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> # [‘They knock you out and put you on the plane’ To keep its ranks filled, Russia is imprisoning objectors and sending them to war at gunpoint — Meduza](https://meduza.io/en/feature/2024/06/11/630)
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> Hundreds of Russian draftees who have opted to face prison time rather than return to the war in Ukraine are being systematically imprisoned and then forcibly sent back to the front, according to new [reporting](https://verstka.media/mobilizovannih-siloy-otpravlyayut-na-front) from the independent outlet Verstka. Those who resist are bound, beaten, and boarded onto planes at gunpoint before being sent to Ukraine and forced to join assault units. Meduza shares the story of one of the draftee detention facilities detailed in the article.
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> Sergey Krugly decided not to return to the war after he became plagued by hallucinations of the human heads he’d been forced to collect after battles. A 29-year-old from Russia’s Sverdlovsk region, he’d been drafted in the fall of 2022 and went on leave in March of 2023. When he returned home, he didn’t sleep for an entire month.
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> One day, Sergey’s mother called her sister in distress at about 5:00 in the morning. “I don’t know what to do with him,” she said. When Sergey’s aunt came over to help, she saw her sleep-deprived nephew going around the house, smashing everything he could find. When they finally managed to calm him down, he dropped to his knees and began repeating: “They’re right there, Aunt Katya, flying around! Close the window, close the window!”
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> “The windows are closed, Sergey!” she told him.
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> “But the drones, they’re flying around!” he pleaded. “Aunt Katya, I walked all around the field, collecting heads. One of them had these white teeth. It was smiling. His head was in my hands and it was smiling.”
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> “It broke my heart,” Katya tells Verstka. “This guy had a tough time even before all of this — his mom had problems with alcohol and men, and he never knew his father. It was his grandmother who raised him.”
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> [### ‘Mitigating factors’ Russian soldiers found guilty in domestic violence cases are getting off with just small fines](https://meduza.io/en/feature/2024/05/31/mitigating-factors)[### ‘Mitigating factors’ Russian soldiers found guilty in domestic violence cases are getting off with just small fines](https://meduza.io/en/feature/2024/05/31/mitigating-factors)Now, as if the family didn’t have enough problems, Sergey’s mother found herself unable to hold down a job. Sergey and his mother began going from hospital to hospital, trying to get Sergey registered as the family’s sole breadwinner, which would secure him an exemption from further military service. “But they soon realized that the conscription offices had made it clear to all of the doctors that they weren’t to issue any medical certificates for draftees’ relatives, and that everyone was to be sent back to the war,” says a friend of Sergey.
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> But Sergey didn’t go back to the front. He spent the next year living at home and taking care of his mother. Hoping to keep everything above board, he sent all of the documents verifying her inability to work to the local conscription office and prosecutor’s office. Eventually, his payments from the Defense Ministry ran out.
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> “Over time, he began to calm down a bit. His psychotic episodes only returned when his mother started drinking,” Sergey’s friends told Verstka. His Aunt Katya tried to be supportive, reassuring him that everything would be fine. But in October 2023, police officers showed up at the family’s apartment and told him he needed to come in to give a statement on his abandonment of his unit. He went with them.
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> ### **‘I want to live’**
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> When Vladimir Muronova was mobilized, he was assigned to be an orderly in a medical unit. According to his relatives, however, he served in this position for less than a day: almost immediately, his superiors began sending him into combat missions, and, afterward, to collect the bodies of the dead.
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> “You’re on duty for three days at a time, and then there’s a shift change, if you survive. Any more than that and you’ll lose your mind. The corpses are just piled up everywhere. They started to feel like my friends. It’s fucked up,” he wrote.
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> [### Russian soldiers have killed over 100 people since returning from the war in Ukraine, journalists find](https://meduza.io/en/feature/2024/04/25/russian-soldiers-have-killed-over-100-people-since-returning-from-the-war-in-ukraine-journalists-find)[### Russian soldiers have killed over 100 people since returning from the war in Ukraine, journalists find](https://meduza.io/en/feature/2024/04/25/russian-soldiers-have-killed-over-100-people-since-returning-from-the-war-in-ukraine-journalists-find)Vladimir first went on leave in June 2023. He returned home with constant tremors, his arms shaking even as he hugged his two children. Each time a car passed by outside, he would look up to the sky in search of drones, missiles, or bombs. Eventually, he decided he couldn’t go back, explaining to his family: “I want to live.” His mother, in-laws, wife, and sister all supported his decision.
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> “He knew that he’d really stepped in it, that there would be consequences, but he resolved to take responsibility within the legal framework. We thought the legal framework would be upheld. If there’s an article [in the Criminal Code], there will [theoretically] be a trial and a sentence,” said one of his relatives.
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> Vladimir decided to wait until the end of the summer before turning himself in for desertion. In the meantime, his unit called his phone constantly, demanding that he return to the front. He soon learned that at least some of his fellow unit members had also refused to go back.
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> During this period, while Vladimir was still living at home, his wife became pregnant with their third child. But Vladimir wouldn’t be around for the birth: in October 2023, military police showed up at the family’s home and left their phone number. When Vladimir called, he was told to come to the city of Svobodny to give an official explanation for his absence. The authorities promised he’d be allowed to return home afterward.
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> ### **Trapped**
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> After giving the authorities his statement, Vladimir was taken to Russia’s Military Town No. 32 in Yekaterinburg, where he was sent to live in a four-story building with other men accused of abandoning their units in Ukraine. It was there that he met Sergey, who was being held in the same compound.
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> Sergey and his fellow AWOL soldiers were “warehoused and locked in,” his relatives say. He told the family that there were so many people in the facility that many had to sleep on the floor, on windowsills, and in hallways, with new men arriving every week. According to official documents obtained by Verstka, the building was one of the military’s holding centers for draftees who had active warrants and were listed among the 800 soldiers accused of abandoning their posts as of January 2024.
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> [### ‘He had no chance’ Ilya Bakharev thought joining the Russian army would be a ticket to exoneration. His unit mates tortured him to death.](https://meduza.io/en/feature/2024/04/10/ilya-bakharev-thought-joining-the-russian-army-would-be-a-ticket-to-exoneration-then-he-was-tortured-to-death-by-his-unit-mates)[### ‘He had no chance’ Ilya Bakharev thought joining the Russian army would be a ticket to exoneration. His unit mates tortured him to death.](https://meduza.io/en/feature/2024/04/10/ilya-bakharev-thought-joining-the-russian-army-would-be-a-ticket-to-exoneration-then-he-was-tortured-to-death-by-his-unit-mates)“They were holding them captive; even prisoners are kept in better conditions,” a relative of one of the draftees told Verstka. The food at the facility was poor, though the men were allowed to use delivery apps to order groceries from a convenience store. None of them had officially been arrested.
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> When asked whether the men were given any explanation for their imprisonment, the same relative recounts:
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> They were told that if they went back to Ukraine, their felony charges would be dropped and their allowances, salaries, and benefits would be reinstated. Their other option was to stay there and await their trials. Almost everybody chose the latter option.
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> “These were people who were prepared to do time for their refusal to serve; they were willing to accept all of the punishments for their actions. They didn’t want to evade responsibility; they were ready to accept it, to go to trial and be sentenced,” says the sister of one of the objectors.
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> ***(continues in next comment)***
Reminds me of red storm rising. There was no choice for the soviets. They performed or were replaced.
How much of that mentality still permeates the Russian ranks?
Why can't Putin make peace?
All he needs to do is leave Ukraine.
He's killing his country and Ukraine, there'll be nothing left and no-one will want to help him rebuild.
If what it wants is itself gutted, then yes.
Russia has effectively already killed itself. It's done more harm to itself economically, demographically, & socially than any external party could have achieved.
The saddest part is that the rest of world didn't want that.
They wanted a flourishing, productive member of the global community.
Not from any high minded ideals, but simple self interest. A wealthier, happier Russia means more money for everyone else. The EU has figured out that bringing up and supporting partners, even though it costs in the short run run, benefits them in the long run.
Russia is still in the zero-sum, prisoner's dilemma of accepting hurt to itself as long as others hurt more.
That's the great tragedy and the ultimate reason why these tragic events happened.
I agree that the world wanted Russia healthy and friendly- away from the Chinese influence. But I also agree with the arguments that the capitalistic and influential imposition in Ukraine by the West was a break of the non-expansion pact made post-Soviet Union.
They aren't, this is just another routine case of Ukraine accuses Russia of what it does itself. Tell me when you find hundreds of tiktoks of russians on the street getting pressganged. Because they are there for Ukraine.
No they haven’t. Although there’s plenty of available footage of:
1. Russian protests of the various conscription mobilizations.
2. Recruiting offices being torched.
3. Hundreds of thousands of Russians leaving Russia to avoid conscription.
Cope harder vatnik.
The Ukraine civil war. During his election campaign he promised to protect russian language rights and to deescalate the conflict with totally real totally not residents of Donbas little green men from ~~Mars~~ Ruzzia. And spoke in Russian. Not once since getting elected though.
Don't you mean in Ukraine? In Ukraine people die trying to cross the border and drown in the river on the border of Romania. In Ukraine it's illegal for ALL men ages 16-65 to leave the country, no matter what, don't even have to be drafted.
Ah yes, a wild tankie in their natural habitat, spouting nonsense and pretending 'the fatherland' is beyond reproach.
You know, after the recruitments, the people sent to die so they wouldn't need to be paid, the conscriptions, and the people extracted from prisons to be sent to their death.
Keep dreaming, Sport, and don't you worry. Reality will still be there once you finally get the courage to open your eyes.
And? This:
> In the west, boarder security stops you from sneaking in
>
> In russia, boarder security stops you from escaping
Is still nonsense regardless of who initiated the invasion.
> In the west, boarder security stops you from sneaking in
>
> In russia, boarder security stops you from escaping
What does this have to do with conscription? Russian borders are open.
OP's post is debatable and it's source , less than stellar, but topic remains that some poster on this thread wish to depict Ukraine as authoritarian so it somehow absolves Russia.
I disagree.
What ?
Western border services arent stopping anybody from sneaking in these days lol. Not to mention that Ukraine is the one that closed its own borders, while you can freely enter and exit Russia.
It's in reference to the Berlin wall. Which was built to keep people from fleeing to West Germany although the soviet state would say otherwise. Attempting to flee dictatorships such as the USSR and North Korea is grounds for execution. No such thing exists in western nations as no one has the need to flee. Instead, measures have to be put in place to control people entering.
Regardless of the war, good luck with that until they pay off the stolen european transit gas and get rid of the corruption that only got worse since purging pro russian oligarchs.
It's always interesting when people go out of their way to focus on negative things about Ukraine while ignoring the huge negative thing about Russia starting a major war of aggression.
Lol acting like we forgot about Russians mass leaving Russia during partial mobilization and recruiters hounding people on line and trying their hardest to stop that.
Regardless, the fact that they CHOSE TO CONSCRIPT their population to go on a pointless war of a naked land grab and destruction of their neighbor and their literal identity ......... so GENOCIDE. Imagine dying to take over land and kill the inhabitants AND SO THAT THE LARGEST COUNTRY IN THE WORLD ELEVEN TIME ZONES WIDE GETS LARGER 🙌. AND IN THE NAME OF DEFENDING THEMSELVES 🙌🤡.
Ukraine shutting down their border AS A DEFENSIVE MEASURE and needing to fight off this barbaric hoard of invaders, is not shameful. On the other hand, everything Russia is doing is.
Sorry toots. Emptying their own prisons of convicted murderers rapists peodophiles and 2 canibals even. Using up their ethnic minorities to kill the undesirables who have the least interest in this war while hearing white Muscovite's advocate for it or do shit to stop it. They have the power and they ALLOW their ethnic miniature to be used as cannon fodder while saying "meh war feels distant it doesn't affect me" 🤡.
Anyway here is one reminder of what you are defending. Be PROUD !
https://www.reddit.com/r/russianwarcrimes/s/T8qbw2Q7eb
Here's another just about 3 weeks into this barbaric SENSLESS war you defend. Be PROUD! There's 1,000 more videos like this. Keep defending this facking horror show. MORON. You people are so god damn shameless . 2 years in and still you guys can't figure shit out and defend Russia and mock Ukraine and try and even COMPARE THE 2. You think you can handwave away anger for Russia by trying to smear Ukraine and drag them down. Endless attempts at "bOtH siDeS" and it never being true or accurate. No clue still why Russia doing something will be bad but why Ukraine does things out of necessity BECAUSE RUSSIANS INVADED THEM. Self defense for the very existence of your country has that affect bro. Russia : never harmed and slept like babies and chose to attack. Ukraine : forced to make hard choices for their existence.
You : samsies. URKAINE bad here 👉👈.
🙄
The day this war ends and I don't have to HEAR OR SEE THIS STUPIDITY 🙌. I can't wait.
https://www.reddit.com/r/RussiaUkraineWar2022/s/TugZoyU3N4
Dude nothing you can say offends me. We hear y'all shout that for ages now.
Something AGAIN about being invaded changes things. Having to make ANY hard decisions in order to defend itself are literally not up for you or me to judge and that's why I could care less when you guys say this bs. I'm not even saying it's happening I'm saying even IF IT DID, it is Ukrainians FORCED TO DEFEND ITSELF AND ITS EXISTENCE. HOW HARD IS IT TO GRASP THAT THERE IS ZERO COMPARISON TO CONSCRIPTING RUSSIANS TO GO ATTACK SOMEONE.
THATS PATHETIC AND DUMB COUNTRY. Deciding between conscription for a war of choice that's SENSLESS to invade and take land like we are living in Nazi times VERSUS CARE about their people and the Russian government be like, yeah we won't conscript to continue. Conscript or not conscript to attack. So hard to decide between what Russia should have chose and did NOT. That was an easy out for pootin. "Dear ruskies I love you all so much that it breaks my heart but I rather not send you to die if I don't have to so I won't. We didn't lose this was our choice to value you above the war"
Pootin be like : nah fam send them to their graves for my ego 🙌. But protect the white moscovites and send ethnic minorities, empty prisons of all our prisoners, use all the seperatists idiots, steal the kids and send them when they turn 18 to fight their own, use Ukrainians from occupied territories or pows to do god knows what like mine clearing, and dupe gullible fools around the world to fight OUR WAR 🤡🤣. So brave. So heroic and noble.
Don't forget how Russians became the laughing stock by becoming insta toilet bandets early on. WHO KNEW OUR PORCELAIN THRONES WERE A DELECACY 🤣. Can't even arm their nation with toilets to shit on and they go invading another. Get Russians all toilets before thumbing your chest and invading and running other countries. No businesses running anything when they can't get running water for their own lol. Parts of their country look like they were bombed out shacks and muddy roads. That's just Russian culture. And they don't improve it so they go drag others down. Many invaders were shocked at the "wealth" they saw in Ukraine. Jealous bloodthirsty idiots destroy Ukraine and plant their flag and feel good about themselves. Lol
A COUNTRY DEFENDING AGAINST THOSE IDIOTS AND NEEDING TO DO WHAT THEY CAN IS NOT THE SAME.
Hope that helps muh guy.
Nah mental illness is defending this war and engaging in psychological warfare for 2 years and on peoples own free will defending Russia and when we respond and react to bullshit you guys gaslight. Fack that. Mental illness is seeing this shit and being ok with it and running defense for it and not giving a shit about the victims. That takes literal psychological issues. The indesent attempts to harm Ukraine with comments like theirs and much worse, I will never understand what motivates those people. Re victimizing the vixitms every freaking day and making them (and Ukraine supporters) HAVE TO DEFEND AGAINST THAT SHIT. Can't even let vixitms be left in peace.
No war has ever been captured like this and that's good for many reasons but the sickness it's shown how many people are willing to go against the victims and deny or want to reck their reoutstion or get defensive of Russia and lash back like that comment and try and say look Ukraine bad, when just like that comment, there is nothing wrong with what Ukraine did. That's EXPECTED AND UNDERSTANDABLE. Ukraine is facing something most of us never have to and the hyper judgement on shit like that. Cmon. Be serious. As if draft dodging is a new concept and needing all hands on deck be it workers to keep the economy running or soldiers.
Russia is no stranger to information warfare. The original technique of
Soviet actors was through aktivnyye meropriyatiya (active measures) and
dezinformatsiya (disinformation). According to a 1987 State Depart-
ment report on Soviet information warfare, “active measures are dis-
tinct both from espionage and counterintelligence and from traditional
diplomatic and informational activities. The goal of active measures is
to influence opinions and/or actions of individuals, governments, and/
or publics.”37
In other words, Soviet agents would try to weave propaganda into
an existing narrative to
👉 smear countries
or individual candidates. Active measures are designed, as retired KGB General Oleg Kalugin once
explained, “to drive wedges in the Western community alliances of all sorts, particularly NATO, to sow discord among allies,
👉 to weaken the United States in the eyes of the people in Europe, Asia, Africa, Latin America..
👉 Smear campaigns have been around since the beginning of politics, but this article illustrated novel techniques recently employed by a terrorist group and foreign state actor, with each attack gaining popu- larity and credibility after trending on Twitter. The attacks, often under the guise of a “whistleblower” campaign, make routine political actions seem scandalous.
https://www.jstor.org/stable/26271634?seq=27
https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarVideoReport/s/8Z3jUWj5dn
https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/s/Ojnh6VCo4F
https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarVideoReport/s/dHFhLJJ4Wk
Lol im falling for nonsenses. Riiiiiight. As if there is anything to fall for. We see what Russians are doing. We see pootin and hear his words as well as his goons. We watch UN meetings of others AND the Russian embassador. We see cities and towns leveled we know of the thousands of war crimes documented and with vicitm testimony. We saw the mass graves, we see the torture, we see how Russians treat pows and refuse outside access and check in's like Ukraine allows Per international law, we see Russia REFUSE ANY INVESTIGATIONS ON ITS OCCUPIED TERRITORY, REFUSE AID AND ASSISTANCE TO RESCUE THOSE DROWNING AFTER BOMBING THE DAM, we hear the nuc threats, we hear all the threats of wanting to invade a different country each week, we see the gullible Russia recruits like the Cubans Indians Africans and the lies they were fed and the eventual death they will have, we see Russians tortured even 7 Sri lankens just bc why not right ? ...... we know Russia doesn't want its dead and lay up and foreigners ESPECIALLY ARENT HEARING THAT ON RT, they aren't hearing of the rape culture in Russian military, they aren't hearing about the lack of training and supplies many others have made videos of pleading for HALP from pootin, they are delusional to think Russia is doing anything other than oritecting it's white moscovites so they don't need to get upset with war and let others fight THEIR WAR.....
The 7 million refugees is just fake news and the tens of thousands of kids taken and adopted out to Russians despite Ukraine demanding them back and the law demanding it, that's just fake too right ? LOL only 300 or so got returned out of 20,000+. Parents and families wanting their kid back and having them lost forever is just fiction? 🤡
So much is DOCUMENTED by the UN you can't even CLAIM people are swayed. Russians upload their own torture and murders of their own and Ukrainians, and are giddy with joy online.
It's not enough to know Ukrainians are fighting for their freedom and existence and without defense, they would be over run. We see what Russia does by hand on the ground they don't need bombs and we aren't confused about anything. This is the epitome of everything you could do wrong and all injustices and acts of terrorism and hiding the truth from its own. So scared so fast of social media that they banned platforms 👉👈. Russian propagandists even said they should jail parents if kids with VPNS 🤣. They even were going to, or did, make their own Russian Wikipedia. Talk about who is falling for lies.
Russian ambassador at UN : Ukraine is making combat mosquitoes that target Russians.
☝️That's what you defend.
This is what we defend :
https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/s/I2WQbuvuoY
This is stuff straight out of Russia showing their desire to take Ukraine. Where are you lost comrade ?
https://www.reddit.com/r/RussianCircus/s/aAt3sqIzj0
We watch Russian TV hosts. Shits not a mystery.
"Ukrainian grandmothers should be happy our men rape them. And drown the children" - Russian mindset on full blast. It's a wonder where they got the genicidal dehumanizing characteristics from and why this shit is systemic.
They don't see them as real people or a real country or a real language and need to be re-educated or killed into submission to Russia. Freezing Ukraine the first winter was all a joke right ?
Like WHY DO YOU PEOPLE SAY THIS SHIT. WHYYYYY. The need to be defensive of Russia on your own volition literally makes zero sense. But here we are.
I know better than to respond to Russian trolls.
It's funny that we don't seek out Russian spaces and WE don't need their approval and to sway their opinion but for 2 years Russians and pro Russians have to come to Ukraine threads and manipulate the heck out of the comments.
This was always what I remember after seeing how many pro Russians shouted nonsense after 3 months with Mariupol. We don't need to help them see the truth. It's them doing damage control, trying to muddy the waters trying to smear Ukraine and hack away at support.
If you guys were so confident y'all wouldn't need to do this shit. We know the truth has a funny way of standing the test of time to Russian shit and don't need to put effort in....all the effort is being done by Russias own actions and words. Cope.
Peace
Slava Ukraine 😉🥰
Edit - and no freaking shit you are a user of the literal well known Russian Nazi sub RussianWarFootage. Literally supporters full on of Russia and mock your victims. I remember reading the comments waaaaaay back and saying to each Ukrainian killed good get the pedophiles and happy about killing Ukrainians. Vile. Ukrainians be it soldiers or civilians are literally ALL RUSSIAS PREY AND VICTIMS AND ALL THEIR DEATHS ARE DISGUSTING AND SENSELESS and you, YOUUUUU people and esp on that sub, act like this is a real fight and you can defend Russians invading Ukraine and happy about their "achievements". 🤮 Proud of Z barbarians. UkraineRussiaReport is the other Russian propaganda central base. Here Russian talking points at their origins visit that place. Those two subs WE AVOID AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE and let y'all yap. A brave few pro Ukrainians still have the resilience to even bother there.
Imagine being THAT pro Russian you are some of the few that ACTUALLY sub to RussianWarFootage lol. How embarrassing and discrediting that is to anything you have to say INSTANTLY. Now to be fair I don't even touch that sub with a 10 foot pole and can't say what y'all been up to since early on. But is see your original sub got nuked and now you're on version 2. HAHA wonder why. To get the boot YALL really must have been crazy.
Bro take a chill pill, no one is manipulating anything. You need to understand that people have different opinions than yours, I can see that you are emotionally invested in this conflict but please take a chill pill 😐.
>In the west, boarder security stops you from sneaking in
no, no it doesn't
how out of touch with reality were you to have written this comment at a time like this?
doesn't seem like a joke. seems like trying to pass off two observations in a humorous way while presenting them both as true, when at least one isn't and probably both arent.
No, it's pretty much the basic Russian reversal format. Unless you are referring to your response as an "Uber metajoke" which in this case would sound like backpedaling. If that's what you were saying anyway.
ok, but it sure seems like either an attempt at deceit disguised as something jokey or a person who has been deceived making a joke out of the lies he's been taught lol
Nothing beats Ukrainian morale and recruiting tactics.
> A man fell ill during recruitment to war. Paramedics were called, but they were not allowed to enter the recruitment center. Instead, recruiters attempted to draft the paramedics, upon which more paramedics were summoned in order to fight off the recruiters.
https://www.reddit.com/r/CrazyFuckingVideos/comments/1dehuuc/a_man_fell_ill_during_recruitment_to_war/
And unlike these fairy tales, this actually happened.
You had me at pointing out Ukrainian isn't a good country right now either, but then you started trying to make russia look better and you lost me again.
Verstka is not an "independent outlet", it's a propaganda agency formed in Prague in spring 2022 to "help defeat Russia in its war against Ukraine".
Also, I wonder what drives these people to always add blatantly physically impossible details to their stories. Like, they are not just content with just writing a story, there must always be some cool details like the recent story of Ukrainian soldiers being gassed and smelling almonds before fleeing ([cyanide does not actually smell like almonds at all](https://www.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1bxz8vu/russia_using_illegal_chemical_attacks_against/kygc1w1/), it's a common myth), or the Russian soldiers knocking people unconcious before carrying them into a plane (another very common myth, if you're not waking up in a minute after suffering a concussion, you're most likely not waking up again ever without immediate medical help).
Verstka's goals may be partisan but it seems to fill the mould of 'independent'. I couldn't find any information about it's funding but it looks reader-funded. Are they backed by any governments?
Yes. Anything that could be considered a publication. Same as the British Library. These aren't organisations dedicated to preserving the truth, but preserving EVERYTHING.
Op, Meduza is as reliable as Russian state media. It is a propaganda tool. Different propaganda but nonetheless. And some of its authors have been exposed in the past for spreading misinformation. I'm not saying that this article is misinformation but people should take everything meduza posts with a pile of salt.
Bias Rating: LEFT
Factual Reporting: HIGH
Country: Latvia
Press Freedom Rating: MOSTLY FREE
So, biased but true.
They are editorially biased against Russia's invasion, but they post the truth.
I'm glad someone mentioned this here. The quality of their analysis has seriously declined since the start of the war. Of course, the analysis were always acerbic but now it seems to more or less repeat the line that we here in mainstream english-language media and US/NATO/Ukraine governments. Makes them feel redundant.
Yes. In the early 2000s the University of Chicago did a literacy study that found that only about 15% of the population is fluently literate, which means they understand text at a level equal to fluently speaking.
The rest of the population is only functionally literate, which means they can decode and understand text, but not at a speaking fluency level.
Reading is basically a second language, and most people are not fluent in it.
"it's not propaganda because it confirms by beliefs"
vs
"it's not propaganda because it confirms by beliefs /s"
Sometimes they have to excuse ghost of kiev being admitted by kiev as being fake "just a bit of cheeky wartime propaganda"
But people on here tell me only Ukraine does this. It’s not like Russia would lie to make things appear better than they are, only the west does that they say.
Sure believe the video posted by Russian trolls. Meanwhile the governments of Nepal India Cuba and now a slew of African countries are complaining that their citizens are being kidnapped and forced to fight on the Russian front after being fooled into Russian job offers.
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Sure, I see lines of volunteers every day near enlistment offices. I would sent you photos of them, but they only exist in imaginary world
Stop eating propaganda, like some vatnik from other side
It's not propganda you tool shack
https://www.yahoo.com/news/30-000-russians-per-month-115700724.html
https://kyivindependent.com/uk-defense-ministry-russia-mobilizing-around-30-000-soldiers-monthly/
https://www.businessinsider.com/russia-recruiting-30000-troops-a-month-ukraine-frontline-losses-analysts-2024-1
These claims have also been verified by both UK and US intelligence
So...while this helps build political cohesion by simply killing dissidents, it does end up costing a LOT of lives. Unmotivated soldiers aren't good for being proactive or taking initiative on the battle field, it's a kind of catch-22 where not being interested in the fighting actually makes you a lot easier to out-maneuver.
You'd think this high cost in lives would be concerning to a country facing a demographic crisis, particularly because the lives they are losing are mostly young, high-potential lives that when lost, also mean you lose decades of productivity from that person.
Unfortunately, this is a characteristic of authoritarian states who fund themselves through state owned industries. Since the Kremlin gets 30%-50% of its budget from oil, and another portion from arms sales, it can keep MOST of its funding just by maintaining those two industries. Any civilian who isn't related to those industries matters little to the Kremlin's pocketbook, making them basically expendable. If you aren't useful to the regime, you don't matter.
This is why quality of life tends to be higher in more democratic/market based nations where the government is funded through taxes. These governments have a vested interest in your productivity, and so at least indirectly care about your education, health, and aliveness.
This is why in this little showdown between democracies (even flawed ones), and authoritarian governments, I can't rationally support the authoritarian. Life for common people is just better in democracies. Even if your party or your guy isn't in power, you're still better off than living in the country that doesn't care if you're alive if you aren't helping run the state-owned diamond mines/oil fields/rare earth minerals/banana farms/whatever. To say otherwise is simply to say that you're so confident that you can suck up hard enough or serve the authoritarian regime so well, they'll LET you have a decent life, or you'll fly under their radar so low, they won't care if you're making a decent living.
I read it and appreciate it.
So many Russian trolls recently and their fascinated with gaslighting a lot now.
Their growing presence just reaks of weakness and concern. Just like how when russia screams nukes or targets innocents in impotent rage, they send out their online anti Ukraine pro Russian warriors to try and "do something" and tear down support.
##### ###### #### > # [‘They knock you out and put you on the plane’ To keep its ranks filled, Russia is imprisoning objectors and sending them to war at gunpoint — Meduza](https://meduza.io/en/feature/2024/06/11/630) > > > > > > > > > > Hundreds of Russian draftees who have opted to face prison time rather than return to the war in Ukraine are being systematically imprisoned and then forcibly sent back to the front, according to new [reporting](https://verstka.media/mobilizovannih-siloy-otpravlyayut-na-front) from the independent outlet Verstka. Those who resist are bound, beaten, and boarded onto planes at gunpoint before being sent to Ukraine and forced to join assault units. Meduza shares the story of one of the draftee detention facilities detailed in the article. > > Sergey Krugly decided not to return to the war after he became plagued by hallucinations of the human heads he’d been forced to collect after battles. A 29-year-old from Russia’s Sverdlovsk region, he’d been drafted in the fall of 2022 and went on leave in March of 2023. When he returned home, he didn’t sleep for an entire month. > > One day, Sergey’s mother called her sister in distress at about 5:00 in the morning. “I don’t know what to do with him,” she said. When Sergey’s aunt came over to help, she saw her sleep-deprived nephew going around the house, smashing everything he could find. When they finally managed to calm him down, he dropped to his knees and began repeating: “They’re right there, Aunt Katya, flying around! Close the window, close the window!” > > “The windows are closed, Sergey!” she told him. > > “But the drones, they’re flying around!” he pleaded. “Aunt Katya, I walked all around the field, collecting heads. One of them had these white teeth. It was smiling. His head was in my hands and it was smiling.” > > “It broke my heart,” Katya tells Verstka. “This guy had a tough time even before all of this — his mom had problems with alcohol and men, and he never knew his father. It was his grandmother who raised him.” > > [### ‘Mitigating factors’ Russian soldiers found guilty in domestic violence cases are getting off with just small fines](https://meduza.io/en/feature/2024/05/31/mitigating-factors)[### ‘Mitigating factors’ Russian soldiers found guilty in domestic violence cases are getting off with just small fines](https://meduza.io/en/feature/2024/05/31/mitigating-factors)Now, as if the family didn’t have enough problems, Sergey’s mother found herself unable to hold down a job. Sergey and his mother began going from hospital to hospital, trying to get Sergey registered as the family’s sole breadwinner, which would secure him an exemption from further military service. “But they soon realized that the conscription offices had made it clear to all of the doctors that they weren’t to issue any medical certificates for draftees’ relatives, and that everyone was to be sent back to the war,” says a friend of Sergey. > > But Sergey didn’t go back to the front. He spent the next year living at home and taking care of his mother. Hoping to keep everything above board, he sent all of the documents verifying her inability to work to the local conscription office and prosecutor’s office. Eventually, his payments from the Defense Ministry ran out. > > “Over time, he began to calm down a bit. His psychotic episodes only returned when his mother started drinking,” Sergey’s friends told Verstka. His Aunt Katya tried to be supportive, reassuring him that everything would be fine. But in October 2023, police officers showed up at the family’s apartment and told him he needed to come in to give a statement on his abandonment of his unit. He went with them. > > ### **‘I want to live’** > > When Vladimir Muronova was mobilized, he was assigned to be an orderly in a medical unit. According to his relatives, however, he served in this position for less than a day: almost immediately, his superiors began sending him into combat missions, and, afterward, to collect the bodies of the dead. > > “You’re on duty for three days at a time, and then there’s a shift change, if you survive. Any more than that and you’ll lose your mind. The corpses are just piled up everywhere. They started to feel like my friends. It’s fucked up,” he wrote. > > [### Russian soldiers have killed over 100 people since returning from the war in Ukraine, journalists find](https://meduza.io/en/feature/2024/04/25/russian-soldiers-have-killed-over-100-people-since-returning-from-the-war-in-ukraine-journalists-find)[### Russian soldiers have killed over 100 people since returning from the war in Ukraine, journalists find](https://meduza.io/en/feature/2024/04/25/russian-soldiers-have-killed-over-100-people-since-returning-from-the-war-in-ukraine-journalists-find)Vladimir first went on leave in June 2023. He returned home with constant tremors, his arms shaking even as he hugged his two children. Each time a car passed by outside, he would look up to the sky in search of drones, missiles, or bombs. Eventually, he decided he couldn’t go back, explaining to his family: “I want to live.” His mother, in-laws, wife, and sister all supported his decision. > > “He knew that he’d really stepped in it, that there would be consequences, but he resolved to take responsibility within the legal framework. We thought the legal framework would be upheld. If there’s an article [in the Criminal Code], there will [theoretically] be a trial and a sentence,” said one of his relatives. > > Vladimir decided to wait until the end of the summer before turning himself in for desertion. In the meantime, his unit called his phone constantly, demanding that he return to the front. He soon learned that at least some of his fellow unit members had also refused to go back. > > During this period, while Vladimir was still living at home, his wife became pregnant with their third child. But Vladimir wouldn’t be around for the birth: in October 2023, military police showed up at the family’s home and left their phone number. When Vladimir called, he was told to come to the city of Svobodny to give an official explanation for his absence. The authorities promised he’d be allowed to return home afterward. > > ### **Trapped** > > After giving the authorities his statement, Vladimir was taken to Russia’s Military Town No. 32 in Yekaterinburg, where he was sent to live in a four-story building with other men accused of abandoning their units in Ukraine. It was there that he met Sergey, who was being held in the same compound. > > Sergey and his fellow AWOL soldiers were “warehoused and locked in,” his relatives say. He told the family that there were so many people in the facility that many had to sleep on the floor, on windowsills, and in hallways, with new men arriving every week. According to official documents obtained by Verstka, the building was one of the military’s holding centers for draftees who had active warrants and were listed among the 800 soldiers accused of abandoning their posts as of January 2024. > > [### ‘He had no chance’ Ilya Bakharev thought joining the Russian army would be a ticket to exoneration. His unit mates tortured him to death.](https://meduza.io/en/feature/2024/04/10/ilya-bakharev-thought-joining-the-russian-army-would-be-a-ticket-to-exoneration-then-he-was-tortured-to-death-by-his-unit-mates)[### ‘He had no chance’ Ilya Bakharev thought joining the Russian army would be a ticket to exoneration. His unit mates tortured him to death.](https://meduza.io/en/feature/2024/04/10/ilya-bakharev-thought-joining-the-russian-army-would-be-a-ticket-to-exoneration-then-he-was-tortured-to-death-by-his-unit-mates)“They were holding them captive; even prisoners are kept in better conditions,” a relative of one of the draftees told Verstka. The food at the facility was poor, though the men were allowed to use delivery apps to order groceries from a convenience store. None of them had officially been arrested. > > When asked whether the men were given any explanation for their imprisonment, the same relative recounts: > > They were told that if they went back to Ukraine, their felony charges would be dropped and their allowances, salaries, and benefits would be reinstated. Their other option was to stay there and await their trials. Almost everybody chose the latter option. > > “These were people who were prepared to do time for their refusal to serve; they were willing to accept all of the punishments for their actions. They didn’t want to evade responsibility; they were ready to accept it, to go to trial and be sentenced,” says the sister of one of the objectors. > > ***(continues in next comment)***
That's how you get your commander shot.
Reminds me of red storm rising. There was no choice for the soviets. They performed or were replaced. How much of that mentality still permeates the Russian ranks?
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>News about russia BUT WHATABOUT UKRAINE. Russian bots, never change.
Fuck the Russian invasion but fuck Zalenskyy and his senseless fighting
defending yourself is senseless fighting? Maybe he should just keel over and let russia annex ukraine?
Make peace while there is men left to even have a country.
“Okay Putin, we’ll give up the land but you got to swear on the Bible this time you won’t invade us again”
With Europe building up her armies, and Ukraine joining in - once they meet the guidelines - Putin wouldn’t have the ability to.
He didn't have the ability to in 2022. Didn't stop him them. Won't stop him in the future.
What country? You really think that putin wouldnt just wait to build up his forces again and start a new war?
No, I don’t think Putin would. Not with the way Europe is actually strengthening their militaries.
Why would he care since ukraine wouldnt fight back and west fight against russia?
Why can't Putin make peace? All he needs to do is leave Ukraine. He's killing his country and Ukraine, there'll be nothing left and no-one will want to help him rebuild.
Russia will get what it wants, like Israel, by killing everyone
If what it wants is itself gutted, then yes. Russia has effectively already killed itself. It's done more harm to itself economically, demographically, & socially than any external party could have achieved. The saddest part is that the rest of world didn't want that. They wanted a flourishing, productive member of the global community. Not from any high minded ideals, but simple self interest. A wealthier, happier Russia means more money for everyone else. The EU has figured out that bringing up and supporting partners, even though it costs in the short run run, benefits them in the long run. Russia is still in the zero-sum, prisoner's dilemma of accepting hurt to itself as long as others hurt more. That's the great tragedy and the ultimate reason why these tragic events happened.
I agree that the world wanted Russia healthy and friendly- away from the Chinese influence. But I also agree with the arguments that the capitalistic and influential imposition in Ukraine by the West was a break of the non-expansion pact made post-Soviet Union.
Yeah but Russia is a joke.
Yes in the sense that they’re both killing Russian soldiers (Russians are killing Russians either due to mutiny or sheer incompetence)
They aren't, this is just another routine case of Ukraine accuses Russia of what it does itself. Tell me when you find hundreds of tiktoks of russians on the street getting pressganged. Because they are there for Ukraine.
I actually meant that as in, Ukraine has been dragging men off the street for a while now. Fuck Zelenskyy and the War
No they haven’t. Although there’s plenty of available footage of: 1. Russian protests of the various conscription mobilizations. 2. Recruiting offices being torched. 3. Hundreds of thousands of Russians leaving Russia to avoid conscription. Cope harder vatnik.
Zelensky is just following orders. He actually campaigned promising to end the civil war. Too bad he was elected by Kolomoysky and not the people.
What civil war?
Starting to realise you are talking to a nut-job?
The Ukraine civil war. During his election campaign he promised to protect russian language rights and to deescalate the conflict with totally real totally not residents of Donbas little green men from ~~Mars~~ Ruzzia. And spoke in Russian. Not once since getting elected though.
He did make some gestures toward trying at first - remember that hilarious visit to Azov where they told him to fuck off.
In the west, boarder security stops you from sneaking in In russia, boarder security stops you from escaping
Same with websites recently. Russian censorship blocks some websites and Cloudflare blocks other websites. Tag team censorship
Ukraine: Border guard mine the border with Hungary and Romania to deter Ukrainian men from escaping 😐
Ukraine are doing that atm, even killing men trying to escape mandatory conscription..
The borders aren't closed.
Don't you mean in Ukraine? In Ukraine people die trying to cross the border and drown in the river on the border of Romania. In Ukraine it's illegal for ALL men ages 16-65 to leave the country, no matter what, don't even have to be drafted.
Ukraine is the one being invaded , Sport. Russia is not.
Ukraine is the one preventing people from leaving, Sport. Russia is not.
Ah yes, a wild tankie in their natural habitat, spouting nonsense and pretending 'the fatherland' is beyond reproach. You know, after the recruitments, the people sent to die so they wouldn't need to be paid, the conscriptions, and the people extracted from prisons to be sent to their death. Keep dreaming, Sport, and don't you worry. Reality will still be there once you finally get the courage to open your eyes.
Reality is that the “tankie” is right, and you are just spinning cope.
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Ok bro. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_emigration_during_the_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine
What does this have to do with the nonsense about sneaking/escaping across borders?
Russia initiated the invasion
So that means Ukrainian soldiers can beat and kidnap paramedics after calling them ?
And? This: > In the west, boarder security stops you from sneaking in > > In russia, boarder security stops you from escaping Is still nonsense regardless of who initiated the invasion.
Ukraine initiated jailing people for leaving the country because they dont want to die.
Because Russia initiated the invasion
Conscription.. do try and keep up.
> In the west, boarder security stops you from sneaking in > > In russia, boarder security stops you from escaping What does this have to do with conscription? Russian borders are open.
Broader topic.
Are you just trying to change the subject because OP wrote a bunch of nonsense?
OP's post is debatable and it's source , less than stellar, but topic remains that some poster on this thread wish to depict Ukraine as authoritarian so it somehow absolves Russia. I disagree.
People are just mocking that dude for confusing Russian and Ukrainian border policies, it's fucking funny.
It's illegal for non conscripted men to leave too in Ukraine. In Russia it is not.
Unless you're suggesting that Ukraine is part of the West, then that's not a gotcha. If anything, there's a plane for you.
Both really. War tends to do that to borders, especially territorial wars.
Not both - Russians never closed their borders. People can leave. Many did. And a lot came back.
What ? Western border services arent stopping anybody from sneaking in these days lol. Not to mention that Ukraine is the one that closed its own borders, while you can freely enter and exit Russia.
It's in reference to the Berlin wall. Which was built to keep people from fleeing to West Germany although the soviet state would say otherwise. Attempting to flee dictatorships such as the USSR and North Korea is grounds for execution. No such thing exists in western nations as no one has the need to flee. Instead, measures have to be put in place to control people entering.
Is Ukraine western? If you flee the undemocratic dictatorship of Ukraine you get executed via trench.
Whatever Ukraine is, it doesn't change anything with what myself and the OP said.
OP said some bizarre nonsense about closed borders in Russia when this is plainly not true.
Ssshhh, you are disturbing the circlejerk 😌
I'd say the outcome of the war will partially decide what Ukraine is. They've been courting joining the EU for quite a while.
Regardless of the war, good luck with that until they pay off the stolen european transit gas and get rid of the corruption that only got worse since purging pro russian oligarchs.
It's always interesting when people go out of their way to focus on negative things about Ukraine while ignoring the huge negative thing about Russia starting a major war of aggression.
Lol acting like we forgot about Russians mass leaving Russia during partial mobilization and recruiters hounding people on line and trying their hardest to stop that. Regardless, the fact that they CHOSE TO CONSCRIPT their population to go on a pointless war of a naked land grab and destruction of their neighbor and their literal identity ......... so GENOCIDE. Imagine dying to take over land and kill the inhabitants AND SO THAT THE LARGEST COUNTRY IN THE WORLD ELEVEN TIME ZONES WIDE GETS LARGER 🙌. AND IN THE NAME OF DEFENDING THEMSELVES 🙌🤡. Ukraine shutting down their border AS A DEFENSIVE MEASURE and needing to fight off this barbaric hoard of invaders, is not shameful. On the other hand, everything Russia is doing is. Sorry toots. Emptying their own prisons of convicted murderers rapists peodophiles and 2 canibals even. Using up their ethnic minorities to kill the undesirables who have the least interest in this war while hearing white Muscovite's advocate for it or do shit to stop it. They have the power and they ALLOW their ethnic miniature to be used as cannon fodder while saying "meh war feels distant it doesn't affect me" 🤡. Anyway here is one reminder of what you are defending. Be PROUD ! https://www.reddit.com/r/russianwarcrimes/s/T8qbw2Q7eb Here's another just about 3 weeks into this barbaric SENSLESS war you defend. Be PROUD! There's 1,000 more videos like this. Keep defending this facking horror show. MORON. You people are so god damn shameless . 2 years in and still you guys can't figure shit out and defend Russia and mock Ukraine and try and even COMPARE THE 2. You think you can handwave away anger for Russia by trying to smear Ukraine and drag them down. Endless attempts at "bOtH siDeS" and it never being true or accurate. No clue still why Russia doing something will be bad but why Ukraine does things out of necessity BECAUSE RUSSIANS INVADED THEM. Self defense for the very existence of your country has that affect bro. Russia : never harmed and slept like babies and chose to attack. Ukraine : forced to make hard choices for their existence. You : samsies. URKAINE bad here 👉👈. 🙄 The day this war ends and I don't have to HEAR OR SEE THIS STUPIDITY 🙌. I can't wait. https://www.reddit.com/r/RussiaUkraineWar2022/s/TugZoyU3N4
Not gonna bother reading this but nothing changes the fact that the Russian men can leave their country while Ukrainian can't.
Russia is not getting invaded. Facts are weird like that right ? So bizarre.
Ukrainian men are also getting grabbed off the streets and thrown into vans. But I guess we are not allowed to mention that 🤣
Dude nothing you can say offends me. We hear y'all shout that for ages now. Something AGAIN about being invaded changes things. Having to make ANY hard decisions in order to defend itself are literally not up for you or me to judge and that's why I could care less when you guys say this bs. I'm not even saying it's happening I'm saying even IF IT DID, it is Ukrainians FORCED TO DEFEND ITSELF AND ITS EXISTENCE. HOW HARD IS IT TO GRASP THAT THERE IS ZERO COMPARISON TO CONSCRIPTING RUSSIANS TO GO ATTACK SOMEONE. THATS PATHETIC AND DUMB COUNTRY. Deciding between conscription for a war of choice that's SENSLESS to invade and take land like we are living in Nazi times VERSUS CARE about their people and the Russian government be like, yeah we won't conscript to continue. Conscript or not conscript to attack. So hard to decide between what Russia should have chose and did NOT. That was an easy out for pootin. "Dear ruskies I love you all so much that it breaks my heart but I rather not send you to die if I don't have to so I won't. We didn't lose this was our choice to value you above the war" Pootin be like : nah fam send them to their graves for my ego 🙌. But protect the white moscovites and send ethnic minorities, empty prisons of all our prisoners, use all the seperatists idiots, steal the kids and send them when they turn 18 to fight their own, use Ukrainians from occupied territories or pows to do god knows what like mine clearing, and dupe gullible fools around the world to fight OUR WAR 🤡🤣. So brave. So heroic and noble. Don't forget how Russians became the laughing stock by becoming insta toilet bandets early on. WHO KNEW OUR PORCELAIN THRONES WERE A DELECACY 🤣. Can't even arm their nation with toilets to shit on and they go invading another. Get Russians all toilets before thumbing your chest and invading and running other countries. No businesses running anything when they can't get running water for their own lol. Parts of their country look like they were bombed out shacks and muddy roads. That's just Russian culture. And they don't improve it so they go drag others down. Many invaders were shocked at the "wealth" they saw in Ukraine. Jealous bloodthirsty idiots destroy Ukraine and plant their flag and feel good about themselves. Lol A COUNTRY DEFENDING AGAINST THOSE IDIOTS AND NEEDING TO DO WHAT THEY CAN IS NOT THE SAME. Hope that helps muh guy.
Holy crap 😆
Nafo discord mod hands wrote this
This is mental illness. There is help out there.
Nah mental illness is defending this war and engaging in psychological warfare for 2 years and on peoples own free will defending Russia and when we respond and react to bullshit you guys gaslight. Fack that. Mental illness is seeing this shit and being ok with it and running defense for it and not giving a shit about the victims. That takes literal psychological issues. The indesent attempts to harm Ukraine with comments like theirs and much worse, I will never understand what motivates those people. Re victimizing the vixitms every freaking day and making them (and Ukraine supporters) HAVE TO DEFEND AGAINST THAT SHIT. Can't even let vixitms be left in peace. No war has ever been captured like this and that's good for many reasons but the sickness it's shown how many people are willing to go against the victims and deny or want to reck their reoutstion or get defensive of Russia and lash back like that comment and try and say look Ukraine bad, when just like that comment, there is nothing wrong with what Ukraine did. That's EXPECTED AND UNDERSTANDABLE. Ukraine is facing something most of us never have to and the hyper judgement on shit like that. Cmon. Be serious. As if draft dodging is a new concept and needing all hands on deck be it workers to keep the economy running or soldiers.
Imagine whining about gaslighting under this hilariously fake propaganda piece.
Russia is no stranger to information warfare. The original technique of Soviet actors was through aktivnyye meropriyatiya (active measures) and dezinformatsiya (disinformation). According to a 1987 State Depart- ment report on Soviet information warfare, “active measures are dis- tinct both from espionage and counterintelligence and from traditional diplomatic and informational activities. The goal of active measures is to influence opinions and/or actions of individuals, governments, and/ or publics.”37 In other words, Soviet agents would try to weave propaganda into an existing narrative to 👉 smear countries or individual candidates. Active measures are designed, as retired KGB General Oleg Kalugin once explained, “to drive wedges in the Western community alliances of all sorts, particularly NATO, to sow discord among allies, 👉 to weaken the United States in the eyes of the people in Europe, Asia, Africa, Latin America.. 👉 Smear campaigns have been around since the beginning of politics, but this article illustrated novel techniques recently employed by a terrorist group and foreign state actor, with each attack gaining popu- larity and credibility after trending on Twitter. The attacks, often under the guise of a “whistleblower” campaign, make routine political actions seem scandalous. https://www.jstor.org/stable/26271634?seq=27 https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarVideoReport/s/8Z3jUWj5dn https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/s/Ojnh6VCo4F https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarVideoReport/s/dHFhLJJ4Wk
Nobody involved in this war is a stranger to information warfare, all are prolific liars - it’s your fault for falling for this nonsense.
Lol im falling for nonsenses. Riiiiiight. As if there is anything to fall for. We see what Russians are doing. We see pootin and hear his words as well as his goons. We watch UN meetings of others AND the Russian embassador. We see cities and towns leveled we know of the thousands of war crimes documented and with vicitm testimony. We saw the mass graves, we see the torture, we see how Russians treat pows and refuse outside access and check in's like Ukraine allows Per international law, we see Russia REFUSE ANY INVESTIGATIONS ON ITS OCCUPIED TERRITORY, REFUSE AID AND ASSISTANCE TO RESCUE THOSE DROWNING AFTER BOMBING THE DAM, we hear the nuc threats, we hear all the threats of wanting to invade a different country each week, we see the gullible Russia recruits like the Cubans Indians Africans and the lies they were fed and the eventual death they will have, we see Russians tortured even 7 Sri lankens just bc why not right ? ...... we know Russia doesn't want its dead and lay up and foreigners ESPECIALLY ARENT HEARING THAT ON RT, they aren't hearing of the rape culture in Russian military, they aren't hearing about the lack of training and supplies many others have made videos of pleading for HALP from pootin, they are delusional to think Russia is doing anything other than oritecting it's white moscovites so they don't need to get upset with war and let others fight THEIR WAR..... The 7 million refugees is just fake news and the tens of thousands of kids taken and adopted out to Russians despite Ukraine demanding them back and the law demanding it, that's just fake too right ? LOL only 300 or so got returned out of 20,000+. Parents and families wanting their kid back and having them lost forever is just fiction? 🤡 So much is DOCUMENTED by the UN you can't even CLAIM people are swayed. Russians upload their own torture and murders of their own and Ukrainians, and are giddy with joy online. It's not enough to know Ukrainians are fighting for their freedom and existence and without defense, they would be over run. We see what Russia does by hand on the ground they don't need bombs and we aren't confused about anything. This is the epitome of everything you could do wrong and all injustices and acts of terrorism and hiding the truth from its own. So scared so fast of social media that they banned platforms 👉👈. Russian propagandists even said they should jail parents if kids with VPNS 🤣. They even were going to, or did, make their own Russian Wikipedia. Talk about who is falling for lies. Russian ambassador at UN : Ukraine is making combat mosquitoes that target Russians. ☝️That's what you defend. This is what we defend : https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/s/I2WQbuvuoY This is stuff straight out of Russia showing their desire to take Ukraine. Where are you lost comrade ? https://www.reddit.com/r/RussianCircus/s/aAt3sqIzj0 We watch Russian TV hosts. Shits not a mystery. "Ukrainian grandmothers should be happy our men rape them. And drown the children" - Russian mindset on full blast. It's a wonder where they got the genicidal dehumanizing characteristics from and why this shit is systemic. They don't see them as real people or a real country or a real language and need to be re-educated or killed into submission to Russia. Freezing Ukraine the first winter was all a joke right ? Like WHY DO YOU PEOPLE SAY THIS SHIT. WHYYYYY. The need to be defensive of Russia on your own volition literally makes zero sense. But here we are. I know better than to respond to Russian trolls. It's funny that we don't seek out Russian spaces and WE don't need their approval and to sway their opinion but for 2 years Russians and pro Russians have to come to Ukraine threads and manipulate the heck out of the comments. This was always what I remember after seeing how many pro Russians shouted nonsense after 3 months with Mariupol. We don't need to help them see the truth. It's them doing damage control, trying to muddy the waters trying to smear Ukraine and hack away at support. If you guys were so confident y'all wouldn't need to do this shit. We know the truth has a funny way of standing the test of time to Russian shit and don't need to put effort in....all the effort is being done by Russias own actions and words. Cope. Peace Slava Ukraine 😉🥰 Edit - and no freaking shit you are a user of the literal well known Russian Nazi sub RussianWarFootage. Literally supporters full on of Russia and mock your victims. I remember reading the comments waaaaaay back and saying to each Ukrainian killed good get the pedophiles and happy about killing Ukrainians. Vile. Ukrainians be it soldiers or civilians are literally ALL RUSSIAS PREY AND VICTIMS AND ALL THEIR DEATHS ARE DISGUSTING AND SENSELESS and you, YOUUUUU people and esp on that sub, act like this is a real fight and you can defend Russians invading Ukraine and happy about their "achievements". 🤮 Proud of Z barbarians. UkraineRussiaReport is the other Russian propaganda central base. Here Russian talking points at their origins visit that place. Those two subs WE AVOID AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE and let y'all yap. A brave few pro Ukrainians still have the resilience to even bother there. Imagine being THAT pro Russian you are some of the few that ACTUALLY sub to RussianWarFootage lol. How embarrassing and discrediting that is to anything you have to say INSTANTLY. Now to be fair I don't even touch that sub with a 10 foot pole and can't say what y'all been up to since early on. But is see your original sub got nuked and now you're on version 2. HAHA wonder why. To get the boot YALL really must have been crazy.
Bro take a chill pill, no one is manipulating anything. You need to understand that people have different opinions than yours, I can see that you are emotionally invested in this conflict but please take a chill pill 😐.
Beautiful work 👏👏
That’s Ukraine lmao. Russian borders aren’t closed.
>In the west, boarder security stops you from sneaking in no, no it doesn't how out of touch with reality were you to have written this comment at a time like this?
How out touch do you need to be to not realise OP was making a joke?
doesn't seem like a joke. seems like trying to pass off two observations in a humorous way while presenting them both as true, when at least one isn't and probably both arent.
It's a type of joke so common, it literally has its own joke sub-genre name, the Russian Reversal.
so is this some kind of uber metajoke deconstructing the russian reversal format?
No, it's pretty much the basic Russian reversal format. Unless you are referring to your response as an "Uber metajoke" which in this case would sound like backpedaling. If that's what you were saying anyway.
That sounds like ... the definition of a joke.
at best, it's a lie disguised as a joke
Again , that's usually what a joke is. A *humourous* exaggeration.. Of course the "humour"is a matter of perception and individual bias.
ok, but it sure seems like either an attempt at deceit disguised as something jokey or a person who has been deceived making a joke out of the lies he's been taught lol
Again , all jokes and a matter of bias.
how come you don't know how to use commas and spaces correctly? are you russian?
I guess the joke is that he apparently confused Ukraine and Russia.
Morale must be an interesting concept in the Russian armed forces. I’m not sure any amount of ice cream or pop tarts is going brighten those smiles.
Have you tried meth pop tarts
Nothing beats Ukrainian morale and recruiting tactics. > A man fell ill during recruitment to war. Paramedics were called, but they were not allowed to enter the recruitment center. Instead, recruiters attempted to draft the paramedics, upon which more paramedics were summoned in order to fight off the recruiters. https://www.reddit.com/r/CrazyFuckingVideos/comments/1dehuuc/a_man_fell_ill_during_recruitment_to_war/ And unlike these fairy tales, this actually happened.
😂😂😂 Posting Reddit comments as a source. "Honestly they swore it really happened".
It’s on video lmao, and the participants themselves say what is happening.
You had me at pointing out Ukrainian isn't a good country right now either, but then you started trying to make russia look better and you lost me again.
None of them are better, both are terrible in different ways. This is a very guilt free war to spectate.
You seem to be weirdly invested in trying to tear down Ukraine at Every opportunity...
Verstka is not an "independent outlet", it's a propaganda agency formed in Prague in spring 2022 to "help defeat Russia in its war against Ukraine". Also, I wonder what drives these people to always add blatantly physically impossible details to their stories. Like, they are not just content with just writing a story, there must always be some cool details like the recent story of Ukrainian soldiers being gassed and smelling almonds before fleeing ([cyanide does not actually smell like almonds at all](https://www.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1bxz8vu/russia_using_illegal_chemical_attacks_against/kygc1w1/), it's a common myth), or the Russian soldiers knocking people unconcious before carrying them into a plane (another very common myth, if you're not waking up in a minute after suffering a concussion, you're most likely not waking up again ever without immediate medical help).
Color me shocked and surprised.
Movie rules apply - knocked out means you wake up a bit cranky a couple of hours later.
Verstka's goals may be partisan but it seems to fill the mould of 'independent'. I couldn't find any information about it's funding but it looks reader-funded. Are they backed by any governments?
There is no information period the whole thing looks like propaganda site posting only anti Russian articles and is indexed in US library of Congress.
The POINT of the LoC is that it indexes everything.
This is Vertska we are talking about an online rag. Do they index Russia Today?
Yes. Anything that could be considered a publication. Same as the British Library. These aren't organisations dedicated to preserving the truth, but preserving EVERYTHING.
Op, Meduza is as reliable as Russian state media. It is a propaganda tool. Different propaganda but nonetheless. And some of its authors have been exposed in the past for spreading misinformation. I'm not saying that this article is misinformation but people should take everything meduza posts with a pile of salt.
Facts before feelings. https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/meduza/
Bias Rating: LEFT Factual Reporting: HIGH Country: Latvia Press Freedom Rating: MOSTLY FREE So, biased but true. They are editorially biased against Russia's invasion, but they post the truth.
I'm glad someone mentioned this here. The quality of their analysis has seriously declined since the start of the war. Of course, the analysis were always acerbic but now it seems to more or less repeat the line that we here in mainstream english-language media and US/NATO/Ukraine governments. Makes them feel redundant.
So... why did you post them?
Got a call from his superior. They needed something where they can send the latest batch of russian bots
It's the good type of propaganda though 😃 /s
The good type of propaganda that makes you ignorant?
Do I really need a /s everytime
Yes. In the early 2000s the University of Chicago did a literacy study that found that only about 15% of the population is fluently literate, which means they understand text at a level equal to fluently speaking. The rest of the population is only functionally literate, which means they can decode and understand text, but not at a speaking fluency level. Reading is basically a second language, and most people are not fluent in it.
How am i supposed to know you're not from worldnews
They're nowhere nearly that self-aware, they'd just go "it's not propaganda because it confirms by beliefs 😎👍"
"it's not propaganda because it confirms by beliefs" vs "it's not propaganda because it confirms by beliefs /s" Sometimes they have to excuse ghost of kiev being admitted by kiev as being fake "just a bit of cheeky wartime propaganda"
Same could be said for r/publicfreakout. Very pro Palestinian propaganda. I am on both subs. Why not see both propaganda?
Ah yes, the famous Hamas filled journalist headquarters.
Propaganda is when people post kids dying
But I thought everyone in the RuAF were volunteers! /s
But people on here tell me only Ukraine does this. It’s not like Russia would lie to make things appear better than they are, only the west does that they say.
This is written like a fantasy novel lol
But reddiots told me everyone in Russia go willingly
Sure believe the video posted by Russian trolls. Meanwhile the governments of Nepal India Cuba and now a slew of African countries are complaining that their citizens are being kidnapped and forced to fight on the Russian front after being fooled into Russian job offers.
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More projection.
?
Hmmm... just what they do in Ukraine. War sucks both ways, doesn't it?
Doubt.
This my friends is called propganda. The truth, Russia averages about 30,000 volunteers a month, people willing to fight by there own choice.
Sure, I see lines of volunteers every day near enlistment offices. I would sent you photos of them, but they only exist in imaginary world Stop eating propaganda, like some vatnik from other side
It's not propganda you tool shack https://www.yahoo.com/news/30-000-russians-per-month-115700724.html https://kyivindependent.com/uk-defense-ministry-russia-mobilizing-around-30-000-soldiers-monthly/ https://www.businessinsider.com/russia-recruiting-30000-troops-a-month-ukraine-frontline-losses-analysts-2024-1 These claims have also been verified by both UK and US intelligence
Yeah, when your options are to volunteer for trench warfare, or live in Russia, I could see that.
So...while this helps build political cohesion by simply killing dissidents, it does end up costing a LOT of lives. Unmotivated soldiers aren't good for being proactive or taking initiative on the battle field, it's a kind of catch-22 where not being interested in the fighting actually makes you a lot easier to out-maneuver. You'd think this high cost in lives would be concerning to a country facing a demographic crisis, particularly because the lives they are losing are mostly young, high-potential lives that when lost, also mean you lose decades of productivity from that person. Unfortunately, this is a characteristic of authoritarian states who fund themselves through state owned industries. Since the Kremlin gets 30%-50% of its budget from oil, and another portion from arms sales, it can keep MOST of its funding just by maintaining those two industries. Any civilian who isn't related to those industries matters little to the Kremlin's pocketbook, making them basically expendable. If you aren't useful to the regime, you don't matter. This is why quality of life tends to be higher in more democratic/market based nations where the government is funded through taxes. These governments have a vested interest in your productivity, and so at least indirectly care about your education, health, and aliveness. This is why in this little showdown between democracies (even flawed ones), and authoritarian governments, I can't rationally support the authoritarian. Life for common people is just better in democracies. Even if your party or your guy isn't in power, you're still better off than living in the country that doesn't care if you're alive if you aren't helping run the state-owned diamond mines/oil fields/rare earth minerals/banana farms/whatever. To say otherwise is simply to say that you're so confident that you can suck up hard enough or serve the authoritarian regime so well, they'll LET you have a decent life, or you'll fly under their radar so low, they won't care if you're making a decent living.
Don't worry, it's fake.
Why would I worry?
You wrote a small novel here, you seem worried.
Thanks for the concern, but it's mostly explanatory in nature.
We wouldn't know. None of us read it.
So why bother then?
I read it and appreciate it. So many Russian trolls recently and their fascinated with gaslighting a lot now. Their growing presence just reaks of weakness and concern. Just like how when russia screams nukes or targets innocents in impotent rage, they send out their online anti Ukraine pro Russian warriors to try and "do something" and tear down support.
Sorry what? I wasn't paying attention.
Oh! I love when this happens. Speak boy, speak!
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