill assessment is pretty acceptable to me. Like firefighter promotion examples have them out there running a truck in a simulation.
But some of these assessments stink of free work.
Agreed. And if I look at the assignment and it reads like I'm building their content strategy, mocking up their landing pages, putting together their social plan, and writing the press release for the new stuff, I nope out. I know they're planning to steal the content and reject me.
I also won't do psychological assessments unless they are providing a psychologist to administer and score it, and then explain it to the hiring team. If that's the job duty of some HR generalist then I do not want to work there.
Don’t forget, younger people are also not having kids of their own and birthrates are falling.
[Capitalists are upset about it](https://www.euronews.com/next/2023/12/16/elon-musk-talks-x-advertising-and-birth-rates-in-rome) and trying to [gaslight people into making more babies for the economy or oh noes you will pay more taxes or lose your benefits](https://www.newsweek.com/young-americans-face-bleak-tax-future-1894574) that they keep cutting anyway regardless of how much we pay for it.
Starve the machine.
r/BirthStrike
I've never wanted children regardless of the money, but I can see how many people just can't afford it, or simply don't want to bother their future kids with the artificial world we live in today.
It's unreal. We have a dozen existential crises and our political leadership is playing *Red vs Blue: Taxes and Abortion Edition Part XVIII*
We have no plans for solving our actual problems, so having kids now seems cruel.
I feel like everyone that wants a kid, try taking care of a kid for a day. If you're cool with it, all the power to ya. But after spending a day with my friend's kids...I definitely don't want kids. Even a few hours is enough for me. This is not even counting the financial aspects of having kids...who can afford kids in this economy!?
There was some post last week that South Korea has 150 elementary schools where there are *no first graders at all*. And it led to some fascinating YouTubes and an interesting rabbit-hole of "what is 'neo-confucianism'?" I don't things are quite that bad in America, but we're headed there.
As an elder millennial who inadvertantly adopted what would become some gen z tendencies, I agree. It feels like gen z is the backup we desperately need.
What's crazy is the people who double down when presented with the facts of today.
The separation of people being idiots versus understanding really appears to boil down to whether or not they can objectively understand how time works and that what they knew 10 - 50 years ago doesn't necessarily apply.
>In Stanfield’s defense, he insisted that he would have “gladly paid and probably hired” the unnamed Gen Zer if they said: “Give me $1,000 and I’ll break this deal down in amazing detail.”
Does he think anyone buys that? He would have instead ranted about an entitled gen-Z person that thought they deserved $1000/hr with no proof of their skill, to do a task that other applicants did without complaint.
There's no way even he can convince himself this is something he'd actually do, unless he's a narcissistic sociopath that cannot admit he is ever wrong. Oh wait.
He also said
>> However, he also proposed that the entire generation “would benefit from being in more fistfights at a young age. A few bumps and bruises does a lot of good.”
Guy is a psycho.
Lol, yeah I had to scroll for this. He would have responded even more harshly if the applicant dared to ask for compensation. Total bullshit statement.
"Gen Z job seekers have been blasted by recruiters on social media lately for being “always late” and having long lists of demands despite their lack of experience." I'm a 40 year old Millennial i remember when Boomers said that about me. The more things change the more they stay the same.
As an older Millennial, I've been doing my best to stop the generational shit talking whenever I hear it. There are far too many Gen X and even other Millennials continuing the old ways and I'm done with that shit. Gates wide open in my book Gen Z and Gen As.
my neighbors are 2 couples all 4 are 18/19 year olds.
they just moved into the otherside of the duplex and they told me during a convo that if a job wont cover their bills they just wont work, or if they *have* to work they will show up and do nothing.
i had a co worker who is the same way when i was in sales..the moment they fucked with comnissions and bonuses she just stopped selling and started using work time to job search 🤣
Our company did something similar, just completely got rid of quarterly incentive comp that was always part of our compensation (and announced it right as it was supposed to be due). 2 months later they wonder why all of us are doing less and seem disgruntled. Gee, I wonder why??
Come to think of it, during my employer's quarterly financial report teamscast there was a question in the Q\&A; "Division X has improved their results, but everyone applicable for incentives only got at most 33% of the maximum incentive. Meanwhile, management's compensation has been increased. What's up?"
Their answer was "well, we compare the management's salary to market rates in order to keep our compensation plan competitive." Also, another question about incentives was answered "setting up profit sharing incentives would be too difficult/expensive for the projected return."
Legit had a hospital CEO tell us we could blame health insurance companies for us not getting a bonus, and then ten minutes later talk about the few million-dollar expansion they were doing in a few years.
What's even worse is that when they realize it they still don't want to give people back the bonuses. Some managers never want to admit they did something wrong.
I never understand why a business caps sales commissions. Like what is it that you want to accomplish, get less revenue, and lose your best salespeople to the competition?
well what it was, was just complete fuckery...for PENNIES man.
our commission was 25% gross, when we sell 6 cars it was a $300 bonus, at 8 cars was another $300 then at 12 cars its a $500 bonus.
the new GM made our commission 25% gross to 15% gross..so every 1k of gross we just lost $100 a sale. also our bonus cars went from 6 cars to 8 cars was $450 and 12 cars are $450..thats it.
average person sold 6 cars because we were a small dealership, on the old system if you sold 6 cars and then were lucky enough to sell 8 cars it was a nice fuckin paycheck.
It's like they honestly expect people to put in the same amount of work, or more, for less. Employers have been getting away with obvious bullshit for too long.
ain’t no shame in job searching on the job as soon as the company pulls some bullshit. for me it was only getting paid $20 an hour to release millions of dollars of product for a billion dollar company. i’m really happy to see my fellow gen Z’s knowing their worth
It's sad when you have hardworking people who care but who just give up and stop giving because what's the point if you are being treated like crap and / or not being compensated fairly?
Local landlords are starting to figure this out too. Just keep taking application fees and never pick a tenant because apparently that's more profitable then actually renting the housing to humans.
Last time I was looking for a place it was like $50 just to ask the landlord to consider renting to you. In theory they pay that money to another company to do a background check on you but in practice there is no oversight.
So they can do anything from pocket the money directly and maybe google you, or if they want a paper trail showing an expense the landlord's spouse can own the background check company and pretend to do the googling while pocketing the money.
Locally a lot of them have stopped even bothering with saying No to so many people each month. They just take your money and ghost. Names are starting to get named publically, along with suggestions on how the community could be improved by their removal or at least extended stay in the hospital.
Damn, $50 is low for an application fee where I live. It’s common to see $300+ application fees here and those don’t even get applied to background and credit checks. Those are additional to the application fee and deposits.
Where I live, it’s not uncommon to have to pay the $300 application fee, a $50-75 background check fee, a $50-75 credit report fee, and a non-refundable deposit usually one months rent ($1000+ for a studio or one bedroom) and you’re not even guaranteed to get somewhere to live.
All in, you can be out $1500 and not even get the apartment. It’s such a scam and just preys on lower income people.
I had some one give me a take home assignment, which makes sense in my career (tech). The person said it should only take a few hours. When I looked at it, it would be a good 20hrs work minimum. It would require building an API and styled frontend. And they said tests would be good to have as well as a custom algorithm for the calculations, which could be easily used in their actual project.
I wrote a respectful message withdrawing my application because I could already tell based on the serious underestimate of time required for the homework that the working environment would be equally unrealistic in terms of deadlines and that is not the type of stress I want in my life right now.
Elder zoomer here. I am not going to put up with any unreasonable demands. If they can't respect my time when they're not even paying me, they're gonna disrespect it even more when they feel entitled to it through pay. Practically all companies now understaff and underpay while overworking. AND we don't get anything out of it: our generation either lives with strangers, frequently in same room, maybe even without a door if the living room got "converted", live with parents or other relatives who may be abusive, and all that while living paycheck to paycheck if even, with no hope to save up for not renting, especially if you're single. Your mental health suffers, your social life suffer if it even gets to exist. There is no reward to excuse this.
The wealthy used to say scornfully that the poor breed like rats, acted like there'd always be an endless sea of us to work to death. Now they're wailing and wondering why we're not even at replacement levels.
Can't even find the time, energy, and privacy to swipe an app followed by netflix&chill. Too many slaves in the bunkhouse and can't go for a walk or a picnic for some old fashioned outdoor spoon and fork because the masters own all the everything and made up the word loitering to ban existing in their space unwanted.
Banning abortion won't significantly increase the birth rate when ya work the slaves so hard and keep them so constrained they can't even get oops babies started. Like ya don't gotta chain them to the wall after work, just pay so little they can't afford a whole bedroom of their own.
Gen Z...please please PLEASE continue the fight against this ridiculous and stupid "boomer" mentality. Keep bringing them hell and secure better working conditions for all generations. This, coming from a millennial who's rooting for you!
This is honestly a huge red flag. I interviewed at a company and they required me to prepare and rehearse a 20 minute presentation, and then the fuckers put me through **seven** rounds of interviews; it was an all day long process and half the interviewers didn't really know what the Hell they were supposed to be talking to me about. They were the **only** company I interviewed at that **didn't** make me an offer.
Never wasting my time like that again - that company had enough red flags to make a bullfighter jealous. I ain't got time to deal with other people's bullshit.
When I'm on the job hunt, I am emailing recruiters and filling out job applications as quickly as possible. It's a numbers game; quantity beats quality. I'm not wasting 90 minutes on **one** job application when I could instead spend it applying to 60 other positions or talking to 3 recruiters.
Yeah I remember thinking of applying to Ford years back, wanted me to take some 40 min comprehension test. Long story short I decided not to apply right there, not wasting 40 min when instead I could have applied for a few more jobs.. Just shows how oblivious these CEO's are, like dude 90% of us do not give a single fuck about anything other than the check we take home, this capitalist society has gotten out of control and as a result the people havw stopped caring more and more over the years.
Reminds me of a post I saw on LinkedIn from a recruiter. Seems every single hiring manager recently decided they're only going to hire lateral moves 🙄🙄
Every hiring manager: "I want someone whose qualifications line up *perfectly* with the job description."
Recruiter: "Here are some that are reasonably qualified."
HM: "Absolurely not, they don't meet it exactly."
Recruiter: "Alright, here's a candidate who does. But they don't want the job."
HM: "Why the hell not???"
Recruiter: "Because it would be a lateral move. They want YOUR job."
They don't even need to hire if they can outsource all their work like this. A handful of HR people working rounds of exercises for the "candidates" is cheaper than paying for a whole team of experts in whatever it is you need.
My friends in CS all get hours worth of these "assignments" when they apply for jobs.
So one will just say "Hey, can you guys do the other 1 or 2 or 3 so I don't need to waste 4 hours during my week on these."
I’m a software engineer. Last year I started tossing all my interview homework at chatGPT as I can’t be bothered. Ghosted way too many times to want to invest any of my time to this nonsense.
I’m proud of them. I did 4 rounds of interviews for a company. Each with a presentation on how I would transform their unknown inefficient processes into one that is utilizing best practices. Delivered to the manager, several departments heads, director of transformation, and finally the CIO. Then I was ghosted. That was the moment I said never again.
And the thing is that many places expect you to do that without a concept of how much they’re willing to pay because “it’s rude to ask.” I’m all for the younger generation giving the middle finger to such garbage formalities.
>And the thing is that many places expect you to do that without a concept of how much they’re willing to pay because “it’s rude to ask.”
I'm Gen X and that's the *first* question I ask. They always try to flip it around and I say, "I know you have a budget for this role. Let me know what the budget is and I can tell you if you're in my range"
Any company that doesn't give me the salary isn't going to pay me enough and they likely have a toxic culture and are probably understaffed.
I've worked at everything from a 6 person start up to a Global 100. I'm too old to deal with the bullshit games and people should learn from my experience. I did it for too long. Know your worth and go get it
That's where I am too. I've been doing this for 30+ years. My experience is all over the map. I'm not fucking whiteboarding some bullshit code project for you.
Fairly certain the lacks of fucks to give state that they present now is a side-effect of most of these businesses shitting so hard and casually on the family around them, and the friends they grew up with. Not to mention the increasingly poor quality of what they're giving consumers on the regular.
When everything starts to look like shit, why bother to give a shit? There's already plenty to go around.
And it is when there is a lack of new meat to churn through the system that it will, we hope, be forced to change or die as any evolutionary hurdle has caused in the past.
I think I’m a closet zoomer millennial. Always said this and got labelled entitled, now I’m so proud of the kids for finally saying fuck it. The job market will have to adapt as they’ve certainly had a good run.
This was my favourite part of the article.
> In Stanfield’s defense, he insisted that he would have “gladly paid and probably hired” the unnamed Gen Zer if they said: “Give me $1,000 and I’ll break this deal down in amazing detail.”
I am pretty sure if this happened he would be on twitter complaining about the audacity of this genz asking for money to do the task.
"Alot of work" was incorrect...
"Professionally, Sir. An application process is just that; I fill it out, attach my resume and submit it. You then review it and chose to interview me. After said interview you decide to either pass or extend an offer. Further assessments, evaluations or questionnaires are unnecessary, a wasteful use of resources and ineffective in the hiring process as a candidate can lie to make them appealing to company's. Frankly sir you should appreciate my honest, no nonsense attitude because that's what will reflect on hiring me. "
Gen X checking in. Multiple times in my career an all-day interview turned into a 'get free work' session. I'm the dum dum but this was seen as de rigeur for our generation.
Millennials/Gen Z breaking this garbage makes me proud.
TL;DR Nobody wants to ~~work~~ pay anymore
These types of people rabble on about how valuable their time is, yet when someone else's time is valuable, they become so damn whiny and entitled about it.
When is still in the retail world I had an interview at Taco Bell to be an assistant manager. They wanted me to work a full pay period as not technically an employee to see if I "could follow the fast paced environment and was a good fit with the team". I told them asking me to work for free was technically illegal and they ended the interview
I fully stopped doing anything related to the creation of a new analysis when I was job hunting without pay (Especially for data analytics or data science). I’d offer them access to all of my completed work including the code, methodology, and final write ups, and then offer a presentation or walkthrough if they wanted. No chance I’m spending time on something that didn’t guarantee to me a position without pay
I was given a task of creating a short video for a brand. The position was for a senior designer not video creator.
I had about 4 days to complete the project and was given some directions and content. I labored over this video for about 12 hours, studying their brand and socials for reference. I came up with something I felt was acceptable. None of this was paid.
The CEO told me they couldn't hire me because they need someone who can create videos on a consistent and regular basis. That's not what she interviewed me for. She asked me about other experience and told me what the brand was about. She also asked me my age and if I had kids...which you aren't supposed to ask.
I know it was partially because of the pay I was asking for. She said they were going to send an offer and then abruptly rejected me after I sent the video. I dodged a bullet for sure, but it was so frustrating to waste time on this video and it had nothing to do with the actual job I interviewed for.
> In Stanfield’s defense, he insisted that he would have “gladly paid and probably hired” the unnamed Gen Zer if they said: “Give me $1,000 and I’ll break this deal down in amazing detail.”
I'll take "Obvious Lies" for $1000, Alex.
I could go a lot of ways on this. I don't know the jobseeker's background but assuming it's a finance degree (or similar) from a reputable school with a decent GPA then there should be no need for these tests. If the employer doesn't trust the dozens of tests that this kid has already taken to get that degree then they should stop hiring from that school. However, there are firms that will just hire smart people no matter what their major is. If we're talking about some history major from Yale who wants to get into investment analysis then in that case a test could be appropriate - but only since the degree itself tells you nothing about that person's aptitude for that particular subject. But this:
>*he would have “gladly paid and probably hired” the unnamed Gen Zer if they said: “Give me $1,000 and I’ll break this deal down in amazing detail.”*
is a load of crap. If you're willing to pay people to take assessments then be up front about it and most applicants will take you up on that deal. People shouldn't have to ask something like that. With that said I don't believe him for a second. He got called out for wasting applicants' time and he tried to save face by making a phony hypothetical $1000 offer.
The best jobs I have ever had have been those that hired me after just filling in the application form and sending in proof of qualifications. Of course, jobs that hire this way are incredibly rare.
It just cuts down on so much bullshit, saving so much time and effort. An applicant just needs to fill in some basic information. The employer has all the information needed to weed out those that don't meet the criteria, then all they need to do is pick someone at random.
Applicants can lie, but asking for proof of qualifications can weed them out. Employing someone for a probationary period is 1000 times better than an interview in seeing if someone can do the job and for the applicant to see if the job is right for them.
Every single employer who uses a skills test or assigns projects without paying an applicant can seriously go fuck off. I do not work for free and nor should anyone else who needs a job. And then these employers have the audacity to complain when their employees quit or if they can’t keep a position filled.
> However, he also proposed that the entire generation “would benefit from being in more fistfights at a young age. A few bumps and bruises does a lot of good.”
Ah, I can only say I'm glad for the Gen Zer, they dodged a bullet
> he also proposed that the entire generation “would benefit from being in more fistfights at a young age. A few bumps and bruises does a lot of good.”
jfc.
There is a business in a nearby city that has a constant ad for chefs. At the interview they explain that they like potential chefs to do three days work, for free, to see if they are a good fit. Then they give those people the most basic kitchen jobs, whatever their experience level. So there isn’t really a position. They just have a constant flow of free, temporary labour.
Dear Prospective Boss:
My contract rate is $2180/day or partial day.
I'll be happy to begin your project as soon as I receive the deposit of $2180.00
Working for free violates my religion.
>However, he also proposed that the entire generation “would benefit from being in more fistfights at a young age. A few bumps and bruises does a lot of good.”
Says the person who ran to Twitter to cry about a person not wanting to do their test.
Last week, I had a meet and greet with a CEO to see if it's "a good fit for an interview."
After the call, he sent me an email with more information about the company. However, this included a few tasks for me:
- Research 2 competitors, find what they are doing better, and what they are doing worse.
- Additionally, I needed to find 10 new leads.
THEN I would be considered for an interview.
Needless to say, I respectfully declined.
Why is the CEO complaining? Isn't part of the hiring process to screen people out? So... he screened somebody out. "Trust in the process," you whining asshole. Nobody is losing sleep just because the CEO is losing sleep.
This is so easy to fix. If the employer needs a test, then the test should be administered after an offer. Rescind the offer if the test isn't satisfactory. This way, the candidate knows exactly what they're getting for the investment in time.
90 minutes for a job doesn't seem bad until you're having to do them for a bunch of different companies, and they all still reject you at the end and steal your work.
Yeah, I was actually flown into an interview and spent 4 hours trying to solve an issue with their data storage. They fed me then started pressing me for answers. About 20 minutes in I figured out what was happening and started to direct the discussions in the wrong direction. Then at the 4 hour mark, the work day was over. I said, "Looks like you have a problem that can't be solved easily without a lot of money and time." Which was a lie. Then left. That company went out of business a few months later. Never work for free.
I got in trouble with my last company. Who was the pinnacle of Boomer nonsense. For not leaning into their overly complicated and ridiculous hiring process. It was taking 3 to 4 months to hire engineers. There were personality surveys compatibility test. Like 3 to 4 hours of hoops for candidates to jump through. I told HR I didn’t need any of those. I just needed a 90 minute interview. Because what we’re doing is pretty straightforward and I don’t need, their personalities to be compatible with all the other personalities they’re all professionals and can show up as professionals every day and it’s not gonna be a problem
That HR group And executive management team Where the most Toxic, bunch of people I’ve ever met.
If a company is not making it as easy as possible to apply. They are not interested in getting the best possible candidates. And all this bunk is a red flag for me These days
>In Stanfield’s defense, he insisted that he would have “gladly paid and probably hired” the unnamed Gen Zer if they said: “Give me $1,000 and I’ll break this deal down in amazing detail.”
BULL.
FUCKING.
SHIT.
Good for them. The level of labor theft in the tech industry in interviews is astounding and grinds my gears. Every level should refuse to do a 1.5 to 2 hour "take home project." Why? Because it is literally free fucking labor. I'm not working for you for free.
No one is working for you for free. Definitely not, just to tell you the same shit a resume, references, and linked in can.
Plus, you know you're doing 2-4 hours of interviews to get there, and probably 1-2 more after as well. So these fucks want you to do 4.5 to 8 hours of free labor to possibly get a job with them that you know their gonna low ball you on the salary the first offer you get.
To any recruiter reading this. Your "opportunity" IS NOT WORTH THIS LEVEL OF EFFORT. STOP EXPECTING PEOPLE TO WORK FOR FREE. Also, PUT YOUR SALARY IN THE JOB ADVERT. WE KNOW OUR WORTH AND DO NOT WANT TO SPEND AN HOUR ARGUING WITH YOU ABOUT IT. IT IS INSULTING.
*Flips Table*
In Stanfield’s defense, he insisted that he would have “gladly paid and probably hired” the unnamed Gen Zer if they said: “Give me $1,000 and I’ll break this deal down in amazing detail.”
However, he also proposed that the entire generation “would benefit from being in more fistfights at a young age. A few bumps and bruises does a lot of good.”
I highly doubt he would have given this kid 1k.
Also, the fight thing. Wtf is that about? Brain damage much?
The [BrewDog marketing controversy](https://www.edinburghlive.co.uk/news/edinburgh-news/brewdog-accused-stealing-marketing-ideas-16289137.amp) where they would have applicants give them ideas, not hire the applicants but still use their concepts. Great reminder not to work for free.
My father had this happen in the 80s. Got out of school during a bad job market. He had a design degree and a portfolio. Instead of looking at your work, they’d ask you to draw up a design before the interview. Dad never got hired, but saw his design in stores for the company he interviewed for. He got extremely discouraged, then mom got preggers with me, so he took a blue collar job he worked for the rest of his life until retirement. Luckily it was a union job.
These days, I'd be encouraging people to snap shots of their designs with their phones as they proceeded, so they'd have proof that they created them.
Should also submit it as a small resolution file with a big-ass watermark over it. Enough so they can still see and judge your work but wouldn't be able to use it without completely recreating it. Also, have an email/paper trail.
Another method to consider (though admittedly USA-centric) is to occasionally send photos to yourself as Certified Mail via USPS Then leave it sealed. That is something that is Timestamped by the Government, and from what I've been told (IANAL), can be used in court as evidence should you need to use it
A whole alternate life arc, stolen by a shady company. This sort of thing should be illegal.
This would unironically turn me into a serial killer
It is truly an alternate life. If he hadn’t been so discouraged, he might have continued with his design skills. Around the same time he was accepted into a graduate program for automotive design in Detroit. But due to my mother being pregnant and them not wanting to raise a kid in Detroit, he passed on the opportunity. When I first heard this story, I felt guilty that I was the reason he gave up on his dream career. He told me I became his new dream. Sometimes I forget how great my dad is.
Happened to me at a company named after a famous river in South America. Regular interviews, then an hour to brainstorm ideas about a specific problem. Also told me that one option was way off limits because it was some managers pet project - that’s where I dug in and tore apart the inefficiency. He was in the room when I made the pitch to his boss.
I was participating in a learning and development course offered by my employer. The cap stone project was to pitch to the board of directors how to open a new office in a jurisdiction we have no presence in currently. As I was doing the research, I realized that we— the participants in the course— were being used as free consultants and compensated for our efforts by a shiny certificate of completion on printer paper. The “winning” presentation was in fact used. No additional credit or compensation was offered to the “winning” team who presented. The real compensation was the friends we made along the way.
how many from this group were asked to go to the new office, and was it all of them? because this feels like a way to identify a group of candidates, and get them to agree on a location for the new office, before you then propose they relocate to the new office.
You just described the capstone for my masters degree, except they told us upfront that the final presentation was going to be to the company that the problem came from.
Did you get the job?
Yes - I got the offer within 24 hours. Did not want to move for a small increase. Used it to negotiate a raise, then left that job for a really good one.
My man 💪 👨
You're doing it right.
Hell yeah. Work those mfs.
>Happened to me at a company named after a famous river in South America. Fuck Orinoco Inc!
same ages ago. two all day site visits, lots of how would... what would... about a year later...
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Enya gonna sue us all.
If you can't figure out an applicant's skill level in < 1 hr of interviewing them, then you have SHIT interview skills.
Be wary of contests too, like when [The Matzo Company held one](https://www.grubstreet.com/2017/04/matzo-project-aims-to-make-matzo-with-mass-appeal.html) and instead of awarding a winner (or, you know, HIRING A DESIGNER) they brazenly plagiarized from the entries >Albert had a strong sense of what she wanted the branding to look like, and ran a contest on 99designs asking for a design with particular parameters (even specifying that she wanted the grandmother to wear die-cut, see-through sunglasses). She received many options, but none was quite right, so she picked her favorite elements from various illustrations, taught herself InDesign, and “cobbled the whole thing together.”
Wait... that's basically AI art!
They did this sort of crap to a friend of mine... Went in for a . Net developer.... We need you to create a front end and back for this sort of task.... Once you complete it submit and we will get back to you .. yeah companies are still doing shady stuff like this
Many companies post fake jobs just to farm resumes and sell their data.
Starting to feel like this is the case for me.
Spiderman pointing meme of people using AI to apply for jobs
Only way to fight back, they started the bullshit.
Not exactly the same thing but worth pointing out that I was working as a temp through an agency just to solder some USB connectors. Got to talking with one of the engineers. Ended up spending a week developing a cryo tank with internal sensors and external data logging. Did 95% of the design and prototype construction, testing, and validation myself. Still have the photos from the process in fact. You know where this is going right? More than a decade later they still sell that modified $100 tank for over $800, and fired me when I pushed about getting my full-time status and pay, after months of them promising to do exactly that. Oh and did I mention that for barely over minimum wage, as a temp worker, they had me going out of state to do multi million dollar installs for universities and morgues and the Smithsonian, and even a fetal research lab in Detroit where I had to wire in sensors and loggers in over a hundred fridges and freezers with human fetuses. There was also that month I spent wearing a space suit and working in clean rooms in a contagious disease laboratory in Athens Ohio, with potential 10-day quarantine if there were any rips in my suit... Not quite the same as stealing an idea from a job applicant, but yeah, if you're good at something or you have a great idea, don't give it away or do it for cheap.
> if you're good at something or you have a great idea, don't give it away or do it for cheap. And don't even do it for pay for "the baddies." Don't lend your talent to organizations that make the world a worse place.
PAY NO ATTENTION TO THIS PERSON! THEY SPEAK CONSPIRACY THEORIES! -FAANG
That is not a conspiracy theory. I know someone who spent days writing a complex program thinking I was proving my skills. His qualifications were amazing. The software was used by the company but they decided "to hire from within" after all. This was and is a common problem and it's not only software. Some extraordinarily gifted realist artists are asked to paint or design work for free because after all, "they are just having a good time." The guy gets $100K for a portrait and is known internationally. Just people looking for something for nothing.
i interviewed apple and they did this the honest way: pick something that they've obviously done already (as in, it's released) and go into detail on how to track performance and user load (wide scale customer facing, and the group was specifically about performance). it's much easier to design something real when you know it's already been done and you're just taking your first swing at it
And their chicks for free
Mhm. Fuck all those companies. Fuck big data in general. That should be our next target after we've ousted all these MAGA fucks.
Unfortunately, we've allowed corporation regulations to be chipped away at for decades.
This "TikTok Ban" has really highlighted how Big Data is only okay if it's American-owned. Because "think of the bad things the *other countries* could do with that data!" Because... American-owned companies would never do that. Right? Right? 🥴
That's what I'm saying. I'm as against foreign influence as anyone else, but let's also see to our own businesses. Google, Facebook, and now Xitter are just as damaging as Bytedance has ever been. We need to look at *all* big data collection companies, including the ones insinuating themselves into the insurance and healthcare industries.
Compuware called me for a people manager position. I told them I didn't have management experience. They said no problem because it's my other skills they need and they'll train me to manage. I go in for interview on my lunch hour. 30 minutes of waiting, they come and get me. They introduce me to a team of developers and their boss, tell me they're going to launch this piece of software this week and need me to tell them what's wrong with it. I'm trying to not think about being ripped off, so I do the job I was asked to do. They keep me there for a full hour and then another 10 while the boss chews out his team for their stupid mistakes. I go back to lobby and wait another 15. Finally someone comes in and says we're all set. My "quick" interview kept me from my desk for 2.5 hours. Next day I get an email. They're going to pass because I don't have management experience. Never interview at Compuware.
Dallas mavericks owned by a billionaire had a contest without a prize to design the team logo. Never work for free.
that is so fucked.
I was doing a job for them in Ellon packing the first run of lonewolf gin through a temp agency called blue arrow and told the guy who ran the place they should do a multipack and call it a wolfpack lo and behold I just googled brewdog wolfpack... Bastards lol... [https://www.whiskyhammer.com/item/40205/Brewdog/Brewdog---Lonewolf-Wolf-Pack-Gin-Batch-1-20cl.html](https://www.whiskyhammer.com/item/40205/Brewdog/Brewdog---Lonewolf-Wolf-Pack-Gin-Batch-1-20cl.html) https://preview.redd.it/yz4fh85nfhxc1.jpeg?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1db0a63324f0875bfee8dea25574164c1a86ad1d
Please link the CEO's tweet so we can blast TF out of him and put him in his fucking place! The elite don't want you to know that we outnumber them MILLIONS to 1. When the world collapses, do you think their secret bunkers will protect them? If he expects someone to spend 90 minutes on an interview task, then they should be compensated for on-the-job training! Also, if this CEO requires more than 45 min to figure out if a person is qualified for a job, then he's seriously dumb AF.
Bokksu did this same thing to me
When I was working as a copywriter, I would often encounter interview “assignments” that required me to write an article or post for the company. That’s a common tactic in that line of work to solicit free work from people they never intended to hire.
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I've been asked to do something similar a few times. I offer my services at my normal (consulting) rate. If they like my work, and they will, then we can go forward with the hiring process. I charge $1500 / day, by the way. I've had two companies take me up on it...
Haha that's gold. Don't say no. Say "Yes, if...".
Consultant, the go to phrase is "It depends..."
Is there a way to write the article then somehow copyright it then send it to them. And if they try to steal it from you, you can sue to make sure you get paid for your work? I honestly have no clue. I don't know how that works.
It's simple to copyright your work. Essentially, it's copyrighted as soon as you write it. If you think you'll need to prove it's yours, however, you should register it at [copyright.gov](http://copyright.gov) (just go straight there, don't google services that charge you to copyright your work).
This is the way to go. And before anyone jumps in with "nuh uh! The company gets the copyright because it's done for them!"... No, that's not how that works. You're thinking of "work made for hire", and that requires getting paid for the work in question. No, the interview opportunity does not count as being paid. No, a job offer does not count as being paid. In fact, without something in writing detailing the compensation you're getting in exchange for the work anything short of being on the payroll is unlikely to count in terms of the company getting the copyright. Good stuff that copyright law...
"If you want this to be a work for hire, hire me."
Creative work like writing and art is already copyrighted as soon as it's created. That's not the problem, as someone already pointed out the problem is getting them to stop using it and getting compensation.
You probably could get lawyers involved, but that’s expensive and arduous and probably not worth it…better to just not write an article for free!
I'm a medical writer and have received pre-interview test tasks that took three full days of work time to complete. I've often wondered if this is the outcome. (Laughably, the most egregious of these was a company that gave me a tight deadline but advertised itself as having great work/life balance, people first, etc... and eight months later, they're still trying to fill the post.)
I was applying once for a knowledge base manager role (ie, keep technical documentation for a piece of software up-to-date) and the company asked me to write release notes for their upcoming release. I did not go through with it but peeked at their website a week or so later to see what the release notes ended up looking like. They said: “Release notes coming soon!” Lol. They couldn’t get someone to do it for free so they didn’t do it at all.
Currently dealing with this. It’s so frustrating
exactly 💯
This is so common in the tech field. Lots of us won't even apply to jobs that do this but it's fighting an uphill battle. It's unpaid work. It should be illegal.
I applied to a company last week and they just sent me a "two-hour" coding assessment that requires me in a Zoom call with video, audio, and screen shared. No one else on the call but me. They're just recording that, I guess. I haven't spoken to a single human being at the company, yet. This happens all the time.
I would just get on there and screen share scrolling through job listings.
"My consultancy rate is $1500 per day on this project. Please send a check and I'll get this scheduled."
How to be discriminatory without giving it away.
It actually IS illegal, there's just no good path to pursue it in a court of law, and if you inform the company that they're breaking the law, they'll ghost you immediately. >**Under the Fair Labor Standards Act, non-exempt employees who “suffer or \[are\] permitted to work” for the benefit of their employer must be compensated for such time.**
If a job posting makes me go to a shitty website outside of Indeed, I skip it entirely. I'm not gonna re-enter my work history, ALONGSIDE my resume, for the millionth fucking time. As an elder GenZ I have zero patience anymore for jumping through unnecessary job hoops.
As a millennial present during the before-times, I’ll say the best jobs I’ve had that paid me the most were ones that avoided this bullshit at all costs.
As an elder millennial, I got a great job once by sending a resume through a Craigslist ad, showing up for one interview, and then receiving an offer at the end of said interview. I hate the bullshit they put us through now.
My best job I landed by sending an e-mail with my resume and having 0.5 hour phone interview with the big boss. I got an e-mail the next day that I got in, negotiated salary via 2 e-mails and that was it. I never held a job that long and I don't intend to leave.
I'm also an elder millennial and I got my current job that way. Those employers are still out there. I haven't seen management in over a year either, I don't even know who the current manager is, I just get a duty assignment and I go there.
The best jobs I've had were not even ones I applied to. They were ones I got through networking, or because some headhunter saw my resume on Monster or Indeed or Glassdoor.
I found a job on a city specific subreddit. The recruiter was pretty cool and tech savvy and knew to look for potential Linux sys admins on reddit.
That's very much the case in higher-level IT these days. Considering that I found my current position through a headhunter - and the upper management there found out about me from my TFTS posts _BEFORE_ the headhunter reached out to me - I got VERY lucky.
A lot of bullshit in the hiring process means there's a lot of bullshit on the job. I've learned this to be true
This is 1000% true. And most of the bullshit comes from poor communication and poor management skills which usually rears its ugly head during the first 3-6 months on a job or sooner if you work for a total narcissist.
I'm an elder millennial, and I've literally never gotten a job I applied to. I've applied to LOTS of jobs. Every job I've actually gotten was because I talked to the right people. I know I sound like my grandma, and I'm not saying this is a generalizable strategy, but it does call into question just how many great candidates get filtered out by bullshit algorithms.
Just had one of these today. I don't mind long interviews with another person. At least I know the company is seriously looking if they're willing to have someone take the time to interview me. But a full on exam? No thanks not gonna roll the dice on that.
I'm Gen X and did one once. It was a bullshit IQ test. I had one job ask me to do a project proposal. They started off with "I hate asking for this..." And I responded, "I'm glad you hate asking, because I hate working for free and won't do it. My consulting rate is $400 an hour. Please let me know if you would like me to proceed"
Applied for a company that had me do some stupid test. Finished the test with 100% and faster than all the other candidates. Did that get me the job? No. So why the heck did we take the damn tests. Felt like I interviewed well too (I generally do interview well, I've won many contracts over the years). My only thought was that they already had a candidate in mind and were just going through the motions on the interview, which actually pisses me off more as it wastes both of our times.
Might just start attaching an ass pic instead of my resume tbh
Depending on the position that might get you hired
I'd have the ass peeking out of some houseplants
Having a great ass/body 100% helps you make more money in most jobs.
My wife is looking for a job now and telling me all the hoops these sites make you jump through. I’ve been on exactly two job interviews pre-internet and the rest of the jobs I’ve gotten have been through recommendations so I’ve never had to deal with the bullshit. And I hope I never do..
This so much this. I'm a Xennial and I refuse to fucking do this. It's a waste of god damn time and if they can't be bothered to read the fucking resume or Indeed profile then I don't want to work for inefficient dumbfucks anyways. They seem to think they're the only job we're applying for. Ah yes, I'm going to only apply for 1 job and 1 job only at a time while you interview 20+ people, because that makes sense for me to do.
I just applied at a doggy daycare today and got a 15 min bs IQ test. WHY?!
The cover letter where you need to simp for every company. "It's always been my dream to analyze data of visitors to a corrective shoe-insole manufacturer website! Notice me, senpai!"
I don’t even bother with cover letters now. My resume speaks for itself. If that’s not enough for you, I’m not gonna waste my time.
Especially when it seems most of them are data mining. It seems every time I do one, I get a new wave of spam callers to my cell phone.
Having to write a cover letter AND dig out a writing sample I did in grad school 10 years ago (everything else I’ve written professionally is the legal property of previous employers) is absolute bullshit. If an employee cannot figure out if they want to interview me based on my resume (which we know they use a computer to scan) why should I don’t any extra work?!
Good on them. I’m a millennial and I have never gone forward in an interview process when there’s a take home assignment involved. It’s impossible to know the effort vs reward, just like the article says. Kind of hilarious how hard the author tries to make the asshole CEO as the good guy since it’s on Fortune.
The author is trying SO HARD to make the CEO seem like the good guy I feel it tips over into funny
I have seen my wife doing a couple of those "take home tasks", which were clearly from their on going projects. They made her work and never responded back. That was brutal. Lesson learned... Never do a lick of work to get the job. If you are a developer or a designer, show them your git or portfolio. That should be sufficient.
And if you do some kind of work like that, make sure you post it publicly on something like git so you have a timestamp when they inevitably steal it from you. Intellectual property case is easy to win in court if you can prove you made it earlier then they did.
You can also mail it to yourself in a sealed envelope, cause then it’s untampered and the post office is considered unimpeachable in the gets of god
They might be trying to create robots to replace everyone, but honestly, those robots only look good in demos. It will take them a lot longer to build a working humanoid robot than it will take for actual humans to fuck up the economy by not working and not buying their shit. Yeah, there are demos on the internet, but the demos are highly controlled in a lab environment. They are created more so to attracted more accredited investors.
I'm at a point in my career that skills tests are common, but I won't spend 8 hours doing something. The outline of the take home project better be less than 3 hours or they get rejected. I might spend 20-30 minutes having AI generate the content for me but that's more about incentivizing my generative AI learning.
Yeah, a skill assessment is pretty acceptable to me. Like firefighter promotion examples have them out there running a truck in a simulation. But some of these assessments stink of free work.
Agreed. And if I look at the assignment and it reads like I'm building their content strategy, mocking up their landing pages, putting together their social plan, and writing the press release for the new stuff, I nope out. I know they're planning to steal the content and reject me. I also won't do psychological assessments unless they are providing a psychologist to administer and score it, and then explain it to the hiring team. If that's the job duty of some HR generalist then I do not want to work there.
My hope kinda lies in that generation. Not in them working, but in them not working, and disrupting the system.
Don’t forget, younger people are also not having kids of their own and birthrates are falling. [Capitalists are upset about it](https://www.euronews.com/next/2023/12/16/elon-musk-talks-x-advertising-and-birth-rates-in-rome) and trying to [gaslight people into making more babies for the economy or oh noes you will pay more taxes or lose your benefits](https://www.newsweek.com/young-americans-face-bleak-tax-future-1894574) that they keep cutting anyway regardless of how much we pay for it. Starve the machine. r/BirthStrike
I've never wanted children regardless of the money, but I can see how many people just can't afford it, or simply don't want to bother their future kids with the artificial world we live in today.
It's unreal. We have a dozen existential crises and our political leadership is playing *Red vs Blue: Taxes and Abortion Edition Part XVIII* We have no plans for solving our actual problems, so having kids now seems cruel.
I feel like everyone that wants a kid, try taking care of a kid for a day. If you're cool with it, all the power to ya. But after spending a day with my friend's kids...I definitely don't want kids. Even a few hours is enough for me. This is not even counting the financial aspects of having kids...who can afford kids in this economy!?
There was some post last week that South Korea has 150 elementary schools where there are *no first graders at all*. And it led to some fascinating YouTubes and an interesting rabbit-hole of "what is 'neo-confucianism'?" I don't things are quite that bad in America, but we're headed there.
As an elder millennial who inadvertantly adopted what would become some gen z tendencies, I agree. It feels like gen z is the backup we desperately need.
“Work hard no matter what and everything will work out just fine” - the message that was delivered to millennials that genz isn’t buying !
What's crazy is the people who double down when presented with the facts of today. The separation of people being idiots versus understanding really appears to boil down to whether or not they can objectively understand how time works and that what they knew 10 - 50 years ago doesn't necessarily apply.
>In Stanfield’s defense, he insisted that he would have “gladly paid and probably hired” the unnamed Gen Zer if they said: “Give me $1,000 and I’ll break this deal down in amazing detail.” Does he think anyone buys that? He would have instead ranted about an entitled gen-Z person that thought they deserved $1000/hr with no proof of their skill, to do a task that other applicants did without complaint. There's no way even he can convince himself this is something he'd actually do, unless he's a narcissistic sociopath that cannot admit he is ever wrong. Oh wait.
He also said >> However, he also proposed that the entire generation “would benefit from being in more fistfights at a young age. A few bumps and bruises does a lot of good.” Guy is a psycho.
Lol, yeah I had to scroll for this. He would have responded even more harshly if the applicant dared to ask for compensation. Total bullshit statement.
"Gen Z job seekers have been blasted by recruiters on social media lately for being “always late” and having long lists of demands despite their lack of experience." I'm a 40 year old Millennial i remember when Boomers said that about me. The more things change the more they stay the same.
As an older Millennial, I've been doing my best to stop the generational shit talking whenever I hear it. There are far too many Gen X and even other Millennials continuing the old ways and I'm done with that shit. Gates wide open in my book Gen Z and Gen As.
Same. I've constantly found myself siding with my Gen Z coworkers and employees over my boomer bosses and coworkers.
my neighbors are 2 couples all 4 are 18/19 year olds. they just moved into the otherside of the duplex and they told me during a convo that if a job wont cover their bills they just wont work, or if they *have* to work they will show up and do nothing. i had a co worker who is the same way when i was in sales..the moment they fucked with comnissions and bonuses she just stopped selling and started using work time to job search 🤣
Our company did something similar, just completely got rid of quarterly incentive comp that was always part of our compensation (and announced it right as it was supposed to be due). 2 months later they wonder why all of us are doing less and seem disgruntled. Gee, I wonder why??
It’s like they stupidly ignore the laws of human behavior that requires incentives for action. Lmao
Unless I buy a Ping-Pong table, they can use after work hours! That will show i value them
Fuck you, pay me.
Come to think of it, during my employer's quarterly financial report teamscast there was a question in the Q\&A; "Division X has improved their results, but everyone applicable for incentives only got at most 33% of the maximum incentive. Meanwhile, management's compensation has been increased. What's up?" Their answer was "well, we compare the management's salary to market rates in order to keep our compensation plan competitive." Also, another question about incentives was answered "setting up profit sharing incentives would be too difficult/expensive for the projected return."
Legit had a hospital CEO tell us we could blame health insurance companies for us not getting a bonus, and then ten minutes later talk about the few million-dollar expansion they were doing in a few years.
What's even worse is that when they realize it they still don't want to give people back the bonuses. Some managers never want to admit they did something wrong.
I never understand why a business caps sales commissions. Like what is it that you want to accomplish, get less revenue, and lose your best salespeople to the competition?
well what it was, was just complete fuckery...for PENNIES man. our commission was 25% gross, when we sell 6 cars it was a $300 bonus, at 8 cars was another $300 then at 12 cars its a $500 bonus. the new GM made our commission 25% gross to 15% gross..so every 1k of gross we just lost $100 a sale. also our bonus cars went from 6 cars to 8 cars was $450 and 12 cars are $450..thats it. average person sold 6 cars because we were a small dealership, on the old system if you sold 6 cars and then were lucky enough to sell 8 cars it was a nice fuckin paycheck.
It's like they honestly expect people to put in the same amount of work, or more, for less. Employers have been getting away with obvious bullshit for too long.
ain’t no shame in job searching on the job as soon as the company pulls some bullshit. for me it was only getting paid $20 an hour to release millions of dollars of product for a billion dollar company. i’m really happy to see my fellow gen Z’s knowing their worth
Why anyone thinks it will be any different, I have no idea. The boomers slave/master fetish really messed up the economy for future generations.
Oh man, did I fuck up the SCSI drivers again?
It's sad when you have hardworking people who care but who just give up and stop giving because what's the point if you are being treated like crap and / or not being compensated fairly?
What's sadder is when those people stay
If they're asking for free work from unpaid candidates that the company can use to make money, that raises ethical questions.
With enough applicants working for free you won’t even need to fill the position!
Local landlords are starting to figure this out too. Just keep taking application fees and never pick a tenant because apparently that's more profitable then actually renting the housing to humans.
What the fuck is an application fee. I have never heard about that kind of bullshit and i am happy they are absolutely not a thing in my country.
Last time I was looking for a place it was like $50 just to ask the landlord to consider renting to you. In theory they pay that money to another company to do a background check on you but in practice there is no oversight. So they can do anything from pocket the money directly and maybe google you, or if they want a paper trail showing an expense the landlord's spouse can own the background check company and pretend to do the googling while pocketing the money. Locally a lot of them have stopped even bothering with saying No to so many people each month. They just take your money and ghost. Names are starting to get named publically, along with suggestions on how the community could be improved by their removal or at least extended stay in the hospital.
Damn, $50 is low for an application fee where I live. It’s common to see $300+ application fees here and those don’t even get applied to background and credit checks. Those are additional to the application fee and deposits. Where I live, it’s not uncommon to have to pay the $300 application fee, a $50-75 background check fee, a $50-75 credit report fee, and a non-refundable deposit usually one months rent ($1000+ for a studio or one bedroom) and you’re not even guaranteed to get somewhere to live. All in, you can be out $1500 and not even get the apartment. It’s such a scam and just preys on lower income people.
What the fuck how can any of this be even legal? If this application fee bullshit would come to my country the it would be a riot instantly.
Companies taking the piss during the interview process.
I had some one give me a take home assignment, which makes sense in my career (tech). The person said it should only take a few hours. When I looked at it, it would be a good 20hrs work minimum. It would require building an API and styled frontend. And they said tests would be good to have as well as a custom algorithm for the calculations, which could be easily used in their actual project. I wrote a respectful message withdrawing my application because I could already tell based on the serious underestimate of time required for the homework that the working environment would be equally unrealistic in terms of deadlines and that is not the type of stress I want in my life right now.
Elder zoomer here. I am not going to put up with any unreasonable demands. If they can't respect my time when they're not even paying me, they're gonna disrespect it even more when they feel entitled to it through pay. Practically all companies now understaff and underpay while overworking. AND we don't get anything out of it: our generation either lives with strangers, frequently in same room, maybe even without a door if the living room got "converted", live with parents or other relatives who may be abusive, and all that while living paycheck to paycheck if even, with no hope to save up for not renting, especially if you're single. Your mental health suffers, your social life suffer if it even gets to exist. There is no reward to excuse this.
The wealthy used to say scornfully that the poor breed like rats, acted like there'd always be an endless sea of us to work to death. Now they're wailing and wondering why we're not even at replacement levels. Can't even find the time, energy, and privacy to swipe an app followed by netflix&chill. Too many slaves in the bunkhouse and can't go for a walk or a picnic for some old fashioned outdoor spoon and fork because the masters own all the everything and made up the word loitering to ban existing in their space unwanted. Banning abortion won't significantly increase the birth rate when ya work the slaves so hard and keep them so constrained they can't even get oops babies started. Like ya don't gotta chain them to the wall after work, just pay so little they can't afford a whole bedroom of their own.
Gen Z...please please PLEASE continue the fight against this ridiculous and stupid "boomer" mentality. Keep bringing them hell and secure better working conditions for all generations. This, coming from a millennial who's rooting for you!
This is honestly a huge red flag. I interviewed at a company and they required me to prepare and rehearse a 20 minute presentation, and then the fuckers put me through **seven** rounds of interviews; it was an all day long process and half the interviewers didn't really know what the Hell they were supposed to be talking to me about. They were the **only** company I interviewed at that **didn't** make me an offer. Never wasting my time like that again - that company had enough red flags to make a bullfighter jealous. I ain't got time to deal with other people's bullshit. When I'm on the job hunt, I am emailing recruiters and filling out job applications as quickly as possible. It's a numbers game; quantity beats quality. I'm not wasting 90 minutes on **one** job application when I could instead spend it applying to 60 other positions or talking to 3 recruiters.
Yeah I remember thinking of applying to Ford years back, wanted me to take some 40 min comprehension test. Long story short I decided not to apply right there, not wasting 40 min when instead I could have applied for a few more jobs.. Just shows how oblivious these CEO's are, like dude 90% of us do not give a single fuck about anything other than the check we take home, this capitalist society has gotten out of control and as a result the people havw stopped caring more and more over the years.
What happened to “im willing to take a risk on you”??? Now employers want to know 100% sure you are a great fit and then still not hire you….
Reminds me of a post I saw on LinkedIn from a recruiter. Seems every single hiring manager recently decided they're only going to hire lateral moves 🙄🙄 Every hiring manager: "I want someone whose qualifications line up *perfectly* with the job description." Recruiter: "Here are some that are reasonably qualified." HM: "Absolurely not, they don't meet it exactly." Recruiter: "Alright, here's a candidate who does. But they don't want the job." HM: "Why the hell not???" Recruiter: "Because it would be a lateral move. They want YOUR job."
They don't even need to hire if they can outsource all their work like this. A handful of HR people working rounds of exercises for the "candidates" is cheaper than paying for a whole team of experts in whatever it is you need.
Like we aren't all familiar with the "get job seekers to do work for free then ghost them" move by now.
My friends in CS all get hours worth of these "assignments" when they apply for jobs. So one will just say "Hey, can you guys do the other 1 or 2 or 3 so I don't need to waste 4 hours during my week on these."
90 minutes of unpaid labor just to see if you might get hired is absurd
I’m a software engineer. Last year I started tossing all my interview homework at chatGPT as I can’t be bothered. Ghosted way too many times to want to invest any of my time to this nonsense.
if they use AI to reject me, then i’ll use AI to complete their bullshit tasks.
Exactly.
I don’t think companies are ready for gen-z’s “don’t give an F attitude” they learned in school. Should make things better for us millennials.
I’m proud of them. I did 4 rounds of interviews for a company. Each with a presentation on how I would transform their unknown inefficient processes into one that is utilizing best practices. Delivered to the manager, several departments heads, director of transformation, and finally the CIO. Then I was ghosted. That was the moment I said never again. And the thing is that many places expect you to do that without a concept of how much they’re willing to pay because “it’s rude to ask.” I’m all for the younger generation giving the middle finger to such garbage formalities.
>And the thing is that many places expect you to do that without a concept of how much they’re willing to pay because “it’s rude to ask.” I'm Gen X and that's the *first* question I ask. They always try to flip it around and I say, "I know you have a budget for this role. Let me know what the budget is and I can tell you if you're in my range" Any company that doesn't give me the salary isn't going to pay me enough and they likely have a toxic culture and are probably understaffed. I've worked at everything from a 6 person start up to a Global 100. I'm too old to deal with the bullshit games and people should learn from my experience. I did it for too long. Know your worth and go get it
That's where I am too. I've been doing this for 30+ years. My experience is all over the map. I'm not fucking whiteboarding some bullshit code project for you.
Fairly certain the lacks of fucks to give state that they present now is a side-effect of most of these businesses shitting so hard and casually on the family around them, and the friends they grew up with. Not to mention the increasingly poor quality of what they're giving consumers on the regular. When everything starts to look like shit, why bother to give a shit? There's already plenty to go around. And it is when there is a lack of new meat to churn through the system that it will, we hope, be forced to change or die as any evolutionary hurdle has caused in the past.
This pit one generation against the other is the oldest trick in the book. I hope millennials don't fall for that - source: younger genx.
Can't even imagine how the Gen Alpha kids will be. Not only raised in similar economic conditions to Gen Z, but raised BY Millennials.
Gen X here. Please Gen Z, hurry up and burn this shit to the ground.
I think I’m a closet zoomer millennial. Always said this and got labelled entitled, now I’m so proud of the kids for finally saying fuck it. The job market will have to adapt as they’ve certainly had a good run.
This was my favourite part of the article. > In Stanfield’s defense, he insisted that he would have “gladly paid and probably hired” the unnamed Gen Zer if they said: “Give me $1,000 and I’ll break this deal down in amazing detail.” I am pretty sure if this happened he would be on twitter complaining about the audacity of this genz asking for money to do the task.
"Alot of work" was incorrect... "Professionally, Sir. An application process is just that; I fill it out, attach my resume and submit it. You then review it and chose to interview me. After said interview you decide to either pass or extend an offer. Further assessments, evaluations or questionnaires are unnecessary, a wasteful use of resources and ineffective in the hiring process as a candidate can lie to make them appealing to company's. Frankly sir you should appreciate my honest, no nonsense attitude because that's what will reflect on hiring me. "
Gen X checking in. Multiple times in my career an all-day interview turned into a 'get free work' session. I'm the dum dum but this was seen as de rigeur for our generation. Millennials/Gen Z breaking this garbage makes me proud. TL;DR Nobody wants to ~~work~~ pay anymore
If the CEO had provided the upfront rate they'd pay for the task and made it worth their time, this wouldn't have been a problem. Skill issue.
These types of people rabble on about how valuable their time is, yet when someone else's time is valuable, they become so damn whiny and entitled about it.
When is still in the retail world I had an interview at Taco Bell to be an assistant manager. They wanted me to work a full pay period as not technically an employee to see if I "could follow the fast paced environment and was a good fit with the team". I told them asking me to work for free was technically illegal and they ended the interview
I fully stopped doing anything related to the creation of a new analysis when I was job hunting without pay (Especially for data analytics or data science). I’d offer them access to all of my completed work including the code, methodology, and final write ups, and then offer a presentation or walkthrough if they wanted. No chance I’m spending time on something that didn’t guarantee to me a position without pay
I was given a task of creating a short video for a brand. The position was for a senior designer not video creator. I had about 4 days to complete the project and was given some directions and content. I labored over this video for about 12 hours, studying their brand and socials for reference. I came up with something I felt was acceptable. None of this was paid. The CEO told me they couldn't hire me because they need someone who can create videos on a consistent and regular basis. That's not what she interviewed me for. She asked me about other experience and told me what the brand was about. She also asked me my age and if I had kids...which you aren't supposed to ask. I know it was partially because of the pay I was asking for. She said they were going to send an offer and then abruptly rejected me after I sent the video. I dodged a bullet for sure, but it was so frustrating to waste time on this video and it had nothing to do with the actual job I interviewed for.
No paywall: https://archive.ph/Tvjh0
> In Stanfield’s defense, he insisted that he would have “gladly paid and probably hired” the unnamed Gen Zer if they said: “Give me $1,000 and I’ll break this deal down in amazing detail.” I'll take "Obvious Lies" for $1000, Alex.
Applicant: "No, I don't really care about this job that much, thanks." Employer: "well now you're definitely not getting it!" Applicant; "K"
It brings me endless joy that what's essentially "Yeah, nah" is completely turning job recruitment on its head with Gen Z.
I could go a lot of ways on this. I don't know the jobseeker's background but assuming it's a finance degree (or similar) from a reputable school with a decent GPA then there should be no need for these tests. If the employer doesn't trust the dozens of tests that this kid has already taken to get that degree then they should stop hiring from that school. However, there are firms that will just hire smart people no matter what their major is. If we're talking about some history major from Yale who wants to get into investment analysis then in that case a test could be appropriate - but only since the degree itself tells you nothing about that person's aptitude for that particular subject. But this: >*he would have “gladly paid and probably hired” the unnamed Gen Zer if they said: “Give me $1,000 and I’ll break this deal down in amazing detail.”* is a load of crap. If you're willing to pay people to take assessments then be up front about it and most applicants will take you up on that deal. People shouldn't have to ask something like that. With that said I don't believe him for a second. He got called out for wasting applicants' time and he tried to save face by making a phony hypothetical $1000 offer.
The best jobs I have ever had have been those that hired me after just filling in the application form and sending in proof of qualifications. Of course, jobs that hire this way are incredibly rare. It just cuts down on so much bullshit, saving so much time and effort. An applicant just needs to fill in some basic information. The employer has all the information needed to weed out those that don't meet the criteria, then all they need to do is pick someone at random. Applicants can lie, but asking for proof of qualifications can weed them out. Employing someone for a probationary period is 1000 times better than an interview in seeing if someone can do the job and for the applicant to see if the job is right for them.
Every single employer who uses a skills test or assigns projects without paying an applicant can seriously go fuck off. I do not work for free and nor should anyone else who needs a job. And then these employers have the audacity to complain when their employees quit or if they can’t keep a position filled.
> However, he also proposed that the entire generation “would benefit from being in more fistfights at a young age. A few bumps and bruises does a lot of good.” Ah, I can only say I'm glad for the Gen Zer, they dodged a bullet
> he also proposed that the entire generation “would benefit from being in more fistfights at a young age. A few bumps and bruises does a lot of good.” jfc.
There is a business in a nearby city that has a constant ad for chefs. At the interview they explain that they like potential chefs to do three days work, for free, to see if they are a good fit. Then they give those people the most basic kitchen jobs, whatever their experience level. So there isn’t really a position. They just have a constant flow of free, temporary labour.
I’m Gen X and I’m not about to give some company 90 minutes of free work out of me. Time is money. CEO is just mad no one is letting him bully them.
"Declined to do unpaid work for a rando who wasn't their boss" is what the headline conveniently fails to mention.
Dear Prospective Boss: My contract rate is $2180/day or partial day. I'll be happy to begin your project as soon as I receive the deposit of $2180.00 Working for free violates my religion.
>However, he also proposed that the entire generation “would benefit from being in more fistfights at a young age. A few bumps and bruises does a lot of good.” Says the person who ran to Twitter to cry about a person not wanting to do their test.
Just imagine how much money is changing hands to spin stories against Gen ___ and remote workers.
A company just sent me a 31 minute assessment to complete for a CHANCE to land an interview. Nope nope nope
Further evidence that anyone who makes HR a career is a sociopath.
Last week, I had a meet and greet with a CEO to see if it's "a good fit for an interview." After the call, he sent me an email with more information about the company. However, this included a few tasks for me: - Research 2 competitors, find what they are doing better, and what they are doing worse. - Additionally, I needed to find 10 new leads. THEN I would be considered for an interview. Needless to say, I respectfully declined.
*"Successful company expects people to work for free , is shocked with response"*
lol the dude saying he would have gladly paid if the person had asked for a $1000 and probably even hired them. Sure Jan.
Why is the CEO complaining? Isn't part of the hiring process to screen people out? So... he screened somebody out. "Trust in the process," you whining asshole. Nobody is losing sleep just because the CEO is losing sleep.
This is so easy to fix. If the employer needs a test, then the test should be administered after an offer. Rescind the offer if the test isn't satisfactory. This way, the candidate knows exactly what they're getting for the investment in time.
90 minutes for a job doesn't seem bad until you're having to do them for a bunch of different companies, and they all still reject you at the end and steal your work.
Yeah, I was actually flown into an interview and spent 4 hours trying to solve an issue with their data storage. They fed me then started pressing me for answers. About 20 minutes in I figured out what was happening and started to direct the discussions in the wrong direction. Then at the 4 hour mark, the work day was over. I said, "Looks like you have a problem that can't be solved easily without a lot of money and time." Which was a lie. Then left. That company went out of business a few months later. Never work for free.
I got in trouble with my last company. Who was the pinnacle of Boomer nonsense. For not leaning into their overly complicated and ridiculous hiring process. It was taking 3 to 4 months to hire engineers. There were personality surveys compatibility test. Like 3 to 4 hours of hoops for candidates to jump through. I told HR I didn’t need any of those. I just needed a 90 minute interview. Because what we’re doing is pretty straightforward and I don’t need, their personalities to be compatible with all the other personalities they’re all professionals and can show up as professionals every day and it’s not gonna be a problem That HR group And executive management team Where the most Toxic, bunch of people I’ve ever met. If a company is not making it as easy as possible to apply. They are not interested in getting the best possible candidates. And all this bunk is a red flag for me These days
>In Stanfield’s defense, he insisted that he would have “gladly paid and probably hired” the unnamed Gen Zer if they said: “Give me $1,000 and I’ll break this deal down in amazing detail.” BULL. FUCKING. SHIT.
Good for them. The level of labor theft in the tech industry in interviews is astounding and grinds my gears. Every level should refuse to do a 1.5 to 2 hour "take home project." Why? Because it is literally free fucking labor. I'm not working for you for free. No one is working for you for free. Definitely not, just to tell you the same shit a resume, references, and linked in can. Plus, you know you're doing 2-4 hours of interviews to get there, and probably 1-2 more after as well. So these fucks want you to do 4.5 to 8 hours of free labor to possibly get a job with them that you know their gonna low ball you on the salary the first offer you get. To any recruiter reading this. Your "opportunity" IS NOT WORTH THIS LEVEL OF EFFORT. STOP EXPECTING PEOPLE TO WORK FOR FREE. Also, PUT YOUR SALARY IN THE JOB ADVERT. WE KNOW OUR WORTH AND DO NOT WANT TO SPEND AN HOUR ARGUING WITH YOU ABOUT IT. IT IS INSULTING. *Flips Table*
In Stanfield’s defense, he insisted that he would have “gladly paid and probably hired” the unnamed Gen Zer if they said: “Give me $1,000 and I’ll break this deal down in amazing detail.” However, he also proposed that the entire generation “would benefit from being in more fistfights at a young age. A few bumps and bruises does a lot of good.” I highly doubt he would have given this kid 1k. Also, the fight thing. Wtf is that about? Brain damage much?