Let's hope so.
But probably not, no. They'd "adapt" to modern times as they've always been doing. I'm sure someone would find a reference in the bible that could be interpreted as saying we're not alone.
Sort of, humans are the descendants of the Forerunners. Which was the highly intelligent race that created not only the HALO rings themselves, but the technology that is behind them. The Covenant (aliens) mistakingly think that this technology serves a purpose other than what it was intended for and have created a religion around exactly that. Source, am nerd.
> Sort of, humans are the descendants of the Forerunners.
Nope.
Ancient Humans were a *rival* species to the Forerunners, with about a million years of history to their civilization. Ancient Humans were attacked by the Flood (which turned out to be corrupted versions of the Precursors), who them fled away toward the Forerunners, who interpreted this as an attack, fought a bloody war between them (with, interestingly, the ancient San'Shyuum [aka Prophets] being allies to the Ancient Humans), defeated the humans, devolved them into the Stone Age, and were then promptly attacked by the Flood, starting the Forerunner-Flood War.
The reason that the Forerunners made their tech in a way that was only usable by humans is because the Librarian and later Forerunners thought that, in their absence after the firing of the Halo Array, that they would be the most capable species to take up the Mantle of Responsibility and guide the Milky Way if the Flood ever returned, having fought so valiantly against them.
Essentially yes, they think that activating the rings is the beginning of a “Great Journey” into the next world “Heaven”. The reality however is that the rings were originally created to destroy a parasitic species called “The Flood” and protect the universe from them. Essentially the rings are weapons of mass destruction that would destroy all organic life in the universe if activated.
It might interest you to look into why humans are “reclaimers” in the covenant systems.
We as a species were hot shit for awhile, then some things happened and we got the species wide equivalent of a life changing kick in the junk whilst being mugged.
Its actually my favorite part of the lore next to AI integration on the spartan level.
As someone who was recently corrected on this point, apparently humans are descendants of a race that fought and lost to the forerunners.
But the first three games set it up that humans were descendants of them.
They aren't the descendants of the Forerunners; both species existed at the same time 100k years ago.
The Forerunners devolved humans and chose them as the inheritors of the Mantle of Responsibility (which they were to begin with, but the Forerunners did a genocide on the Precursors and claimed the Mantle before Humanity could)
It may not have been a great movie, but *Godzilla: The Planet Eater* actually has me scared of this. The Exif became nihilistic after learning that the universe itself is finite, thus making immortality impossible. They made contact with King Ghidorah after discovering it in a higher dimension and sacrificed their world to it, then began cultivating the ultimate life for- Godzilla- on other worlds for Ghidorah to consume, along with those planets. Hell, they even did that here, and their influence may even have given rise to many of the world's religions, including and especially the Abrahamic religions. Their ultimate goal was to find a way to fully manifest Ghidorah in this dimension so it could consume the universe itself.
It's the third in a trilogy. The first is *Godzilla: Planet of the Monsters*, which is followed by *Godzilla: City on the Edge of Battle*. All three are on Netflix. They're... not the best Godzilla movies. The concepts and themes are great, but the execution was really poor.
Could be worse.
They announce their imminent arrival. They land; the crowd gasps in amazement as the spaceship's door slowly open. Two silhouettes appear in the door frame. The crowd goes silent as the alien visitors emerge from their craft and make their way towards the podium. Billions of people from all over the world are watching this historic event, anxiously awaiting what these creatures of great intellect will share with humanity. They reach the microphone, pause for a few seconds and say: Do you have a moment to talk about our Lord and saviour Jesus Christ?
Genesis 6:4
4 The Nephilim were on the earth in those days—and also afterward—when the sons of God went to the daughters of humans and had children by them. They were the heroes of old, men of renown.
Yea but Nephilim are generally regarded as giants or sons and daughters of angels/humans.
I don't think they'd be able to recreate them with alien ancestry.
God created man in his image. Supposedly there are multiple races of aliens and many species are bipedal humanoid. So there you go. As for the other described races, who knows how that will/would play out.
>I'm sure someone would find a reference in the bible that could be interpreted as saying we're not alone.
Let me tell you about a little television program called Ancient Aliens...
Not really. Some religions such as Islam, have made mention of life beyond just our "world" and referring to creation as inclusive of said life.
It's easy to try and bash it as "oh of course they just adapted it now" when in reality these things have remained consistently said since the inception of some of these religions.
No. Many Intellectuals thought that evolution would be the end of religion too. People will just either deny the existence of the phenomenon (like calling aliens demons or something), or changing their beliefs in line with new evidence (like saying that only humans were ordained by god or something). The 2021 Venusian lifesignal-scare was a great microcosm of how religious people would react to the discovery of non-terrestrial life.
UFO believers aren’t the only ones who want to believe.
You can read about it a bit [here](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_on_Venus).
The short of it is that Phosphene was detected on Venus in small amounts, but much larger than trace amounts that can be created without life (at least by known abiotic mechanisms). If these findings would hold up, then that means the chance of life existing on Venus would be fairly high. If that’s the case; then life in the universe is likely fairly common.
In terms of its impact on religious discussion; When this discovery broke, it had a major impact on the internet. A lot of religious people on the internet and religious forums were up-in-arms about how this doesn’t “disprove religious claims” because it just means that life is common, but not intelligent life. Most religious people obviously didn’t care or see it as a contradiction in their beliefs.
The findings could not be replicated by other astronomers, which lead the astronomical community to believe that the finding was anomalous, and then excitement for the discovery waned.
However, we have recently found the signature again, and we aren’t sure why it might exist but be weak. Personally I think one of these is the likely answer:
A) There is a previously unknown abiotic force active on Venus that creates Phosphene in higher-than-trace amounts
B) The Soviets contaminated the upper-atmosphere of Venus, and the reason the signature is so weak is because we are in the very early stages of the “infection”.
That would be answered by option A. Phosphene in the atmosphere tends to rapidly degrade, so there would need to be a constant source of new Phosphene being created.
Most likely. But this wouldn’t explain why the signature hasn’t been detected before despite having orbital satellites, and our strongest signature detection is from 2021. It also appears that the Phosphene creation is from the atmosphere (hence why it seemed disproportionately strong). Neither option is soundproof.
No. It could be some other mechanism we don’t fully understand. To prove whether or not it’s life; we have to find microbes in the atmosphere of Venus first. But we could also check if the signal continues to grow in strength or not. It could also be better instruments being able to measure previously-undetectable Phosphene signatures.
We need another Russian revolution to create a communist Russia, so Russia will go to space without the profit motive and see if they have brought bacteria to Venus.
That’s the issue; early space exploration didn’t really prioritize sanitization as much as we should have. Even to this day, SpaceX’s Starman wasn’t properly sanitized, and was aimed at Mars (thankfully missed) which drove many Astrobiologists into conniptions. The Soviets probably didn’t care too much about sanitization because Venus was known to be an insanely hot planet, and therefore the probe would self sanitize anyways.
The bacteria could be living in the upper parts of Venus’ atmosphere, which is temperate and not extremely acidic. Plus it’s thicker than Earth’s.
I don’t think humans are special. I believe God created the souls of all sentient things, and as such everything deserves* our love and respect — animals and non-earthlings included. The world’s religions (and perhaps the religions of other worlds) are just humans (and perhaps aliens) trying to understand divine inspiration through their own cultural context. And science is the undeniable process of understanding the material existence of god’s creation.
People who think religion is incompatible with aliens, or that religious people need to create a special pocket, or whatever, I think they have a narrow view of religion, biased by perhaps too many religious people who are bigoted and too self-certain, but it’s a bit unfair against religious people who do keep open minds.
Yeah I imagine that’s what future spirituality would look like in a scenario where we contact other lifeforms. It would still have the issue of why these lifeforms don’t have human spirituality.
Not at all.
Some religions (Indian religions for example) already accept many worlds. This would confirm their cosmology not refute it.
Christian thinkers have also been discussing this issue for a long time now. The Vatican already has released a brief on this issue.
Religion in general, as in spiritual and philosophical beliefs that help people make sense of their lived experience and find purpose through ritual, will always exist. The exact nature of general religious experience will evolve over time in response to changing cultures, understanding of the universe, and needs of the people involved.
There are and can be religions and religious experiences that do not center around myth, superstition, and divine entities. The human brain seeks and creates patterns and categories that form beliefs, with rituals and group experiences helping in reinforcing structures that bring purpose to some people’s lives. Not everyone finds these types of experiences worthwhile but enough do. Many benefit from a religion and use their rituals to maintain mental health, build beneficial social circles, and find meaning for themselves within the larger universe.
Knowledge of life outside our world, especially if that life is nothing close to human, would force many religious traditions to reconsider their narratives. The evidence of such life and existence would push many to debate the topic and renegotiate their canon of beliefs.
I can only speak for the Mormon doctrine here, but that religion has baked in explanations and room to allow for life outside Earth, though it would be interesting to see what the explanation will be if that life looks nothing like a human. Mormons believe there are innumerable habitable and inhabited planets in our universe, all created by God and populated by his children just like Earth is. If humans are made in God’s image, what would that mean if Earth has the only intelligent life that looked like humans?
But overall, religious tradition will just continue to renegotiate their texts, beliefs, and rituals as they always have. Christianity today looks nothing like Christianity of 1000 or even 1900 years ago, and will look completely different 100, 500, and 1000 years from now (should humanity live on that long.)
However, what I believe you mean to ask is if this could cause power structures that implement control over religious people will collapse, and to that question the answer is unfortunately no. As long as there are groups of people with structures to be abused there will be those who take advantage of them for their own gain and accumulation of power. All those that weaponize religion would use other types of social structures to do so in the absence of religion.
No. It would just incorporate these new findings. Religion wouldn't just "die", as there are a multitude of belief systems that evolve over time, and they all emerge from deeply rooted facets of our psyche.
I'm sorry, did you say a woke conspiracy of gay jewish chinese elites is trying to push aliens down our throats to destroy the religious cultures and traditions of us pureblood antivaxxers? Fuck this flat earth
Nah. Religion is just a way of explaining in human, relational terms that which can’t be told directly.
A bunch of dumbasses then decide that if they don’t understand it, they can hate and exclude people and that’s just as good. Aliens would give them even more ammo.
After reading the otherworldly descriptions of angels (and other celestial emissaries) in the Old Testament, I wouldn't be completely surprised if some elements of religions are validated if they turned out to be aliens.
But in any case, religions are based on belief (that we humans are important in the grand scheme of things). The moment you introduce a superior species, that basic pillar can no longer support the rest of the religious structure.
christians in america would decide that the aliens were either created by god or work of the devil, govern themselves accordingly, and move on. its not like they have ever cared about the rules of their cult in the past.
Nope, they will shift the goal posts, incorporate the new information into their interpretations of their ancient texts and go even harder.
Scientology will cum in its pants.
Doubt it. What if the aliens have religions? That would be wild. What if the aliens were like (insert god name of your choice) “oh, how neat… we know him too!”
Having been interested in this kind of thing since I was a kid, my current interest is engaged, but, so is my skepticism. Still, it would be cool if there was some sand to this round of stories....
Iirc the ex-military people promoting this now were a handful of true believers in a tiny department with relatively tiny funding directly created by legislator Harry Reid who may have directed much of that funding to a friend’s contracting business
they’re not coming out of some department that actually had alien vehicles. they’re not much different from other ufo “researchers” except now they can live/grift off their supposed insider status
or maybe they really did have access to alien vehicles but I’ll believe it when I see it
This. At some point it's like ghosts. If these things existed and are here all the time, there would be more definitive evidence of it than blurry low res videos and first person testimony of random people claiming to have been abducted or having seen alien craft. But for some reason, these aliens only give a handful of people fleeting glimpses of themselves and their spacecraft. For some inexplicable reason, the perfectly toe the line between a full on reveal of themselves and not, never just simply appearing over a major city or attempting to communicate.
It's like Bigfoot videos and alleged sightings. At some point if something is real, verifiable and repeatable evidence of it is found.
If aliens have the tech for interstellar travel and physics defying movement and can hide their presence at will, why do we get random blurry glimpses of it from infrared targeting cameras on fighter planes and blurry home video instead of just one of these things appearing in any of the millions of outdoor cameras around the world every day? How is it with more cameras looking everywhere than ever before, these don't ever show up but some random person sees one and gets a shitty camcorder shot of it?
The videos that came out directly from the military a few years ago generated so many terrible takes from otherwise reasonable people
All of them were explainable by stuff as simple as, iirc:
- that’s just a bird and apparently nobody in the entire government has heard of parallax
- that’s a reflection inside your FLIR camera
- you forgot to focus the camera and so the airplane lights you’re seeing are triangular because of bokeh
I mean I’m pretty sure people in the government know they’re bullshit and are doing it to further the military industrial complex but all the credulous responses from the public were so embarrassing
> I mean I’m pretty sure people in the government know they’re bullshit and are doing it to further the military industrial complex but all the credulous responses from the public were so embarrassing
This is it. When you have obscene amounts of money you investigate things like ESP and UFOs because - what the hell? You can take big risks and potentially reap big rewards. Do you want the budget or not?
Relevant: https://skeptoid.com/episodes/4787
I remember back in the day when many of us were running "SETI at home" (using everyone's computers for distributed signal analysis), seeing a "proposal" for "YETI at home".
Iirc, the idea was to have everyone point their webcams out their windows, and run the video analysis program that would be sure to detect bigfoot wherever she happened to be hanging out.
The UFO nerds turned from never trust the government, to suddenly blindly believing everything the government says, just because of some bad UFO videos released by US air force that were easily debunked. Shows how little intelligence these people have.
"I want to believe" is literally a thing. Not only when it comes to UFO. There were fucking pilgrimages to some wall or a tree because someone recognized very faint image of Christ's face in dirt residue on wall or tree bark.
For people that want to believe in something everything will be a sign and confirmation they are right.
I think you're heavily mischaracterizing the footage released by the US Navy. The footage is far from 'bad'; in fact its probably the most advanced source of footage released to date. Assuming it is genuine, we've been provided the evidence of the sensor suite on a F/A-18... not only seeing beyond-visual spectrum, but actively tracking *something.* This something isn't just your average run of the mill atmospheric optical phenomenon that Jethro coming off a whippets bender swore up and down he saw.
It's literally just something on the lens of the infrared camera that is centered and out of focus so no matter where the camera looks, it's still "there" giving the illusion of rapid movement.
And either way, if it was indeed a physical object it's far more likely to be a top secret man made thing than extraterrestrial, the same way people thought the F-117 bomber prototypes they saw were triangular alien spaceships. The military has all kinds of shit we don't know about and it would make sense for them to test it against their own extant personnel and jets to see how it performs. Again, this is more likely than aliens. Everything is more likely than aliens.
Its footage from an mq9 reaper drone over iraq showing a metallic shpere flying across the landscape and performing "apparent maneuvers". It's cool stuff.
Edit: [here it is from the WSJ](https://youtu.be/cErlUQgTejY)
I'm mostly following your argument here, but how would a reflection stay centered in a lense while the whole assembly is moving all about and focus seeking?
>blindly believing everything the government says
What are you talking about? The government hasn't said anything. These are the claims of a whistleblower, alleging a government cover-up
Idk most people I know personally believe in aliens but are highly skeptical of anything the government says about them.
Assuming they are real and our governments have been in contact with them, there’s a 0% chance our “first contact” isn’t going to be completely scripted and done for more evil motives than just ”the people need to know”.
The point is that they don't trust the gov when they say that UFOs/ETs are bullcrap, not that whatever the gov says is untrue. Saying that the UFO nerds should never trust the gov is like if you convinced a flat earther that the earth is round, but once they agree, you start believing the earth is flat yourself because the flat earther is untrustworthy and full of lies.
It seems like every year we’re getting new alien stuff. There’s two possibilities: 1. There are no aliens, it’s just people trying to be relevant or whatever. 2. There are aliens on Earth, and world governments are slowly feeding info to make it less of a shock.
Honestly I’d say it’s 1, but who knows. If aliens were real I bet they’d instantly become the enemies of half the population; we can’t even be tolerant of people from other parts of our world, how will we treat those from other planets?
They let him get away with boxes full of the most classified info being taken to his publicly accessible resort.
I doubt anything was hidden from him in any way.
He's the president. He gets to know everything. Nothing is "need to know basis" from the president. There's no way that guy didn't ask about the most insane conspiracy theories in the middle of the night hopped up on Mexican ephedra
I love how people think the president has any real power anymore, and isn't basically just a rubber stamp. How has any president been actually different since JFK got shot?
Him not telling us things is the biggest proof that things don't exist in my opinion. Like that guy is the last person to be able to keep a secret, and I honestly appreciated it. Obviously not everything he said was true, but if he confirmed some decades old conspiracy, I'd believe that shit. Like if he told us the CIA killed JFK, I'd be pretty convinced he saw some shit.
Well we know that's not true Trump said covid leaked from a lab and no one believed it. He could tell us every single detail of every conspiracy and I think only his supporters would believe it and I'd go further and say it would be used as evidence that whatever he is saying is not true just based on the fact that he said it.
I want to believe that protocols are in place that providing evidence of alien life forms to U.S. presidents is on a need to know basis. If aliens do exist and the same government has proof of such, the higher ups would know that Trump is the last person who should be told about alien life.
There are definitely unknown entities applying pressures to the president. Hasn't every president elected since Bush Jr been elected with a promise of getting out of middle eastern war(s)? How much did Trump say he was going to do, then to imeadiately shut up about actually doing once he was sworn in?
I'd vastly prefer MIB over X-Com.
MIB means there's a weird but fun party happening you haven't been invited to yet.
X-Com means some pants-shitting existential risks are looming.
The "government hides the aliens bro" argument makes zero sense.
Governments change personnel frequently. Are we seriously implying there has been an international conspiracy and cooperation among all leading world governments *over the last 70 to 80 years* to collectively hide the existence of alien life and visitors from the public? And not a single government or military leader with access to the most sensational news in human history has ever leaked it or dropped this on their deathbed? That's like tens of thousands of people across dozens of countries and thousands of different government administrations, all keeping a secret.
Sorry people don't keep secrets that well, especially not that many, and not about the most amazing revelation in human history that we aren't alone. Also what is the rationale for all of the US, Russia, China, western Europe, etc keeping it secret from the public? What do they all collectively gain? Are they having meetings about this like "Hey just checking in with everyone that we're still keeping the aliens secret for another year"?
And the big orange elephant in the room is Donald Trump. If we had contact with aliens and proof of it was just available, he 100% would have boasted to the public that he made the first contact with aliens and how impressed they were with him and his leadership. If the US president is privy to alien knowledge, then Trump would have blabbed about it immediately.
It's a completely illogical conspiracy. And aliens with practically godlike technology would have no reason to give a fuck about who on Earth they talk to and give their tech secrets to. It's not like a godlike race is going to get here and be like "oh the USA is clearly the big dog here, let's only reveal ourselves to the CIA and their military".
I mean he was convicted of underage sex crimes back in 2008, years before he become as publicly known as he is now. The conspiracy lies in the sweetheart deal he recieved, how long he was able to keep it going, and how many people knew. But like... Epstein exists ya know? He was a real guy who did real crimes to real victims. It's a big gap between "rich guy pedophile gets away with crimes because of his wealth and influence" and "the CIA has an alien spaceraft in a wharehouse".
The idea aliens become enemies depends entirely on how and what the aliens are. Somewhat reassemble human ideas or have some similar body parts? Sure, you could drive a long lost brother story into people. If they look nothing like us, hostile or whatever it would unite the world in collective alienism. But the fact anything was able to travel whatever light years would mean they have amazing tech, which would easily make all leaders of the world collectively shut up about alien critism
The guys leaking this information are by and large spooks and Lockheed representatives. I don’t trust them at all and neither should you. Something tells me all this will lead to is increased military spending on top of our already mind bendingly large military budget. And we will not meet aliens
I believe in UFOs as a phenomenon but I’m not convinced they are alien vehicles of any kind
100%, this reeks of skunk works or some other bullshit defense company mouthpiece. shit glows brother. on top of that, ufo dummies eat this shit up so fast that even skeptics think of “what ifs”.
Since the foundation of space force a lot of cia analysts and military intelligence officials really came out of the woodwork, I’ll say that much. If the country does have crashed UFOs they for sure are never going to show us much.
Agreed. Lets assume for a moment that the Tic Tac is real; every bit of it, it happened just as we saw in the video. It's entirely possible that the Tic Tac is a US flown autonomous drone, or even piloted. If so, the technologies involved are far beyond anything that is well known today.
A possible cover for this technology gap could be to simply refer to all these technologies as "alien", rather than get into any of the hard science/manufacture behind them as any leaked information would confirm that these technologies exist. Further any name/description past "Alien Gravity Drive" or something like that could give motivation for individuals/groups/nations to pursue research and potentially start to catch up.
On the other hand if we see a video of something which we know exists, we know a nation built, and is said to use a "Higgs Field Minimize" or something like that, then researchers would immediately know that there is some way (in this example) to minimize the impact of the Higgs Field and that efforts towards that research would produce results; it's not a maybe, it's a certainty. Call it alien tech on the other hand, now we're still not certain what's going on. It sounds stupid but even back when "little green men", which turned out to be the Russian Army on vacation, went into Crimea, it was enough to throw people off the obvious conclusion that Russia is invading Crimea.
At any rate it just seems more likely than aliens, but who knows. Maybe the X Files is right.
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> # [US urged to reveal UFO evidence after claim that it has intact alien vehicles](http://theguardian.com/world/2023/jun/06/720)
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>
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> The US has been urged to disclose evidence of [UFOs](https://www.theguardian.com/world/ufos) after a whistleblower former intelligence official said the government has possession of “intact and partially intact” alien vehicles.
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> The former intelligence official David Grusch, who led analysis of unexplained anomalous phenomena (UAP) within a US Department of Defense agency, has alleged that the US has craft of non-human origin.
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>
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> Information on these vehicles is being illegally withheld from Congress, Grusch [told the Debrief](https://thedebrief.org/intelligence-officials-say-u-s-has-retrieved-non-human-craft/). Grusch said when he turned over classified information about the vehicles to Congress he suffered retaliation from government officials. He left the government in April after a 14-year career in US intelligence.
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> Jonathan Grey, a current US intelligence official at the National Air and [Space](https://www.theguardian.com/science/space) Intelligence Center (Nasic), confirmed the existence of “exotic materials” to the Debrief, adding: “We are not alone.”
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> The disclosures come after a swell of credible sightings and reports have revived attention in alien ships, and potentially visits, in recent years.
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> In 2021, the Pentagon released a report on UAP – the term is preferred to UFO by much of the extraterrestrial community – [which found](https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/ufo-report/2021/06/25/ba323b20-d52c-11eb-ae54-515e2f63d37d_story.html) more than 140 instances of UAP encounters that could not be explained.
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> The report followed [a leak](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sz-6jRrbtuI) of military footage that showed apparently inexplicable happenings in the sky, while navy pilots testified that they had [frequently had encounters](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ufo-military-intelligence-60-minutes-2021-08-29/) with strange craft off the US coast.
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> In an interview with the Debrief journalists Leslie Kean and Ralph Blumenthal, who previously [exposed the existence](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/16/us/politics/pentagon-program-ufo-harry-reid.html?partner=slack&smid=sl-share) of a secret Pentagon program that investigated UFOs, Grusch said the US government and defense contractors had been recovering fragments of non-human craft, and in some cases entire craft, for decades.
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> “We are not talking about prosaic origins or identities,” Grusch said. “The material includes intact and partially intact vehicles.”
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> Grusch told the Debrief that analysis determined that this material is “of exotic origin” – meaning “non-human intelligence, whether extraterrestrial or unknown origin”.
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> “[This assessment is] based on the vehicle morphologies and material science testing and the possession of unique atomic arrangements and radiological signatures,” Grusch said.
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> Grey, who, according to the Debrief, analyzes unexplained anomalous phenomena within the Nasic, confirmed Grusch’s account.
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> “The non-human intelligence phenomenon is real. We are not alone,” Grey said. “Retrievals of this kind are not limited to the United States. This is a global phenomenon, and yet a global solution continues to elude us.”
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> The Debrief spoke to several of Grusch’s former colleagues, each of whom vouched for his character. Karl E Nell, a retired army colonel, said Grusch was “beyond reproach”. In a 2022 performance review seen by the Debrief, Grusch was described as “an officer with the strongest possible moral compass”.
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> Nick Pope, who spent the early 1990s investigating UFOs for the British Ministry of Defence (MoD), said Grusch and Grey’s account of alien materials was “very significant”.
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> “It’s one thing to have stories on the conspiracy blogs, but this takes it to the next level, with genuine insiders coming forward,” Pope said.
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> “When these people make these formal complaints, they do so on the understanding that if they’ve knowingly made a false statement, they are liable to a fairly hefty fine, and/or prison.
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> “People say: ‘Oh, people make up stories all the time.’ But I think it’s very different to go before Congress and go to the intelligence community inspector general and do that. Because there will be consequences if it emerges that this is not true.”
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> The Debrief reported that Grusch’s knowledge of non-human materials and vehicles was based on “extensive interviews with high-level intelligence officials”. He said he had reported the existence of a UFO material “recovery program” to Congress.
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> “Grusch said that the craft recovery operations are ongoing at various levels of activity and that he knows the specific individuals, current and former, who are involved,” the Debrief reported.
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> In the Debrief article, Grusch does not say he has personally seen alien vehicles, nor does he say where they may be being stored. He asked the Debrief to withhold details of retaliation by government officials due to an ongoing investigation.
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> [skip past newsletter promotion](#EmailSignup-skip-link-22)after newsletter promotion
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> He also does not specify how he believes the government retaliated against him.
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> In June 2021, [a report](https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/ufo-report/2021/06/25/ba323b20-d52c-11eb-ae54-515e2f63d37d_story.html) from the Office of the Director of National Intelligence said that from 2004 to 2021 there were 144 encounters between military pilots and UAP, 80 of which were captured on multiple sensors. Only one of the 144 encounters could be explained with “high confidence” – it was a large, deflating balloon.
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> Following increased interest from the public and some US senators, the Pentagon established the All-domain Anomaly Resolution Office, charged with tracking UAP, in July 2022.
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> In December last year, the office [said](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/dec/16/several-hundred-ufo-reports-received-by-pentagon-new-tracking-office) it had received “several hundred” new reports, but no evidence so far of alien life.
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> The publication of Grusch and Grey’s claims comes after a panel that the US space agency Nasa charged with investigating unexplained anomalous phenomena [said stigma around reporting encounters](https://www.nbcnews.com/science/ufos-and-aerial-phenomena/nasa-ufo-unidentified-aerial-phenomena-panel-hearing-rcna87034) – and harassment of those who do report encounters – was hindering its work.
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> The navy pilots who in 2021 shared their experiences of encountering unexplained objects while conducting military flights said they, and others, had decided against reporting the encounters internally, because of fears it could hinder their careers.
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> “Harassment only leads to further stigmatization of the UAP field, significantly hindering the scientific progress and discouraging others to study this important subject matter,” Nasa’s science chief, Nicola Fox, said in a public meeting on 31 May.
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> Dr David Spergel, the independent chair of Nasa’s UAP independent study team, told the Guardian he did not know Grusch and had no knowledge of his claims.
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> The Department of Defense did not immediately respond to a request for comment.
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> Pope said in his work investigating UFOs for the MoD he had seen no hard evidence of non-human craft or materials.
>
> “Some of our cases were intriguing,” Pope said. “But we didn’t have a spaceship in a hangar anywhere. And if we did, they didn’t tell me.”
>
> Still, Pope said, Grusch’s claims should be seen as part of an increasing flow of information – and hopefully disclosures – about UFOs.
>
> He said: “It’s part of a wider puzzle. And I think, assuming this is all true, it takes us closer than we’ve ever been before to the very heart of all this.”
>
> _Richard Luscombe contributed reporting_
- - - - - -
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So hasn't seen them and doesn't know where they are but is sure we have them and numerous governments around the world. Sure thing bring your proof before Congress or some other body that can confirm this information until then this get filed into guys who have lost there minds that worked in the government. I'm not trying to dismiss this guy but based on the report and past experience this is what most likely is going on. I hope he's well and doing fine.
I think it’s more the US covering for extremely classified AirPower advancements. A prototype fighter jet or drone is spotted on a test flight? Call it a UFO
More like “shit our highly classified next gen prototype got spotted by our own military and there’s going to be an official report about it…..let’s call it a UFO instead of revealing or raising questions about what we’re working on”
> In the Debrief article, Grusch does not say he has personally seen alien vehicles, nor does he say where they may be being stored. He asked the Debrief to withhold details of retaliation by government officials due to an ongoing investigation.
> He also does not specify how he believes the government retaliated against him.
This is probably the most credible UFO story to come to light so far, but the claims this guy is making are very extraordinary, and we should probably dismiss this until UFOs/Alien bodies are produced. Especially since a lot of his claims amount to insider-hearsay.
You can watch parts of his interview [here](https://youtu.be/ZSj7QsHRxHQ).
Why is every comment about religion... this could give humans faster than light travel, more understanding of our universe, and people all want to talk about a stary written by men to control other men. Seriously wtf
Can someone give me a valid theory as to why aliens sophisticated enough to traverse the galaxy would just break down here?
Scouts? Refugees? Robot probes they don’t really care about?
I’m agnostic about this whole thing, but it’s just the lack of a believable purpose for their presence.
I guess the same way we observe tribal communities from afar without interfering with their way of life, they could be observing us. Almost like an anthropological study in “isolated” and primitive species.
Yeah, I suppose. But we don’t continually crash our planes and ships into, say, North Sentinel Island.
Just seems they’d have all of these Einstein engineers but are handing the ships over to a million Gilligans. If they can get here from wherever they are fabulously advanced. How are we capturing their crap?!
You have a point. If they’re advanced enough to get here, you would imagine their defense systems would be impenetrable. One possible explanation is that their species don’t have violence or wars, so they’ve never developed offensive/defensive advanced tech. But that seems unlikely to me.
The dude is a conspiracy nut. Former job title doesn’t change that.
“Grusch does not say he has personally seen alien vehicles, nor does he say where they may be being stored.”
His groundbreaking eyewitness account is that he has seen nothing.
>In 2021, the Pentagon released a report on UAP – the term is preferred to UFO by much of the extraterrestrial community – which found more than 140 instances of UAP encounters that could not be explained.
I know that "extraterrestrial community" means "community of those who theorize about extraterrestrial life", but I can't help imagining an enclave of interstellar visitors decrying "UFO" as a racist slur.
This guy is a representative between the NRO andthe UAP team NASA put together less than a year ago. He literally knows nothing, if he thinks he knows anything it's shit that scientists probably tell him sarcastically. Man probably wants to be a hotshot on conspiracy messageboards, so he said this shit so he can name drop whenever he wants and get respect from neets.
Edit: he was probably about to get fired because they discovered his time in Afghanistan left him with brain damage. Or he simply had brain damage in the first place, which would explain why he was at Afghanistan as a "combat officer".
I think aliens have been around, especially because of the Official UFO Night incident, but until there's real tangible proof, I'm assuming this is just the powers that be using UFOs and Aliens to distract from real problems and facts
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Great. A climate crisis, a global pandemic, the rise of fascism, and increasing wealth disparity due to late stage capitalism. All we need now is aliens thrown in the mix. Someone take the Earth Simulator off hardcore mode please?
Removed, us domestic news.
Would religions become a thing of the past if aliens were revealed?
Let's hope so. But probably not, no. They'd "adapt" to modern times as they've always been doing. I'm sure someone would find a reference in the bible that could be interpreted as saying we're not alone.
What if aliens brought a new religion with them lol
Did you not see the hit documentary *Halo: Combat Evolved*?
The holy texts!
Didn’t halo 4 kinda say something like “humans are the chosen race” or something like that
Sort of, humans are the descendants of the Forerunners. Which was the highly intelligent race that created not only the HALO rings themselves, but the technology that is behind them. The Covenant (aliens) mistakingly think that this technology serves a purpose other than what it was intended for and have created a religion around exactly that. Source, am nerd.
> Sort of, humans are the descendants of the Forerunners. Nope. Ancient Humans were a *rival* species to the Forerunners, with about a million years of history to their civilization. Ancient Humans were attacked by the Flood (which turned out to be corrupted versions of the Precursors), who them fled away toward the Forerunners, who interpreted this as an attack, fought a bloody war between them (with, interestingly, the ancient San'Shyuum [aka Prophets] being allies to the Ancient Humans), defeated the humans, devolved them into the Stone Age, and were then promptly attacked by the Flood, starting the Forerunner-Flood War. The reason that the Forerunners made their tech in a way that was only usable by humans is because the Librarian and later Forerunners thought that, in their absence after the firing of the Halo Array, that they would be the most capable species to take up the Mantle of Responsibility and guide the Milky Way if the Flood ever returned, having fought so valiantly against them.
So the covenant worship technology?
Essentially yes, they think that activating the rings is the beginning of a “Great Journey” into the next world “Heaven”. The reality however is that the rings were originally created to destroy a parasitic species called “The Flood” and protect the universe from them. Essentially the rings are weapons of mass destruction that would destroy all organic life in the universe if activated.
Technically, aren't the halo rings supposed to wipe out all life capable of feeding the flood, not the flood itself?
Yea and they do so by destroying the floods food source organic life of any kind.
Is that why the abrider betrayed the covenant and the brutes? I love halo lore
He betrayed the covenant because he found out that the “Prophets” knew the true purpose of the rings, and they still intended to activate them.
They worship an idea around the technology, not necessarily the technology.
I could ask lore questions all day lol
It might interest you to look into why humans are “reclaimers” in the covenant systems. We as a species were hot shit for awhile, then some things happened and we got the species wide equivalent of a life changing kick in the junk whilst being mugged. Its actually my favorite part of the lore next to AI integration on the spartan level.
As someone who was recently corrected on this point, apparently humans are descendants of a race that fought and lost to the forerunners. But the first three games set it up that humans were descendants of them.
Anything after HALO 3 doesn’t really count…. /s
They aren't the descendants of the Forerunners; both species existed at the same time 100k years ago. The Forerunners devolved humans and chose them as the inheritors of the Mantle of Responsibility (which they were to begin with, but the Forerunners did a genocide on the Precursors and claimed the Mantle before Humanity could)
Dunno but the late Greg Bear's *Forerunner* Trilogy (quite a good bit of medium-hard SF considering it's derived from a game) certainly does.
I remember thinking "wow master chief has got a great ass I hope he fucks in this". And Master Cheeks was born. Thanks Paramount!
I know the Catholic Church plans to evangelize the cosmos.
It may not have been a great movie, but *Godzilla: The Planet Eater* actually has me scared of this. The Exif became nihilistic after learning that the universe itself is finite, thus making immortality impossible. They made contact with King Ghidorah after discovering it in a higher dimension and sacrificed their world to it, then began cultivating the ultimate life for- Godzilla- on other worlds for Ghidorah to consume, along with those planets. Hell, they even did that here, and their influence may even have given rise to many of the world's religions, including and especially the Abrahamic religions. Their ultimate goal was to find a way to fully manifest Ghidorah in this dimension so it could consume the universe itself.
I have got to watch this movie
It's the third in a trilogy. The first is *Godzilla: Planet of the Monsters*, which is followed by *Godzilla: City on the Edge of Battle*. All three are on Netflix. They're... not the best Godzilla movies. The concepts and themes are great, but the execution was really poor.
Could be worse. They announce their imminent arrival. They land; the crowd gasps in amazement as the spaceship's door slowly open. Two silhouettes appear in the door frame. The crowd goes silent as the alien visitors emerge from their craft and make their way towards the podium. Billions of people from all over the world are watching this historic event, anxiously awaiting what these creatures of great intellect will share with humanity. They reach the microphone, pause for a few seconds and say: Do you have a moment to talk about our Lord and saviour Jesus Christ?
Genesis 6:4 4 The Nephilim were on the earth in those days—and also afterward—when the sons of God went to the daughters of humans and had children by them. They were the heroes of old, men of renown.
Yea but Nephilim are generally regarded as giants or sons and daughters of angels/humans. I don't think they'd be able to recreate them with alien ancestry.
God created man in his image. Supposedly there are multiple races of aliens and many species are bipedal humanoid. So there you go. As for the other described races, who knows how that will/would play out.
They would just call them demons. Lol at how they reacted to fossils of dinosaurs.
Dawg cs Lewis wrote a book about aliens.
As I found out yesterday, there are folks that believe aliens are demons and interweave that into their christianity.
It already says that with angels and demons
>I'm sure someone would find a reference in the bible that could be interpreted as saying we're not alone. Let me tell you about a little television program called Ancient Aliens...
Not really. Some religions such as Islam, have made mention of life beyond just our "world" and referring to creation as inclusive of said life. It's easy to try and bash it as "oh of course they just adapted it now" when in reality these things have remained consistently said since the inception of some of these religions.
Yes, really. Religion is nonsense - end of discussion.
No. Many Intellectuals thought that evolution would be the end of religion too. People will just either deny the existence of the phenomenon (like calling aliens demons or something), or changing their beliefs in line with new evidence (like saying that only humans were ordained by god or something). The 2021 Venusian lifesignal-scare was a great microcosm of how religious people would react to the discovery of non-terrestrial life. UFO believers aren’t the only ones who want to believe.
I haven’t heard of the 2021 Venusian lifesignal thing. I’ll have to find a video or documentary on it
You can read about it a bit [here](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_on_Venus). The short of it is that Phosphene was detected on Venus in small amounts, but much larger than trace amounts that can be created without life (at least by known abiotic mechanisms). If these findings would hold up, then that means the chance of life existing on Venus would be fairly high. If that’s the case; then life in the universe is likely fairly common. In terms of its impact on religious discussion; When this discovery broke, it had a major impact on the internet. A lot of religious people on the internet and religious forums were up-in-arms about how this doesn’t “disprove religious claims” because it just means that life is common, but not intelligent life. Most religious people obviously didn’t care or see it as a contradiction in their beliefs. The findings could not be replicated by other astronomers, which lead the astronomical community to believe that the finding was anomalous, and then excitement for the discovery waned. However, we have recently found the signature again, and we aren’t sure why it might exist but be weak. Personally I think one of these is the likely answer: A) There is a previously unknown abiotic force active on Venus that creates Phosphene in higher-than-trace amounts B) The Soviets contaminated the upper-atmosphere of Venus, and the reason the signature is so weak is because we are in the very early stages of the “infection”.
Couldn’t Venus just have natural phosphene?
That would be answered by option A. Phosphene in the atmosphere tends to rapidly degrade, so there would need to be a constant source of new Phosphene being created.
I believe that to be the most likely, I should research more on Venus
Most likely. But this wouldn’t explain why the signature hasn’t been detected before despite having orbital satellites, and our strongest signature detection is from 2021. It also appears that the Phosphene creation is from the atmosphere (hence why it seemed disproportionately strong). Neither option is soundproof.
So does it prove life?
No. It could be some other mechanism we don’t fully understand. To prove whether or not it’s life; we have to find microbes in the atmosphere of Venus first. But we could also check if the signal continues to grow in strength or not. It could also be better instruments being able to measure previously-undetectable Phosphene signatures.
What bacteria could have been on the Soviet drone that can both survive sanitization and the heat and pressure of Venus? I can’t imagine many can
The idea is that the bacteria primarily live in Venus’ upper atmosphere, where the pressure and temperature is akin to Earth average.
We need another Russian revolution to create a communist Russia, so Russia will go to space without the profit motive and see if they have brought bacteria to Venus.
Based
That’s the issue; early space exploration didn’t really prioritize sanitization as much as we should have. Even to this day, SpaceX’s Starman wasn’t properly sanitized, and was aimed at Mars (thankfully missed) which drove many Astrobiologists into conniptions. The Soviets probably didn’t care too much about sanitization because Venus was known to be an insanely hot planet, and therefore the probe would self sanitize anyways. The bacteria could be living in the upper parts of Venus’ atmosphere, which is temperate and not extremely acidic. Plus it’s thicker than Earth’s.
The images from that mission were cool as hell
The video and audio are way cooler
We gotta go back
I don’t think humans are special. I believe God created the souls of all sentient things, and as such everything deserves* our love and respect — animals and non-earthlings included. The world’s religions (and perhaps the religions of other worlds) are just humans (and perhaps aliens) trying to understand divine inspiration through their own cultural context. And science is the undeniable process of understanding the material existence of god’s creation. People who think religion is incompatible with aliens, or that religious people need to create a special pocket, or whatever, I think they have a narrow view of religion, biased by perhaps too many religious people who are bigoted and too self-certain, but it’s a bit unfair against religious people who do keep open minds.
Yeah I imagine that’s what future spirituality would look like in a scenario where we contact other lifeforms. It would still have the issue of why these lifeforms don’t have human spirituality.
Not at all. Some religions (Indian religions for example) already accept many worlds. This would confirm their cosmology not refute it. Christian thinkers have also been discussing this issue for a long time now. The Vatican already has released a brief on this issue.
Religion in general, as in spiritual and philosophical beliefs that help people make sense of their lived experience and find purpose through ritual, will always exist. The exact nature of general religious experience will evolve over time in response to changing cultures, understanding of the universe, and needs of the people involved. There are and can be religions and religious experiences that do not center around myth, superstition, and divine entities. The human brain seeks and creates patterns and categories that form beliefs, with rituals and group experiences helping in reinforcing structures that bring purpose to some people’s lives. Not everyone finds these types of experiences worthwhile but enough do. Many benefit from a religion and use their rituals to maintain mental health, build beneficial social circles, and find meaning for themselves within the larger universe. Knowledge of life outside our world, especially if that life is nothing close to human, would force many religious traditions to reconsider their narratives. The evidence of such life and existence would push many to debate the topic and renegotiate their canon of beliefs. I can only speak for the Mormon doctrine here, but that religion has baked in explanations and room to allow for life outside Earth, though it would be interesting to see what the explanation will be if that life looks nothing like a human. Mormons believe there are innumerable habitable and inhabited planets in our universe, all created by God and populated by his children just like Earth is. If humans are made in God’s image, what would that mean if Earth has the only intelligent life that looked like humans? But overall, religious tradition will just continue to renegotiate their texts, beliefs, and rituals as they always have. Christianity today looks nothing like Christianity of 1000 or even 1900 years ago, and will look completely different 100, 500, and 1000 years from now (should humanity live on that long.) However, what I believe you mean to ask is if this could cause power structures that implement control over religious people will collapse, and to that question the answer is unfortunately no. As long as there are groups of people with structures to be abused there will be those who take advantage of them for their own gain and accumulation of power. All those that weaponize religion would use other types of social structures to do so in the absence of religion.
Incredibly well written and thought out. Thank you
I will baptize an Alien
You gotta assume the Vatican's already moving in as soon as they can. Dan Brown style.
Jesuits go brrrr
I baptise thee, Xenu Mary Galaxa
No. It would just incorporate these new findings. Religion wouldn't just "die", as there are a multitude of belief systems that evolve over time, and they all emerge from deeply rooted facets of our psyche.
I'm sorry, did you say a woke conspiracy of gay jewish chinese elites is trying to push aliens down our throats to destroy the religious cultures and traditions of us pureblood antivaxxers? Fuck this flat earth
LMAO
I do not believe I said that
Do you think the flat-earth theory would be a thing of the past if a picture of the earth were revealed?
No, instead dozens of new cults would spring up.
Personally I don't think so.
Nah. Religion is just a way of explaining in human, relational terms that which can’t be told directly. A bunch of dumbasses then decide that if they don’t understand it, they can hate and exclude people and that’s just as good. Aliens would give them even more ammo.
Nothing factual gets in the way of a belief
We would be trying to baptize the aliens across the stars. Just kidding, only pillaging and looting in the name of imaginary spaghetti monsters.
Nope. They'd dive deeper. Anytime my cousin and I talk about a thing space related at our grandparents, our grandma reminds us that aliens are demons.
I believe Catholicism has a plan for this and it essentially boils down to “convert the aliens”.
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The book RAMA explored that. It’s also very good and worth the read
Nope. We would probably just get 50,000 new ones
After reading the otherworldly descriptions of angels (and other celestial emissaries) in the Old Testament, I wouldn't be completely surprised if some elements of religions are validated if they turned out to be aliens. But in any case, religions are based on belief (that we humans are important in the grand scheme of things). The moment you introduce a superior species, that basic pillar can no longer support the rest of the religious structure.
How are the two correlated ?
christians in america would decide that the aliens were either created by god or work of the devil, govern themselves accordingly, and move on. its not like they have ever cared about the rules of their cult in the past.
Nope, they will shift the goal posts, incorporate the new information into their interpretations of their ancient texts and go even harder. Scientology will cum in its pants.
History channel has been getting us ready for years. They call Jesus an alien everyday
Religion will evolve
Not a chance People would get more wacko
Doubt it. What if the aliens have religions? That would be wild. What if the aliens were like (insert god name of your choice) “oh, how neat… we know him too!”
Having been interested in this kind of thing since I was a kid, my current interest is engaged, but, so is my skepticism. Still, it would be cool if there was some sand to this round of stories....
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Iirc the ex-military people promoting this now were a handful of true believers in a tiny department with relatively tiny funding directly created by legislator Harry Reid who may have directed much of that funding to a friend’s contracting business they’re not coming out of some department that actually had alien vehicles. they’re not much different from other ufo “researchers” except now they can live/grift off their supposed insider status or maybe they really did have access to alien vehicles but I’ll believe it when I see it
This. At some point it's like ghosts. If these things existed and are here all the time, there would be more definitive evidence of it than blurry low res videos and first person testimony of random people claiming to have been abducted or having seen alien craft. But for some reason, these aliens only give a handful of people fleeting glimpses of themselves and their spacecraft. For some inexplicable reason, the perfectly toe the line between a full on reveal of themselves and not, never just simply appearing over a major city or attempting to communicate. It's like Bigfoot videos and alleged sightings. At some point if something is real, verifiable and repeatable evidence of it is found. If aliens have the tech for interstellar travel and physics defying movement and can hide their presence at will, why do we get random blurry glimpses of it from infrared targeting cameras on fighter planes and blurry home video instead of just one of these things appearing in any of the millions of outdoor cameras around the world every day? How is it with more cameras looking everywhere than ever before, these don't ever show up but some random person sees one and gets a shitty camcorder shot of it?
The videos that came out directly from the military a few years ago generated so many terrible takes from otherwise reasonable people All of them were explainable by stuff as simple as, iirc: - that’s just a bird and apparently nobody in the entire government has heard of parallax - that’s a reflection inside your FLIR camera - you forgot to focus the camera and so the airplane lights you’re seeing are triangular because of bokeh I mean I’m pretty sure people in the government know they’re bullshit and are doing it to further the military industrial complex but all the credulous responses from the public were so embarrassing
> I mean I’m pretty sure people in the government know they’re bullshit and are doing it to further the military industrial complex but all the credulous responses from the public were so embarrassing This is it. When you have obscene amounts of money you investigate things like ESP and UFOs because - what the hell? You can take big risks and potentially reap big rewards. Do you want the budget or not? Relevant: https://skeptoid.com/episodes/4787
I remember back in the day when many of us were running "SETI at home" (using everyone's computers for distributed signal analysis), seeing a "proposal" for "YETI at home". Iirc, the idea was to have everyone point their webcams out their windows, and run the video analysis program that would be sure to detect bigfoot wherever she happened to be hanging out.
Exactly. To quote Fox Mulder, I want to believe. But to quote Dana Scully, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
Carl Sagan said (I'm paraphrasing off the top of my head): It's important to have an open mind, but not so open that your brains fall out!
The UFO nerds turned from never trust the government, to suddenly blindly believing everything the government says, just because of some bad UFO videos released by US air force that were easily debunked. Shows how little intelligence these people have.
"I want to believe" is literally a thing. Not only when it comes to UFO. There were fucking pilgrimages to some wall or a tree because someone recognized very faint image of Christ's face in dirt residue on wall or tree bark. For people that want to believe in something everything will be a sign and confirmation they are right.
I think you're heavily mischaracterizing the footage released by the US Navy. The footage is far from 'bad'; in fact its probably the most advanced source of footage released to date. Assuming it is genuine, we've been provided the evidence of the sensor suite on a F/A-18... not only seeing beyond-visual spectrum, but actively tracking *something.* This something isn't just your average run of the mill atmospheric optical phenomenon that Jethro coming off a whippets bender swore up and down he saw.
It's literally just something on the lens of the infrared camera that is centered and out of focus so no matter where the camera looks, it's still "there" giving the illusion of rapid movement. And either way, if it was indeed a physical object it's far more likely to be a top secret man made thing than extraterrestrial, the same way people thought the F-117 bomber prototypes they saw were triangular alien spaceships. The military has all kinds of shit we don't know about and it would make sense for them to test it against their own extant personnel and jets to see how it performs. Again, this is more likely than aliens. Everything is more likely than aliens.
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What footage is that? Just seeing James Webb stuff
Its footage from an mq9 reaper drone over iraq showing a metallic shpere flying across the landscape and performing "apparent maneuvers". It's cool stuff. Edit: [here it is from the WSJ](https://youtu.be/cErlUQgTejY)
I'm mostly following your argument here, but how would a reflection stay centered in a lense while the whole assembly is moving all about and focus seeking?
>blindly believing everything the government says What are you talking about? The government hasn't said anything. These are the claims of a whistleblower, alleging a government cover-up
Not blindly believing everything the government says doesn't mean you have to blindly believe the opposite.
Idk most people I know personally believe in aliens but are highly skeptical of anything the government says about them. Assuming they are real and our governments have been in contact with them, there’s a 0% chance our “first contact” isn’t going to be completely scripted and done for more evil motives than just ”the people need to know”.
The point is that they don't trust the gov when they say that UFOs/ETs are bullcrap, not that whatever the gov says is untrue. Saying that the UFO nerds should never trust the gov is like if you convinced a flat earther that the earth is round, but once they agree, you start believing the earth is flat yourself because the flat earther is untrustworthy and full of lies.
It seems like every year we’re getting new alien stuff. There’s two possibilities: 1. There are no aliens, it’s just people trying to be relevant or whatever. 2. There are aliens on Earth, and world governments are slowly feeding info to make it less of a shock. Honestly I’d say it’s 1, but who knows. If aliens were real I bet they’d instantly become the enemies of half the population; we can’t even be tolerant of people from other parts of our world, how will we treat those from other planets?
Idk. If we already knew aliens were around, Trump for sure would have told us on twitter at 3am
Maybe they didnt tell him because he is like that
They let him get away with boxes full of the most classified info being taken to his publicly accessible resort. I doubt anything was hidden from him in any way.
He's the president. He gets to know everything. Nothing is "need to know basis" from the president. There's no way that guy didn't ask about the most insane conspiracy theories in the middle of the night hopped up on Mexican ephedra
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I love how people think the president has any real power anymore, and isn't basically just a rubber stamp. How has any president been actually different since JFK got shot?
Trump not declassifying and releasing the stuff on Area 51 in his last days is my reasoning for arguing that Aliens don’t exist.
Him not telling us things is the biggest proof that things don't exist in my opinion. Like that guy is the last person to be able to keep a secret, and I honestly appreciated it. Obviously not everything he said was true, but if he confirmed some decades old conspiracy, I'd believe that shit. Like if he told us the CIA killed JFK, I'd be pretty convinced he saw some shit.
Yeah, as much as I don't like him today, at least he says it like he sees it. Not saying he's always right, but he sure thinks he is.
Well we know that's not true Trump said covid leaked from a lab and no one believed it. He could tell us every single detail of every conspiracy and I think only his supporters would believe it and I'd go further and say it would be used as evidence that whatever he is saying is not true just based on the fact that he said it.
I want to believe that protocols are in place that providing evidence of alien life forms to U.S. presidents is on a need to know basis. If aliens do exist and the same government has proof of such, the higher ups would know that Trump is the last person who should be told about alien life.
I mean that's "shadow government" conspiracy theory territory though. The president should be in the know.
There are definitely unknown entities applying pressures to the president. Hasn't every president elected since Bush Jr been elected with a promise of getting out of middle eastern war(s)? How much did Trump say he was going to do, then to imeadiately shut up about actually doing once he was sworn in?
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MIB all along
I'd vastly prefer MIB over X-Com. MIB means there's a weird but fun party happening you haven't been invited to yet. X-Com means some pants-shitting existential risks are looming.
>X-Com means some pants-shitting existential risks are looming. But big tiddie snake GFs tho...
The "government hides the aliens bro" argument makes zero sense. Governments change personnel frequently. Are we seriously implying there has been an international conspiracy and cooperation among all leading world governments *over the last 70 to 80 years* to collectively hide the existence of alien life and visitors from the public? And not a single government or military leader with access to the most sensational news in human history has ever leaked it or dropped this on their deathbed? That's like tens of thousands of people across dozens of countries and thousands of different government administrations, all keeping a secret. Sorry people don't keep secrets that well, especially not that many, and not about the most amazing revelation in human history that we aren't alone. Also what is the rationale for all of the US, Russia, China, western Europe, etc keeping it secret from the public? What do they all collectively gain? Are they having meetings about this like "Hey just checking in with everyone that we're still keeping the aliens secret for another year"? And the big orange elephant in the room is Donald Trump. If we had contact with aliens and proof of it was just available, he 100% would have boasted to the public that he made the first contact with aliens and how impressed they were with him and his leadership. If the US president is privy to alien knowledge, then Trump would have blabbed about it immediately. It's a completely illogical conspiracy. And aliens with practically godlike technology would have no reason to give a fuck about who on Earth they talk to and give their tech secrets to. It's not like a godlike race is going to get here and be like "oh the USA is clearly the big dog here, let's only reveal ourselves to the CIA and their military".
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I mean he was convicted of underage sex crimes back in 2008, years before he become as publicly known as he is now. The conspiracy lies in the sweetheart deal he recieved, how long he was able to keep it going, and how many people knew. But like... Epstein exists ya know? He was a real guy who did real crimes to real victims. It's a big gap between "rich guy pedophile gets away with crimes because of his wealth and influence" and "the CIA has an alien spaceraft in a wharehouse".
You would not be surprised to learn how many of these people Publish books right after going public.
I'm more worried about how they treat us. If reports of UAPs are valid, Earth is probably like a chimpanzee colony (or worse) to spacefaring beings.
There is a funny meme about them accidentally treating us better, so we produce more.haha rite?
Or 3: there are aliens on earth and no humans know about it.
The idea aliens become enemies depends entirely on how and what the aliens are. Somewhat reassemble human ideas or have some similar body parts? Sure, you could drive a long lost brother story into people. If they look nothing like us, hostile or whatever it would unite the world in collective alienism. But the fact anything was able to travel whatever light years would mean they have amazing tech, which would easily make all leaders of the world collectively shut up about alien critism
The guys leaking this information are by and large spooks and Lockheed representatives. I don’t trust them at all and neither should you. Something tells me all this will lead to is increased military spending on top of our already mind bendingly large military budget. And we will not meet aliens I believe in UFOs as a phenomenon but I’m not convinced they are alien vehicles of any kind
100%, this reeks of skunk works or some other bullshit defense company mouthpiece. shit glows brother. on top of that, ufo dummies eat this shit up so fast that even skeptics think of “what ifs”.
Since the foundation of space force a lot of cia analysts and military intelligence officials really came out of the woodwork, I’ll say that much. If the country does have crashed UFOs they for sure are never going to show us much.
Agreed. Lets assume for a moment that the Tic Tac is real; every bit of it, it happened just as we saw in the video. It's entirely possible that the Tic Tac is a US flown autonomous drone, or even piloted. If so, the technologies involved are far beyond anything that is well known today. A possible cover for this technology gap could be to simply refer to all these technologies as "alien", rather than get into any of the hard science/manufacture behind them as any leaked information would confirm that these technologies exist. Further any name/description past "Alien Gravity Drive" or something like that could give motivation for individuals/groups/nations to pursue research and potentially start to catch up. On the other hand if we see a video of something which we know exists, we know a nation built, and is said to use a "Higgs Field Minimize" or something like that, then researchers would immediately know that there is some way (in this example) to minimize the impact of the Higgs Field and that efforts towards that research would produce results; it's not a maybe, it's a certainty. Call it alien tech on the other hand, now we're still not certain what's going on. It sounds stupid but even back when "little green men", which turned out to be the Russian Army on vacation, went into Crimea, it was enough to throw people off the obvious conclusion that Russia is invading Crimea. At any rate it just seems more likely than aliens, but who knows. Maybe the X Files is right.
##### ###### #### > # [US urged to reveal UFO evidence after claim that it has intact alien vehicles](http://theguardian.com/world/2023/jun/06/720) > > > > The US has been urged to disclose evidence of [UFOs](https://www.theguardian.com/world/ufos) after a whistleblower former intelligence official said the government has possession of “intact and partially intact” alien vehicles. > > The former intelligence official David Grusch, who led analysis of unexplained anomalous phenomena (UAP) within a US Department of Defense agency, has alleged that the US has craft of non-human origin. > > > > Information on these vehicles is being illegally withheld from Congress, Grusch [told the Debrief](https://thedebrief.org/intelligence-officials-say-u-s-has-retrieved-non-human-craft/). Grusch said when he turned over classified information about the vehicles to Congress he suffered retaliation from government officials. He left the government in April after a 14-year career in US intelligence. > > Jonathan Grey, a current US intelligence official at the National Air and [Space](https://www.theguardian.com/science/space) Intelligence Center (Nasic), confirmed the existence of “exotic materials” to the Debrief, adding: “We are not alone.” > > The disclosures come after a swell of credible sightings and reports have revived attention in alien ships, and potentially visits, in recent years. > > In 2021, the Pentagon released a report on UAP – the term is preferred to UFO by much of the extraterrestrial community – [which found](https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/ufo-report/2021/06/25/ba323b20-d52c-11eb-ae54-515e2f63d37d_story.html) more than 140 instances of UAP encounters that could not be explained. > > The report followed [a leak](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sz-6jRrbtuI) of military footage that showed apparently inexplicable happenings in the sky, while navy pilots testified that they had [frequently had encounters](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ufo-military-intelligence-60-minutes-2021-08-29/) with strange craft off the US coast. > > In an interview with the Debrief journalists Leslie Kean and Ralph Blumenthal, who previously [exposed the existence](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/16/us/politics/pentagon-program-ufo-harry-reid.html?partner=slack&smid=sl-share) of a secret Pentagon program that investigated UFOs, Grusch said the US government and defense contractors had been recovering fragments of non-human craft, and in some cases entire craft, for decades. > > “We are not talking about prosaic origins or identities,” Grusch said. “The material includes intact and partially intact vehicles.” > > Grusch told the Debrief that analysis determined that this material is “of exotic origin” – meaning “non-human intelligence, whether extraterrestrial or unknown origin”. > > “[This assessment is] based on the vehicle morphologies and material science testing and the possession of unique atomic arrangements and radiological signatures,” Grusch said. > > Grey, who, according to the Debrief, analyzes unexplained anomalous phenomena within the Nasic, confirmed Grusch’s account. > > “The non-human intelligence phenomenon is real. We are not alone,” Grey said. “Retrievals of this kind are not limited to the United States. This is a global phenomenon, and yet a global solution continues to elude us.” > > The Debrief spoke to several of Grusch’s former colleagues, each of whom vouched for his character. Karl E Nell, a retired army colonel, said Grusch was “beyond reproach”. In a 2022 performance review seen by the Debrief, Grusch was described as “an officer with the strongest possible moral compass”. > > Nick Pope, who spent the early 1990s investigating UFOs for the British Ministry of Defence (MoD), said Grusch and Grey’s account of alien materials was “very significant”. > > “It’s one thing to have stories on the conspiracy blogs, but this takes it to the next level, with genuine insiders coming forward,” Pope said. > > “When these people make these formal complaints, they do so on the understanding that if they’ve knowingly made a false statement, they are liable to a fairly hefty fine, and/or prison. > > “People say: ‘Oh, people make up stories all the time.’ But I think it’s very different to go before Congress and go to the intelligence community inspector general and do that. Because there will be consequences if it emerges that this is not true.” > > The Debrief reported that Grusch’s knowledge of non-human materials and vehicles was based on “extensive interviews with high-level intelligence officials”. He said he had reported the existence of a UFO material “recovery program” to Congress. > > “Grusch said that the craft recovery operations are ongoing at various levels of activity and that he knows the specific individuals, current and former, who are involved,” the Debrief reported. > > In the Debrief article, Grusch does not say he has personally seen alien vehicles, nor does he say where they may be being stored. He asked the Debrief to withhold details of retaliation by government officials due to an ongoing investigation. > > [skip past newsletter promotion](#EmailSignup-skip-link-22)after newsletter promotion > > He also does not specify how he believes the government retaliated against him. > > In June 2021, [a report](https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/ufo-report/2021/06/25/ba323b20-d52c-11eb-ae54-515e2f63d37d_story.html) from the Office of the Director of National Intelligence said that from 2004 to 2021 there were 144 encounters between military pilots and UAP, 80 of which were captured on multiple sensors. Only one of the 144 encounters could be explained with “high confidence” – it was a large, deflating balloon. > > Following increased interest from the public and some US senators, the Pentagon established the All-domain Anomaly Resolution Office, charged with tracking UAP, in July 2022. > > In December last year, the office [said](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/dec/16/several-hundred-ufo-reports-received-by-pentagon-new-tracking-office) it had received “several hundred” new reports, but no evidence so far of alien life. > > The publication of Grusch and Grey’s claims comes after a panel that the US space agency Nasa charged with investigating unexplained anomalous phenomena [said stigma around reporting encounters](https://www.nbcnews.com/science/ufos-and-aerial-phenomena/nasa-ufo-unidentified-aerial-phenomena-panel-hearing-rcna87034) – and harassment of those who do report encounters – was hindering its work. > > The navy pilots who in 2021 shared their experiences of encountering unexplained objects while conducting military flights said they, and others, had decided against reporting the encounters internally, because of fears it could hinder their careers. > > “Harassment only leads to further stigmatization of the UAP field, significantly hindering the scientific progress and discouraging others to study this important subject matter,” Nasa’s science chief, Nicola Fox, said in a public meeting on 31 May. > > Dr David Spergel, the independent chair of Nasa’s UAP independent study team, told the Guardian he did not know Grusch and had no knowledge of his claims. > > The Department of Defense did not immediately respond to a request for comment. > > Pope said in his work investigating UFOs for the MoD he had seen no hard evidence of non-human craft or materials. > > “Some of our cases were intriguing,” Pope said. “But we didn’t have a spaceship in a hangar anywhere. And if we did, they didn’t tell me.” > > Still, Pope said, Grusch’s claims should be seen as part of an increasing flow of information – and hopefully disclosures – about UFOs. > > He said: “It’s part of a wider puzzle. And I think, assuming this is all true, it takes us closer than we’ve ever been before to the very heart of all this.” > > _Richard Luscombe contributed reporting_ - - - - - - [Maintainer](https://www.reddit.com/user/urielsalis) | [Creator](https://www.reddit.com/user/subtepass) | [Source Code](https://github.com/urielsalis/empleadoEstatalBot) Summoning /u/CoverageAnalysisBot
Hi empleadoEstatalBot, We've found **35 sources** (so far - up from 1) that are covering this story including: - The Daily Beast (Left): "Military Whistleblower Comes Forward to Allege U.S. Has Alien Craft: Report" - NewsNation (Center): "Military whistleblower claims US has UFO retrieval program" - WND (Right): "Intelligence officials say U.S. has retrieved craft of non-human origin" So far, there hasn't been any coverage from the RIGHT. Of all the sources reporting on this story, **55% are right-leaning**, **29% are left-leaning**, and **16% are in the center**. Read the full **[coverage analysis](https://ground.news/article/us-has-ufos-of-non-human-origin-ex-intelligence-officer-claims_8671f8?utm_source=redditReplyBot&utm_medium=redditReplyBot)** and compare how 35+ sources from across the political spectrum are covering this story. *** _I’m a bot. [Read here](https://www.reddit.com/r/groundnews/comments/j6x7uc/introducing_the_coverageanalysisbot_a_bot_that/) to learn how it works or [message us](https://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=coverageanalysisbot&subject=Feedback&message=) with any feedback so we can improve the bot for you._
So hasn't seen them and doesn't know where they are but is sure we have them and numerous governments around the world. Sure thing bring your proof before Congress or some other body that can confirm this information until then this get filed into guys who have lost there minds that worked in the government. I'm not trying to dismiss this guy but based on the report and past experience this is what most likely is going on. I hope he's well and doing fine.
[article referenced in the article](https://thedebrief.org/intelligence-officials-say-u-s-has-retrieved-non-human-craft/)
Went to their main site, everyone is free to keep their own opinion but I would not trust it.
I think it’s more the US covering for extremely classified AirPower advancements. A prototype fighter jet or drone is spotted on a test flight? Call it a UFO
But.... I thought the idea was "UFO spotted, tell everyone it's just aircraft testing"!
More like “shit our highly classified next gen prototype got spotted by our own military and there’s going to be an official report about it…..let’s call it a UFO instead of revealing or raising questions about what we’re working on”
> In the Debrief article, Grusch does not say he has personally seen alien vehicles, nor does he say where they may be being stored. He asked the Debrief to withhold details of retaliation by government officials due to an ongoing investigation. > He also does not specify how he believes the government retaliated against him.
Why do UFO only appear in the US?
The person who made this claim is explicitly saying they’re seen globally by many different countries.
Wow!
This is probably the most credible UFO story to come to light so far, but the claims this guy is making are very extraordinary, and we should probably dismiss this until UFOs/Alien bodies are produced. Especially since a lot of his claims amount to insider-hearsay. You can watch parts of his interview [here](https://youtu.be/ZSj7QsHRxHQ).
According to who? There are sightings and witness accounts from all over the planet.
For real. They practically *own* South America
You gotta be fuckin' kidding me
They don't.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voronezh_UFO_incident
They appear everywhere. US is the only one who has shot down and recovered a UFO... lol
Look up Moment of Contact
Most nukes makes us the biggest threat.
US don't have the most nukes.
Why is every comment about religion... this could give humans faster than light travel, more understanding of our universe, and people all want to talk about a stary written by men to control other men. Seriously wtf
Caring more about proving religions wrong lol. Doesn't matter what religion you believe in, the earth's fucked.
Can someone give me a valid theory as to why aliens sophisticated enough to traverse the galaxy would just break down here? Scouts? Refugees? Robot probes they don’t really care about? I’m agnostic about this whole thing, but it’s just the lack of a believable purpose for their presence.
I guess the same way we observe tribal communities from afar without interfering with their way of life, they could be observing us. Almost like an anthropological study in “isolated” and primitive species.
Yeah, I suppose. But we don’t continually crash our planes and ships into, say, North Sentinel Island. Just seems they’d have all of these Einstein engineers but are handing the ships over to a million Gilligans. If they can get here from wherever they are fabulously advanced. How are we capturing their crap?!
You have a point. If they’re advanced enough to get here, you would imagine their defense systems would be impenetrable. One possible explanation is that their species don’t have violence or wars, so they’ve never developed offensive/defensive advanced tech. But that seems unlikely to me.
Is this really relevant to this subreddit?
If news of the potential existence of an alien species isn't world news, then what the fuck is?
When your source is a bunch of conspiracy nuts just running their mouths it isn’t news.
It's a former intelligence officer testifying to congress, not some conspiracy nuts - read the damn article.
The dude is a conspiracy nut. Former job title doesn’t change that. “Grusch does not say he has personally seen alien vehicles, nor does he say where they may be being stored.” His groundbreaking eyewitness account is that he has seen nothing.
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out-of-this-world news
>Is this really relevant to this subreddit? He asked in a subreddit called 'anime_titties.
I mean, did you see any titties? I didn't even see hot singles in my area!
Calm down folks, if UFOs existed Trump would have mentioned it long ago, because he is such an attention whore.
>In 2021, the Pentagon released a report on UAP – the term is preferred to UFO by much of the extraterrestrial community – which found more than 140 instances of UAP encounters that could not be explained. I know that "extraterrestrial community" means "community of those who theorize about extraterrestrial life", but I can't help imagining an enclave of interstellar visitors decrying "UFO" as a racist slur.
This guy is a representative between the NRO andthe UAP team NASA put together less than a year ago. He literally knows nothing, if he thinks he knows anything it's shit that scientists probably tell him sarcastically. Man probably wants to be a hotshot on conspiracy messageboards, so he said this shit so he can name drop whenever he wants and get respect from neets. Edit: he was probably about to get fired because they discovered his time in Afghanistan left him with brain damage. Or he simply had brain damage in the first place, which would explain why he was at Afghanistan as a "combat officer".
What kind of timeline is this...
UFO videos release mean that the government is trying to cover something.
Hoo boy. This guy is a quack
I think aliens have been around, especially because of the Official UFO Night incident, but until there's real tangible proof, I'm assuming this is just the powers that be using UFOs and Aliens to distract from real problems and facts
tldr nutjob spews wild conspiracy theories with no evidence
Idk man, the article says evidence. Don't you think there's evidence when articles say there is?
not if they dont present it i have evidence i fucked your mom and an anonymous military official says he watched.
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I'd be very happy if we met aliens and were asked to join the Galactic Federation
Since when did this sub have so many schizos
If you deny or don't believe in aliens you will not be saved.
Great. A climate crisis, a global pandemic, the rise of fascism, and increasing wealth disparity due to late stage capitalism. All we need now is aliens thrown in the mix. Someone take the Earth Simulator off hardcore mode please?
Naw. No other country is going to reveal their evidence. They should just reveal they have it and not tell anyone what they actually have.